"What Is Singular They?": Oregon State Guide to Grammar
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- čas přidán 31. 05. 2022
- This video describes the rise of “they” as a singular pronoun, showing how it solves a grammatical conundrum and then comparing it to the transformed usage of “you” in the 17th century. Written and performed by Senior Instructor J.T. Bushnell, it is designed for high school and college students studying grammar, writing, or linguistics.
The School of Writing, Literature, and Film at Oregon State University sponsors this series. For further explanations of grammar issues and writing tips, please subscribe to the free SWLF CZcams Channel or visit liberalarts.oregonstate.edu/w.... In the comments section below, feel free to suggest other terms you would like us to cover. Liking, sharing, and commenting on these videos will help us to build a rich digital learning environment around grammar and language.
Below are a few more videos in this series. If there are topics you'd like to see us cover in the future, please let us know in the comments!
"What Is Grammar?": • An Introduction to The...
"What Is a Noun?": • "What Is a Noun?": Ore...
"What Is a Verb?": • "What Is a Verb?": Ore...
"What Is a Subject?": • "What Is a Subject in ...
"What Is a Predicate?": • "What Is a Predicate i...
“What Is a Phrase?”: • "What Is a Phrase in G...
“What Is a Clause?”: • "What Is a Clause in G...
“When to Use Commas”: • "When To Use Commas": ...
“When NOT to Use Commas”: • "When NOT to Use Comma...
“What Is the Oxford Comma (And Is It Really Optional)?”: • "What Is the Oxford Co...
"What Is Passive Voice?": • "What Is Passive Voice...
"What Is Parallelism?": • "What Is Parallelism?"...
"What Is Gender-Neutral Language?": • "What Is Gender-Neutra...
“What Are Dialects?”: • "What Are Dialects?": ...
“What Is Code-Meshing?”: • "What Is Code-Meshing?...
“How to Use a Semicolon”: • "How to Use a Semicolo...
“How to Use a Colon”: • "How to Use a Colon": ...
“How to Use Apostrophes”: • "How to Use Apostrophe...
“What Is a Comma Splice?”: • "What Is a Comma Splic...
“What Is Syntax?”: • "What Is Syntax in Gra...
"What Is Mood in Grammar?": • "What Is Mood in Gramm...
"What Is (AND ISN'T) Standard Written English?": • "What Is (AND ISN'T) S...
As a french student in english litterature studies, your videos are really making this whole mess a bit easier, thank you for your help !
Thanks so much, IUG! We are delighted to hear you are enjoying the videos!
If you enjoyed our video, please give it a like, ask a question, or give us your thoughts. Thanks for watching, everybody!
Oregon State University School of writing and you can't even create a correct sentence without implementing your left wing narrative of singular use of plural pronouns. The correct sentence would be "If a writer cares about grammar, then a correct use of pronouns is important to the syntax of the English language." They is plural not singular and you can use vocabulary to explain things rather than using "they" as plural to appease the cultural Marxists you employ at OSU.
You already referenced who you are talking about when you started the sentence off with "If a writer" so why would you need to refer to the writer twice in the same sentence?
Heather and Dan went for a walk to the park. Dan was deciding what they should eat while Heather was on their phone when all of the sudden they said to they, "take a look at them!" They turned around as fast as they could to see what they was talking about but they had no idea. At this point they was very confused and decided that they needed a coffee and asked if they also wanted a coffee. They said no and that they would go get a beer instead. Heather realized they need some cash for a tip and asked Dan so they lent them a couple of bucks. After their drink they went to the mall to finally get lunch.
"You" is different. In many languages the plural form is used when addressing a higher ranking person. My native Finnish has no gender, but in regular speech "he/she" (hän) is often referred to as "it" (se). Languages evolve.
Thanks for adding to this story, Wilhelm! We're excited to hear how other peoples and languages deal with these problems!
The "you/You" example is also known as The T-V distinction! comes from the Latin pronouns tu and vos.
I found your channel and I'm loving these videos so much! Thank you!
Excellent! Thanks so much, Fernanda!
Thank you for this. I used to be a stick-in-the-mud about grammar but then I listened to a Great Courses Plus lecture series about the history of language by John McWhorter and finally understood why that position was unhelpful at best. Education really is a vital key to breaking misconceptions.
Thanks so much for your thoughtful comment, Chryss!
Great lecture
Thanks so much, Smriti! We hope you enjoy the other videos in the series as well!
awesome! Thanks!
Thanks so much, Jerika! We hope you enjoy the other videos in this series as well!
