Electric Paramotor ULTIMATE DURATION Testing!
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- čas přidán 2. 06. 2024
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Timestamps
0:00 Intro
0:24 Giveaway
1:08 The Tests
1:43 Best Case
7:02 Worst Case
11:44 Average Case
14:40 Conclusions - Zábava
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what will happened when battery blow up on fire mid flight.
Is there any quick release to dump it ? I saw in previous video you loaded it from top...
Oh bummer. I wanted the blueprint one but it was out of stock in my size so I ordered the national Forest. Any way to change my order?
@@Pateramalina This is very unlikely with these types of batteries unless abused. They ltypically will have several safeguards built in that prevent this. I work in the RC hobby field and these batteries usually only catch fire when they are not charged properly. Using the factory charger will prevent this. Even then, they of not explode. Most info on exploding lithium batteries is simply internet bunk.
Got off the ground and gave *"a"* flight time and the form factor of just jamming a battery in there is the least complex way of both engineering and using. Surprised no counter-rotating propellers as this should aid greatly in both control and efficiency without adding a crazy amount of weight. Having a secondary "landing battery" like having a backup parachute seems critical as well so I can understand the giveaway! Some of these systems are becoming incredibly "dense" so the bulkiness of the battery might be set for a tremendous reduction for 2024 anyways. Watching what Aptera is up to for ground transportation might give a clue as to the future of pure play BEV. Turning an actual car into a flying car as pure play BEV is not as complex as people realize and that one might be the one to do it.
Where you turned around at is where I live. That neighborhood is called Castelgate. I hike that area a lot. I've probably seen you flying around too. I've wondered who that was. Now I know. Hopefully you see this comment. I have been wanting to fly like this for awhile. You around town? I would love to learn.
I really appreciate you doing this. I can't think of a more trusted tester and I was craving this information. My flying style is basically going up to 3k feet, falling with style, and repeat. However, I'm about 20 minutes from my favorite farm so the range is a concern. I bet Kyle Mooney would love this. :)
I miss your PPG videos. Have they moved to a different channel by chance?
Make more paramotor videos woody
Thank you for this review.
Just know that there are people who like flying these with bigger, more efficient wings, where 1 hour+ flight times can be achieved. I enjoy flying my 27m buzz, and this SP140 is perfect for that, for my style of flying.
I'd be lying if I said I wasn't excited to see this video! I've seen many of your previous reviews so I know your style, this is gonna be sick! Thanks Tucker!!
Excellent content!!
I would really like to see a video where you use this as a paraglider for a longer flight, flying thermals and/or hang and only boosting with the motor during the start and as required to stay airborne!!
He doesn't do thermalling. Don't know why.
That would require a large and efficient wing and it doesn't seem like he have one of those or even enjoy that type of flying. But this type of motor would be ideal for that as it's easy to throttle back without issues getting it started again.
@@znail4675 Exactly my point, electric motors should, at least in theory be perfect for cutting the power and cruising, especially since the range shouldn't be as much of an issue then!
I would consider buying one for that reason alone 😊
This was my thought exactly. Seems like a good, low maint. way for “flatlanders” to climb up and get some thermal time until they have enough time to travel to a launch site.
@@kevinlind4640 A reasonable argument for electric paramotors..
Looked like an approx. one hour flight time based in your 6 minute 10% usage, but 44 minutes is not too bad for an initial product. Batteries are improving, so eventually 1 hour flight will likely be achievable under normal conditions.
Great tests. As I say to people, it depends what your usage case is. I love electric cars, but I don't do long drives very often. And as you pointed out, if you just want to get some air under your feet in an evening, half an hour is perfect.
Some things I would like to add: I think the term "best case" for flight time isn't really typical in this case, as the vast majority of people will not be flying a sporty 16m advanced wing if they are aiming for long flight times.
Similarly, for a "normal flight," most people are not flying the most sporty wing, "the Freeride," and performing barrel rolls; this is not an average flight for an average person. Of course, most of us who fly paramotors understand that Tucker is not "normal." However, for those who dont fly paramotors, I think this could use some clarity.
