This is truly a vehicle designed by enthusiastic, knowledgeable, caring and intelligent people for the world out there. I absolutely love their completely “open source” approach to this!
It seems to me that this vehicle is being designed by intelligent, sensible people. A brilliant job. I think JL-R's best course of action now is to make Jim Ratcliffe an enormous financial offer he cannot refuse, then rename the Grenadier 'The Land-Rover Defender' and call their present Defender 'The Discovery' (which we all know is what it was in reality anyway!)
Land Rover won’t give the Grenadier a second thought, they’ve moved on. Coil springs, solid axles is 20th not 21st century technology, as I have both the old and new defender I know which is better off road and which I prefer to drive. Take the New Defender for a test drive, you might be surprised how good it is. I’ve not used my old defender for the last 12 months since getting the new one, I might go and put a ‘For Sale’ sign on it.
@@petersmith3727 The reason the new Defender is not a Defender, is not the driveabilty aspect, or the off-road capability, it's the fixabilty of it. I think the New Defender is a lot of the same stuff as the LR4, Discovery in a different body shell. I am not hearing good things about it's repairabilty already and that is concerning. I have owned landrovers all my life, currently driving a L322 and fixing my 1968 109. As I can't afford to buy LR's new i buy them used so repairabilty is very much on my mind.
@@Colinpark I think they made the defender like that because the discovery was sort of becoming the main land rover doing all sorts and being an iconic car but land rover probably thought that because that car did so well they should make the defender like that but tougher so that the defender can reclaim itself as the icon of the land rover lineup but land rover did such a good job of the discovery that everyone thinks that this is just a well done discovery with defender badging which is probably why thee is so much hate with this car. not sure if that made sense but I'm sure you'll get the just of it.
@@Colinpark I appreciate at the moment they are expensive but as you are a true Land Rover enthusiast like myself I don't think you will have much to worry about repairing one in the future when you own one. As well as my 200TDi 90 and Series IIa Lightweight I also own a P38 and Disco 3 and I have worked and repaired all of them and I get more satisfaction repairing the P38 and Disco, probably because of the extra complexity of the vehicles. I have been all over the New Defender and mechanically it seems it will be easy to work on, no more difficult than my other cars. I've already done oil and filter changes and presently stripping, cleaning and checking the brakes as the 21500 mile service interval is ridiculous. Electronically; the systems on it are basically the same as on all modern cars which are safety and emission focused that manufacturers are required to fit, and as for Land Rovers terrain response systems along with the air suspension, they have been developed and refined over many decades so I wouldn't have any sleepless nights over them. The problems I have over the Grenadier is it is a mish mash car, it has modern sophisticated engine, transmission, over the air software updates etc mixed with old fashion solid axles and springs. So it is neither old tech or new and they aren't even marketing it for the Bush and Outback market so it's chasing the same market as Land Rover. As cars are so expensive I would rather put my money in an established, good or bad, motor manufacturer than be a guinea pig for a chemical company. I hope it does well, competition is always good, but I think it is a bit late to the party when shortly (Defender included) all new ICE cars will stop been produced.
Thanks! As a South African 2 x Defender owner (plus sadly a Disco 2 which pushed me to Land Cruiser) this looks like the Defender I was hoping for - I literally cried when I sold my 110 Td5, and have been lamenting LR not fixing the basics and then betraying us with the new “Defender”
Gavin its not for us. They are making a car that is first world tough its a big marketing ploy unless they change aspects of the vehicle such as emission criteria and the shit it comes with such as adblue and DPF's it won't work for us. They are targeting the USA and Europe where image is everything and there is no wilderness left and driving on a wet field is off road. Its a pity I was getting excited looks like I will be forced to buy a LC 200 GX at inflated prices disappointing
@@rationalthinker9181 I would likely disagree, on a mid term there are no markets left where you can sell cars without having proper emissions. Such things as SCR and DPF already are and furthermore will be required to get your cars sold. Even the LC 70 Series have DPF available. I think, for what is possible to the future of a simple rugged bush car, ineos did a very good one.
If you're in South Africa, you'd better stick to Toyotas. You need something as reliable as a hammer. From what I've seen on the news lately, you may need to escape overland to Namibia, or Botswana. Even Zimbabwe or Mozambique might be safer options.
As an Australian who owns a 70 series Landcruiser., this has really caught my eye. I am a lover of the Defender shape, but that is basically where it ends. I see the Grenadier as about the only true competitor with the 70 series, but possibly more so as it has the refinement and style that my Cruiser lacks. Effectively when one buys a 70 series the biggest appeal of these vehicles is that it is a robustly built blank canvas with a sensational V8 engine. From this point on, it is all about modifying and personalising this vehicle to suit ones requirements. I look forward to seeing where the Ineos will go with regards to after market modifications and additions. It sounds like Ineos are listening to their potential customers and are applying real logic when developing this vehicle.
I hated the idea of this at first, but it’s growing on me, I’m a puma Defender owner, this appeals to me way more than the 2020 Defender, I need to see one in the flesh.
@@wyattfamily8997 thats the only gripe I have about this is the BMW engine. I think the diesel will be good but with all the timing gear in the back of the engine its going to be expensive to service.
Would love to be a fly on the wall in LR meetings where they first had to discuss the terrible press created by the issues the TFL channel guys had with the first 2 Defenders they received, and now this vehicle, which has the potential to crush future Defender sales.
The new Defender aims at rich US suburban customer, this one aims at commercial users/offroad enthusiasts/goverment agencies. Don’t think that the Grenadier is going to have any impact on Defender sales at all.
@@lukasvass681 Well I suppose I might fall into the LR target demographic you describe, and if I had the option to buy either one today, it would be the Grenadier. It has everything I want except LR’s reputation for reliability problems, and (probably) at a lower price.
Brilliantly done, I'm living in Central Canada where the winters are as cold as Mermansk, a large part of our winters that last 6 months of the year, and I've owned/ driven Volvo's 40+ yrs, and you say this is built for longevity and Dyier's like ourselves, this is what had kept my keen interest in the Grenadier and all the testing videos, not the reviewers, you have followed these and kept and done all the legit everyday questions any owner would ask, so to me after your video here, I am kind of thinking of this could become the Volvo of 4x4 in this category of vehicles, just meaning the part of practical, serviceable and longevity built into it, quality materials, and ease of access to parts, I can say this after being a Volvo Canada employee and driven them over 40yrs and 1.7 million kms and hope this vehicle makes it to Canada which will take a few years, I can wait, we will have petrol only in N.A. the diesels don't meet emissions here, too bad, fantastic video thx you again👍
Had an off-road ride in the Grenadier today. The N57 engine is sweet. Great amounts of torque. Very smooth. He accelerated hard over the field full of ruts and uneven ground and the vehicle felt solid. Very impressive. Came away so impressed I'm 99% certain I'll order one in October.
As an owner of a Defender and having driven them for 30 years now....your comment at 14.27 made me chuckle more than it should have. Great review and as nice as it is, i still like the fact that i can fix everything myself on my Defender. Would I buy one to drive around Australia in stead of the Defender? Absolutely. Great channel and appreciate the work you put it to it.
I had to subscribe to your channel on the strength of this film! Ineos is such an interesting product, it will be such a breath of fresh air if they give the customer experience such a high priority over dealership profit. This approach is what the industry has been missing for so long, I'm genuinely more excited about this vehicle than any which came before. Can't wait to see it in the flesh! Cheers.
Will, your look at this vehicle is so detailed and thorough, your enthusiasm for it and the way it could work for consumers comes across perfectly. I really hope you manage to get a drive very soon, your viewpoint is way better than many of the "car review" style.... Love the attention to detail and the brutal honesty 👍🏻👍🏻
Thanks again for all the hard work, let us know where to send gas money, that was a heck of a drive for you. I think we were all hoping for what it seems we will be getting. Also I think the reason we are getting our “Dream Defender” is because it’s not being built by a car company. And thank god.
