KEMPOWER Satellites Come to North America! FIRST CHARGE in Québec w/ Hyundai Ioniq 5
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- čas přidán 20. 08. 2024
- Finally, Kempower's much-lauded DC fast charging solution comes to North America. While there have been limited Kempower USA sites with a solo dispenser, the most compelling aspect has been missing: the ability to distribute power based on the EV, rather than solely the equipment.
The Kempower S series promises to make best use of power for the wide variety of EV capabilities available across North America. With up to 500kW of power on tap and 300kW of that available to an individual EV, when the site is quiet, the dynamic power routing is not only appreciated, it's essential.
Join us for a test charge on the first full Kempower Satellite station in America and a good look around the site, including how it differs from other fast charge stations you might use.
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I understand if you use your cellphone camera and scan that QR code when your charging you will receive real-time charging information. Real handy to know the status of your charge.
Thanks Dave, that does seem to be a neat feature. In this case, the Electric Circuit app is very data rich and updates relatively quickly, but for providers with clunkier apps, like ZEF or Circle K, a simple charge update via QR code could be really useful.
Love the DCFC handles.
@@bradcooke5383Felt really solid, with the spring-loaded system removing a lot of the challenges that extra weight brings for accessibility. Definitely appreciated the combination.
Imagine if all CCS installs used equipment as good as this. Would be such a different conversation about charging in North America.
Nice site overview. Hope to see more Kempower installs sooner rather than later.
Read your comment to the tune of the John Lennon song and it kinda sorta works... not sure he'd approve, but I'm running with it!Thanks for the thoughts, I'm hopeful we'll see much more from Kempower as their US offices and production gather pace early next year.
Great to see a Finnish product deploying overseas. Greetings from Finland!
We gratefully welcome our Finnish charging saviours with open arms and an (unlimited) pot of coffee!⚡ 🇨🇦🇫🇮🇺🇲⚡
@@plugandplayEV haha great! Coffee always works for Finns!
Kemppi power , kudo to the welders ❤❤
Great addition for North America. KEMPOWER are building a factory in the USA. I think the physical design is more user friendly especially for EV newbies.
PS I know the Qu confuses Anglophones but the locals pronounce Quebec like "Ke-beck".
Ha, as a professed Francophile, I appreciate the pronunciation assist... it's been too long since I headed north of the border and I'm clearly rusty. A second KEMPOWER installation recently went in via Bornes Quebec, who are doing some great work up there. Excited to see them spread closer to us for testing.
OMG, Freekin awesome !!!! So excited for them to increase their adoption rate here in NA. Saw a vid dropped by them this past week with an update on the Durham, NC factory and it is still a work in progress. Guy said maybe by Q1`24 they will be pumping out for NA, made in NA. Love the cable mana, the HW, and the sw tech they use. Real solid package. Thx so much for bringing to a sight for sore eyes. loved the vid.
Thanks for the support and enthusiasm (always glad there are others who love this stuff!) Your region is really going to pop with charging hardware and battery manufacturing over the next few years. I note similar activity in Ohio/Michigan and it's wonderful to see the vibrancy returning to these talented labor pools.
Nice overview, looking forward to these coming to the US too. Easy and open site designs would be helpful here as well.
Thanks Brian. Given the number of boats and campers we saw towed in your area (and Wisconsin), I'd say they should start installing around the Great Lakes immediately.
Welcome to the province of Quebec, Canada, EV paradise and cheap electricity ⚡️🚗👍
Merci beaucoup! Always love it up that way and hope to come back more often.
@@plugandplayEV
If you pass by our place in Trois-Rivieres, I suggest you stop at the mecca of electric vehicles: the roulez electrique station at 519 rue des Volontaires, Trois-Rivières QC G9A 2E7 👍
Thanks for the review, Steve.
Thanks for the watch and comment, always appreciated!
The way this site is setup and these units work (perfect dynamic load sharing) is great stuff.
Pull through parking is perfect and good reach on the cables.
Only things that would be a nice improvement would be covered parking.
What I don't like is the the dynamic pricing (This will be very confusing for customers and no way of knowing what to expect as far as cost before visiting this site).
Spot on, and exactly what I experienced in terms of pricing. The rate worked out, of course, but there's an initial sticker shock even if you're used to the many approaches that CPOs have attempted over the years. It could just be a pilot to see how users react, but a two page list of varied tiers across an amount of time the driver probably won't stay can't be the way forward.
I always skip over covered parking as I anticipate it will arrive as EV charging replaces gas pumps, as we've seen in Norway. It's worth calling out each and every time, though, because networks and site hosts need to hear what we want. Thanks for the thoughtful points 👍
At first glance, it seems as though they would really prefer to just charge you by the kWh, but the government doesn't allow it. So, they work around the rules by nominally charging by the minute, but setting the per-minute rate based on the number of kWh you pull in that minute. Thus, $0.50/kWh translates to $25/hr@50 kW, $100/hr at 200 kW, etc.
They switched to per kWh pricing when your car pulls more than 20 kWh. If your car asks for less than 20kWh it goes to per hour pricing, this is to encourage people to stop charging when it's less efficient (even more so the fee doubles when you get at 90%).
