A Rational Defense of Ibn Taymiyyah’s Epistemology: with Jamie Turner
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2024
- Jamie Turner’s work can be accessed here bham.academia.edu/JamieBTurner
Key Epistemological Concepts: 00:00-33:10
Ibn Taymiyyah’s Epistemology: 33:11-1:31:41
Addressing Five Different Objections:
1) The Argument from Circularity: 1:31:42-1:50:02
2) The Argument from Contingency of Religious Belief: 1:50:03-2:04:19
3) The Argument from Religious Disagreement: 2:04:20-2:47:15
4) The Argument from Cognitive Science of Religion: 2:47:16-2:53:32
5) The Argument from Proper Basicality: 2:53:33-3:10:30
Conclusion + Q&A: 3:10:31-03:30:18
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Rehabilitating Ibn Taymiyya on Blogging Theology thanks to Jamie Turner and other distinguished scholars
Suggest discussing Ibn Taymiyyah's other books such as:
1. The book Minhaj Al-Sunnah (In Criticism of the Shiite Religion) and it was suggested that the guest should be Abdul Rahman Al-Dimashqiyyah because he specializes in criticizing Shiite thought
2.Answering Those Who Altered the Religion of Jesus Christ
(It is considered an important reference for Arab scholars in the criticism of Christianity)
It was suggested that the guest be Sheikh Muhammad al-Tarawneh or Shamsi.
3. The book Al-Aqeedah Al-Wasitiyyah: To talk about Ibn Taymiyyah’s perspective on eilm alkalam, it was suggested that the guest be Sheikh Hassan Somali.
4. The book kashf aldunun and other books: to talk about Ibn Taymiyyah’s criticism of some of the ideas of philosophical and logical thought. Some Arab professors say that Ibn Taymiyyah is the greatest Arab philosopher.
The book Al-Aqeedah Al-Wasitiyyah, Al-Aqeedah Al-Tadmuriyah, and Al-Aqeedah Al-Hamawiyyah are among the most important books of the Islamic faith, which Muslim scholars are keen to teach to Muslim students, and it is one of the best books of Ibn Taymiyyah
1:25 --- My apology. I am ALWAYS listening to CZcams on multitasking and seldom watch it alone. Now that the pandemic is over, it becomes harder to allocate more than 3 hours of presentation while having a day job. This is the way.
Ibn Taymiyya was grossly mistaken on contingencies with no first 'alhawadith laa awwala lahaa', and a specie eternality 'alqidam annawi', contingencies within the Divine 'alhawadith fi alDhat', and his falacious typology of Tawhid which is self contradictory. All of the above and other positions were philosophical innovations and not from the Salaf, and he made many strawman claims regarding the Asharis which are unsubstantiated like the claim they negate attributes or limit them to seven etc. (Asrar Rashid)
Among the most important suggestions for very important academic topics:
1.The book Al-Risala al-Akmaliyah is one of the most important books in responding to the Ash'aris. It is important that the Ash'aris read it instead of ignorant criticism. (It is one of the most famous books of Ibn Taymiyyah.)
2. Ibn Taymiyyah’s critical ideas of the Shiites in his famous book (Minhaj al-Sunnah), which is considered an important reference in comparing Islamic schools of thought.
There is another very important book called The Origins of the Twelver Creed by the author Nasser Al-Qafari.
3. Ibn Taymiyyah's thoughts on Christianity in his famous book (Answering Those Who Altered The Religion of Jesus Christ)
4. Ibn Taymiyyah’s thoughts on the attributes of the Creator and eilm alkalam in his most important books on the Islamic faith, such as: Al-Wasitiyyah, Al-Aqidah Al-Hamawiyyah, and Al-Aqidah Al-Tammuriya
These three books are considered important references for Muslims in the study of the Islamic faith, and senior Muslim scholars encourage students of Islamic sciences to read them because they are important in the Islamic faith.
5.The book Removal of blame from the Great Imams - It is one of the books that should be discussed
In it, he talked about the biographies of Muslim imams and discussed their ideas, and criticized many other ideas and beliefs such as the Ash'ari and Matrudian beliefs. He also discussed the ideas of Muslim philosophers and criticized their alignment behind the Yuban philosophers and natural philosophy.
How would you prove robot has consciousness using empirical data. How do you prove to blind man using empirical what color red is. In theory, robot can be programmed to move its hand when it touches hot surface. How do i know its having the experience of hot using test tube(Deduction/induction). The only thing i am certain of is that i have experience of hot. This experience can only come from entity that can already experience existence(Allah-one/indivisible/All-Loving)
What I love about Ibn Taymiyya is that he gave the Muslim masses great validation of their faith by reassuring them that their innate sense of faith is, in fact, deeper, more sophisticated, and more valid than the faith of elitist theologians who spent their lives trying to reconcile Islam with Aristotle.
What a load of tosh.
@@-Ahmed8592 Actually many scholars did that before either of them, going back to Imam Malik RA. Still, the Ummah needs a periodic refreshment of the Deen and Ibn Taymiyya was the refresher for his time.
@@contemplatively Ibn Taymiyyah was the arch innovator of his time.
