The Climbing Magnets Mystery (ft. Steve Mould)
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- čas přidán 5. 04. 2018
- When spun on a screwdriver, magnets climb up its length, but why?
This video brought to you by my friend Steve Mould: ve42.co/SteveMould
This all started with a question on twitter, when someone wanted to know why a chain of neodymium magnets climbs up a screwdriver when the screwdriver is rotated. A search for the explanation ensued, culminating in the stick-slip conclusion presented in this video. Let us know what you think in the comments.
My left ear enjoyed the start
I was thinking the same.
And the end.
My right one didn't
Yeah me too
Sounds like the microphone was broken, and the audio was not looked at
ME "Well that's easy to answer..."
Steve "If you turn upside down, it still goes up"
ME "Alright... I still a dumb mf"
In my head, I was already constructing a complicated device to spin it with a smaller radius at the top. Then Steve just turns the screwdriver upside down. Now i feel stupid 😁
Paul Paulson haha, same here. I am sure we would have come to that conclusion briefly though lol.
Guess I am joining your club...it was obvious...and also wrong!
I was thinking the same exact thing. You weren't the only one.
that is a pretty fair explanation, and the most obvious one. specially because it does happen with other things. its damn mindblowing that its actually gravity and not the radius of the spin that makes it move.
Occam's Razor, you betray us once more
Why is this on 2veritasium and not on the main channel?
Steve Mould is High quality content!
Exactly, if you want to get people to check out Steve's channel then show this to 4.6 mil people rather than just .5 mil.
@@robinsparrow1618 5 mil. am i missing something here?
@@TheSmith645 .5 mil
half a million
4.6 is bigger than .5
@@robinsparrow1618 damn i missed the dot before 5
@@TheSmith645 all good
4 seconds into video... "uhm... centrifugal force? How is that not obvious?"
1:00 into the video... "oh... okay... never mind then..."
5:30 "Ooooh! Because gravity! Okay."
Same. I always thought it was centrifugal force.
I am amazed to be wrong about something so simple.
I thought it was Eddy currents (the same thing that happens when you drop a neodymium magnet through a foil tube or copper pipe)
Such an exciting collaboration! And really intuitively explained too- well done ☺️
Marvel: "Avengers Infinity War is the most ambitious crossover event in history"
Veritasium: "hold my beer."
Haha wow I thought exactly the same thing when I saw the title XD
Added Kina we're memers at heart, memers for life
I was literally watching Infinity War videos when I saw this in my Sub.
No Thank You I disagree. Steve Mould is an amazing science guy on CZcams and this is called a collaboration. For main content, you should watch Veritasium not 2Veritasium. However, I do agree that he doesn't seem to give two shits about his content or scheduling these days, just posts when he wants to
It's like Magneto teaming up with Iron Man.
The only think I can think of (haven’t heard their explanation yet) is that magnetic fields have a flow, I think it’s clockwise, that they are acting in. It’s the same reason railguns work, you wind your electromagnets in a way where both magnetic rails have a flow that goes forward towards the tip, and the ammunition is launched that direction. Here, the forces aren’t as extreme, and the magnets don’t have anything to suspend them in open space, so friction stops them from moving, but by spinning it, you’re adding another velocity than just towards the rod, and the magnetic field’s flow makes them roll forward. My thought starts crumbling there though. Dunno if it’s friction that lets it go up, I’m just thinking that the magnets roll and maybe this is why.
Edit: well shit I was waaaay off.
But in order to be certain this theory is correct, it needs to be tested with different variables. For example, magnets with a square cross section instead of a circle, or a change in relative size in either the metal pole (screwdriver) or the magnets to test the "roll and slip" idea.
Well, since there's no symmetry and gravity always biases it upwards... And as it moves around the screw driver, gravity is tipping the magnet roll downwards, only the bottom edge makes good contact and the strip rolls around its end. And it'll have a turning radius pointing upwards, since the "inside" of the turn is always pointing up thanks to gravity. Kind of like if you take a core of a toilet paper roll or any other cylinder, stand it up on its end on a flat surface and apply a fake "gravity" to the top, tangential to the flat surface thereby tilting the cylinder... If you then push the cylinder along such that it rolls on the remaining edge, it'll tend to translate on the surface away from the direction "gravity" is pointing in.