As a side note, the battery Tucker is flying here is no longer available, as it has been upgraded to a larger capacity version, increasing from 3.7 kWh to 4.8 kWh. This will proportionally increase the flight time. Therefore, any orders placed going forward will include the new battery design at no additional cost. This also applies to any orders placed within the past month.
The curse of electric is that you want to fly longer then you would with gas motor. Just because it is more comfortable to fly but you cant. So that is why it's kinda a curse 😔. But batterys will just be getting better and better so it will be less and less of a curse over time.
Not sure if this is obvious, but with an EV pickup like a Ford F150 Lightning, It could easily recharge a couple extra para-motor batteries several times while flying the others. I own a Lightning, and it's GREAT. 🙂
Same goes for Hyundai/Kia/Genesis with the backseat onboard inverter or the external V2L adapter. :)
Paul's comment should be pinned!
1:52 Immediately realize this "best case test" is MISLEADING. It may be Tucker's "most efficient" glider, but it's a 16M (Ozone's smallest Viper XC), fast cruise speed, cross-country wing.... and is overloaded past Ozone's specification (225# if at 75% of the PPG range, which is already exceeded with just the weight of the PG and pilot here). All of this burns way more power than for the average PPG pilot on a properly loaded beginner to intermediate wing.
Of course, this is MY best case scenario with the gear I have available, at my weight, which I cannot change. I bet the vast majority of pilots weigh more than me. As I said, 60 minutes is surely obtainable with different gear.
If I could, I wish I could weigh 190lbs and fly a 26m Spyder as that is probably the most common setup.
@@TuckerGott Ya I probably do a vid with the Spyder 3 as that is a popular wing even if it's not the most efficient. I would love to do a video benchmarking a bunch of different wings.
It's just hard to do it all in the same environment setup. As typically I want to do the testing in zero wind so pretty much just have an hour or so in the evening when the thermals die down. But don't really have to do a whole flight on it just need to fly for a few minutes and make sure altitude is being held. So I might do that
thanks for all the testing Tucker
Super awesome video! In terms of video ideas, I'd love to see an altitude test, more so to learn how the effects of large changes in altitude compare between gasoline and electric paramotors. Thanks for posting!
I’m super excited to see this. I’ve always hated small engine tinkering, and since I love my electric vehicle so much, I have been waiting for the time electric hobby motors become more standard!
An interesting comparison would be the cost of operations. What does it cost to fly 30 minutes on gas vs electric? What about maintenance costs in the long term?
Great question. Rough numbers and maybe tucker will comment. 2 strokes can do ~40-50mpg. So with expensive gas, $1=10-15 miles.
Now for electric. The big battery is 3.7kwh, which tucker used. With charging losses and heat, thats about 4kwh from your outlet. Or about $1 to charge. His normal ride was 30 minutes. Lets say he was doing 30mph. That means he went about ~15 miles for $1.
So not a huge difference in cost.
It would probably have to be over the course of a month for that to happen so he could compare his electric bill before the test to how much his bill jumps to charge the Electric paramotor over a month and then how much gas he spends on refueling an IC paramotor over a month. He'd have to make sure they have the same number of flights per month.
I imagine the Electric paramotor is going to be cheaper than the IC paramotor in terms of fueling up/charging up. Big thing with IC paramotors is that they have longer flight times and are much faster to fuel up.
@@shawnd567 Depends a lot where you live too, around here 4 kWh is about $0.28, in Hawaii it'd be like $1.25 though. Current US average is $0.155 / kWh so $0.62 for 4 kWh.
Maintenance and depreciation might be more important. I'd assume maintenance would be cheaper on the electric since it's so much simpler mechanically, although it might be harder to find expertise if you do need to fix something. The battery cells are rated for ~83% capacity after 700 cycles (0-100-0%) at 10 kW (max continuous power), not sure how that compares to ICE.
Great question!! Also, do not forget to remember to add the cost of a second battery, so you can do a hot swap, and fly for an additional 30 or so minutes. In a petrol rig, you just have the cost of the gas can, and the cost of the gas, so landing, refueling, and flying again is much more cost efficient. But, I am loving the view of instant torque, the reduction of noise, and just being different then everyone else. Thanks Tucker, for the great videos!!