I forgot to add “actually…”
When the Prophet sws was testing the belief of the salve girl, he simply asked, "where's Allah?" Her reply, "He's above the sky," was sufficient for the prophet sws to declare her as a believer. The problem with the Kalaam theologians is that they gave precidence to their clouded arguments to the texts of Quran.
Where is Allāh? A question which our Salafī brothers often ask and mistakenly deem it a creedal matter. I want to clarify this issue with the following important points, Inshā’Allāh:
1. There is only one incident in the authentic narrations where the Prophet ﷺ asked this question from a slave girl. This narration is a solitary narration (Khabr wāḥid) that has been reported with various different words.
2. In the narration of Imām Muslim the words of the Prophet ﷺ are: ‘Where is Allah?’, to which the slave girl replied في السماء - He is in the heavens. However, in other authentic reports, the Prophet ﷺ asked her: ‘Do you bear witness that there is no God but Allah?’. And in one narration he ﷺ asked: ‘Who is your Rabb?’. So there are different wordings of this incident and it’s definitively not proven that the words ‘Where is Allah’ are the only authentic transmission of the incident.
3. For arguments sake, we will give preference to the narration of Muslim due to its rigorous nature. Thus, then know that the narration in Muslim has been mentioned by Imām Muslim in the section pertaining to Ṣalāh and not Īmān*. Most of the narration is to do with prayer, and this incident has been mentioned as *part of the entire narration.
4. The slave girl replied that Allāh is in the heavens, to which the Prophet ﷺ said to the companion: ‘free her for indeed she is a مؤمنة (believer)’. Now, the important question here is that would anyone - including our Salafī interlocutor - accept that a person will enter the fold of Islam merely by saying that Allāh is in the heavens without the declaration of shahādah? Of course not. Even our Salafī brothers regard the shahādah as a sine quo non to enter faith. But in this narration there is no mention of the slave girl giving her declaration.
5. Keeping the aforesaid point in mind, it is clear that the Prophet ﷺ wanted to ascertain a sign from her to determine whether she is a believer. Why? The answer is that some narrations (Abū Dāwūd, Aḥmad, etc) postulate that she couldn’t speak. Hence, instead of saying Allāh is in the heavens, she pointed (أشارت) at the heavens. The owner of this slave girl, a companion, was having difficulty knowing whether she was a believer due to the fact that she couldn’t speak. So he brought the case to the Prophet ﷺ. Otherwise if she could speak, it would have been easy for the companion to determine this matter by asking her himself without taking her to the Prophet ﷺ.
6. How did the Prophet ﷺ ascertain a sign of her īmān by asking her this question? The likes of Imām Al-Nawawī, et al., explain that, since she couldn’t speak, she pointed at the heavens which meant that she supplicated to Allāh and not the idols of the ground. The sky is the direction of the داعي (supplicator) just as the direction of the one praying Ṣalāh is the Ka’ba. In fact, the Prophet ﷺ said: When one of you offers Ṣalāh, they should not spit in front of them, for indeed Allāh is in front of them when they pray (Bukhārī). And in one narration it is mentioned that Allāh is between him and the Qibla. Despite facing the Ka’ba in prayer, and despite the fact that the one praying is speaking to Allāh, and despite the fact that copious authentic narrations apparently suggest that Allāh is in that direction, and despite the fact that the Ka’ba is the *House of Allah*, NO ONE believes that Allāh is in the Ka’ba or in that direction. Hence, just as Allāh is not in the Ka’ba, He is not in the heavens too!
7. In addition, our Salafī brothers who take this narration literally, without any interpretation or contextualisation, cannot remain consistent in explaining verses of the Quran such as ‘He (Allāh) is with you wherever you are…’; ‘And We are nearer to him than his jugular vein’, amongst many other verses like this.
8. So why point at the sky when referring to Allāh? The summary of the detailed answer given by the polymath, Imām Al-Ghazālī, is that true reverence of Allāh is with the heart and the actions of the body limbs are indicative to that reverence and acknowledgment of the lofty status. The maximum a person can show of Allāh’s high status with their body is indicating to the heavens. As we sometimes say, ‘the person is in the sky’. Meaning, they have a high status. And, yes, this kind of indication is natural and intuitive. But it doesn’t mean that Allāh is literally in the sky. This is a very short summary of Imām Al-Ghazālī’s lengthy answer.
9. The methodology of the people of Sunnah is simple: Imām Al-Nawawī has transmitted a consensus from Qāḍī ʿIyāḍ that the texts that postulate a direction, or place, etc., for Allāh will be given an appropriate interpretation. And in this way one remains consistent and faithful to the Book of Allāh.
10. In summation, Allāh exists without any place. Prophet ﷺ said: ‘Allāh existed and nothing (including place and direction) existed apart from Him’ (Bukhārī). Place, locus and directions are all creations and He is the only Creator - it is rationally impossible for the Creator to dwell into His creation.
تلك عشرة كاملة
So what is correct answer to the question "Where is Allah"
["Allah, the Exalted, existed eternally and there was no location, place and space and He now is as He was (without a place, direction and being confined in space)"]
Abu Salih reported: The Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
اللَّهُمَّ أَنْتَ الْأَوَّلُ فَلَيْسَ قَبْلَكَ شَيْءٌ وَأَنْتَ الْآخِرُ فَلَيْسَ بَعْدَكَ شَيْءٌ وَأَنْتَ الظَّاهِرُ فَلَيْسَ فَوْقَكَ شَيْءٌ وَأَنْتَ الْبَاطِنُ فَلَيْسَ دُونَكَ شَيْءٌ
O Allah, you are the First, there is nothing before you. You are the Last, there is nothing after you. You are the Manifest, there is nothing above you. You are the Hidden, there is nothing below you.
