What if Heracross was in gen1? Solo Challenge - Pokemon Yellow
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- čas přidán 26. 05. 2023
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Heracross Rom Patch: drive.google.com/drive/folder...
Rom Patching Site: www.marcrobledo.com/RomPatche...
Rules:
1. Only my starter in battle
2. No items in battle, except held items
3. No glitches, exploits, save states, or RNG manipulation
4. No evasion moves before level 100*
Rule details:
-- *In gen1, evasion boosting is allowed if the Pokemon does it through means other than learning the move by level up or TM. For example, using Mimic or Mirror Move to boost evasion is allowed. (This exception is to keep ranking consistent with my legacy videos.)
-- I am allowed to manipulate my starter
-- I play the game at 4x game speed
-- For fair comparisons all my Pokemon have perfect (or near perfect) DVs / IVs
-- I am allowed to catch HM users - I can use all field moves
-- All in-battle glitches are allowed in generation 1
-- In generation 1, I'm allowed to skip Marowak with the Poke Doll
-- Surge's trash-can-puzzle is automatically solved
-- The bike is allowed in gen1, banned in gen2, and allowed for bypassing terrain in gen3
-- Saving between league members is allowed
-- If the solo Pokemon faints and I choose to blackout it counts towards my reset counter
-- I can pause the game and timer to take breaks
-- The footage is sped up / slowed down to match the pace of my narration
-- The ability Pickup can only be used if the starter has it
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STAB: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
DVs / IVs: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
Damage Calculations: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
Gen1 Stat Calculator: pycosites.com/pkmn/stat_gen1.php
Gen2 Stat Calculator: pycosites.com/pkmn/stat_gen2.php
Gen1 Crit Rates: www.smogon.com/rb/articles/cr...
Learnsets: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
Base Stats: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...) - Hry
I really like these backports. I think it would be really cool to see the gen 1 mons that get evolutions in the future. Like scizor and steelix
No Steel type though.
@@Undrave theres patches to add steel dark and/or fairy
@@emperortoho Sure but it doesn't feel as authentically 'what if they made this guy in Gen 1'.
@@Undrave maybe in the case of fairy since it changes the types of the encounterable mons, but the other two would minimally affect the game(and hardly at all for dark)
Could still do the eevolutions, politoed, tangrowth, electrivire, hitmontop, and magmortar. Might be missing one or two.
I think Quagsire would be an amazing choice for a backport because of the Water/Ground type! it feels like it'll be so great, especially since it starts with Water Gun ready to go and learns Amnesia at level 23. And it even has equal special attack and special defense so you don't have to decide
Aw man if only we got Quagsire in Gen 1!
Mandatory Oddish on Route 25. That's gonna slow it down.
@@dragonslayerz2220 for sure! but with the 2 rare candies you get before then it can probably hit level 23 fast enough and get Amnesia before her. A pretty good attack stat + badge boost and Slam i believe it can deal with her and still have a very competitive time by the end. it's also in medium fast growth rate and not on the slow growth rate thankfully
I like this idea.
What experience group is it in?
Considering Megahorn was an exclusive move to Heracross in Gen II i think it makes a lot of sense to backport it considering GF probably wouldve still given it Megahorn if it existed at that time
After all, they gave Crabhammer to Krabby in Gen 1 before giving Crabhammer to other Crustacean Mons like Crawdaunt, Crabbominable, and Clawitzer.
@@JBly4 I could see 100 power with 65 acc
and they gave goldeen/seaking the move waterfall that later became an hm.
I would love to see a SUDOWOODO backport! Gen 1 had no pure rock type, and starting with Mimic would lend itself to all kinds of silly strategies... if you can get past the base 30 speed and special. 😄
Obviously the best choice for Heracross will be the move submission
Unironically, Submission would do wonders for Heracross competitively in Generation 2 since it lacks proper Fighting STAB.
Hell, it might even win the match-up vs the otherwise unstoppable Snorlax if it did.
@@heartnet40 Not that great since it has terrible accuracy and recoil damage without a good way to heal will limit how much use the mon will get before it drops.
