Wait, so I shouldn't be pulling straight?
Vložit
- čas přidán 7. 06. 2020
- Creating a straight pull is something that I've talked about for years but as I've learned more I thought it was time to address it and clarify things in a video. Thanks for watching and I've got more content planned for this channel soon!
- Sport
![The Physics of How Discs Fly [FIXED]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OI09iSIm7cI/mqdefault.jpg)
Please do another video where you explain in more detail (slow-mo) this improved technique :)
agreed. Great topic and nice video. I would like to see the video throwing examples slow motion / frame by frame with commentary. Thanks.
Totally agree, all he says is 'think' this but dont actually do it.... ok so where do I go from this
Yes please!
Danny,
Have followed you for a couple years, this is my favorite video. Simple, yet really what I need at this point to refine my technique. Thank you.
The “Reach Back” ruined me for a long time. I was reaching back early and then holding my arm there while x-stepping,
I finally watched a vid with Simon explaining that it’s more of a leave behind than a reach back. Took a while to undo my bad form but now I throw much further.
As you do your x-step leave the disc in about the same spot, your body moves ‘around’ the disc. At the exact moment your plant foot hits the ground this should be when your arm is fully extended behind you. Then, immediately start to transfer in to the forward rotations and motions.
kinda hard to explain but essentially if you do it right your body is moving, the disc is staying still-ish, and the moment your body hits its peak power position don’t hesitate to unleash.
Wish I could like this 1000x I read this a couple days back and did some field work.. holy crap there was a major difference. The weight transfer is so obvious now.
Michael Reyes thx.
czcams.com/video/q9e_lEs7ASE/video.html
Now it will be hard to not see that this is actually the way 90% of pros throw if you watch for it. I’m glad you got it so fast! It took me a couple months of relearning how to throw with this method. At first it didn’t work as well as my bad form but after a while I got the timing down and now throw 75-100 ft further.
Thank you so much. I've learned so much bad advice from these types of videos and practiced so many bad habits; it's ironic that some of the best advice was found in the comments section. Seems so simple now in retrospect.
Dude this is great advice! I didn’t think about it this way, thank you
The key is to be 'Explosive' during your drive - Gannon Buhr
Just this morning I was thinking of all those who I am thankful for being a part of my disc golf journey and you were at the top of the list.
I'm finally feeling like my game is coming together. Thanks Danny for your help.
Thanks for your awesome work. I'm learning a lot. When I started out about 6-7 years ago I was taught the same thing as you. I was starting the lawnmower and pulling as fast as I could. Ended up with arthrosis in the shoulder and had to stop playing. Picked up the discs again this year and the amount of new resources teaching lower body rotation is helping a lot. I've had to disc down, every a beginners mindset and learn everything from scratch again, but it feels much better and gentler on my body. Grateful for the community that provides these resources!
I have maybe 15 rounds under my belt. Watching your videos and other great players share your knowledge has added at least 100 feet to my game. Not to mention accuracy in tight wooded areas, disc flight, grip, stance, and well EVERYTHING disc golf.
Because of the knowledge you and others have shared, I was able to beat two co-workers that have been playing for years. One by 1 and the other by 7.
So THANK YOU for sharing your knowledge. We all benefit form you.
Great vid Danny. I recently just stopped doing the full reach back which I learned from you, and have actually started doing the shorter pull.
My drives are getting longer.
Thanks man. I refer your channel to all the new players
Great Danny. Even the teacher can still learn. You have helped me a lot. Keep learning and pass all that information to us. Thanks.
Thanks for this. I think that the search for the perfect form is endless since you have to adapt to so many variables in the field. Your advices on speed (slow is smooth etc.) and x-step timing have been the best advices to improve my own form. Thanks for all others too!
I have been watching a lot of videos on form lately and completely broke down my throwing motion and rebuilt it. I was definitely worse for a while before things started clicking. Started throwing better when I was throwing in a way that was comfortable for me while keeping in mind the tips that I've learned, instead of trying to exactly replicate tutorial vids, because I was just overthinking and messing things up. So I think things like reach back length and how big your steps are etc should be based on your comfort level more than anything. I love the thoughtful breakdown of form in these videos, keep up the good work!
