🎹 Eastern European Pianos | Estonia, Petrof, Bohemia | Pianos of the World- EP. 06 🎹
Vložit
- čas přidán 28. 05. 2024
- 🛒 Shop for Pianos HERE ▸ geni.us/all-pianos
💕 Subscribe to Merriam Pianos HERE ▸ bit.ly/SubscribeMerriam
🔔 Click the 🔔 bell to be notified of all videos! ▸ bit.ly/SubscribeMerriam
#EuropeanPianos #EstoniaPianos #PetrofPianos
0:00 - Intro
0:36 - Opening Playing Demo on Estonia L168
1:01 - Video Overview
1:30 - Eastern European Pianos v.s. The Rest of The World
2:41 - Eastern European Piano History
3:57 - Post-U.S.S.R. Eastern European Pianos
6:03 - Estonia Pianos
6:52 - Family Operated Piano. Companies
8:27 - North American Geography v.s. European Geography
9:40 - Eastern European Piano Qualities
11:27 - Video Outro
Thanks for joining us at the Merriam Pianos CZcams channel. Today, we’ve got the final entry in our series on the various piano-producing regions from around the world as we explore Eastern Europe.
In many cases, pianos produced in Eastern Europe represent a high-value, lower-cost alternative to a German piano, while offering a distinctly different musical experience from a Japanese piano.
Please like, subscribe, and hit the notification bell!
Overview
After exploring all of these different piano-producing regions of the world in recent weeks, it’s really quite striking how different their stories all are from one another.
Something that makes the Eastern European story so different from the German or American story for example is that despite economic and industrial might, the Eastern European region didn’t achieve the same level of piano producing dominance.
Major events such as the two World Wars and the rise of communism were big factors in preventing the Eastern European piano industry from maintaining a strong foothold throughout the 19th century.
Post-U.S.S.R. to Today
After the Soviet Union dissolved in 1991, a handful of major players were able to survive and eventually began to prosper, such as Petrof and Bohemia (since purchased by C. Bechstein and now sold under the W. Hoffmann brand) in the Czech Republic. The top lines from these brands are held in very high regard today as excellent handcrafted pianos.
In Poland, the last domestic producer Calisia went out of business in the early 2000s, however, new manufacturers have set up shop in older Polish factories where a lot of well-regarded piano rebuilding is now taking place.
Schimmel actually purchased a factory from a rebuilder and now produces their Wilhelm Schimmel pianos from the ground up in Poland (originally these pianos were sold under the Vogel brand).
In the North-Western portion of Eastern Europe, we of course have Estonia. Estonia is still producing pianos to this day in Estonia, and they’re easily achieving the highest quality level of any Eastern European manufacturer.
In fact, Estonia’s pianos are probably the best pianos ever to come out of Eastern Europe, and are regarded by many as one of the highest value performance level pianos available anywhere in the world.
It’s interesting to note that with the exception of Estonia, the majority of pianos being produced in Eastern Europe today tend to feature Western European designs and approaches to sound, but are built in Eastern Europe to leverage the lower cost of labour.
Musical Qualities
Since many of the modern Eastern European pianos of today tend to sound and play like Western European instruments, we’re going to focus on the Eastern European pianos of the past when discussing overall musical qualities and characteristics.
For instance, the Petrof and Bohemia pianos of the past definitely shared certain characteristics. One example would be the actions, which seemed to utilize a different geometric design than Western actions that made it feel like the keys were on a slight slope. The black keys also felt narrower.
Tone-wise, these pianos tended to have a very lovely mid-range bell-like tone, and a nice sustain across the instrument. The bass tended not to be too brassy, but quite clear instead.
Conclusion
Thanks very much for watching and for joining us throughout this recent series exploring the different piano-producing regions from around the world. It’s been a very fun journey and we hope you’ve enjoyed it!
Connect with Merriam Music:
● Website ▸ www.merriammusic.com/
● Contact Us ▸ www.merriammusic.com/contact/
● Instagram ▸ / merriammusic
● Facebook ▸ / merriammusic
● Twitter ▸ / merriammusicinc - Hudba
Czech Petrof is splendid ...