Hi LR enthusiast from NZ here. I flew to Frankfurt for the release on the new Defender and was disappointed. This vehicle I believe is what Defender owners wanted to see. I enjoyed your video and may buy one, not sure how at this point. I think its far more sophisticated than a 70 series Cruiser which are very popular down-under!!
I really wish you would have pressed them more about all the plastic parts, cooling system issues and all the other short comings of the BMW engine and whether they acknowledge those short comings and worked on solutions for them.
Yes the infamous plastic water pump haha , if they have made no changes to the bmw engine ( the plastic parts ) you can forget any long term reliability 😇
@@madfrosty5228 In the meantime BMW retracted from plastic water pumps. ( I am not fond of Beamers anyway) but I know Audis had them too. The engine itself is not too bad at all. Still, as long as the vehicle needs to meet (F*K!) EU standards it will match it. Nevertheless there are other reliable engines on the market. I assume if the vehicle is utilized primary somewhere else - they will use other engines. The Grenadier seems pretty modular and so I assume the car can be retrofitted or altered as needed.
And then there is the EGR problem , especially with diesel version , sucking the exhaust gasses back in the intake is the worse thing that ever happened to modern engines, otherwise these inline 6 engines are really good .
@@madfrosty5228 Yepp but this is not solely a problem of BMW, but in my LR Disco Diesel as well. Utilize frequently Diesel cleaners to keep at least some of the problems at bay. Recently the injectors were verified. All fine. But you are right, as long as in Europe with some infrastructure this is okay. In Africa or else where this might be a problem. An old Mercedes Benz or Peugeot engine from 1980 would run a million miles w/o problems. But not match EU exhaust regulation. Its like so.
Awesome video! It will be great to see it on and off-road in Aus. I think people in Aus (where I'm from) need to take a reality check when it comes to the engine choice in the Grenadier. We don't have tough emission's regulations for cars 'yet' and it's only a matter of time until we do. Just look and all the people that cried about the DPF's in the 70 series and now the V6 in the new 300 series. They are making a vehicle that can be sold worldwide not for the AU market. I also love how there's a bunch of what is considered aftermarket features fitted from the factory and no need to spend another $50k+ AUD just to make a 79 a nice 4x4 to drive long distances.
I would really love it if this vehicle is offered in the states with the diesel. We get shafted over here on real work horse 4x4’s with reliable diesel engines unless you want a giant pick up truck, which a lot of us have no interest in. We do now have the wrangler diesel option, which is great, but the Grenadier has a lot more cargo space that the Jeep really lacks. I’m not too confident that this truck will be that affordable for most of us in the states but I will keep my fingers crossed. If we do get them I will definitely be visiting a dealer that will sell them to get a close up look. Thanks for the videos.
Iv ordered mine , and I can’t wait, iv also owned a 110 defender but sold it after 2 years as it was just to uncomfortable, but the look I loved , so the grenadier should suit me perfectly ❤
have a good feeling about this grenadier, that will be a master stroke if you have the option to replace any faulty parts if any from 3d drawings you can look at and follow, wow brilliant. cant wait to see one in the flesh :))
I haven’t been excited about a new vehicle for a long time till now. I absolutely love this project and wouldn’t mind picking one up in TX once it becomes available. However, having lived in the rust belt of the USA for 20 years, I cannot help by wonder about the possible rust issue with all the nooks and crannies on the exterior. They WILL collect salt and mud very easily. I’m sure structurally the vehicle can be made to withstand the harsh environment but esthetically I am not so sure. Also, all the exposed hinges will start leaking rust within a year - it is inevitable due to the design unless more existing metals are used in their design.
You don’t buy a Defender (old model) with your head, you buy it with your heart, you love it for what it is not what it could be. How many original Grenidiers will be loved, cherished and rebuilt in 70 odd years time, that will be its test of success.
I spotted the first thing that would break straightaway...the mud flaps. When bogged (in sand) and having to reverse out, those mud flaps would rip off within seconds. I now use Clevis pins on mine (for quick removal) now as I have had my front ones ripped off just like described above.
The main question for me is: Will the Diesel work in Mongolia? Will it work in Afrika? How does it deal with high Sulfur content of Diesel? What about Water in the Diesel? Can we go Overlanding in it? Can we cross Africa?
@@ChibaCityBlues not true, people overlanding with brand new vw diesel t5/t6 transporter , Ford transit ,Mercedes sprinter And I talking about European car ,
@@sogniluigi I know. And I overland a T5 Rockton Expedition myself. So I might know a thing or two about the car. Australia, North and South America, the northern part of Asia and Europe are no problem. But trust me on this: In Africa and in the southern parts of Asia Diesel quality becomes an issue especially for diesel particulate filters. The sensors will make the whole car shut down. The last VW Transporter that works for worldwide travel is the T4 2.4 D with 78 hp.
Love it, great information. I'm sitting down under in anticipation, waiting to see this in real life. I think one of these will look fantastic next to my 79 series double cab!!!
They say that they are interested in "Long term ownership" but the thing that worries me is that BMW power train. great when new - but they have not exactly covered themselves in glory over the last 20 years with long term reliability in either their mechanicals or electronics! Failing timing guides, bad valve guide oil seals, rod bearings needing replacing every 100k! What's this thing going to be like out of warranty?
As a defender enthusiast I subscribed to your channel - but it was the Grenadier that brought me here! Brilliant review and thanks for publicly archiving all the great LR stuff too. p.s. I think I would buy one. : )
LOL, most people who want to buy one will be rather disturbed when they discover they will be priced closer to a Mercedes G-Wagon, and buyers will need a footballer's salary to buy one. There will be so many brexiteers who will discover that it is no longer 1962, and that they can't afford a car designed for footballers or Saudi sheiks, and they will be stuck with ordering Dacia Sanderos for that 'off-road-look' on a pensioner's income. Still, at least it gives jobs for Welsh workers. Oh, sorry, it gives jobs for Frenchmen.
@@themildoff-roadist8661 LOL, in your wet dreams. You can spec out a Mini fairly easily for 45K. This will be a low-volume car with no dealership support, no pedigree, and high start-up costs. The only way they're going to make any money on these is to make them a premium product. You won't get any change out of 100K if you want one of these. Furthermore, they're not even electric, so they will fall foul of emissions regulations in many countries and be very expensive to own. The beauty of an old Defender was that they were cheap to fix because you can find parts anywhere. This will be the complete opposite.
@@horsenuts1831 ineos did say that this vehicle will start at about 45 grand but that's defender territory so ye it's still quite expensive although a key point that people keep forgetting with both the defender and the ineos is that they're actually full cars unlike pickups and also they have straight six engines unlike most pickups which have smaller 4 cylinder engines unless your in America but then if your in America you won't be looking at this kind of work vehicle, you'll most likely be looking at something like a ram pickup or a ford f series pickup etc.
Would like to see it tested in the Canadian North and on a winter road in -50 below as well as towing ability and winchin under situations that would occur in winter where it could have a life and death situation.
Well done. I'm willing to bet this will actually own it's market. Once it is up to full production I expect it will outsell all of Land Rover (13,900 USA), the G-wagen (7700 units USA), or the new Land Cruiser 200 replacement (3100 units USA). I also expect it to kill the used Defender market in North America. Who will spend $150,000 on a 25 year old POS Defender, when you can buy this for $65,k? That being said the Bronco and Wrangler are expected to do close to a half million units combined next year.
I like the brutal honesty about this car "making the Defender looks like a pile of sh!t" I hope they sell well, and really eat into Defender sales. I hope JLR goes under. Because there is another brutal honesty the author said in that video last year. "Land Rover shafted us with the new Defender"
Land Rover will sell an awful lot more defenders than Ineos will grenadiers, very different markets and people will buy a new defender every 3 years rather than every 10. Buying engines and drive train parts form other manufacturers is going to be costly for Ineos.
As I said on part 1 I saw it at Abenteuer and ALLRAD and the stand was rammed, lots of interest, they were very busy with passenger rides on the off road course. If interest translates to sales they should do well.
Great video Will, was at goodwood on the Friday equally pestering the ineos team for info. I really think they're onto a winner with this one. If it proves to be as robust and reliable as it appears, then I can see this being a major blow to new defender sales. Been looking to replace my current vehicle for a while, and this couldn't come soon enough. Bring on October reservation day !
