Greyhawk Is WotC's Next Victim
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- čas přidán 2. 08. 2024
- Greyhawk will feature in the #onednd DMG. If you are a Greyhawk fan, you should not be happy about this.
#dnd #ttrpg #osr
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The Greyhawk Grognard channel had a video about this topic and he played somber funeral music through the whole video.
I saw it.
I just had a mental image of the 4x2 framed Greyhawk map on my study wall spontaneously combusting in horror at this news - right in front of my eyes.
I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news
Explosive Runes Triggered! 😂
Greyhawk is gonna get the two male halflings kissing on the cover treatment
and you can bet they'll be visually very efeminate. cannot afford the danger to have machos (unless those are stupid and villanous), even if they're cock-appreciators
lil niggas kissin
Did that happen?
This new version shall be dubbed "Gheyhawk"
Can't wait for the Adventures of Freddy Furry and the Rump Rangers in GheyHawk.
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LOL, spot on... that's what we'll get. Vecna will suddenly resemble Donald Trump, Greyhawk's druids will be hyper-fetishized like they are everywhere else in 5e, the Flannae people will become a "marginalized ethnic group", etc..... GOD this freaking sucks.
"The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real things of its own."
Indeed. Spread the word, share the video!
in other words: Evil is the absence of Good, it is Not-Being, therefore cant create shite
That cover looks like an intern from a London advertising firm had a fantasy art Tumblr. I'm sure the interior will be the same, and that they will 'diversify' Greyhawk.
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All WotC stuff looks like Magic the Gathering. That's all they do.
Greyhawk has nothing to do with the colorful, sanitized, furry-esque and inofensive 5e mood.
it will be s.o.b wotc
Well it will now lol
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I know nothing of Greyhawk, Mystara, whatever, as I'm young and didn't dive into any. Can you kill some of my curiosity as to the feel of the world?
@@isaacmarx6277Greyhawk vs Other Settings czcams.com/video/SsbX-f52ks0/video.html
They've already turned Bigby into a gnome and Iggwilv into a misunderstood villian during 5E, so... yeah. All signs point to shit.
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WTF?!? I've only tangentially been paying attention to the stupid things they've been doing, because I know they'll be stupid, but did they SERIOUSLY make Bigby a Gnome, just because the dude from Critical Role who liked to use his hand spells was also a Gnome? I don't even mind Critical Role, (except insofar as people who have no business emulating them keep trying to emulate them) but holy shit, what is wrong with WotC?
Yeah that was despicable. Iggwilv is basically a cosplayer of a goody two shoes in 5ed. She turned over a new leaf and Is reformed....how? We dont know. Wotc says: It s Just a phase.
Guess next time we ll get Demogorgon adopting kittens for fun.
Bigby? They said that he was crushed by a giant boulder(lucky Crit) and Mordy was too stingy to resurrect him as human so he paid a Hobodruid to do the reincarnation mumbo jumbo.
Too bad Bigby probably knows the Clone spell meaning the whole thing Is beyond stupid.
Next time what Greyhawk Npc Is going to be ridiculed Wotc?
Isn't Greyhawk very European-centric? Yeah, that's going to be very problematic to the wokeists.
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Don't worry, they'll add plenty of black people to it
Oh, but they'll talk about the native Flan were opressed by the evil and imperialistic suloise.
I'm sure they'll add immigrants to to the setting now...
To the wokies all the settings were problematic! Serious which setting did they not corrupt?
After the assertion about Elmores famous Red Box Cover, theres no way this wont be trashed to heck!
It surely will be.
I just also read that the PHB cover character spelling-up is supposed to be Yolande, the elven queen of Celene... and she's black.
Where did you hear that?
Well of course she's Black! 🤣
I really like the geography of Greyhawk. Dungeon Masterpiece video on the geopolitics of the world showed me the great adventuring potential it has.
Not with WotC though
@@RPGPundit Modern WotC is disappointment. They couldn't see potential even if it was a pie and it hit their face.
