Paul compares a few saws and suggests an affordable option that is widely available. For more information on these topics, see paulsellers.com or woodworkingmas...
A hint for those like me that get lost easily. I would mark all the valleys with a permanent marker before I started sharpening. As you sharpen the black mark is removed and you know where you left off.
Paul, I've got to hand it to you. Don't know anyone else who could make filing a saw blade interesting enough to watch the whole thing. And find it interesting. Hats off. As they say here in Texas.
As I have started to (attempt) to switch from "DIY carpenter/function over form" guy; to "woodworker", I've found that no one on youtube can explain both the easy and hard concepts better than Mr. Sellers. Thank you sir!
Oh my gosh - I have a woodwork twin! My problem is, I waited 40 years to go from function over form, so now we're teaching an old dog new tricks! Gave up "mechanicing" after over 45 years as a hobby - high performance and vintage car parts (and of course - the cars they go on) got way too expensive for my budget. Mr. Sellers is a blessing. I must say though - less wood is going into the fireplace!
Dan Hartman it's funny you say that about less wood going in the fireplace. I've actually started grabbing pieces of oak firewood to rip and cut stock out of for building small boxes. It's much for satisfying to me personally to take my wood from a rough split piece to a hand ripped, hand planed, beautiful piece of stock
Deadly Chicken in that case, you might save some work if you get a froe for splitting (riving) out of the log and a hatchet to hew to rough shape. A lot less sawing! Check out Peter Follensbee’s videos on hewing. He makes fine furniture using stock that is split, hewn and planed.
After watching this video last year I bought one of the S&J saws. I didn’t sharpen it or change the set - it works pretty well for both rip and crosscut. I rarely need a perfect crosscut if I’m using a panel saw anyway and it works great at rip. I did use some acetone to remove that varnish - it goes through the wood way easier now.
Paul, you have the gift of being able to explain calmly and clearly complicated things. It is so nice to listen to your narrative. I would like to know how you feel about modern saws with 'hardened" (blue) teeth. Can they be sharpened or should they be tossed on the scrap heap once they are dull?
As a novice diy woodworker I have had some confusion of this subject. But thanks to you for expaining it with so clearly. And the closeups also helps a lot. Thanks again Paul. You are the best 👍
Paul, love the videos! I have only sharpened a handful of saws in my lifetime but I feel compelled to offer a tip to a veteran such as yourself only in the hope it may be of use. If you get an old magic marker and run it down the top edge of the teeth lightly you should never miss a tooth again for rip cuts. For crosscuts, as the teeth are set first to one side and then the other, you can mark every other tooth by running marker down the side touching only the back of the teeth set on that side. Repeat on other side and it will mark the teeth set opposite. Thanks for sharing!
In the local hardware stores around here, the rip cut saw is totally absent. Everybody concentrates on selling throw-away junk for sawing two-by-fours with nails and concrete in them for house construction. Getting a quality tool is hard, it's either from online or second hand.
apinakapinastorba But that is why I love these videos, and feel that they are so vital for the continuation of the tradtion. Paul is showing you how to convert a run of the mill commercial saw to whatever you need or want. When I worked in construction as a framer, I always heard this old saw "Be smarter than the wood", or something similar; and what he is teaching is something that I'm lacking. The knowhow to overcome our modern day commercial driven carbon copy drek. Which makes me wonder if he has made any of his own saws in his youth?
Not knowing where you are in the world it’s difficult to advise but look out these spear and Jackson ones. If not look at Flynn and garlick saws from Sheffield or bad axe tool works. Avoid these lie Neilson saws they are not what they want you to think they are far far to thin and wander in the cut
@@whitacrebespoke Interesting about the Lie Nielsons. I always linked them with quality - their marketing is good. Is it just their saws to avoid or is all their gear a bit Meh?
Kutulue mostly just the saws the plates are far far to thin they say it will follow its own line and it’s operator error it it won’t cut straight. I brought a back saw and took it back as every time it will follow the grain and the plate bends to follow. The planes are good quality. Although I don’t like the dovetail marker much either
I've just filed an old S and J following this video and am over the moon with the result. It's a good feeling to know I'm not forced to buy a new saw every time many thanks.
Thankyou for taking the time to make those oversized visual aids. I now clearly understand the difference between the crosscut and rip tooth pattern. Thanks for the effort involved, this novice appreciates it!!!
Dear Paul! Just hand cut my first really fitting moritise/tenon using your videos & technique. It is really rewardig seeing a simple piece of wood shaped to your own imagination. Up to now I did some furniture in my house mostly with screws or dowels. I'll do our coffee table with more traditional joinery. Thank you, thank you, thank you for all the inspiration. All the Best.
Cheap induction hardened saws have their place in any woodworkers toolkit. They are ideal for keeping in the back of the car, or for first cuts on reclaimed timbers... As for IH saws being un-resharpenable, well, that's both true & untrue. Sure, you can't resharpen the original tooth pattern, but the rest of the blade can be cut & sharpened quite easily. What you need is a couple of lengths of angle iron, a big vise, and a metal scoring knife (I make mine from hardwood offcuts & old hacksaw blades). Clamp the saw between the pieces of angle iron, teeth up, with roughly 1/4" of clear blade showing. Score the sawblade several times with the scoring knife, using the edge of the angle iron as a straightedge. (The trick is getting behind the hardened edge, but you'll easily be able to see if you're hitting the hardening with the scoring knife - if you are, reclamp with slightly more of the sawblade showing & re-score.) Using pliers, flex the scored blade back & forth until the old cutting edge breaks off. Clean up the new edge with a file. Hey-Presto, you now have a blank saw blade, ideal for practicing your saw sharpening skills on. Better to practice on a cheap blade that would otherwise be binned, than on your more valued workshop saws... BE SURE TO WEAR SAFETY EQUIPMENT - Leather gloves & safety glasses people!
