Here's a Kierkegaard quote for you about this subject: “I recollect a depressed person, who, at one time in the midst of his suffering when he wished himself dead, at the sight of a basket of potatoes was prompted to ask himself whether he still did not have more joy in existing than a potato.” Soren Kierkegaard, Concluding Postscript of 1846 Hong tr 1992 p. 300
"Be not afraid of life. Believe that life is worth living, and your belief will help create the fact" So simple, yet so powerful. Great introduction to William James mate!
If somone was suicidal i would tell him to do it if they want, that they don't have to continue living if they don't want, theres no point to it, Alan watts said that if you feel free to kill yourself then you don't have to do it cause is the pressure of having to continue living no matter what that is the problem
Did I miss something or was the message really 'just fucking believe'? I'm an atheist who isn't convinced by the lack of evidence of a spiritual realm so this doesn't help me at all. In fact it feels dangerously affirming of my beliefs, that life is indeed not worth living if you don't believe in a spiritual realm, which I don't.
@@summerbreeze5115 i firmly disagree with depression being better than nothingness. Depression is bad, nothingness is neutral. I think few people would think that something bad is better than something neutral. I've never lost someone before their time, so in my experience death has always been a blessing and comfort for someone who's been ailing. I repeat, neutral is better than bad. I have a pretty open mind but I think it'd be very hard to convince me that bad is better than neutral.
@@summerbreeze5115 please stop insulting me. I think it's incredibly insulting to tell me that having depression is better than not having it. Whoopie, good for you that you neither have nor understand depression. You're the embodiment of the phrase "ignorance is bliss". There's nothing wrong with that, but keep it to yourself, because trying to spread the gospel of blissful ignorance really just comes across as insulting.
Thank you, I didn't know this perspective even existed! I always wondered if the religious were having a better time than the atheists when grappling the meaning of life, but I think I've found an answer that finally makes sense.
Nice video! Thanks for putting it together. I agree that the first approach seems more useful. I too am having trouble understanding what he was going for with the second one. Doesn't seem pragmatic at all to suggest that a nihilist suddenly begin believing in a spiritual order. Maybe this is because I'm not suicidal, but it seems to skirt the issue rather than addressing it. Like, Approach 1: If you are religious, realize you have agency in the universe. Approach 2: If you aren't religious, become religious, then see Approach 1. Reminds me of phoning in the second half of a college essay after realizing my logical argument was falling apart to support my claim, but it's 3am and it's due at 8am. Lol
What's funny is that I've seen people give more emphasis to the second approach. James talks more about this in his essay The Will To Believe which I haven't read yet unfortunately.
I’m so glad someone else saw this I’m reading this like… wtf??? “Just believe bro” He sounds like my old religious family members that try to get me to come back.
Bruh how can you diss my man Spinoza like this. In the words of that wise dude Henri Bergson, "One could say that every philosopher has two philosophies: his own and that of Spinoza" Anyways, subscribed.
Great video. I feel like James reflected in Victor Frankl, those who find meaning in the face of abject suffering create ultimate freedom. Even if there is no "God" (whatever you personally mean by those three letters) in reality, in effect by choosing to believe and have faith/trust in something beyond yourself you can actually bring God into being, in its purest form, without dogma, name or antiquated ritual. (This idea reminds me a bit for he opening scene in the first Black & White computer game....anyone else) Another way of looking at it, if faith and trust can be used as synonyms, the social group where no one trusts each tends towards the bad/evil/corrupt but in a group where trust is fostered, celebrated and given mutually between all members the group is righteous (a better word than strong) and stable...Perhaps. Lots of assertions here but I feel like the assertion that by choosing to have faith you create grace out of nothingness which can be the only weapon against Nihilism. And I suspect there some empirical grounds for this when considering the sheer volume of myth surrounding this theme and the feelings of awe you can feel when reading stories of real people who acted with faith and trust in extreme situations....?
thanks for the video! I am not entirely sold with the idea that fighing for justice makes it all worth it. at times i feel exhausted and crushed. but yeah, if we surrender and agree to injustice - we are doomed. think of women, people of color, native peoples, queers, lower class. People have been fighting against systemic injustice since the agricultural revolution. And them fighting made our world better (for sure i am happy we dont live in the last century). but yeah, that's the take. My psycologist suggested thinking of what makes me happy but those things are on such smaller scale then the scale of the injustice and suffering (e.g. a walk with a friend, good coffe, and sun shining on my face vs a war in my country). i was suggested to look into *existential therapy* in case someone else is struggling with similar issues happy i found your chanel via this video. will look into ur series on forgotten philosophers
I think I will stick with Epicurean way of looking at this aspect of life. Live life to get pleasure. Chase pleasures! There are so many things in the world, so many ways to derive pleasure that all you need is the resource to get those pleasures, so chase the resources. And when you are tired, cherish small things in life.
