Recettear is a game in which you stop an evil overlord from taking over the world by lecturing him on how world domination isn't economically viable. Such a thing cannot be criticized.
I recently learned that selling an item excessively (Ie. flooding the market) in recettear drops that items value to 0. Hidden things like that really increases the depth.
@@pancakes6587 It does not- at least, if it does, it's so small of a change that it's not even worth acknowledging, as you can literally just sell the same thing over and over and it'll sell anyways.
@@lethauntic Yeah it does, if you flood the market with one type of item in moonlighter the demand goes down and you have to reduce the price so people will buy it
It's the same in real life, and the same in other games like Mount and blade bannerlord.. it's a mechanic that balance emergent issue, it's should always be there in a game that has some economy on items.
I was going to buy moonlighter but I might give it a year now and by then the devs will probably add a bunch of content to bandage some of these issues.
I actually love the sale mechanics of Recettear. Comboing the just right price system is very rewarding since you will need to level up the customer's trust so they are willing to buy more expensive items to the point that even the little girl can end up spending much more than pocket change if you manage her trust levels well enough. It teaches you the bigger value in treating your customer right over trying to earn immediate maximum profits. I wish we could get something like Recettear 2 that either focuses and expands the shop systems or polishes the dungeon crawling. The current game does get VERY grindy late game.
It would be great to have a more lenient Just Combo system with more variablea involved (like, idk, weather or decor affecting mood, that kinda thing?).
As someone who played Recettear about 215 hours, I can say that, behind its cuteness, is a game so challenging as rewarding. Totally recommendable, just like this video. PS: That little girl is SO stingy...
It sounds like the one thing Moonlighter really NEEDED(which is different from what it could do better), is stronger personalities. Recettear was powerful just with the characters that live in it and how they interact with each other. It had comedy that was quick and light, that also managed to show them growing over the course of the game. Moonlighter is at a disadvantage in that aspect due to how the dungeon-crawling is inherently about going solo and playing the lonely game. There's a reason Recettear stretched the limits of disbelief to let the little girl walk with you in the dungeon, and it was for a worthwhile purpose.
We only touched on this a little but Recettear has so much more charm than Moonlighter with its writing alone. Moonlighter is gorgeous but it is severely lacking in personality. I don't understand how the old man has so many lines of dialogue that are all essentially saying the same thing.
Very much this! I've been rolling these ideas around in my head, trying prototype something that builds on this design space for years now, and I came to basically the same conclusion. I adored both games, but Recettear had a narrative that was equal parts silly and emotional, created personal ludonarrative motivation for the player (paying off the debt so they can keep playing and having fun), and introduced all kinds of fun colorful characters. That's what carried it through. Hoping to make something that builds on this genre some time soon!
I recommend checking out Faraway Story. It's got less polish in terms of item selling, but it experimented with more things and the story is similarly a blend of funny and emotional.
Yeah, the first hour of the game I was a bit baffled by the lack of important dialogue and character development. It just looked like I was surrounded by robots instead of characters.
> There's a reason Recettear stretched the limits of disbelief to let the little girl walk with you in the dungeon, and it was for a worthwhile purpose. It's not even so much a stretch, it happens often enough in anime, where a support character is literally just carrying items.
@@azure5584 Yahtzee is a video game reviewer well known for his very strict but fair criticisms (Zero Punctuation on The Escapist channel). If Yahtzee enjoys a game, it is a great game (he enjoyed Portal, Doom, Return of the Obra Dinn, Undertale...). He also is behind the terms "console peasants" and "pc master race" and the pc master race character art, but invented them to mock elitists.
The "sale box" in moonlighter sounds like a spin on the vending machines in recettear. In recettear however, it's used to get rid of excess stock that you can't fit in the store so you can make more money in a day. It's useful when the loan due date is just around the corner.
They also want to buy my high quality weapons DESPITE BOT HAVING EVEN HALF THE MONEY FOR IT. *DO I HAVE TO PUT UP A SIGN SAYING "NO CHILDREN ALLOWED" , LITTLE GIRL? **_GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY STORE!_*
They also want to buy my high quality weapons DESPITE BOT HAVING EVEN HALF THE MONEY FOR IT. *DO I HAVE TO PUT UP A SIGN SAYING "NO CHILDREN ALLOWED" , LITTLE GIRL? **_GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY STORE!_*
I find it odd that you only showed Louie when explaining how the gameplay is simple, essentially showing "the basic character" as if it's representative of the rest. However, there are several adventurers you can use, and they play quite differently. Charme, my adventurer of choice, has parries, a dash, and a set of versatile super moves. Not to say the dungeon crawling still doesn't get dull, but it's a little disingenuous to say there's not much of interest there. There's actually plenty, so long as you try to unlock the other adventurers.
@@Piorn Agreed. I loved recettear to bits and tried out moonlighter and I gotta say the charm of Recettears character and world kept me hooked while I could barely continue with Moonlighter. They're both great games and I do hope more item shop keeper games come out since it's a really fun concept.
@@charbomber110 Will still be different. Instead of a farm, doing cleaning things, events and such, you do dungeons with more depth than stardew valley and own a shop. Having relationships in a game is not unique to stardew valley, and then pretty much the other main similarities is there being a town, the pixel art design, and gathering items (all of which are common in games in general)
Atelier series or a spinoff atelier game would be the perfect candidate for a great shop game. They already have the gameloop ready but they donlt have the store management part (which would work great with alchemy mechanics).
The haggling in Recettear becomes predictable, but it doesn't start that way. There's nothing that shows or states your relationship with customers, or how much they are willing to haggle with you. It's up to you to remember how much you can push a price and with who. It's a shame to hear Moonlighter has "correct" prices for items. Moonlighter sounds like it has some serviceable problems, probably just needs a sequel or something.
But Reccetear had "correct" prices as well. Right from the start too. You know how much an item is worth and you should always sell it at 120% to 130%. Unless it's in high demand or low demand. In Moonlighter you don't know the value of the item, all the buyers do though. So it becomes a time to find the right price for the item and once that is done you it's a bit auto mode. Until the item is deemed of high value but unlike Reccetear you can't charge 200% for it. Both games with the shop is easy mode the moment you just learn how to use it.
@@Zefar77 That's not true, the just right system is required to actually start raking in big profits by selling expensive items. You can't just sell for profit, otherwise you can't make actually big sales in time.
I disagree with how you make Recettear sound like it was intended to be equal parts item shop and dungeon crawling when the latter is really just an accessory. The game can be played successfully without ever stepping foot in a dungeon where as the reverse is not true so clearly the item shop aspect is the main focus of the game. As long as the item shop aspect is good that is all that matters.
You would think a game called "Moonlighter" about simultaneously holding down two jobs would have some kind of fatigue mechanic where you couldn't just work all day and adventure all night. I'd love to see choices between, say, being open all day as a friendly general store vs. theming the place as an elite adventuring shop, which cuts down your clientele, but they don't mind shopping at a creepy place that's only open from dusk to midnight. (Of course, if the friendly guy has to take a day off because he's sick from overwork, he might have neighbors stopping by to check on him and bring him chicken soup...)
