We’re all being played and I’m tired of it
Vložit
- čas přidán 5. 08. 2024
- Visit www.squarespace.com/LTT and use offer code LTT for 10% off
Checkout the G.Skill Trident Z5 Royal at:
lmg.gg/TridentZRoyalNewegg
lmg.gg/TridentZRoyalAmazon
AMD, Intel, Nvidia, Apple and pretty much everyone else think you are an IDIOT. They think they can just mislead consumers by tweaking their naming schemes for their hardware (Remember the RTX 4080 12GB?) and making them more confusing. How bad has it become? We're gonna tell you.
Discuss on the forum: linustechtips.com/topic/15762...
Purchases made through some store links may provide some compensation to Linus Media Group.
► GET MERCH: lttstore.com
► GET EXCLUSIVE CONTENT ON FLOATPLANE: lmg.gg/lttfloatplane
► GET A VPN: www.piavpn.com/linus
► SPONSORS, AFFILIATES, AND PARTNERS: lmg.gg/partners
► EQUIPMENT WE USE TO FILM LTT: lmg.gg/LTTEquipment
► OUR WAN PODCAST GEAR: lmg.gg/wanset
FOLLOW US
---------------------------------------------------
Twitter: / linustech
Facebook: / linustech
Instagram: / linustech
TikTok: / linustech
Twitch: / linustech
MUSIC CREDIT
---------------------------------------------------
Intro: Laszlo - Supernova
Video Link: • [Electro] - Laszlo - S...
iTunes Download Link: itunes.apple.com/us/album/sup...
Artist Link: / laszlomusic
Outro: Approaching Nirvana - Sugar High
Video Link: • Sugar High - Approachi...
Listen on Spotify: spoti.fi/UxWkUw
Artist Link: / approachingnirvana
Intro animation by MBarek Abdelwassaa / mbarek_abdel
Monitor And Keyboard by vadimmihalkevich / CC BY 4.0 geni.us/PgGWp
Mechanical RGB Keyboard by BigBrotherECE / CC BY 4.0 geni.us/mj6pHk4
Mouse Gamer free Model By Oscar Creativo / CC BY 4.0 geni.us/Ps3XfE
CHAPTERS
---------------------------------------------------
0:00 The Names are Stupid
2:12 The Names are Misleading
4:59 The Names are Intentional
6:41 The Names are Stupid, again
8:39 The Names are Confusing
9:04 The Names are Here to Stay - Věda a technologie
They wanted to compete with the USB names
Shots fired
HDMI same boat...
Explanation?
USB technical names are bad, but the consumer-facing branding they recommend (as opposed what deceptive manufacturers use) is mostly good. There's USB 5 Gbps, USB 10 Gbps, USB 20 Gbps and USB 40 Gbps. Pretty simple. But manufacturers find that saying "USB 3.2 Gen 1" is somehow more impressive.
@@farin4560 usb 2.0, 3.0, 3.1, 3.2 gen 1, 3.2 gen 2, 3.2 gen 2x2, and instead of getting usb 4. It's just thunderbolt 3/4 now.
never stop calling out marketing bullshit
Motherboard branding has been like this and worse for decades. Huge number of motherboards with codes that are mostly meaningless. 12 variations of the same thing. It's good for system integrators as customers just give up and ask someone to do it for them. The industry prefers to sell pre-built PCs. They don't want consumers decoding part numbers.
@@L9MN4sTCUk do you mean the Chipset names of motherboards like X670E or do you mean the whole names of some ? because i think the X670E or B550 etc is quiet nice.
@@ruka-chan7226 Motherboard names. B550M, B550MA, B550MA-PLUS, B550-F, B550-XE. Are just some examples of B550 chipset motherboards all on sale simultaneously.
Especially from Linus himself
Just pawns in the game :(
This is exactly why I have zero idea how to recommend a laptop to someone. It takes like 2 weeks of research to know what the fuck the stupid naming schemes even mean anymore.
TDP differences being an extra layer on the shit cake that is buying a modern laptop.
Recommend framework!
Just tell them to stop overthinking it, and buy based on their budget.
@chrism6880 problem with that is that I've had multiple instances where a more expensive laptop is actually worse performance than a cheaper one. Buying based on budget is fine but you don't want to get ripped off.
@DeckDogs4Life I don't really believe in min-maxing every dollar. Is the device's performance worth what it costs? Is it within your budget? Only two questions really necessary in making a purchasing decision.
Cool browser extension idea. Hover over a processor name like "i9-9900K" press a button and popup appears with info like:
9th Generation Intel Processor
8 core 16 threads
14 nm
95 W
Integrated graphics card: UHD Graphics 630
And so on maybe even along with benchmark results. It'd make shopping for laptops and cpu's so much easier.
This is what LABS should be doing. Hopefully they see your suggestion but in all honesty they shouldve been on top of things like this. But it seems they don't like to give tools for the community to use
YES, I would install this immediately, I cant be bothered to memorize all these asinine naming schemes
in pc cases the problem isn't that bad because of the overall more tech knowledge of pc buyers (they tend to research or consult someone that knows), but in the case of notebooks, even tech savvy people become confused because quite often the same chip has significant % difference in performance between models (heat dissipation, ram, etcetera).
@@CallMeRabbitzUSVI Yeah honestly making an extension like that would be pretty easy. I'd do it myself, but I already have enough on my plate right now Hardest part would be finding reliable data about hardware, but that's literally what labs is supposed to be about.
@EisenWald_CH
notebooks are also a pc
you should have said a desktop
and not prebuilt ones wich most non-savvy people prefer
At this rate they're going to end up like monitor names...
You think it would be confusing if we get an AMD Ryzen 8149X82GF7913R2D2?
Oh hell naw
@@walterwhite415 thats organised
@@walterwhite415 Idk man the 8670309XPSYNC3PO has a better night light for midnight gaming.