I appreciate your videos they’ve helped my game a lot. I shot 7 under my average so four over last week. Still learning but quickly getting better with ur advice and watching the pros
As a new player, I've been getting so many mixed signals for "what to absolutely do," "what people tell you to do, but you shouldn't," and everything in-between. The "perfectly straight pull" thing is something I've been working on a lot recently, but I'm actually keeping myself inside both yesterday and today because I started getting tension in my rotator cuff (the same thing baseball pitchers injure) from the way I was throwing. Thank you for clarifying how the shot mechanic should look and feel, because I was afraid that I'd hurt myself from trying to learn how to throw...
This is what I´ve noticed too, most pros talk about the importance of the reachback but I see more of what u talked bout when they compete and especially them truly using the entire movement without stalling in the end at all, gr8 vid :)
the reachback is important, but that is just part of the entire form, u can get too much of a good thing :P
Appreciate the honesty..I have adapted my own sort of wide rail style and it has let me get more distance with less effort and also let's me keep my eye on my imaginary target for longer giving me more accuracy
Props to you for doing this. My respect for your teaching (already high) just went up a lot.
I saw you talking about this in one of your vods a few days ago (from denmark, so i cant watch live)
I finally hit 100 meters consistent. Been playing for 1½ months now. So thanks alot!
It takes a big man to admit to being wrong and check your self keep up the good work man love the videos!
Danny. Love the vids and watching your progression.
So are we all just gonna politely ignore the wrapped corpse on his bed?
It might be the person who gave him bad advice when he began and so the slaying prompted him to make the video. Nothing to see here, move along to the next Danny video.
I can't see anything else now, thanks. Guess I'll watch it again...
Super helpful and insightful presentation. Thanks man!
Being intellectually humble enough to admit that you were wrong or misleading about something you think about a lot is great!
As for the substance of the video, I really think that directly addressing how to go from the power pocket to release will help. I like to imagine my throw as one complete motion, where the disc travels a certain path with my body doing certain things to make the disc go on that path. When you kept saying straight pull I literally imagine the disc going on a 100% straight path as much as possible. When people who didn't emphasize straight pull didn't directly offer a shape for the pull and release I kept going back to straight pull. Now I'm not exactly sure how to go from power pocket to release so it's difficult for me to imagine my throw before I actually do it. I think a video on going from the power pocket to release would help a lot of us in being able to fully conceptualize what a throw looks like because we can put together pull to power pocket, and power pocket to release.
When you reach the power pocket, it's time to rotate your body, as you do, "punch"the disc straight out from your chest. Because you're rotating, it will release where you want it.
look up bezier curves
You yeet it 😂
Thanks for all your great knowledge.
thanks. plan to check out some of the tips today. I saw a tip somewhere that you should be able to stand still, except a for step on release, and with decent form be able to throw the disc where you want and with distance. Have been doing that and, at 68, find my body likes it better.
I think this video will help me out a lot, ty Danny.
Dat jump cut tho! Don't know if you've had it before and I just now saw it, but love it!
I rebuilt my driving form from the ground up this season since we weren't on the course, and relied a lot on your videos along with videos of other people like Simon, Uli, and Feldberg doing workshops and critiquing form. A big "ah-ha" moment for me was a critique video Simon did where he emphasized that the arm doesn't actually extend back for that long but just for a moment right before you begin your pull through. That really helped me with an issue I was having where I felt like my release points were off because there was just too much going on with my arm. It feels a lot smoother and a lot more natural to have my elbow bent for most of the cross step and then extend back for a moment towards the end right as my plant foot hits the ground.
Man the throw at 4:50 looks so good even frame by frame!
Great vid as always Danny. Some of the best adjustments I've made to my throws I learned from you. Don't need the mask outdoors when nobody's around though. Haha. Love the blue LED background. Keep those lessons coming.