Will, I am at timer 5.04 and had to stop video... I can believe the good information coming out from you.. I am more and more amazed with the Grenadier. I WANT ONE.. OK back to tour video👌👌👌👌
I see what you mean by a comparison to the Defender. I went from 25 years of Series Land Rover ownership to a 300Tdi Defender. For me that was comfort, reliability, economy, power and great brakes. It has needed "maintenance" as it's aged, but I still drive it 450km each way to work on a weekly basis, and typically cover 10,000+ remote km on road trips. However I imagine the Grenadier will be like a Defender with the quietness, power and smoothness of my D4. It's the most tempting vehicle on offer, but I fear what will happen to the price in Australia.
It's a yes from me. Appeals far more than a Defender does, whether we're talking about the old one or the new. I like the utilitarian style and solid axles mixed with a more powerful straight-6, auto box and some fun-looking gadgets and switches. I would buy one but *could* I afford it? I doubt it.
This product need 9 more Features that will allow it to truly be a compelling product 1 remote start ( if you need to start it when it’s cold ) 2 keyless entry and start ( in the great outdoors I should not have to take out my gloves and fight with my phone and wallet And bunch of keys in my jeans pocket to get the keys to start the car in the freezing cold) 3 wireless charging pad for cell phones ( people will be very dependent on CarPlay and Android Auto ) 4 more cup holders 2 for each passenger : water and a slurpy can’t tell you why but cup holders sell 5 multiple USB ports 6 an optional rear bench seat that could accommodate 2 kids that could be clipped in or clipped out . Entry to the rear would only need to be on one side of the mid row seats keep the batteries on the other side. Or from the small split door at the back 7 and maybe put another one of those clipping racks on top of each of the front fenders ( this is more of a nice to have ) 8 also if you could have a touring mode and an off road mode that would allow the ICU to adjust the torque curve and horsepower curves for road highway cross country touting . Because in the US 95% of the time this thing is going to be on the highway taking kids to soccer and the wife to dinner 9 night mode for the touch screen , speedometer be that it can be dimmed at night with the Speedo still showing With these features I think this would fly of the shelf and these features would add less that $100 to production cost the technology is readily available and adds more utility to this fantastic product
If they go ahead with dealerships, then they might get pushbacks on online ordering/ warranties. Dealerships like to keep a grip on after-sales servicing and part sales to maximize returns. So I got some doubts about some of these claims.
Second time around watching this. I noticed a few things; I like the door handles, I also like the large foot rest for the left foot. I also have a suspicion that Ineos may be keeping their cards close to their chest regarding the lack of a normal instrument binnacle, I suspect that the final decision hasn't been made but there will be one. If it was just going to be a small screen it would have been fitted by now rather than the blanking plate we see.
The Chelsea tractor brigade will still buy the new Defender. People that use these as a working vehicle, farmers, power companies etc, will buy the Grenadier. Apparently the SAS is looking to order a large fleet of these, if thats the case there will be a lot in the Hereford area.
For what it is worth, here is what I think. Despite the name, the new Defender is not really a replacement for the old Defender....but nor is the Grenadier. They are both new vehicles for the 4x4/off-road/Chelsea tractor/poser market. The existing 'Defender' market is split into many factions, these new vehicles will appeal to some existing Defender owners but not to others. - Some will welcome more refinement, while others would baulk at all the trim that will start to deteriate VERY quickly. - Many will think they are too expensive. - Most old Defender parts are cheap and easily obtainable. The old Defender is very well supported by aftermarket accessory suppliers. - The old Defender is a well understood and simple vehicle. There are few, if any, bad suprises. - Some own Defenders to work on themselves as a hobby or through neccessity. - Some use their Defenders in ways that would be unthinkable for a new and much more expensive vehicle. - Some like the low cost ownership (insurance, servicing, depreciation) of the old Defender. - Many have no need of a much more powerful engine. - The thought of an automatic gearbox! ?! - Many like to modify their old Defenders to make them more individual. I for one have no need or desire for the improvements which are pointed out in these videos. The idea of losing a large percentage of its, in my opinion, large purchase price in inevitable depreciation would be the icing on the cake for me. I understand many will buy them for a myriad of their own reasons but to continually compare it to older Defender models as if it were the only natural ownership progression is not really valid. Just because it looks like a Defender does not mean that Defender owners will jump enthusiastically in that direction! The Grenadier is a new car for people to buy if they like them. Given the option for current Defender owners to upgrade why just look at the new Defender or a Grenadier? There are other non-Defender options out there. To call the old Defender a 'pile of shit' is being extremly disrespctful to a car that is still very popular and which fullfils an important place in today's motoring scene. Does the Grenadier make old Defenders look basic and outdated?, perhaps. Do Grenadiers look more comfortable and lavishly trimmed?, yes. But does it really make the Defender look like a 'pile of shit'? To be honest I expected more from a channel called 'LR Workshop'.
As someone who has owned and loved my 2001 Defender for over 10 years, it is a pile of shit. A loveable P.O.S., but the build quality is awful. I'll never sell it, but trust me I would absolutely love a Grenadier. My Defender is for trashing up mountains, but this would go anywhere on the planet. The first 'Defender' that takes the Land Cruiser on and may well win.
@@ianworley8169 Define 'P.O.S'. Useless? worthless? stinks? Your comment contradicts itself. A car that was in production for 70 odd years and which a sizeable majority are still in existence is due more respect than calling it a P.O.S. It may be outdated, unrefined, improvable, but it ain't no P.O.S.
The drive of an X5 - reality of a Land cruiser - the look of an old defender! Why would you not want to buy 😍!! The Grenadier should of been the new defender and the new current defender should of been called the defender sport . Ordered my one - due late 2023 🥰
This product need 6 more Features that will allow it to truly be a compelling product 1 remote start 2 keyless entry and start ( in the great outdoors I should not have to take out my gloves and fight with my phone and wallet in my jeans pocket to get the keys to start the car in the freezing cold) 3 wireless charging for cell phones 4 more cup holders 2 for each passenger : water and a slurpy 5 multiple USB ports 6 an optional rear bench seat that could accommodate 2 kids that could be clipped in or clipped out . Entry to the rear would only need to be on one side of the mid row seats keep the batteries on the other side. Or from the small split door at the back 7 and maybe put another one of those clipping racks on top of each of the front fenders ( this is more of a nice to have ) With these features I think this would fly of the shelf and these features would add less that $100 to production cost the technology is readily available and adds more utility to the product
Yes for those of us of a certain age, parts diagram on the screen allows for incompetents like me to try and order items or discuss over the phone with suppliers etc
It's a shame they're not trying to compete with the 70 Series, or even focus on Africa at all. In Kenya, the 1HZ is the only engine option - you can't get the V8 diesel at all. It's also available from all dealers at around £70,000 before options (although the single-cab 79 Series starts at £45,000 - why all the others are so much more I don't know). However, having access to parts catalogues and repair manuals for free will make repairs in similar territories so much easier. That's something I hadn't even thought of. I sincerely hope though that they sell a model at least without a DPF for certain markets. Countries in the East African Community may sell low sulphur fuels and support such vehicles, but that's a rarity across Africa.
@@corhendriks1755 That explains it. In that case we'll continue to buy HZJ79 single cabs and convert them to safari vehicles. I'd rather support local industry and provide local jobs than import from overseas.
in Australia the 70 series 4x4 V8 4.5 L T Diesel 4 door 5 seat is 39,000 pound onroad drive away. The price would have to be sharp too compete in Australia. There is a 30,000 pa market in Australia for this vehicle, and that would be without taking sales of Toyota. A 4x4 four door ute has held the number one and two sales positions by volume for the past 5 years.
It's a true dilemma, would I own one? Probably yes. I'm like you, part of the attraction of the defender is the fact that I need to repair it etc, but sometimes it breaks and it's tedious, I would just like it to work. Such a difficult mix of reasons for owning one. Looks great though.