I played Moonlighter after the full release and the game is just not finished. Bosses drop unique loot that is useless, you can't craft anything with it. You can't refight bosses after defeating them once so replaying previous dungeons is pointless. The items' popularity system either doesn't work or its effect is negligible that there is no reason to not sell everything overpriced.
I said the same things about Moonlighter around when it came out and I had people telling me that I had no idea what I was talking about. It's a decent to good game, but it's so incredibly shallow that it leaves you wanting more _while_ you're playing it. Playing the game after the 4-5 hour mark, I found myself doing what is no different than running around an open-world map doing all of the mini-games, not because you enjoy them (maybe to some degree), but specifically just to beat the game, no more.
Everytime someone tries to sell me on Moonlighter:"It's a game where you run an item shop and do dungeon crawling to find items to sell in your shop!" Me:"Oh so its like Recettear but not as good" Wake me when they port Recettear to Switch
Thank you for making this video. I loved Recettear. That game to me is a hidden masterpiece that many people seem to miss out on because "ew, anime" or "ew, simulators" or "ew, cute games". It's just such a good game. A great story that will even make you tear up in some parts, an in depth shop simulator and a FUN dungeon experience. Yes, it's dated. It's very simple. But sometimes simple doesn't mean that it isn't fun and I for one had a lot of fun in those dungeons. Especially later in the game when you're trying to crawl through ONE HUNDRED floors of a dungeon and you start grinding for that ONE rare ingredient to make the ultimate weapon for one of your adventurers. I loved that and I'm getting an urge to go back right now to play through it again. So, thank you for making this video because I wondered if Moonlighter was finally a replacement to one of my favorite hidden gems or if it was just another knock off that tried to do what Recettear did but once again, failed. And I think you answered that. I'll still give Moonlighter a shot eventually but at least now I won't be as disappointed when it fails to live up to my standards. :)
My thoughts exactly. Atelier isn't so much into the selling aspect, but along with the alchemy system (which is mandatory to beat the game), it's there if you want to exploit it. And it's a better way to farm for cash instead of mindlessly killing cute animals all over the maps.
I can see either Gust or Falcom doing a good job with something like this. Like with Gust, they could make an Atelier game similar to this, which they sort of did with Atelier Rorona. But that game was less about managing the shop and dealing with customers, than just dealing with the government to pay off the store's debts.
Thank you for stating my exact opinion of this game. What irks me is that I did my research on this game, and reviewers I found praised it.. none of them must've played it for more than 4 hours. Sort of makes me mad. Seems like I've found an honest reviewer, might as well subscribe :) It's too bad really, because this game would be amazing if it was finished. There were so many points in the game were I felt they missed an opportunity to integrate systems with eachother. Sidenote, I too found it fun to figure out prices of stuff, was bummed out when I realized everything was sorted out by price. Not to mention the banker, holy fuck.
THANK YOU! I couldn’t understand why I wasn’t a fan of moonlighter even though it’s a beautiful game. I never played more than 5-6 times for a few hours, and I just couldn’t get into it!
I like the in-depth look you take on these two games; you managed to accurately capture my opinions on them. A note though that the final line “Recettear and Moonlighter blaze the trail for something amazing” is kind of an odd note to end on, since the potential for these games wasn’t really explored in the video. Nonetheless, I agree - this new emerging genre strangely excites me.
Holy hell. How did I ever not see this video? This is my favourite kind of genre, and I’ve been watching your channel for ages. Thankfully there are loads of item shop mobile games that have kept me going with the lack of proper games on the concept.
Gotta be honest, the art style of Recettear and its greater focus on the shop side really bias me towards it over Moonlighter. I've never been huge on most dungeon crawling anyways, so the simple dungeon crawling was almost a selling point to me. Just enough to give me something else to do without being too much.
How you explained it sounded like Moonlighter is just the story of a man who got so sick of his day to day life he decided to just use that as a side hustle so he could go adventuring. But seriously I may have to play these games. These look pretty damn sweet.
I LOVE Recettear. Is one of my favorite games but I never got to sit down and actually think about it. Thanks for that and I agree with you, the dungeon crawler side of Recettear is really basic I didn't even bother with it too much, I only went there to get materials to craft expensive stuff but I'm ok with that since the rest of the game outweighs it, I still have to finish Recettear using it's dungeon crawler side tho. I think another important part of Recettear it's the charm of the Characters, Recette is so Innocent and enthusiastic and yet pretty self aware, makes you care for her. My biggest complain it'd be that the Rival character doesn't do anything, she's cute and all but it never develops into anything, I was expecting the Rival to steal some of my clients with her offers or something but nope. All in all, Recettear is a neat little experiment and this moonlighter guy tried to replicate it but I feel it missed the core and heart of Recettear.
@@aster7132 Low budget 2D games age slowly, so Recetear is still optically fine. As far as gameplay goes, due to the lack of rivals in it''s genre to outshine it it's also still good.
Just got Moonlighter a couple days ago, and i came to similar conclusions on my own. I think a sequel, taking into account all your criticisms would be amazing, I hope it did well enough for that. I spent a few days trying to sell a Training Sword, and after slowly decreasing it to only 100 coins more than its crafting price I went and looked up if it was even viable to craft things. As you said it wasnt, maybe the rich folk every so often would buy it from a case. Which kinda sucks because Forging is one of my favorite mechanics in games, I'm still enjoying crafting weapons for myself, but I was pretty excited to sell them (especially since there are adventurer NPCs that come in specifically looking for Weapons and Equipment)
I can’t thumb this hard enough. Definitely needed to be said. I haven’t got around to Recettear yet, but Moonlight was addictive until you got that wall. And by the end it was like they left off the back half of the game. So. Many. Missed. Opportunities.
I haven't booted up Recettear since July 2012, so not once in 8 years, and the moment the note on the music came up in the video, I could hum the tune, before the music was actually played. That's either the sign of *very* repetitive music, or brilliant composition. I can't really tell.
Shoppe Keep 2 may not have dungeons (yet; early access), but it does give you the option to leave town, complete side quests, and gather rare resources for making super valuable items after you open the blacksmith shop.
Played Recettear before. I was excited when Moonlighter was launched. Spent several days (not even a week, just around 3-4days) then that's it, a big let down. It's just the same one damn concept repeated over and over for the next 4 or 5 dungeons (reskin on stuffs like current mobile game industry lol). The shop mechanics is dumb. You just need to go to dungeon and target on getting most expensive pcs (like lava core if I remembered correctly for the lava dungeon), and you could obtain those easily if you enter the secret area(the one where you jump on the hole with a shiny light, and fight waves of monsters). Then sell it at the suitable price and viola! You make tremendous amount of profits (zero monetary cost btw) that you will feel so poor that only money is what's left and there is no point on making any money further. The existence of sales box has no point at all, you just need the most expensive goods to put on the table and people would buy it ALL if it is priced right. And as for weapon, I use only bow and it clears the game easily, just keep on spamming button while dodging the incoming projectile. After beating the alien boss and that's it. The End. The shop is more like a frills; you sell eveything as long as it is priced right, unlike recettear where I tried so hard to sell that piece of thing and no one wanted to buy. Lack of loli and Japanese voice acting is also a flaw. In short, Moonlighter is lack of depth and loli. Loli is powerful!!