I often find myself asking what does "BQN242C165HB" even stands for. Is that a bar code or something? 💀
Cpu companies in 1980 : our new x86 cpu
Cpu companies in 2024 : ai
In a vacuum that's actually pretty good advancement lol
Ai, Ai ai aI I a aaa Iiia!
Ai
@@LeafBoye I mean, things generally expand in vacuums, including the cosmos 😆
Ikr?
If I buy something and it's not what I wanted because the naming was confusing, I will forever retain that time period of hatred for the company and it will take certain steps to gain me as a customer back.
These new CPU naming schemes make me want to live in a cave with no computer again.
Restocking fee.
ooga wooga
100%. From a cynical marketing perspective, it's good to be able to market lesser products to people and for them to *feel good about it,* like they've made a good decision.
It's NOT good for the consumer to feel confused, because no one feels good about something they're confused about.
And it's a cardinal sin to dupe a customer into buying something they later regret, because you'll never have that customer back, again. Maybe fine for disposable As-Seen-On-TV product salesmen, but CPU companies need to be able to sell their parts every several years to consumers who are upgrading.
The naming schemes seem to have jumped the shark to confusion at best, and careening towards regret. To speak CEO-ese, this is unlikely to result in stable long-term growth.
I blame the stock market for all of this.
When companies are run by people who give a shit about the long term performance of the company, they work on customer retention and safe, reliable profits for decades to come.
As soon as you allow your shareholders to take control, the major decisions are all made by "investors" who don't know a damn thing about the industry but know that if their number doesn't get at least 7% bigger within three months they'll burn the whole thing to the ground.
Product names are "to appeal to your gut feeling"? Monitor manufacturers probably didn't get the memo
Marketing team for monitor manufacturers must be the engineers themselves
I feel like i have to learn a whole new language whenever i look at monitors
At least from the monitor name I can immediately read the size and I think TV/monitor size is most likely still the deciding factor for most buyers. "Hey I want to buy a 65 inch tv" is probably something you hear way more than "Hey I want a 65 inch tv with HDR and a special HDMI port for gaming so that I can play at 120Hz etc."
LG UltraGear 24GN60R. Ok, so, the 24 is for the inches. The rest, well, probably just nonsense.
Yeah. Snapdragon CPUs would also like to have a word.
AMD and Intel are slowly becoming TV manufacturers with their oddly stupid naming schemes
at this point their SoCs will become a TV so you are not wrong.
the only way companies are revealing who is worthg & who is not is the quality of the product now
@@turtlefrog-tn3ek TVs have an SoC
@@LutraLovegood you dont say.
And qualcomm is no better with their new snapdragon elite lineup as well
I feel like consumers should come up with their own naming standard and just ignore the companies
This would be amazing. It could be like a community maintained spreadsheet that would translate the marketing BS into something people could easily understand.
It used to be called Consumer reports magazine.....
@@vernanok1677 Pepperidge Farms remembers
AMD's new numbers are even worse. The one Linus explained are now "old", and the ones now including AI actually aren't explainable. It's real bad
This bothers me so much. I just got a laptop with a Core 5 120U thinking it was the same architecture as the new ultra ones with 7nm, but its just a rebrand of the 13gen for laptops with a higher clock and the same 10nm shitty process. Result: i still got the same jet engine with poor battery life just as every other generation. That misleading "Intel 7" litography is such a bs.
It appears you have sufficient knowledge to research the CPU model before making a purchase, as it's not as if smartphones with internet connections don't exist.
@@potatorigs2155congratulations, you've just proven the point of the video.
@@potatorigs2155 the research shouldn't have to be done they a clearly manipulating their marketing to trick consumers into thinking they are buying a different product
@@potatorigs2155 did this comment make you feel like a big strong man
@@potatorigs2155 When the model came to my country, i bought it instantly because it came with a mx570, making it the best ultra thin device graphics wise, surpassing the 780M and Arc on the Ultras. I researched it after, then found out what it really was. It is still a very capable machine, but it sure pissed me off on how misleading it was. But that's ME, the vast majority of people wouldn't know. That's the problem.
Yoda gonna be doing infomercials for AMD/ Intel soon
screwing the names up, we are!
Also the confusing nature of LTT video titles. Like after watching you go "That's not so". In the title Linus say "X, Y, Z" "I thought this video was about..."
Why not just invent our own naming scheme and ignore completely their BS? Something like "AMD 2024 arch, 4C8T, 35W" CPU? We could have a table mapping our naming scheme to the branding BS for people who want to know what to buy, but if the 'open' naming scheme would be adopted by tech reviewers, maybe shops would adopt it too.
4:55 It is the biggest bs ever. You get a Ryzen 5 (7520U) that is beaten by a Ryzen 3 (7440U) by a big leap in Single and Multi. The naming is broken. Just don't use 4 different Zen architectures in 1 generation.
they fail zen 4 tests so they get downclassed as zen 2 or zen 3
would you prefer those bad but working dies instead be wasted completely?
@@erkinalp Don't throw those chips away, but give them a naming that makes sense and isn't deceptive!
@@erkinalp they dont fail zen4 tests (thats not even a thing) They are actually zen 2 or zen 3 based chips they either had left from before or made new ones cuz they are cheaper to make(as they try to sometimes shrink them down to newer nodes and that makes them take low die space than usual zen 4 chips so they can get more chips per wafer, driving down costs) and rebrand them under 7000, 8000 and 9000 series names
@@rudrasingh6354 yes that's a thing: the CPU is tested against various instruction inputs with various V/F curves under a certain sustained load (both low end and high end), failing instruction sets (at the ISA revision granularity) and failing low V/high F combos (at the performance class granularity) get disabled. there's a whole wikipedia article on it, they call it "product binning"
@@Gramini I agree though that's sadly beyond my capacity as I do not and have never worked at AMD
Deliberately confusing product names are not new however. Recently found out that my mom's notebook is not Windows 11 compatible, and was wondering why, bought it in early 2020. Then I found out that the Ryzen 2200U is apparently a 2018 chip which was already a recycled chip from 1st Gen Ryzen, early 2017. Of course, the main villain is Microsoft, and it runs shockingly well for a 2C/4T chip, but still.