That was my thought anyway, before you pointed out the noise -- though I still think it would work just as well even if it could not slip.
Someone please explain what on earth I just read.
It's still just increasing centrifugal force to the top. The magnets hang to the ground, creating a upward 'track' on the axis.
Steves videos almost always amaze me. This was another great one. Thanks for sharing it with us! :)
Really like Steve Mould's videos. Been following him for a while. Well worth a sub!
Isn't it general relativity and quantum mechanics that don't get along? I'm pretty sure QFT and even the Dirac Equation are perfectly happy with special relativity...
Yeah, at 6:05 he says general relativity, the first time was probably a stick and slip of the tongue ! :P
yes qft = qm + sr basically, its gravity thats the problem, im sure steve knows this prob just a hiccup he didnt catch
As soon as I heard him say that, I hit ctrl+f "special" to see if anybody had commented on it. It's inconsistent with general relativity, but Feynman made special relativity work with quantum mechanics.
I was wondering that myself!
Quantum Field Theory (QFT) is the unification of special relativity and quantum mechanics.
The real challenge is unifying QFT with _general_ relativity.
You can demonstrate it by drawing a line with a marker over the magnets and do a short spin to check it it rotated the way you predicted.
That was a very good explanation, having those models really made it clear what was going on. Great video!
Steve is really awesome. He has the most easy to understand explanations Ive seen.
What if the magnets are square?
I'll test that on monday, I ordered 12mm cubic magnets. If the video is correct, I shouldn't observe the effect !
My thoughts exactly. My guess is that the square magnets won't remain "flat", they will reorient to be diamonds, then process up the screwdriver by the same means on the now-angled side.
I have 130 square magnets here...I could test it now...but I would have to unpack a bunch of the magnets and that's a PITA. I'll just wait and see what Benjamin has to say Monday. ;)
Just leaving this here to get reminded once u answer.
same here
@Benjamin and while you're at it, spin it clockwise and anti-clockwise to check if the created electric field has something to do with it
what a fantastically calming way of speaking
Very good explanation!
I first thought it was the thing he disproved at the very beginning. Basic centripetal force if I'm not mistaking.
Really nice to have my intuition broken and then rebuilt in a better way :)
I love Steve so much. He explains everything so nicely and elegantly that even a 5 year old would understand after a while.
should've painted the magnets on the sides and made another demo that way.
yes, chequermarked magnets and a high speed camera ought to be able to verify this
i miss you derek
Are you a former lover of his?
Dirk from Veritablium
I miss you dalek
GAYYYYYYYYYY
He is at his thirties, he found more perspective things to do.
But yes, his videos are ones of the best on youtube.
Throughout the video, everything I came up with a counter point he almost immediately explained it to my satisfaction. Cool video, thank you. It's always a good day when I can learn something new.
Steve Mould has the best science channel on CZcams. I love the way he explains things
Yep, Steve Mould definitely deserves more subscribers!
FFS I rly thought my headset was broken or smth bcause of the start, you scared the shit out of me, I just bought it a few weeks ago
My headset IS broken, so I couldn't even hear him lmao
WoyablePitt Your keyboard seems broken though, there are letters missing in some of the words...
You think that’s bad?
I was listening on my phone, I thought it had blown the speaker or something... -_-
WoyablePit
What a great video! Very interactive, he was answering my questions rhight after i was aking them.
Fantastic explanation and visual demonstration.
I think he should of tried to prove his hypothesis by using square magnets
I would be curious to see if the same affect is observed with a length of all-thread rod.
To prove this theory about gravity's role in this mystery, we should recreate it on the International Space Station where the impact of gravity is minimal. Reminds me of the feather and hammer experiment on the moon...
You could just hold the screwdriver horizontal so their is no top or bottom quicker and cheaper.