Haven't heard of this one. The trailer looks super promising! Though the non-shop half seems to be closer to a life sim like Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing so it's not as comparable to Recettear . Hopefully it all comes together.
The _Atelier_ series tends to have a similar diametric gameplay aspect of RPG and Item Shop management. Most of the titles don't go too heavy into the Item Shop side of things in the way _Recettear_ does, but the RPG aspects are mostly about supporting the crafting system, which ties into various other Town and Time Management systems. _Nelke_ (a more recent side game of the series) goes full Town Management; sending adventurers out to gather materials, so alchemists can craft items, so shop owners can sell things, and you can grow the town. It's not pure Item Shop gameplay, but it's more micro-intensive than other City Building games.
Omg I remember Recettear.. I really hope a triple A company tries to do something amazing with this game format. Maybe Fire Emblem; Ana Edition? I'd love to play that ;-;
I'm playing Moonlighter and enjoying it so far. I'm not far enough to understand all your critiques firsthand, but I can still see what you're saying. I gotta disagree on the polish though. Some parts are very polished, and then there are a TON of things that feel like they weren't double-checked at all. First of all, almost none of the mechanics are explained, or at least not well. You get stuck on an invisible door on the south wall of any room. You can go through objects in the hub town by attacking, thus moving Will slightly forward. The falling animation always makes Will fall north, despite being able to fall from any direction, so most falling happens through the floor and looks really unnatural. There are a few weapon types, but the 2 options in each type are so insignificant. The menus are pretty when just looking at them, but when using them, they take a lot of getting used to and can be really clunky. Organizing items you want to keep for crafting is such a chore. The whole presentation of how dungeons work is almost nonexistent, leaving me with a lot of questions like "What happens if I leave now? Can I leave now? Why can't I?", forcing me to simply guess, and almost always be punished for it. Also what's that giant slime ghost? Can I fight him? How come nobody mentions him? Why is he there in there first place, lore-wise and gameplay-wise? And of course, several minor visual glitches, like a curse slot on my item menu that wouldn't go away until I reset the game. Also the cursed items suck, literally just sell the cheapest items and move cursed items into slots that won't affect the others. Basically no strategy involved, just frustrating and clunky. Like you mentioned, the systems sometimes have fake depth, and I think the curse system is the worst offender. Forcing you to spend time on a menu =/= interesting or fun. Now, if it incentivized you to be smart by getting bonuses based on placement, THAT could be fun. But it's just a few arbitrary roadblocks that take a moment to correct. Ugh. Just let me have my treasure, I already earned it. I like the game but I almost quit early on because they gave almost no thought to how teach teach the systems of a game that has a lot of systems and leans heavily on them. I'm glad I stuck it out because it is good, but not great.
Replaying Recettear right now, I had fond memories of it but wondered if it would hold up, and I really feel it does. I also never knew that the dungeons kept going, my first time I focused on my shop and put the game down after doing the main story of paying off my debt a couple times. I'm doing more of the dungeons now and I'm impressed how good that part of the game is. It's not as good as a pure dungeon crawler obviously, but it's really surprisingly deep and challenging in a way that kind of reminds me of Stardew Valley. Add to that several additional layers of crafting using dungeon components, the different adventurers with different playstyles, it feels like it has no business being as good as it is, and I'm having a good time.
I was confused at first, because I love recettear and hated moonlighter. I played moonlighter for a few hours, but it just made me wish I was playing recettear... But yeah, you got the heart of it.
Few things. 1: Reccetear shop music is timeless. I like it more than the music in Moonlighter. Also one theme in Moonlighter sounds way to similar to Sniper Elite 4 main theme. 2: The item merchant in Moonlight overprice the items by like 400% and it's both easier and worth more to just head to the dungeon to get them. I ignored him the moment I saw the prices he asked for the items. 3: I didn't feel like I was swimming in money in Moonlighter. Upgrades or weapons on rank 3 cost 32 000 and 64 000. One weapon later and most money is gone. That's just for one piece too. 4: Shop system in both games where easy. On my previous save file for Reccetear I had no problem with selling items for ideal prices. In Moonlighter it's a bit more fun to actually sell more stuff and having to restock the store. But because there is no pressure it's just about getting all of that money.
I kinda want to see a game like Recettear and Moonlighter but it slowly becomes a satire on capitalism. Like at first its dungeon delving and selling items, until it becomes out-sourcing exploring and looting to other warriors, stomping competition out of business with prices lower than theirs, running your store like a franchise and going across villages opening your own stores in. Creating and shifting the supply and demand chain with hoarding valuable items and limiting the distribution. Bribing royalty and kingdoms to suit in your favour against others. Becoming the invisible hand of the free market. Eventually it stops being a fantasy adventure game, but a management game only. The fantasy elements will still be there, but to do it personally as your character is not worth the time compared to many other workers doing the same for you. The problem I see in making a game like this becomes having extension knowledge of economics and business and also having to keep the game fun after the monopolization.
Recettear is one of my favorite games. I really like all the character's interactions and the artstyle for the characters, but I can see what you're talking about with your points on the dungeon crawling.
The problem with item shop games is that they lack the unpredictability of actually running a shop in an MMO. This is afterall where the gameplay is from and the blend of basic management with dungeoneering has existed for decades - just not in a single player format. It's the kind of game which needs to be driven by a dynamic world which changes the supply and demand of items and is essential to making the item shop itself interesting. In essence, you really need to blend X4 world systems with item shop mechanics.
Recettear has exactly what you are asking for tho, certain items will increase and decrease in demand, making them cost more or less and attract more or less costumer. Some fads may come and go, and displaying popular items will attract those that are into said fads.
I've got two other games in this vein for people hungry for more (like I always am, capitalism, ho!). Little Dragons Cafe is by Harvest Moon's old director, and is a restaurant manager, dungeon crawler, and Dragon raising sim. Super cute, but can feel kind of dumbed down compared to Recettear, and doesn't have much of a difficulty curve. The Bell Chimes for Gold is... An otome dating sim where you try and buy the affection of older men. It's... Not good. You can beat the whole thing in 6 hours, and the dungeon/store manager split doesnt work since you can make way more money just dungeon crawling. Might be worth your time if you're desperate but... Hey, who isn't when you're a fan of this genre?
Im so happy to see a new video made :] please keep up the good work, you make AMAZING content. Even my fiance, whom finds video games completely uninteresting, enjoys the insight you offer in your videos.
Reckettear is an under rated gem. Played it on Steam years ago, would def' buy it again on PS if it popped up, or a new game from them with the same concept.
I understand your criticisms about Moonlighter, but considering I got it for $7.78 on Steam during a pixelart sale, I personally can't complain. I find it intensely fun, and it's great to have a game that affords me a chance to get a "full" experience in 15-25 minutes when I don't have an hour or more needed for other games.
love your critical review. Maybe Moonlighter will have a DLC that could fix the game. When it came out on PC it was very buggy, but now on Switch it is nice.