@@InfernosReaper he has rest could have leftovers and could receive a wish
@@InfernosReaper Dude, it would be gen 2, everyone uses rest in gen 2
Rest sleep talk with Submission would be dope in gen 2 for Heracross
Funny thing is though we're more familiar with the Roman name Hercules, this Pokemon gets the Greek version Heracles (glory of Hera).
Man, Heracross in Gen 1 with Swords Dance/Earthquake/Rock Slide/Megahorn looks scary. With no Skarmory or Forretress getting in the way this thing could just murder your team.
For anyone wondering, Heracross's time would put it in A teir. Likely around Hypno.
I really enjoy the backports. Maybe Celebi vs Mew would be cool.
When I put Heracross in Gen I before I did use its Special Defence stat for its Special. My reasoning was that because Heracross doesn't learn any Special moves, then using its Special Defence stat would make it almost the same as the usual Heracross we know stat-wise. But to be honest, you are 100% correct, if Heracross was actually in Gen I in the first place it would've definitely had a low Special. When they did the Special split they gave most of the Fighting types a higher Special Defence (e.g. Hitmonlee, Hitmonchan, Machamp), because at that point they knew how terrible the type was so wanted to buff them all. Machamp was clearly intended to be a top-tier Pokemon like Golem, Alakazam and Gengar were, and Machoke was supposed to be a good Pokemon like Kadabra, Haunter and Graveler if you couldn't trade. But Fighting-types were so bad that Machamp is probably an even worse Pokemon than Abra and Gastly in Gen I. I love the Gen I games but they really messed up with that one. I think the Cubone for Machoke/Machamp in-game trade in Yellow was to give an incentive to actually use a Fighting-type in a playthrough. I think in the Nintendo Cup 97 tournament basically nobody used any Fighting types, so the game designers would've realised then at the very least.
Came into the comments with this exact reasoning in my head. Glad to see someone thinking the same and to not have to explain myself :) although if Scott is trying to match the original design (flaws and all) it maybe makes sense that he would err on the side of making ported fighting Pokemon terrible where possible lol
A good reference for what should be Heracross's Special is Pinsir and Scyther. Both use their lower Sp.Atk as gen 1's special (and note that neither of them has any Special moves either). So it definitely looks like Scott made the right choice in going with the Sp.Atk stat instead of Sp.Def.
As an idea, you could use the Seismic Toss TM on the self destructing hiker to make it a bit quicker
Yes. Would've been two-hits on the Geodudes.
I'll have to remember that one!
27:45 When you kill Kadabra Heracross's speed was 120.
This means that even if you had leveled up earlier, you would have been faster than Kadabra.
I like the backport videos as occasional vids. I don’t know how feasible this would be to implement, but I’d be curious to see how Smeargle does with Sketch in Gen 1.
Mimic already has the Sketch behavior in Gen 1 if the opponent switches 😆
Never heard of that. An interesting oversight since I'm pretty sure only jugglers and Agatha switch.
I would be very interested to see a Gen 3 Psychic type backported, maybe Claydol or Lunatone? Would be interesting to see if they get carried by their Psychic typing into a really great time.
Yessss, especially with rock slide!
Wobbufet ?
@@InsanityForce There's no Mirror Coat in Gen 1. And, Counter works differently in that it only works on Normal and Fighting moves.
@@shadowtitanx3962 That was the joke.
Maybe Xatu?
I'd be really curious about Ledian because you could be very generous (110 special and elemental punches), moderate (55 special with punches) or very harsh (55 special and no punches). Might even be an interesting one to run with the different interpretations.
Ledian doesn't get the elemental punches by level up, though. I feel as though it would be too much of a stretch.
omg even if it doesnt afford to get the punch moves, i would love to see base 110 special giving Ledian a chance to not be so terrible
Sadly, 110 Special would mean nothing on Ledian without the punches. Its entire Gen2 movepool is physical, except for the punch TMs and Giga Drain. I love using it with those in Crystal because it's funny seeing a ladybug punching Gyarados and Dragonite for 4x damage, but that's not an option in Gen1, where it would be reliant on a movepool consisting of only Normal type moves and Dig. There's one other special move it gets. Psybeam. But that's breeding only.