... world class level ...
👍⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐👍
I was hoping to hear more on Petrof pianos, in particularly the Ant. Petrof series, which is their newer high end series, which seems to sound so nice and their videos. And it seems they put in a lot of new research efforts on this series. Perhaps a review on Ant. Petrof 225?
The clarity and projection of the Estonia is amazing. Surely an underestimated brand. The list price though is well in the mid-range of German pianos. A great instrument, but not a bargain.
The Estonia grands are incredibly musical and expressive! I would argue that, given their specs, design, and quality of craftsmanship, they are actually one of the best bargains on the market as far as premium concert-class grand pianos go.
I disliked the sound of the Estonia in the beginning in the video, though.
I would like to see a video on France and French pianos… Pleyel is a brand that most people don’t know about but people in France do actually really like them. Pleyels have really nice, silky smooth, almost Bösendorfer-style bass alongside an iconically short decay harpsichord-like high end…
I have just bought a new Petrof piano N 122 N 2, it is really wonderful, such a rich and warm tone. I can recommend this very much! Greatings from Germany 😊
Hello from Canada! Thanks for tuning in and congrats on your new Petrof piano! While we don't carry new Petrof instruments currently, we get quite a few used Petrof instruments through our showrooms and I can certainly attest to them being very solid and rewarding instruments. :)
Excellent summary as always. The few cases where I could play an Eastern European piano of earlier eras, I found the action lighter and somewhat more fluid..and I personally liked that. The tonal integration was more mellow, and I liked that too. Perhaps the phrase is "more intimate" in the way that French instruments tended toward an intimacy, esp. Pleyel.
Great series!! Thank you!
Thank you for the effort that went into this series. It's been very interesting.
Hi Stu & Crew. Informative series, I would say that you could find a place as a lecturer in the nearby school for piano builders in Kalisz :-)
For them, it's an excellent overview of potential places to find a job.
From what I know, we have only 3 schools of this craft in the world?
So now the question about "why in Eastern Europe we have local center of rebuilders" or "why Polish-made Bechstein have imperfections" seems to be answered - young craftsmen need to practice ;-)
Would be cool to hear/see you playing those old Wild West Saloon pianos or some historical unicorns, or one-offs, something like Doug DeMuro with pianos "Let me film your cool piano, and tell the story of your instrument"
But this kind of content may be possible only when you go on your World-Tour :-)
(...)
Anyway, you have touched upon peripherals - headphones.
It's clear that every little piece of equipment for recording/reproducing sound is crucial in its own way.
Could you crunch this topic a bit more?
I would like to see serious, in-depth material about piano recording, preferred microphone types, microphone placement, comb filtering, and so on.
Do you really need to take off the lid to capture the real sound of a piano?
How many microphones/tracks do one need to record to have enough for a proper mix, in what format, what multitrack field recorder is best (can you make some tests and comparisons?)
All about MIDI recording and playing with it, what keyboard is the most price/features balanced solely as a MIDI input.
A view from the studio perspective ;-)
(...)
Here you have a high-pitch whistle, above 10k - something like in old CRT monitors or cheap capacitors/transformers on the computer motherboard.
For the last chapter - hurry to close - losing solicitude :-)
Homework accomplished.
(...)
Can't wait when you play something ( i mean "to present an instrument").
I have two comments about comb filtering and MIDI recording:
1) Comb filtering: in my homemade experiments with speakers, wooden resonators (soundboards) and transducers, I have noticed that adding extra speakers produces a more congested sound. If you place a single transducer on a soundboard, the sound is clean, but adding a second transducer does interfere with the first one, and the sound may be louder or more room filling, but it is less pure. If you place more than one driver playing the same content less than 60 cm (24 inches) apart, the sound is much less desirable than if you use a single speaker driver.
There is a video of Yuja Wang at the Steinway factory playing Prokofiev's Toccata in D minor, and the performance was recorded with a single shotgun microphone. The sound is very clear and organic.