Good video. I'll make one nitpick: Recettear's death mechanic in combination with its general difficulty curve means that its death mechanic essentially doesn't exist. It's actively unfun to deal with the consequences of a death, so players pretty much always savescum if they die.
This has inspired me to try and make a small video game about this. Then, if it turns out to be fun at first, I'll remake it. I was wondering what kind of game I should make, and now I think I know.
Shoppe Keep 2 is in early access right now. It differs from the original by way of combat and resource-gathering outside of the town. It does take a while to get outside the town, though...
Little Dragons Cafe just came out and is a 3D dungeon crawler, restaurant manager, and dragon raising sim. It's kinda simplistic, especially in the beginning, but it's super cute and balances all the genre juggling well.
The Moonlightwr Between Dimensions DLC changed quite a bit in the gameplay and mechanics of Moonlighter. Not touching on how item management between what sells for high amounts and whats required for upgrades or potions creation seems off base. You can only bring back so many items per dungeon run and discovering item prices in the ship is a fun side project and makes you consider your options when deciding what to bring back from the dungeon runs. I know you were comparing two games here but perhaps you should have given each game their own critique instead of trying to pit both games against one another
May I suggest to all of you, a similar game like this but with more balanced combat, crafting, multiple stores and dungeons, and pretty anime characters? Faraway Story. It's free, translated, and still has updates coming.
i only played a couple hour of moonlighter, but personally, for me the weak point of moonlighter is the combat system. it is working fine, but for how much they emphasis the importance of the dungeon, i expect the combat to be a little better than what they offer. i could look pass recettear's(which i play to completion back in the day) combat system because it is not really that important for the narrative and the gameplay besides getting few item to sell. i don't even go to dungeon crawling that much since i find just buying items from the guild/market and sell it at markup price is sufficient enough to get me through the bills. the way they did it also make you think twice before going dungeon crawling since it takes up the entire day, losing a full day of store tending opportunities. moonlighter on the other hand, the narrative is based around the mystery of the dungeon and bringing glory back to your town. And the way they split day-night cycle where you could go dungeon crawling at night, since you can't open the store at night anyway, means they encourage you to go dungeon crawling as often as possible. for a game that emphasis that much, narrative or mechanics, i expect the combat to be a bit better than that. the combat feels clunky, the dungeon are quite repetitive besides changing the tilesets., etc.
@@syaondri yeah, i played it on subsequent run. Since i like that game that much Edit : still, my point is with how much moonlighter narrative/gameplay loops works, i just feel the combat parts quite lacking
I'd say that Moonlighter in general feels just.. Sub par compared to Recettear, even in the areas in which it shines. The dungeons are fairly bland and repetitive, which was touched upon on the video, but a few other things were forgotten as well. Recettear had randomized events that occured in dungeons, like the slippery floors one that was in the video. It also had multiple characters each with their own attacks and abilities, which I feel was more than what the small amount of weapon variety in Moonlighter offered. It is a shame however, since Moonlighter does have the good bones for something to come of it, but even as a roguelike it felt lacking in comparison, and thats not even comparing it to other rogue like games.
I've always wanted a co-op and versus mode in recettear...my friend and I looked into it buut no dice! (they even have characters that can fill that role if someone wants to mod it!)
Moonlighter - seems like all the budget went into the art/polish. Also, the developers confuse tedium with fun - catching a thief every 10seconds and managing backpack space isn't fun. It was already a chore sorting the good stuff from garbage in Recettear, but to add another layer of fitting the items in backpack space is just absurd. Give backpack options/upgrades and streamline the dungeon crawling experience instead of halting it.
you should revisit this!! games like cult of the lamb are getting more popular, but I find they're suffering from the same problems you outline in this video
I loved Recettear...but it is balls-out hard. The fact that the weekly payment goes up so quickly, you'll find yourself in an unwinnable position many times and have to restart your game.
Anybody who knows about Recettear and praises it deserves a sub and thumbs up in my book. Didn't know about Moonlighter as an item shop game so I'll definitely check it out!
Recettear is a game in which you stop an evil overlord from taking over the world by lecturing him on how world domination isn't economically viable. Such a thing cannot be criticized.
THE IRS?!?!?
Capitalism ho!
Ferengi?
@@syaondri capitalism?
Isn't this a reverse Maoyuu Mao Yuusha.
I recently learned that selling an item excessively (Ie. flooding the market) in recettear drops that items value to 0.
Hidden things like that really increases the depth.
Janathon Ching the same thing happens in moonlighter sorta
@@pancakes6587 It does not- at least, if it does, it's so small of a change that it's not even worth acknowledging, as you can literally just sell the same thing over and over and it'll sell anyways.
@@lethauntic Yeah it does, if you flood the market with one type of item in moonlighter the demand goes down and you have to reduce the price so people will buy it
It's the same in real life, and the same in other games like Mount and blade bannerlord.. it's a mechanic that balance emergent issue, it's should always be there in a game that has some economy on items.
We now need a game with Recettear's depth and Moonlighter's polish.
And Recettear's lolis.
Maybe Moonlighter could have an update to fix the Game Design...
Maybe Recetear can have an update too
Mineko's night market might be that. I hope it is
I was going to buy moonlighter but I might give it a year now and by then the devs will probably add a bunch of content to bandage some of these issues.
I actually love the sale mechanics of Recettear. Comboing the just right price system is very rewarding since you will need to level up the customer's trust so they are willing to buy more expensive items to the point that even the little girl can end up spending much more than pocket change if you manage her trust levels well enough. It teaches you the bigger value in treating your customer right over trying to earn immediate maximum profits.
I wish we could get something like Recettear 2 that either focuses and expands the shop systems or polishes the dungeon crawling. The current game does get VERY grindy late game.
It would be great to have a more lenient Just Combo system with more variablea involved (like, idk, weather or decor affecting mood, that kinda thing?).
@@syaondri looks like a mana khemia clone, but less polished (no judging, it's indie)
I actually like that Tear _lies to you_ about how best to manage your price haggles.
Because she's a loan shark and wants you to fail.
As someone who played Recettear about 215 hours, I can say that, behind its cuteness, is a game so challenging as rewarding. Totally recommendable, just like this video.
PS: That little girl is SO stingy...
I shall call that "thief" girl
"chain breaker girl"
It sounds like the one thing Moonlighter really NEEDED(which is different from what it could do better), is stronger personalities. Recettear was powerful just with the characters that live in it and how they interact with each other. It had comedy that was quick and light, that also managed to show them growing over the course of the game.
Moonlighter is at a disadvantage in that aspect due to how the dungeon-crawling is inherently about going solo and playing the lonely game. There's a reason Recettear stretched the limits of disbelief to let the little girl walk with you in the dungeon, and it was for a worthwhile purpose.
We only touched on this a little but Recettear has so much more charm than Moonlighter with its writing alone. Moonlighter is gorgeous but it is severely lacking in personality. I don't understand how the old man has so many lines of dialogue that are all essentially saying the same thing.