It's worse. The 2200U wasn't "recycled" from 1st gen Ryzen, it's a 1st gen Ryzen part that had no direct predecessor, they just arbitrarily decided to brand it as 2nd gen even though it isn't. There is no Ryzen 1200U.
@@nathangamble125
That was what I meant to say, they just recycled the old gen and shipped it under the name of the new one.
And, as mentioned, I'm really split on this. Like, 1st gen Ryzen must have slapped hard considering nobody ever noticed anything in daily use (2 Cores!), on the other hand, screw their marketing.
A yes the Microsoft bs called Windows 11 that only exists to make money and eliminate old CPUs and for no other reason
I m getting confused like this for Intel mobile chips
Especially funny looking at my Vivobook with a 3200U- it's Win11 compatible, even though its apparently weaker than the i3 6100, which is NOT compatible (doesn't matter, the 6100 is chugging along with Kubuntu).
Saw you and Luke talking about this on the WAN show this week, I think doing these videos is really important. You guys carry a lot of weight, and videos like this have a real impact.
8:57
Also, that each Apple M chip can have varying core counts, but there is no indication of that from the model number.
In apples defence, any "pro" chip is better than the standard M chip within a generation number. Any "max" chip is better than the "pro" chip within a given generation number. There are multiple SKUs yes, but theres no overlap. The core counts are also published when you buy the thing, its not hidden in some arbritrary numbering scheme that changes depending on the wind. literally all of it is "higher number = better" as long as you're staying within a generation.
The chips in the laptops are the same as those in the desktops too - with the same performace. There isnt mobile versions with higher numbers that are weaker than desktop ones with lower numbers. They're all directly and easily comparable.
The same cannot be said for the intel or AMD naming schemes.
While apple's approach is a bit better, since RAM capacity is thrown in and not called out, that's another potential issue when comparing base, pro and max chips.
If you look at the Apple store page for their products, the number of CPU and GPU cores has the largest font size on the page and is at the top. They make what you're getting very clear and they aren't hiding it behind stuff like Intel and AMD are.
Such as when the MacBook Air M2 had an SSD with half the speed of the MacBook Air M1 making its performance in everyday tasks worse than the previous model.
@@jameshodgetts7541 Not just that, but within the same model. Take the M2, which can have 8, 9, or 10 GPU cores enabled depending on the device it's in.
I miss the good old days when every project had "turbo" in the name for no reason.
My personal favorite is the Nvidia GTX 650 Ti BOOST
May I introduce you to the Porsche Taycan Turbo. It's an electric car with no actual turbo.
Like the 'Turbo' button on PCs that should really have been labelled 'Don't Throttle' because turning it off dropped the clock speed down from its default.
@@mysticgreg Instead of Turbo, it should be labeled as "I have a very old game that is running way too fast"
Product*
Thanks for clarifying the soap joke, all experts know Costco soap tastes a bit too acidic and recommend Walmart soap instead for a more balanced taste.
consumers only see the i7
Honestly, jokes aside I've used a couple dishwasher detergents that have left a horrible taste on the dishes even after a second wash without any detergent in.
So, having one that either doesn't have a taste, or tastes nice is a bonus!
@@animationcreations42 if you can taste dish soap after full cycle - you may want to get a better dishwasher, it is not healthy
Apples biggest issues are the just "ipad" naming. Where it's like "yeah but what ipad?" And the pro MacBooks with pro chips....it makes "m3 pro MacBook pro" quite a mouthful to not be misunderstood. And many think an m3 pro is an m3 MacBook pro...
That point at the end is probably the biggest issue. Pleasing investors
I have dyslexia and I've railed against the alphabet soup naming for decades. It's effectively meaningless garbage to me, no different from a randomized activation key. When choosing parts, I rely heavily on websites like Passmark to figure things out, paying attention to the gibberish only so far as to spell it right to make sure I have the right part.
I don’t have dislexia and everytime someone says which processor they have I read it as “some AMD CPU, no idea if it’s any good though”. Building a PC these days must be a nightmare.
@@ThePC007 I built a new PC in November of last year, and the only reason I was confident enough in the parts I got was because I'd specifically started watch LTT, gamers nexus and a couple other channels about two years prior, knowing I needed a new PC. All the parts I got had been out for over a year and had repeatedly shown their good standing in various benchmark charts and such. It was still several weeks of reading the specs on which exact video card and motherboard and AIO and... sigh.
2. years.
Yep. It's a nightmare.
@@ThePC007 The desktop CPUs have pretty sane naming at least- just likely gonna want to stick with 7800x3d for gaming.
The naming schemes themselves arw dyslexiic so you aren't really thinking much different.
Notebookcheck is better than passmark. Passmark doesn't show worse case and best case scenario for every PC part.
Yoda is now leading the Intel Marketing Team.
Processor 7 ultra, Intel Core
Buy you must
sersou
you bought the i9 Ti ?
Leading the Intel Marketing Team Yoda is now
Ok, I admit I usually skip the ad after the intro, but I'm kinda glad I didn't this time.
Creating branding confusion is a valid marketing strategy. Ever wonder why some Coke bottles or Sprite bottles or Mt. Dew bottles look the same? So that consumers will mistakenly buy the wrong one and leave the store, going home, and then being too hassled to return it. When buying some online games like ESO? They are CONFUSING. Try not to buy the wrong combo of software as you might not get a refund.
It's come into hardware.
On another note, my Jeep started having transmission issues at 141,000 miles. That model jeep is - according to one engineer - only supposed to last to 150,000 miles before the transmission goes. Lo and behold, a software update has sort of rectified the issue magically.