@@justsomejojo god damn lmao, i thought it at least got psychic from TMs like butterfree / venomoth. Even ariados gets psychic!
@@mymarshlands Garbodor gets Psychic, even
If you ever decide to backport mons past Gen 2 into Yellow, Slaking would be a funny one for just how OP it would be in a gen where Truant or abilities at all don't exist.
Regigigas 🗿
@@TheModdedwarfare3 Him too lol.
It would be interesting to see what the level-up moves would be. No Slack Off, Encore, Feint Attack, Yawn, or Focus Punch (who cares though lol).
I think Piloswine would be a cool back port cause of it’s unique ice ground type but Kingdra would also be cool to compare it with Seadra
Or maybe Bellossom vs Vileplume / Politoed vs Poliwrath ? SlowBro/King may be a bit too similar ?
He's done Kingdra before
Backport suggestion: Sunflora. How would a Pure Grass type perform? It can Learn Swords Dance in gen 3. It gets the move Growth pretty early on at level 4 or 6. Pound is its starting normal move along with absorb. It is also in the Medium-Slow growth rate. Gets Razor Leaf at level 10. Downside? It has a base 30 speed. and a base 55 in defense. I would say it would have its high 105 special stat since its special defense is a mere 85 in gen 2. Main challenge? All of the poison, bug, and flying attacks heading its way something it cannot outspeed. Even with Mimic capabilities, would you need to have it with Cut as a primary? Is Sunflora even possible with its limited movepool?
Scott said he decided to give Heracross 40 Special because it wouldn't have special moves anyway, so I'd assume Sunflora would get the higher special stat as a pure grass type.
If it has no special moves, does 95 special actually make sense, since it's effectively just the special defense stat then?
My thoughts exactly
If we look at other fighting type mons (primeape, hitmonlee, machamp) they always have their lower special attack as the special value in gen 1 instead of their higher special defence
I agree but that's definitely not what GameFreak would have done.
Look at, say, Hitmonlee/Hitmonchan (35 special -> 35 SpA 110 SpD), Machamp (65 Special -> 85 SpD 65 SpA) , Pinsir (55->70) and Scyther( 55->80). OK Hitmonchan did get elemental punches and Machamp had Fire Blast. (and Chan really needed the Special, actually)
Imagine if Gen 1 Amnesia Snorlax also had 110 Special instead of 65. It does learn some good special moves like most normal types.
Love these backporting videos, super interesting way to explore the older generations :)
Togepi or Ho-Oh would be interesting seeing as they were in Gen 1 in the anime.
Not a mon backport, but doing a Magnemite and/or Magneton run with Steel type reintegrated would be interesting!
You should backport a salemence or flygon with dragon claw to see how a dragon type with a dragon move (that's not dragon rage) does in Gen 1
Could also just give Dragonite Dragon Claw. Or do both and do a vs.
Memorizing you upload schedule is totally worth it
I'm surprised Pin Missile didn't even beat out Twinneedle since Heracross actually does learn Pin Missile in generations 6-7 (granted, this was done to synergize with them giving Mega Heracross Skill Link as its ability).
Man this one was awesome! I’m happy you went with some Gen 1 vibes that were a detriment to Heracross, like having 40 Special as well as delaying Horn Attack to a later level.
I wonder if Heracross needed Rest for the later parts when Swords Dance entered the picture. Granted we didn’t see every battle after Swords Dance, but Heracross seemed like it would have benefitted from keeping Body Slam, notably from Exeggutor. Then again, maybe Rest is an important safety net.
Love watching these back ports! Especially stoked for this one, as Heracross is my favorite Pokemon. Thanks for providing the rom patch!
Fun fact about Lorelei's "Smart-ish AI" is that they added that for Yellow specifically because in R/B, having a lead Pokemon who could be forced to always use Rest (in a room you cant backtrack out of) left some potential softlock possibilities, since Trainer Pokemon dont have PP so if you can't kill it in two turns the fight never ends.
Yeah we all know this already man
@@BugOnAChip I didn't
I love these back ports; this is great! Such a cool thing you’re doing, Scott
I wish I had your rom patch!