The Open Ppg site has a price comparison for gas vs electric.
Great video, Tucker!! Answered all my questions.
I have been super interested in paramotoring for a long time and I am looking to start soon. I greatly appreciate your testing and it is great to see how effective the electric is compared to gas. Thank you for taking the time to do multiple trials.
I loved the full length Tucker I'm Jazzed to start flying Electric.
Been watching you for years now Tucker. I wish I had the guts to fly like that. It must feel amazing.
Thanks for the detailed flight time vid. I also got about the same results so was cool to see the comparison.
awesome video tucker very informative.
Tucker, thanks, looking forward to the sounds tests. Do some flights on more staid canopies?
Your videos are the best Tucker!
Love that we're able to follow "newish" technology and see the ups and downs (no pun intended) as it grows and gets better. Thanks for being a public test person.
Also, I've watched pretty much all of your vids, and I'm frothing at the mouth for another Iceland or Nordic video ;). A man can dream, can't he?
Great video as always, just the information I was looking for! The intro reminded me of Bill Nye, which was also awesome. 🤙
I enjoyed watching your flights. You are always very entertaining, you have a great station.
Do you feel like you could throw another battery in, and fly again? Could the motor handle it?
Tucker, I am from Canada and coming to AZ next weekend the 27th to get my motorbike and ride it back home. Id be thrilled to come watch you fly somewhere and grab a handshake! Cheers man safe flying. If not ill be looking for ya in the skies while I'm down there.
Where in AZ is he?
@dannydaw59 mmm I'm not 100% but could be just north of Phoenix in some of his videos flying. I know there's a ppg area by the 303 I think it is.
HAHA, Love the BASE promo at the beginning 🤙🤙
Thanks for the video, I love the idea of an eparamotor BUT at 78 pounds… that alone is a Deal Breaker… my Power to Fly Atom 80 weighs just over 50 with fuel… more maintenance no doubt but I can’t imagine trying to carry 78 pounds and only flying 30 minutes, Thanks again
Love the content!
Beautifully presented, bro 👊🏻🤙🏻 i will one day own a paramotor 🙏🏻
That was incredible at 8 minutes 43 seconds that flip you did it was trippy to watch I wasn't ready for it
It's good technology of future :) nice information, thanks for your work!
Well I'm broke at least I watch these cool videos it's like in flying awesome
Me too
I'm curious if this is practical and light enough for just getting into a thermal and staying aloft.
Would be interesting to have a competition on who can have the longest flight with an electric paramotor riding thermals
As always great video. I would say you are spot on. For your average pilot who goes for a 30 min flight after work, this is a low maintenance higher (hopefully we shall see) reliability option. Suggestion for other videos as I have seen a few other times in the comments, altitude test, how does it compare to a 2 stroke once you get about 6-7k feet?
I'd love to see how the battery lasts for a climb & glide style of flying, like one might do for practicing wingovers and stuff. And if it's not too boring, compare cost of ownership. What I am most looking forward to is the sound testing. I feel like noise is what gets LZs shut down, and I find it fatiguing too. Silent would be amazing (and impossible) but any improvement would be exciting.
very nice video that's just how you roll fly safe and jump safe
I would love to see more electric videos
ALTITUDE HOLD is something i am working on since months! strange that you mentioned that tucker 😁
Great video. Being mostly conservative I can see this working. The range might be disappointing though. There haven't been any truly comprehensive unbiased realistic reviews out there. This one answeredmost of my questions.
Excellent review, thanks!
"Did I just see a flying man? No, impossible" 5 minutes later "Hold up...there he is again!"
There are two of us that fly around my town. Every time one of us flies the local facebook page lights up. It’s pretty funny.
@rule1dontgosplat
That’s so awesome 😂🤩
One thing to note though, is that on this one, you get your one 1/2 hr flight, and then you have to go home 'cause your battery needs to charge for a few hours. On a petrol paramotor, you could just refill the tank and go again. And while you could buy more batteries for this thing, they're probably quite expensive, and given how heavy they are it'd be a lot more weight than a few litres of extra fuel...
Great idea with the altitude lock programming. Tesla feature bonus material/perks.
