ABS ON vs ABS OFF | What's Really the Difference?
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- čas přidán 13. 05. 2024
- We tested braking with and without ABS, with the same car, on the same surface, with the same driver - all to see what the real difference is. We also tested this in a straight line test, a curve braking test, and a braking lane change.
ABS systems are immensely effective in road cars now, but what happens when you disable this? Is the difference really that big?
Today we have set out three challenges to test this out. And I’m going to drive the same car, on the same surface, both with and without ABS - to see exactly what the difference is.
And to be honest - the difference really surprised me.
⭕ Superkart vs Ferrari 488 Pista
• SUPERKART vs Ferrari 4...
⭕ No ABS Formula 1 Car vs Tesla Drag Race and Braking test!
• Formula 1 Car v Tesla ...
ABS is enormously clever, in that it extracts almost the maximum braking potential from the tyres - whilst not relying on the driver to control the grip.
I’m a pro-racing driver, and many of the race cars I’ve driven, like Formula 1 cars or Radicals, don’t have ABS. But despite this you can actually brake much more effectively than with ABS.
It’s called threshold-braking, and it’s where you aim to press the brake pedal as hard as possible, but whilst staying just below the threshold at which the tyre will lock up.
But the important difference here is that on a track, you do many many laps straight after one another. So you know the turn, and you know the grip level.
But what about on the road? If you’re taking a turn, you often haven’t driven it before. Or if you have, you don’t know the exact conditions at that point in time, or if there is now something in the way.
So ABS replicates a pro-driver, but on any surface, in any condition, irrespective of the driver’s skill. It’s very clever, so let me show you how it works.
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Can you do a lap of a track faster with ABS on or off? This shows that ABS helps braking regardless of conditions and talent, and allows control whilst locked, but can a pro driver do better?
Would love to see a video on different ways you can lose control of your car and how to regain control, e.g. Oversteer from too much lateral Gs on a corner vs oversteer from excess power vs lift off oversteer (where the tyres aren't moving fast enough) etc.
Do this again but try to do your very best without the ABS
LOVE IT, even though I am not a racing car driver my friend was and taught me how to cadence break and handle aquaplaning as well as so much more. But having learned these tools without ever braking hard on non-ABS I had a warped perception.
I thought without ABS with cadence braking you can stop quicker* (obviously depending on road surface, conditions etc)
I have always driven with ABS on I think all my cars, so it was all hypothetical.
Watching this, knowing as a race car driver you know the cadence technique to find limit and back off slightly before increasing pressure and releasing as you slow to a stop. This warped my knowledge, seeing how much worse ABS and non-ABS was, was a surprise to me.
I assumed straight line say 60kph the results would be negligible ABS stopping 5m earlier, this showed the complexity and "well" just how incredible braking software is this days.
Thank you, now if I ever hear an old geezer "ie; my dad" say how much better cars were and abs over-rated I will show him this.
Sorry for the long message, massive fan (mostly of your fathers workshop, but you're alright I guess 😜)
Would be interesting to see what ABS is like compared to threshold and cadence braking.
Cadence? Yeah, that was my first thought too.
Exactly. Obviously ABS is needed when you slam on the brake pedal. But can a pro driver do better without ABS? By how much?
That's what I click on this video expecting
I remember some show from the 90s demonstrating cadence braking, maybe Top Gear before it got all silly and scripted?
Definitely be interesting to see how ABS compares to cadence braking.
Threshold braking? That's a new one to me, guess I'd better google that practice.
You won't be threshold braking in normal day to day driving, unless you're a nutter.
It'd be great to repeat the tests with ABS off, but controlling your braking. Great video!
Was disappointed in them not doing that test, they nailed it otherwise
I feel a good driver could do an excellent job
@@lurka1337 Yes he could, but what would be the point of it? If a racing driver can handle it, the video would create a false impression. It makes sense to not control the breaking since it would be tricking the viewer into thinking it's easy. If you really want to find out, find a unused road and test it yourself. After some practice you'll be able to control the breaking, however you will need practice and you still won't be as reliable as ABS. ABS is used in racing just for this reason, you can be more confident in you're breaking and can shift your focus to the environment and not to master the breaking.
@@Tobiasliese I just think it would be entertaining, you know what you tube is for? I want fact CZcams is not where I go first, sometimes it's useful, but it's just entertainment IMO...
Also would like to see what a good driver or even average driver would do VS ABS
Getting your driver's licence in Norway involves an obligatory session at a skid pan. In my instructor's car, you could turn the ABS on and off at the click of a button, as it was mandatory that all pupils get to acquainted with how a car with and without ABS behaves. Let's just say it was a highly instructive (and incredibly fun) session, and that ABS is basically a godsend to the average driver.
To every driver.