Well, regarding the soft drinks, that's an entirely different issue completely outside of brand confusion. The bottles themselves look the same because of manufacturer and vending machines being the same. You don't want to change the shape of your bottle creating a second manufacturing line (which would be more expensive) and then not be able to have it in the billions of vending machines out there because it doesn't fit or it has a design flaw. Arrowhead water learned this the hard way when back in 2008 or 2010 or there abouts, they switched to a much less thick plastic bottle "For the environment" when in reality they were just being cheap asses and cutting corners, I mean costs, to increase their profit margins. As soon as those bottles went out into the wild, vending machine operators quickly learned you could only stack a third to half of the bottles before the weight got to be too much and started crushing/deforming the bottles on the bottom. Inside vending machines things are stacked on their sides, just an fyi, so squeeze a water bottle and picture 60 or so bottles stacked sideways on top of each other. That's a lot of deformation. This meant that as the tray rotated underneath the stack to allow a bottle to be dispensed, because the bottles were deformed, the tray would jam as the bottle above the one attempting to be dispensed would be sitting too far down into the tray and be in the way. Sales of Arrowhead drastically fell off causing them to re-revise their manufacturing process to add thickness and rigidity back into the bottle because without sales, you have no profits and you don't have any profit margins to worry about. So that's why all of the bottles look the same, more or less. Changes at this point screw them out of sales and costs them more to deal with, and they all know it, and when one tries, they find out fast why nobody does that.
Also... Sprite is owned by coke, mt dew is owned by pepsi. You'd expect sameness between coke and sprite because it's cheaper to have one manufacturing pipeline and one type of equipment in your bottling plant to handle that type of bottle instead of two to handle two different shapes of the same volume bottle. Same with Mt Dew and Pepsi, same company, same bottle manufacturer, same bottling plants, same bottle shapes.
Where brand confusion comes into play is when one brand makes theirs look as close to another as possible, like Dr. Pepper and Mr. Pibb. Pibb used extremely similar color labels and designs as Dr. Pepper specifically because of brand confusion. Two letter suffixes Dr and Mr, double letters (the b in pibb, the p's in Pepper), two word names, reddish burgundy color backgrounds with white lettering, same slightly tilted graphics... Everything to look just close enough that someone not paying attention grabs the wrong one especially if the words are not perfectly forward displayed, but not close enough that they get sued for registered trademark violations.
@@Stant123 I've never seen things stacked on their side in vending machines. Is that country specific?
The only reason nvidia stock is so expensive is because the ceo said ai 50 times in 1 sentence💀
I loved the production, shooting and story telling of this video
Then the investors panicked because he hadn’t been on stage to say AI in 24 hours so the stock tanked and lowered their market cap by 500 billion dollars
this brand of american capitalism is ruining so many different fields including gaming... FUCK SHAREHOLDERS. There's a reason Steam offers such a great service. Why? No shareholders is one of the reasons.
@Evelyn27Official you forgot about gaming consoles, playstation sucks fr, Xbox is alr, steam deck is CHAD
@@realskyquest because playstation (sony) and microsoft are publicly traded. shareholder bullshit again
I built my computer in 2014, as i'm getting ready for a new build this video explains to the dot how I felt browsing for new parts.
Someone on the LTT team got their "The Nod" Moment.
For context, YT search: Groove the nod.
Yeah the 12yrs old one.
The insane marketing naming sharnegalfritz is exactly why I gave up trying to find the "best" combination of a DIY PC for my budget and just got a Steam Deck instead.
Even using an LTT or PCPP build suggestion list there were still issues where people were arguing for ups and downs and replacements the entire time. As a former PC nerd before my kids were born I can absolutely see why Console gaming is still so powerful.
When I shopped for a cheap-ish laptop I had to check benchmarks of every processors to find something okay in a sea of outdated ones or garbage-value sold at full-price.
We need a tool on LTT Labs that can compare these processors, so we can be sure to get the naming schemes right.
I feel like making some look up tables in excel wouldn't be terribly difficult...
Use on android CPU-L, SoC-L, GPU-L.
@@Andrey543100fr thease are god teir
@@alliterationking2029 okay but part of LTT's job is to help us with shit like this lol
Tom's Hardware has always had that.
And a quick look at the latest table shows that the Ryzen 7 7700x beats the Ryzen 9 7900x which beats the Ryzen 9 7950x. But that's only because they put a graphics test first. In single threaded performance, the numbers go the correct way.
So good luck decoding benchmarks tables.
My wife was asking why places like best buy are still in business. Because of this crap and the dishonest sellers on amazon. At least there is a chance the best buy person will steer you in the right direction.
physical stores are making a comeback with how shitty amazon has become. i realized that i get better quality products for the same money if i just go somewhere that doesn't host chinese companies and their rebranded trash.
RadioShack died so amazon could live.
@@simpson6700 It's pretty amazing that Amazon has made Best Buy look like good guys.
In my experience brick and mortar stores aren't much better. Two weeks ago I had distant family ask me for a recommendation for a laptop. I found one good value, even told them where to buy it. Being older people they went to a B and M store where they found one for €100 less with "almost the same specs". They saved €100 for a worse screen (IPS vs OLED), worse keyboard, worse CPU, worse iGPU, worse battery (25% smaller). I wouldn't have bought it if it was €300 cheaper.
What're OEM's gonna do? Tell nvidia, amd and intel how to make CPU's/GPU's? Remember, back in the pascal and turing days, laptop gpu's were a lot more honest. CPU's too. OEM's had no issues selling and cooling parts with higher TDP's.
Maybe we could as a community of consumers, it professionals, hobbyists and technies just come up with a community naming scheme. We could create a website that includes a translator that makes sense out of those stupid naming schemes.
Same as going to the movies and buy pop corn, almost nobody goes for medium because with 10 more cents you will get the big, the medium size is only to encourage you to get the big size.