Brilliant video, lots of my questions answered and i never even asked. The Grenadier is in my opinion the best looking 4x4 truck at the moment, does look too much like a 110 Land Rover Defender though.
After I do my N to S American trip in a Tacoma a/w an Alu-Cab Canopy Camper. (done in about fall of 2024) I will likely buy the Grenadier to travel the rest of the world - Probably European pick up if they allow that. Thanks for your videos - certainly appreciated - Looking forward to more input you have on the Grenadier. 2 thumbs UP...
@@ojbarberena7090 I'd be glad to say hi - If I remember! I leave Canada next fall (2022) and will likely be in Columbia in 2 years from now - But I have no real timetable - I will play it as it goes. BTW - Just a few weeks ago I started truly learning Spanish. (more than just saying hi and ordering a beer-:) Para que pueda ser mucho más inmersivo en mis viajes.
Would I have a grenadier?? Yes yes yes.. Would I replace my 1995 110 for one?? No no no. Its both or nothing.. I love my Defender, but I'm never getting rid of it, no way I'll miss it too much. I want a defender side by side a grenadier, not one or the other
Which engine are you referring to/which one would you buy and why? Love myself a diesel but not sure about the modern ones with add blue, particular filters and whatnot...
Jim Ratcliffe is in Iceland testing the Grenadier - well I suppose the next Jim inspired improvement should be that it will take bigger tyres! After all, just about everything in Iceland is a mini-monster truck. So looking forward to that improvement.
If Sir Ratcliffe stands true to his mission & supports his customer base with integrity & promise then he will be to the 4WD world what Steve Jobs was to Apple in the 2000’s. Go , Go, Go!! This is the kind of leadership & decision making CEO’S & Co’s WW need in this day & age. 💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼👍🏻
70 series is way lighter (so better off road), it looks better if you ask me, they can be similarly reliable tho you can trust more the 70 series as the ineous is new, and the 70 series is cheaper. Would you make a comparison? The weight is too much for me to consider - is the no go.
@@lukasvass681 Too bad... Real men know that emissions regulations are bullshit made up by governements to make car companies work more... We all know! Is just like Cars, now a days, after 6/7 years, they start to give so many troubles that we look around to buy another one. Do car makers make Cars that last like an old Toyota FJ62? I don't think so! Anyway, I wouldn't be so hot about this "ineos" at least for the first 2/3 years. One last thing, you can use all the technology you want, but no automatic tranny will ever beat a 6 Speed manual for durability. I really hope they will offer manual option. About the Wright? "To be light is everything, in any condition".....(Ayrton Senna)
@@lukasvass681 You can have it imported brand new. There are people doing this. Cant find the website now. There are EU compliant versions if you want but are more expensive.
@@alextoader2880 there isn’t a Euro 6d compliant version of the J7. You can’t walk into a Toyota dealership and order one. Been there done that. Some people and companies are trying to import 3rd world/Arab spec vehicles using some legal loopholes or even frauds but those cars don’t have the factory warranty and support, it is difficult to have them financed or insured…
@@lukasvass681 Toyota 70 comes with 2 years warranty if I am not mistaken. If you are worried it will break inside those 2 years then you are in the wrong market :)
I would change that BMW gear selector. In my opinion it doesn’t fit the well thought interior design. They went an extra mile to develop that beautiful reduction case gear knob, so why not a bespoke gear selector?
Regarding your comment about it not being the next ROW 300Tdi - Defenders in South Africa had locally fitted BMW engines, and in Australia Isuzu engines. I suppose if an agent established themselves as a 3rd World supplier, they could fit them from new with a Cummins Diesel and a 5 speed Gearbox, then sell the Ineos drivetrain as a repower option kit for older Defenders.
Can't really be compared to a 70 Series, as the Toyota is far far more agricultural. 6 speed manual gearbox, no sound insulation, low hanging leaf springs in the rear and very basic seats. The Grenadier is a way more sophisticated with an automatic transmission and everything else that makes it far more comfortable. I do hope that the Grenadier is greater than the sum of its (very appealing components (e.g. strong diffs, reputable gearbox, one of the "good" BMW engines, Recaro seats, etc.). 3 year warranty is comforting and interior looks very good. Wishing the Ineos team every success with this product!
@@spudboy1328 Ooops, typo on my part. :) I have assumed it was a matter of time before Toyota the 6 speed manual gearbox from the Prado 150 Series into the 70 Series, but that never happened. Review of a Prado with the (very rare for Australia) 6 speed manual gearbox, just as an interesting side read: www.caradvice.com.au/385150/2016-toyota-landcruiser-prado-2-8l-gxl-manual-review/
That's every off road vehicle there is. I work for a tire shop and we sell more AT/MT's on sparkling clean trucks and Suvs then ones that actually get driven for their purpose.
Hmm.. at first I was terrified by the BMW engine in it. Now that I see how it looks, it starts to wake up the 8 year old in me and that's one of my main criteria for considering a vehicle. Looks promising.
This is truly a vehicle designed by enthusiastic, knowledgeable, caring and intelligent people for the world out there. I absolutely love their completely “open source” approach to this!
We love sarcasm. Top man. This car is junk.
It seems to me that this vehicle is being designed by intelligent, sensible people. A brilliant job.
I think JL-R's best course of action now is to make Jim Ratcliffe an enormous financial offer he cannot refuse, then rename the Grenadier 'The Land-Rover Defender' and call their present Defender 'The Discovery' (which we all know is what it was in reality anyway!)
The Grenadier is all the Defender fans wanted from Land Rover but they dropped the ball. I will be reserving a Grenadier.
Land Rover won’t give the Grenadier a second thought, they’ve moved on. Coil springs, solid axles is 20th not 21st century technology, as I have both the old and new defender I know which is better off road and which I prefer to drive. Take the New Defender for a test drive, you might be surprised how good it is. I’ve not used my old defender for the last 12 months since getting the new one, I might go and put a ‘For Sale’ sign on it.
@@petersmith3727 The reason the new Defender is not a Defender, is not the driveabilty aspect, or the off-road capability, it's the fixabilty of it. I think the New Defender is a lot of the same stuff as the LR4, Discovery in a different body shell. I am not hearing good things about it's repairabilty already and that is concerning. I have owned landrovers all my life, currently driving a L322 and fixing my 1968 109. As I can't afford to buy LR's new i buy them used so repairabilty is very much on my mind.
@@Colinpark I think they made the defender like that because the discovery was sort of becoming the main land rover doing all sorts and being an iconic car but land rover probably thought that because that car did so well they should make the defender like that but tougher so that the defender can reclaim itself as the icon of the land rover lineup but land rover did such a good job of the discovery that everyone thinks that this is just a well done discovery with defender badging which is probably why thee is so much hate with this car. not sure if that made sense but I'm sure you'll get the just of it.
@@Colinpark I appreciate at the moment they are expensive but as you are a true Land Rover enthusiast like myself I don't think you will have much to worry about repairing one in the future when you own one. As well as my 200TDi 90 and Series IIa Lightweight I also own a P38 and Disco 3 and I have worked and repaired all of them and I get more satisfaction repairing the P38 and Disco, probably because of the extra complexity of the vehicles.
I have been all over the New Defender and mechanically it seems it will be easy to work on, no more difficult than my other cars. I've already done oil and filter changes and presently stripping, cleaning and checking the brakes as the 21500 mile service interval is ridiculous. Electronically; the systems on it are basically the same as on all modern cars which are safety and emission focused that manufacturers are required to fit, and as for Land Rovers terrain response systems along with the air suspension, they have been developed and refined over many decades so I wouldn't have any sleepless nights over them.
The problems I have over the Grenadier is it is a mish mash car, it has modern sophisticated engine, transmission, over the air software updates etc mixed with old fashion solid axles and springs. So it is neither old tech or new and they aren't even marketing it for the Bush and Outback market so it's chasing the same market as Land Rover. As cars are so expensive I would rather put my money in an established, good or bad, motor manufacturer than be a guinea pig for a chemical company. I hope it does well, competition is always good, but I think it is a bit late to the party when shortly (Defender included) all new ICE cars will stop been produced.