That sounds very good, and I wish we would have this in The Netherlands. I was lucky to have a couple of driving lessons in the snow in which we learned what icy situations did on an empty parking lot that was not having any curbs, and it was indeed a fun and, if you ask me, a very valuable lesson. Probably not one that will make me instinctly do the right thing in case of icy situations, but at least I knew how it feels (weird! :P ).
@@robertvanruyssevelt7159Just the casual drivers. Real drivers don't care.
@@Dutch3DMaster Must feel weird to be a man without a penis too.
You can actually see at 2:19 that the system disables ABS at speeds below about 1-2 mph. Most manufacturers have this to prevent problems like GM had where the car would slow down to 1 mph and keep rolling through a stop sign because of erratic wheel speed sensor signals.
It's also the reason why ABS can fail you in really poor grip conditions, such as snow or ice. once all 4 wheels have stopped turning, the computer doesn't know you're still moving, so it allows the wheels to stay locked.
@@johnhufnagel This is kind of unlikely since all four wheels would have to lock up at the exact same moment. The failure mode I have described is when the computer thinks one wheel is locking up when it actually isn't, and the computer disables the brakes entirely and allows the wheels to free roll at 1-2 mph. Both of these failure modes have been corrected with better software since the infantile days of ABS.
@@kdmq perhaps it's because most of my vehicles are of the early aughts generation, but I have been able to have that exact scenario happen to the multiple times in the snow. Getting all four wheels to locks simultaneously isn't that difficult in a very low traction environment. I guess it's possible far newer vehicles with far newer ABS programming will fare better, but I don't have data to support that.
I've noticed that in Forza Motorsport 7, they appear to simulate some part of this situation. Must be the wrong part, because threshold braking gets really weird at 2 MPH when suddenly brake pressure randomly plummets. If I remember correctly, this occurs with ABS disabled.
@@johnhufnagel I would suspect that this is more due to the "reaction time" of the ABS control module being slower than in present-day computers. Since, due to the weight shift of the car, the back tires almost always lock up either a millisecond before or after the front tires, depending on how the brake proportioning valve is set. You would have to jab the brakes as hard as you can, on the most uniform ice, in a mid-engine car, to truly lock up all four wheels at the same time. That being said, you are still correct in that you can lock up the wheels in older ABS cars from ~2000-2005.
I was expecting threshold braking comparison on ABS and non-ABS systems.
Yeah me too
Yeah, this is dumb, this is Karen Braking VS ABS, I mean, don't get me wrong I like ABS but it is mostly intended for Karens.
@@yoancarlove7383 No, it’s really meant for everyone. People have a habit of making mistakes when they panic. Also winter driving… you should still threshold brake in winter but you’re always running closer to the limit of grip so there are more chances to screw up.
@@yoancarlove7383 You ain't better than the machine, John Henry.
@@yoancarlove7383 - the problem with that attitude is that most of us are Karens if I'm interpreting your reference properly. I've seen comparisons where a "professional" driver could out brake and ABS equipped car under ideal conditions but even then, it took them a few tries to do it. How often do we get to practice in an emergency situation? In less than ideal conditions, even a professional driver couldn't come close to duplicating the stopping distances that an ABS equipped car could achieve. Besides, ABS isn't necessarily there to provide the absolute shortest stopping distance although it can certainly help. ABS is there to insure we stop in a "controlled" manner as this video very effectively demonstrated. The thing is, the vast majority of us aren't nearly as good behind the wheel as we like to think we are.
6:34 I didn't notice that was a life sized cutout of Hamster until that shot
Savage!
same
One of the many reasons why I roll my eyes when someone says “all these electronic assists kill the driving experience”.
On a race track YES!
But on a road they saved more lives than is possible to count.
Why does everyone act like they are F1 driver and need all the power and “driver” feel while lugging in their Fiesta to Lidl?!
@@DMAX-tp4pc That is why F1 banned ABS and Traction Control, it makes them much faster, to the point of being potentially less safe than normal.
Or me in my 2014 Kia Soul turning off traction control so I can get that launch off the green light lmfao. Ig we kind of just like pretending we drive fast cars. A boy can dream can’t he…
Would also be interesting to see how 20 years old ABS compares to the new versions.
I've heard some of the first abs modules operated at 2 hz.
@@juanordonezgalban2278 Believe in JESUS today, confess and repent of your sins. No one goes to heaven for doing good but by believing in JESUS who died for our sins. GOD loves you soo much unconditionally.😍😚☺❤🍂
really sucks. almost caused an accident in our familys truck so i pulled the fuse and braking is a lot better now
@@alunesh12345 cool but please dont spam his word everywhere, it turns people away from jesus especially when they need him
My car turns 21 this year, ABS is broken and I've had to let up on the brakes to avoid hitting curbs when I was a new driver
Can you do a part 2 with threshold braking vs ABS?
Yeah. For us that grew up without ABS, we know this is not how your brake when you don’t have ABS! My mom taught me how to brake without ABS when I was a teen. Is it lost knowledge?