So, when you're conjugating verbs for singular "they", do you conjugate them as you would for 3rd person singular (i.e. "they is") or for 3rd person plural (i.e. "they are")? "They is" sounds pretty strange to me, although I suppose it could be useful to differentiate singular "they" from plural "they".
Great question, Ben! The way that most people are using the word (we are going for description here rather than prescription) is to conjugate according to plural conventions (e.g. "Someone left their shoes on the beach today. They are going to have sore feet when they get home.")
Hold on question, didn’t we as the english speaking society, & even most educated filmmakers, article writers, & manual makers, already just casually, instinctively, or offhandedly use singular-they in everything they wrote, like for example in a users manual, or when referring a user/player in a video game manual, as “they” everywhere within that manual? So as to apply to whoever was going to use their product?
Even if maybe slightly incorrect at the time, it was already common use no?
Cuz it’s way simpler than typing out he/she every single time no?
Yes! The use of singular "they" certainly has a fairly long history. Thanks for keeping the conversation going, @SaveDareDevil-Mx !
As a Portuguese speaker, it was confusing not to know how to address neutral words such as "person", for Portuguese is a binary gender language and, for example, "person" is feminine and we use she/her to replace it. So, I would find it confusing how to refer to such words. I didn't know how to research it and tried many ways until I found out about "they". I had never noticed before its use, but after finding out about it, I observed its use in many books. Now I think it's easier for me to express myself. I've also found this usage in a Merrian Webster article and it said that it's older and could be found, for example, in Emily Dickinson's letter, in the 1800s.
Thanks so much for your thoughtful comment, Fernanda! Gendered languages operate in a very different way from ungendered languages when it comes to singular pronouns and nouns. In the United States, for example, there are debates circulating about the use of "latinx" as a possible gender-less form of "latino" or "latina." That new word sounds quite strange (and rather tough to pronounce!), but given the fact that within the US, an ungendered language of English operates alongside a gendered language of Spanish, it isn't surprising to see that efforts to make one language (English) more equitable encourages people to attempt similar things in another commonly spoken language here (Spanish).
You do say that the "singular they" is used for "everyday language." If you're writing a business letter or a document to distribute to your students, do you personally use "they" or "he" in this situation? I have been resistant to accept the "singular they," but might reconsider. Is it a bit like "gonna"? (e.g., "I'm gonna take the train.") OK for casual speech or texting, but not for a document you'd give to your boss?
I'd say it's fine for a formal document, especially if you're talking generally about a person or people. If it's a memo in which you talk about a business' clients, "they" seems ideal since someone of any gender can be a client, and it's not restricted to a single person. "They" is generally accepted as grammatically correct, so unless your boss is really pedantic and resistant, they probably wouldn't even notice, because it's so natural.
Thanks for jumping in here, catboy descartes (a sentence we never thought we would write--what a name!) Colleen, we agree with this response. It may seem odd at first (it certainly was for us, having grown up and gone to university in an earlier era), but it is now perfectly formally correct.
The singular "they" is precedented by Wm. Tyndale in his English translations of the Bible way back in the 16th century.
Thanks so much for sharing more information on the history of this word, Matthew!
Is the person an amalgamation of two or more persons? In that case, I would use "they". If not, the person can select from the singular pronouns "he", "she", or "it".
But “it” even more grammaticaly incorrect due to (for some reason) implying them to be an inanimate object (we need to get one of those neo pronouns instead, “zhe” has none of those problems, but it sounds to similar to she, and “e” is to easy to miss due to being so short so realy “they” is the best option)
I am an effeminate gay male who came out in my 20s in the 1980s, except to my parents. When my mother would ask me who I was going out with on a Saturday night, I would always say a friend of mine from school and only refer to him as "them" to hide his bio-sex. Years later, when I was "out" to my mother, she told me that she guessed I was trying to hide things from her by my use of "they/them" pronouns. The use of "they" as a singular has become more common since the 1960s. And when the actual bio-sex or trans-gender of a person is unknown (like in the video's example of "the writer"), then the use of "they" is perfectly acceptable because the phrase "she or he" is too cumbersome. However, what the video leaves out is when the bio-sex or trans-gender of the person is actually known, then "they" would not be appropriate because it keeps the person as an object, rather than a subject. For example in these sentences: [I am unfamiliar with this writer. Who are they?] Both the "writer" and "they" are descriptors of some person about whom little is known. That writer remains objectified. And since we would still say, "who are they", rather than, "who is they" because "they" is predominantly used to refer to a group, the singular "they" keeps the person objectified just like a group of people are more objects rather than individual subjects. Once the bio-sex or trans-gender of the person is known, that person becomes more of a subject, more personal. So, the use of "they" as a singular for a known person would actually be impolite as it tends to objectify the person. At that point we would use "he" or "she" as in: [That writer is a trans-gender woman. She writes well.] I will say that I would disagree with using "they" to describe postmodern philosophical non-genders, as these categories are imaginary. There is no gender spectrum. The science is clear as to males & females. And there is sufficient evidence that supports the existence of the brain dysphoria of truly trans-gender women and trans-gender men. And the polite use of "he" or "she" as pronouns for trans-gender persons is appropriate. And this would be true regardless of how far the trans-gender individual has transitioned. Sincerity is important. I learned that from my mother. So, let me be clear, I remain convinced that there are people with true trans-gender dysphoria. There are just not very many of them. The postmodern trans idea, which has recently exploded onto the scene, that someone is both female and male or is neither female nor male remains in the imagination or spirituality of the holder. And in polite society, there is no obligation for non-believers to deconstruct the English language to satisfy other people's imaginings. The one limited exception to use "they" for a known person would be for that extreme minority of people who are born intersex. And in that case if their sex is not deducible from outward appearance and general conversation, then just respectfully wing it and hope for the best.