**Started watching and THANK YOU for the rom patch!!**
Love the backports and the minimalist approach you take to them! Although I may be the only fan of this Mon, I would love to see you backport Sawk into Yellow!
Love these. I work Saturday so listening to these on saturday rules
I appreciated the slowbone call out made my day. Keep it up Scott love the content
These backporting videos are the most interesting and fun in my opinion. Hope you keep doing them. Greetings from Germany bro 🙏
I love these backports, Heracross was superb, I knew you'd get a sub 1 hour, but sub 50 min, most impressive. I got 2 ideas for a backport next. 1. Crobat, this thing is a beast, as Golbat had a surprisingly good special in Gen 1, Crobat will have a good one as well, making special moves decent throughout, plus its speed will make it a crit machine. 2. is there a way to backport Hidden Power and have it function like it does in Gen 2, imagine the absolute power some mons would have with HP Ice or Ground to improve their poor Gen 1 movesets. how about a mad 3rd option of HP on a Magikarp, just for giggles?
It would probably be easy to "backport" Hidden Power by cheating a little. If he just manually added a move called "Hidden Power" with the appropriate typing/power and set his DVs appropriately for whatever run he planned on doing (without actually making Hidden Power update its typing or power dynamically based on the DVs), it would function identically to how it would in Gen 2 with no more effort than adding Megahorn. Distributing that as a patch may be confusing though.
hey scott i just got out of the hospital and im doing much better i can walk again and im eating and drinking good still to weak get up on my own but ill never forget how ur videos gave me a bit of joy in the worst time of my life
I always appreciated the editing style of your character just going on after being spotted ❤️
Edit: Nice Arcanine indeed
Yooo you’re a legend for making this patch I’m gonna go test this sucker out
My interest in Pokemon naturally waxes and wanes over time, but you are the only Poketuber that I consistently watch as soon as your videos come out. Your content is entertaining, relaxing, and informative, and you cram so much info and stats into your videos that I'll never get tired of them. Keep it up!
i have been waiting for this for so long! you never disappoint me scott!
Love these backports with signature moves! I think you did a great job with the moveset for sure, feels super Gen 1.
A Lanturn backport would be cool since it has an interesting type combo and a diverse movepool.
I second this one. STAB thunderbolt and Surf, access to ice beam, interesting stat distribution. But also it's SpcAtk and SpcDef are the exact same so you wouldn't have to worry about whether you gave it an unfair advantage or handicap.
Love seeing these backports to Yellow. Nice addition to the usual content.
Great video! Would love to see all of the gen 1 Pokémon that got evolutions in later games, like Pichu, Scissor, and Porygon 2. Maybe even eventually something like Alolan Ninetails or Sandslash with a type swap to a different existing gen 1 type.
Quick note, the good speed Heracross had the bad speed tag on it during the Lance fight, though the slight screen tint was correct.
Loving the back ports. Piloswine, Houndoom with dark typing, and Ampharos would be my requests, as they are my favorite three from gen 2.
Thanks for the awesome videos Scott!
I love the super cartoonish bomb the hiker in the art is holding. Combined with his mischievous grin, I think it suits him perfectly
Hero-Cross is one of my faves. This was great, ty so much!
Something that I have been very curious about would be play-throughs of the game where the major glitches in the game are fixed, making the game closer to what the developers actually intended. This would include removing things like the badge boost glitch, 1/256 glitches (for missing and for crits), the messed up type interaction between ghost and psychic, counter only affecting normal and physical moves, paralysis-speed bug, mimic swap bug, fixing the poke-doll exploit, and more. I also think that making struggle a typeless move would be worth considering, although this might be too large a change.
These portbacks are pretty cool.
I love the backports, this is so interesting. The difference between run 2 and 3 is also fascinating! I would love to see a perfect run vs a worst run, with 1 in all dvs, not only speed but attack, defence etc too!
really great video!! thanks for the upload love your videos
A little late to the party but..... banger of a vid! Love the "back loading" of Pokemon through generations idea too. Keep it up!
I always chuckle at all the little edits in these vids - I love angry Kabutops!
What a fantastic choice to bring back to gen 1! I think it's gonna do a really good job today!