Very much this! I've been rolling these ideas around in my head, trying prototype something that builds on this design space for years now, and I came to basically the same conclusion. I adored both games, but Recettear had a narrative that was equal parts silly and emotional, created personal ludonarrative motivation for the player (paying off the debt so they can keep playing and having fun), and introduced all kinds of fun colorful characters. That's what carried it through. Hoping to make something that builds on this genre some time soon!
I recommend checking out Faraway Story. It's got less polish in terms of item selling, but it experimented with more things and the story is similarly a blend of funny and emotional.
Yeah, the first hour of the game I was a bit baffled by the lack of important dialogue and character development. It just looked like I was surrounded by robots instead of characters.
> There's a reason Recettear stretched the limits of disbelief to let the little girl walk with you in the dungeon, and it was for a worthwhile purpose.
It's not even so much a stretch, it happens often enough in anime, where a support character is literally just carrying items.
Got Recettear after Yahtzee's critique on Moonlighter, and I regret nothing.
This game is a gem.
hey hey seth here
Who the fuck is Yahtzee?
@@azure5584 Yahtzee is a video game reviewer well known for his very strict but fair criticisms (Zero Punctuation on The Escapist channel). If Yahtzee enjoys a game, it is a great game (he enjoyed Portal, Doom, Return of the Obra Dinn, Undertale...). He also is behind the terms "console peasants" and "pc master race" and the pc master race character art, but invented them to mock elitists.
One thing to remember with Recettear is that it's actually quite a bit older than it may seem due to the gap between the English and original release.
The "sale box" in moonlighter sounds like a spin on the vending machines in recettear.
In recettear however, it's used to get rid of excess stock that you can't fit in the store so you can make more money in a day.
It's useful when the loan due date is just around the corner.
It’s actually for selling vending machines out of your vending machines for MEGA PROFIT
“BUY MY STATUE!”
He really brought back my love for the game
Joee
Waiting patiently this video since the announcement
"Get out of my store" for some reason i laughing
That was a great joke. I laughed pretty hard.
Little girls that waste your time and, more importantly, *break your chain*
They also want to buy my high quality weapons DESPITE BOT HAVING EVEN HALF THE MONEY FOR IT.
*DO I HAVE TO PUT UP A SIGN SAYING "NO CHILDREN ALLOWED" , LITTLE GIRL? **_GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY STORE!_*
They also want to buy my high quality weapons DESPITE BOT HAVING EVEN HALF THE MONEY FOR IT.
*DO I HAVE TO PUT UP A SIGN SAYING "NO CHILDREN ALLOWED" , LITTLE GIRL? **_GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY STORE!_*
I find it odd that you only showed Louie when explaining how the gameplay is simple, essentially showing "the basic character" as if it's representative of the rest.
However, there are several adventurers you can use, and they play quite differently. Charme, my adventurer of choice, has parries, a dash, and a set of versatile super moves. Not to say the dungeon crawling still doesn't get dull, but it's a little disingenuous to say there's not much of interest there. There's actually plenty, so long as you try to unlock the other adventurers.
In fact, I think Recettear supports more playstyles than Moonlighter overall.
@@Piorn Agreed. I loved recettear to bits and tried out moonlighter and I gotta say the charm of Recettears character and world kept me hooked while I could barely continue with Moonlighter. They're both great games and I do hope more item shop keeper games come out since it's a really fun concept.
i wish you could develop relationships in moonlighter. that's pretty much all it needs
No moonlighter needs way more than that
I would also ask for a post-game. Like, a new way to find products.
Well then it's just Stardew valley.
@@charbomber110 Will still be different. Instead of a farm, doing cleaning things, events and such, you do dungeons with more depth than stardew valley and own a shop. Having relationships in a game is not unique to stardew valley, and then pretty much the other main similarities is there being a town, the pixel art design, and gathering items (all of which are common in games in general)
I kinda hope the makers of Moonlighter see this and then make a Moonlighter 2.
Atelier series or a spinoff atelier game would be the perfect candidate for a great shop game. They already have the gameloop ready but they donlt have the store management part (which would work great with alchemy mechanics).
The haggling in Recettear becomes predictable, but it doesn't start that way. There's nothing that shows or states your relationship with customers, or how much they are willing to haggle with you. It's up to you to remember how much you can push a price and with who. It's a shame to hear Moonlighter has "correct" prices for items. Moonlighter sounds like it has some serviceable problems, probably just needs a sequel or something.
But Reccetear had "correct" prices as well. Right from the start too. You know how much an item is worth and you should always sell it at 120% to 130%. Unless it's in high demand or low demand.
In Moonlighter you don't know the value of the item, all the buyers do though. So it becomes a time to find the right price for the item and once that is done you it's a bit auto mode. Until the item is deemed of high value but unlike Reccetear you can't charge 200% for it.
Both games with the shop is easy mode the moment you just learn how to use it.
*Buy my statue*
@@Zefar77 That's not true, the just right system is required to actually start raking in big profits by selling expensive items. You can't just sell for profit, otherwise you can't make actually big sales in time.
I disagree with how you make Recettear sound like it was intended to be equal parts item shop and dungeon crawling when the latter is really just an accessory. The game can be played successfully without ever stepping foot in a dungeon where as the reverse is not true so clearly the item shop aspect is the main focus of the game. As long as the item shop aspect is good that is all that matters.
@@syaondri Maybe not. Byt the game's main objective is to pay back Recette's debt, which is how you win the game. Anything beyond that is completion.
As someone who has gotten game clear on Recettear over 30 times i can verify this is true
I need a Recettear 2
Sadly enough, moonlighter ain't Recettear 2
You would think a game called "Moonlighter" about simultaneously holding down two jobs would have some kind of fatigue mechanic where you couldn't just work all day and adventure all night. I'd love to see choices between, say, being open all day as a friendly general store vs. theming the place as an elite adventuring shop, which cuts down your clientele, but they don't mind shopping at a creepy place that's only open from dusk to midnight. (Of course, if the friendly guy has to take a day off because he's sick from overwork, he might have neighbors stopping by to check on him and bring him chicken soup...)
I played Moonlighter after the full release and the game is just not finished. Bosses drop unique loot that is useless, you can't craft anything with it. You can't refight bosses after defeating them once so replaying previous dungeons is pointless.
The items' popularity system either doesn't work or its effect is negligible that there is no reason to not sell everything overpriced.
The real star of the shop-adventure hybrid is a little title called Kamidori: Alchemist Meister, but most of y'all aren"t ready for that one
I was searching for this comment. You are a man of culture my friend
I said the same things about Moonlighter around when it came out and I had people telling me that I had no idea what I was talking about.
It's a decent to good game, but it's so incredibly shallow that it leaves you wanting more _while_ you're playing it. Playing the game after the 4-5 hour mark, I found myself doing what is no different than running around an open-world map doing all of the mini-games, not because you enjoy them (maybe to some degree), but specifically just to beat the game, no more.
Everytime someone tries to sell me on Moonlighter:"It's a game where you run an item shop and do dungeon crawling to find items to sell in your shop!"
Me:"Oh so its like Recettear but not as good"
Wake me when they port Recettear to Switch
im seriously about to learn game design just so i can create another recettear that's Just as good
@@jamiewilson2550 Hope it goes well!!!