I ran a 2 year greyhawk campaign at Uni 35 years ago. I only had the boxed set, but it was enough, my world probably had no resemblance to official greyhawk lore, but the main villain was Iuz, and they were based at greyhawk city. The wizard, who was a necromancer, became the guild master of the grave diggers and embalmers guild, and secretly built a massive undead army which he used to help defeat Iuz’s undead army.
thats cool
Sounds good
I put in an order with drive thru back in January. After not getting my order for 3 months, I contacted them last month. It's been three weeks since then and still nothing. So good luck with that.
Damn. The infrastructure really is collapsing.
And now the activism crusade wraps around to the origin of D&D settings.
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I have used 5ed exactly how you describe it since it launched. I have never understood why people balked at the idea of running the game customized! Lol
Most millennials aren't creative enough.
What does it take to make a campaign setting? Step one: random tables. Step two: congratulation yourself on making your setting.
More or less correct
I'll take to the High Seas for the digital map, assuming they didn't change it. The rest will be useless.
just make your own greyhawk setting! less heart break, less nonsense, less hassle!
We live in a strange time where some of the best RPG material has been published in recent years, while at the same time the publisher of 'official' D&D continuously expands a creative wasteland (intentionally). Anyways, looking forward to reading and playing Baptism by Fire.
Thanks! Let me know how you liked it!
@@RPGPundit I definitely will!
I learned after the first couple products of yours that I purchased to always buy the print copy as well as the PDF. Got the hardcover of BoF enroute!
Awesome, thank you!
I heard about this yesterday from Greyhawk Grognard, old-school GH fan like myself. I am a HUGE fan of Greyhawk, having grown up with it and poured my heart & soul into it since the 80s. Seeing it ignored by 5e era D&D up till now was less hurtful than hearing THIS. Like everything else the woke cult infiltrates, it'll be destroyed. It PISSES ME OFF.
i feel for you.
WotC and Hasbro shall not get another cent from me.
What happened to their inclusion review process with the word "MASTER" in Dungeon Master's Guide. We can't even use the phrase Master Bedroom in real estate anymore. Now it's Primary Bedroom and Primary Bathroom. This is the issue with censorship, it never ends with how far it goes.
Greyhawk was the first published game setting I ever played in. For me, the 1983 boxed version will always be definitive. I actually don't care what WotC does with the setting since I don't buy any of their products.
Shoutout to the Greyhawk Grognard. That guy has better 5e Greyhawk material (and all other editions) than ANY WotC source you've seen!
Go check it out, and it's free!
Also his work he publishes is well worth purchasing as well. Adventures Dark and Deep - AD&D 2nd edition as if Gary would have done it.
Yup, he does good work.
@@RPGPundit You do too! I just want to see you guys cross pollinate more!
I have the physical book.
I have had it over a week now.
I just haven't done a video of it yet.
Of Baptism of Fire? Well, please send me a DM on X or something when you do!
@@RPGPundit yes i do have it ( in soft cover ).
We didn't muck about. We knew from previous experience that we'd want the full color hardcover because your books are beautiful and they are of a quality that DESERVES to be in hard cover.
Also: DON'T RUSH THE PRINTERS!!!!! PLEASE!!!!
I'd rather wait six months to get a well-made book than wait six weeks to get something they slapped together as fast as they could!
Greyhawk is mostly awesome. There were a lot of things the gazetteer didn't really explain but that doesn't really matter because you're supposed to make it your own anyway. All I can say is that I'm very glad my ex- didn't manage to steal my Greyhawk maps and books.
The Woke on the Coast will probably make the Bone Marches into the heroes of the world and turn the city of Greyhawk into Seattle 2026. I've never given those psychopaths a dime and never will. "You're paying money to people who killed your puppy." Yup. That's exactly accurate. Their goal is to destroy not create.
(What did she get? AH's Starship Troopers, Star Fleet Battles and a pile of expansions, Magic Realm, Ace of Aces, Ogre and GEV, and much more... There was this shed on the property she was renting, you see... And I forgot about my stuff being in there... Even more tragically, she probably just threw it in the trash.)
