Croydon, Old Town and its fantastic history
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- čas přidán 5. 07. 2024
- This video goes back to the beginning of the story of Croydon's history: Old Town.
Filmed on a sunny November day I used the Old Town Heritage Walk route and captured some additional footage along the way.
You can download the route here (it also has the link to the Market Town walk that I covered in another film):
www.croydon.gov.uk/planning-a...
Jump To:
00:00 Start
00:17 Whitgift Almshouses (Hospital of the Holy Trinity)
01:29 Walking down Church Street
03:36 Elis David Almshouses
04:04 Croydon Minster
04:59 Flint Cottages
05:20 Old Palace School
05:55 Tudor Arch
06:16 Memorial Gardens
06:40 Queen's Doorway
07:11 War Memorial
07:36 Wandle Park
08:50 Some extras along the way
09:41 Close
Thank you for watching, I really appreciate it.
If you would like to make a contribution towards the costs of making content then please click on the “Thanks” button on any video, or alternatively you can buy me a coffee here: www.buymeacoffee.com/philswallow
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#croydon #croydonlocalhistory #oldtown #oldtowncroydon #croydonoldtown #localhistory
Since I arrived in England, in the early eighties, I always lived around Croydon.
I never knew that Croydon had so much history! So interesting! Thanks.
It’s very rich in history, in the suburbs too - glad you enjoyed it!
Loved seeing my grandads pub which he ran during the second world war situated in old town (the rose and crown). I had many a pint in there with my best man Frank Buddin (who lived just around the corner); we were both stationed at H28 Woodside LFB Fire Station in the 1970's! Those were the good old days!
I never visited there but what a great building it is. I was in the area last week visiting Croydon Minster including a trip to the bell tower which was great fun. The Ashburton area has an interesting history, one on my list to cover in some films.
@@philswallow thanks for your comments Phil and I had to reply as you mentioned Ashburton and that brought back a memory- namely a fractured spine sustained whilst fighting a fire and then on my last night shift at Woodside before transferring to C21 Shoreditch Fire Station one hell of a roof fire just down the road from Ashburton Park! Then off to the city of London where many stories can be told like the Moregate tube train disaster!
Wow, some serious action and damage there. My late grandfather was a firefighter during The Blitz. Based in Mitcham I think, some nights they went from shift to shift with no break due to the demand from the bombing onslaught. Huge respect to you and your colleagues.
Superb nostalgia for me. So many memories. Drinking in the Rose & Crown in the 80s and 90s, evening school at the John Ruskin in 1968, so many of my Brown family in the Parish Register at St Johns and Great Great Granny Jane Brown in the Alms Houses when too old with others recorded across the Borough churches. Thank you Phil
I’m glad you enjoyed it, you certainly have a lot of local connections!
@@philswallow my Mother's Mother's side (Coldham, Brown, Evans, Hall, Melton & Potter etc) were in Croydon from the 1840s. They relocated from Suffolk, Sussex, deepest Surrey. So lots of connections.
Terrific clip. I'm a bit embarrassed, in that I didn't know some of those spots existed.
Walking and eyes closed... 🫣
Croydon’s history is quite something!
I remember buying my spark plugs in woolworths for my escort they sold loads of stuff. Great video Phil
Woolworths was a huge part of our lives back in the day!
You have opened my eyes to how much of this past is still present another great video appreciated . 😊
It’s great that so much of it is still there, the building of the flyover many years ago cut through Old Town completely (sadly)
Another great video Phil. I have never been to Wandle Park! Incredible all that graffiti at the start up so high. Looks like a lot of the buildings need some TLC.
Cheers mate, it’s close but in some ways hidden. It’s a shame some of those buildings were marked in that way, probably a challenge
Wandle Park, a fogotten gem. That's mainly because it was subject to under-investment for decades. In its heyday the boating lake and island in the park were a real treat for visitors. Even when the lake was drained they retained the dip and the island which was great for kids on bikes - but the killjoys decided to flatten it out and create the most boring piece of grassed area in the borough. In the early sixties it was impressive playing there in the immediate shadow of the old Croydon B power station (since removed and whose chimneys are part of the IKEA signposting.