Cool to think about as battery tech improves, for short flights its great, for anyone wanting cross country or all day flights its just not there yet, its more of a purpose rig for competitive flying or a quick ride after work right now.
A 2 blade prop will make a huge difference too.
Yes - I can confirm 2 blade will outferform a 3. I run many props on my long range FPV planes (R/C) and the 2 blade props are the go, I have proof through my On Screen displays and logging recharge Amps, distance travelled etc.
Having tried out a Surron Ultra Bee for a summer, this was my exact experience with a high power battery. Amazing, instant power for about 20 minutes and then cruising your way back home. Very fun, not the most practical yet.
Tip - Always let your battery cool down before you recharge it as well.
You will get more recharge cycles out of it that way.😁
Letting it cool is safer too. Less likely to go 💥
Wouldn't the BMS prevent it from charging if it were too warm?
@@zefallafez Possibly, but i doubt it.
@@ozzie7523 Temperature sensors in BMSes are really cheap and easy. I would be seriously surprised and disappointed if this battery pack didn't use one; that's the sort of penny-pinching I'd expect from a knock-off tool battery maker, not a custom expensive niche product maker.
I would be surprised if the BMS doesn't have any kind of thermal protection when charging. That's like rule number one for preventing thermal runaway.
Even my power tool batteries won't charge until they cool down, at least the ones for my string trimmer which get the hottest.
It's relatively simple to include a temperature sensor in the pack and not charge at all until it drops below a threshold, or ideally factor it into the charge profile.
Amazing video.. as always.
I was a little surprised by the power fall off .. . I thought you said this had a LFP chemistry battery. I watch a lot of car EV channels.. and one thing that they always mention.. is that LFP batteries give almost full power right to the end. There is not as much voltage difference between Full and Empty on LFP. chem...
Love to see the new tech.. and this will only improve with time.
Be cool to have a EV truck as your base.. and have it recharging batteries while you are flying.. You would need probably 5 pack to to fly continuously.
Thanks T-Gottem!
My typical flight is right around 1hr to 1hr 15mins. Maybe 10% of my flights are under 30 mins so this technology just hasnt come far enough to work for me. When it does I'm on board, but not yet....
Great info. I was hoping i could put this exact motor on a trike, and in place of the usual gas and coolant tank, put an extra one or two batteries. If I could get the batteries in parallel, then it would use all equally, other wise I'd have to hot swap the connectors as each battery goes. The motor is probably undersized for what I want to do but I hope the company will offer improvements.
Do you think that it would be more efficient/a better use case to use this motor to power up to altitude and then glide around with it shut off for a while, rinse and repeat? Maybe chase thermals?
Awesome! I don't know how much range it would add, but if you could hook some solar cells on top of your wing, that would be sick!
Man would I love to do that looks like do much fun
Tucker, thanks for the temperature check after landing. I think a rise is normal,and the cooling is adequate if you can still touch it with the back of your hand for a certain time. That shows that the thermal design of the whole engine is good. The short flying time is disappointing. 👍😊🇫🇷
do you think it would be possible to have a second battery with you and Land shortly for switching batteries... just to maybe extend the range
I never thought I would see the day Tucker flying a production electric paramotor.
Thanks for your review. I'm very excited to someday transition over to electric paramotor. But it does not seem like the technology is quite there yet. Disappointing that you had such loss of power as the battery drained. Also, for me, the battery life would need to be x2 or x3 what you're showing for me to make that leap.
Yup thats where im at as well. Even electric cars are disappointing in this regard.
Wonder if hybrid is possible..🤔
Muy linda Máquina
Perfect time for you to review this motor! I've been wanting it for almost a year now but there always comes something else i need to use my savings to😅. hope to win the giveaway but if not i just need to save for it a bit longer and just focus on paragliding for now😁
Was waiting on this video to just see the performance. I must say only Tucker can turn a 360° and head back the way he came @4:08 . 2 years ago I would have loved to be able to win/fly this thing. Unfortunately my health now prevents me from running (Or even walking) with this thing on my back, so bummer for me. Can't wait to hear the lucky person who gets this and takes or has lessons to be able to fly a para-motor. I sure hope this thing doesn't end up on Ebay or something. Best of luck to all that follow Tucker. BTW, Mildred (Tuckers "Chase" camera) was named after my submitted grandmother's name and I was recognized on his channel...so I got that piece of history in my life! I proudly wear my Risky Biscuits merch, my favorite is "Don't report Tucker to the FAA!"