You could also use a diamond file, they aren't as expensive as they used to be, but quality still costs money and the real cheap one are not worth buying.
As always it was an excellent demonstration and teaching. I just bought a handsaw from a Sheffield saw maker, they claim to be the last English saw makers. This video clip is going to be very useful. Thank you Paul Seller for your service to craftsmanship.
Paul, I like very much your videos showing simple and low cost solutions and the simple techniques to improve them. You got me into using the axe and carving a spoon. A vice instead of clamps will be the next steps. A lot of respect and thanks from Switzerland.
I’m not planning on sharpening a hand saw any time soon. However, I learned a lot about saw teeth and the differences between rip cut and cross cut saws. Never knew the blade is tapered from top to bottom. Another great learning tool experience. Thanks!
Great video Paul. Just the sort of advice novice woodworkers need. Me, being from Sheffield, find it a bit sad that the Spear and Jackson saw was made in Taiwan, but such is the way of the world now. It would be nice to see a similar video comparing back saws.
Very grateful, sir. It is always a pleasure to learn from you. It is definitely a privilege to have your knowledge. A greeting from Barcelona, Mr. Sellers.
Thank you for adding this to the information out there, great examples of wisdom beginners dismiss by rushing but then don't know where to go when they do realize the mistake.
I was looking for a sharpen-able saw and saw the S&J which seemed to fit the bill but I wanted to be sure before I actually ordered it since I couldn't see it in person first. This video cemented my decision, I've bought just one for now and will use it as it comes and then at a later date I'll buy a 2nd one and do the rip modifications. Sounds like it's a solid tool that I'll be using for a long time. Thanks for the great video, as always!
I love using my $30 Japanese saw, but I hate the idea of just throwing away an old blade. Thanks for the sharpening lesson. I think the next saw I get will be one I can sharpen.
just when I think I couldn't learn something from one of your videos, you throw in a jem of wisdom! thank you sir and I'll be waiting for the next one!
Used to keep hedgehogs for pets but always released them in the wild after a while. They always did a weird burp after i fed them crepes. They loved crepes.😀
Hello Mr. Sellers, I'm a woodworking mastercraft subscriber and love your lessons and tutelage. I'm wondering if you have done a video or could do a video on restoring an old rusty hand saw like you did with the hand plane restoration. Would be very useful. Thank you.
I very much appreciate your explanations,precise and easy to understand. In one episode,I noticed what looks to be a book shelf in the background. This is something that I have been looking for. I am wondering if it's possible to share or purchase the plans? You make it a joy to watch your videos,and showing how any one can make hand tools and maintain what we use,to get the best results. Thank you very much.
Saw the video and I do think he improved it. I think it's worth mentioning that when you take some set out of the teeth, what you give up is steerability. The narrow kerf means if you get off track it's hard to steer back to your line. Rex does mention this when discussing the narrow kerf Japanese saws. It's a good channel. He should get his own PBS show.
Even if I could afford that LN, I deserve the S&J more for what I will ever be able to do with hand tools. Sadly, the less expensive saws are not as easy to come by in the states. I did find some nice vintage saws but getting my sharpening skills up to snuff is not all that easy after leaving that for 40 years. Thanks for posting this!
You remind me of the guy who taught me James Price, we gave him shit as a class but we all respected and listened to him because he couldn't be beaten in skill, he actually also taught my father when he was in college.
Although an obsessive woodworker I am also a builder for a living, and as such use hard point saws all the time. I use the spear and Jackson predator saws and when new they are unbelievably sharp and cut an absolute dream. ( cross cutting more so than ripping, and now I know why) My question is, having never used a traditional saw, is a freshly sharpened traditional saw as sharp, as a good quality hard point saw ?
I have lots of late 70s and 80s versions of these spear and Jackson saws handed down from my late farther, they are great every day saws I use mine for site work and in the workshop. As I have now vowed not to buy another disposable hard point I'm getting down those I had so the S&Js are getting more and more work as are some of my vintage ones. I think S&J don't offer a rip because they don't have the machine tooling to do it any more. Would be interested to know where they are made as S&J until about 2 years ago put made in England on them now I notice there's no mention of that.
He mentioned the S+J was made in Taiwan but I'm not sure if that was just a throw away comment meaning 'outsourced to cheap labour in Asia'. I would have thought that S+J would have access to the tooling to make a rip template but don't more to do with economic reasons - and they could certainly outsource to produce a rip saw like they have with the cross cut variant - but I think it's more to do with demand which in turn leaves knowledgeable craftsmen out of a place to buy a reasonably priced rip saw......
+Jonto Dickens S&J own some of the biggest and best names in hand tools they brought the lot (well those Stanley and irwin didn't). Elwell, tyzack, brades, amongst many others so the tooling was there as tyzack and elwell both made good saws. What I suspect though is they figured them out here in the uk then shipped manufacturing out side. What you will find is they are punched in the same machine as the hard points hence no rip available. If you want a new rip from factory at a fairly reasonable price by one from Flinn and garlick they are more expensive (not as expensive as the designer tools) but worth it.
+Nathan Tonning his new shop is all that matter, there are new lighting and new space, more importantly, new atmosphere, hence the better image quality
Great video, thanks Paul! Is any triangular file suitable for the sharpening or does it have to be a special saw sharpening file? I know the latter are sold at some specialist stores, the former in any hardware store and cheaper, too. Thanks, Bjorn
I like you , sir , you are so good in lecturing , I like being so clear , and calm . I remember every word you say though my mother tongue is Arabic , thank you , gentleman .