Thanks for your purchase!
I apologize if I've spammed your comments, but this really, really, really hits home in a dreadful way for me. I just want to add that every single word you said here is 100% CORRECT. Thank you Pundit. I'm going to share your video with everyone who'll listen.
Thanks!
Condolences to the Greyhawk fans out there. WoTC has a reverse-Midas touch with these "updates". They turn them to 💩
Yes. Spread the word, share the video!
This is all academic to me. WotC was dead to me when fourth edition was released.
Same here.
Left WoTC after that 4E garbage and never looked back.
Congrats on the success of Baptism of Fire! Also, I love Greyhawk and am pissed about this. Watch, the Circle of Eight will now be 4 diverse women, 1 trans, a "good" drow, race-swapped Bigby (I heard they made him a gnome), and Mordenkainen. And since Mordy will be the only straight white man, he'll most assuredly be made the bad guy of the group.
That's pretty likely.
The only positive future for official D&D would be for Hasbro to sell D&D to a creative entity, who would then either focus on D&D as a toolkit and/or create brand new settings that were not reflections of current political fashions. WOTC has made such a mess of the classic settings that they’re basically unrecoverable.
That would probably only happen if Hasbro went bankrupt, but no company survives forever.
Planescape > Ravenloft > Dark Sun > Spelljammer > Greyhawk > Mystara > Dragonlance > Forgottten Realms
I'm counting the campaign settings that occur in the same world (like Kara-Tur and Forgotten Realms) as part of the original, and I never played Birthright, Lankhmar, Eberron, any of the one-off settings (like Council of Wyrms), or Magic the Gathering settings.
Baptism of Fire IS THE FIRE!
Thank you!
Well, Greyhawk was supposed to be the default setting for 3e but they never really did anything with it. the 5e crowd is a different type though. We'll see. Can't wait for your "I told you so" video though.
Didn't you know that The only white member of the Circle of Eight was Rary?
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The Ruining of Greyhawk.
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As an avid Dark Sun fan, I still thank whatever power or god allowed us to dodge the bullet that unfortunately the Greyhawk fans are now going to have to endure. You know whats going to happen, and all you will be left with will be a hollow shell of a game that will on paper look like Greyhawk, but in many ways it more than likely wont resemble the original campaign setting at all. You have my genuine sympathies in advance.
Oh, just give them time...they've admitted there is audience for Dark Sun and they're hesitant (not opposed) to reviving it. It wont be long now before they run out of easier stuff to ruin and turn to "fixing" Dark Sun to make it "for modern audiences." Stripmining the work of better creatives is all they can do at this point to turn a buck.
Mystara fan here. The only setting WotC never ever touched at all. We were the ones spared.
BoF n1 in Historical on Drivethru..
That's great, but makes sense given there aren't that many historical RPGs, and it's also still #1 in Print.
The only bright side about all the traditional settings getting destroyed, is that I’m really inspired now to reread CAS, R E Howard, Tolkien, and various real world mythology as inspiration to develop my own settings.
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WotC fucked up the 5E reintroduction of Ravenloft (don't scare players!), Spelljammer (why the fuck is it in the Astral Sea?), Dragonlance (not a campaign book but a meh adventure), and to a lesser degree Planescape (they don't make alignment relevant to the Outer Planes).
What happened to the Plasmoids weighing 2000 pounds or more?
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WOCT is like the cosmic destroyer of worlds. Something like Tiamat, but trans
Oh yeah.
The treatment of spelljammer is actually what really started my disillusioned official 5e.
And it only got sooo much worse from there.
But... but that's the world with that undead guy from Stranger Things... Vecna!
Need to buy it now just because it reminds me of the old times. Remember Vecna? Remember Mordenkainen?
Seriously, after Ravenloft I have stopped following WotC.
Viktra Mordenheim was a true direct stab in the heart. They couldn't change Strahd because they had already put to the print the new and politically improved Curse of Strahd.