Wish we had more of this in New Hampshire
New Hampshire really needs to hit the accelerator on this stuff. Maybe installing larger stations like this after missing the boat on DCFC to date could actually be turned to a positive, though... install a bunch of future-proofed locations and not have any legacy 50kW sites to deal with. One can hope!
Nice. Thanks, Steve! I'd love to see more of these, but I don't know that I consider these a replacement for true, high-power equipment. 500 kW shared across all the stalls is maybe most appropriate for "destinations" as opposed to travel/freeway stops. Also, it's nice to see what proper cable management can do for the heavy, unwieldly CCS1 cables. 😉
Thanks Eric, interesting points.There is another level up to the power unit at 600kW, though I doubt that would be sufficient improvement to counter your point about appropriate travel stop power. Right now, I'd say I'd be fine with 100kW minimum when everything is full, as it wouldn't be long until we'd push beyond that as tapers hit and others unplug, but when there's a consistent flow of 800V EVs, it could be considered a bottleneck again. For the moment, I'll definitely take this over the options currently installed.
And yes, it's almost like the "elegance" of the connector is irrelevant when you have competent cable management in place...!
@@plugandplayEV Definitely! I love the configuration (you know I'm a sucker for full, pull-through stalls), but my preference for a travel plaza would be an implementation like this supplemented by two to four split-power 350-400 kW dispensers. Essentially, imagine one of these Kempower packages added to every EVgo-Pilot/Flying J location.
Bio/snack break with a fast charging car? No problem! You're in and out in under 15 minutes using one of the high-power units.
Stopping for food and walking the dog? Also not a problem. Just grab one of the Kempower stalls and take your time.
@@newscoulomb3705pricing appropriately for various power levels would help steer traffic to the most suitable charging hardware but that might make things complicated/confusing for both the retailer and the consumer.
@@anthonyc8499 I wasn't really referring to pricing in anyway, though maybe that could be built into it a bit. Really, parking fees after a set period of time are the only fair ways to address that.
But what I was referring to is simply dedicated high-power units, which would prevent fast charging EVs from hogging most of the Kempower installation's juice while also preventing owners of fast charging EVs from being frustrated at the power levels they are receiving.
The upcoming seven automaker network is already looking toward 400 kW units, which more than likely means they are either looking to guarantee 500 A per post, or 500 A up to 900 V. So clearly, they are valuing higher dedicated power to each post.
Yea!
🙌
These are great! We just need them everywhere now! I still have a 70 mi round trip just to get to a DC fast charger
I suspect there will be a long line to snap these off the US production line... I hope your state is at the front of the order book!
Thank you for the look, Steve. Amazingly petite at the dispenser! Great set up for moderate use locations. I’ve often come to an EA with 2 eGMP’s or one eGMP + newer ID.4 or other MEB on. Adding my ID.4 would put it at/near a 500kWh site cap, and a 4th would lower top speeds. Still, dynamic balancing should avoid most of the pain by spreading power evenly.
Thanks, Dave, good points. I think the other thing to remember is that not everyone is always pulling peak power. The EGMP cars do suck down that 230-240kW, but only for a short period, as we saw in this video. If they're at 60% and a couple of others plug in, it's unlikely to add much more than a minute or two to the charge session.
There are certainly peak scenarios in which charging will be notably slower, but I'd liken that to getting gas at a busy station on the weekend or traveling on a holiday, assuming there are enough stations so that drivers have a choice where they stop to charge.
Great video! I'm really glad to see Kempower's equipment here in North America. Just slightly concerning with you only pulling 190 kW upon initial plug-in. Was your battery not up to ideal temps? When you plugged in later, you immediately rocketed up to the full 240 kW. If your initial battery temps were good, then maybe there was a configuration issue.
They also really need to move to per kilowatt-hour pricing in Canada. The tiered rates for every 10 kW charging speed are absolutely ridiculous!
Right, I left my OBD2 reader behind on this trip but 190kW would be a little high for temperature-limited charging. Usually I see steps from around 65-70kW, up through 120-130kW and then cranking up to full power when the pack minimum hits its target 20C/68F. The station had only been open few months, so perhaps they were still dialing it in.
The tiered pricing only didn't phase me much because I trust the Electric Circuit there to be reasonably priced, thanks to abundant hydro power and previous visits. If I were making a charging decision based on cost, that would definitely be a tough system to price out!
@@plugandplayEV According to the Kia EV forums, if you're between 20 and 24°C, you'll have ~190 kW (270 amp) limit. It's only once you hit a minimum battery cell temperature of 25°C that you get the full unlimited power of 305 amps (240 kW).
I still think pricing per minute with tiers every kilowatt is ridiculous. They might as well just directly bill by the kWh. I think legislation allowing that recently passed in Canada, so hopefully it gets implemented soon.
The cable management is superior. Per minute pricing adjusted for speed is pretty contorted but I guess it is fair. Would the site be over-subscribed if every dispenser had an Ionic 5 plugging in at once?
Pricing is certainly unintelligible initially, but it worked out as a sensible rate overall. Without Hydro Quebec's power generation, however, I do wonder if it would become a premium price for the higher power load.