When I add microphones in my vst pianos, the effect is more 3D, but at the expense of purity. So, how many microphones are needed to record piano? Well, more than one gives you access to the room acoustics and instrument localization in space, but at the expense of introducing comb filtering.
A real piano does not work like cone speakers, but more like DML (Distributed Mode Loudspeaker) or Magnepan speakers. A Kawai dealer told me Kawai seems to be going for the AURES system instead of individual speakers for the best piano realism. The idea was introduced by Yamaha initially with their TransAcoustic pianos, and Kawai followed suit.
A digital piano such as the Kawai CA79/99/NV5S/NV10S uses 5 microphones for their sample, squeezing all those microphone captures through a 2-channel system. This creates comb filtering, no matter how much high-end you go in the amplifiers or DAC's. I think this is a limitation shared by vst pianos as well: you can add all the microphones you want and capture more angles of the sound, but you can't escape the comb filtering effect, which is heard as a sound less pure. Comb filtering introduces artifacts in the sample.
The Yamaha AvantGrand N3X has 4 fully independent 3-way speaker systems, to channel each microphone capture in a way that reduces comb filtering. The speakers are placed in the N3X exactly where the recording microphones were placed in the CFX. It is the only digital piano on the market to ever make that claim. Everybody else places their speakers in decent locations, but not in the exact same location of the recording microphones.
2) MIDI recording: Yamaha and Steinway have high-resolution MIDI recording systems available for their pianos. The Disklavier Pro is used in international e-competitions, so judges can listen to a performance played back in an identical piano. The Synchron Stage Vienna has 3 pianos: a Steinway D274, a Bösendorfer 290 Imperial, and a Yamaha CFX. The CFX has an Enspire PRO system that allows the pianist to play in a booth isolated from the orchestra. His performance is recorded via high resolution MIDI. When the orchestra leaves, then the piano is rolled into the hall. The same performance is now played back via MIDI and captured with microphones under acoustically perfect conditions. So you can mix the orchestra and the piano, which were both recorded live, but with a perfectly clean recording for the piano.
I learned to play piano on a Petrof (upright) and Estonia (grand piano) back in Ukraine. Both great instruments! Though, I have always personally preferred the August Forster (it was a rather loud instrument, especially noticeable in the upper range) to the Estonia, but the latter was still a great instrument. I also loved the Petrof, they somehow know how to build good instruments!
Hi Dalton! All of the instruments you mentioned are fantastic in their own regard and offer something a little bit different in terms of tone and expression. :)
August Forster has always been a fabulous piano.
Yes, my favourite too. It always has a great sound. I haven't heard an August Förster that would be harsh or muffled or blurry or weak.@@KalieBurger
I think you make a very important point there when you talk about how small Europe is. More importantly though is that the whole idea of borders and nation states is a somewhat novel concept to Europe, at least to the German-Austrian cultural are that stretched from Germany and Austria over what is now the Czech Republic, Western Poland, parts of Ukraine to the whole Baltic area (Kaliningrad being the German city of Königsberg) before WW I. German was spoken commonly in the Czech Republic as well as the Baltics and it was really one large area where different cultures mixed and mingled. A lot of German companies including piano manufacturers had also factories in (then German now Czech) Bohemia, such as August Förster, or actually originated there. The history of the piano industry has a strong common root in Germany, Austria and all Central European countries, and it really the English and French piano building history that should be considered as a separate history, even though sadly it now just that, history. My main point: it's not so much about the size of nations but of culture. In this respect, the German, Austrian and Central European cultures are fairly similar with a history of centuries of common roots and cross-fertilisation, and French and British culture are fairly distinct with little overlap to the Central European area. And that holds true until today. (Ask an Estonian whether he consideres himself "an Eastern European" and prepare to get smacked.)
Thanks so much for these wonderful insights! There are a lot of fantastic and compelling points in here. I certainly understand the sentiment of British and French culture and history being considered separate, particularly in regard to piano manufacturing. Thanks again for tuning in and sharing your commentary. We appreciate it! :)
I would really love to hear you analyze August Förster pianos, I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one interested.@@MerriamPianos
I really enjoyed this series on piano producing regions of the world! Thanks!