Smart people correct themselves when they were wrong; this is why I feel confident taking advice from Mr. Lindahl.
Great breakdown!
Great video! I think this is a "second" or next-level of thinking for form. I agree that over-emphasizing reach-back can have diminishing returns, and that the straight pull-through is more of a mental aid than a perfect-form requirement. And I also agree that we all need to focus more on our lower body (legs and hips) for extra power. However, I've struggled with getting more power out of my lower body. What has helped me recently is 1) focusing on added flexibility: in my calves, hamstrings, and my my entire back 2) core strength. These two have helped me add an extra dynamic to my throws, and it's translated to easier distance for me.
Would like to see your demonstration in slow motion with pauses to emphasize. I think mcbeth is a great example of what your talking, I just assumed his technique was a little unorthodox.
I still struggle to get 200 feet and I think pulling straight is at least part of it. Thanks Danny! Hope you begin making more instruction videos soon.
I’m really interested to see you break this down, like in your Physics of Flight videos, showing different angles, slow motion and explain how this works. I’ve started throwing the way Bradley Walker explains on Facebook and immediately see more accuracy and distance. I’m still having trouble with the lower body engagement. Thanks!!! Great video!!
next videos title: "fast is smoother?"
Fast is long and long is good!
I love how you always come up with new ways to improve technique. Even after years of videos, it's still fresh!
Really good insight, been doing exactly the same as you. Lucky for me, I only started playing 5 months ago ^_^
New follower and new to disc golf. I've been playing ultimate since I was 9 and am now getting into disc golf 20 years later. I was wondering if you could do a video about ultimate players comom mistakes when transitioning to disc golf. Keep the vids coming!
Thank you. Can you also discuss the components as you speak over a slow motion or frame by frame of the distance throw?
One thing I've learned recently that's extremely helpful when throwing is to think about what you're doing with your not-leading foot. This is especially evident when throwing from a stand-still, as you'll find that if you keep that back foot planted (or where it's supposed to be when you throw), that throw will be significantly more on-target at the release point. Pivoting unconsciously when you try to really muscle through on a throw seems the be the true cause of "yanking it", and keeping your mind on that back foot can help you put more into a disc without reaping hilariously off-target results.
Check out Tristan Tanners latest video, he does exactly this soooo good. More of a focus on not rounding rather than reaching back and then especially the slow is smooth, smooth is far part. 😅
I was following your advice to the t. You ruined the early years of my golf! Lol jk. I did that with switching putter to putter several times and going through several styles of putting. 🤣
On the real, been playing since Feb 2017 and your vids helped form my drive i think somewhere in 2018 along with me just getting out and trying to see what works for me and my body style. Able to get 430ft max in an open area now, and I'm fine with that, not going pro unfortunately, lol.
Thanks Danny!
Danny, it’s perfectly normal for our attitudes, beliefs, and techniques to continue to evolve, and it takes guts to admit errors in your thinking. Cheers.
Using language we use today, I believe the Beto drill was a power pocket drill. Get used to throwing out from the power pocket and then build your form back to 1 step, then 2 step, then x-step. Trying to practice swapping into throwing from the power pocket with your x-step when you were trying to pull across your chest is just a huge change. I'll confess, it never stuck with me until I started to practice just throwing from a stand still from the power pocket and using my lower body and timing to increase distance. Seen through new information, that old drill makes more sense. Considering who Dan was learning from as well as how far he was throwing with T-birds back then, I can't believe that he wasn't throwing with good form. I just didn't understand what he was trying to teach until much later.
I don't normally give your video likes but...
This time ur evolution in the techniques demonstrates humility. Something lacking in "how to" videos. Keep throwing, keep growing.
I really love the disk golf game. I however messed up my shoulder throwing an forehand drive. I smashed it (the drive) it was the last drive for 11 years now. I so miss the game is there a fix I have regained movement but my confidence is gone. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge. Peace. Nathan
THANK YOU for this. I have been struggling lately because I've been obsessing with reach back and straight pull through and it just doesn't feel as natural.