You won’t think anything of that bad later if you killed yourself because of it. That’s the problem William James is trying to tackle in order to find a view of life that would make life worth living despite one’s suicidal ambitions.
I don't think its correct to phrase the views as being for believers and atheists. The first one seems mainly aimed at someone who wants to abandon their beliefs but is afraid of what will happen if they do and the second one seems directed not towards an atheist but rather someone having a crisis of faith that wants to believe but is struggling.
This is one of my least favorite works from James. Part of the birth of nihilism was nominalism-as his teacher Peirce identified. James construed God as totally transcendent and not immanent. He construed truth as distinct from life, which is the opposite of pragmatism. And he makes nature into a substance. Whereas nature is properly construed as potentiality. James wants you to have a WILL to live, but no REASON. He made a world that you don’t care about. The world is just a tool for your purpose. Nietzsche is more correct here, “Amor Fati: let this be my love henceforth!” James has no love for life.
Here's a Kierkegaard quote for you about this subject: “I recollect a depressed person, who, at one time in the midst of his suffering when he wished himself dead, at the sight of a basket of potatoes was prompted to ask himself whether he still did not have more joy in existing than a potato.” Soren Kierkegaard, Concluding Postscript of 1846 Hong tr 1992 p. 300
"Be not afraid of life. Believe that life is worth living, and your belief will help create the fact"
So simple, yet so powerful. Great introduction to William James mate!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed!
I haven't done much studying on James, but I think I kinda like this guy. Great video
thanks friend
If somone was suicidal i would tell him to do it if they want, that they don't have to continue living if they don't want, theres no point to it, Alan watts said that if you feel free to kill yourself then you don't have to do it cause is the pressure of having to continue living no matter what that is the problem
Thanks
Did I miss something or was the message really 'just fucking believe'? I'm an atheist who isn't convinced by the lack of evidence of a spiritual realm so this doesn't help me at all. In fact it feels dangerously affirming of my beliefs, that life is indeed not worth living if you don't believe in a spiritual realm, which I don't.
Live because life is precious & extremely rare. It's a miracle really
Your catatonic depression is still better than eternal nothingness
@@summerbreeze5115 i firmly disagree with depression being better than nothingness. Depression is bad, nothingness is neutral. I think few people would think that something bad is better than something neutral.
I've never lost someone before their time, so in my experience death has always been a blessing and comfort for someone who's been ailing. I repeat, neutral is better than bad. I have a pretty open mind but I think it'd be very hard to convince me that bad is better than neutral.
@@summerbreeze5115 please stop insulting me. I think it's incredibly insulting to tell me that having depression is better than not having it. Whoopie, good for you that you neither have nor understand depression. You're the embodiment of the phrase "ignorance is bliss". There's nothing wrong with that, but keep it to yourself, because trying to spread the gospel of blissful ignorance really just comes across as insulting.
@@brandonlabbe3577 depression is better in a sense it is temporary.
Life once gone is gone forever.
Thank you, I didn't know this perspective even existed! I always wondered if the religious were having a better time than the atheists when grappling the meaning of life, but I think I've found an answer that finally makes sense.
Nice video! Thanks for putting it together. I agree that the first approach seems more useful. I too am having trouble understanding what he was going for with the second one. Doesn't seem pragmatic at all to suggest that a nihilist suddenly begin believing in a spiritual order. Maybe this is because I'm not suicidal, but it seems to skirt the issue rather than addressing it. Like, Approach 1: If you are religious, realize you have agency in the universe. Approach 2: If you aren't religious, become religious, then see Approach 1. Reminds me of phoning in the second half of a college essay after realizing my logical argument was falling apart to support my claim, but it's 3am and it's due at 8am. Lol
What's funny is that I've seen people give more emphasis to the second approach. James talks more about this in his essay The Will To Believe which I haven't read yet unfortunately.