@@float32 born in 02 here, and my first car was a 97 accent no abs or at least no fuse in the fuse box for it and my now car is a 2010 elantra no abs... yeah sounds ridiculous but it was still an option in 2010 to have abs just like how powered windows were. With time, I've learn how to brake without abs and now I have to reflexes to release some brake pressure and also brake gently while turning.
Also, I live where it gets under freezing for 5 solid months per year and lots of ice and snow, this helped me alot to learn how to drive and brake well.
I was waiting for that part next but they never did. Those poor tires though!!
@@balinoob1837 I'm actually surprised it was not mandatory by 2010. What country are you in? I am in Canada and I think it was standard in everything after around mid 2000's. (I may be wrong) now all the new stuff if it has an abs fault it goes all nuts because stability control was mandatory after 2013 or 2014 i think. I buy older cars and disable the abs in winter because I hate it
@@balinoob1837 I'm actually surprised it was not mandatory by 2010. What country are you in? I am in Canada and I think it was standard in everything after around mid 2000's. (I may be wrong) now all the new stuff if it has an abs fault it goes all nuts because stability control was mandatory after 2013 or 2014 i think. I buy older cars and disable the abs in winter because I hate it
The life size Hammond killed me 😂 Didn't see that coming!
I was hoping to see how well a pro driver like you can brake with ABS off.
This video was not about proving himself, it was about demonstrating the importance of ABS. If he had put in some skills, then you wouldn't have understood/seen the complete extent to which the abs helps.
@@samyakhp4353 then he should have put a random driver behind the wheel for both tests to see how they did.
@@SoloRenegade
I mean, the average driver doesn’t know how to threshold brake, and that’s what he demonstrated here. The ABS system requires no thought, just mash the brake. He could get a random driver behind the wheel, but that requires more effort than what he can replicate well enough anyways. Also, when things go wrong, his experience will let him get to safety more safely, like avoiding the camera.
side note, remember when Hamilton forgot to turn off the front tire brake heating mode? That’s how a car behaves when the tires lock, and every one else turning properly is proper threshold braking.
Everyone is not pro racing driver on road
ABS is better for normal people
You missed a point from the introduction. Pro drivers are able to use threshold braking on a closed course because they run through the same turns repeatedly. ABS is useful in situations where the driver does not have a chance to practice.
Besides, most amateur drivers who think they know how to threshold brake actually do not. It would be professional malpractice to post a video that encourages them.
I remember during college a friend crashed into a car in front during a sudden stop on the highway while I was riding shotgun. I was left wondering how had he managed to crash if he had plenty of distance.
Turns out I was used to my car which had ABS and his didn´t. I was just judging braking distances with my car in my mind! After that I thanked my dad who always focused on safety when buying my first car, a trend I still continue today :)
can you do one on downforce? Basically apply some different aero parts, homemade and professionally designed and what difference it makes.
Great idea!
Check out Kyle Engineers channel. Ex F1 aerodynamics guy analyzes road car aerodynamics.
Aerodynamically downforce only works if a car is fast - which is the reason race cars use it. With the typical speeds driven on public roads it would probably not make a real difference, and with the speed driven in cities it would make no difference at all.
What it would do is increase fuel consumption.
@@simonm1447 Yep, also the faster you go, the more downforce gets generated, and F1 cars have to be driven hard to get any grip or have the brakes work at all because of how crazy they are.
@@mosca3289 Believe in JESUS today, confess and repent of your sins. No one goes to heaven for doing good but by believing in JESUS who died for our sins. GOD loves you soo much unconditionally.😍😚☺❤🍂
6:28 When you care more about a tripod than Richard Hammond 😂
I thought this would be a comparison between professional racing braking techniques and ABS.
Same. Its more like a complete novice without ABS vs. ABS.
@@repairdrive true but it shows that having abs is absolutely something that should be in every daily vehicle so if someone is to tell you otherwise you would know they are lying
At least it shows the impact on daily drivers. Not everyone is a professionnal driver on the road.
I did the same test on a 1995 chevy, it took longer to stop with ABS than without at that time. The systems have definitely improved since then.
The regulation is aware of the treshold braking and that abs causes more distance. However the ABS is a must and there is certain factor. The ABS brake is allowed 1.1 to 1.25 times longer. The benefit of ABS is not the distance, the manueverability instead. 👍 great video
Did not know this. Cool! Thanks for info.
ABS was never mandatory in the US for this exact reason, it does add a little to stopping distance than optimal brake pressure (worse on stuff like gravel roads). ESC did become mandatory in 2012 in the US, and the easy way to to ESC is with ABS and TC, which is why all cars have it now.
The additional stopping distance is on a public road driven with a normal driver more theory, a professional race driver may get the same results (or with multiple attempts even a little bit better) , but a non professional normal car driver has not the skills to beat ABS.
