Star Trek: Picard - re:View
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- čas přidán 25. 01. 2020
- Nerd Alert! It's Mike and Rich! They're here to talk about the new CBS All Access show, Star Trek Picard. A series that is certified fresh from Rotten Tomatoes based on a vague opening episode with little to no information. Do Mike and Rich hate it? Do they love it? Will they give it a fair shake? Who knows!?!?!! WHO CARES?!!?!?!?!?
- Zábava
CBS called RLM to get Mike's input on Picard, but Jay answered the phone
fantastic
"Lightning fast VCR repair, Jay here. Oh you need help rebooting your Star Trek franchise? Sure I can do that"
Lol
hahahaha you think RLM is that important that CBS would call them.
Its a thing that some people call a joke
By having Jay man the cameras, they forced him to listen to them talk about Star Trek for an hour again. He cannot escape.
Jay needs to complain to the labor board due to work place abuse
Jay must be feeding the Star Trek writers their ideas to get back at them for years of endless trivia.
It's probable longer then that since this was edited to the final product.
Mike is devious at torturing his coworkers
And they involved him with just enough passive aggressiveness that he couldn't mentally leave the room. Cruel.
Rich's rant about ruining Star Trek in terms of shitting on the dream of humanity turning out ok hit really hard.
its depressing that EVERYTHING has to be grimdark
Yeah a lot of people loved that about star trek. It always had these morality and hope lessons. Everything written today is dark and hopeless, it's getting old.
@@Mike-ks6qu Too many writers think dark instantly equals deep
@@BoyBlunder66 valid point, but I would like to see that old fashioned star trek optimism again lol.
i agree everybody wants to have a cry about everything thats wrong rather than looking for whats gd or trying to do something about it. cant even have optimism in sci fi
“Jay do you know who the Cardassians are?”
“Like Kim and Chloe?”
“No......”
Beware of fake Trekkies!
I talked to one today that didn't recognize Obo and Quack!
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Mike: “The writers know as much about Star Trek as Jay does.”
Jay: “Yup!”
Pure Gold
guessing it was also Jay that spelled Romulan as Romulin? 9:43
Jay chimes in lol. I know engage! 😂😂😂😂
It's spot on too, when they press Jay and he mentions Earl Grey but not how Picard likes it. In STP he now drinks decaf with milk.
"Jay, you remember 'Vash'?"
"No."
"Okay, the writers don't remember that."
I'm willing to put my money on Jay's knowledge than the writers.
Franchises don't die by being cancelled anymore, it's now a form of multi-generational mental torture where everything good is destroyed bit by bit until no one can remember what was good about them in the first place. The giant Borg cube is the ultimate form of JJ Abrams Mystery Box, filled w/the ashes of Trek.
I have seen every episode of every Trek series. I don't consider myself an expert on it but I think I understand it. I hated Discovery. It felt like a mashed together product rather than a piece of art created by inspired people who love the franchise. I am really liking Picard so far. The characters, acting, visuals, everything just feels right. And I actually feel like I am watching the Star Trek universe.
A mystery urn, if you will
Best comment
@@cellsec7703 I think they got more of the surface-level elements correct and Patrick Stewart's acting is certainly better than what we got on DISCO. But it's still a fundamentally flawed product and the Romulus plot still isn't believable within the context of everything we learned in TNG. I'm finding it almost as bad as "Into Darkness" plot- and script-wise.
The script was written by an edge lord teenager!!!!!!!
Rich’s comment on the Star Trek Lincoln moment is such an honest moment of longing it hurt to listen to. He is so right.
Summed up at 20:50
I’ve never watched Star Trek and barely even know what it’s about, but that part still made me so sad lol
Rlm missed that the writers were trying to do the same thing with the "horrible Romulan secret" being robot racism. But it's easy to miss cause everything is horrible in these new series, so it doesn't contrast like in the original.
It really struck me... I love Rich, I don't think I've ever seen him be that vulnerable honestly
"The writers know as much about Star Trek as Jay does."
1. Everything is so clear now.
2. That's an insult to Jay, because Jay also knows that he doesn't know a whole lot about Star Trek, and the writers don't know that about themselves.
Nah. The writers know that they don't know. But they don't care.
Jay knows he doesn't know Star Trak and so he never tried to write one in the first place. These morons on the other hand...
They know as much about Star Trek as Jay does, but Jay could probably write a better Star Trek show.