“4.7 trillion dollars” basically the price of a 4090 these days
Nah like half a 4090
The corporation equivalent of investing in a 4090 lol
throw in a couple hundred organs and you may be able to buy one
how come... in Germany its just around 2 Grands...
if you got a working plan in life its affordable.
@@Protoscherge threw class consciousness out of the window
Not an Intel fanboy but I think Intel's marketing is not as confusing on their website, 14th Gen Intel Core i9 Processor makes sense if you read it out loud and that is what they have on their website. I do wish they had gone further and renamed each series of Core i'X' to something that made sense here's my suggestion:
Core i3 = peon
Core i5 = peasant
Core i7 = deluxocrat
Core i9 = splurgemonger
Used in a sentence, "I got the 14th Gen Intel Splurgemonger Processor and now I can't afford food"
This way you also discover more about yourself when you buy a CPU.
U got me theret😂😂😂😂
10:40 Welcome to the enshittification. It's not just tech companies. It's every large company in existence. Everyone has become so obsessed with short term profits that companies are failing and people are dying (shoutout to Boeing). Without any legal repercussion (thanks to government elected officials), these executives get away with moving from company to company ducking people over.
Thanks for calling it out, but you're not wealthy enough for it to matter.
Somewhere at the AMD naming office:
A-I choose number 5
B-I choose number 1
C-I wanna go with letter, so X
A-why letter? It's not fitting beutiful for the name
C-why would it matter u went with I for the previous processor
A-okey and D what u choose
D-I wanna 9
*Intense cards game*
C-Yeah I won, so this processor would be Ryzen 9 8930 X
B-U lucky boy, I only got 3 in this processor
C-Well U won almost all the naming for the previous one which was absurd (Ryzen 5 7410 I)
D-Lets play one more I wanna win the full naming
*Proceed to play another game for the processor's name*
If it's hard for techy people to figure it out, it's bad. Why wouldn't they want people to buy the right thing for them? People being tricked and finding out ends up destroying the brands reputation and association
Money & Greed sir, Every company is guilty of it someway or another unfortunatently
the fact AMD changes the mobile naming scheme every 9 months is a big issue
the latest one with zen version on the third digit is at least comprehensible, but I'd really prefer it to be the first digit
3050 should've been 75W since the day one, but make the chip bigger and clocks much lower to make it efficient!
Nvidia is afraid that if they do that, people will overclock instead of buying the more expensive card, so they redline all their cards all the time
@@blisphul8084 I won't buy a card with external power connector for multiple reasons, but it mostly comes down to cooling
3050 KalmX, even with current config, would be a nice card... when 3050 first released and at a 20% lower price than it's sold now
nowadays we need a civil version of 4000 Ada SFF, no need for ECC, no need for pro features, maybe even cut the memory in half, but the chip config is amazing
Simple solution. Never buy AMD.
zen version as first number makes no sense. 9500 would seem better than 7950
@@blairhoughton7918 that's dumb, we buy what is best or best bang for buck. we dont avoid companies if product names are confusing. Or else you would never buy a monitor in your life.
They looked at Ibanez's naming scheme for their guitar models and said "yeah that makes sense"
lul
intel lithography naming is deceiving at it's best
There's actually a decent reason for the rename at least. Intel shifted their node names to align with the transistor density of other manufacturers. Granted this is still shady, because the shift also means smaller numbers, which are assumed to be better in lithography, and because transistor density isn't actually all that important to a consumer. But like, at least they have a justification for it, as part of moving towards de-facto industry standard tools and measures.
Clicked because Linus is angry
But is he angry on the left or the right, or in the middle?
I clicked purely for this comments 😃
Would you have clicked if the arrow was red?
And on the left!
Maybe next April Fool's Day you could poke fun at it and re-brand your t-shirt sizes so XL (Extra Large) is VNS (Very Not Small) and S (Small) is LS (Linus Sized)
“Medium” could be “LS” or “SL” - “Large Small” or “Small Large”. For bonus points have both!
HL: Half-Linus
LTS - Less Than Sebastian
LSx2 Gen 2, Linus sized times 2 with better material.
I remember when car names had a meaning. BMW 325 was actually a 3 series with a 2.5 l engine, now a 540 was a 3 litre engine
The whole thing is a marketing problem, the technicians themselves make it easy in most cases. If the whole thing goes to marketing, they make something out of it because they simply don't know enough about the technology themselves, the technicians get terribly upset afterward, but that doesn't help either.
100% agreed. I'm a fab researcher at Intel. I see things before they get official names. The Ultra 7 165H was called the Core 7 1465P for a long time. Arrow Lake was the 15xxx series for a while too. I'm pretty sure the feelings over at IFS are almost universal disgust. They took our hard work and decided it needed to be dressed up with a shiny new name to sell well.
If only someone could have seen this coming and built testing infrastructure to test it all and rank it, and provide a nice printout to give to anyone that would go shopping.
And call it cpubenchmark.
Or no, lets call it techpowerup.
No, maybe notebookcheck.
Also wrong, all those names seem so used.
@@hubertnnn Lets call it LTT Labs
Yep, Once people realize that LTT Labs was all for show they would realize those $70 screwdriver purchases were a waste
@@hubertnnn Let's call it AnandTech, TechSpot or Tom's Hardware instead, shall we? Or 3DCenter and PC Games Hardware for our German speaking viewers.
The latter one is my absolute favorite, because not only are they the kings of benchmarking and their articles are great, but also does the print magazine have these really nice top lists for CPUs, GPUs, RAM, PSUs, fans, monitors etc. (with all the important info like price, performance, watts, temperatures, rpm, Sone, ...) Even if you've been out of the loop for a while, you simply buy the latest issue, browse through the lists and check the recommendations and maybe also read the benchmark marathons of the latest GPUs and GPUs, and you instantly know what's what again.
Intel started this with with saying you need an I5 or I7 or I9 without the "version".