You can compare this with fighter aircraft, the 1960 models had no fbw and the performance was strongly dependent on the skills of the pilot, while later models have fbw enabling a care free handling, which helps average pilots to get much better results than in the older models.
@@peterleblanc661 My car doesn't have ABS, you just have to find the point right before they start to lock up.
I'm sure for 95% of drivers, ABS is going to both reduce braking distance AND increase control.
That's all that matters and it SHOULD be mandatory.
Omg, what you said about the on track situation vs real life situations is exactly what I’ve been telling people who goes ABS and other electronic systems are for those that can’t drive.
Excellent video - Really well done & great clarity.
Many thanks !
Thank you for mentioning threshold braking. I grew up on cars before ABS became standard and had to learn threshold and cadence braking (basically manual ABS by pumping the pedal, when the wheels lock). The first is just getting to know how your vehicle responds on different surfaces and weather conditions, the latter is getting your brain to ignore panic mode and do the "stupid" thing of releasing the brake pedal, waiting for the tyre to rotate, then applying pressure again, rinse and repeat. That is actually harder than most people think.
The first time I drove an ABS vehicle (I had to use my boss' car for the day for a business trip) and had to do an emergency stop (black ice and stopped traffic), I really didn't stop at all. I'd learnt to cadence brake and started pumping, the ABS started pumping and... I just carried straight on. The lucky thing, as shown in your video, is that with both cadence and ABS, you can still steer the car. There was a gap and run-off, which, despite ice and the tyres locking up, I could aim for. I avoided the accident, but after that, I found a quiet stretch of road and really tested the ABS. If you you've "broken" your brain to actually do cadence braking, it takes a lot of effort to unlearn that and trust the ABS. Nowadays, people have grown up with ABS, so it isn't such a problem.
Threshold braking also save me. I was driving an older Toyota Carina E (well, it was nearly new at the time, but before ABS was standard) on a single track tarmac road covered with dust. I drove the road every day and I'd had the car for several months and I'd been practicing late braking on that stretch, because it was a "y" junction, I needed to turn up the short stalk of the "y", but if I messed it up, I could carry straight on. It was also open (clear view in all directions), so a safe place to test the bakes. One day, as I was approaching the junction, a woman in a Volvo pulled out of the stalk of the "y" without looking, got into the middle of the road and saw the Toyota coming at her with a good 50mph (60mph stretch of road). I slammed on the brakes and got them to the "howling" point, they were just at the maximum level of adhesion and were just about to lock up. I managed to hold them there, scrubbed off over 30mph, before I reached the Volvo, let up on the brakes, turned the wheel, the car started to turn into the junction, with a bit of understeer. A quick (very quick) dab of handbrake got broke the back end loose and the front gripped, being front wheel drive, I gunned the engine and pulled the car into the junction. I shot along the side of the Volvo with inches to spare.
The days of learning how the car reacted, specifically how it reacted on a dusty tarmac road, paid off. I did the perfect maneuver, with perfect timing. I couldn't have done it if I had tried, it was pure instinct and a one in a million shot. I expect, if I ever tried to re-enact it, I'd probably smash into the Volvo.
Anyway, it would be great to see such a video as this one, where the professional driver also showed how much shorter the braking distance is, if you can threshold brake. I expect it is only a couple of metres, but it could make all the difference. I find we are much lazier these days, we generally ignore our natural reflexes and don't train ourselves to brake properly, we just rely on the technology to get us out of trouble.
I got to test this myself when I was learning to get my driver's license. I was on a driving course made for trying emergency braking and driving on really slippery surfaces, complete with soft obstacles to give the feeling of crashing without damaging the vehicle. That stuff is required for getting the license here in Finland.
Honestly that should be a standard for the world a demonstration for a crash intentionally
Lmao in India the school didn't even have a proper working car. And for my licence test the person in charge took around 2000inr (15 gbp) and gave me the licence without a test. He wouldn't let me take it either. My mum had to teach me how to drive separately
We need that, here in America.
@@saniakshay12 In finland it costs at least 1200€ with very many lessons (about the same in gbp) could be more nowadays
I reckon a good test would be a few handling test with and without stability control on
Yes agreed, with a regular drive and maybe a pro too?
@@OVERDRIVE.studios great idea.
@@OVERDRIVE.studios yeah both would be ideal.
Amazing video. I was really struggling with the whole idea of ABS for my driving theory test but now I fully understand it. thanks!
I love that in the final test you made Hammond the right size.
"Imagine you're driving along and a tractor pulls out in front of you..."
..OK...[closes eyes], so I'm, in Russia.....
Literally anywhere in eastern Europe.
Nah just Oklahoma
@@chadbeaver9199 not a totally equal comparison. Farmers in OK are smart enough to not do donuts on a 5 lane highway. There’s a big difference between pulling a tractor out onto a road and what the maniac in the video did!
