The Westland Wyvern; Outdated Monster
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- čas přidán 18. 04. 2024
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I can't decide how to feel about the Wyvern. It is simultaneously a beautiful bird with graceful lines and a warlike stance, while also appearing like something a daydreaming schoolboy doodled in his notebook while counting the seconds to the last period bell.
Any fan of counter rotating props will like it. Cheers!
@@shauny2285👍👍👍
Love flying it in war thunder
Been there, done that.
Agreed. I think it's a great looking aeroplane!
Ejecting under water must have been a hell of an experience.
Guess that’s the real reason they gave the backseater a periscope…
Ejecting over water is hard enough.
Oh yeah. And he had an aircraft carrier directly above him
Now there's a headache in itself.
@@tonymarsh8436 I have to wonder how he avoided the carrier's propellers.
@@danielkemp4860 That was only on the trainer that was never produced.. but that joke would have been amusing if it was a produced model
heard an anecdote of the Wyvern test pilot suffering an engine failure, landing in a field, coming to a stop with no damage and catching his breath, then saw the stick jerking left and right. looked down the wing and the farmer was whacking the aileron with a stick. he'd already told the local flying club they didn't have permission to land there
Aaaaaaannnndddd here comes the War Thunder PTSD. I hear that turboprop whine and start praying
The whine is both the most annoying and terrifying sound to hear in game
I absolutely despise this thing in war thunder, you can find the worst players using this, it's got airspawn, minimizing it's low-er acceleration, and goes easily 700km/h in the deck while fighting P-51 D10/30 Bf109 G-2/6/10 ... J21(all propeller powered variants) and whatever the japanese, soviets and italians have at ~br 4.0
My FAVE plane to use in WT! 🤘
@@badllama8090 I hate you!!!!
This is effectively the UK equivalent of the Skyraider. It's ironic that such aircraft were considered obsolete in the mid 1950s, yet 10 years later, Skyraiders were performing sterling service in Vietnam in the COIN role. I wonder if the RAF ever regretted cancelling their order for the Wyvern?
I'm curious if the UK had not scrapped the Malta's I wonder if that would have bee enough to keep the Wyvern around (though simultaneously, it could have doomed it further if someone else had come up with a jet attack craft earlier)
More like a competitor to the A2D Skyshark a turboprop evolution of the Skyraider.
The Skyraider hung around for a long time because it could be used from both USN and Marine Essex class carriers still in use in the 60's and 70's.
The British had the Harrier in service from 1969 fully capable of operating from the smallest RN carriers making prop and turbo prop aircraft obsolete.
The Skyraider was finally retired just 2 years after the Harrier was adopted by the US Marines.
@@themanformerlyknownascomme777
RN had the Sea Hornet in service at the same time as the Wyvern. Although they could handle a slightly smaller payload, they were cheaper to operate and far more reliable. It’s notable that RN deployed Sea Hornets to the Malay emergency, not Wyverns.
@@Ushio01 Correct about the Skyshark, but I'm thinking more about the role than the technical spec. Skyraider and Wyvern were both large, prop aircraft designed originally as torpedo bombers.
There's a big gap between 1957 (Wyvern out of service) and 1969 (Harrier into service), and Harriers weren't routinely operated from carriers by UK forces until the Sea Harrier entered service with the FAA in 1980(?).
Skyhawks and Crusaders operated off Essexes too, so the "smallness" of their decks (they were only really "small" by US standards: plenty big to everyone else!) wasn't the prime reason for keeping Skyraiders around. In any case, I was thinking more of the land-based USAF/SVAF COIN role that Skyraiders undertook.
They might have regretted it but the RAF didn't have the money.
I love the Wyvern it was always a favourite of mine, I think it's really attractive
Irony 😅
@@michaelleslie2913 no Michael,no irony,fact
OK mate was just checking 😅👍
She’s a looker all right..Certainly an amazing design..
The strange transitional period from the end of WW2 1945~1950 -
- inc aircraft too late for service - or which turned out to be technological 'dead-ends ' or redundant
--- is a period that tends to be overlooked by most Aircraft historians -- so hats off to you Ed for this interesting video. ✌😎
A universe where jet engines weren’t developed for an additional 10/20/30 years would be a fun setting for a book
@@DefaultProphet A universe where the romans developed flight - would be equally as novel --- (pardon the pun)
One of the best looking IMO of that era. Another classic case of constantly moving goalposts from the original. Strange how the Double Mamba with Contra rotating props was so succesful in the Fairy Gannet from around the same period.