This is why I always just hit up cpu benchmark numbers. model numbers mean nothing to me.. ESPECIALLY IN A LAPTOP!
Props to editor, who came up with transition at 6:40
All of these names Suck. They know they can avoid
1. Jumping through hoops to name a processor
2. Running out of numbers by not racing to "9000" and then going "wait sounds really clunky... uh..."
But they don't!
It's completely intentional, because they can keep selling an old CPU gen by making it look like the new one, which is such a uber-asinine way to treat one's customers!!! 🤬They've been doing this a lot in the past with sometimes highly misleading GPU rebranding, too, but Zen 3 CPU was one of the worst examples. Should I get a 5600 U? No, I'll go for the slightly better model, 5700 U. Well, tough luck and have fun with the crappy battery life, because that was a Zen 2! Naming scheme was: 5300 U Zen 2, 5400 U Zen 3, 5500 U Zen 2 etc. Misleading customers like that is downright EVIL! And I guess they want to hide their evildoing by making this p*** take on their own customers a little less obvious.
I literally do the opposite of what they want.
If I don't understand the model number, I don't buy the product.
Thanks for calling this out; I like the 3/5/7/9 series prefix, the architecture generation, then something to indicate the core count, then something for the clock speed, followed by something to indicate integrated graphics or not, then something to indicate if it's unlocked or not for overclocking. I hate companies branding using different numbers for the same architecture generation whether it's laptop or desktop - they should be the same. They shouldn't have AI anywhere in the name. Core and Pentium are unneccesary. AMD's laptop CPU naming sheme is a complete mess now.
The worst thing about AMD mobile is the broken MediaTek wifi adapters they're always paired with that constantly crash the whole laptop.
Blame the laptop manufacturers honestly, they're the one who design the laptop
Must be a deal with intel to not pair their wifi adapters with AMD
@naoyanaraharjo4693 it's a deal between AMD and MediaTek that AMD processors will be paired with MediaTek Wi-Fi adapters. I blame MediaTek though for selling completely broken products like the MT7921 and not even having drivers you can download to fix them. It took me months to troubleshoot and eventually I fixed it by replacing it with an Intel AX200 and from what I've read online it's a very common problem.
@@3dcomrade I bet dollars to donuts that such a deal exists, especially considering Intel's shady and sometimes downright illegal history with OEMs, which is a shame, because the Wi-Fi adapters are pretty damn stable. Well, except for the one in my old PC, which would suddenly disappear like once a year, and only a complete wipe of the driver could bring it back.
0:17 "Yo dawg I heard you don't like ads so I made this ad by using examples of ads for your ad."
Moniter and USB names:"First time?"
As a brand strategist who works at a major agency, I can tell you with confidence that this kind of nonsense will not sell more product. Confusing the consumer does nothing but create chaos and is downright ineffective.
The backwards Intel naming scheme reminds me of the full names of military equipment. What we know as the M1A2 Abrams is in full:
Tank, Combat, Full Tracked, 120-mm Gun M1A2
The M4 is: Carbine, Caliber 5.56mm, M4.
That doesn't bother me because I only look i5, i7 or i9 when I plan to upgrade. Then I'll look at their numbers which still have stayed true to older generation as the higher it goes the better it performs.
AMD switched it around so the first number means something else and that is far worse.
Sorry, but that's very clear. The description tells me exactly what I need to know vs the other stuff. That's backwards done right.
That's just listing the hierarchy. and makes total sense. Going from larger category to smaller category and getting more well defined as you go. It's literally how any sort of orgaanization on a computer or even paperwork works. Look at the breadcrumb car in Windows Explorer for instance, it literally shows you that same hierarchy as you go multiple folders deep. URLs literally work the same way (for the same reason) with the slashes referencing directories. Physical file folders in a filing cabinet.
Listing the hierarchy is not the same as a direct name that's meant to be used in conversation, but it is extremely useful if trying to manage assets and inventory to ensure you are talking about the right thing. You could technically have something with the same generic name, but different categorization from a different supplier that needs to be managed separately.
@@Zefar77This is true, I was not taking a shot at Intel, merely pointing out this observation.
It's a fact that shareholder-first approach to business will ALWAYS prioritize short term gains to *higher* long term gains. There are even studies showing this. It was esp obv after the ruling that made stock buybacks legal. Almost all the money that could go toward R&D is going towards shareholders instead, ever since that ruling.
I guess I'm a weird shareholder in that I want more money later instead of using shares as gambling on the stock market.
But it seems the big fish just use shares as trading cards, nothing else.
I know you said on WAN show that you don't want to make videos like this, but this is so important to keep calling out. You're one of the few good ones who help keep consumers informed when it feels like every corporation is against us. I know it gets frustrating and depressing, but change starts with knowledge.
I love how he markets his stuff mid video without stopping and inconspicuous. GENIUS! 👏👏👏7:29 Was so fire !
I believe I recall intel calling out amd's naming scheme a while ago and getting completely shit on over it.
GN's video was infuriating to watch because of this. Its like one thief calling out another and then him getting clowned on because he's a thief. So much hypocrisy.
Even before that, I remember the presentation where they were demoing that they'd finally managed to release a mobile CPU that wasn't just reheated 14nm Skylake (I think it was either the i7-1065G7 or i7-1165G7) and they kept tripping up over the name of the chip. The number of times the voiceover went "and the Intel core i7... uhh... The Intel Core i7 processor"
I learned a long time ago to never trust naming schemes and just search up the benchmarks for the processors instead. If I know what score of the processor then I know what to expect from it. Combine that with power draw and I get my answer. But then again I have been following tech for much longer than the average person so I can't expect that from them. Companies should do better...
I haven't been following hardware releases for that long (started around the time the first ryzen released). One of the first things that came to mind were "I don't understand what this tech specs or naming schemes mean" and I started looking for benchmarks right away. Later on I realized that not even people who have been following this for longer can always tell which cpu is faster based on naming alone and they refer to benchmarks to make their decisions too.