Love the backports! Great run
Love the content! Would love to see the gen 2 starters compete against one another in gen 1!
I'm bursting out in laughter at the thought of running into a level 46 ratticate and how fast it would be in real life. Imagine watching a huge rat hyper fang a vulpix and when it faints, the rat sees you and starts running towards you. Nightmare fuel.
Dude, these dashboards are insane =o!
I adore these backport videos! Espeon, Leafeon, or Glaceon would be cool candidates for the next backport! :)
Just got home from an overnighter and was looking for more content from you to consume before heading to bed
I'm impressed by Heracross in gen 1 all around. Great video Scott.
Wow good job you added Megahorn, can't imagine how Heracross would have coped without it!
Man, idk why youtube stopped recommending me these. Can't believe I missed this banger!
Silly CZcams.
this video was awesome, keep it up man.
Excellent video as always =)
I figure it's gonna be tricky to back-port Dark type Pokemon, when that is possible I'll be really excited to see Umbreon. Until then I think that Mantine might be very interesting/strong.
This was really fun to watch.
I love this series I like seeing how well pokemon of other games do in here
I'd love to see a Gardevoir Backport. Anyway, Heracross did surprisingly well.
Love the video! Keep up the good work!
Do more of these and you'll have yourself a sub. Backporting sounds so interesting and it changes so many things in gen 1
(I aint a jerk so ill subscribe anyway, but please do more of these, they're pretty interesting)
This video spurred me into making a series of spreadsheets of Gen 1 "retrogrades" for future Gen mons, with the Special Stat, Movepools in the Gen 1-2 style, very few newer attacks being present, etc.
I'm glad you left in the little explanation marks on nugget bridge.
Otherwise, I would have worried you were skipping ahead!
i love all your vids man i would love to see more back-ports of course. kind of curious about my only non-fire fave starter totodile.
I definitely think if GF made this guy in gen 1, they would've made megahorn specifically for him as an exclusive anyways, so it totally makes sense backporting it
Abilities didn't exist yet, but in that champion battle that's truly a guts heracross
Im glad you ended up doing megahorn i didnt see how the poll ended
"I want you to look at my PP" will never stop being funny.
Keep up the great videos! o/
Top backport requests:
1. Celebi (pokemon who can literally time travel)
2. Gen 1 evos to compare with the original counterparts (my fav being scizor, though not sure how hard the steel type would be to include)
3. Eeveelutions (espeon not getting confusion until 16 would make for a painful early game)
4. Larvitar line (same a steel, not sure how hard it would be to include dark type)
Loving all your videos!
What an amazing concept!
more backport pokemon! those are always fun runs to see. I'd like to see ampharos, it's one of my favorite gen 2 pokemon
"But that leads us to Agatha,"
The best sleights are those which slip under the radar~
This is awesome content to see from you.
Heracross is a beast, can't wait to see how it goes in Yellow :)
Uhh.. Scott plays yellow lol
@@adventureoflinkmk2 umm, I know, and I'm not sure why you wrote that reply to my comment. I can read video titles 😉
Heracross had a tough time with its 45 base special and with its bad typing for gen 1. Even though after making some optimizations,it had some fantastic results. 😊 That makes me want to watch a Joltik playthrough in gen 1 as a kind of follow up run , because they share the bug type, and Joltik I think is going to have better special stat then heracross did , I think 🤔. And besides I really want to know how the Ai in gen 1 would interact with different types of Pokemon. I really like the series, keep it up.😊
yea joltik sounds fun
LOVE this cross gen series! It's so cool and unique!
At least I got the “Slo-Bone” shoutout even if he’s not gonna use it.
Heracross with no megahorn is just a pinsir
Except, Fighting type is a liability and lower Special. Pinsir being Mono Bug is way better on top of slightly more Special. Ironic, considering that Pinsir is always in Heracross's shadow until Mega Pinsir showed up.
Hey Scott, don’t know if you’ll see this for a while but in a wild Pokémon battle picking the run option even in newer generations still takes up your turn if you can’t escape and I think that’s how it’s supposed to be
My favorite Pokémon as a gen 1 starter? Say less. Thanks for linking the patch file, this is dope. If you ever make the same patch for fire red, it’s on!