I really like this video series, I would like to see another episode about the rest of Europe like France and Italy.
This entire series of the histories of these piano companies was absolutely fantastic and interesting. I would love to see another addition which tells the story of a piano I inherited when purchasing a house. It is a Nordiska Model: 152 C Grand. I understand they originally were manufactured in Sweden but now by DongBei Piano Group Co. of Liaoning, China.
Thank you for the kind words! We're so happy to hear that you enjoyed this series! The Nordiska history is also quite an interesting one. Given the amount of compelling stories about so many different brands, we may need to revisit this series in the future. ;)
I had a Belarus (Беларусь) upright back in the 80s. It sounded decent. My parents sold it as we moved to Germany in 1988.
Strezov Sampling has a sample library of a Belarus upright for very small money. :)
That is awesome that a sample library of that upright exists! It is very cool that you get to re-experience that instrument again in a way. :)
@@MerriamPianos Yeah, it reminds me of my first piano lessons at the age of 5. :D
I have a Belarus (Беларусь) waiting to go to a piano junkyard. Scholze that's built about 10-12 years later is lightyears apart from that piece of garbage. Piano design was never a priority in USSR as the brightest minds were apparently utilized elsewhere.
Well, after this All around piano tour particulary interesting, explaining part of the distinct difference in sound between piano of different country…..back to piano test ? Maybe some interesting, not really weel-known, digital keyboard like viscount or numa x gt ?
And yes, it’s not the first time I ask…..😉
I wanted to buy an Estonia 168 but for 32.000€ I went for the Schimmel C121 instead ;-)
PETROF all the way!
Very excellent pianos! :)
Since Czech Republic identifies as Central Europe rather than Eastern and the piano making tradition in Bohemia is a continuum since the Austrian(-Hungarian) times, Petrof and Bösendorfer being made in the same country, August Förster moving from Northern Bohemia to Saxony and then splitting into two factories, one in Eastern Germany, one in Czechoslovakia - I'd see more sense in making a Central European video, with Czech & Saxon factories together. Nonetheless, thank you for including Petrof et al.
While I understand the sentiment given the geographic disposition of these countries, our categorization is based off of how most people discuss these particular countries and which "side" of Europe they are more associated with for whatever reason. In either case, these are some extraordinary brands making wonderful instruments. :)
I understand that :-) But first, "most people" are wrong ;-) and second, it's simply a given that when Central Europeans countries are discussed and the expression "Eastern" is used and some Czech/Polish/Slovak etc. person reads it, at least one comment of the kind I gave MUST appear... If there is none, that means no one from that area has read it yet. Thank you for your videos, anyway!!@@MerriamPianos
Did you cover Boesendorfer in any of your episodes? Thanks
In theory, it should be here in the "Eastern Europe" episode since Petrof (that is made geographically more to the West than Bösendorfer) is featured here... ;-)
Great series. But what about Africa? Any piano makers / traditions there?
Czech Kingdom of Bohemia has been for centuries the most powerful kingdom in the world ...
👍⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐👍
Joke of the week... and it's only Tuesday :-)
Haha, I just realized how small Germany actually is! 😄 I never thought about it because I’m German and for me it’s normal.
BTW, I’ve got Pianoteq 8 and my favourite preset is the Petrof Mistral Classical Recording preset.
Well, despite Germany's size there is (and has been for quite some time) some very excellent pianos coming out of the country! ;)
And that is awesome! Pianoteq is a fantastic VST. Thanks for tuning in and happy playing!
@@MerriamPianos Thanks - yes, I think so, too - at least I’ve got a Schimmel upright and it sounds great! I don’t like recording it, though, because I don’t have any experience on recording a real piano. This is the actual reason why I got Pianoteq. I already had a stage piano (a Kawai MP10) which I got as a practicing instrument during my professional training.
I don't give a damn about their history, just let me try the piano for 10 minutes, that is the test.