@@MJM17 you ain't been in Oklahoma for a while have ya? I saw a guy do that in Lindsay a few months ago. We got guys shutting down i35 and i240 to do burnouts and donuts. No sir that all happens here, just not in Norman, Moore, or OKC, aka little California.
love this kind of content! keep up the good work!
Hey how are you doing
This vid was fun to view..and also apparently fun to make. Thank you, sir, for the great work, it earned my subscription..
You mentioned threshold braking in the intro so could you do a test where you compare it to ABS? Every ABS test I've seen is like this where ABS is compared to non-ABS brakes which are completely slammed instead of the driver trying to manage the brakes
I can stop far faster in my car manually controlling the brakes no abs then with abs on you gotta keep it right on the edge of slipping to stop the fastest
@@davidp4270 The thing is that ABS can do it again, and again and again, and for any kind of driver... We tend to think that everyone drives as good as one, but then again, youtube is filled with ppl crashing into other ppl and stuff ...
@@MMOPhotos And a lot of those crashes are cars with ABS because the drivers aren't paying attention to enough to use the brakes.
@@dekoldrick That is true... I've seen ridiculously stupid crashes where the driver just slams to the brake and does not even attempt to turn or anything and so they go, nose down, bottom up and crashing hard with the car / object in front of them... it's even funnier when they actually manage to slow enough and end up crashing at 5/10mph... it's like "dude... seriously??"
@@davidp4270 you are still not better than abs is everyday use.
Aww man, i would've loved to have you compare "No ABS but No Lockup" Breaking as well, because even off the Racetrack people do this, and that would've been great to know how this compared to ABS. I did that back in my Golf 3 which didn't have ABS and as you mention briefly, it becomes instinct to go off the break and check were the limit is.
thanks this was really informative!
Excellent comparison! Thank you!
Hamilton’s looking at those tyres right now and shaking his head
Baku 2021
Perfectly explained ❤
You guys are amazing love your content! Make more vids asap!
ABS actually increases you're braking distances on loose surfaces like dirt roads, in which case you are better off locking the wheels to dig the tires into the gravel
would love to see threshold braking vs abs braking on track. long straight into tight turn kinda thing?
Great channel, interesting content and extremely well presented. Thank you
Great video. Lockups were for the visual impact I'm sure, but they did the job! Brilliant to see the ABS in action with the directional changes. I've had a couple of pre-ABS 'events' and had the composure to make a brake-or-not decision, never just locked up in panic. BUT, that's a crap situation to be in and I thank my lucky stars I'm still here. Post ABS I would just plant my foot through the floor, I've always trusted the tech but this video ramps that trust up a notch.
Hey how are you doing
He sacrificed his tires for our education.
I would be very interested in seeing how effective ESC is at improving cornering in the real world, that in your list??
Hey how are you doing
Thank you for making this video!
This is really super useful and educating video! Thank you!
Can you do this test without intentionally locking up? Like how an actual driver would drive.
I think you overestimate the skills of the average actual driver.
@@stephenshoihet2590 no
@@fridaytwilight YES. because in an emergency, no driver would actually tryto not lock up. its called panicking.And most driver would even know how to brake without locking up cuz they aren't racing drivers
@@Keoponloeu No, actually studies have shown in most cases people do not brake hard enough. Sure people will panic and lock up at times but they also let up during those times. I'm sorry I work in the industry and have seen results of these studies.
@@ProjectExMachina or lack of grip due to weather condition so you keep control. Panic lock up does not mean you stay locked up indefinitely. There is quite a difference. The video shows worst case scenario difference but worst case scenario is not most of the time.
“Im a professional racing driver”
*Proceeds to lock up every time he tries to brake*
He said that he slammed on the brakes, meaning that he tried to lock up in that scenario
Damn. It’s almost as if his goal was to lock up the wheels to show the difference slamming on the brakes the same amount without ABS.
@@thatoneguy611 Yes but that's not the question we want answering! We want to know how ABS compare to threshold braking. ABS is obviously better than locking up!
Just look at the top rated comments if you don't believe me.
这个视频太好了，用不同的视角解释的非常清晰，感谢作者。支持你
really nice work on the first lock-up
It looks like you still had minimal control on the angle of the car, it did straighten out when you corrected.
"RICHARD NO!!!"...
Wow, I like the new series. What about traction control on a wet surface?
Hey how are you doing
I'm glad I subbed to this channel!!
Pretty happy I found this channel :)
Liking the life size richard hammond cutout
Scott, that's a great video, especially when you show how easily the car can rotate even when braking in a straight line.
I'd love to see a comparison between ABS and and your breaking (but doing your best rather than locking up). Perhaps also attempted with an average driver.
Hey how are you w
Doing
Braking physics on a bicycle is interesting in that the front and rear brakes operate independently, meaning you can test the braking demand required to stop more suddenly based on how much force you apply to the front and rear. It's a great way to understand how inertia results in different braking limitations for front and rear tires.