Thanks! As a South African 2 x Defender owner (plus sadly a Disco 2 which pushed me to Land Cruiser) this looks like the Defender I was hoping for - I literally cried when I sold my 110 Td5, and have been lamenting LR not fixing the basics and then betraying us with the new “Defender”
Gavin its not for us. They are making a car that is first world tough its a big marketing ploy unless they change aspects of the vehicle such as emission criteria and the shit it comes with such as adblue and DPF's it won't work for us. They are targeting the USA and Europe where image is everything and there is no wilderness left and driving on a wet field is off road. Its a pity I was getting excited looks like I will be forced to buy a LC 200 GX at inflated prices disappointing
@@rationalthinker9181 I would likely disagree, on a mid term there are no markets left where you can sell cars without having proper emissions. Such things as SCR and DPF already are and furthermore will be required to get your cars sold. Even the LC 70 Series have DPF available. I think, for what is possible to the future of a simple rugged bush car, ineos did a very good one.
If you're in South Africa, you'd better stick to Toyotas. You need something as reliable as a hammer. From what I've seen on the news lately, you may need to escape overland to Namibia, or Botswana. Even Zimbabwe or Mozambique might be safer options.
@@6B8RX Yeah in that case we see down there youre right.. god bless
New Defender is awesome .
I love how people are totally ignoring the Lamborghini Urus parked nest to the Grenadier.
what lambo ??????????
@@graham-martin5847 The one parked on right of it
It’s just a Q8😂
I was taking the p-ss lol I would rather have the grenadier anyway wouldn't want one of those stupid useless things anyway pmsl
So was I 😉
As an Australian who owns a 70 series Landcruiser., this has really caught my eye. I am a lover of the Defender shape, but that is basically where it ends. I see the Grenadier as about the only true competitor with the 70 series, but possibly more so as it has the refinement and style that my Cruiser lacks. Effectively when one buys a 70 series the biggest appeal of these vehicles is that it is a robustly built blank canvas with a sensational V8 engine. From this point on, it is all about modifying and personalising this vehicle to suit ones requirements. I look forward to seeing where the Ineos will go with regards to after market modifications and additions. It sounds like Ineos are listening to their potential customers and are applying real logic when developing this vehicle.
I hated the idea of this at first, but it’s growing on me, I’m a puma Defender owner, this appeals to me way more than the 2020 Defender, I need to see one in the flesh.
Depending on one stream of income had never made any millionaire and earning check don't put you on forbes
@Rosendo Lee Oh, I've heard of him but I didn't take it seriously until I tried out with $ 5000 and made profits within some days
How can one reach an expert in trading,cos I have lost alot of money trading with a wrong trader
Text him directly on telegram @Charlespatrick1
@@laronstehr7322Please let him know you were referred by one of his client
Trading with Mr Charles Patrick Was The biggest thing I ever dreamed of. I advised you to give him a try you will never regret it
I love the concept , the spares backup , but it needs an Isuzu 4J motor option , that would be a game changer .
Exactly, using a BMW motor is idiotic and shortsighted as anyone in a remote area will stay well away.
@@wyattfamily8997 thats the only gripe I have about this is the BMW engine. I think the diesel will be good but with all the timing gear in the back of the engine its going to be expensive to service.
Would love to be a fly on the wall in LR meetings where they first had to discuss the terrible press created by the issues the TFL channel guys had with the first 2 Defenders they received, and now this vehicle, which has the potential to crush future Defender sales.
The new Defender aims at rich US suburban customer, this one aims at commercial users/offroad enthusiasts/goverment agencies. Don’t think that the Grenadier is going to have any impact on Defender sales at all.
@@lukasvass681 Well I suppose I might fall into the LR target demographic you describe, and if I had the option to buy either one today, it would be the Grenadier. It has everything I want except LR’s reputation for reliability problems, and (probably) at a lower price.
I don’t think the target market for the new Defender was watching those videos, and I don’t think JLR cared
@@srpacific They may not care but customers do
@@lukasvass681 there will be some cross over, some defender buyers, but the new thing for some reason.
Brilliantly done, I'm living in Central Canada where the winters are as cold as Mermansk, a large part of our winters that last 6 months of the year, and I've owned/ driven Volvo's 40+ yrs, and you say this is built for longevity and Dyier's like ourselves, this is what had kept my keen interest in the Grenadier and all the testing videos, not the reviewers, you have followed these and kept and done all the legit everyday questions any owner would ask, so to me after your video here, I am kind of thinking of this could become the Volvo of 4x4 in this category of vehicles, just meaning the part of practical, serviceable and longevity built into it, quality materials, and ease of access to parts, I can say this after being a Volvo Canada employee and driven them over 40yrs and 1.7 million kms and hope this vehicle makes it to Canada which will take a few years, I can wait, we will have petrol only in N.A. the diesels don't meet emissions here, too bad, fantastic video thx you again👍
I noticed it has a Volvo Wiper control from the new Volvo platform, I wonder how much of it is Volvo?
Had an off-road ride in the Grenadier today. The N57 engine is sweet. Great amounts of torque. Very smooth. He accelerated hard over the field full of ruts and uneven ground and the vehicle felt solid. Very impressive. Came away so impressed I'm 99% certain I'll order one in October.
We actually love diesel here in the US and yes I will get one as well...thank you for the updates
Excellent video and compelling narration, I sold my Defender earlier this year and will buy one of these as soon as I can.
As an owner of a Defender and having driven them for 30 years now....your comment at 14.27 made me chuckle more than it should have. Great review and as nice as it is, i still like the fact that i can fix everything myself on my Defender. Would I buy one to drive around Australia in stead of the Defender? Absolutely. Great channel and appreciate the work you put it to it.
The Grenadier is brilliant,super good luck to you.
Forget the Rivian, this is where it's at!!! 🤤😍😍
I had to subscribe to your channel on the strength of this film! Ineos is such an interesting product, it will be such a breath of fresh air if they give the customer experience such a high priority over dealership profit. This approach is what the industry has been missing for so long, I'm genuinely more excited about this vehicle than any which came before. Can't wait to see it in the flesh! Cheers.
Will, your look at this vehicle is so detailed and thorough, your enthusiasm for it and the way it could work for consumers comes across perfectly.
I really hope you manage to get a drive very soon, your viewpoint is way better than many of the "car review" style.... Love the attention to detail and the brutal honesty 👍🏻👍🏻
Well done Ineos on the parts diagrams !!
Thanks again for all the hard work, let us know where to send gas money, that was a heck of a drive for you. I think we were all hoping for what it seems we will be getting. Also I think the reason we are getting our “Dream Defender” is because it’s not being built by a car company. And thank god.
Hi LR enthusiast from NZ here. I flew to Frankfurt for the release on the new Defender and was disappointed. This vehicle I believe is what Defender owners wanted to see. I enjoyed your video and may buy one, not sure how at this point. I think its far more sophisticated than a 70 series Cruiser which are very popular down-under!!
They’d be very popular here if they’d let us have them 😡🇬🇧
I really wish you would have pressed them more about all the plastic parts, cooling system issues and all the other short comings of the BMW engine and whether they acknowledge those short comings and worked on solutions for them.
Yes the infamous plastic water pump haha , if they have made no changes to the bmw engine ( the plastic parts ) you can forget any long term reliability 😇
@@madfrosty5228 In the meantime BMW retracted from plastic water pumps. ( I am not fond of Beamers anyway) but I know Audis had them too. The engine itself is not too bad at all. Still, as long as the vehicle needs to meet (F*K!) EU standards it will match it. Nevertheless there are other reliable engines on the market. I assume if the vehicle is utilized primary somewhere else - they will use other engines. The Grenadier seems pretty modular and so I assume the car can be retrofitted or altered as needed.
And then there is the EGR problem , especially with diesel version , sucking the exhaust gasses back in the intake is the worse thing that ever happened to modern engines, otherwise these inline 6 engines are really good .