Seriously ? Looks like they kept raising the cockpit every time they lengthened the nose .
On the other hand it was a truly lethal aircraft, killing many of its pilots.
@@user-yt8gu1cl5x From memory, a sizeable number of British and American aircraft proved exceedingly lethal to their crews in those days. Probably goes for Russian aircraft too but the truth will be hidden! The Cutlass and Scimitar spring to mind, both cut down many pilots if you'll excuse the pun.
Brest looking?
Despite it's protracted development, this is among my favorite planes. My fantasy hangar would park the Wyvern right next to my Douglas Skyshark.
I once read that a big issue with the Wyvern was that the turbine engine would be throttled way back for landing, like a piston engine. If something happened that required aborting the landing and executing a go-around, the engine took some time to "spool up" again after full throttle was applied. This meant full power was not immediately available, as with piston engines, and this was a critical concern.
The engines were modified with overspeed and underspeed fuel governors that kept the engine running at more or less a constant speed, with the propeller running at flat pitch. Full power then happened much more quickly, with the prop governor regulating speed.
I feel the same way about late-WW2 prop fighters as I do about suits of Renaissance armor: Tech that peaked just as it went redundant.
I’ve seen the prototype at the fleet air arm museum, bigger than you think, shame no service variants were preserved
Essentially only two years in frontline service…an expensive failure by any standards. Ed Nash = the oracle of obscure aircraft. Another fascinating video. Thank you.
Governments love spending other people's money. This aircraft is proof!
@@58fins I think you will find that the British government was mostly in the process of doing the opposite: they were accidentally bankrupting their aircraft industry with unmatched efficiency.
A hideously beautiful aircraft.
Meanwhile they were doing just fine with the Sea Fury.
The F-35: "9 years? Hold my beer." * 25 years later * "I think I'm done."
Crash after hover anyway
The F-35 was made as 3 in one while at lessened strife between US/Russia so the project slowed down
A really beautiful plane. I still prefer the old prop´s about jets. Thank you for the presentation of this dinosaur.
Way back in the early 70s I built a number of the Frog kits because of the sheer look of the beast. It took a lot of years but I eventually managed to direct import 2 examples from Russia (ex Frog/Novo moulds wth no box/instructions/decals). After hunting them for so long I've never found the heart to actually build the damn things! Still a beast though!
My late neighbour who used to live across the road from me had his first job as an engineer for Westlands working on the Wyvern. He reckoned he spent near 18mths up at boscombe down and other facilities following the prototypes around, whilst they tried fixing problems with them.
He used to visit the FAA once a year, as he told me, to "reaquaint himself with old friends."
I admit having a soft spot to this aircraft, I really like its looks.
One of my all time favourite ugly/beautiful planes. Up therexwith the Gannet and Skyraider
Thanks Ed. When you see this in the flesh it's a monster of an aircraft . I 'm only an hour away from RNAS Yeovilton and the aircraft is in bare metal . It may have been a failure but the RR Eagle is a magnificent piece of engineering. Thankyou Ed.
Anyone interested in the ejector seat should read Doddy Hays book The man in the hot seat which mentions the aquatic ejection escape in the final chapter.
I can remember seeing these aircraft flying as a young child, along with Gannets, when we went as a family on holiday to the coast. At the time I thought Wyverns were a development of the Spitfire, because the planform of the wings was very similar.
One of the most beautiful aircraft ever built!
Kind of reminds me of the Piper PA-48 Enforcer, looks-wise.
I really like a lot of these kind of quirky British aircraft. Wyvern, Lightning, Vulcan, Hunter, Buccaneer etc.
Still its amazing how quickly Soviets managed to advance compared to brits im aviation knowing that first really successful jet fighter mig 15 was using copy of the Nene and next model mig 19 was basically way above anything Britain had to offer.
@@cactuslietuva it really is given that the British made that engine. The soviets apparently had more German engineers.
@@cactuslietuvaThe brits had no money unfortunately, and limited ambition after the war.
@@TheBenchPressMan well they empire and exploitation of other nations crumple completely after ww 2.
@@TheBenchPressMan The Air museum youtube channel episode about the hunter (my favourite) talks about that.
My father was in the FAA and said the Wyvern was disappointing , it had directional stability problems and " couldn't loose a Sea-Fury !" cutting edge technology and interferance by Ministry of Supply !!! love the looks of it though , I can see parallels with the Douglas Skyshark , another beast of a plane .