You should have posted this to your main channel. This is a very simple yet very well done video. You could've given Steve far more visibility like that!
Almost wrecked my headphones trying to correct the missing audio channel on Derek, but then Steve came one. Thanks Steve!
So for some reason the right channel/side has no audio for your voice during the introduction... Just FYI.
Updated: @ 6:17 it's the same. Apparently either your mic was/is 'jacked' (pun intended) or maybe just some slight technical difficulties....
Again - Just wanted you to know, because I'm certain your going to get other comments on this the more the video is watched.
It's a mono mic, he recorded or imported it as stereo, so just the left channel got a signal. Happens quite a lot somehow. You'd think people would watch their videos before uploading them...
There is actually some sound on the right channel it's just really quiet. Also yeah, this keeps happening and it's quite annoying.
I am actually watching with one broaken earphone so in the part where derek is talking there is almost no audio, there is definately some audio though like Jack Evans said
Yeah, but it was still really quiet... had to turn the volume all the way up to be able to hear him on the right side.
why didn't he prove his explanation by using square magnets ??
Great vid. Very well explained. Another great Channel to sub to!
I've been subscribed ever since he uploaded the gravity waves video. his content is amazing :D
My first guess was what he said we thought was happening, once he he showed us that it wasn’t the way he was turning the screwdriver, I thought that the magnet could be spinning , and it just roles up the screwdriver but I had no idea why. Great explanation.
But why wouldn’t the magnet rotate the other way around the pressure point, resulting in it becoming on the upper side of the magnet, and make go down?
The momentum of the magnet and the fact that the lowest point of contact is always under the center of gravity of the magnet creates a torque thatwill make it rise, which ever way is up !
Benjamin Herisson oh right, thanks for the explanation.
Jason Karim If this were a problem of just geometry, then yes. But I don't know it would fit in 6 seconds with all the forces and points of contact taken into account.
It's a shorter route for the magnet to rotate up than down. Plus, rotating down would mean the magnet would temporarily go further away from the pole, and it doesn't want to do that.
Eddy currents are also in play in, enforcing the direction of rotation, as the opposite way would fight the eddy currents generating from the rod rotation. You can halt the magnets from pirouetting around the pole, yet the magnets will still rise :)
when I started watching this video, I was like, "It's so obvious", but then you turned it upside down .-.
That strobe effect shot made me wonder... if, rather than spinning the magnets around the pole, you spin the pole and either prevent - or allow - the magnets to spin with it, would they still climb? Great explanation, by the way! I’ve also visited and subscribed to Steve Mould’s channel and now I know I’m not going to get anything done today!!
Magnetic fields have a spin, they rotate from their poles to the plain of inertia, you can look a ferrocel image to see the patern that it creates. The explanation that you give in the video probably is the most accurate to describe this phenomenon. Nice video ;).
So if we do the same experiment on the ISS (where there is no gravity) magnets don't "climb" on the stick. Correct?
Gino Giotto they should not, no,
Just a correction, there is gravity on ISS, but it's just constantly falling as it revolves around earth. It's a microgravity environment.
...or just hold the screwdriver sideways.
To prove your theory, I think you should make same experiment with rectangular cuboid magnet.
*Puts it sideways.
*Magnet flies to space.
Now we need someone in the ISS to do this experiment. Logic tells the magnets will just spin around. Probably will move up or down depending on little "vertical" movements if done by hand, since it's rather impossible to keep all axis fixed when done by a human hand.
Steve could have proved this hypothesis by spinning the magnets around a horizontal screwdriver. The result being they move in neither direction.
if the screwdriver stayed level, it shouldn't move at all
Suddenly very aware of Derek's mortality. Looks like he's aged 15 years since his last upload
because it was 15 years ago
I recommend 1.25 speed for easier viewing :) great video! It's satisfying to get such a nice explanation for a beautiful little phenomenon like that.
Wow! I was expecting this to be a fairly lame video boiling down to the tilt of the screwdriver, but I WTFed when he did it upside-down. The stick-slip explanation is gorgeous and unexpected.