I would advise to turn the battery pack around, inserted from below. if it caches fire, drop it and go down safely, especially since you are burning the full range of the battery. they do not like that. and one more thing, there is the 'revolution' in prop tech, that would fit your channel! if and once it is out there!
Tucker, you need to run this exact same set of tests when it's hot, or warm. 85, to 95F. I've recently learned that batteries of this type tend not to perform as well in cold, or cool weather. I'd like to see if that hold true for this batter in warm or hot weather. Of course that's also going to affect lift, and thrust efficiency, as well. Thanks for the awesome video! :)
i have an Ebike i use all year cold and hot. There is def a difference when its really cold but the battery naturally warms itself as you use it so if you have it in a temperature controlled House, then vehicle, then quick setup time the battery temp is likely not gonna change much until you get down to really cold temps that you probably would not even fly in. basically its negligible unless its really cold out.
I concur with the previous comment. I have been flying these batteries for many years and cold temps basically don't effect them when used correctly. You take them from a normal ambient temperature. Install and then fly. They easily produce enough internal temp to keep them warm well past what one would fly themselves or any aircraft in. I don't have any actual data, but would think that the cooler temps would actually promote longer battery health as the battery wouldn't "overheat" itself as it would in summer heat.
The excess heat acts as a catylst?
By the time these batteries will start to be affected you will be long-gone, and home under a warm blanket.
Well done and very informative. Would it be practical to stow a second battery theoretically increasing fly time and range ?
I'm sure that I'm in good company among your subscribers as a paraglider pilot who dreams of only having a motor as a back up in case that spot I was sure I'd find lift at didn't pan out, or if the landing spot I chose turned out to have a wire fence when I got closer. Would be nice to have second chances in flight. So the next test I'd like to see is how does it handle thermalling mid-day.
So cool!!
Great testing here. I like this thing for what it is. I'd like to find out a little more about the durability of that frame and should a guy happen to have a rough landing is it somewhat easy/cheap to repair or would it be expensive? Thank you
Please make more of the cactus shirts. Thanks
Not a pilot, but I fully agree with you man, I dont like the throttle display cutting out and the range is not there I think. I assume though more range means bigger battery and more weight so not sure if there is a sweet spot for this yet
This peramotor is pretty amazing, i will say as someone who is very familiar with EVs dont use cruse control. Try to modulate the throttle as efficient as possible if its possible see if you can see the amp draw or the wattage. You can really get good range with evs don't work the motor as hard as possible with the given condition, love your vids man.
Hi is it possible to buy an extra battery so that you can land, battery swap and immediately go flying again? If it is possible to buy extra batteries, how much do they cost? And how long will a battery drained to 10%, take to charge back up to 90% from an electric vehicle with the ability to charge if (eg a Ford Lightening truck)
For a lot of people electric hang or parra-motors are launch platforms to chase thermal flights with a fly home inbuilt.
Could you try catching thermals on a couple of flights power off while thermaling and gliding down to a start altitude?
luv u tucker
No diddy
Great video Tucker.
3 questions, what's the charge time, could you run it on a trike & could they provide a backup battery to help with emergency landings. A bit like a reserve tank in a car that you can switch to.
Looks like Arizona is treating you well, best of luck mate. 👍
Id do a trike as a hybrid, better energy density for weight and less danger while still getting elec benefits. ..til it suddenly drizzles.
From an electronics perspective, 80C isn't too bad for what it's doing. Some of those chips are rated to 105C sometimes even higher. Also the hotter it gets the more it's able to dissipate in the environment, so a plateau at 80C on MOSFETs is pretty good. Obviously cooler is better but you probably don't want to carry around a 20lbs radiator just to make it mildly colder!
You should post ambient temperature for yhe flights. Temperature can greatly affect battery performance.
Good info. Thanks. What is the battery chemistry 14th?
also worth mentioning that as time goes on batteries degrade, especially if they're being charged to 100%.