Source: Ṣaḥīḥ Muslim 2713, Grade: Sahih
Al-Bayhaqi commented on this tradition, saying:
وَاسْتَدَلَّ بَعْضُ أَصْحَابِنَا فِي نَفْيِ الْمَكَانِ عَنْهُ … وَإِذَا لَمْ يَكُنْ فَوْقَهُ شَيْءٌ وَلَا دُونَهُ شَيْءٌ لَمْ يَكُنْ فِي مَكَانٍ
Some of our scholars cited this as evidence of negating a place for Him… If there is nothing above or below Him, then He is not in a place.
Source: Kitāb al-Asmā’ wal-Ṣifāt 2/287
You should learn Tafser Hadith&Alquran to understand Hadith&AlQuran. Its not like you read love story novel
Kindly provide the reference for point number 2.
@@muslimuddin3656
If you know arabic you wouldn't blind follow this statement and copy paste it. All these arguments are weakened for a long time ago
Very technical content but very insightful and great presentation. Jazaakum Allahu Khayran.
IbnThaimya's hypothesis is based on an Analog of TRINITY . He manipulated thouheed of Islam into a far west idea of three in one mannerism .
@@moidunnigulam6706 cry
@@cumar9875 / Can you prove his findings are true ?
Assalammualaikum Wbth, Iam Muslim from Malaysia,
And i have found this Y.T Channel bring so many intresting content, i just so love about History and Religion Theology, and iam more to dakwah about Islamic Fitan Eschatology,About Akhirul Zaman.
Thank you paul,
It very helpful
I wasn’t aware of ibn tahmiyah in this way before
Mostly he is being hated by masses
He was a product of European resurrection period .
because he refuted all sects, of course he is hated by them. He destroyed their creed and you see even nowadays his fruits through his books since asharis come back to ahlul sunnah.
They hate him alot. Everyone who fights for Haqq will have a hard life. Thats a rule.
@@Ben_B. / He introduced his own path apart from the muslim aqeedah of his period which has been contradictory to the existing aqeedah unto his time .
Then how can you say his DISCOVERY was compatible to AHLU SSUNNAH ?
@@moidunnigulam6706 read Kitab Tawhid by Imam Ibn Khuzayma, Kitab Aqeedatu Salaf wa ashabul hadith by Sheikhul Islam As-Sabuni, Radd al Jahmiyyah by Ad-Darimi and Imam Ahmad.
If you did it come back and show me where Ibn Taymiyyah differed.
@@moidunnigulam6706 what? xd
you embarassed yourself. His name is abu uthman sabuni. stop using google jahil
One of the most important books of the Islamic faith of Ibn Taymiyyah, which is considered a reference for Islamic scholars, has not been discussed so far, such as the book Al-Aqeedah Al-Wasitiyyah, Al-Aqeedah Al-Hamawiyyah, and al-Aqeeda at-Tadmuriyyah .
The book Minhaj Al-Sunnah by Ibn Taymiyyah is also a reference for Muslim scholars in criticizing the Shiites.
He himself was not accepted as someone who followed the manhaj of ahl al sunnah!
The manhaj of ahl sunnah holds on to the quran and family of rasulAllah saw!
I dont do takfir on him, taymiyaah which is but he wasn't that credible either as a scholar.
It has been refuted centuries ago wake up
@@hassanalim9218 at last read about him before saying such stuffs, Him and Bukhari weren't even in the same time, how did Bukhari has a ''baab'' on him when he wasn't even born yet.
Haven't seen Jamie Turner in a while. Thanks for the interview, gonna take a while to finish this!
Just commenting to save for future watch. Thanks to everyone at BT.
Can’t follow with all the interruptions ie ads. So I’ll download and watch it uninterrupted 👍
Salaam aleykum:
About the argument of circularity.
If I look in a camera and the camera could capture the same reality as my eyes. This suggest that the perceived realities is true right ? And when the camera holds other instruments and axioms while receiving the same reality while still possible to to capture the same reality. What would be the argument against this?
It's shocking how many people are discrediting Ibn Taymiyyah in the comment section, yet rely so much on his students who were basically copies of him in terms of theology. ie. Ibn Kathir, Ad Dhahabi, Ibn al Qayyim and so on.
And no, contrary to the myths that people are spreading in the comments, Ibn Taymiyyah didn't become relelvant only after the Najdi Dawah a few centuries after his death, he very much so, was still known during the Ottoman Empire, so much so that Sultan Murad IV was reading the transadaptation of Ibn Taymiyyah's al Siyasa al Shariyah (Sharʿī governance for the betterment of the ruler and the ruled), pretty good times for the Ottomans by the way.
2 of the students you mention differed from him in creed, this is well known.