With six EGMP cars plugged in and at a similarly low state of charge, an equal split of the 500kW available would be around 83kW. So even in that unusual scenario, it's a decent rate and the session would be less than 30 minutes. I'm not sure if they prioritize those who plugged in first or just make it a simple even split as more cars plug in... something I'll research, thanks.
@@plugandplayEVOh man...those units look absolutely fantastic! We are planning a trip through Quebec next spring out to the East coast and look forward to charging at one of these.
Hope they come to Ontario soon...great idea and the pull through bays are an awesome idea!
Amazing!!!
Have a great day!
Mike😅
Scan the QR code and use your phone to track it. What I do every time I use Kempower chargers.
Definitely missed a trick with that one, thanks. I've become numb to QR codes on everything, everywhere, but it sounds like this one is useful!
Awesome, glad to see this!!! 🤔 My vote is for Connecticut! 🤣
Works for me... getting through Connecticut comfortably and quickly is a laudible objective!
hahahah you are correct!!! @@plugandplayEV
I really like the layout and the transparency of the chargers. It makes it easier to understand what kind of power you can get.
I’m curious if the 500kW site max is at 800V only or 400V as well. If it’s truly 500kW split between all those chargers, then worst case would mean each cable gets 83kW, which isn’t great but better than sitting in line at EA. If it gets halved down to 250kW site max for 400V then I’d say that’s not good.
Each handle can push 300A, so even at 400V you're still getting the site's full capability of 500kW i.e. 4 x 400V could get the maximum 120kW, but 5 x 400V cars would see a slight decrease to 100kW. When full with 400V EVs, as you point out, it would be a little over 83kW each, which is still reasonable and would jump back up as soon as any one of them unplugged.
This Kempower site is a really slick installation. I’d be curious how Eric Way would have scored it and what the amenities are like. The only thing I didn’t like about the setup was that the parking stalls should have green paint on them to reinforce the small signage that they’re for active charging only.
This station is very expensive for both the hardware and real estate. Those are some long conduit lines they had to run.
Amenities aren't actually bad, other than having to walk in potentially bad weather to get to them. The chicken restaurant (sit-down place) is in the adjacent building and then there are several gas stations with c-stores and a Subway if you walk a little further along.
We have the livestream lined up this Wednesday and it's more of an open topic, so I'll be sure to ask Eric what approximate score he'd anticipate for a site like this. I know he's not sold on it as a travel option, though, based on his thoughts elsewhere in this comments section.
like the colour of your car
Thank you!
Thanks for the overview. Will be in Quebec soon if my plans work out. Do you know if a US based Flo account will work there as is, or do I need to modify it somehow for payment to go smoothly?
Thanks, Bob. I'm 90% sure that your FLO account will activate an Electric Circuit station just fine. I've only done the reverse, with my EC card starting a FLO in Ontario, but the two have close ties and are also a roaming partner of ChargePoint, if you need a back up. I would just load up sufficient funds ahead of time in case the connection gets patchy or slow. Safe travels!
300A cables so 500 kW of switching capacity but 400V car on an empty location can get 120 kW only... bummer. Also, does the dispenser screen really read CCS2 ? :)
Yes! I initially thought it was referring to the second CCS handle as I was charging on the other one (which I assumed would say "CCS 1" as in handle 1, next to CCS handle 2 on the right). But no, looked back over the footage when I wasn't charging and both left/right sides read "CCS2"... some local software updates required for the North American market, it seems!
nice,,, doesnt ioniq have plug and pay yet ?
No, Hyundai-Kia has been crazy slow on that tech, considering how forward-looking they are on fast charging otherwise. Ioniqs can do Autocharge on EVgo though, because it's more network-led than dependent on the automaker.
Does your Ioniq 5 not easily switch over MPH to KM? I notice you had not bothered to change the dash.
It does switch (manually), but I track efficiency on long trips like this and it's easier to just keep it set to Imperial so that the mi/kWh metric doesn't disappear.
Steve sorry to bother you I have a question for you: did you ever have to change the 12 volt battery in your Chevy bolt when you owned it.
No problem at all. No, the 12V was never an issue when we had our Bolts but we only ran them to 35,000 miles, then returned from lease. Long-term owners seem to have gone much futher without a need to change.
@@plugandplayEV thank you Steve for your reply regarding the 12volt battery In the Chevy bolts.
Those will be out of service most of the time once they start getting used a lot (due to the liquid cooling system failing)
You had a similar sentiment to those pole-mounted chargers near me and I have a video in the works that has Team Optimist winning that round... I'll plan a trip back to Quebec next year to see if you take this one! 😉
@@plugandplayEV well the book isn't written on that yet. These things always seem to work for the first few years; but in addition, that's an entitely different beast to liquid cooled 500 amp cables that are 30 ft long.
I am realist (neither pessimist nor optimist because those perspectives are intrinsically wrong due to bias)
@@homomorphic Yep, completely understood and I value your input all the more for it. Always appreciated, even when I might disagree :-)
I don't think those are liquid-cooled, The liquid cooled Kempower setup looks different
@@Crazypostman if it is 500 amps or more it better be.