1.20min. That was a brilliant intro.
4.20min 180°🤣🤪 I'm not a troll, just having fun with a few drinks.
5.10 min, that is an autopilot
16.20 min. This is, in my cynical opinion, the best test of a product. You, Tucker, are probably the most consistent, honest creator on CZcams. Please be yourself(as previous), don't change for anyone other than yourself. 👍😅🎉
Very cool, electric motor. How much does a rig like this cost? Thanks
So, you did a 360 and made it back? Amazing.
I have flown the X4 for a couple years so I'm pretty familiar with electric power. Compared to the SP140 the X4 is less efficient due to the smaller propellers but the batteries I use are of a bit higher mass/energy density.
The advertised "40-60" mins I believe is "Flight time" not run time. You should include the time to descend after the battery runs out. 44 minutes ending at 500ft is a bit different from 44 minutes ending with 1000', or on the ground. When you're flying ICE and you have say 1 hour of fuel, you know that the climb out will burn fuel faster but you gain the time back when idling down burning almost nothing. That all said your test for the casual flight hit on the need for a 'go around' or two and leaving some juice available for that. Your test is very forgiving there because of your high level of skill and comparatively large, open, and safe LZ. I fly in an area with lots of tall trees and small LZs and I'm a newer pilot so I'd never run that over 30 minutes. I fly a boaty ;) wing and I'm only 170lbs, but I'd be wanting to be on the ground with 20% left for healthy go around performance.
The RPM in level flight cruise would be useful.
I think as the battery technology advances electric paramotors will become more common. Currently there are batteries with 4 times mass to power index almost ready for manufacture. Which means with the same weight and size of battery, we will be able to get 4 hours of flight time. That will make a lot more sense. Plus the charging time will be greatly reduced.
when are you posting a video detailing your workout routine? dayum
Thanks for the vid! No purchase necessary to enter sweepstakes and giveaways. I admire your sense of generating revenue, but not a fan of enticing sales by leading people to think they have to buy things to enter a giveaway. Don't let the lure of profits lead you too much. Wow, the throttle housing is 3d printed? I would expect something molded or milled. 40miutes aint much, but neither is a 16 meter glider. Once battery tech doubles in efficiency per pound, I'll be looking at electric. Until then, its similar fate with cars. Works great if you dont mind short time use, don't mind lithium and don't ask about recycling/costs. Fwiw, Im a 125lb pilot that enjoys flying a 27m pg wing...
There's 2 aspects for best case scenario. Time, and mileage.
Sure you might stay up longer with a boaty glider but would you have made it to the helipad and back?
Super cool for sure, great info . just not sure i would spend 8k to fly 30 min at a time. it is interesting for sure and i would fly the heck out it if won for sure. stay safe have fun...
Tucker, what do you think a 2 blade prop would affect the duration as opposed to the 3 blade?
Thanks for the very informative video. I don't understand why in the ppg application that battery tech is not moving along much faster? It seems to me that other than flight time, that electric paramotors are superior in every other metric, please educate me if I am misguided?
so could you sacrifice some performance for range by using a 2 blade prop?
Will it do better at higher altitude, then a gas para motor. That might be a cool comparison.
I remember when you set it up, you set the throttle response to a sports setting, would the stock setting get better range?
That red glow next to the setting Sun Simulator is "The Destroyer" planet Nibiru😮
A 3 blade prop will also decrease efficiency if you were to fly with a 2 blade you would increase the flight time but decrease the performance. As an FPV drone pilot you can definitely notice the difference with the prop when it comes to flight time and performance.
4:09 Tucker, turning around is 180, not 360 ;P
Clearly. 😉 I misspoke.
@@TuckerGottthere’s always gotta be one…
You've probably covered this but I'm curious about whether you have a desire to speedfly
So... I'm gonna enter, because of course we all support TG, but f'ck, who wants 78lbs worth of one hour on their back? LOL! Another honest video Tucker! Staying real!
Not sure I caught your fall rate in comparison to a gas version.
Also,could this be put on a trike! With a 300lb pilot? Would it even fly ? 😮 does it have that kind of power?
Good luck everyone.