I think that has to be the inside story ie the Wyvern just wasn’t very good in its own terms. As others have noted the Skyraider was on paper more outdated, yet served very successfully in the earlier part of Vietnam.
Amazingly (considering its short service time and lacklustre performance) There is a surviving example of the Wyvern in the RN Fleet Air Arm Museum, Yeovilton. But it is one of the piston engine prototypes and [I believe] never actually flew.
Thank you for a wonderful video about an aircraft that I had very little knowledge about. You have remedied that situation.
Great presentation, I always thought that early jets did not have the bomb capacity of prop aircraft. The Skyraider being in service for many years doing a similar job to that intended for Wyvern. This is a blast from the past as I was really impressed with the old 1/72nd Frog W Wyvern kit I built in my teens. I built mostly Airfix, but Frog produced many unusual RAF and FAA aircraft that Airfix didn't
The legendary Eric ‘Winkle’ Brown, I believe stated the Wyvern was ‘very nearly a very good aircraft’. Praiseworthy from a RN Test Pilot who flew more Types and holds more records than any British aviator.
The one that got away ... I was never able to get my dirty hands on a 1/72 kit of this to beat it into a lump of glue and paint. A lucky aircraft, so to speak.
I lusted after a model of this aircraft for 30 yrs, and finally got one! Love this plane. Always thought it looked like a big, brutish strike or COIN platform. As another person commented, it would have been useful in Korea or SE Asia.
I don't remember ever seeing footage of Wyverns in flighr before. Thanks for the video. Now I must make the Frog model I've had for the last thirty years.
I think a little unfair on the Wyvern…Rolls Royce keep cancelling engines didn’t help Westland. But as other commenters have said in the same performance range as the Skyraider which was kept in USN fleet service longer. Obviously not a fighter but a reasonable strike aircraft for the warm wars of the 1950s.
I once heard that a camel is in fact horse that was designed by a committee.
From it's outward appearance I can only assume the Wyvern was itself designed by a similar committee.
That is a gorgeous airplane.
Great video of one of my all time favourite aircraft. Excellent footage from operation muskateer that I'd never seen before ty!
Nice one Edd. I've always liked the look of the Wyvern.
Good video, Ed. I'd just add to your list of reasons why the Wyvern was pushed into service as simply to keep much needed jobs in the post-war era. But there's nothing that odd about a non-jet attack plane in naval service in the 1950's. The A-1 Skyraider served with the US Navy into the mid 1960's!
I notice that the narrator did not mention the development of the Fairey Gannet in this video. Surely the Gannet had something to do with the thinking processes of the big wigs when it came to this aircraft? It started development in 1949, entered service in 1953 and stayed in service until 1978.
I've been waiting for this, my favourite British prop aircraft.
Love your channel man. Thanks for all of your work.
good looking plane!
YES!
FINALLY!
I have been waiting SO long for this video.
Thank you, Ed. Truly the pinnacle of fighting prop planes.
To be fair, she looks more like a long-running, prototype/experimental program. Just looking at her, there are a lot of things being tried on one plane, not all had a future ofc. Like a Kangaroo mated with a Seafire to my eyes. Thanks Ed.
_'kyaayyjuutainpartaal Ed'
Underwater ejection!? Top man! Wet balls of steel. I assume he waited for the carrier to clear from overhead, before triggering the ejection sequence…..
BOINK!!
In that terrifying situation I don't suppose he had many alternative options.
Been waiting for this one. Thanks Ed! Legend.
Excellent vid - occasionally thought a decent vid on the Wyvern was so worthwhile. And the aircraft - not pretty but very attractive imo. More focus on development - stick to turboprop, push hard for the engine dev from either AW or RR and sorting out that flame out. And the FAA might've had a decent fighter/attack for the late 40s/early 50s and in op for Korea vs the Sea Furys et al that did operate. A decent bridge to jets anyway if it was available from 46ish.
Hello from Cleveland Ohio! Excellent video . Look into the history of the Cleveland Air races.
Never mind. We got the Blackburn Buccaneer which to this day is the best naval strike aircraft of all time.
Under water egress. AcesII in the F15 today has the canopy integrated into the seat top itself.
I wounder if under water ejection would work on the f15 or it would dragged the pilot down too far before the canopy can deploy.
Great looking and a beast, one of Teddy Petters finest, just the wrong time….
Now that I think about it, I would absolutely love to see a video on the Suez Crisis by Ed!