Always happy to see some of Recettear's enduring legacy.
Thank you for making this video. I loved Recettear. That game to me is a hidden masterpiece that many people seem to miss out on because "ew, anime" or "ew, simulators" or "ew, cute games". It's just such a good game. A great story that will even make you tear up in some parts, an in depth shop simulator and a FUN dungeon experience. Yes, it's dated. It's very simple. But sometimes simple doesn't mean that it isn't fun and I for one had a lot of fun in those dungeons. Especially later in the game when you're trying to crawl through ONE HUNDRED floors of a dungeon and you start grinding for that ONE rare ingredient to make the ultimate weapon for one of your adventurers. I loved that and I'm getting an urge to go back right now to play through it again.
So, thank you for making this video because I wondered if Moonlighter was finally a replacement to one of my favorite hidden gems or if it was just another knock off that tried to do what Recettear did but once again, failed. And I think you answered that. I'll still give Moonlighter a shot eventually but at least now I won't be as disappointed when it fails to live up to my standards. :)
This makes me want to revisit Recettear.
Do iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit
lol I shoulddddd. Need the time to though haha
Just stop time. Go break a clock.
I'll do one better: I'll make a time machine and take my laptop with me every time I go back. I'll keep rewinding three hours until I beat the game XD
The premise of these games remind me of the Atelier games.
My thoughts exactly.
Atelier isn't so much into the selling aspect, but along with the alchemy system (which is mandatory to beat the game), it's there if you want to exploit it.
And it's a better way to farm for cash instead of mindlessly killing cute animals all over the maps.
I can see either Gust or Falcom doing a good job with something like this. Like with Gust, they could make an Atelier game similar to this, which they sort of did with Atelier Rorona. But that game was less about managing the shop and dealing with customers, than just dealing with the government to pay off the store's debts.
I spat out my drink, laughing, when he said " - to keep the debt fairy away."
Great video. Although Moonlighter seems more polished, I enjoyed my time with Recettear much more.
Thank you for stating my exact opinion of this game. What irks me is that I did my research on this game, and reviewers I found praised it.. none of them must've played it for more than 4 hours. Sort of makes me mad. Seems like I've found an honest reviewer, might as well subscribe :)
It's too bad really, because this game would be amazing if it was finished. There were so many points in the game were I felt they missed an opportunity to integrate systems with eachother.
Sidenote, I too found it fun to figure out prices of stuff, was bummed out when I realized everything was sorted out by price. Not to mention the banker, holy fuck.
THANK YOU! I couldn’t understand why I wasn’t a fan of moonlighter even though it’s a beautiful game. I never played more than 5-6 times for a few hours, and I just couldn’t get into it!
I like the in-depth look you take on these two games; you managed to accurately capture my opinions on them. A note though that the final line “Recettear and Moonlighter blaze the trail for something amazing” is kind of an odd note to end on, since the potential for these games wasn’t really explored in the video. Nonetheless, I agree - this new emerging genre strangely excites me.
Holy hell. How did I ever not see this video? This is my favourite kind of genre, and I’ve been watching your channel for ages. Thankfully there are loads of item shop mobile games that have kept me going with the lack of proper games on the concept.
moonlighter is one of the many reasons why I'm wary around amazing looking indie games
Gotta be honest, the art style of Recettear and its greater focus on the shop side really bias me towards it over Moonlighter. I've never been huge on most dungeon crawling anyways, so the simple dungeon crawling was almost a selling point to me. Just enough to give me something else to do without being too much.
How you explained it sounded like Moonlighter is just the story of a man who got so sick of his day to day life he decided to just use that as a side hustle so he could go adventuring.
But seriously I may have to play these games. These look pretty damn sweet.
Do it! They're still solid if a bit flawed.
I LOVE Recettear. Is one of my favorite games but I never got to sit down and actually think about it. Thanks for that and I agree with you, the dungeon crawler side of Recettear is really basic I didn't even bother with it too much, I only went there to get materials to craft expensive stuff but I'm ok with that since the rest of the game outweighs it, I still have to finish Recettear using it's dungeon crawler side tho.
I think another important part of Recettear it's the charm of the Characters, Recette is so Innocent and enthusiastic and yet pretty self aware, makes you care for her.
My biggest complain it'd be that the Rival character doesn't do anything, she's cute and all but it never develops into anything, I was expecting the Rival to steal some of my clients with her offers or something but nope.
All in all, Recettear is a neat little experiment and this moonlighter guy tried to replicate it but I feel it missed the core and heart of Recettear.
9Tensai9 I played moonlighter but not recettear. Is the game still good if i played it?
@@aster7132 Low budget 2D games age slowly, so Recetear is still optically fine. As far as gameplay goes, due to the lack of rivals in it''s genre to outshine it it's also still good.
Just got Moonlighter a couple days ago, and i came to similar conclusions on my own.
I think a sequel, taking into account all your criticisms would be amazing, I hope it did well enough for that.
I spent a few days trying to sell a Training Sword, and after slowly decreasing it to only 100 coins more than its crafting price I went and looked up if it was even viable to craft things.
As you said it wasnt, maybe the rich folk every so often would buy it from a case. Which kinda sucks because Forging is one of my favorite mechanics in games, I'm still enjoying crafting weapons for myself, but I was pretty excited to sell them (especially since there are adventurer NPCs that come in specifically looking for Weapons and Equipment)
I can’t thumb this hard enough. Definitely needed to be said. I haven’t got around to Recettear yet, but Moonlight was addictive until you got that wall. And by the end it was like they left off the back half of the game. So. Many. Missed. Opportunities.
I haven't booted up Recettear since July 2012, so not once in 8 years, and the moment the note on the music came up in the video, I could hum the tune, before the music was actually played. That's either the sign of *very* repetitive music, or brilliant composition. I can't really tell.
You can choose between varius heroes in Recettear, with different attacks
5 years later and i am STILL waiting on a really good shop management game
Shoppe Keep 2 may not have dungeons (yet; early access), but it does give you the option to leave town, complete side quests, and gather rare resources for making super valuable items after you open the blacksmith shop.
Played Recettear before. I was excited when Moonlighter was launched. Spent several days (not even a week, just around 3-4days) then that's it, a big let down.
It's just the same one damn concept repeated over and over for the next 4 or 5 dungeons (reskin on stuffs like current mobile game industry lol).
The shop mechanics is dumb. You just need to go to dungeon and target on getting most expensive pcs (like lava core if I remembered correctly for the lava dungeon), and you could obtain those easily if you enter the secret area(the one where you jump on the hole with a shiny light, and fight waves of monsters). Then sell it at the suitable price and viola! You make tremendous amount of profits (zero monetary cost btw) that you will feel so poor that only money is what's left and there is no point on making any money further. The existence of sales box has no point at all, you just need the most expensive goods to put on the table and people would buy it ALL if it is priced right. And as for weapon, I use only bow and it clears the game easily, just keep on spamming button while dodging the incoming projectile.