@@madfrosty5228 pretty easy fix on most cars. Put a blanking plate and do a tune 👌🏽
@@madfrosty5228 Yepp but this is not solely a problem of BMW, but in my LR Disco Diesel as well. Utilize frequently Diesel cleaners to keep at least some of the problems at bay. Recently the injectors were verified. All fine. But you are right, as long as in Europe with some infrastructure this is okay. In Africa or else where this might be a problem. An old Mercedes Benz or Peugeot engine from 1980 would run a million miles w/o problems. But not match EU exhaust regulation. Its like so.
Awesome video! It will be great to see it on and off-road in Aus.
I think people in Aus (where I'm from) need to take a reality check when it comes to the engine choice in the Grenadier. We don't have tough emission's regulations for cars 'yet' and it's only a matter of time until we do. Just look and all the people that cried about the DPF's in the 70 series and now the V6 in the new 300 series. They are making a vehicle that can be sold worldwide not for the AU market.
I also love how there's a bunch of what is considered aftermarket features fitted from the factory and no need to spend another $50k+ AUD just to make a 79 a nice 4x4 to drive long distances.
I would really love it if this vehicle is offered in the states with the diesel. We get shafted over here on real work horse 4x4’s with reliable diesel engines unless you want a giant pick up truck, which a lot of us have no interest in. We do now have the wrangler diesel option, which is great, but the Grenadier has a lot more cargo space that the Jeep really lacks. I’m not too confident that this truck will be that affordable for most of us in the states but I will keep my fingers crossed. If we do get them I will definitely be visiting a dealer that will sell them to get a close up look. Thanks for the videos.
If only other automakers thought like this!
Iv ordered mine , and I can’t wait, iv also owned a 110 defender but sold it after 2 years as it was just to uncomfortable, but the look I loved , so the grenadier should suit me perfectly ❤
have a good feeling about this grenadier, that will be a master stroke if you have the option to replace any faulty parts if any from 3d drawings you can look at and follow, wow brilliant.
cant wait to see one in the flesh :))
I just took delivery of my 2021 Ford bronco and I just put an order in for the Grenader!
If Grenadier's proposition will turn into real I will definitely buy one. I am a long time Land Rover user quite fed up with JLR.
I haven’t been excited about a new vehicle for a long time till now. I absolutely love this project and wouldn’t mind picking one up in TX once it becomes available. However, having lived in the rust belt of the USA for 20 years, I cannot help by wonder about the possible rust issue with all the nooks and crannies on the exterior. They WILL collect salt and mud very easily. I’m sure structurally the vehicle can be made to withstand the harsh environment but esthetically I am not so sure. Also, all the exposed hinges will start leaking rust within a year - it is inevitable due to the design unless more existing metals are used in their design.
You don’t buy a Defender (old model) with your head, you buy it with your heart, you love it for what it is not what it could be. How many original Grenidiers will be loved, cherished and rebuilt in 70 odd years time, that will be its test of success.
I’ve got an old Defender 90 which I love but I really want one of these x
I went and looked at a new defender 90, the seats don’t even fold flat and it’s so expensive when the old 90 is so much more useful.
Love my TD5 90 too. I thrash it up mountain tracks here in Portugal and through overgrowth and brush, without a care. But, I so want one of these too.
Great looking vehicle, i'm sure the UK farmers will be screaming out for one of these
I hope they can make it suitable for Africa and other non-western markets. The world deserves good engineering like this.
32 year land cruiser owner. If they sell them in the US, I’ll buy one!
Gas or diesel?
Made the reservation...look forward to its arrival in the US. It will be the new hot vehicle
Spot on Will
I spotted the first thing that would break straightaway...the mud flaps. When bogged (in sand) and having to reverse out, those mud flaps would rip off within seconds. I now use Clevis pins on mine (for quick removal) now as I have had my front ones ripped off just like described above.
The main question for me is: Will the Diesel work in Mongolia? Will it work in Afrika? How does it deal with high Sulfur content of Diesel? What about Water in the Diesel? Can we go Overlanding in it? Can we cross Africa?
People overland Africa and mongolia on brand new landrover, hilux, ford,etc etc
Risky but can be done
@@sogniluigi Yes. With a petrol engine or with an Toyota for the African market. Not with a Diesel that is legal to use and own in the EU.
@@ChibaCityBlues not true, people overlanding with brand new vw diesel t5/t6 transporter , Ford transit ,Mercedes sprinter
And I talking about European car ,
@@sogniluigi I know. And I overland a T5 Rockton Expedition myself. So I might know a thing or two about the car. Australia, North and South America, the northern part of Asia and Europe are no problem.
But trust me on this: In Africa and in the southern parts of Asia Diesel quality becomes an issue especially for diesel particulate filters. The sensors will make the whole car shut down. The last VW Transporter that works for worldwide travel is the T4 2.4 D with 78 hp.
ADBLUE seems hard to find in Africa or Mongolia.
Great overview and appreciate your candid, unvarnished insight and opinions. Oh…and DEFINITELY buying one myself!
I would love to see a transparent sun visor (maybe secondary) like aircraft use.
Love it, great information. I'm sitting down under in anticipation, waiting to see this in real life. I think one of these will look fantastic next to my 79 series double cab!!!
A vehicle with a BMW motor in outback Australia, better hope nothing goes wrong or you'd be waiting weeks for parts and a mechanic.
They say that they are interested in "Long term ownership" but the thing that worries me is that BMW power train. great when new - but they have not exactly covered themselves in glory over the last 20 years with long term reliability in either their mechanicals or electronics!
Failing timing guides, bad valve guide oil seals, rod bearings needing replacing every 100k! What's this thing going to be like out of warranty?
To answer your last line..... Broken is what I'd say.
As a defender enthusiast I subscribed to your channel - but it was the Grenadier that brought me here! Brilliant review and thanks for publicly archiving all the great LR stuff too. p.s. I think I would buy one. : )
I have a VW Amarok that is coming up for replacement in the next 12-18 months and I think the Grenedier will be the replacement.
I hope they sell them faster than they can make them.
LOL, most people who want to buy one will be rather disturbed when they discover they will be priced closer to a Mercedes G-Wagon, and buyers will need a footballer's salary to buy one.
There will be so many brexiteers who will discover that it is no longer 1962, and that they can't afford a car designed for footballers or Saudi sheiks, and they will be stuck with ordering Dacia Sanderos for that 'off-road-look' on a pensioner's income.
Still, at least it gives jobs for Welsh workers. Oh, sorry, it gives jobs for Frenchmen.
@@horsenuts1831 The diesel G Class is a hundred grand I think. This will be only 45 grand if what I heard is true.
@@themildoff-roadist8661 LOL, in your wet dreams. You can spec out a Mini fairly easily for 45K. This will be a low-volume car with no dealership support, no pedigree, and high start-up costs. The only way they're going to make any money on these is to make them a premium product. You won't get any change out of 100K if you want one of these. Furthermore, they're not even electric, so they will fall foul of emissions regulations in many countries and be very expensive to own.
The beauty of an old Defender was that they were cheap to fix because you can find parts anywhere. This will be the complete opposite.
@@horsenuts1831 ineos did say that this vehicle will start at about 45 grand but that's defender territory so ye it's still quite expensive although a key point that people keep forgetting with both the defender and the ineos is that they're actually full cars unlike pickups and also they have straight six engines unlike most pickups which have smaller 4 cylinder engines unless your in America but then if your in America you won't be looking at this kind of work vehicle, you'll most likely be looking at something like a ram pickup or a ford f series pickup etc.
Would like to see it tested in the Canadian North and on a winter road in -50 below as well as towing ability and winchin under situations that would occur in winter where it could have a life and death situation.
I love this one over LR new defender that is more like grand Cherokee i own rather than wrangler
Yes will buy one cannot wait and will do the canning stock route and other iconic tracks here in AUS
Well done. I'm willing to bet this will actually own it's market. Once it is up to full production I expect it will outsell all of Land Rover (13,900 USA), the G-wagen (7700 units USA), or the new Land Cruiser 200 replacement (3100 units USA). I also expect it to kill the used Defender market in North America. Who will spend $150,000 on a 25 year old POS Defender, when you can buy this for $65,k? That being said the Bronco and Wrangler are expected to do close to a half million units combined next year.