I bought the 24 inch 9515K to try. It's OK for cross cut but not so great for rip cuts. I am debating whether to invest in refiling it and then trying again. I will point out though, that my blade measures 1.0mm thick, pretty consistently throughout, and that matches the spec sheet on the S&J website. Maybe it has changed since this video where Paul measured it at 0.81-0.85 mm? 25% difference.
i fully intend to try this great stuff but I was taught that a rip cut saw also has less teeth per inch and a bigger gap between each tooth to allow for larger amounts of swarf so that the saw cuts along the grain more efficiently as for the set they both should have a decent set to stop the sides from binding so is there a way to increase the valley size to make a rip saw cut faster
+Roc Lo You can change the number of teeth per inch ... eg you can effectively turn every second tooth into a gullet and halve the number of teeth per inch ... but if you were to do it by hand you are going to go through some files ... and good files are not super abundant these days. Someone with a re-toothing machine that punches out the teeth could easily strip off the original teeth and create any pitch you wanted.
+Paul McGee i wish i knew someone like that, i suppose I'll have to decide which one i want more my file was given to me by my dad he got it from his dad now i have the file any instructional videos on how to proceed on this technique I'm very curious about the shape of the valley/gullet as i have seen they differ in some saws some people say its got to do with the swarf or shavings and how they curl into the gullet so i'm after the one that gets you through the rip the fastest.
I think that metallurgy has improved to the point that a less expensive saw is nearly as functional as the high-priced one. By the way, would it be better to remove the varnish, and wax the blade? I think automotive brake cleaner/degreaser would remove it quickly.
Poundland sell some saws which are useless as they come but can be re-filed. They are also a good source of steel for making cabinet scrapers and scratch stocks.
Hi Paul, great video again thanks for uploading. if you're ever running out of ideas for a video I'd love to see a demo of all of those handmade planes that are above your left shoulder on the video. loved the video you did on your spill plane, would be great to see the rest of them.
The latest Trad S & J's are riveted is it 'worthwhile' removing same and proper saw screws inset for cleaning and setting. (heard the rivets/handle come loose) I'm moving away the cheap fixes of my youth, next proper metal for my brace augers (bought as a Elec Apprentice (underfloor joists, conduit)))
Thank you very much for the thorough explanation. Do you have experience with japanese saws? I will certainly want to know you opinion about them. Have a good one!
Paul, thank you, my confidence & learning builds with each video watched. Looking at the high end saw in the video, the toe end top of the plate has been shaped differently, does this serve purpose or is it just fancy design ?
When Paul pulls the file back, he’s resting it lightly in the tooth to align it and then he applies downward pressure only as he pushes forward to cut. Never apply pressure on a file while drawing backwards. It dulls and breaks its teeth. Rubbing back and forth with a file as if it were sandpaper is a sure sign that a person doesn’t know how to use it.
One comparison you could do would be to sharpened another cross cut saw the same amount of time in the cross cut fashion and then compared the two, the cross cut sharpened as a rip cut and the cross cut sharpened in a cross cut. And then compared it to the pricey rip cut saw. After you sharpened it .-.
Thanks Paul I learned a few new tricks today ! I have some old Sandvik hand saws and the blades have a slight curve . The teeth edges are not a straight edge. I hope I explained that right. Why is the bottom of the blade curved and what is this called?
I guess you mean the back of the blade. This is called a skew and the saw is called a skew-backed saw. The reason for it is that it makes the saw easier to steer in the cut. A slight bend along the blade usually does not affect the saw but you can bend it quite hard in the opposite way and often this is enough to straighten it. The teeth if they are not even will need jointing or topping. This is using a flat file to straighten them which means the teeth have to be filed to the new level too. Not an easy task for a novice.
Not to contradict Paul, but if you mean the teeth edge, it’s called a Breasted Toothline. A breasted saw is supposed to make the use of the saw more comfortable for long sawing sessions, since it suits better to the natural swing of the arm when it comes to full length strokes.
I really like your videos. They're so informative yet so simple to understand. I bought a bunch of hand tools at an estate sale a few years ago. The hand saws are duller than a Meril Streep movie. I've been meaning to sharpen them .. along with my grandpa's saws, my dad's saws, my uncle's saws and a few others.. lol I'm curious though. Why was there a notch missing from the tip of one of those new saws? One of mine has the same notch and I thought the guy I got it from needed a small strip of tool steel, maybe for cutting threads on dowels.. but now I'm stumped.. what's the purpose of the notch?
Just did that today with an old tenon saw from a boot fair that I paid £5 for. Thirty Minutes in a bath of distilled (white) vinegar and wash off under a running tap with a nail brush and the rust is dealt with. Its a bit dark, but it is smooth ready for a bit more finishing and fettling. Be aware, when you take it out of the vinegar you must rinse the vinegar off (vinegar is an acid, however mild) and dry the blade thoroughly then give it a little rub of light oil or the rust will come back within an hour.
I'm no saw expert, and do more carving than precision woodworking, but I have a Freud rip cut saw ( made in England) that I have been pleased with. no longer recall where I ordered it from, probably Woodcraft years ago.
Great video Paul, much appreciated. Any chance you could make one to show us lesser mortals how to cut square and true? Not so much across the width of the timber, a knife wall solves that issue - I mean when you cut down into the timber. I guess practice is the answer, but is it the only answer?
The saw can be a big issue to excessive set or set to much on one side will cause wandering issues. Once you have a decent correctly set saw it then come down to practice. Like any tool a saw will try to follow the grain so it's just a case of keeping it cutting true with your hand placement.