I’m so glad someone else saw this
I’m reading this like… wtf???
“Just believe bro”
He sounds like my old religious family members that try to get me to come back.
Bruh how can you diss my man Spinoza like this. In the words of that wise dude Henri Bergson, "One could say that every philosopher has two philosophies: his own and that of Spinoza"
Anyways, subscribed.
Lol I like Spinoza, even did a vid about him. Just haven't met many people nowadays who self identify as a spinozist, rip.
Great video. I feel like James reflected in Victor Frankl, those who find meaning in the face of abject suffering create ultimate freedom. Even if there is no "God" (whatever you personally mean by those three letters) in reality, in effect by choosing to believe and have faith/trust in something beyond yourself you can actually bring God into being, in its purest form, without dogma, name or antiquated ritual. (This idea reminds me a bit for he opening scene in the first Black & White computer game....anyone else)
Another way of looking at it, if faith and trust can be used as synonyms, the social group where no one trusts each tends towards the bad/evil/corrupt but in a group where trust is fostered, celebrated and given mutually between all members the group is righteous (a better word than strong) and stable...Perhaps.
Lots of assertions here but I feel like the assertion that by choosing to have faith you create grace out of nothingness which can be the only weapon against Nihilism. And I suspect there some empirical grounds for this when considering the sheer volume of myth surrounding this theme and the feelings of awe you can feel when reading stories of real people who acted with faith and trust in extreme situations....?
Think about not using background music.
thanks for the video! I am not entirely sold with the idea that fighing for justice makes it all worth it. at times i feel exhausted and crushed. but yeah, if we surrender and agree to injustice - we are doomed. think of women, people of color, native peoples, queers, lower class. People have been fighting against systemic injustice since the agricultural revolution. And them fighting made our world better (for sure i am happy we dont live in the last century). but yeah, that's the take.
My psycologist suggested thinking of what makes me happy but those things are on such smaller scale then the scale of the injustice and suffering (e.g. a walk with a friend, good coffe, and sun shining on my face vs a war in my country). i was suggested to look into *existential therapy* in case someone else is struggling with similar issues
happy i found your chanel via this video. will look into ur series on forgotten philosophers
Thank you for posting this its helped me for a little perspective on what I'm feeling
I'm glad you enjoyed!
Struggling for an ideal. (Semon on the Mount). ♥
The best of all possible worlds
I think I will stick with Epicurean way of looking at this aspect of life. Live life to get pleasure. Chase pleasures! There are so many things in the world, so many ways to derive pleasure that all you need is the resource to get those pleasures, so chase the resources. And when you are tired, cherish small things in life.
Endless pleasure is boring.
" If God exists why bad thing happen" depends what you see as bad now and what you will think of it later
You won’t think anything of that bad later if you killed yourself because of it. That’s the problem William James is trying to tackle in order to find a view of life that would make life worth living despite one’s suicidal ambitions.
Brazilian James
Salve😎
What all philosophers have you studied? Just curious.
I don't think its correct to phrase the views as being for believers and atheists. The first one seems mainly aimed at someone who wants to abandon their beliefs but is afraid of what will happen if they do and the second one seems directed not towards an atheist but rather someone having a crisis of faith that wants to believe but is struggling.
I’m so grateful that I found your channel!
This is one of my least favorite works from James. Part of the birth of nihilism was nominalism-as his teacher Peirce identified. James construed God as totally transcendent and not immanent. He construed truth as distinct from life, which is the opposite of pragmatism. And he makes nature into a substance. Whereas nature is properly construed as potentiality. James wants you to have a WILL to live, but no REASON. He made a world that you don’t care about. The world is just a tool for your purpose. Nietzsche is more correct here, “Amor Fati: let this be my love henceforth!” James has no love for life.
Thank you
Bruh you killed Spinoza another time with that burn, maybe even cremated him this time. xD (Also I see a long form video, a great one nonetheless )
Yeah this was a one off in terms of length, imma try and shorten up the next one. Thanks friend!
Missourians
Camus
No
Interesting, but I couldn't finish listening because of the aweful backround music.