@@avalentova I personally don't think its even fair to blame writers. in most cases writers are just trying to get work, its the producers and license holders who are to blame
The main thing I love about that is they actually prove that basically everything in the show is the stuff Jay, as a person who doesn't care about Star Trek, knows. And he actually seemed to know a bit more than the writers, so they could have taken him on as a consultant on Star Trek trivia and it would have been better.
Kurtzman - “I spoke to JJ. He’s bringing back the Emperor who was exploded twice. That means we can find parts of Data in the explosion. He only exploded once.”
@Erik Lerström That's so stupid, it's entirely plausible. Picard vs Kahn. The fight we were...waiting for?
First class comment sir. I pissed myself.
Except it’s been established that you can manipulate the force to save one from death. There is no plausible way for Data’s parts to be salvaged. Especially not in a Romulan nebula.
It's Lores dahj-er
Ok. Sadly this made sense to me for almost a whole second.
"The bi-annual Star Trek funeral" is the most depressingly accurate way to describe this.
@@adamlevine6700 Are you trolling or shilling?
Most likely shilling troll. That or some form of brain damage from all the chemicals they snort these days.
RLM: These damn Picards keep walking on my lawn
@@adamlevine6700 That sounds like the member berries talking. Picard was just more of the same emotional gloss over nonsense Kurtzman always produces. You're only defending it because of the nostalgia factor which is ironic considering your silly accusations against Rich and Mike.
@Adam Levine
What drugs are you taking? Want some, might help me later when i watch rise skywalker.
I learned so much about Trucker culture and tradition in this episode.
There is one critical error.
The funeral pyre is fed with VHS not DVD.
That's why they call it Star Truck, baby.
Truck Trek: The Next Gas Station
Like a documentary
I learned so much about Mike's Zuckerberg-esque Illuminati sweater.
It's so depressing. When I saw the first trailer for "Picard" I got very excited, thinking it was going to be about Jean-Luc being an ambassador and diplomat, like Spock did in the latter portion of his life. But that was before I knew the awful truth about Kurtzman.
@@Mademoiselle_Katie - Seven of Nine is in this? I mean, I saw Jerry Ryan, but aside from her face and name absolutely nothing about the character was Seven. Not even remotely recognizable aside from appearance...
...which pretty much sums up every character they brought back from classic Trek, now that I think about it.
I could see Seven legitimately going rogue, but there should be some essence of her former self. Especially her intolerance to synthahol and alcohol.
Kurtzman is actually Sauron in human form, and he delights in tormenting the Edain, who he despises.
So it's a crossover.
I always knew Patrick Stewart was a bad fit. I didn't fall into the nostalgia trap. If they had brought back Ron Moore, then found a way to bring Michael Piller back from the dead, I would have given it a chance.
I thought the exact same thing. I mean, what else can you do with a 90 year old man with a reputation for skilful diplomacy? Oh right, turn him into an action star according to Kurtzman.
Watched Picard ep1 with my wife, who is not a Trek fan, and she was like "was Data his lover?"
But he was??
well Data is fully functional and programmed in many pleasuring techniques. Like silverdaddies in slings.
I bet Data vibrates in all the right places.
@@Ripcookiethief apparently even the most shriveled and calcified prostates are no match for that ultrasonic delight.
25:05 It kinda sounds like Mike did the same thing.
"And then my wife... uh oh shit"
Star Trek: Picard. Written by: Jay Bauman.
Jay finally got his revenge.
That hack!
Jay Bauman can put his Jay into my lil Bussyman.
Jay might not know anything about Star Trek but I feel like a show written by him would be way way weirder than this.
@@puttanesca621 It will probably be like TOS with a lot of body horror
17:45 Rich has NEVER made a better point than he does here, defending Gene Roddenberry's optimistic vision against this forgettable product of rank-and-file sci-fi writers who, believing they've done a service for everyone, have just kept us mired in shortsighted political thinking.
Jup, the was part of what made Star Trek enjoyable to watch, that it was set in a time when humanity had got rid of racism and all the crap from the past and was working together, and more than that trying to work together with everybody else. So many times they fell into Romulan traps they knew might be traps because they refused to leave people to die no matter who they were, and in general always tried to avoid violence where they could.
Now it's shoot first ask questions later to the point that I feel like modern writers got some 40k mixed up in their research for Star Trek. In the grim darkness of the future there is only war... and mass xenophobia.
@@Barnesofthenorth It's more like Shoot and never ask questions :/
@Ralph's Place How is Star Trek not optimistic? They live in an egalitarian society without material want or any systemic discrimination.