Then came out all that crap with dungeons for disabled, anarco-socialists in the ethereal plane, queers in space, and Undragonlance.
I was waiting for the next victim... and here it comes.
The only one they're not going to touch is Mystara - too problematic to even consider.
A friend of mine (I think you know who he is) was accused of being racist because he wrote a tongue-in-cheek gazetteer for the orcs back in the 80s. Heck, the dude understood what the humanoids stood for in old D&D and approached it the right way by making them imitate the surrounding cultures.
I'm the one that introduced my kid to 5th edition; I'm the same one that has convinced him to let it go and go OSR.
I wish the worst to WotC.
Your analysis is spot on.
Nope. Dark Sun is the one never going to be touched cause "slavery centered".
@@professord6968 Oh, I forgot that one. See, while I don't align myself with conservativism (I'm more of a libertarian) I can't stand these self-destructive neo-liberals. Backalong, Dark Sun was the most 'leftist' of the settings with heroes fighting an oppressive and tyrannical world full of all those things that it's fun to rebel against, but these people don't want to even talk about.
These killers of joy consider an interesting setting one where you play a barista in a cafeteria and try to solve 'love crises' with magic...
Yeah i agree. Regarding Ravenloft they could have made Victor s wife Elise the new Darklord swapping their roles due the fickleness of the Dark Powers in some strange way.
But noooooo. Let s make a lesbian pseudo horror story with zero sense at all with a genderswapped Victor chasing her lover ignoring the fact that the Darklord will never open the domain to avoid losing her target meaning the adventurer will never visit the domain or escape It.
@@professord6968 I totally agree. It could have been interesting by continuing a legacy. But because this people are creatively dead inside, they prefer to warp, twist, and swap what came before with the clear intent of deleting the past.
I dont know who predicted that wotc would make its way through all the worlds of d & d playing on nastalga to get the quick sucker buck, sorry for the spelling guys hooked on phonics kid here.
Whats your favorite ttrpg? Also, what do you think of Dungeon Crawl Classics?
My favorite RPG is my own system (the OSR variant I used in Lion & Dragon, Star Adventurer, Invisible College, and Baptism of Fire). But I love DCC as a system; I know that these days the company is horribly woke and can't really recommend people buy it, but as a game it is so damn good. So much so that my Last Sun campaign had me publish a Setting book, and a sourcebook (The Gonzo Fantasy Companion) but I didn't create a main rulebook because I can't imagine a set of rules that would do a better job than DCC at Gonzo.
In fact, one of my main criticisms of DCC is that the core rulebook doesn't actually go to the logical result of what "gonzoness" of the rules suggest. The rules are wild, but the implied setting still looks too normal. My World of the Last Sun is a way to correct that: it's a setting that was written with the question "what would a world have to look like where all the DCC rules work the way they do?"
@@RPGPundit Interesting! I already own DCC, dunno anything about the company it's under, but I hadn't played it yet! Looking at it it seems really dope, glad to hear the praise! I'll be running it in my homebrew setting, but I'll definitely check out Last Sun when I have the chance
Inappropriate Characters: I am a bit behind on these livestreams, so you maybe mentioned it in a recent podcast, but why no simulcast on YT?
One of our cohosts got banned
I'm thinking I don't really care if they destroy settings as long as I'm still able to buy the original ones made by TSR from DrivethruRPG.
They can't really destoy anything if we can buy the old stuff. Its like when a movie gets remade eg Road House and we know just by seeing the trailer it wont even be a shadow of the original, but weve stiĺl got the original. The most recent D&D books ive read are 2E... but im a Dinosaur. I'm kind if proud and happy my RPG memories are still intact. Im sticking to 1E 2E and OSR as ive heard so much bad stuff about 5E and WOTC.
Yep, let's try to get those old farts to buy some books! Yeah, no.
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I thought 3E was all about Faurun as I remember
In the 3e era the last decent FR campaign book was published. But the default "setting" of the core books was Greyhawk. You see, for example, the Greyhawk deities were the ones used as examples in the book.