I drive a 2003 Toyota with no ABS. As much as I hate driving in wet condition, I really appreciate that it taught me about Threshold breaking and caution driving ⚠️
Would have been more interesting to see your unpractised, but best attempts vs ABS. As you said, you are a professional driver, so a best-case scenario for not having ABS. You also mentioned that non-ABS braking is virtually impossible to get right in a new situation, even if you know the car.
Therefore, I would love to see you try out what you can do in new situation, and then compare it to one with ABS. Additionally, I would love to see two more representations added. Someone who is not new to spirited driving, who has perhaps done some autocross and/or karting, but does not have professional experience dealing with non-ABS braking. The last representation I would like to see is 'the layman'. Your average driver on the road.
I think this would really show that ABS is not a joke. IT's not as simple as many people think. there's so much more to it than "just pump the brake pedal" which you still hear a lot, or "just modulate your braking".
Perhaps you could also add in a section where you compare your own performance to your performance in a car that you haven't driven before.
Would love to hear your thoughts.
Try the same on a straight on a solid snow cover or on gras. You will be surprised!
This is why I always tell lads who want to take it off of their cars to leave it well alone. It makes a huge difference and has saved many lives since it was widely implemented.
I'm supprise by these results. Good video
Nice test, and good explanation of ABS. I think that ABS is better only in perfect condition for average drivers. What will happen if one tire is on gravel, or snow or you have very bumpy section. Tire with lowest traction will activate ABS and it will release pressure in main breaking cilindar. This culd leade to catastrofic results for ABS, and you will beat it without hitch...
We frequently get conditions here in the winter that causes abs to greatly extend braking distance. The state puts deicing chemicals down when temps are too low which causes snow to stick to the roads and build up in a consistency much like beach sand. There is traction available under it and locking the wheels up gets the tires down to that grip, but abs causes the tires to ride back up on the granular snow as soon as they start to carve down into it. It's very frustrating.
None of that makes sense. Just drive slower.
This is way more interesting to watch!
As a none-car guy, I just want to say, this was really informative, I had no idea that brakes had so much science and shenanigans going on when you hit the brakes. you got my like.
I would like to see a test of threshold braking vs modern day ABS. Early days of ABS no doubt had longer braking distance, but I'm curious if modern day ABS can actually out perform threshold braking.
A lot of tests have been done with both motorcycles and cars. Certainly on Motorcycles even the MOTO GP riders admit they can't beat ABS. In theory threshold braking should be as good or marginally better as there is no off time on the brakes. In practice it is not repeatable and it doesn't really matter who you are if you catch leaves at the side of the road or a mixed surface you only have one foot on the pedal so if you threshold or cadence brake to the wheel that is slipping you are missing out on good braking on the wheels that weren't. 4 channel ABS gets round that by only pumping the wheel that needs to be pumped. 2 channel diagonally split used to pump the opposite rear to whatever it was doing with the front. So if the front slipped it pumped a rear that didn't need to be pumped. And if the rear only slipped it probably wasn't doing much braking anyway and just locked because it was lightly loaded. (It was mainly small front wheel drive cars that had the 2 channel system).
In no way is threshold braking as good as ABS... Sure a pro driver will come close on a known track after many laps but no human on the planet has the reaction time of a modern ABS which checks if the wheels are locked dozens of times a second and can slightly release the brakes multiple times a second and with greater accuracy than any foot!
ABS is amazing and there are no reason to disconnect it even for prep drivers when the regulations allow them to have the system on board. (I have a vintage car that has an ABS on/off switch! Although that was a very early ABS system so it probably isn't as good as what is available now, but it could still be better than a pro driver...)
Hey!
Didn't you notice all those Senna/Schumacher reincarnation in the comments?🤣
Speaking from experience (many hours on track when I was younger and working on side tracks), in reality pro drivers/race pilots CAN outperform ABS.
Imagine 100% is the perfect brake while 100% is a lockup.
ABS would ALWAYS hit a good 95%, which is enough in a normal pubblic road.
Race pilots can CONSISTENCY hit something between 96-98% .
BUT...
They are pilots, people who memorized every single inches of a track after spending a lifetime marking the laps over laps.
Nothing comparable to us mortals🤣
@@oliviero46 actually now abs always gets 99%-100% if setup properly, which it is on race cars in the race categories in which it is allowed. So no, race drivers like to think they can beat it but they can't, the foot isn't precise enough and they don't react in the hundredth or thousandth of a second
Now I have a better understanding of how to drive without the abs after understanding how abs works. Thanks!🙏
absolutely terrifying. great video!
I’d love to see the “downside” in a race environment.
Try a lap with and without and see how a driver uses the brakes differently.
There is no doubt ABS is better for any public driving, but I want to see why it’s not used in racing.