After beating the alien boss and that's it. The End. The shop is more like a frills; you sell eveything as long as it is priced right, unlike recettear where I tried so hard to sell that piece of thing and no one wanted to buy. Lack of loli and Japanese voice acting is also a flaw.
In short, Moonlighter is lack of depth and loli. Loli is powerful!!
You might think about doing a follow-up with restaurant based item shop games. I've seen a few that follow similar formulas
I recall hope Mineko's Night Market will solve these problems. This could be an amazing game genre, but it's young
Haven't heard of this one. The trailer looks super promising! Though the non-shop half seems to be closer to a life sim like Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing so it's not as comparable to Recettear . Hopefully it all comes together.
I like the idea of running a shop like in these, I don't like having to go out and kill shit
One last problem with Moonlighter:
I don't want to play as Blandboy McProtagonist-kun.
The _Atelier_ series tends to have a similar diametric gameplay aspect of RPG and Item Shop management. Most of the titles don't go too heavy into the Item Shop side of things in the way _Recettear_ does, but the RPG aspects are mostly about supporting the crafting system, which ties into various other Town and Time Management systems. _Nelke_ (a more recent side game of the series) goes full Town Management; sending adventurers out to gather materials, so alchemists can craft items, so shop owners can sell things, and you can grow the town. It's not pure Item Shop gameplay, but it's more micro-intensive than other City Building games.
Omg I remember Recettear..
I really hope a triple A company tries to do something amazing with this game format.
Maybe Fire Emblem; Ana Edition? I'd love to play that ;-;
I'm playing Moonlighter and enjoying it so far. I'm not far enough to understand all your critiques firsthand, but I can still see what you're saying. I gotta disagree on the polish though. Some parts are very polished, and then there are a TON of things that feel like they weren't double-checked at all.
First of all, almost none of the mechanics are explained, or at least not well. You get stuck on an invisible door on the south wall of any room. You can go through objects in the hub town by attacking, thus moving Will slightly forward. The falling animation always makes Will fall north, despite being able to fall from any direction, so most falling happens through the floor and looks really unnatural. There are a few weapon types, but the 2 options in each type are so insignificant. The menus are pretty when just looking at them, but when using them, they take a lot of getting used to and can be really clunky. Organizing items you want to keep for crafting is such a chore. The whole presentation of how dungeons work is almost nonexistent, leaving me with a lot of questions like "What happens if I leave now? Can I leave now? Why can't I?", forcing me to simply guess, and almost always be punished for it. Also what's that giant slime ghost? Can I fight him? How come nobody mentions him? Why is he there in there first place, lore-wise and gameplay-wise? And of course, several minor visual glitches, like a curse slot on my item menu that wouldn't go away until I reset the game.
Also the cursed items suck, literally just sell the cheapest items and move cursed items into slots that won't affect the others. Basically no strategy involved, just frustrating and clunky. Like you mentioned, the systems sometimes have fake depth, and I think the curse system is the worst offender. Forcing you to spend time on a menu =/= interesting or fun. Now, if it incentivized you to be smart by getting bonuses based on placement, THAT could be fun. But it's just a few arbitrary roadblocks that take a moment to correct. Ugh. Just let me have my treasure, I already earned it.
I like the game but I almost quit early on because they gave almost no thought to how teach teach the systems of a game that has a lot of systems and leans heavily on them. I'm glad I stuck it out because it is good, but not great.
Now we must combined the two, and make the perfect game
Replaying Recettear right now, I had fond memories of it but wondered if it would hold up, and I really feel it does. I also never knew that the dungeons kept going, my first time I focused on my shop and put the game down after doing the main story of paying off my debt a couple times. I'm doing more of the dungeons now and I'm impressed how good that part of the game is. It's not as good as a pure dungeon crawler obviously, but it's really surprisingly deep and challenging in a way that kind of reminds me of Stardew Valley. Add to that several additional layers of crafting using dungeon components, the different adventurers with different playstyles, it feels like it has no business being as good as it is, and I'm having a good time.
I was confused at first, because I love recettear and hated moonlighter. I played moonlighter for a few hours, but it just made me wish I was playing recettear... But yeah, you got the heart of it.
This episode feels like it's been.... previously recorded :eyes:
Few things.
1: Reccetear shop music is timeless. I like it more than the music in Moonlighter. Also one theme in Moonlighter sounds way to similar to Sniper Elite 4 main theme.
2: The item merchant in Moonlight overprice the items by like 400% and it's both easier and worth more to just head to the dungeon to get them. I ignored him the moment I saw the prices he asked for the items.
3: I didn't feel like I was swimming in money in Moonlighter. Upgrades or weapons on rank 3 cost 32 000 and 64 000. One weapon later and most money is gone. That's just for one piece too.
4: Shop system in both games where easy. On my previous save file for Reccetear I had no problem with selling items for ideal prices. In Moonlighter it's a bit more fun to actually sell more stuff and having to restock the store. But because there is no pressure it's just about getting all of that money.
A friends bought me Recettear as a gift and I’m so glad because I loved it but might have otherwise missed it
1:56 I have never agreed more in my entire life.
Summary: Recetter is an item shop system with a dungeon crawler. Moonlighter is a dungeon crawler with an item shop system.
As an economist, this is gold. Imagine the possibilities *o*
I have a feeling that there is no actual economy or market there really
I kinda want to see a game like Recettear and Moonlighter but it slowly becomes a satire on capitalism. Like at first its dungeon delving and selling items, until it becomes out-sourcing exploring and looting to other warriors, stomping competition out of business with prices lower than theirs, running your store like a franchise and going across villages opening your own stores in. Creating and shifting the supply and demand chain with hoarding valuable items and limiting the distribution. Bribing royalty and kingdoms to suit in your favour against others. Becoming the invisible hand of the free market.
Eventually it stops being a fantasy adventure game, but a management game only. The fantasy elements will still be there, but to do it personally as your character is not worth the time compared to many other workers doing the same for you.
The problem I see in making a game like this becomes having extension knowledge of economics and business and also having to keep the game fun after the monopolization.
Recettear's is a really amazing game! Moonlight nice relaxing game, but not that much more...
It seems Moonlighter has had a LOT of updates since this video. Would love to hear your take on the current version.
Recettear is one of my favorite games. I really like all the character's interactions and the artstyle for the characters, but I can see what you're talking about with your points on the dungeon crawling.
The problem with item shop games is that they lack the unpredictability of actually running a shop in an MMO. This is afterall where the gameplay is from and the blend of basic management with dungeoneering has existed for decades - just not in a single player format.
It's the kind of game which needs to be driven by a dynamic world which changes the supply and demand of items and is essential to making the item shop itself interesting. In essence, you really need to blend X4 world systems with item shop mechanics.
Recettear has exactly what you are asking for tho, certain items will increase and decrease in demand, making them cost more or less and attract more or less costumer. Some fads may come and go, and displaying popular items will attract those that are into said fads.
i've played the hell out of both of these, and i can't wait for someday when i'll get a full, honest, polished item shop game.
Yoooo, whatsup, whats your opinion about haubted chocolatier?