This video makes me want a new adjective meaning "seemingly lame at first glance but surprisingly interesting." :)
Now build one space elevator using that :3
Yes!
lmao genius
I like the idea, but how would you get down? Also, wouldn't it take a ridiculous amount of energy to spin something that massive?
Horrible idea.
"yeah, let's introduce a destabilizing oscillation effect into a 35,000 km orbital tether" What could go wrong?
azdgariarada What are you talking about? Spinning the tether would make it *more* stable, in fact that's how some of the first satellites were launched. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spin-stabilisation
S T I C C AND S L I P P
Wow such a great and clear explanation!
I agree, satisfying explanation! Nice job fellas.
To be played at 1.25x
wwwKx 1.5x
Saved my day
Thank you
Those are rookie numbers.
Too perfect with 1.25x
I have no sound at all when you're speaking
Do you only have a left speaker?
I do, but it may be broken ^^
Yes, but it was off (the balance was set to "all right") for an unknown reason ^^
That's funny, this video helped you troubleshoot your pesky speaker issues. V2 FTW
Bastien Durel I think left
It would be great to see more videos from you, Derek. When I heard the Community Tab was going to be rolled out to all creators with 10K subscribers and up, I also thought it would be perfect for someone like you whose video style doesn't allow for frequent uploads to keep in touch with subscribers _in between_ uploads.
Beautifully explained!!
Before hearing the explanation, my guess is that it's because of the greater momentum/centrifugal force being at the top, where the swing is the largest. It's being pulled toward the greater force.
But after watching, the rotation and slipping of the magnets does appear to be the best explanation. Now, will square magnets exhibit the same climbing action? I suspect they would. And maybe do to my original hypothesis. Maybe.
Your initial (not original) hypothesis was the one he explained at the beginning of the video and which he quickly showed was false by turning the screwdriver upside down. Did you and the people who liked your comments even watch the video?
i mean, i haven't really seen the video yet but from what he's shown so far im reminded of when i used to do that using a pencil and a ruler and watch it rise from the bottom and go flying off
Oliver Reichenbach If like me they all thought the transition to the second video was going to be the explanation, and were told to make a guess before the explination, then why would you accuse them of not watching the whole video?
Square magnets wont work, but they should straighten themselves when starting at a 45 degree angle (and slightly rise in the process) according to this explanation
Lenz's law, change of flux in metal screwdriver hence eddy current in screwdriver which in turn oppose magnetic field of neodymium magnets, causing them to rise.
If what you say is true, it should move downwards if the screw driver is supn the other way
This can‘t be the reason, because if your argumentation would be true it wouldn‘t rise up in the experiment where he holds the ruler against the magnets. In that experiment there is no change of flux.
Even when there's a scale relative motion existed between magnet and screwdriver. As the point of contact keeps changing there is still a possibility of formation of eddy current. Might be wrong, but it's just a thought.
Gravity MUST play a part, or the chirality of spin and orientation of the screwdriver would matter
Instead, we see the magnets always traveling against the force of gravity
Lenz's law states that the emf is induced in such a way, so as to neutralize its cause. According to this if we are rotating clockwise Lenz's law should make rotate counterclockwise. It has nothing to do with up and down.
WOW! Very cleverly worked out. Thanks
I’ve been subscribed to Steve Mould for about 18months or so I guess and I love his channel as much as I love yours. Nice to see you supporting other youtubers. But you haven’t replied to my email and it’s been like 2years or so. No problem though. I’ll keep waiting, you must be really busy.
Hmm haven't we all tried this with a pencil and some kind of ring when we were little? But I guess putting magnets into anything will make it cooler.
Exactly my thoughts! Spinning a ring around a pencil makes it rise up too.
nope it just makes it go away from your hand. If you try spinning it upsite down, it'll just fall
Except those two things have nothing do do with each other and do not even show the same effect.
I feel like with the right 3D animation this could've been explained in about 6 seconds instead of six minutes.
but it will take 60 minutes to make instead of 6 minutes XD
chan yoon jun lol
but with already over 14k views you would save more collective time.
save 5 minutes 14k times by once spending 50 minutes more would have been a good trade off
Yeah but I prefer this hands on explanation
More like 600 minutes to make, not 60.