Even then gotta watch out for "benchmark sites." Thankfully the first results for benchmarks on Google were passmark instead of userbenchmark. That's how i learned (cross-referencing both sites) that userbenchmark were just Intel/Nvidia shills.
And you need to know what kind of load you will be putting on the machine... a single-threaded game is going to be vastly different than a heavily multithreaded rendering job (and that's assuming that it hasn't been moved to the GPU).
This is the far superior name imo (idk if you can check which one i got, so "we're all being played and I'm tired of it")
Didn't feel compelled to click on it but the intro and general stuff was actually interesting. I think you said you were worried about being negative on wan show and tbh this is the stuff i love. But you gotta do what you love I know.
7:30
That might just be my fav ad insert lol
At 6:00 - that's done on purpose. Getting consumers to believe they are purchasing a newer model will first save manufacturers the cost of actually selling a new model. And for the consumer only to find it slower will entice them to purchase yet another device, furthering the profit made. Any potential negative feedback can be disregarded as consumer error.
and the funny thing is, the best website for figuring out how it all works is MSI's, when a company that can profit from the confusion publishes a user guide to understand it, you know you did gone mess up
if i bought something assuming it's good, and its bad
shame on me for assuming
but shame on the seller for not clarifying
I'll be better, but I won't buy from the seller again unless i can understand it
1:29
That ARC logo on the right also a subtle way of marketing 😉
This video is a paramount example why a consumer should absolutely always study up on pcs before owning one, that way you actually understand how ram works, what terms mean this and that when it comes to your overclocking and volting, adjusting fan speeds, etc etc
with this type of development i think i need at least 3 more pc, 1 for general online, 1 for ultrawide, 1 for audio equipment, tbh i want 1 more for competitive titles/high hz gaming but it can be done w benches
aaaand the more the better for audio tbh lol, so yeah 10 more pcs, and it looks near
@@iikatinggangsengii2471 I’ve already been planning my next 7 builds lol 😂
Wow, Riley really went all-out with that sponsor segment. I got flashbacks of earrings/necklaces/watches/luxury cars the moment your face wasn't on screen.
It's a bit of annoying now I have to check components benchmarks in order to ensure I am actually doing an upgrade thanks to confusing nomenclatures.
Excellent video btw.
still trying to understand LG's monitor naming scheme: 27UP, 27UL, 27GL, 27GK...500 600 650 700 800
3:54 for the love of god was that a regular sharpie on that whiteboard?
Acetone to the rescue.
Getting Trident Royal to sponsor a video about misleading branding was genius.
"AMD is misleading you. So is *EVERYONE* else."
>Stares at Linus*
>X-Files Theme Plays*
#LIEnus
#LIEnus
#LIEnus
A good example of the name scheme confusion is the ryzen 5 7520u
Since the inception of ryzen, the ryzen 5 has always indicated 6 hyper threaded cores but the 7520 arbitrarily has just 4 cores, which was originally reserved for the ryzen 3
Not to mention that in 90% of cases ryzen 7000 indicates ddr5 memory - minus the 7730u which uses ddr4…
Ryzen 5 1400 and 1500X were 4c/8t on desktop. And all of the early generation Ryzen laptop CPUs were up to 4c/8t including CPUs like the Ryzen 7 2800H (Zen1) and Ryzen 7 3750H (Zen+). Zen2 was the first one on mobile with 6c/12t Ryzen 5 and 8c/16t Ryzen 7
AMD just wants you to blindling buy Ryzen 9 everything. Their most expensive offering.
Different market segment, but I love Mikrotik's approach to switch and router product names which exactly describe the device's port configuration
Worse than CPU naming schemes is the laptop naming schemes from all the manufacturers, where sufixes mean shit cause the info isn't shared anywhere; yet that info does mean a lot to the consumer (screen (!), ram, storage, keyboard layout they will be getting) and makes comparison between shops much harder.
This was exactly a problem I was having, where I was trying to recommend a laptop for my sister. I know about the AMD naming scheme, but god damn I was still so confused
Notably there's a significant difference between the 7730U and the 7735U, where the 7730U is Cezanne while the 7735U is Rembrandt. They've released the Rembrandt APUs as Ryzen 6000 series (clearly they gave it a different series) but they've also released the Rembrandt as the 7035 series instead of it's own number for architecture??????
I like AMD and I have a full AMD system, but it's shit like this that made me go "Am I doing the right thing?"
You think thats bad? Intel used to allow universal undervolting so you could make your laptop cpu run cooler. AMD never did and still doesn't. Infact, its much harder to undervolt amd's parts on laptops than even intel and nvidia. Nvidia still lets you undervolt and overclock mobile gpu's
i love that they think going from zen 3 to 3+ isnt a big enough step up to warrant a number change and instead they just tack on the 5...
The only thing you can do is choose something that is less bad, and only if you know about how everything is bad first...
@@siyzerix Remember how NVIDIA released a new GPU under the same name as 10 year older model?
Cant find what model was it.
@@illuminoeye_gaming That's the thing! They clearly knew it was a big jump when they released it as 6000 series but they decidedly changed their mind when they updated the naming scheme for no reason!
It's basically akin to snake oil tactics to most casual consumers, and is why more people are getting MacBooks because they came through with such a simple and effective way of naming their product!
6:29 Investor Bait is fantastic term I will be using
This needs to be shouted from the rooftops.
Clarity sells. Confusion doesn't. Even if your PR team tries to sell it that way.
Something a bit Offtopic: But could you make a video about Epyc 4004? A Supermicro H13SAE with an Epyc 4584PX + 128GB ECC would be a really interesting build….
These naming schemes are so confusing that even as tech enthusiasts, I couldn't understand it when I did my research before buying my new PC.
That's why I didn't even bother researching Intel CPUs.
Intel is still pretty straight forward.