Also, it takes a lot to admit you were wrong! It's a good thing though because no one is perfect and it shows that even some of the best people have to correct themselves.
That being said, do you think all of your drills videos still hold up well? Are there any you think you would not recommend anymore like the one you mentioned in the video? Which one do you still stand by?
Great video Danny I can honestly say as someone who has watched your videos and actually gotten a fair bit better because of them that you're a great teacher and to keep the videos coming they actually help a lot so thank you for your hard work
It is interesting to see whip velocity and when it makes the crack.. It's actually right BEFORE full extension
You taught the accepted technique in a quicky growing sport, as it grows and more info if available you updated, no bad thing :)
A really cool way I was taught this shoulder/elbow position is, you aren't moving your shoulder at all. Turn your hips to load them, this turns your shoulders. All the elbow is doing is going from the "tuck", to pointing straight out in front of you. That's all it is. Bradley Walker gave a great example of this as thinking of the barney song. I love you, you love me. as pointing at himself, then the person in front of him. It's super simple, just hard to think of it as simple. Right on Danny! I'm all about the lower body doing the work. It's all in the hips, it's all in the hips. Lol
Great video!
if you were not improving yourself and trying to teach ppl i wouldn't be watching you. You should always be learning and trying new things.
Danny. Props for wearing a mask. Hopefully we'll see some masks when the Tour starts back up but i doubt it.
There's no one within a country mile of him lol
Masks outside are a joke lol
Most masks don’t fit well and are useless. Especially if you are not inside 1 m from people.
Exactly. It's estimated every human on earth kills over fifty (50) living things a day just by walking - let alone running. I took one step today on my lawn and realized I stepped on (and killed) 3 ants. Masks are only the beginning. As humans, we need to hover, preferably in bubbles, only in the daytime. At night we need to just sit alone in the dark and watch CNN. Every life is precious so stay calm and don't move much.
I was taught the pull the disc from the reach back as if your starting a lawn mower and as a result the first 2 years of playing my "power" was 80% arm and I was only getting about 250 ft. After watching tons of videos from different pro's I finally started to get my rotation and hips involved I still only get to about 300 ft. but I am much more consistent and I am sure once I can get the timing better (mainly starting to pull before getting my right foot planted) that I can get to 400 ft.
Always so insightful Danny, great video. Every time i catch one of your new clips, i feel like you're able to articulate it so well i can almost always see an immediate impact on my own personal form. Awesome stuff and greatly appreciated.
A way I think of looking at it is that the disc is still moving in a fairly straight line with your body removing around it
One of the things I know now that I wish I had learned earlier is that if my reach back makes it feel like I don't have control over the disc and the momentum of my body, I'm probably reaching too far or doing something else that makes the throw feel awkward. If you reach back farther than you ever have because someone told you to reach back farther, you will probably throw the same distance with less accuracy and maybe throw further with less accuracy (which is sometimes worse). Work on being fast and getting snap within that comfort zone, and maybe don't even run up, then work on getting further and more controlled reach back.
Man, I worked really hard on both that Beto video and the lawn mower pull back in the day. I ran into the Beto video the other day and it brought back bad memories. I'm still trying to fix all the bad habits from them. When I started back in the day all the 'videos' explained things incorrectly. The people making the videos were throwing correctly, they were bombing, but articulating what they were doing badly.
Just a beginner here and I’m experiencing bad pain in my shoulder/shoulder blade. Could you do a video on how to not hurt yourself as a beginner?
A tip for the editing. Show the shots over and over like 10 times as you are just filming yourself talking. I have to rewind and check the details over and over! Thanks tho needed this video!
I get two piece of advice. Both seem logical.
The towels *snap* or the towel woooosch (sound).
The woosch difference is that it is more consistent power thruout its path. I guess the woosch comes more related to the lawnmover thing.