I've heard The WOTC Fs are putting out a new setting called Grey Slop.
Sounds lovely. 😂
From a marketing perspective so much about this is going to be hitting people wrong. Old school gamers who know what Greyhawk is will not want this sludge.
FYI most AD&D lore, like Vecna, is all Greyhawk world lore which has been stripped out to use generically in all D&D editions.
So, let us turn to the wee gamers who are new to all of this. They have no emotional attachment to the name Greyhawk. WOTC will likely do a major flub on it and make it into Grey Slop. I do not believe the kids want this crap either.
I have no idea who they think will be buying this garbage.
It's because its "50th Anniversary", which has been WotC's staff excuse to destroy all the most foundational parts of the D&D hobby.
WotC can't make up their f#cking minds about which setting they're going to use as the default setting for the game. They keep keep haphazardly changing it between editions in a schizophrenic fit and are incapable of sticking to one. THAT'S how much respect this setting is going to get. And that's not even taking into account the culture in WotC--just the fact that they treat the "official" setting like cheap window dressing.
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I'm so glad I ordered Baptism of fire, I'm just gonna pretend Grey hawk isn't going to be mangled by Wotc😂
Thanks for you purchase! If you got it off DTRPG, and you have a second, go to the page and give it a rating or review
Hello!
Staying in the Forgotten Realms. No interest in D&DOne.
And ordered the deluxe hardcover of Baptism sight unseen.
I really appreciate that, thank you!
Shouldn't Radiant Citadel be the main setting? Wasn't it so diverse and beloved? Surely it sold so well, it has to be the flagship going forward, *right?*
Heh, they can't touch Greyhawk. Mr. Gygax blew it up. Ask Gord. If you respect the lore (and we know they never will) you can't touch it. The only Greyhawk left is "our" greyhawk, which we each make. They can ruin _their_ greyhawk all they like, but it doesn't make it any more offical than anyone elses. *You're too late, wokc.*
Though I am (morbidly) curious to see what they'll do to 'Quests from the Infinite Staircase' I'll not buy another wotc product. Even If I ever cave to Ebberon, I'll buy it _used._ They won't get a cent more from me.
You have a playlist for all the inappropriate characters games you play?
Inappropriate characters is not a live play show. It's a talk show with me, venger, and Ryan, often with some guest star, where we talk about news and controversy in the hobby.
You can find our videos here:
rumble.com/c/InappropChars
I think the United States should take a question from Peru.
Where did those people came from?
Communism
They have done this with many things. Star Wars, Star Trek, Dr Who and many other ips. They never create only destroy and we have to stop being fooled by them and the nostalgia trick
Absolutely agree. But in RPGs at least, we have decentralized freedom, and a big indie publishing legacy that means that there's tons of great games, much better than WotC D&D, particularly in the OSR
But, but Pundit . . . it's a map of Greyhawk . . .
Unrelated: I used to be a fan of Dunhill Nightcap, but I haven't smoked a pipe in years. I remember it being pretty strong.
@Kasimir Urbanski hey have you ever thought about a video on getting creating a table that is friendly to conservative players. I have seen this sort of video for the safe space crowd. I am personally on the right but would like to to create a peaceful mixed table. I like having military people with their ideas and Tolkien hippy types around the table as their is always a variety of ideas. Being conservative on the west coast I don't talk about my politics. Some of my players have said shit that has pissed me off not knowing what I think. It was at the end of the game and I was happy enough to have them just leave.
I don't know, I would think that the only necessary element to having a functional ideologically diverse table is to have everyone there for the game & nothing else.
@@RPGPundit Lol , I wish
While I completely agree with you on the settings thing.
Wizards definitely only wants to butcher them or make them disappear.
I'm going to have to disagree with you on the idea that the players didn't mold 5e into a whole bunch of different versions of itself.
I mean have you seen the DM's guild?
Sure there's a ton of woke trash on there.