The i5 series are budget gaming CPUs. i7 are the stronger gaming CPUs and i9 are the top of the line.
The number goes up and the performance goes up. AMD though seems to have changed that around.
@@Zefar77 Which part wins though? The number or the ultra? Is a core ultra 5 better or worse than a core 7? How about a Core Ultra 3? Which they said they wouldn't be doing, Core would be 3, 5 and 7, and Core Ultra would be 5, 7 and 9, yet the Core Ultra 3 105UL exists
Intel's naming scheme is easy.
If it starts with "Intel" it is crappy.
If it starts with anything else it is also crappy.
@@jamesmicklewright2835As Linus said in the video, “Ultra” just means it has an AI coprocessor. So if you don’t need AI, the Core 5 and the Core Ultra 5 are the same.
@@jamesmicklewright2835 ultra series is still better than AI chips of AMD
can all the CZcamsrs create generic synonyms(naming scheme) for all similar types of products and create a site or something where we can look and easily compare them. if all the influencers work on this, it may take off and the the company naming scheme would be just on launching and you guys can recreate a new name as soon you get your hands on it.
Im working on a benchmark agregator website
now that i could get behind. Cut the bs, compare it to previous parts performance. Everything gets a generic Tier number, year release, and performance number. Call it a disambiguation nomenclature scale. They already do all this testing, why not have LTT do that one final step and save us the pain? new chip comes out- its just an AMD 7 25 8000. an Intel 9 25 7500.
Maybe we should just start describing things by what cores they have?
Like, we just call Ryzen 7 7840H "8-core Zen 4 APU" and Core Ultra 7 155H "6P plus 8E Meteor Lake".
This could also discourage people from wasting money on more expensive versions of the same thing which aren't significantly faster, like the Ryzen 9 8940HS and Ultra 7 165H. There's no reason for there to be so many different SKUs of the same silicon.
@@VelocifyerThe website your building is exactly what Linus is afraid of. Since it would make visiting the LABD website irrevalant.
I'm kinda on his side but at the sametime they seem to not know what the purpose of LABS is outside of random testing of equipment for videos.
My suggestion: [Brand and Series] - [Part type(cpu, gpu, etc.)] - [Architecture] - [Point release] - [Space] - [Year(08,24,etc.)] - [Special Signifier(Ai, doubled up, etc.]
An example being like Apple M CPU 40 24 Ultra. Tells you everything you could need to know in a reasonable order.
To be fair, aren't there all these different SKUs because of chip binning? Having less models while keeping performance consistent would mean throwing away more chips and then increasing the cost. A solution to the naming scheme when there's so many variations would've been a useful addition to the video
i once tried to buy a cover case for my mother's kindle fire that was couple of years old. That was a stressful experience even on Amazon's own website!
Pfft.... Ask technology connections. Walmart has the best dish detergent....
the amount of dishwasher videos i've seen from that man are unfathomable
😂 did not expect this. But lovely comment!
As someone who works in consumer research for dish soap brands, I can attest that we do this to coerce consumers into buying what is more expensive, more often.
Could you imagine coming into this space as a newb? 95% of us know what's going on (except for the laptop fvckery), but I wouldn't want to be a freshman. I'm doing the best I can to teach all of this to my wife, but on several occasions I've caught her sneaking dangerous-looking knives into our game room. Thanks, Linus and LTT for calling out the BS.
PS: More Reilly! Can you maybe get him to do a 20-minute Tim Apple standup segment?
Let's not forget who presses for those kind of shenanigans... OEMs.
They're the ones who need to label "bigger" numbers everywhere on their laptops every year and push Intel/AMD/Nvidia to do this.
That's why this isn't happening on desktops.
how do you know?
also, Nvidia could have created their own laptop company. They have more than enough resources for that
@@TabalugaDragon they say don't mine for gold, sell the shovels. Nvidia almost certainly is better off selling gpus than cannibalizing their own gpu sales by making laptops
7:25 "We say our adjectives first!" Hoo boy, this section was a vision of an alternate universe where Wolfe lost on the Plains of Abraham.
Sometimes, if it ain't broke... Don't fix it.
I became wise to the way they changed suddenly, but I guess I was one of the lucky ones as I actually took time to look at speed and feeds etc. So it was quite apparent.
Still great chips... Insanely bad naming scheme though. Worse than Apple actually.
3:22 So the first number is the year... as a digit sum... Which won't get confusing when we get to 2030 where it jumps from 13 back to 5...
Fortunately AMD is already getting ahead of that by jumping from 8000 to 300. Why not 100 you may ask? No clue, but if Intel has 200 coming up, ours must be bigger number and therefor better, completely forgetting that 10000>200 too.
USB would like its confusion back.
How hard is it to do 1 -> 2 -> 3 -> 4... -> 360 -> One -> Series S/X // -> Ultra 9 285K?
At least the PlayStation is still sane. 1,2,3,4, and 5. But then we have the slim versions.
but then the competition has a bigger number for the generation and the average consumer buys the bigger number. So the cat mouse chase to have the bigger number never ends...it sucks
@@schmitt00 Fairly sure 4 is higher than 'One'.. and I don't even know what to comment on Series S/X vs PS5.. except for.. I need a nice word to insert here.
Though I know AMD plays that number with Intel, and it's horrible.
8:13 even intel says, we cant have a GF..
Processor, what did you think?
hm
i have no idea regarding that matter
The fact that brand new AMD laptop CPUs contain either Zen 2, Zen 3 or Zen 4 architecture is ridiculous
Hey LTT, thanks for making videos about this kind of behavior! I know Linus was down on this video on the WAN show, but it’s important to keeping consumers informed and trying to keep the companies honest. Maybe move this kinda stuff to short circuit?
Well, the biggest culprits are big OEM like Dell, HP, Lenovo, Asus and ... they demand from hardware chip makers to make new models for ewach year, because they want new models every year, to boost their sales. It is getting completely off the control and is not good for consumers.