@@conjugatemethod well known that this is made up by the asha'irah lol. Imam Dhahabi, Ibnul Qayyim and Ibn Katheer criticized the Asha'irah and Ilm-Al-Kalam. That's why the asha'irah criticized them for criticizing their aqeedah and ilm-al-kalam lol
@@conjugatemethod you clearly take your creed from social mddia
@@aq4356 Ibn Taymiyya was grossly mistaken on contingencies with no first 'alhawadith laa awwala lahaa', and a specie eternality 'alqidam annawi', contingencies within the Divine 'alhawadith fi alDhat', and his falacious typology of Tawhid which is self contradictory. All of the above and other positions were philosophical innovations and not from the Salaf, and he made many strawman claims regarding the Asharis which are unsubstantiated like the claim they negate attributes or limit them to seven etc.
Adh Dhahabi and Ibn Kathir may Allah have mercy on them both, changed towards the end of their lives.
Asalamualaikum. If possible, can I know if jamie and other colleagues in his philosophy of religion field do have 19th and 20th: existential, post-modern and analytical philosophy in their reading list? Although I am able to completely follow most of his ideas, but in all other places, they tend to use different terminology when it comes to discussions on epistemology.
We should also highlight or accept weaknesses of past so we become guides of world. Remember the Qur'an is warning for us also for the world.
IbnThaimya's hypothesis is based on an Analog of TRINITY . He manipulated thouheed of Islam into a far west idea of three in one mannerism .
As a born muslim I feel so dumb when compared to the depth of your understanding about Islam, Paul. You have my highest respect. I hope you enter the highest heaven too.
bro Paul isnt even in the video :P
@@jaisalrw3494 my comment are for the whole channel.
you shouldn't feel dumb, it doesn't matter if you're born Muslim or not, all it takes is some effort, sincerity and discipline to gain knowledge, things which everyone is capable. There's also many converts who don't know nor do learn much as well. However it's just more common for converts to go deeper than a lot of born Muslims since well... you tend to research things more before you convert, while born Muslims take it for granted.
The discussion of theologian, jurisprudence would not over laymen, it's not even wajib for details, because in depth of discussion would create doubt over laymen.
Jazakumullah khayran
*_Barak'Allah Feekom_*
Will you make a video on his statement that whatever exists must be a body?
Faith is “metaphorically“ like a sense or a muscle, that exists inside the integral aggregate of human being. Like the Matrix of the language, it needs to be enticed, used(rituals) and trained(respective education) in order to come out of senseless situation of last 4 tail vertebrae in the human body🤔
Ash'aris and sufis are crying 😂
No, they’re laughing at the inconsistencies 🥴
@@abumousewahabi9867 Thank you for this proof! So you're crying 🤣
@@Khaledf Love the projections 😂😂
@@Khaledf crying with laughter.
it doesn't matter coz wahhabi can't tell the difference with their only braincell. 🤣
keep it, we need it to rip you a new a$$hole like always. lmao
No. We are laughing at brain-dead Wahhabis such as you,
Salam alaykum Paul,
Would you consider posting readable documents (for a price)? For those of us that read faster and have a bad attention span for audio :) There is AI tools that can do it for you quickly and easily, even creating whole e-books in a click.
وَعَلَيْكُم السَّلَام وَرَحْمَةُ اَللهِ وَبَرَكاتُهُ
Today is modern world. Are there any chances to re produce new law . Like wise about covid. About interavtion. Or we have complete law and recycle. Or may unite scholar making new ijma?
Allah completed the religion, and there were much worse diseases in the past than covid
We should consider Great Scholar Imam Ahmed Raza Khan of India
xd
Blogging Theology is the hub of intellectual people who always shines in-between us ✨⭐ 🌙
great talk
I actually cant figure out what is the aim of this video ? Is the aim to defend Ibn Taymiyyah here ? Or critizing him ?
defend since he was a genius also in rationality
@@Ben_B. Here was a heretic, who proclaimed Allah has a human body, who problaimed the universe is eternal etc... He is also the grandfather of Wahhabism !! Because of his heretic teachings he got arrested several time by true Sunni rulers and died in prison, which he deserved, subhanallah !! I hope he is suffering for his heretic beliefs in Jahannam now !
@@msbudmsbud7593 damn you must be rafidhi or an atheist.
Ibn Hajar called him Sheikhul Islam. Guess he is a kafir, too.
As-Suyuti called him Sheikhul Islam. Guess he is a kafir, too.
As-Subki called him Sheikhul Islam. Guess he is a kafir, too.
Ibn Katheer called him Sheikhul Islam. Gues s he is a kafir, too.
And many many more.
You are a jahil lmao
tell me which books did you study you ape
If something is true, it would be true, even when i think its false…
Al Hamdu li Allah! I am so happy to see a new video of Jamie after so long☺️ thank you
Ibn Taymiyya rahimahuAllah sat on the minbar of Damascus mosque and said this is how Allah sat on the Throne . He went to prison for that.(related among others by Ibn Battuta who lived at the same period as him when he went to Damascus ) He made anthropomorphist statements in the book Minhaj volume 1 page 159. He is the first and the only one with ibn abd al wahhab after him to have divided at Tawhid into a trinity. He also used the gospels as an evidence to write that Allah is in the skies.Majmu’ al-Fatawa, volume 5, page 406
In the book Mufassal-I’tiqad, in his Majmu’ al-Fatawa, volume 4, p.374 he wrote that prophet Muhamad alayhi Salat wa Salam will sat besides Allah on the Throne.