"evaculated"
I actually like the idea that even this Uptopia of star trek can have moments where starfleet and the federation do not live up to their own ideals all the time
in factDS9 especially shows that when push comes to shove, having to give up some of your ideals to survive is sometimes the only way to do it, hence why DS9 is regarded as one of the better written shows.
Writers: "let's make a political statement on our show about racism"
Show: "racism still exists and is still used to justify atrocities, we're fucked give up"
Writers: HELL YA!
“Don’t discount anything that’s too stupid. So, OK, Romulans in biker costumes attack Picard and the little girl.”
Best back-to-back sentences, ever.
I feel like that first part summarizes the direction of star trek in the last decade. That and "So anyways, I started blasting..."
Time to insert a scene concept that belongs in Star Wars into Star Trek
Federation can't detect a new tech that allows unauthorized persons to beam into their secured back yard... But that's not the whole plot of the movie like it would if this were a Mission impossible episode.
This is one of the funniest videos I've ever watched. I almost died laughing about the flamable martian atmosphere. Who writes this?!? Oh, yes, the STD writers...
"J. J. Abrams doesn't care about space"
Damn. He went there.
J.J. Abrams went to space??? 😲
@@johnnada2226 - I wish he would. And never come back.
@@willmccormick947 You mean Frank Herbert's Dune? Oh, wait... Warhammer 40k? Dunno he was working on those LOL
But seriously calling Star Wars greatest sci-fi franchise? More like well known, popular and mainstream (which usually disqualifies the greatest part immediately) but greatest? Just looking at movies - it has 9 main movies and 6 of those are disasters. That does not sound... well it doesn't sound great let alone greatest :D
@@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan Oh man I knew someone was going to make that comment LMFAO
The thing is Dune is not a movie franchise (and I completely agree the Lynch movie is just abysmal). The books are beyond amazing and timeless. SW is JUST those 3 movies. The rest (be it other trilogies, or stuff like Rogue one without any characters or the animated series) is okay at best, beyond terrible at worst.
So the point still stands. Star wars is not the greatest anything - unless we talk about corporate products made to sell toys (which is what most of the franchise, let's be honest, is about. Like the prequels).
Awkward Mike Myers standing nearby.
The only way I can accept "Picard" as canon is the alternate "pathetic picard" Q timeline
The problem isn't just Picard being a completely different character, but Starfleet being completely different.
I blame the subversive crap that was Deep Space 9 for paving the way to Picard.
At least thanks to parallels there is a alternate universe where this series never existed
This show, as well as Star Trek Disco, are set in the Kelvin timeline.
@@GeorgeMonet could you explain why DS9 was subversive crap?
I wouldn’t blame ds9 necessarily, but that later writers didn’t get why ds9 worked. Ds9 could have the occasional starfleet bad episode (there were always a couple a season) was because they had another show being always optimistic during their run. Currently, though, all running Star Trek shows are “dark” for many episodes.
"May I ask your name?"
"Its Dawsh"
"Dodge?"
"Mhm, Dashj"
Daaaghe?
First 30 seconds:
"Bianual Star Trek funeral..."
I wonder if they like it.
Seems more frequent than that.
LOL, certainly set the tone.
-Maybe this is just the one that perfectly ends the series and they can finally put it gracefully to rest?-
Edit: Oh noooooooooooooooo.......
10 seconds*
can you imagine how much these guys bitched about ds9 when it was on. give them ten years and they’ll be singing Picard praises
"I'll give them the benefit of the doubt" is Rich Evans trying to cope with everything
Tsukiru it’s the only mechanism he had that works :D
@John Doe I understood that reference!
No, it's Rich Evans demonstrating superiority over spastic dweebs like yourself; he's trying to talk about real elements of storytelling and how this series falls short, while you whine and shit your pants over "canon"
Mega Zeta Got it, you’re intellectual level is that of a toddler. Enjoy the pretty lights. The rest of us will continue to use our brains and question plot holes. Now it may sound crazy but we kind of expect writers to do the job they are being paid for.
20:52 to 21:10 is heartbreaking. You hear Rich's childhood come out about how inspiring Star Trek's progressivism is. That we are so far passed hate we cannot even remember it. Then you hear how they have flipped all that upside down and all Rich can say is "fuck that" over and over again, with such pain that, literally, a part of his childhood might have been ruined by this.
It hurt me to watch it because it was so true. I wanted to cry.
I swear it sounds like he starts to choke up a bit, it hurts
“Maybe it won’t suck” famous last words
"I will never leave you" says the 90 year old man.