I've got two other games in this vein for people hungry for more (like I always am, capitalism, ho!). Little Dragons Cafe is by Harvest Moon's old director, and is a restaurant manager, dungeon crawler, and Dragon raising sim. Super cute, but can feel kind of dumbed down compared to Recettear, and doesn't have much of a difficulty curve.
The Bell Chimes for Gold is... An otome dating sim where you try and buy the affection of older men. It's... Not good. You can beat the whole thing in 6 hours, and the dungeon/store manager split doesnt work since you can make way more money just dungeon crawling. Might be worth your time if you're desperate but... Hey, who isn't when you're a fan of this genre?
Im so happy to see a new video made :] please keep up the good work, you make AMAZING content. Even my fiance, whom finds video games completely uninteresting, enjoys the insight you offer in your videos.
Any video talking about Recettear its a good video
Reckettear is an under rated gem. Played it on Steam years ago, would def' buy it again on PS if it popped up, or a new game from them with the same concept.
I remember the old flash game, Swords And Potions
I understand your criticisms about Moonlighter, but considering I got it for $7.78 on Steam during a pixelart sale, I personally can't complain. I find it intensely fun, and it's great to have a game that affords me a chance to get a "full" experience in 15-25 minutes when I don't have an hour or more needed for other games.
love your critical review. Maybe Moonlighter will have a DLC that could fix the game. When it came out on PC it was very buggy, but now on Switch it is nice.
I do hope that developers continue this genre. The idea behind it is great.
Yoo, whatsup, what are your opinion about haunted chocolatier?
I did not know a game like Recettear was something I wanted, but here I am considering it. And I don't just clog a steam library either.
Good video. I'll make one nitpick: Recettear's death mechanic in combination with its general difficulty curve means that its death mechanic essentially doesn't exist. It's actively unfun to deal with the consequences of a death, so players pretty much always savescum if they die.
This has inspired me to try and make a small video game about this. Then, if it turns out to be fun at first, I'll remake it.
I was wondering what kind of game I should make, and now I think I know.
Does anyone knows of any other game like those two? A shop keeping game mixed with something else?
I'd die for a new game with Recettears style and more polish.
Shoppe Keep 2 is in early access right now. It differs from the original by way of combat and resource-gathering outside of the town. It does take a while to get outside the town, though...
Maybe give Rune Factory 4 a try. It's more like Harvest moon than Recttear with its shop aspect but, it's still pretty good.
Little Dragons Cafe just came out and is a 3D dungeon crawler, restaurant manager, and dragon raising sim. It's kinda simplistic, especially in the beginning, but it's super cute and balances all the genre juggling well.
I've played RF4, it's pretty good and has a bunch of stuff with the normal rpg things, but not much on shop things as you said, tnks tho ❤
The Moonlightwr Between Dimensions DLC changed quite a bit in the gameplay and mechanics of Moonlighter. Not touching on how item management between what sells for high amounts and whats required for upgrades or potions creation seems off base. You can only bring back so many items per dungeon run and discovering item prices in the ship is a fun side project and makes you consider your options when deciding what to bring back from the dungeon runs. I know you were comparing two games here but perhaps you should have given each game their own critique instead of trying to pit both games against one another
May I suggest to all of you, a similar game like this but with more balanced combat, crafting, multiple stores and dungeons, and pretty anime characters?
Faraway Story. It's free, translated, and still has updates coming.
i only played a couple hour of moonlighter, but personally, for me the weak point of moonlighter is the combat system. it is working fine, but for how much they emphasis the importance of the dungeon, i expect the combat to be a little better than what they offer.
i could look pass recettear's(which i play to completion back in the day) combat system because it is not really that important for the narrative and the gameplay besides getting few item to sell. i don't even go to dungeon crawling that much since i find just buying items from the guild/market and sell it at markup price is sufficient enough to get me through the bills. the way they did it also make you think twice before going dungeon crawling since it takes up the entire day, losing a full day of store tending opportunities.
moonlighter on the other hand, the narrative is based around the mystery of the dungeon and bringing glory back to your town. And the way they split day-night cycle where you could go dungeon crawling at night, since you can't open the store at night anyway, means they encourage you to go dungeon crawling as often as possible. for a game that emphasis that much, narrative or mechanics, i expect the combat to be a bit better than that. the combat feels clunky, the dungeon are quite repetitive besides changing the tilesets., etc.
@@syaondri yeah, i played it on subsequent run. Since i like that game that much
Edit : still, my point is with how much moonlighter narrative/gameplay loops works, i just feel the combat parts quite lacking
I'd say that Moonlighter in general feels just.. Sub par compared to Recettear, even in the areas in which it shines. The dungeons are fairly bland and repetitive, which was touched upon on the video, but a few other things were forgotten as well. Recettear had randomized events that occured in dungeons, like the slippery floors one that was in the video. It also had multiple characters each with their own attacks and abilities, which I feel was more than what the small amount of weapon variety in Moonlighter offered. It is a shame however, since Moonlighter does have the good bones for something to come of it, but even as a roguelike it felt lacking in comparison, and thats not even comparing it to other rogue like games.
Concernedape will show them how its done with haunted chocolatier
Get outta my store kills me 🤣🤣
This channel is gold, you just earned a sub. I've watched your videos and it's awesome!!
Pretty sure it's 'recketteer', if we're going by one of the in-game jokes
I've always thought it was pronounced with a K, so to speak, as a play on racketeering.
"recketteer" is a mispronunciation.Tear was worried that someone would make that very mistake.
I've always wanted a co-op and versus mode in recettear...my friend and I looked into it buut no dice! (they even have characters that can fill that role if someone wants to mod it!)
Moonlighter's dungeon mechanics mixed with Recettear's character development and shop mechanics...
MOONLIGHTEAR!!!!!
There is actually someone who remember recettear? I love exploring in recettear dungeon, it is just fun to fight a lot of annoying slimes at once.
Anyway Moonlighter... ack someone's always done something... I guess it's still a blue ocean
Moonlighter - seems like all the budget went into the art/polish.
Also, the developers confuse tedium with fun - catching a thief every 10seconds and managing backpack space isn't fun.
It was already a chore sorting the good stuff from garbage in Recettear, but to add another layer of fitting the items in backpack space is just absurd.
Give backpack options/upgrades and streamline the dungeon crawling experience instead of halting it.
We need recettear 2 with -boobies- combat like moonlighter
Otherwise.. "Get out of my store"
2:00 I need that line for my message ringtone xD
you should revisit this!! games like cult of the lamb are getting more popular, but I find they're suffering from the same problems you outline in this video
Boy does Cult of the Lamb have the EXACT same problem
the music in moonlighter is pretty choice.
It would be dope to have a game of this genre in VR
I loved Recettear...but it is balls-out hard. The fact that the weekly payment goes up so quickly, you'll find yourself in an unwinnable position many times and have to restart your game.
Had to restart once since one day went unbelievably bad, it's by no means easy, and shouldn't be, but not too hard either.
Anybody who knows about Recettear and praises it deserves a sub and thumbs up in my book. Didn't know about Moonlighter as an item shop game so I'll definitely check it out!
They should just do a collab then and make the perfect game of this type :D