In Minhaj al-Nabawiyyah, volume 1 , page 210 he wrote : If we say: God moves and He is endowed with attributes that have a beginning (hawadith), what is the proof of the falsity of our words? »
You can find all and it's contrary in his writtings because in order to be freed from prison he had to repent (his main repentance of 707 (hijri) is quoted by Ibn Hajar al- Asqalani (rahimahuAllah), in his book al-Dourar al-Kamina, volume 1, page 158)., that's why his writtings look so schizophrenic and that's how people who want to rehabilate him are confused. They use selectiv reading and take the good writtings of his recurrent repentances but prefer to ignore the fact that every time he was freed he went back to his anthropomorphism and blasphems. But he died in prison. wa Allahu a'lam
all the so called salafi sects and people who learned islam in jail mixing delinquency violence terrorism with Islam made him their Guru by feeling empathy with him because he was injailed. They have a better example of a person being locked up with prophet Joseph alayhi Salam in the Qu'ran but they prefer Ibn Taymiyyah's case...
he is the father of that tendency of self taught islam from those who pretend to teach islam without ijazza interpreting hadiths according to their own mental state. The misfortune of nowadays is that even academics, very few of them, are using his writtings because it allows them to do bid'a unorthodox thesis all in quoting him as an authority thinking ibn taymiyya is a legitimate one. Especially the english speaking academics because of the lack of translations of orthodox scholars
the english speakers are still paying the results of Lawrence of Arabia's fitna
his reviews in Aqeeda had been refuted centuries ago, he created a new bid'a aqeeda in the 14th century as if before him all muslims were disbelievers (here you have a justification for his followers to spread the blood of muslims even if ibn taymiyya is innocent of that...) but the so called modern salafis, the self taught sectarians are still using the inversatory accusation of bid'a towards orthodox muslims.
my personal guess toward ibn taymiyyah is that he was suffering from a mental illness that was not dignosticated at his time which is schizophrenia and that he succeded in transcripting his mental state into books... we have that same tendency nowadays with absolute psychopaths who wrote all sort of books to legitimate the worst crimes under the cover of islam. Wa Allahu a'lam.
I can see that you love the comments which present Ibn Taymiyya's bid'a in aqeeda as not being refuted and that's just ridiculous since it has been refuted centuries ago even if the modern so called salafis denies it and still present themselves as genius in knowing Allah because they can use ibn tayymiyya's writings to play cat and mouse with modern orthodox muslims who have not studied Aqeeda... But these tricky conversations that the lay muslim is not willing to have with them by fearing to blasphem against Allah (a thing that ibn taymiyya's followers are not afraid of as if aqeeda was a philisophical or rationalist subject of discussion... May Allah preserv us from such thoughts...) don't work with intellectual orthodox muslims.
That's ridiculous
بارك الله فيك، صَدَقت في ما قلت .
Ibn Battuta who mentioned that lie entered Damascus while shaykh Al- Islam in prison. Try another one😊
@@Khaledf ibn battuta also didnt like ibn taymiyyah. he lied in purpose. look the evidence they use lmao the asha'irah and rawafidh come together in this comment section xD
Ibn Taymiyya’s skepticism rejects intellect.
Muslims should learn from everyone, especially those they don't agree with.
One more points that these people won't invite critical academicsian of ibn taymiyah works
ok, this is such an imbalance. Ibn Taymiyya (RA) is not the only scholar of Islam, nor is he the most influential one.
it his account why do you even care? He is the Mujaddid of his time lol
@@Ben_B. I care to provide constructive criticism to a fellow Muslim, hoping that me doing so will be counted as a good deed in my book.
@@enesabdulla5872 one can criticize every scholar, also imam ghazali or fakh ar-dina ar-razi. Ibn Taymiyyah is misunderstood by Asharis and by people who follow him nowadays
@@Ben_B. I am not criticizing any scholar. I am far from being qualified for that. I am providing feedback to Paul Williams because he has too much content on Ibn Taymiyya (RA).
@@enesabdulla5872 He, Ibn Taimiyyah was SALAFI but accepted Hambali sectarian.
ibnTaimiyyah is the St Paul of Islam.
[EDIT: slip of the brain... I meant Luther/Calvin because Salafiyyah is similar to Protestantism]
He deviated from ahl asSunnah walJama'ah on many issues and he was rightly ignored/forgotten about untill the najdi/wahhabi/salafi movement revived his ideas in recent times .
Many Muslims have been influenced by these heretical movements and you will see them here supporting ibnTaimiyyah inc. Paul Williams.
Either you support & follow the first 3 Generations (the khayrulQuroon) which consists of the 4 Schools of Fiqh/ madhabs OR you go against them as ibnTaimiyyah and his supporters (salafis) do.
retard can't distinguish between fiqh and aqeedah. Ibn Taymiyyah defended the 4 school of thought. You probably didnt even touch 1 of his books and yet you are here barking "wahabiiii 😥😥"
Lol😂 what a ignorant.
Assalamualaikum, massive love to Habibna Ustadh(even if you hate) Bassam and Brother Jamie Turner.
Focus on Ashari and maturidi and ımam ghazali
Insha'Allah
Bro please, all muslim thinkers can be useful why all the hate ? Stop this bigotry please it will only make our community backwards
They gone far away from true Aqidah...most of the cases..