Did you know that while I lived in Croydon, when you stood in George Street and looked down the alley between the Hospital of the Holy Trinity and the first of the shops, you could see the old 'Headmaster's House'. This was the residence of the Headmaster when the school that stood where the Whitgift Centre now stands. However, it was also the school building when it and the almshouses were first built. What is lost these days is that the almshouses and the school were built to serve the poor and the needy old people and educate the poor deserving boys of two of the Archbishops manors, Lambeth and Croydon.
Did you realise that the name Crown Hill (which is , in fact, part of Church Street), was so-named because of the pub that stood where Barclays' bank now does. George Street, of course was named for the pub of that name - not, as some once believed, because of King George III or IV. George IV was however spotted riding speedily towards the home of his then First Lord of the Treasury (Prime Minister) cutting up pedestrians near the Almshouses. Robert Banks Jenkinson, 2d Earl of Liverpool lived out towards Addiscombe.
You may recall the Classic cinema in Crown Hill, a real fleapit, but dearly loved by some of us at the time. Then there is the terrible tale of the ancient building opposite. What became KFC (I think) the building that occupies the site alongside Crown HIll/Church Street and also Bell Hill and is bounded in the west by Surrey Street - it had been several different hereditaments in its day, but in the shape that it had when a public house, it became a listed building. When the planning consents (including listed planning consents) were given to completely renovate (rebuild) the sixteenth/seventeenth century buildings the constructors moved in. They sensibly began by stripping the roof. As they did so they uncovered what was essentially a still complete thirteenth or fourteenth century roof from an older (and unlisted) iteration of the building - it was lost or the sake of progress.
Did you know that there are still a number of mediaeval alleyways running into Church Street, and they all had names - this was the mediaeval 'High Street' and grew up outside of the palace gates - where were the palace gates? Just adjacent to what had been the Gun Tavern at Old Palce Road. You would turn out of Church Street to enter the palace grounds passing by the fish ponds and other water features towards the Archiepiscopal Palace of Croydon.
The area at the bottom of Church Street, including around by the Church, was at a low point in the Wandle valley and for much of the middle ages and well into the modern period was a dank, wet and altogether unhealthy place (it was why the Archbishops moved to Addington Palace!). There are records of flooding that were truly disturbing - including the re-emergence of freshly deposited coffins being forced to the surface by water pressure in the churchyard!
Ah! Happy days.
I remember being taken to Hewitts for school uniform and Brownies/Guides uniform.
Hewitts was THE place to go, Jenni!
I miss seeing you walking and talking Phil. You add so much with your commentary and personality
Haha, thanks Karen, I will return to that very soon. These Croydon ones started out in that style and I kept it going for the series - stay tuned! 😊
You more or less finished with the River Wandle and all very good.
How about starting (or continuing) with the River Wandle, along to Beddington Park (incl Carew Manor) and Carshalton, perhaps further? A super walk away from the noisy roads.
Back along Croydon Road, Charles Cryer Arts and some decent pubs!
Cheers!
Definitely one to consider Graham, it would be good to gauge demand so will see how the comments go!
Another great video, thanks!
Thank you!
Great stuff Phil, thanks! I lived in Croydon until I was 35, so know (almost!) everywhere you showed. It wasn't until after I left that I got interested in history. Wow, you've found loads of interesting history of the area! I didn't notice any mention of the Croydon Canal, which you may not be aware of. I've not been able to find much out at all, other than it existed. There is a part of it still there today......and I just cannot remember the name of the place. It's up the hill away from central Croydon, on the way to Crystal Palace. Penge maybe? I used to visit a friend who's flat backed onto the short stretch of canal still there, and I believe the only part of it. I think it went near to the current flyover too but that's about all I ever found out. I used to work in Purley Way at Landis & Gyr, which was in an old 1930's building previously with 2 different names (Radio "something" and AGI). I'm so annoyed they demolished it, I had a lot of memories from there (next to Sainsbury's Homebase, I think it's a Staples now). I remember seeing when they lifted the old railway line that went under the bridge at Woodside, so I saw the last train to ever go along it. They were lifting the track bit by bit then loading it onto a wagon behind a locomotive, then moving along to the next bit. After the track was gone but before the tram tracks were laid, myself and some naughty friends walked along the railway route nearer central Croydon at Sandilands bridge (Addiscombe Road), at night, and climbed up through an old platform there. We walked up to the tunnel then bottled it!