@Dickum N Lickum the V: Emperor Of CZcams. The character, not the actor. Do you understand the difference?
@Dickum N Lickum the V: Emperor Of CZcams. Born in 2305. Set in 2399. JLP is factually 93 to 94 years old.
@@CountArtha No one has ever died of old age. There's no such thing. Picard has brain issues and a mechanical heart that has caused him near-fatal issues before. He might die earlier than most in the Star Trek universe.
Calls the guy an idiot, gets proven he’s an even bigger one...the irony is so bad I think there’s lead in the air boys...
@@sorryifoldcomment8596 I was responding to someone who said that Picard would die "of old age" at a later point by stating the fact (and you seem to agree) that there is no such actual cause of death. It's always liver failure or heart murmur or brain hemorrhage and ultimately heart failure and brain death.
Picard is a man who allowed himself to go naturally bald around the age of 50. He's unlikely to hold back the many causes of death that McCoy apparently held back to reach age 137 (an impossible age according to modern science).
Rich's frustration at their portrayal of racism is so pure & inspiring.
right, i almost cried myself when he started to get teary eyed.
@Johnny Walker Then why do you consider anti-racism left wing?
Jacob Junge Because they’re the only ones still whining about racism constantly even though it’s essentially been eliminated in the western world
@@BR-dy1ie Good meme
@@BR-dy1ie Hahahahahaha OK buddy.
Star Trek is hoping for a future where we overcome the terrible things that hold us back; today's issues are *usually* supposed to be reflected in a *different context*. Different planets, different cultures, aliens, etc. We see our problems reflected in a different context. I feel like Picard misses the mark because instead of that layer of abstraction, they just decided "HEY WHAT IF THE FEDERATION WERE ACTUALLY AMERICA?!"
It's crude, it's awkward, it doesn't *work*, and it's depressing.
As a truck driver I find this intro f****** hilarious.
They forgot to mention the tossing of coupons from Loves Stations into the funeral rig. It similar to various cultures burning symbolic paper money for the departed. 😜
There is one scene from Top Gear which comes to mind. Change gear , change gear, change gear, check mirrors, murder a prostitude, change gear, change.. murder...
Rich: Do you know Cardassians?
Jay: Uh, like Kim and Klohe and...
Mike with his eyes closed, trying really hard to stop his mind from leaving his body
Now he knows how Jay feels.
*Jay look*
this made me laugh out loud
Imagine how great this show could be if they added some Cardassians like Garak or Duckard. But that would require someone who can actually write.
This comment is what taught me that he didn't say Kardashians lol.
I love that, "Jay, do you know about Vahj?" "No" "The writers don't know about Vahj." It's conclusive, I love it.
Oh. Jay doesn't know about 'Vajj'? Surprising. Have I misspelled that?
@@caoimhinbenjamin9998 It's Vash
@@fireflynovember Great. Thanks for your very literal reply.
@@WunderbredSyndicate Only on Risa
@@WunderbredSyndicate Might be. I don't know much about Bag.
The fact that the thumbnail depicts Mike and Rich seemingly posing as the Picard facepalm meme, but it turns out that those facepalms occured organically multiple times throughout the video, is very telling.
Yeah when rich talks about the meme, they don't even use him recreating it for a thumbnail, he jus fr did that multiple times, funny asf
When Mike says "I wish they never made the Next Gen movies, I wish it just ended there," with the final scene of 'All Good Things..." He speaks for me as well. I never was completely happy with Generation, First Contact, Insurrection, or Nemesis. I think the decline of Star Trek really started there, culminating with the early cancelation of Enterprise. JJ swooped in like a necromancer to resurrect the corpse, but he filled it with the soul of a completely different type of franchise.
I quite liked First Contact, and Generations could’ve been done better if they cut out the TOS stuff and put the whole crew in the nexus.
The Next Gen movies have always felt off. Generations was just awkward, like throwing together too much nonsense. First Contact was regarded as the "good one", like Next Gen's equivalent of Wrath of Khan, but when you get past the flashiness, you're left with a plothole filled story that made no sense. If the Borg could go back in time, why wouldn't they do that... like before they were engaged in battle? And why the moment of first contact? Just go 10 years before Best of Both Worlds. Who's going to stop them? Then they could actually assimilate the Federation instead of, I dunno, Earth's first warp vessel.