As a Muslim, my focus will be on following the companions of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh and the six imams of hadith and the four imams of jurisprudence, who were not Ash'ari or Maturid, but were on Salafism by following the Prophet Muhammad pbuh
@@zahidmuslim4110 The word Aqidah is not even mentioned in the Qur'an and Sunna.
ooooh boy that one's gonna be a good 3 and half hours
Meanwhile, online Salafis against philosophy 💀💀
i really dont understand them, their silly and overzealous as hell 💩
Most of them don't understand the difference between Falsafa and Modern Philosophy. The philosophy Salafis oppose should really be opposed, and was opposed by scholars like Imam al-Ghazali and others.
@@shihab2468 So according to you Imam Al Ghazali is Falsafa, whaaat? Where you learn this from
@@africandawahrevival The Philosophy that Salafis reject was also rejected by Al-Ghazali and others.
falsfa is just philosophy in arabic
Its awfully irking to me that the vast majority of the videos relating to Sunni scholars seem to be focused on rehabilitating Ibn Taymiyya rather than going to the actual foundational salaf such as 4 Sunni fiqh imams, tabari, fakhr razi, etc.
Seems even odder because Ibn taymiyya came hundreds of years later and isnt even part of the first 3 generations to begin with.
Chronology wise, was Razi from the Salaf?
Agreed. Hugely influenced from the 'salafi' movement of recent times. Ibn Taymiyya, an influential scholar for sure, was criticised by his contemporaries from all 4 schools of fiqh and the sunni scholars at the time.
There is an obsession to refocus on Ibn Taymiyya over other more orthodox scholars.
All Muslims should stick with the 4 schools of fiqh and the schools of Aqeedah accepted for over 1000 years.
@@nanashi7779 who mentioned Razi? At any rate Razi does not represent a break in the tradition like Ibn Taymiyyah does.
Rehabilitating? Please explain what you meant by that.
Salaf is a general term. If you meant the first three generations, then you need to understand that just like you would be listening to someone in our generation (not from the salaf) discussing and interpreting the works and lives of the “salaf”, that this is the same thing that much of what ibn Taymiyya’s work is anyway. So in a sense it is only a matter of chain of narration and interpretive viewpoint. For instance, whomever from our generation is going to talk about the salaf you mentioned is inevitably going to rely on others before him who are narrating and interpreting the life and works of the salaf including most likely and ironically to your point ibn Taymiyya himself. I hope this is clear.
Please understand that I agree that it would be beneficial inshallah to invite knowledgable speakers to discuss in detail the life and works of the earlier scholars including the ones you mentioned. My disagreement is with the way you went about justifying it. I do not find it “awfully irking” that the life and works of a scholar of the intellectual and historic weight of ibn Taymiyya is being discussed and detailed from various focal and view points. I understand that not all muslims agree with some of his views and works, but at least some do and find no other channel going into his life and works in such depth and volume as BT.
If you have guest suggestions for BT please share them so the brothers at BT can see your suggestion and so we all benefit as well inshallah.
Peace be upon you, and Eid Mubarak.
@@ramialhamad8768 that sounds like just another of the typical and it must be said all-too-convenient post-rationalisations we’ve all grown accustomed to hearing from his adherents.
Ibn Taymiyyah has many good books, too bad they're overshadowed by his other very questionable books in which he advocates for violence against other Islamic minorities and straight out lying on Muslim schoolers of his time
Are you Nusairi?
@@shihabshihabi375 No
Thank you 1000 timss brother Paul
Philosophers are called Ahul ArRay in Arabic..اهل الراي..those who follow opinions.
My translation for the word combines Arabic with Greek based on my native English ( I am American.) with degrees in History.
Philo was an Alexandrian Jew who lived in Egypt pre Christianity. Born 20 B.C. died 50 C.E. He was highly influenced by the Hellenistic civilization in which he lived, rejecting the Orthodox religion for something more loosly interpretive.
Sofia is the Greek word for wisdom..So PHILOSOPHY combines his name and belief system.
In Arabic the word for wisdom is HIKMAH.The sunnah is that hikmah includes the words and actions of Prophet Muhammad.
You either believe and follow him or you dont. Most don't, therefore individual opinions thrive.
Know that there is not a single verse in the Quran wherein Allah has told us to believe in Him alone without the mention of the Prophet Muhammad following in the same verse.
Nervertheless, most dont believe and are ungrateful as Allah has said in the Quran.
Study your Islam in Arabic.
How long does it take to master Arabic?
Not true. They are called اهل الكلام
Your etymology for the word ‘Philosophy’ is wrong.
@@bloggingontology1151
Prove it
@@dayan47 you made the claim, you should prove it.
Would you be willing to host a rational critique of Ibn Taymiyyah's anthropomorphism?
you must be a rafidhi or jahmi
@@Ben_B. Neither.
@@Ben_B. you must live here you unthinking Wahhabi, lol. You’ve been spamming the comments section with your bile since this video was released, 😂. Try reading a critique of Ibn Taymiyyah if you’re not too far gone in your ignorance.
@@Ben_B. Probably a salty deviant ashari
@@adeebiqbal6745 No. he is just making an intelligent suggestion. Something, I suspect, which is beyond your comprehension.