In defence of the much more expensive saw, it's a bit shorter than the S&J saw, so each stroke is going to remove less wood sort of inherently. It's nice to know the S&J saws are not as bad as they look. I suspect the reverberation of the S&J is down to the thicker plate having less clearance in the cut, resulting in more friction. Probably a rub with an oily rag or a fraction more set would probably take care of that.
+Mooncabbage Actually, I use the same length stroke no matter the length of the saw as long as it is longer than 20". Habits become standard.The reverberating plate is caused by the extra length of the plate and then the added friction caused by the surface coating on the plate. With the coating removed and a little wax it cuts as well as any and all premium saws.
I guess it makes sense that the stroke length would be the same, you'd find a comfortable stroke and stick with it. How did you remove the coating from the saw plate? Would you consider doing a video on cheaper tenon saws/back saws? Good quality second hand tenon saws aren't a thing in my part of the world. I ended up buying a Veritas backsaw, which wasn't too pricey, but is actually more expensive than the S&J equivalent, probably about twice as much. I did eventually find an old backsaw which works just fine for me, but it did take a while. The same beginning woodworker that benefits from this video might benefit from another on a starting tenon saw too.
great video. Very interesting for beginners like myself ^^ Especially because i need to buy a saw. Seeing all the different kinds of saw in the store, i felt really lost and bought nothing. :D
I think that the only question left is longevity. How long does each saw last before it requires resharpening? If both saws hold a point for about the same time, I don't see much justification for a more expensive saw. Hard to spend 7 times the money for a 5% performance improvement.
+Paul Sellers I have to rewatch to check if it was mentioned, but is there any insight(adage) on when|why to upgrade to a more expensive saw if all you've ever known is cheap stuff?
I think the more expensive saw has less reverberation because of the shape of the tip, it's got less metal so less inertia and less steel that moves free.
I am about to convert a 8 ppi crosscut saw into a rip saw but I wonder: the crosscut saw has some rake to it and I am concerned that the rake will cause some problem if I only file across while following the (raked) gullet. Do you think I can treat the saw just like Paul did or should I try to eliminate the rake as well? Thankfull for help
Aren't rip cut saws more accurate when ripping though? I feel like they may be able to stay straight line cut more reliably than if you use a saw with crosscut teeth or with "universal" teeth
Does it make any difference for cutting plywood? Asking because plywood has layers of wood sheets arranged with the fibres at right angles to each other. What is a rip cut for one layer is a cross cut for another. Most of the work in India happens with plywood. I am a hobbyist. Thanks, Regards,
Plywood is notorious for breakout due to the layered fibres. You will only really know when you actually get the plywood and cut it. Is pinewood not easily available in india?
Interesting, the S &J crosscut converted to a rip tooth still has the set on the teeth. Normally rip teeth don’t have set on , do they? They probably bind less I would guess.🇨🇦👍👨🦳
A hint for those like me that get lost easily. I would mark all the valleys with a permanent marker before I started sharpening. As you sharpen the black mark is removed and you know where you left off.
+Katie Dotson (K8-T) You don't really need it if you remember the adage, sharpen the back of the tooth leaning away from you.
@@Paul.Sellers you seem to forget that I'm retarded
Paul, I've got to hand it to you. Don't know anyone else who could make filing a saw blade interesting enough to watch the whole thing. And find it interesting. Hats off. As they say here in Texas.
As I have started to (attempt) to switch from "DIY carpenter/function over form" guy; to "woodworker", I've found that no one on youtube can explain both the easy and hard concepts better than Mr. Sellers.
Thank you sir!
Oh my gosh - I have a woodwork twin! My problem is, I waited 40 years to go from function over form, so now we're teaching an old dog new tricks! Gave up "mechanicing" after over 45 years as a hobby - high performance and vintage car parts (and of course - the cars they go on) got way too expensive for my budget. Mr. Sellers is a blessing. I must say though - less wood is going into the fireplace!
Dan Hartman it's funny you say that about less wood going in the fireplace. I've actually started grabbing pieces of oak firewood to rip and cut stock out of for building small boxes. It's much for satisfying to me personally to take my wood from a rough split piece to a hand ripped, hand planed, beautiful piece of stock
Deadly Chicken in that case, you might save some work if you get a froe for splitting (riving) out of the log and a hatchet to hew to rough shape. A lot less sawing! Check out Peter Follensbee’s videos on hewing. He makes fine furniture using stock that is split, hewn and planed.
After watching this video last year I bought one of the S&J saws. I didn’t sharpen it or change the set - it works pretty well for both rip and crosscut. I rarely need a perfect crosscut if I’m using a panel saw anyway and it works great at rip.
I did use some acetone to remove that varnish - it goes through the wood way easier now.
Paul, you have the gift of being able to explain calmly and clearly complicated things. It is so nice to listen to your narrative. I would like to know how you feel about modern saws with 'hardened" (blue) teeth. Can they be sharpened or should they be tossed on the scrap heap once they are dull?
As a novice diy woodworker I have had some confusion of this subject. But thanks to you for expaining it with so clearly. And the closeups also helps a lot. Thanks again Paul. You are the best 👍
Paul, love the videos! I have only sharpened a handful of saws in my lifetime but I feel compelled to offer a tip to a veteran such as yourself only in the hope it may be of use. If you get an old magic marker and run it down the top edge of the teeth lightly you should never miss a tooth again for rip cuts. For crosscuts, as the teeth are set first to one side and then the other, you can mark every other tooth by running marker down the side touching only the back of the teeth set on that side. Repeat on other side and it will mark the teeth set opposite. Thanks for sharing!