After seeing your videos and shoulder/elbow/wrist positioning, the snap seems more speedy. But since I have problems with the fingertips being in the rim too long, the disc snaps to the right. Snaps with great speed, but to the right.
really helpful!!!
Danny, Danny, Danny. I have watched all your videos, your latest video sort of contradicting your previous ones, I am more confused than ever. I am still trying to solve my rounding issues and throw farther. Could you come up with a short basic correct form video for a reliable backhand?
I love throwing really flippy disc. I throw a destroyer or something with those numbers and throw at an angle. Like bowling sum people throw straight down the middle, others curve it in.
I bought a radar gun and have been trying a bunch of stuff. Turns out my standstills go as fast as my walkups/runups (55-60mph). Not sure runups "hurt me long term" but apparently they aren't helping.
I feel better when I reach back really far and when I swing around harder, it feels like I'm storing more kinetic energy.
But the added momentum backwards can be too much to overcome when I'm trying to sync up the arm to the hip, so that the throw occurs during the powerband created by the hip.
Paul McBeth can throw as far as anyone and he doesn't turn all the way around, so what is missing? I tried some experiments with swinging my torso, jerking my elbow out in front of the throw, etc.
The lawn mower analogy is as good as the straight pull advice actually, especially old lawn mowers lol. To pull start a mower, you have to accelerate gradually, and it gets easier as it goes along, just like a disc golf throw. All budding pros go through a try hard phase, where we maximize our effort in an attempt to maximize distance. A tale as old as time lol...
This is not the way. The way to greater distance is refined motion, effortless, efficient motion. Trying too hard is the easiest way to ruin everything that is smooth and making it rough.
It is a body thing. Where are YOU torquiest? When is your hip power being generated, and how are you bracing it off from the shot?
I used to stomp my front foot down so hard it hurt by the end of a round. I was spinning on the ball instead of the heel.
It was bracing off my lower body power and cutting it off before my hand could catch up. It was as if the footwork and the throw were two separate things. They need to flow through each other.
The hand starts then the hip starts then the hand catches up, and moves through picking up the hip's power while it is still happening.
This is where an extra long reach back can ruin the timing of it all. The hip only has so long to engage.
When the foot gets planted, the energy is fully loaded and has to be released somewhere almost immediately.
In my case, it was going into the ground, grinding my knee and foot spending the energy creating friction with the ground.
Concrete tee pads are not a good place to learn driving footwork... too much traction.
When I played on chirt, (hard packed dirt with crushed gravel) I was able to get my foot spinning on the heel with less resistance.
This enabled me to try different timing without always feeling like I was dragging behind.
The traction of the concrete was stifling my plant foot in a way that I didn't even know was affecting me.
Spinning on the ball of my foot was the crutch for that impediment, not a solution.
Trying too hard was the cause of bracing off my shot power into the ground.
Having a dirt road to practice on has helped me get my spin happening more easily, and if I do it wrong I am punished with a fall on rough terrain. lol
The solution was to shorten the reach-back and spend less energy loading back as far as possible. It was sending too much momentum backwards.
To load far enough back, we just have to be back far enough to pull the hand into and THROUGH the hip's power while its small window is open.
Reaching back too far means your hand won't catch up and you will feel pinched at the armpit... my old nemesis.
Not reaching back enough will put the hand out too early, and you will throw out your elbow while never getting any power from your hips.
I like the feeling of jerking my elbow across my chest, but it is a slippery slope to tennis elbow injuries. It gets the hand speed up, but does not deliver enough power.
It is too easy to get out in front from a short reach back, so for safety, we are trained to err on the side of reaching back too far.
When you feel the weight stagnate on your back foot because you are too bent over at the hip, you are reaching back too far.
When you feel the pinch at the armpit, you are reaching back just a wee bit too far. It is a minute adjustment.
It takes the whole body working as one fluid motion with all the beginnings and endings overlapping to get full power.
What it doesn't take, is trying hard. I throw farther on a relaxed good form throw than my hardest effort throws 100% of the time, and with far greater accuracy.