Main reason is regulation. With ABS there are easily also traction controls included which both brings clear benefits but with a lot of engineering effort
They're not used in racing so that it's morw about the pilot, you have to know how to not lock up
Back when I was young, in pre-ABS days, I was taught to pump the brake pedal, especially on snow or wet surfaces. Same result as ABS, but much cheaper. Now, we are substituting thinking and training with technology. ABS does work pretty well.....until it breaks. Then it gets costly. I own a vehicle without ABS to this day.
ABS is more effective than manually pumping. Good ABS is better than threshold braking. That's why ABS was used on F1 until they banned it along with all driver aids.
@@roflchopter11 Tell me how effective yours is when the module fails and it costs you 500 bucks.
@@howiem3883 150k miles and still going. But it'll revert to non-ABS operation, as demonstrated by this video of what happens when you pull the fuse.
@@roflchopter11 And you will continue to drive. How about that.....
@@howiem3883 brakes only hold you back, after all.
Great demonstration!
Thanks for this video, great
This video should have titled, "Braking with ABS vs Improper Braking" My youngest vehicle is a 1992 model year without ABS. One just simply does not brake in this method if they bothered to learn the basics of driving. Modulate your break preasure and counter steering are part of basic driving skills. Even without braking, if you enter a slide in bad weather you need to know how to counter steer. Although the most vital driving skill is learning to drive in a manner that you are not having unforseen "emergencies" multiple times a week just driving to & from work. I put in quotes because if you are regularly having emergencies, the problem is you. Not others drivers, or pesky situations "out of your control" If we truely enforced driving laws, and made people take responsibility for thier actions and choices while driving, we would see people's behaviors change significantly. For example, an injury colision with a distracted driver (cell phone, etc) a criminal charge of assault with a deadly weapon should happen. If the same type of colision involves a fatality, a charge of manslaughter. That's accountability, and enforcing the laws. At this point everyone knows distracted driving not ony causes collisions, but it causes serious injuries & death. So the choice to drive distracted is a wilful & negligent disregard for the lives of other drivers. Pure & simple as that. Not learning to safely operate one's vehicle should be treated in the same manner. In nearly every State in the USA the very law regarding driving makes it the legal responsibility of the driver to operate thier vehicle safely, and avoid collisions. This law is rarely enforced, and high vehicle collisiom injury and death rate is what we have to show for this lack of enforcement.
That was my thought exactly. It's hard to believe that a professional race car driver could keep a job with braking like that. Good braking is not just a matter of standing on the pedal with all your might, though that is a viable option with ABS. This video was pretty much a total waste. If this is the quality of comparison testing, I don't see any reason to return to this channel.
@@ligerone2154 unfortunately CZcams channels have become about entertainment, not information. So as long as it is done in an entertaining manner they remain popular regardless of the flaws, and lack of real informative information.
I hear you but it's time to unlearn how to brake. At least for myself. I didn't have ABS until I was 40. If I continue to use my current car with ABS with my old braking style. I will lose stopping distance. How much is up for debate. I just hope when the time comes that I press hard enough to engage ABS and stay there with my foot.
When I'm about to replace my tires the next time. I will spend a few hours just doing ABS braking. Since it's in the spine and it will be hard to unlearn it.
@@jorgenblomqvist2654 I have driven cars with ABS (rentals & family's cars) I never had an issue with breaking correctly. Well, with modern cars at least. Old late 1980's to mid 1990's ABS systems were horrible. The ABS would be defeated if you used your breaks correctly. It was a limit of the analog ABS systems & early computer controlled ABS. The modern systems sample the wheel speed and break line peasure far faster, and don't suffer from this. You can modulate your break preasure, and it will still work if the wheels start to lock up. You get the best of both worlds. The ability to drive safely, and have a system that saves your bacon in a worst case situation. Counter steering isn't an issue since you only do so if you starting to slide.
@@williamallen7836 It's not just about ABS when it comes to stoppage distance. Reaction time is at least equal important as ABS to avoid collisions.
We have an electric car that everyone uses when available. It has autonomous braking. Saved me once from hitting a car reversing out from driveway. Too many cars parked on street and landscaping. So the car was way faster than me to apply the brakes.
Won't buy another car without that feature. I can say with 100% that it would have been a collision without autonomous braking.
"I'm a pro driver" locks the brakes completely.... my grandma can brake better.
Great subject and again may I add my opinion on ABS. My first experience was in early 70s with (if my memory serves me right) 1972 Olds Toronado that had rear wheel ABS and I wasn't all that impressed and I didn't find it very useful. Years passed and when I got behind a friends new 1992 Chevy Suburban with all wheel ABS. It was OK but the pedal pulsing was most irritating under hard braking. Wasn't impressed but it was much more efficient ! Since the last 20/25 years the systems have improved considerably and now with all the electronic traction control systems it has become the norm and very capable in almost all road conditions. Thanks again.