I like the brutal honesty about this car "making the Defender looks like a pile of sh!t"
I hope they sell well, and really eat into Defender sales. I hope JLR goes under. Because there is another brutal honesty the author said in that video last year.
"Land Rover shafted us with the new Defender"
Land Rover will sell an awful lot more defenders than Ineos will grenadiers, very different markets and people will buy a new defender every 3 years rather than every 10. Buying engines and drive train parts form other manufacturers is going to be costly for Ineos.
I really enjoyed that. Thank you for making the long round trip and for making the video review.
As I said on part 1 I saw it at Abenteuer and ALLRAD and the stand was rammed, lots of interest, they were very busy with passenger rides on the off road course. If interest translates to sales they should do well.
Great video Will, was at goodwood on the Friday equally pestering the ineos team for info. I really think they're onto a winner with this one. If it proves to be as robust and reliable as it appears, then I can see this being a major blow to new defender sales. Been looking to replace my current vehicle for a while, and this couldn't come soon enough. Bring on October reservation day !
Will, I am at timer 5.04 and had to stop video... I can believe the good information coming out from you.. I am more and more amazed with the Grenadier. I WANT ONE.. OK back to tour video👌👌👌👌
Great commentary, want one!
I see what you mean by a comparison to the Defender. I went from 25 years of Series Land Rover ownership to a 300Tdi Defender. For me that was comfort, reliability, economy, power and great brakes. It has needed "maintenance" as it's aged, but I still drive it 450km each way to work on a weekly basis, and typically cover 10,000+ remote km on road trips. However I imagine the Grenadier will be like a Defender with the quietness, power and smoothness of my D4.
It's the most tempting vehicle on offer, but I fear what will happen to the price in Australia.
It's a yes from me. Appeals far more than a Defender does, whether we're talking about the old one or the new. I like the utilitarian style and solid axles mixed with a more powerful straight-6, auto box and some fun-looking gadgets and switches.
I would buy one but *could* I afford it? I doubt it.
This product need 9 more Features that will allow it to truly be a compelling product
1 remote start ( if you need to start it when it’s cold )
2 keyless entry and start ( in the great outdoors I should not have to take out my gloves and fight with my phone and wallet And bunch of keys in my jeans pocket to get the keys to start the car in the freezing cold)
3 wireless charging pad for cell phones ( people will be very dependent on CarPlay and Android Auto )
4 more cup holders 2 for each passenger : water and a slurpy can’t tell you why but cup holders sell
5 multiple USB ports
6 an optional rear bench seat that could accommodate 2 kids that could be clipped in or clipped out . Entry to the rear would only need to be on one side of the mid row seats keep the batteries on the other side. Or from the small split door at the back
7 and maybe put another one of those clipping racks on top of each of the front fenders ( this is more of a nice to have )
8 also if you could have a touring mode and an off road mode that would allow the ICU to adjust the torque curve and horsepower curves for road highway cross country touting . Because in the US 95% of the time this thing is going to be on the highway taking kids to soccer and the wife to dinner
9 night mode for the touch screen , speedometer be that it can be dimmed at night with the Speedo still showing
With these features I think this would fly of the shelf and these features would add less that $100 to production cost the technology is readily available and adds more utility to this fantastic product
If they go ahead with dealerships, then they might get pushbacks on online ordering/ warranties. Dealerships like to keep a grip on after-sales servicing and part sales to maximize returns.
So I got some doubts about some of these claims.
Second time around watching this.
I noticed a few things;
I like the door handles, I also like the large foot rest for the left foot.
I also have a suspicion that Ineos may be keeping their cards close to their chest regarding the lack of a normal instrument binnacle, I suspect that the final decision hasn't been made but there will be one. If it was just going to be a small screen it would have been fitted by now rather than the blanking plate we see.
The Chelsea tractor brigade will still buy the new Defender. People that use these as a working vehicle, farmers, power companies etc, will buy the Grenadier. Apparently the SAS is looking to order a large fleet of these, if thats the case there will be a lot in the Hereford area.
For what it is worth, here is what I think.
Despite the name, the new Defender is not really a replacement for the old Defender....but nor is the Grenadier. They are both new vehicles for the 4x4/off-road/Chelsea tractor/poser market.
The existing 'Defender' market is split into many factions, these new vehicles will appeal to some existing Defender owners but not to others.
- Some will welcome more refinement, while others would baulk at all the trim that will start to deteriate VERY quickly.
- Many will think they are too expensive.
- Most old Defender parts are cheap and easily obtainable. The old Defender is very well supported by aftermarket accessory suppliers.
- The old Defender is a well understood and simple vehicle. There are few, if any, bad suprises.
- Some own Defenders to work on themselves as a hobby or through neccessity.
- Some use their Defenders in ways that would be unthinkable for a new and much more expensive vehicle.
- Some like the low cost ownership (insurance, servicing, depreciation) of the old Defender.
- Many have no need of a much more powerful engine.
- The thought of an automatic gearbox!
?!
- Many like to modify their old Defenders to make them more individual.
I for one have no need or desire for the improvements which are pointed out in these videos. The idea of losing a large percentage of its, in my opinion, large purchase price in inevitable depreciation would be the icing on the cake for me.
I understand many will buy them for a myriad of their own reasons but to continually compare it to older Defender models as if it were the only natural ownership progression is not really valid.
Just because it looks like a Defender does not mean that Defender owners will jump enthusiastically in that direction! The Grenadier is a new car for people to buy if they like them. Given the option for current Defender owners to upgrade why just look at the new Defender or a Grenadier? There are other non-Defender options out there.
To call the old Defender a 'pile of shit' is being extremly disrespctful to a car that is still very popular and which fullfils an important place in today's motoring scene. Does the Grenadier make old Defenders look basic and outdated?, perhaps. Do Grenadiers look more comfortable and lavishly trimmed?, yes. But does it really make the Defender look like a 'pile of shit'? To be honest I expected more from a channel called 'LR Workshop'.
As someone who has owned and loved my 2001 Defender for over 10 years, it is a pile of shit. A loveable P.O.S., but the build quality is awful. I'll never sell it, but trust me I would absolutely love a Grenadier. My Defender is for trashing up mountains, but this would go anywhere on the planet. The first 'Defender' that takes the Land Cruiser on and may well win.
@@ianworley8169 Define 'P.O.S'. Useless? worthless? stinks? Your comment contradicts itself. A car that was in production for 70 odd years and which a sizeable majority are still in existence is due more respect than calling it a P.O.S. It may be outdated, unrefined, improvable, but it ain't no P.O.S.
I love to get this if it is available in the US.
I asked them on insta and they said they are. So fingers crossed!
The drive of an X5 - reality of a Land cruiser - the look of an old defender! Why would you not want to buy 😍!!
The Grenadier should of been the new defender and the new current defender should of been called the defender sport .
Ordered my one - due late 2023 🥰
Thank you so much! loads of interesting thoughts and info!
We love that truck out hear in Jamaica loving it
This product need 6 more Features that will allow it to truly be a compelling product
1 remote start
2 keyless entry and start ( in the great outdoors I should not have to take out my gloves and fight with my phone and wallet in my jeans pocket to get the keys to start the car in the freezing cold)
3 wireless charging for cell phones
4 more cup holders 2 for each passenger : water and a slurpy
5 multiple USB ports
6 an optional rear bench seat that could accommodate 2 kids that could be clipped in or clipped out . Entry to the rear would only need to be on one side of the mid row seats keep the batteries on the other side. Or from the small split door at the back
7 and maybe put another one of those clipping racks on top of each of the front fenders ( this is more of a nice to have )
With these features I think this would fly of the shelf and these features would add less that $100 to production cost the technology is readily available and adds more utility to the product
A Grenadier with the Arctic Trucks treatment would be nice. Also a 1000kg payload.
Yes for those of us of a certain age, parts diagram on the screen allows for incompetents like me to try and order items or discuss over the phone with suppliers etc
much better than land rovers 'Pretender'. would love to own one.