I made the mistake of emulating mediocre pros when none better were available (20 years ago).
Now with all the best players out there, we can look and study their forms and we see that different stuff works for different folks.
The secret I wish to discover is how to elongate the hip powerband time frame, so I have more time to accelerate through the pull.
I think it is all about covering more ground in the x-step, keeping momentum without effort... exploding into the plant foot with the hip timing and hand timing... and not losing power to the brace
I release my disc at full arm extension and I've been having major problems with my wrist turning out at release and everything missing my line right or bad anhyzer. I get comments that my pull back looks great.
Theoretically speaking, locking my shoulder and not going full extension would help to fix this?
I've seen this a lot lately in videos. That mic has a cardioid pattern. Since it is facing almost directly away from you, it is way less sensitive than if you were in front of it. We're hearing quite a bit of the room as the compression tries to maintain the audio level of your voice.
Love the info in the video as always!
Two or three years ago a new friend taught me to do the reach back. This minimized my rounding and immediately made me throw at least 50 ft further. After doing this for a while, I started getting off balance because of reaching back too far, which has slowed my game down. Still need to get a good balance.
I can’t stop dropping my elbow in the pull through ending up with disc in ground or throwing with elbow up which leads to nose up. Any good drills for helping with elbow pulling straight through?
I am new to the game and want to get better. I've watched a ton of form videos. Still a lot I have to fix. I am wondering what is the best thing or things to practice or work on first to get better?
Also, with regards to the head rotation you mention in at the 6 min mark. Try out seth munseys side lying torso rotations. If you do them and rotate your head correctly, you can rotate your spine much long without discomfort and strain. This means; looking forward while trying to rotate your body backwards will reduce your rotational capacity and therefore reduce the potential energy you can store in your spine for the throw when it can uncoil. And yes, it will close the 90 angle og your shoulder and result in rounding and the all known «grip lock» lol :-)
Unfortunately my throw is 100based on pulling through my chest. Really developed it from 2017-2019 from all these tutorials.
It’s been extremely hard to stop using my arm after I reach the sling shot pocket.
I find myself getting discouraged since I can throw 350 consistent with poor technique. But I’ll never reach that 400+ until I get the disc lag and hip rotation down
I still for the life of me cannot perform a non-shanked or non-moon rocket backhand while attempting the x step. Hopefully with the help of your videos I can graduate from the standstill tee pad backhand.
Time to do some experimenting on the field. Going to test the difference between finishing the shot more to the left vs. right. Results will be posted.
Would you still recommend the Beto drill for beginners?
Rambling is always fine to me as long as they are clear concise thoughts mostly
When throwing it’s important to avoid hypercapnia and hypoxia say, for example, by wearing a covering over your breathing holes
I basically got two problems: 1. When I try the pulling technique, I'm looking "away" from the direction I want to throw to, always feeling I'm loosing my target out of sight and therefore loosing control of where I'm throwing. 2. I'm not able to release the disc always in the same (horizontal) angle. I would say I have a variance of 45°, releasing it sometimes to the left, right, middle, etc.
Great comments Danny, it's funny how what you describe at around the 5:00 mark describes Jennifer Allen's form exactly. It's bizarre she's so revered as a distance thrower, despite the fact Paige throws much faster with far superior compact form. Also, why are you wearing a mask out in a public park with no one around you? Just a fashion statement to compensate for lack of mustache? Keep up the great work, your videos are a true asset to the disc golf community!
Jennifer Allen leans with her spine straight and not the way Danny explains it. During Allens reachback you can pretty much draw a straight line from the plant foot, through her spine and up. Her last step with her plant foot is very wide, I guess to compensate for that insane reachback.
Just wearing the mask because I think more people should. I don't usually wear it while doing field work but I wanted to wear it while filming.