I absolutely love these!
Without dark, fairy, steel or abilities, I think the next Pokémon that would make for great content would be:
3. Mewtwo X versus Y
2. Alolan Raichu (remember it can learn Surf!)
1. Arceus race of all 15 legal types
When you said the early game has been brutal on Heracross, it reminds me of when I used it in Crystal. It's very limited movepool drove me crazy, but it's sheer raw power with normal moves like Headbutt got through a lot when it mattered. I used Rock Smash and Fury Cutter, despite the weak power, but it was quite an experience and fun to use. Once it learned Earthquake, Reversal, and Megahorn, it was a beast.
With back-ports, I like the concept for Pokemon that make sense to be in Generation 1. Heracross fits in perfectly with Pinsir and Scyther design wise, for example.
So how about Regional variants? Their Kantonian forms are already in the game. I think it'd be very interesting to see how a Fighting Tauros or Ghost Marowak would do!
I really like these backport pokemon videos. I would love to see Breloom soon, either in Gen 1 or Gen 2. For a Gen 2 mon, I'd love to see how little Natu does in Pokemon Yellow.
Favorite pokemon of Gen 2 and still my absolute Go To fighting type to this day.
Another banger vid! I'm a bit curious though. If you can backport some moves to Gen 1, would it be possible to change the attack power and accuracy of the moves to reflect their current values?
If possible, you can maybe do some replays of select pokemon you want that maybe underperformed than expected and see how they'd fare if (for example) Leech Life was an 80 power move
Really cool video! And really nice to see the differences in DVs. Lmao at you not using Megahorn after taking all that effort to program it in - it would have been cool if you could have used it at the end though, Rest seems rather useless after the self-destructing hiker
Girafarig/Quagsire/Blissey/Lugia would all be cool backports too. Thanks for the quality content.
There is a gen 1 lugia run somewhere, Aeroblast is OP
Nidorino and eventually Nidoking carried me through Yellow way back in the day!! Seriously strong back then. It was my only Pokemon that hit level 100 lmao, which was an excruciating grind for the first gen.
I really like the idea of backporting the regional variants of gen 1 pokemon!
Of course adding pokemon that have types that did not exist in gen 1 might be tricky, but there are plenty of options that don't have that problem.
Alolan raichu could be a good place to start since it's the evolution of yellows maskot and also because by getting psychic it would gain some much needed coverage. There are many other pokemon that could be really interesting like Galarian Slowbro, Paldean Tauros or the galarian versions of the legendary birds.
Also the other eveelutions would be interesting.
When I was rewatching the fossil solo runs, it occurred to me that the Rock Water typing being resistant to normal type moves for the early game while still taking only neutral damage from Misty could be replicated without the crippling weakness to Grass that the fossils have: Rock Grass (like Cradily) or Ghost Grass (like Gourgeist).
Then I remembered how much Grass types struggle against Lance's Aerodactyl and figured the typing still isn't probably worth it. ^_^"
Excellent video Scott, thank you!
I think it's fair to think that heracross would have had megahorn, a good analog for this is how Kingler got crab hammer. Actually gen 1 is jam packed with signature moves, many of them there just for flavor.
Its asking a lot (sorry Scott!) But it would be cool to see you try giving back port pokemon 2 or 3 kinds of the game freak treatment. Like on the one hand a totally thoughtless and failed execution (such as their treatment of sycther), then a middle of the road treatment like you did here, and then maybe a peak potential run where a pokemon gets a decent level up set, like as if it was a starter pokemon. In heracross' case that could mean giving it moves like leech life, karate chop or low kick earlier on. 4x against grass poison and grass psychic with leech life would be cool to see haha 😂
I agree that the 40 special is whay GF would have done in gen 1, after all the hitmons only got their super high SDEF after gen 1. It seems like gf was kinda overreacting after how psychic type dominated in gen 1. Even still they failed to fix fighting type hahaha.
For the back port series, are you planning on doing all the pokes cut from the original 190 pokemon of gen 1? Seems like the best candidates
My favorite pokemon is back on the channel! Hurray!