Superb explanation!
nice vid kirk i love your aequitaserum channel
I got the idea that the weight was bearing more on the bottom than the top, but didn't know where to go from there. Good video.
So it wouldn't work if it was oiled? Or if the magnet was curved the same shape as the rod?
Just tried with spherical magnets and they go down.
Jokes on you, I'm already subscribed. I love both of your content :)
Great explanation of this phenomenon
That's pretty rad, gj dude!
Great explanation!
So clear when he explains it!
Very cool explanation...
Well the explanation is far simpler than what I had imagined. I was thinking of something long the lines of electromagnetic induction (moving magnet + wire = current, current + changing magnet field = force, although thinking about that now it'd probably cancel itself out).
Omg wow... I totally thought that it was because of that flinging motion of the spinning. This is actually really amazing haha!
Hi all, I'm the OliReading who first came across this strange phenomenon - that's my tweet to Steve Mould you can see 30 seconds into the video. Very pleased it's stimulated so much discussion here, and quite pleased that the solution Steve gives is not a very obvious one!
Take a look at my twitter feed @OliReading, and also check out some of my neat magnet art at instagram.com/oligettingcrafty/
Great find!
You and the team need to pass this one on to the space station for examination in low gravity.
Nice work.
You could just hold the screwdriver horizontal so their is no top or bottom quicker and cheaper.
Wow wow wow... Excellent explanation. My mind was blown away. THIS is called a scientific study
It'll be interesting to see them do this experiment on the ISS
You could just hold the screwdriver horizontal so their is no top or bottom quicker and cheaper.
this topic should be revisited. a WAY to observe whether the magnets are also 'rotating' is NEEDED. cheers
Once he started talking about how it slips, I just started thinking that the magnets were spinning up it, as well. It's handy sometimes to have a natural understanding of how things work.
Oh, and I hope you get more rest, Derek. You looked like you hadn't been getting much sleep or were sick when recording this. Best of luck.
"PIVOT! PIVOT! PIVOT!! PIVOOOTT!!!"
Great video :D
It's so easy to explain, that I can't explain it to be understood by you. Outward momentum is bigger at the top because the movement you make is like a cone that's bigger at the top and smaller at the bottom.
This is amazing!
really smart explanation!
You couldnt have explained that any better...you are good
this was fascinating!
Is it possible that induced eddy currents with a counter vailing force are playing a role as well? We need to try this with square magnets
Steve Mould should be mentioned on the main channel.
He deserves that, I'm sure!
That was a fun one. I'm rather dim... but the explanation seems to match up with what I had in mind :) neat. May have to show this one to the kids.
As soon as he mentioned the pressure at the contact points, my brain lit up like a solar flare.
Thank you for this video. The explanation makes sense and was well delivered. But the role that gravity plays suggests that it wouldn't work sideways or on the ISS... Any way those versions could be included in a follow up video?
SO if you were to reduce the friction this effect should not happen? would be a nice test to prove the hypotesis, if a nice lubricant was applied to the screwdriver than it should at the very least slow down the ascending movement right?
Love you content!
I conveniently just finished rewatching Walter Lewin’s lecture around angular momentum. I’m sure you remember it. I imagine the same principles apply here? Ah, I just finished watching. Lol! I love counter intuitive puzzles. Thanks for sharing!
another cool example of how audio can be used to help solve physics problems. We can hear faster than we can see and there are many problems worth examining with sound along side visuals
I also suspect the same principle that a drill works on whatever that motion is called, it draws the magnets up somehow in the same way that a corkscrew does but uses magnetic forces instead. With both the rotating actions at work it also would be interesting to see theorize is this would be practical for a high rise elevators or even possibly to space.
hey does it have something to do with eddy currents?
I want to see Tadashi Tokieda solve this problem. He has always the coolest ways to really show and solve the solution.
That's pretty cool, especially the one with the drill