But there's also a bunch of regular and options stuff as well.
And like I said in a different comment to someone else. There are entire companies dedicated to making 5e mods.
Well, that's something, I guess.
I'll add that the article this came from was written by Chris Perkins, who is a loathsome SJW and a poser, who demonstrably knows jack-all about Greyhawk judging by YT video interviews I've seen him on. Perkins has a permanent "I'm smarter than all you peasants" leer on his face, between his mangled earlobes...and this is the "professional" WotC hired as their chief editor.
Perkins is scum. No one can still be working at WotC and not be scum.
Pretty much so cc
Hail SHIT LORD !!
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I'm totally out of the loop here. What did WOTC do to Ravenloft, Dragonlance and Spelljammer exactly? I heard people complain but nobody says what they did
Made not just bad products but products that gutted everything important about those settings. Turned them all into Seattle Washington Fantasy world. Going even so far as to outright say in Ravenloft that horror was unfun and shouldn't be done, do not ever cause any fear.
If you look, you'll find I did multiple videos of each. Searching for those titles you should find them.
Could have reprinted the previous edition version of this, but couldn’t stop modifying it with their idiotic message.
Strixhaven for example was a bad Hogwarts remake instead of focusing on Mage Guilds.
Candle keep was based on an 80’s children show instead of something actually interesting.
Ravenloft was the less worse of the bad releases as there are plenty of earlier editions to buy instead.
You know, every time you say cosplay, you're insulting cosplay. Every time you call something fanfic you're insulting fanfic writers! No! I'm serious! Cosplayers and fanfic writers have passion! They love these stories and these settings! They love it so much it's made them a little crazy! They are enthusiastic for the stories and characters and the settings and they love the people that are like them. The people who are making this trash hate the settings. If they didn't, they wouldn't change them. They hate the fans. Cosplayers and fanfic writers are innumerable echelons above and beyond the companies and employees making these settings and stories and games that they hate for fans that they despise.
Well, on one hand you have a point. There's definitely cosplayers & fanfic writers who have a genuine love & passion for their subject.
But there's also a lot of "casuals" who enter the hobby from/for cosplay. And lots of fanfic authors that use it as platforms for some agenda that has nothing to do with the hobby
I agree with both positions.
@@RPGPundit Okay, you have a point, but there's something that separates the people with an agenda from the other cosplayers and fanfic writers: activism, and cosplay and fanfiction is always a secondary concern to their activism. And where an actual fan gets in a position to make content, like Henry Cavill or Jon Favreau, the activists do all that they can to discredit and disgrace them. And I can't stand to call them cosplayers and fanfic writers when I could just call them activists. And it's not like it's insulting. They're proud of it! It would be amazing if they turned "activist" into a bad word.
It will be the same way they did the Dragonlance material recently. It was just a train wreck. Sorry for the language but FUCK WotC. I left YEARS AGO and have not looked back. Myself and my group are now Old-School Essentials Advanced Fantasy.
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Buy up the old Greyhawk source material, adapt to create your own OSR variant...and ignore any modern WotC sewage. Easy-peasy.
I love Greyhawk more than Fr setting. And i know Wotc will f.... up Greyhawk .Especially after the revolting gnomification of Bigby in the giant book.
Expecting Transgender Rary, gay Robilar and drama queen Iuz.
Likely they'll just replace some of the famous wizards with "diversity" characters that "canonically were ALWAYS teh most powerful members".
WOTC’s stupid woke crap is what made me and my friends go with Basic Fantasy RPG when we started playing again.
Check out the OSR!
@@RPGPundit I thought BFRPG was part of the OSR? I love it
GURPS doesn't mesh well with DnD.
Its incredibly sad to see the lack of creativity here. Nothing original, just remake something old that people like.
WotC was never particularly capable at creating settings. But in recent years that would be impossible.
Have you ever read the stories about Elminster?
Your fear of human rights is sad.
I'm not sure which stories you mean. Greenwood's original Realms were heavily into kinky straight stuff.