Hey Danny! I just recently started golfing about a month ago and a buddy recommended your videos to really develop form! My question is: when I'm practicing, how slow is too slow? I'm having trouble finding a good speed to walk-up/throw. I feel when going slow, getting the timing down for the reach back and planting the front foot is throwing off the rythm of the stance and makes for a loss of power, but throwing faster makes it wildly inconsistent and hard to improve any form. How do you find a happy medium?
I know that I’m not Danny, but if you are just starting, there is no such thing as too slow. If you really want to work on form, throw standstills. If you haven’t already, Tristan Tanner just made a form breakdown video. It can show you how to get good power with a slow run-up. If you want a happy medium, watch him.
@@willhowarddg Thank you for the info! I've thrown standstill for most of the time and feel incredibly comfortable with it, however, when I try to adjust to a slow walk up, it seems like everything goes awry. A normal walk up feels good, but its wild. I was trying to correct form by slowing it down, but the timing of everything just feels awkward. Sorry if that's a bad explanation! Thank you for the help again haha
check out spin and throw technique disc golf group on Facebook. This is exactly what is discussed. A lot of pro breakdowns as well that show them doing this exact thing. Finally glad to see someone else realizing what is really happening during a throw.
Yes, Danny needs to look at Brad's concepts and give them some deep thought!!
I disagree completely. I've had some interaction with Bradley in the past and I don't really want anything to do with him now. I think focusing on rotation completely will cause rounding in more players than it will help and attacking anyone who disagrees is a poor way to learn more.
@@DannyLindahl You might not like the guy but what you explained in this video is very very similar to the technique he teaches.
@@DannyLindahl danny, not saying you should be his buddy. He has concepts that are generating results. Looking at high level professionals, you see many concepts in what they're doing that no one is talking about. Maybe you could be the better teacher of these concepts?!?!?
@@udtpup23 I disagree. I think what I'm talking about is a much more applicable way to learn for more players. He's basically talking about the wide rail but super aggressively for no reason. Definitely not going near that group with a 30 foot pole.
My problems were the same. I still do reach back too far. I feel like if I don’t I use to much muscle.
The Beto Drill confounded me for a long time. What I've come to realize is it's a more advanced drill. It was sold as the first thing you show new people in disc golf (until the influx of content in the past 4-5 years) but I think that's wrong. It's actually a drill that shows how and when you can apply arm power to the throw. It starts your arm at the moment where it's appropriate to actually explode out with your arm muscles. Thats something you can go without practicing for a long time.
Like you mentioned, it's also great at making rounding impossible... but I think thats a benefit not the feature. Great video! Every time I find myself nitpicking any of your advice, you end up correcting it anyways. Bravo.
I'm starting to wonder if Dan's original drill wasn't similar to the what Brad & Danny are talking about with the ejection from the power pocket. When he described it, he may have opened up by accident trying to demonstrate it, but I think Dan had some pretty crazy distance for not doing things properly. Blake had shown him and I think a lot of the discussions are just getting around to putting on video what Blake was trying to teach via DGR years ago. If you break down Dan's 'Beto drill', it's designed around building the timing for when to 'throw' the disc out of the power pocket so that as you are rotating you are familiar with the feel. If you combine Brad's spin and throw suggestions with the Beto Drill (plus keeping your shoulder locked as Danny mentions), it makes a lot more sense and you can see how that would be a building block. @Danny - for what it's worth, you had this eureka moment back in 2017 as well :) czcams.com/video/i9Cg9U1a1zg/video.html Love seeing your journey (Danny). Would be interested in hearing how your progress has resulted in your playing (tourney results, etc.).
@@dwmichaels Spin and Throw is garbage. I would recommend finding other ways to learn backhand. BW is misguided on many things and is driven by the confidence of the few things he's really gotten right. Not a reliable source in my opinion.
Like I said in my comment, I agree that the Beto drill puts your arm in the position where it's appropriate to apply power. That and the fact that it eliminates the possibility of rounding are great things to practice, but it's probably not appropriate for a beginner like it's always been billed as.