I find Ibn Taymiyyas's argument more profound than others while I see a blind man with hardcore belief that there is a creator of the heaven and the universe. Indeed Allah's existence is self-evident, it's a fitrah, no need to reasoning after reasoning..
Ibn Taymiyyah was not a theologian and didn't have a theology. His sole purpose of engaging these topics was to destroy the theologians and their philosophical foundations and show that the traditional non-kalam aqeeda based on the Qur'an and the correct hadeeth is the correct aqeeda.
Any Muslim scholar whose role is to destroy philosophies that are not of the faith of the early Muslims.
Because our religion was completed in the farewell sermon of Prophet Muhammad pbuh
The Prophet Muhammad instructed us to follow his companions and did not tell us to follow Ibn al-Rumi, al-Badawi, al-Ash’ari, etc..
I will follow what he says to my prophet muhammad pbuh because he is my guide to the ultimate truth
Ibn Taymiyyah was an Athari and yes he did use philosophy if you've actually read his work
@@Hastenforthedawm Can you read? I said he used their tools. I can use a carpenter's tools to destroy a table without myself being a carpenter who makes tables. Maybe now you get it.
@@disuser-lp3qv1tm8f he did both. He didn't promote Kalam though.
@@Hastenforthedawm Theology is what they called Kalam. Don't argue about things you don't understand.
Ibn Taymiyyah is not considered a credible scholar in general, except among Salafis. However, Salafis do not actually follow Ibn Taymiyyah; they primarily follow Ibn Abdul-Wahhab. Ibn Abdul-Wahhab is a prominent scholar associated with the Saudi state and is considered the founder of Salafi ideology. It should be noted that Ibn Taymiyyah was not a takfiri (someone who declares other Muslims as unbelievers) but rather an innovator in some aspects and partially held anthropomorphic beliefs. Soo, dear sufi brothers do not hate ibn taymiyyah, he is just being used to propagande ibn abdilvahhabs ideolgy.
Its sad to say but such a brilliant mind mr paul Williams use his channel as time and again dedicate it to his favourite person ibn taymiyah..its very very strange as viewer why time and again he is being promoted..okay we got it you dedicated a session about his reserch etc etc..but it becoming very apparent this CZcams channel is being used just to promote him and repeatedly mr Williams stating ibn taymiyah and interuppting khalil andani ...its really disappointing that it has become a fan based channel unfortunately
What I always wonder about with the fitra argument and what I don't see discussed much, is how do you explain all these diverging beliefs in primitive peoples around the world? Some don't even have a concept of God. What could have happened to their fitra that even the idea of God wouldn't be in their understanding?
The opposite is true. Primitive peoples instinctively believe in the existence of a Creator.
The problem is in the educational systems in the West, which affected the peoples of the East as well, which raise children not to believe in the existence of the Creator, such as Darwin's theory, etc..
You can watch Sheikh Abdullah Al-Ajiri's symposium on this subject, which is translated into English
His definition of intuition slightly leans towards empiricism if I'm being totally honest, he believed in tabula rasa in a sense , but made it so the dhat is more susceptible and receptory to real knowledge that is acquired through sensational experience and conditions, to put it short I'll put two definitions of intuition :
Def A) : apriori knowledge, knowledge that is instilled in the human mind since the very beginning, to the point that he doesn't need empirical experience to know that information ( neccesary truths such as the existence of God, causation, non contradiction.... Etc )
Def B) : intuition is the predisposed human reception of knowledge, that knowledge ( refering to neccesary truths that are mentioned in def 1A)..etc ) is inquired through sensational experience and meeting certain conditions, like a cassette player recieving the information to play the cassette when it's placed in it , the condition here is to play the cassette but it isn't prior but rather it was inquired when sensational condition was met (i.e having the cassette placed in the player ) although these truths are neccesary, but the inquiry of knowledge about them is simply depending on the conditions.
Ibn taymĩyya goes by Def B)
السَّلاَمُ عَلَيْكُمْ وَرَحْمَةُ اللهِ وَبَرَكَاتُهُ SUBHANALLAH... WALHAMDULILLAH... WALAILAHAILLALLAH. WALLAHUAKBAR. WALAHAULAWALAQUATA ILLA BILLAH.
From..Indonesia.
Many anti-philosophical rants are often directed to metaphysics, but from my experience epistemology is worse, lol. Atleast metaphysicians are not skeptics. But, most people won't go deep enough anyway.
May Almighty Allah Reward you Best in this Life and in the Hereafter.
Ibn Taimiyyah was a genius scholar mutaakhkhiriin after tabie' tabi'en. Some of his Fatwa being used till now in some countries. That's why he deserved title "Sheikhul Islam".
Waaay too many examples in the intro.
says D. Abu Yarub Al-Marzouqi says that Ibn Taymiyyah revealed Aristotelian logic, and he did not criticize logic, but rather criticized the metaphysical conditions set by Aristotle. Al-Mazrouq believes that Ibn Taymiyyah is the greatest of the Muslim philosophers
Dr. Al-Tayeb Bou Azza says that Al-Sahwerdi, Al-Nubakhti, and Ibn Taymiyyah are the symbols of the Muslims who criticized Aristotelian criticism scientifically.