It’s so funny now how people long for the days of Rick Berman. In his heyday, fans often argued that he was destroying Trek. DS9 had too much war; Roddenberry would never! Voyager sucks, Enterprise sucks, blah blah blah… and now, people realize finally how much he kept things going in the right direction overall. When Enterprise ended, the anti-Bermanites got their wishes granted. They wanted new blood. And oh boy, they’ve sure got it now…
@@RappingNinja It's going to be really fun eventually when things get so much worse people start longing for the Kurtzman days
Everyday of life must be extremely stressful for JJ and his friends. Earth's sun could go supernova literally any day now.
Yet with enough warning that a rescue armada could be comissioned halfway across the galaxy.
@Dottoman They are just shock merchants that prey on people who are already susceptible to panic... Same exact group yelled about Global Cooling and said an ice age was coming... Then Global Warming when that backfired... Now, it's Climate Change because it's the perfect strawman phrase (because OF COURSE climate changes)... The same old song and dance is tiresome ed at this point... Environmental CLEANNESS and filtering is what should be the focus... Literally can't control anything else...
@Dottoman I agree. I think it's the height of hubris to declare "we're killing the planet". The planet will be just fine no matter what happens to the climate. The only real risk is our own safety and comfort in that new environment. Even if the worst-case scenarios by the most rabid activists came true, life would go on just as it did 65 million years ago by adapting to the changes.
@Dottoman To simplify the problem, consider one of the most difficult challenges to working in a mine, or travelling in space, or in fact, any industrial, technological, or engineering activity in an enclosed space--inclusive of your mobile phone or your computer: how the frick do we get rid of the excess heat and other noxious waste?
Short answer is: we can't. The long answer is: reduce the activity until whatever it is cools off and the dust settles down. Add the problem of 'how do I get fuel for said activities' and it becomes a vicious spiral. As someone who's not very healthy to begin with...it doesn't matter what you call it, or when: we're kind of screwed.
Seeing Rich get emotional about the Lincoln scene was actually kind of moving. I love that the idea of optimism can still inspire people.
Ironically revealing your wretched pessimism and proving you a hypocrite
@@MegaZeta You ok bud?
It's really sad to see the way Star Trek has gone. I think we need that optimisim now as much as we did in the 60s.
Given how cynical he normally is, this was kinda moving.
New Trek is missing triumphant secular humanism, hell we need that message now as much as ever.
"Maybe it won't suck." Rich, you were so innocent. We all were.
I wouldn't say Picard didn't care about Data at all. Id say by the end of the series (not nemesis) he at least considered him a comrade. The level of obsession he has with him here is bat shit crazy by the writers tho.
It's fanfiction.net writer level obssession.
looking back at this rich and mike were pretty wrong about picard and data's relationship. not the obsession part but they were pretty close friends at the end of the series, they act as if picard could've cared less if data was alive or he considered him a nuisance
@@FlimFlix Yes, and no. Yes they we're friends by the end, but no in that Picard still care for Data the least of the main cast.
@@FlimFlix Yes, they said he had no interaction with Data outside of work, completely ignoring the Shakespeare scenes and others and the way Picard went to bat for Data repeatedly even after Data stole his ship, and the movies which span a longer time than the TV shows did in Star Trek time. He risked his own life in First Contact to save Data with the excuse that he would do it for any of his crew, but I don't believe that. Not to mention the last episode of TNG shows Picard finally come to the poker game, implying his relationship got closer with everyone.
Those movies are really what made them become chums.
Just wait til they see the showrunners' attempt to compete with the Baby Yoda craze... Picard's adventures with Baby Data.
My God, if there's a baby Data, it'll be proof that God is dead and we killed him.
YES!
A tiny pasty body, with Brent Spiner's head digitally grafted on.
"I didn't know androids pooped."
"I am fully functional."
Its going to happen
Baby Q. Get it right.
I legit hope they do this.
As someone who doesnt know much about Star Trek, when Rich described the Abe Lincoln thing, I understood.
And now I feel really bad for old Star Trek fans.
Same, broke my fucking heart to think about this beloved franchise being squeezed of all it has
Finally someone gets it. Thank you.
The old Trek writers used to bitch about Rodenberry's insistence on that reality. They're all trained to think that interpersonal conflict is what drives stories. It makes them have to work harder and out of their comfort zone, and it is what made old Trek stand out. Since the last showrunners of the Rodenberry era to even know that stuff shuffled out and got replaced by sloppy hacks like Kurtzman, no one even pushes for it.