I had an 80ies Petrof upright piano as a kid when learning piano. It was not at all a high-end instrument. In fact, it was what my father could afford to buy.
It had a quite distinctive sound, but it was so difficult to play because of the action. It was very heavy and unballanced. I have quite small hands, so it was very difficult to play fast pieces. on top of this, because of the unballanced action, getting the sound right was sometimes impossible, each key had a different strike point and was even differently weighted. It was really holding me back technically and musically, it was a nightmare to play it because it was so unballanced. Simple pieces became difficult to play. I even got injured several times because of this, when playing beethoven sonatas or difficult Chopin pieces
In spite of all this, it stayed with me until 2014. It was a gift from my father, it was what he could afford to make my dream of playing the piano become true. And when I managed to deal with the crappy action, it had a quite beatiful tone.
2014 I sold it when I bought a new Yamaha grand. The tone of it is very different and sometimes a bit too bright for my taste, but it is sooo much easier to play, because of its concistent and much lighter action (even though it‘s a grand piano and not an upright!). My playing improved in the matter of a few weeks.
So I have a quite bad impression of the pianos from eastern europe. Maybe I‘m wrong, but I feel especially the ones from the soviet times are not well made instruments.
Algorithm bump.
Russian 1945~1989 of Czechoslovakia (now Czechia and Slovakia) has totally dameged almost everything // we see now in Ukraine, how Russia behaves ... !!!
🤔🙄😥
I tried some of those, not impressed.
The communist era Petrof aren't good pianos, I've seen many of these 80's-90's grand with 2 pedals priced unfairly high in the used market.
Glad that you mentioned Bohemia, it is hard to find info on these pianos and I couldn't even find any of their videos here on youtube.
How do you rate their grand in person say compared to modern Petrof or Yamaha in terms of quality (aside from regional characteristics)
Hi! Brent from Merriam Music here! Thanks for tuning in and sharing your insights! We sincerely appreciate it. My personal experience with Bohemia pianos is fairly limited, but I always felt that the Bohemia grands I played were quite wonderful and, based on their price points, presented a wonderful cost-to-value ratio. :)
@@MerriamPianos I hope you can do a video or demo of Bohemia here if you could.
There aren't any videos I can find here nor soundclip, and yours are the only mention the make.
The uprights are pretty inexpensive now but it is the grand I am interested in.
My First Video of your Channel. Content is good, B-Rolls are fantastic. Camera is over-exposed. But this high pitched Noise in the Audio gives me a headache. Needed to stop, but looking for other Videos on your channel now.
Thanks for stopping by our channel and taking the time to check out our videos! Thank you for your feedback. I will pass it along to our production team. :)
@@MerriamPianos Hi again, i get stuck at the other ones, watched about 2 hours or so :-) The others are fine, everythings perfect. Give them a thunbs up, its only this one and that can happen and in post there is nothing to do. If they do a Low Pass filter, the audio gets dull etc.... Nice Greetings from the Boesendorfer Country :-)
Central and Eastern Europe sucks at Western targets! that's why it plays differently, differently! Love Petrof
Petrof make very nice pianos! And I think I understand what you are saying. Different places have different perspectives when it comes to musical beauty. That is one of the things that makes the world of music so exciting and eclectic. :)
Liked the video - but you should know - Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are NOT in Eastern Europe. They are CENTRAL European countries along with Germany, Austria, Slovenia and Hungary.
Thanks for tuning in! And I totally understand where you are coming from. We separated the conversation in two regions/instalment, but there certainly would be an argument to have divided things into three. :)
@@MerriamPianos It's common for American's to think that Eastern Europe is the same as the former "Eastern Bloc" from the Cold War. They are not.
No one in Europe would ever think to say that Poland and the Czech Rep., are in Eastern Europe.
It would be like saying Illinois is part of the US East Coast.
Yea, they pretty much are inferior junk.
Petrof inferior junk? :-)))))
I like Petrof grands. The II and Mondial I are beautiful instruments
Get your geography right.
He follows Cold War conventions where all post-Soviet countries are ''Eastern European'', except Eastern Germany.