I believe you are correct @4:45 with regards to that you reach straight out from your body in the reach back. However what is important to remember is; that point is not neccessarily 180 degrees from youe target. The stiffer and more reduced your thoracic rotational capacity is (often reduced with lack of mobility exercises or increased age) the more «wide raid» you have to go. If you can only rotate comfortably to 155 degrees away from your target, I would Reach OUT from my body with the disc instead og reaching to the 180 degrees because it WILL result in rounding (shoulder angle etc). If you want to increase your thoracic mobility I would recommend Seth Munsey over at disc golf strong! If you can improve it, it will result in more thoracic rotation (comfortably) away from the target and there more potential energy stored in the spine which you can uncoil and use for power in your throw and thus resulting in more distance. #discgolfstrong
Rotate your hips or engage your hips is in a way the worst advice I got, because I thought I should then do that myself and I started practising that. Then I learnt that the hips should rotate as effect of weight shift and brace (which makes much more sense), so when I started working on proper weight shift and brace (this year) I realized that my timing was way off because I was rotating my hips to early (as soon as my front toe touched the ground I started rotating). I have been working on fixing this, but that´s really tough because muscle memory is so strong.
How do I lock my shoulder?
I miss the stache Danny!
A couple of your demonstrations in this video appear (to me) to contradict your recent video of not turning around resulting in blocking the disc’s sight line. Could you clarify/differentiate?
That straight line pull advice always perplexed me because it never appeared like pros were actually pulling straight. And they'd never get the disc to their right pec before opening their shoulders. I just kept thinking that their games would improve with better form, lmao! I could pull in a straight line but, it didn't feel powerful; like my arm is a wet noodle pulling the disc along.
Rotate hips too, not just shoulder. Case in point, Tristan Tanner. He too doesn’t have much of a reach back, but he throws FAR!
Danny, this isn't a right or wrong situation. Yes, you can keep a disc on the Line Of Play closing your elbow towards you with a locked shoulder as you rotate your spine driving in and down with your left knee. No, you can't eject a disc along the LOP opening the elbow unless you open the shoulder at the same time, and at a fairly specific rate. This is what the Mobius Line-Puller demonstrates perfectly.
If the shoulder is locked, the disc is rounded in the smash. Period.
Thus, the timing of the release becomes absolutely critical, as the direction of disc travel is the tangent to the curvature of the smash.
A locked shoulder throw is by far the most powerful because it properly treats the upper arm as the handle of the whip, and the whipping force through two hinges is the most powerful for humans. Treating the shoulders as the handle of the whip is effectively what straight-pulling is, and it is far more accurate, because the release time doesn't matter - you just fly a bit short, or a bit long.
For the vast majority of players, a locked shoulder will always produce more power, but less accuracy. Only the MOST athletic individuals can hope to achieve a consistent release point such that the rounded smash always goes in the same direction.
I use both the static-shoulder method AND the straight-pull-straight-smash method, as appropriate for the shots I require. Understanding the distinction, and the differences - and having them under strict control and at your disposal is what you need on the DGC. Most of us have pretty pitiful levels of talent, and it's essential we promote the most error-tolerant forms of the sport to the usual novice and intermediate player.
Those people lucky enough to have enough talent to control a static shoulder max-power release point successfully are not that common. Therefore, Static-shoulder throws are an advanced technique, to be taught to players once they've found enough body-awareness to create a reliable x-step, and a decent straight-pull-and-smash, and are seeking more power, and have good form and good balance. You need to learn to walk, before you *can* learn to run.
I’m SO THANKFUL for this video. Coming back to disc golf after a few years, and having spent some time learning a (ball) golf swing (which is allll about timing, relaxed arms, and lower body power) I found it odd that many are teaching to pull fast before the body rotates, which effectively makes the lower body pointless. Great clarification!
Daniel please turn on close captions thank you
A good rule i break is beat up your replacement disc so when you lose the main mold it's of age for play
So basically youre extending your arm and creating a longer lever which will increase the speed of the disc?
Can you play a song about rounding on the guitar for us?
Nice video, what's your twitch name so I can follow?!