Great memories! Re the canal, that may be one for future film. The rail line from West Croydon (Overground line I think) follows the original canal route and in fact part of it is in cuttings such that you can visualise how it would have been. I also have plans for some shoots in the Woodside area. I’m going to a talk in a couple of weeks all about it so should learn more. I will be covering the old race course there (whoops, given that game away 😁)
@@philswallowYes you've jogged me memory, I also remember reading that some of the old train line followed the canal route. I think there was a bridge across Bingham Road, where the tram now crosses it. I remember walking along a footpath near Coombe Road, I can't think exactly where, and you could see the old railway route in a valley and some of the foot bridges were still there. That was a long time ago so I don't know what's still there, and if that's now the tram route or not. There was also a bridge across Coombe Road, which was removed after they took the track up. That's where the tram now does a sharp left turn instead of crossing Coombe Road, at Llyod Park. Did you know the large creator with a slide (if it's still there) in Lloyd Park was a WWII bomb crater? I'm full of useless info! Teehee. I've subscribed and looking forward to more. :)
@explorewithgeoff It’s all good info, Geoff. The tram made good use of the old Coombe Road line and tunnel - it works pretty well as a modern form of transport - guaranteed journey times etc
@@philswallow The West Croydon basin was built for the canal. Certainly in the 1950s, 60s and 70s, maybe even the 80s, you could stand in Station Road looking into the old station goods entrance and still see the original wharf buildings of the canal. They were joined around 1801 and 1803 to the junctions with the two new iron railways. A short line ran down to what is now Reeves' Corner along what became Tamworth Road. Tamworth Road was laid down specifically for this purpose, and Church Road was laid down for the Croydon, Godstone and Merstham Iron Railway. The Surrey Iron Railway followed what later became the Wimbledon Line and later still the Tramlink route. Going out the canal went via Spurgeon's Bridge (built because of the canal). The tow path still exists around that area along the length of the old canal. As a child my neighbour and I often dug up clay pipes, a legacy of the 'navvies' who constructed it. Then it went off to South Norwood where the bridge over what became Portland road was built (for the canal) and the aptly named Jolly Sailor pub served as a hospitality stop.
The John Ruskin school in Tamworth Road was not originally a Grammar school. It was just one of the board schools established under the 1907 Education Act. It became a Grammar school at some point after the 1944 Education Act, and later transferred to its new site in Upper Shirley in the 1950s (now itself an housing estate!) the only chool in Croydon to have a windmill in its grounds.. What you have not mentioned are the buildings almost opposite, the last of the wholesale butchers that Croydon was once famous for. There are photographs of the chaos caused by the striking butchers and delivery drivers around the time of the General Strike. The whole area simply seized up - there were just that many vehicles employed in these businesses, and they were not moving but just lined up in the carriageway along Tamworth Road, Church Street and most other feeder roads - chaos ensued!
You didn't mention either the building just to the left of the school as you viewed it. This was the Barlow & Parker confectionery and supplies wholesaling warehouse and offices. Not many people these days will have heard of the firm, but I was a regular visitor in the early 1960s - about adecade after the events that made the place quite infamous. It was on the roof of Barlow & Parker that the famous words were uttered "Let him have it" by Derek Bentley. These words were what underpinned of the charges of murder against Derek Bentley and caused the nearly half-century of appeals and work by his sister Iris to have him exonerated. The Craig-Bentley case was a failed burglary. Bentley with a sixteen year old Christopher Craig were attempting to break in to the warehouse through the large roof-lights. They were interrupted by the Police. Unfortunately Craig was armed with a gun and Bentley was being held by a policeman. Bentley was heard to say "Let him have it" after which Craig fired and a policeman, PC Sidney Miles, was fatally wounded.
Bemtley's defence was that he was urging his younger companion to hand over the weapon. Craig either panicked or misunderstood and fired. Since Craig was too young to be tried for the cpaital offence, he was sent to Borstal. Derek Bentley, was sentenced to be hanged by the neck until dead. For those of us around my age, this was a haunting episode in what was home turf. Bentley was eventually pardoned - but much good that did him.
Thank you for your comments John, they are very much appreciated.
Νice video ❤
Thanks! 🙏