Thanks for the comment and for sharing your experiences, W E. As we mention in a previous video, we aren't working from the perspective of prescription in this grammar series (e.g. finding the "right" way that grammar should operate and insisting that others follow our lead). Instead, we are trying to help viewers by describing grammar practices as they are exist at this moment in time. Gender and sexuality are messy terms indeed but we do not want to speak of someone's identity as a thing to be absolutely categorized--particularly not without input from the person being categorized. As the lesson suggests, plenty of people actively choose to refer to themselves through the "they" pronoun. It is that social practice that we, as grammarians, are most interested in here.
What was wrong with he/him/his/man being gender neutral? That makes she/her/hers/woman special and reserved for women only. That's how Spanish works, the feminine form (ella/nosotras/ellas/using 'a' at the end of adjectives) is for women only and the other form (el/nosotros/ellos) is for everyone. They/Them/Theirs as a singular is very confusing for me.
Thanks for the comment, Chilango. We wouldn't say that we are the arbiters of gender pronouns, and you are, of course, welcome to choose how you manage them. Like all elements of any language, grammar is constantly changing based upon how it is used by the people who speak and write it. Because of these changes, we prefer to approach grammar descriptively rather than prescriptively (see our first video in this series). Currently, a growing number of English speakers are using "they" to express a gender neutral subject, so it stands to reason that grammarians should help to explain this usage rather than try to lock one "true" grammar into place.
@@SWLF How do you deal with sir and ma'am when trying to be polite
Interesting question! Alternatives to these words are still in flux, and we don't think an alternative has fully stabilized in our language, but you can find a bit more about how people have responded to this question here: www.dictionary.com/e/alternatives-for-sir-madam/
The only reason why "they" works as a singular pronoun is because its singular usage is first _contextualized_ within the sentence. It is intrinsically plural.
This is the answer.
Question: what is wrong with this sentence, “If a writer doesn’t respect people’s pronouns they are stupid”
Answare” science we are using they in the singular, rather than the plural, it should actually be “they is” instead of “they are”
This was… incredible!
Excellent! Thanks so much for supporting the series, Marcus!
Now there are three ways of saying the same thing. The traditional (natural) way: he. The feminist way: he or she. And the trans way: they. I prefer the traditional way. Sue me.
idk bro 'they' comes pretty naturally to me, 'he' feels very awkward
@@hellishlycute would agree that "they" is more natural than "he or she"
Thanks for keeping the conversation going, hellishlycute and Insignificant Fool! We certainly don't want to tell either of you what to do--how you speak is very much your own decisions. As we mention in earlier posts, this is the difference between descriptive grammar (describing what we already do) and prescriptive grammar (telling people what to do). The only thing we'd take issue with is calling "traditional" ways of using pronouns "natural" or the "feminist" way as using "he or she" or the "trans" way as using "they." As with all language (see our "What is Onomatopoeia?" video), there is nothing natural about pronoun usage, just as there is nothing necessarily more or less artificial about other pronoun usages. Pronouns are products of convention and are therefore subject to change to meet different moments in our history. We are living in one in which "he" as a pronoun standing is for all people feels (to many of us) dated and less inclusive than other, less singularly gendered pronouns.
@@SWLF interestingly enough, the only "grammar" I learned during my high school year back in 1989 was exactly this. When to use they and when "he or she". It's just not something that developed naturally, but that has to be taught. That's why I think explaining the political thinking behind this "change" is important.
How is it natural to pretend everyone ever is male.