Aeronave Muito bonita! Muito interessante! Grato pelo vídeo 🌟
BEAUTY is in the eye of the beholder...
Or beer holder...
It has a resemblance to the tucano. Could have been a long server as a training system or cheap fighter
Underwater ejection! Do you get a snorkle instead of a tie?
A Wyvern with a Centaurus 373 at 3,220 hp could have been in service in say 1948, which would have made more sense. Integration of the Python could have continued as a trials project.
Contra-rotating props, gull wings, dramatic, swooping lines... Straight out of Crimson Skies
Great video!
My late father was an armourer on these with 831 sqn on Ark Royal,I have some old photographs but have never seen actual footage of carrier ops before so many thanks.
Thank you for another excellent video!
a great very interesting video and aircraft Mr.Ed.have a good one Mr.
This has always been one of my favourites. Weird but also cool looking, and it certainly looks the part with a load of rockets slung under it.
A very handsome aircraft. I wonder why it wasn't kept as a ground attack aircraft? Further, the notable efficiency of a turboprop over a piston or full jet would have presented some advantages, surely, with its longer loiter times?
You are right that the Royal Navy was desperate for a replacement for the torpedo strike Blackburn Firebrand which were getting worn out and short of spares as Blackburn had moved on and carrier aeroplanes get a real pounding in use. There were not yet missiles to hit Soviet cruisers from a distance so a torpedo strike aeroplane was their principal surface fleet weapon to combat the Soviet navy in northern waters. Hence the Wyvern was the Royal Navy’s principal weapon against the Soviet fleet.
Great work, as usual. Mahalo for your work and Aloha!
Very informative and interesting, really was. Thank you 🎉
Looks a bit like the forerunner to the Tucano, PC-9 and similar styles.
Oh hey, it's the scourge of 4.3 ARB
Great vid , kind of resembles the crop duster conversions flying around now, with that stance and prop set up😅
The Ag Cat goes to war ! --- What a beautiful plane.
One of my favorites in War Thunder.
Great video, Ed...👍
one of my favourites
Wonderful aircraft
Hornet, SeaFury, Wyvern all very impressive but forgotten in the light of the jet age...
Hey, a plane I've actually heard of!
I love this channel!!!!
Excellent!
Wyvern Torpedo Fighter?
80 years later, that seems oddly appropriate!
Always enjoyable.
Awesome thanks
I want one.
But just imagine this as a competitor to the Skyraider. As a turboprop one could even argue that is could have even been developed into many other roles. Perhaps even better than that champion of role change, the Skyraider.
Hi Ya' Ed'? It's tRICKy! I've long appreciated your work, and thank you for your military service, commitment, & guts! Seeing what appeared to be rocket rails in one photo' here, it occured to me that I can't recall ever seeing rockets being fired "at sea", from Naval aircraft! Is such the case? I know of rocket barges, and firing of them to cover amphibious landings only.
That's great information.
The Douglas Skyshark comes to mind, which was a bust. I suppose the Brits didn't see a need for a bomb truck, _ala_ the Skyraider. The Wyvern looks like it would have been quite a hauler.
love it
Good video. Prop aircraft will rule for ..ever ..Doh!
8:25 Ah, this must be the origin of the expression ‘Siphon the Python’. I always thought it meant something completely different….😊
During that period, the jet engine have short range and not reliable for Navy usage. US navy also continue to support research on propeller aircraft and skyraiders continue to be use until the 1960s.
Whatever the plane had for problems, you can't just not be awed by that tail-fin. Very weird bloody-mindedness got this behemoth into service.
Another post war propeller aircraft I didn't know about like the Sea Fury which I wonder how they would match up with red flag exercises type
In the Reno air races I do not see turbo props because of the spool up and down times but do wonder why power settings cannot be done with different blade pitching and aero breaking, they must know something I do not
I love the jet in all is types
Thank you for this good informative video
I always wondered why the specification for this aircraft wasn't just for an attack aircraft like the skyraider what's ironically did spawn a (unsuccessful)turboprop powered version called the A2D Skyshark
Oh man this thing howls like Henry hoover and flies fast in War Thunder😁😁😁
Does a video on the P4M-1, 1Q or P2V Neptunes interest you? The early 5f and 6f series are interesting and amazing looking aircraft.
Only ever seen one but it didn't run sadly
Just imagine they had chosen the Crecy to run the MK 1 with the Crecy ! UUUUÄÄÄÄHH!! UUUUÄÄÄÄHH!!
The doom dyson!