That Lamborghini Urus is blocking the light from shining on the grenadier
It's a shame they're not trying to compete with the 70 Series, or even focus on Africa at all. In Kenya, the 1HZ is the only engine option - you can't get the V8 diesel at all. It's also available from all dealers at around £70,000 before options (although the single-cab 79 Series starts at £45,000 - why all the others are so much more I don't know). However, having access to parts catalogues and repair manuals for free will make repairs in similar territories so much easier. That's something I hadn't even thought of. I sincerely hope though that they sell a model at least without a DPF for certain markets. Countries in the East African Community may sell low sulphur fuels and support such vehicles, but that's a rarity across Africa.
LC 79 SC is assembled in Kenya, so no import duties
@@corhendriks1755 That explains it. In that case we'll continue to buy HZJ79 single cabs and convert them to safari vehicles. I'd rather support local industry and provide local jobs than import from overseas.
in Australia the 70 series 4x4 V8 4.5 L T Diesel 4 door 5 seat is 39,000 pound onroad drive away. The price would have to be sharp too compete in Australia. There is a 30,000 pa market in Australia for this vehicle, and that would be without taking sales of Toyota. A 4x4 four door ute has held the number one and two sales positions by volume for the past 5 years.
are you saying it is coming to the US? I would love this car. please please please!!!!
It's a true dilemma, would I own one? Probably yes. I'm like you, part of the attraction of the defender is the fact that I need to repair it etc, but sometimes it breaks and it's tedious, I would just like it to work. Such a difficult mix of reasons for owning one. Looks great though.
Brilliant video, lots of my questions answered and i never even asked.
The Grenadier is in my opinion the best looking 4x4 truck at the moment, does look too much like a 110 Land Rover Defender though.
After I do my N to S American trip in a Tacoma a/w an Alu-Cab Canopy Camper. (done in about fall of 2024) I will likely buy the Grenadier to travel the rest of the world - Probably European pick up if they allow that.
Thanks for your videos - certainly appreciated - Looking forward to more input you have on the Grenadier. 2 thumbs UP...
I'm in Colombia. Let me know when your in town.
Sounds amazing! How are you going to get from Panama to Colombia?
@@ojbarberena7090 I'd be glad to say hi - If I remember! I leave Canada next fall (2022) and will likely be in Columbia in 2 years from now - But I have no real timetable - I will play it as it goes. BTW - Just a few weeks ago I started truly learning Spanish. (more than just saying hi and ordering a beer-:) Para que pueda ser mucho más inmersivo en mis viajes.
@@SirPinkiePiePowers Likely a boat/shipping container. Or do you figure I should give the gap a go?
@@SirPinkiePiePowers it would be shipped in a container to the port of Buenaventura or Cartagena.
First of all, please buy one so that we have a reliable tester. Question: How many ECUs does it have?
Well done son time to move on enjoy the Grenadier.
What are their plans for post the petrol and diesel car ban? Any electrification plan?
there are rumors about a partnership with Hyundai to use their hydrogen fuel cell technology
Would I have a grenadier?? Yes yes yes.. Would I replace my 1995 110 for one?? No no no. Its both or nothing.. I love my Defender, but I'm never getting rid of it, no way I'll miss it too much. I want a defender side by side a grenadier, not one or the other
Which engine are you referring to/which one would you buy and why? Love myself a diesel but not sure about the modern ones with add blue, particular filters and whatnot...
45k? Wow that’s a game changer. I’m sure there will be a big options list but even so £45k is affordable.
I'm a buyer for sure
Anyone want to buy a 2005 Nissan Patrol Y61?
Thanks for the great information
Jim Ratcliffe is in Iceland testing the Grenadier - well I suppose the next Jim inspired improvement should be that it will take bigger tyres! After all, just about everything in Iceland is a mini-monster truck. So looking forward to that improvement.
I like this vehicle
If Sir Ratcliffe stands true to his mission & supports his customer base with integrity & promise then he will be to the 4WD world what Steve Jobs was to Apple in the 2000’s. Go , Go, Go!! This is the kind of leadership & decision making CEO’S & Co’s WW need in this day & age. 💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼👍🏻
very good info thank you so much!
70 series is way lighter (so better off road), it looks better if you ask me, they can be similarly reliable tho you can trust more the 70 series as the ineous is new, and the 70 series is cheaper. Would you make a comparison? The weight is too much for me to consider - is the no go.
The problem is the J7 does not meet the latest emission limits so it is not available in UK, EU, US or Canada…
@@lukasvass681
Too bad...
Real men know that emissions regulations are bullshit made up by governements to make car companies work more...
We all know!
Is just like Cars, now a days, after 6/7 years, they start to give so many troubles that we look around to buy another one.
Do car makers make Cars that last like an old Toyota FJ62?
I don't think so!
Anyway, I wouldn't be so hot about this "ineos" at least for the first 2/3 years.
One last thing, you can use all the technology you want, but no automatic tranny will ever beat a 6 Speed manual for durability.
I really hope they will offer manual option.
About the Wright?
"To be light is everything, in any condition".....(Ayrton Senna)
@@lukasvass681 You can have it imported brand new. There are people doing this. Cant find the website now. There are EU compliant versions if you want but are more expensive.
@@alextoader2880 there isn’t a Euro 6d compliant version of the J7. You can’t walk into a Toyota dealership and order one. Been there done that. Some people and companies are trying to import 3rd world/Arab spec vehicles using some legal loopholes or even frauds but those cars don’t have the factory warranty and support, it is difficult to have them financed or insured…
@@lukasvass681 Toyota 70 comes with 2 years warranty if I am not mistaken. If you are worried it will break inside those 2 years then you are in the wrong market :)
I love this and would love one I think it would look great in a gun metal grey !
I would change that BMW gear selector. In my opinion it doesn’t fit the well thought interior design. They went an extra mile to develop that beautiful reduction case gear knob, so why not a bespoke gear selector?
Maybe they will ! This is a prototype and no doubt they will want a few “nice surprises” on launch.
I'd buy one tomorrow if I could
Its what the old defender should have evolved in to
Regarding your comment about it not being the next ROW 300Tdi - Defenders in South Africa had locally fitted BMW engines, and in Australia Isuzu engines. I suppose if an agent established themselves as a 3rd World supplier, they could fit them from new with a Cummins Diesel and a 5 speed Gearbox, then sell the Ineos drivetrain as a repower option kit for older Defenders.
Very very interesting Thankyou
What would be cool is that after 10 years, they release 3D models of the plastic parts, so you can always get those parts.
Can't really be compared to a 70 Series, as the Toyota is far far more agricultural. 6 speed manual gearbox, no sound insulation, low hanging leaf springs in the rear and very basic seats. The Grenadier is a way more sophisticated with an automatic transmission and everything else that makes it far more comfortable. I do hope that the Grenadier is greater than the sum of its (very appealing components (e.g. strong diffs, reputable gearbox, one of the "good" BMW engines, Recaro seats, etc.). 3 year warranty is comforting and interior looks very good. Wishing the Ineos team every success with this product!
70 Series only has a 5 speed manual gearbox. Unless you count reverse as a gear I suppose!
@@spudboy1328 Ooops, typo on my part. :) I have assumed it was a matter of time before Toyota the 6 speed manual gearbox from the Prado 150 Series into the 70 Series, but that never happened.
Review of a Prado with the (very rare for Australia) 6 speed manual gearbox, just as an interesting side read: www.caradvice.com.au/385150/2016-toyota-landcruiser-prado-2-8l-gxl-manual-review/
I'm still expecting the first few I see well be the hard-core kerb crawlers in the demanding child transport role.
That's every off road vehicle there is. I work for a tire shop and we sell more AT/MT's on sparkling clean trucks and Suvs then ones that actually get driven for their purpose.
Great video! Intriguing vehicle. Might be a bit too expensive, but perhaps within reach.
Hmm.. at first I was terrified by the BMW engine in it. Now that I see how it looks, it starts to wake up the 8 year old in me and that's one of my main criteria for considering a vehicle.
Looks promising.