Ibn Taymiyyah was the most knowledgeable of these three in the logical industry and the ability to detect its imbalances
It's more than slightly bothersome that Ibn Taymiyyah is attracting so much attention, yet his theology was refuted and mostly ignored until only the last few decades.
It's bothersome because it marginalises Ash'ari and Maturidi theology which by far are the most subscribed to creed in Sunni Islam throughout Islamic history.
This concentration gives the false impression of Taymiyyan ascendancy when in fact the complete opposite is true.
Cope and seethe Ibn plato
Do not worry or be bothered, my friend. Nothing happens except by the will of God. And remember what God said: « *Do people think they will be left alone after saying ‘We believe’ without being put to the test?* We tested those who went before them: *God will certainly mark out which ones are truthful and which are lying.* Do the evildoers think they can escape us? How ill they judge! But as for those who strive for their meeting with God, God’s appointed time is bound to come; He is the All Hearing, the All Knowing. *Those who exert themselves do so for their own benefit* -God does not need His creatures-We shall certainly blot out the misdeeds of those who believe and do good deeds, and We shall reward them according to the best of their actions. »
Triggered Ashar'i who believes the Arabic Qur'an i.e Kalam Lafdhi is created and deflects clear attributes is coping hard
@@sbasha7 Your response reveals that you are likely not capable of understanding the nature of the differences and instead revel in the type of crude tribalism that Islam came to eradicate.
@Adam If falsehood doesn't trigger you (not you personally), then something is wrong with your heart.
❤️❤️❤️🌹🌹
Imam ibn Taymiyyah answered the questions of today's time
he was ahead of his time thats why many scholars said that ibn taymiyyah was an ocean and the other scholars at his time rain drops
Please add Urdu subtitles
The anger is not unexpected from pseudo-Ash'aris given what they did with Ibn Taymiyya.
I'm just sad that I can't react HAHA in their comments.
Ibn Taymiyya was grossly mistaken on contingencies with no first 'alhawadith laa awwala lahaa', and a specie eternality 'alqidam annawi', contingencies within the Divine 'alhawadith fi alDhat', and his falacious typology of Tawhid which is self contradictory. All of the above and other positions were philosophical innovations and not from the Salaf, and he made many strawman claims regarding the Asharis which are unsubstantiated like the claim they negate attributes or limit them to seven etc.
@@bloggingontology1151 again the copy paste stuff keep doing your taqleed on asrar rashid
@@Ben_B. answer the points you jahil!
@@bloggingontology1151 you call me jahil while you didnt touch 1 book of ibn taymiyyah and make taqleed on asrar rashid. Keep your arrogance down
Very systematic!
Why there are no views on this?
Is that Camus in your profile bro?
@@africandawahrevival yes
How comes your comment is 1 month old when he only posted the video few hours ago? 🤔
@@africandawahrevival yes
@@ahmed.aljelali may I ask why? Are you an existentialist?
Islam And Religious Pluralism: The Quran Allows It Most Mullahs Don't Quran 5:84
Christians Worshiped Trinity-God In Prophet Mosque In Madinah 1400 Years Ago And Prophet Did Not Kill Them
Source?
The troll factories are working hard on this comment section. Divide and conquer.
Too many deviants in the comment section. Indeed they feel challenged by the name of Ibn Taymiyyah.
Neo Jahmis coping in the comment section 😂😂
more like wahhabi pagans losin their sh it and gettin owned like always. 🤣
you can't blame em, wahhabi cult has a combined IQ of 1 n that's for writin dogsh it. lmao
The "Hero Wars" adds are extremely sexual. Please remove them.
Channels don't control ads, unfortunately CZcams is full of degenerate ads.
@@aq4356 Unfortunately, CZcams is also still full of Wahhabis.
Ibn Taymiyya was grossly mistaken on contingencies with no first 'alhawadith laa awwala lahaa', and a specie eternality 'alqidam annawi', contingencies within the Divine 'alhawadith fi alDhat', and his falacious typology of Tawhid which is self contradictory. All of the above and other positions were philosophical innovations and not from the Salaf, and he made many strawman claims regarding the Asharis which are unsubstantiated like the claim they negate attributes or limit them to seven etc. (Asrar Rashid)
Asharis literally affirm 7 attributes its in their books. Maturidis affirm 8.
Ashari affirm: Life, Hearing, Seeing, Speech, Might, Will, Knowledge for Allah.
Other attributes they change the meaning to another or make tafweed of the whole meaning and in the result they deny the real attribute. We seek Allahs refuge of these sort of unterstanding
@@Ben_B. your comment here is a clear instance of the petitio principii or ‘begging the question’ fallacy . I.e., the conclusion is taken for granted in the premises.
@@bloggingontology1151 xd
@@Ben_B. Let's be honest They affirm that these 7 or 8 attributes can be known rational without aid of revelation by necessity
@@mohammadzaky5749 then im asking you what do they do with other attributes like anger, love, pleasure, istawa, nuzul, smile, ashamed, beauty etc?
They change the meaning of the apparent meaning to a different meaning and this is wrong.
The same you affirmed Speech, Hearing, Seeing, Will etc. the same you affirm the other attributes.
IbnThaimya's hypothesis is based on an Analog of TRINITY . He manipulated thouheed of Islam into a far west idea of three in one mannerism .