+Jay Benson That's a good idea. Thank you for the tip.
In the local hardware stores around here, the rip cut saw is totally absent. Everybody concentrates on selling throw-away junk for sawing two-by-fours with nails and concrete in them for house construction. Getting a quality tool is hard, it's either from online or second hand.
apinakapinastorba But that is why I love these videos, and feel that they are so vital for the continuation of the tradtion. Paul is showing you how to convert a run of the mill commercial saw to whatever you need or want. When I worked in construction as a framer, I always heard this old saw "Be smarter than the wood", or something similar; and what he is teaching is something that I'm lacking. The knowhow to overcome our modern day commercial driven carbon copy drek. Which makes me wonder if he has made any of his own saws in his youth?
The rip saws will be found, in circular form, 10" diameter.
Not knowing where you are in the world it’s difficult to advise but look out these spear and Jackson ones. If not look at Flynn and garlick saws from Sheffield or bad axe tool works. Avoid these lie Neilson saws they are not what they want you to think they are far far to thin and wander in the cut
@@whitacrebespoke Interesting about the Lie Nielsons. I always linked them with quality - their marketing is good. Is it just their saws to avoid or is all their gear a bit Meh?
Kutulue mostly just the saws the plates are far far to thin they say it will follow its own line and it’s operator error it it won’t cut straight. I brought a back saw and took it back as every time it will follow the grain and the plate bends to follow. The planes are good quality. Although I don’t like the dovetail marker much either
I've just filed an old S and J following this video and am over the moon with the result. It's a good feeling to know I'm not forced to buy a new saw every time many thanks.
Thankyou for taking the time to make those oversized visual aids. I now clearly understand the difference between the crosscut and rip tooth pattern. Thanks for the effort involved, this novice appreciates it!!!
I’ve been searching for a rip cut saw for a long time with no success. Thank you so much for sharing this.
Dear Paul! Just hand cut my first really fitting moritise/tenon using your videos & technique. It is really rewardig seeing a simple piece of wood shaped to your own imagination. Up to now I did some furniture in my house mostly with screws or dowels. I'll do our coffee table with more traditional joinery. Thank you, thank you, thank you for all the inspiration. All the Best.
Thank you Paul
I ordered the spear&jackson yesterday and today i found this Video
Iam Happy to see that my decision wasnt bad
Greats from Germany
Cheap induction hardened saws have their place in any woodworkers toolkit. They are ideal for keeping in the back of the car, or for first cuts on reclaimed timbers...
As for IH saws being un-resharpenable, well, that's both true & untrue. Sure, you can't resharpen the original tooth pattern, but the rest of the blade can be cut & sharpened quite easily. What you need is a couple of lengths of angle iron, a big vise, and a metal scoring knife (I make mine from hardwood offcuts & old hacksaw blades).
Clamp the saw between the pieces of angle iron, teeth up, with roughly 1/4" of clear blade showing. Score the sawblade several times with the scoring knife, using the edge of the angle iron as a straightedge. (The trick is getting behind the hardened edge, but you'll easily be able to see if you're hitting the hardening with the scoring knife - if you are, reclamp with slightly more of the sawblade showing & re-score.)
Using pliers, flex the scored blade back & forth until the old cutting edge breaks off. Clean up the new edge with a file. Hey-Presto, you now have a blank saw blade, ideal for practicing your saw sharpening skills on. Better to practice on a cheap blade that would otherwise be binned, than on your more valued workshop saws...
BE SURE TO WEAR SAFETY EQUIPMENT - Leather gloves & safety glasses people!
You could also use a diamond file, they aren't as expensive as they used to be, but quality still costs money and the real cheap one are not worth buying.
As always it was an excellent demonstration and teaching. I just bought a handsaw from a Sheffield saw maker, they claim to be the last English saw makers. This video clip is going to be very useful.
Thank you Paul Seller for your service to craftsmanship.
Paul, I like very much your videos showing simple and low cost solutions and the simple techniques to improve them. You got me into using the axe and carving a spoon. A vice instead of clamps will be the next steps. A lot of respect and thanks from Switzerland.
Paul! You have saved me during difficult times with your videos! Please keep up the good work and the love for the craft! best regards.
Your commitment to helping me so much in woodworking is awesome
I’m not planning on sharpening a hand saw any time soon. However, I learned a lot about saw teeth and the differences between rip cut and cross cut saws. Never knew the blade is tapered from top to bottom. Another great learning tool experience. Thanks!
Get into the habbit of filing and sharpening them.
Great video Paul. Just the sort of advice novice woodworkers need. Me, being from Sheffield, find it a bit sad that the Spear and Jackson saw was made in Taiwan, but such is the way of the world now. It would be nice to see a similar video comparing back saws.
spear & jackson very good hand saw, but stanley fatmax is the best forever 👍
Very grateful, sir. It is always a pleasure to learn from you. It is definitely a privilege to have your knowledge. A greeting from Barcelona, Mr. Sellers.
Three cheers for the Saw Whisperer.
I suppose the 5 dislikes are people who have an overstock of hand made saws.
:D And envious, competing, woodworking video makers perhaps?
Thank you for adding this to the information out there, great examples of wisdom beginners dismiss by rushing but then don't know where to go when they do realize the mistake.
I never had a handle on the difference between Cross and Rip before this video. Subscribed.
I learn more from you then anyone else. Thank you sir. You're a pleasure to watch.
Interesting video Paul, thanks for sharing!