Love the test, pretty much what i expect.
Race track you don't have to worry about some road traffic conditions and ABS will help so much...
Hey how are you doing
How are any of these tests fair?
You didn’t even try to slow the car quickly without abs, You purposely made it slide as far as possible. No one who drives an non abs car would brake like that.
If the driver is panicking, yes they would. That's the point of ABS.
@@pranavps851 I’m not saying that you’re wrong but the point in this video was to test the efficiency of abs over non abs. It was an unfair test because he didn’t even try to brake smoothly/quickly in the non abs car.
I agree some people will panic brake like this but that’s not the cars fault is it, I think we should base a test like this on there being a reasonable standard of driver being behind the wheel.
But how much faster is a red car compared to a white cat? 💁🏽♂️
Beautiful presentation
This channel deserves my subscription
Wow this is awesome ❤
Awesome demonstration
Very very interesting video, thanks!
I love the attention to detail on the life size Richard Hammond cutout!
6:45 i like how the engine also goes "nooooooooooooooo"
Good video... with equal traction under each tire. Put the test in the winter in Alaska (or anywhere with variable icing conditions) with dry ruts and icy strips created by normal road travel with studded tires and suddenly ABS can fail spectacularly. Volvo found a simple solution as they seem to have a lot of experience in such conditions - triangular breaking - whichever 'triangle' has the most traction is the one that is used for braking. My 1984 Volvo Wagon was better on the road in winter conditions than my fancy 2004 Ford Explorer with its 'fancy' ABS system. Almost put me in the ditch several times before I realized the 'design fault' in the Ford. However, on dry pavement, the Ford ABS system did keep me from hitting the guard rail when there was a wreck in front of me. I'm looking forward to purchasing something more modern one of these days and seeing just what has been done to improve it.
Because of this I understand ABS now. Most informative video.
Nice video 👏👏👏
I'd like to see some comparisons with driving on gravel, and mixed gravel / pavement. I've experienced real problems with cars like Subarus in such conditions. Pulling off of pavement onto a paved turnout, but which had a few pieces of gravel on the paved surface. Real problems resulted!
I wish more serious driving tasks like this would be required for licensing. I took an emergency vehicle operators course as part of training for my job. The familiarity I gained with what a car can handle and the spacial awareness of the car was amazing. We did a section like this so we understood that we can manuever through ABS braking.
We charged forward at a wall of comes about 6ft wide. When we were less than a car length away (going about 30mph) the instructor told us to go left or right at random. You had to stand on the brakes and steer the car around the cones without losing control. Surprisingly it was easy to do. I often wonder how many accidents could be prevented if people had that understanding of how the car operates on its margins.
loved the explanation of abs to a pro driver in first 90 seconds. brilliant
Thanks. Very clear. Bur I thought that miles were used in the days when people used hp to refer to how many horses pulled the carriage.
I used to think only the very best race drivers could brake better without abs. But then I had an abs fault at a couple of track days and found myself stopping better by threshold braking. The downside was that I was having to think quite a lot about more ab out brake pressures, whereas with abs I could concentrate more on other things. Those two days did teach me to recognise the onset of lock-up though, to the extent that I now very rarely invoke the abs. I still wonder whether, if I pull the fuse and learn to properly threshold brake, if I might be quicker.
It is basically impossible to outbreak a modern day ABS System on road. On old early-mid 90s cars, where ABS often was even an optional extra you had to pay for, it might have been possible to slightly outbreak the system under ideal circumstances (on an ideal road with a prepared driver, absolutely not in an unforseen emergency stop) - but everything that was made in the last decade or so has 4 channel ABS and much faster regulation - not even formula one drivers can beat that because you simply cant break each wheel individually. There are countless studies about this. As soon as one wheel locks up you loose against ABS, and as soon as one is not perfectly decelerated on the treshold you also loose.
On rougher/thick road conditions like gravel, deep snow or back roads, no abs stops much faster than abs. But again you dont get steering control if the wheel is locked hence why threshold braking which is the most efficient method.
i had no ideea. ABS is awesome makes me sort of a professional race driver while braking :) thanks for the video !!
I learned threshold breaking in an integra with a faulted abs. Its terrifying when u lock up but when you start testing the tolerances of your breaks you learn quick
When I did my first advanced drivers course I was taught to pump and pulse as fast and hard as I could in an emergency braking scenario (pre owning a car with ABS, I only had a Commodore VK back then).
ABS is even more beneficial in the wet.
Modern cars have brake assistance so it's not as if you can find a sweet spot like in your race car. They will apply maximum braking force without maximum pedal force.
One question... This days cars are with dual abs and ebd together so how does it work together?🤔🤔🤔
Nice vids new subscriber
nice, i expacted less diference between abs/non abs, but it is big because high speed and when rubber melts, it slides like on oil, similar thing happens on wet when water starts to evaporate under wheel and lifts it up