So tell me please how do I refer to multiple people now?... They?... Or/and how do I refer to one person now?... They? That's why people assume "they" is plural. In a conversation we need to know without fiddling around what we are talking about and this is just ... well... Off.
In french the use of plural is used as a singular pronoun when in front of the person which is usually elderly, unknown or to put some distance out of respect
I am sorry but we can connect dots around to try to make it work but it doesn't solve the singular/plural issue in a discussion. It's a social trend IMO.
Great question, Uno! The easiest way to look avoid confusing with pronouns is to look for an "antecedent"--the noun to which a pronoun refers. In the example from the video, Prof Bushnell begins with the sentence "If a writer cares about grammar, they’ll use pronouns carefully." Here, the antecedent is clear (they is a stand-in for writer). As you suggest, the same principle works in French (and in many other languages, for that matter) for honorific pronouns without much confusion, provided the antecedent is clear. It may seem strange to you, but it is fairly common practice at the moment to have they stand in for BOTH plural and singular antecedents.
Hope that helps!
They is right?
In most contexts today (and certainly in everyday use), we say yes! It is even sanctioned by the Merriam-Webster Dictionary.
I think "he or she" is fine. Even the generic "he" isn't the worst in most situations, honestly, though I admit it can be problematic in some very rare instances. "They," however, simply isn't correct as a singular pronoun--it's inherently plural. Using it as a singular pronoun is ungrammatical.
Also, the singular "they" is not necessary because "he," "she," and "it" already exist. The singular "they" doesn't meet an actual need in the language. That's also why trying to introduce new pronouns like "zhe" into the language doesn't make sense, either. Such pronouns wouldn't meet an actual need.
I think a lot of the push for repurposing "they" as a singular pronoun comes from the LGBTQ+ community because people want their sexual orientations to be recognized. That makes this not only a linguistic issue, but a moral one, and a huge part of how people view the issue stems from their worldviews. As it is, I can't support this from a moral standpoint, either, so the singular "they" is not something I can stand behind.
Well, you are certainly welcome to your opinion, @michiban6, and we agree that in this case, English grammar is very much subject to changing worldviews. That said, as we suggest here and in other videos in this series, we disagree with you in terms of the conclusion you reach. Grammar isn't an "inherent" system but rather a historical one that changes over time based precisely upon those changing worldviews and accompanying pressures. For that reason, we do not offer a "prescriptive" grammar in this series but are instead trying to describe how grammar works in a day-to-day sense. In 2024, "they" is a common, widely accepted gender-neutral pronoun.
Notice no mention of a singular “them” hahahaha. “They” can only be used singular in certain circumstances, mostly when regarding the past. It’s hard for me to think of any other examples that wouldn’t sound as if referring to multiple people. Most importantly when writing, if you refer to a singular individual as “they” instead of their name, he, or she.. the reader will have a lot more trouble following along…
It’s easy to just refer to singular people as He or She and I cannot wrap my mind around why people wouldn’t want to.
1. Gender is completely irrelevant in the specific context.
2. You genuinely don’t know the persons gender. (Admittedly this only makes sense in the real world and not in fiction)
3. 3 or more people are interacting and you want to be able to refer to them unambiguously using pronouns, (he and she aren’t enough science there are only two and thus someone is gonna have to share and the plural confusion can be solved by using they is for the individual and they are for the group)
It’s easy to guess a gender, since gender is a synonym for sex. Just look at the bone structure/body, adams apple, etc.
I love this! A just and simple solution to a gender bias issue.
Thanks so much for your kind words, Robert!
I prescribe that "they" is plural. Get your own new pronoun.
Hmmm, well, we certainly disagree, John. As the failed efforts to get "ze" introduced as a gender-neutral pronoun or to keep "you" as a plural pronoun suggest, languages often resist top-down prescriptions for how they "should" work. Instead, they operate democratically, shifting and evolving their meanings over time to meet the needs of their changing users. That's why we prefer descriptive rather than prescriptive ways of understanding grammar.
TLDW: women are blamed for destroying classical grammar.
They is not singular
If a writer cares about grammar, the writer will use pronouns carefully.
If a writer cares about grammar, then the writer will use the subject to explain who is being referenced. You can write with much more elegance than to subvert your vocabulary to a singular use of the word they'll. You failed at English 101.
Well we already do
The singular they exists mostly to be able to talk about people who’s gender you don’t know
For example If I were to tell someone about you I would say something like “@hbkx450 seems pretty elitist because they claim people have bad grades just for having a different opinion than them.”
If a writer cares about grammar, this person will use pronouns carefully.