Bert de Weert I was actually just wondering why your videos aren't longer like these
I was looking for a sharpen-able saw and saw the S&J which seemed to fit the bill but I wanted to be sure before I actually ordered it since I couldn't see it in person first. This video cemented my decision, I've bought just one for now and will use it as it comes and then at a later date I'll buy a 2nd one and do the rip modifications. Sounds like it's a solid tool that I'll be using for a long time. Thanks for the great video, as always!
Have the echo what others have said, you make filing a hand saw interesting
Just years of experience being explained wonderfully
Thank you
I love using my $30 Japanese saw, but I hate the idea of just throwing away an old blade. Thanks for the sharpening lesson. I think the next saw I get will be one I can sharpen.
Thank you, Paul! This is a lesson to be learnt by me. Essential basics to coping with handsaws.
paul , you have more planes than ryanair
just when I think I couldn't learn something from one of your videos, you throw in a jem of wisdom! thank you sir and I'll be waiting for the next one!
Used to keep hedgehogs for pets but always released them in the wild after a while. They always did a weird burp after i fed them crepes. They loved crepes.😀
Hello Mr. Sellers, I'm a woodworking mastercraft subscriber and love your lessons and tutelage. I'm wondering if you have done a video or could do a video on restoring an old rusty hand saw like you did with the hand plane restoration. Would be very useful. Thank you.
I very much appreciate your explanations,precise and easy to understand. In one episode,I noticed what looks to be a book shelf in the background. This is something that I have been looking for. I am wondering if it's possible to share or purchase the plans? You make it a joy to watch your videos,and showing how any one can make hand tools and maintain what we use,to get the best results. Thank you very much.
The Spear and Jackson saw is currently $109.99 on Amazon here in the US...great video Paul, trhanks.
Thank you so much for such an in-depth video on those saws. Very helpful as always.
On Rex's channel the Spear & Jackson saw had excessive set, and when reduced it made it an even better, more accurate saw.
Saw the video and I do think he improved it. I think it's worth mentioning that when you take some set out of the teeth, what you give up is steerability. The narrow kerf means if you get off track it's hard to steer back to your line. Rex does mention this when discussing the narrow kerf Japanese saws. It's a good channel. He should get his own PBS show.
Even if I could afford that LN, I deserve the S&J more for what I will ever be able to do with hand tools. Sadly, the less expensive saws are not as easy to come by in the states. I did find some nice vintage saws but getting my sharpening skills up to snuff is not all that easy after leaving that for 40 years. Thanks for posting this!
I would suggest if you can afford it buy some good tools. S&j are a good beginners tool.
Thanks for taking the time to make the video. Where do I buy years of experience?
They're free!
You remind me of the guy who taught me James Price, we gave him shit as a class but we all respected and listened to him because he couldn't be beaten in skill, he actually also taught my father when he was in college.
Although an obsessive woodworker I am also a builder for a living, and as such use hard point saws all the time. I use the spear and Jackson predator saws and when new they are unbelievably sharp and cut an absolute dream. ( cross cutting more so than ripping, and now I know why) My question is, having never used a traditional saw, is a freshly sharpened traditional saw as sharp, as a good quality hard point saw ?
Yep
I have lots of late 70s and 80s versions of these spear and Jackson saws handed down from my late farther, they are great every day saws I use mine for site work and in the workshop. As I have now vowed not to buy another disposable hard point I'm getting down those I had so the S&Js are getting more and more work as are some of my vintage ones. I think S&J don't offer a rip because they don't have the machine tooling to do it any more. Would be interested to know where they are made as S&J until about 2 years ago put made in England on them now I notice there's no mention of that.
He mentioned the S+J was made in Taiwan but I'm not sure if that was just a throw away comment meaning 'outsourced to cheap labour in Asia'. I would have thought that S+J would have access to the tooling to make a rip template but don't more to do with economic reasons - and they could certainly outsource to produce a rip saw like they have with the cross cut variant - but I think it's more to do with demand which in turn leaves knowledgeable craftsmen out of a place to buy a reasonably priced rip saw......
+Jonto Dickens S&J own some of the biggest and best names in hand tools they brought the lot (well those Stanley and irwin didn't). Elwell, tyzack, brades, amongst many others so the tooling was there as tyzack and elwell both made good saws. What I suspect though is they figured them out here in the uk then shipped manufacturing out side. What you will find is they are punched in the same machine as the hard points hence no rip available. If you want a new rip from factory at a fairly reasonable price by one from Flinn and garlick they are more expensive (not as expensive as the designer tools) but worth it.
+Jonto Dickens just read in a book on British saws that S&J are England's oldest saw maker and they have shafted there history.
Thank you so much for these types of reviews of more economical tools!
Can you do cheap vs expensive vs vintage handsaws?
13:24 They dictate to you what you can buy and don't really give you what you really need. Amazing as usual.
Rip se
Qw
On a side topic it would be awesome if they would make blades for sawzalls that are wide like handsaws
The audio and visual are both very sharp and clear! Have you changed cameras?
No.
+Nathan Tonning I think this might have been filmed in the new shop. The lighting is far and away better than ever before.
+Nathan Tonning It does look outstanding.
+Nathan Tonning his new shop is all that matter, there are new lighting and new space, more importantly, new atmosphere, hence the better image quality
+Nathan Tonning Weirdly I was thinking the same thing too. Looks great now
Great video, thanks Paul! Is any triangular file suitable for the sharpening or does it have to be a special saw sharpening file? I know the latter are sold at some specialist stores, the former in any hardware store and cheaper, too. Thanks, Bjorn
I like you , sir , you are so good in lecturing , I like being so clear , and calm . I remember every word you say though my mother tongue is Arabic , thank you , gentleman .
I bought the 24 inch 9515K to try. It's OK for cross cut but not so great for rip cuts. I am debating whether to invest in refiling it and then trying again. I will point out though, that my blade measures 1.0mm thick, pretty consistently throughout, and that matches the spec sheet on the S&J website. Maybe it has changed since this video where Paul measured it at 0.81-0.85 mm? 25% difference.
i fully intend to try this great stuff but I was taught that a rip cut saw also has less teeth per inch and a bigger gap between each tooth to allow for larger amounts of swarf so that the saw cuts along the grain more efficiently as for the set they both should have a decent set to stop the sides from binding so is there a way to increase the valley size to make a rip saw cut faster
+Roc Lo You can change the number of teeth per inch ... eg you can effectively turn every second tooth into a gullet and halve the number of teeth per inch ... but if you were to do it by hand you are going to go through some files ... and good files are not super abundant these days.
Someone with a re-toothing machine that punches out the teeth could easily strip off the original teeth and create any pitch you wanted.
+Paul McGee i wish i knew someone like that, i suppose I'll have to decide which one i want more my file was given to me by my dad he got it from his dad now i have the file any instructional videos on how to proceed on this technique I'm very curious about the shape of the valley/gullet as i have seen they differ in some saws some people say its got to do with the swarf or shavings and how they curl into the gullet so i'm after the one that gets you through the rip the fastest.
I think that metallurgy has improved to the point that a less expensive saw is nearly as functional as the high-priced one.
By the way, would it be better to remove the varnish, and wax the blade? I think automotive brake cleaner/degreaser would remove it quickly.
+Bob Blarney Yes, but I wanted as close to new as possible. It was this that cause the vibration on the returning strokes.
Thanks for the video, and thank you for demostrate that not all time de more expensive tools are much better than a cheapest.
Poundland sell some saws which are useless as they come but can be re-filed. They are also a good source of steel for making cabinet scrapers and scratch stocks.
Hi Paul, great video again thanks for uploading. if you're ever running out of ideas for a video I'd love to see a demo of all of those handmade planes that are above your left shoulder on the video. loved the video you did on your spill plane, would be great to see the rest of them.
The latest Trad S & J's are riveted is it 'worthwhile' removing same and proper saw screws inset for cleaning and setting. (heard the rivets/handle come loose) I'm moving away the cheap fixes of my youth, next proper metal for my brace augers (bought as a Elec Apprentice (underfloor joists, conduit)))
Paul, Do you ever use the japanese-style pull cut saws?
A good video. I like the continuous presentation style and real-time teeth sharpening.
Thank you very much for the thorough explanation.
Do you have experience with japanese saws? I will certainly want to know you opinion about them.
Have a good one!
Paul, thank you, my confidence & learning builds with each video watched. Looking at the high end saw in the video, the toe end top of the plate has been shaped differently, does this serve purpose or is it just fancy design ?
When Paul pulls the file back, he’s resting it lightly in the tooth to align it and then he applies downward pressure only as he pushes forward to cut. Never apply pressure on a file while drawing backwards. It dulls and breaks its teeth. Rubbing back and forth with a file as if it were sandpaper is a sure sign that a person doesn’t know how to use it.
One comparison you could do would be to sharpened another cross cut saw the same amount of time in the cross cut fashion and then compared the two, the cross cut sharpened as a rip cut and the cross cut sharpened in a cross cut. And then compared it to the pricey rip cut saw. After you sharpened it .-.
Thanks Paul I learned a few new tricks today !
I have some old Sandvik hand saws and the blades have a slight curve . The teeth edges are not a straight edge.
I hope I explained that right.
Why is the bottom of the blade curved and what is this called?
I guess you mean the back of the blade. This is called a skew and the saw is called a skew-backed saw. The reason for it is that it makes the saw easier to steer in the cut. A slight bend along the blade usually does not affect the saw but you can bend it quite hard in the opposite way and often this is enough to straighten it. The teeth if they are not even will need jointing or topping. This is using a flat file to straighten them which means the teeth have to be filed to the new level too. Not an easy task for a novice.
Not to contradict Paul, but if you mean the teeth edge, it’s called a Breasted Toothline. A breasted saw is supposed to make the use of the saw more comfortable for long sawing sessions, since it suits better to the natural swing of the arm when it comes to full length strokes.
Bahco also make a 7tpi resharpenable saw, and it's made in Sweden
And that's why I love your videos Paul :) Thank you
For me, the hard part is not skipping teeth or filing some twice, especially with finer saws, like 10pt.
You make great woodwork teacher Mr sellers.
I really like your videos. They're so informative yet so simple to understand. I bought a bunch of hand tools at an estate sale a few years ago. The hand saws are duller than a Meril Streep movie. I've been meaning to sharpen them .. along with my grandpa's saws, my dad's saws, my uncle's saws and a few others.. lol I'm curious though. Why was there a notch missing from the tip of one of those new saws? One of mine has the same notch and I thought the guy I got it from needed a small strip of tool steel, maybe for cutting threads on dowels.. but now I'm stumped.. what's the purpose of the notch?
This was so informative and helpful, Paul. Thank you!
Hi Paul, what kind/type saw would you recommend/use on 5/8" birch plywood for both cross and rip cuts? Thank you in advance
Because the plywood is thin I would just use a crosscut handsaw made by Spear and Jackson 10ppi.
Paul, I appreciate your prompt reply, thanks!
Paul, do you ever use a diamond stone on your saws? or just a file?
GAAAAAAAH! That noise! I think we just discovered what's going to be waiting for me in Room 101.
It was absolutely horrible. I normally like listening to Paul but not with screeching metal on metal as background music.
@@joshuarosen6242 It's not much better when you're doing it yourself. But it is more rewarding.
would anyone recommend putting an old saw blade in a vinegar bath to remove the rust or will it damage the blade?
Just did that today with an old tenon saw from a boot fair that I paid £5 for. Thirty Minutes in a bath of distilled (white) vinegar and wash off under a running tap with a nail brush and the rust is dealt with. Its a bit dark, but it is smooth ready for a bit more finishing and fettling. Be aware, when you take it out of the vinegar you must rinse the vinegar off (vinegar is an acid, however mild) and dry the blade thoroughly then give it a little rub of light oil or the rust will come back within an hour.
Hi there from Portugal,
Another great video, and I love all of them :D
Thanks Master PSellsers
great show, so much information.........
What brand of saw available in the U.S. would you recommend?
+Mike W try great neck saws. lows ore home Depot carry them. I've reset and resharpened several without problems or complaints
Me too. Thanks.
Well, I use a 470 year old saw made by a very old company.it burns the hell out of me when I want to sharpen it
I'm no saw expert, and do more carving than precision woodworking, but I have a Freud rip cut saw ( made in England) that I have been pleased with. no longer recall where I ordered it from, probably Woodcraft years ago.
Looked at the Freud website, it appears they only make circular saw blades now? no handsaws listed
Thanks for another great detailed video Paul.
Great video Paul, much appreciated. Any chance you could make one to show us lesser mortals how to cut square and true? Not so much across the width of the timber, a knife wall solves that issue - I mean when you cut down into the timber. I guess practice is the answer, but is it the only answer?
The saw can be a big issue to excessive set or set to much on one side will cause wandering issues. Once you have a decent correctly set saw it then come down to practice. Like any tool a saw will try to follow the grain so it's just a case of keeping it cutting true with your hand placement.
In defence of the much more expensive saw, it's a bit shorter than the S&J saw, so each stroke is going to remove less wood sort of inherently. It's nice to know the S&J saws are not as bad as they look. I suspect the reverberation of the S&J is down to the thicker plate having less clearance in the cut, resulting in more friction. Probably a rub with an oily rag or a fraction more set would probably take care of that.
+Mooncabbage Actually, I use the same length stroke no matter the length of the saw as long as it is longer than 20". Habits become standard.The reverberating plate is caused by the extra length of the plate and then the added friction caused by the surface coating on the plate. With the coating removed and a little wax it cuts as well as any and all premium saws.
I guess it makes sense that the stroke length would be the same, you'd find a comfortable stroke and stick with it.
How did you remove the coating from the saw plate?
Would you consider doing a video on cheaper tenon saws/back saws? Good quality second hand tenon saws aren't a thing in my part of the world. I ended up buying a Veritas backsaw, which wasn't too pricey, but is actually more expensive than the S&J equivalent, probably about twice as much.
I did eventually find an old backsaw which works just fine for me, but it did take a while. The same beginning woodworker that benefits from this video might benefit from another on a starting tenon saw too.
This is GREAT. Thank you Paul. I love this channel.
great video. Very interesting for beginners like myself ^^
Especially because i need to buy a saw.
Seeing all the different kinds of saw in the store, i felt really lost and bought nothing. :D
Understand the teeth and you can then choose the saw for your purpose.
Ripcut or cross-cut, tapered metal or not, I suspect you can become accustomed to what you have and achieve great results.
What a great video Paul! Thanks!
Thanks Paul, I have learned so much from you!
Thank you!
I think that the only question left is longevity. How long does each saw last before it requires resharpening? If both saws hold a point for about the same time, I don't see much justification for a more expensive saw. Hard to spend 7 times the money for a 5% performance improvement.
+Brandon Francey No question as to longevity. I have been using it extensively now and it's still going strong.
This is unbelievably helpful.
+Paul Sellers I have to rewatch to check if it was mentioned, but is there any insight(adage) on when|why to upgrade to a more expensive saw if all you've ever known is cheap stuff?
Thanks Paul, I learned a lot, always wondered what caused the saw to vibrate on the pull stroke .do you think vibration is mostly human error??
I think the more expensive saw has less reverberation because of the shape of the tip, it's got less metal so less inertia and less steel that moves free.
I am about to convert a 8 ppi crosscut saw into a rip saw but I wonder: the crosscut saw has some rake to it and I am concerned that the rake will cause some problem if I only file across while following the (raked) gullet. Do you think I can treat the saw just like Paul did or should I try to eliminate the rake as well? Thankfull for help
So you get RIPED of with a expensive saw?
+Elroy I'm sure he's cross about it.
+Joshua Rosen I saw what you did there!
bluesideup007 These jokes are cutting me up
What a sharp comment.
If you wanted to replace the rivets with proper saw nuts, how do you remove the existing rivets?
Thank you friend 😀
Aren't rip cut saws more accurate when ripping though? I feel like they may be able to stay straight line cut more reliably than if you use a saw with crosscut teeth or with "universal" teeth
Does it make any difference for cutting plywood? Asking because plywood has layers of wood sheets arranged with the fibres at right angles to each other. What is a rip cut for one layer is a cross cut for another. Most of the work in India happens with plywood. I am a hobbyist. Thanks, Regards,
Plywood is notorious for breakout due to the layered fibres. You will only really know when you actually get the plywood and cut it.
Is pinewood not easily available in india?
Interesting, the S &J crosscut converted to a rip tooth still has the set on the teeth. Normally rip teeth don’t have set on , do they? They probably bind less I would guess.🇨🇦👍👨🦳
Could that bit of vibration with the S&J be caused by the varnish on it? That must have some effect…
Does the set matter going from what I assume is a wider set cross cut to a mildly set rip