@@kevintipcorn6787 "Oh Captain, my Captain"
Star Trek is more than an idea, it's more than a TV show or trend. It represents a close knit groups ideals for the future of the Human race. A path for young people to be inspired to walk on. There are more stories about changed mentalities surrounding Star Trek than there's time to write about in a year.
And yet, here we sit, helpless watching as a group of shitbirds, literally, the worst trash this planet has to offer in their bracket, the refuse of the writer's society, mistreat and abuse that legacy, that work. That life time passion people bled, sweat, and teared for.
I'd have no qualms for sending these inebriated sewage parrots to the jail for what they did. Pass it under terrorist acts against established social legacies, i don't care. As far as i'm concerned, the systematic mutilation of a legacy in this manner is a crime. Like that scumbag Lucas did for the original 3, complete with not releasing Master prints to the library, for archive.
Think about it, this would be like Random Joe, got a clue, walked in the Louvre and decided to paint some additions to any of the many established pieces of contemporary art found in there. The fuck do we send that guy to the jail, when we don't even care about what happens to a legacy piece like Star Trek, which now is getting in the protected age, as far as some countries would be concerned.
Fuck JJA, and his posse of scum, little Napoleon Midas del culo that he is.
I'm honestly surprised there wasn't a WALL around the Federation.
Mike with his written, physical pieces of paper always gets a good chuckle from me
You can see Rich's pain about the loss of that optimistic future.
My heart breaks.
This reminds me, a few weeks ago I decided to watch SW: The Rise of Skywalker, and there was that scene of Rey climbing the wreckage of the Death Star, she gets to the iconic room where Luke and Vader had their fight, and the familiar music sting plays... not a single heartstring was pulled within me, and that's when I realized my love of Star Wars was truly dead. I shed a few tears for the loss of that love as you do, but not much since it was more of the death of an elderly grandparent that had been slowly and steadily ravaged by dementia for decades rather than the sudden death of child.
Hollywood believes everything must be sacrificed on the alter of social justice. Everything.
Indeed... it's a pain we can all relate to unfortunately as we watch Abrams and his bros slowly destroy Star Trek and Star Wars...
@@commiedeer Johnson set Star Wars on the path to Skywalker.
Fun Fact: This review is 44 seconds longer than the actual episode.
Fun fact it was also 200% more entertaining
Fun fact: ... and it has much more entertainment and craftmanship in it.
Wow you’re so good at math, you should get a job doing math or something
And Picard was cheating, they're doing 17 minute "action" scenes. RLM is all killer, no filler.
It also somehow gets as much wrong about Star Trek
Man I almost wish I didn't watch this. I was never a huge Star Trek fan, but I always had a soft spot for it due to it's optimistic vision of the future. Seeing that scene with the "reporter" was like seeing someone go back in time to when I was 8 years old and thinking "Wow, Captain Picard is such a good man", then punching me in the face and telling me to "Grow up you fucking nerd". In a weird way it's kind of funny with just how wrong it all is, but like... I genuinely feel bad.
The worst part about it is that they're making Picard put to be a bad person for things that don't actually follow his character. You can criticize a favorite, beloved character sure, but if you're doing it my contriving situations that never would've happened to begin with then it's just stupid and petty
Maybe youre just over sensitive to hard questions?
@@rowlandbuck2703 Yeah, hard questions like "Should we annihilate all life in the universe with Mass Effect 3 giant octopuses?"
That's how I felt when The Last Jedi had Luke turn his back on the universe.
@@rowlandbuck2703 maybe you're just a giant smoothbrained bitch
This is also post Dominion War, where the Romulan helped defeat the Dominion. The embargo was ended and relations with the Romulan Star Empire had never been better.
The natural course of events after the Dominion War should have been peace and cordial relations between the Federation and Romulans. Then add in the fact that the Cardassians suffered greatly during the war their best course of action at the time would have been to join the Federation. That would mean the end of antagonistic relations between the 4 Great Powers in the Federation's part of the galaxy, something that fits nicely with the franchise's overall theme of peace, cooperation and tolerance. From their the next Star Trek show should have jumped ahead a few decades and given us the next Next Generation. Instead we got a prequel featuring a war, a bunch of time spent in the Mirror Universe, Section 31, and the Federation deciding to end that war by blowing up the Klingon homeworld. So not only did we as viewer get sent back to the past, that past was an ugly one completely devoid of the spirit of old Trek.
Man fuck Alex Kurtzman.
Final lines of the finale:
“What is your name girl?”
“Dodger Picard.”
very cool
I clapped
Spoiler alert
"Dodger"
*looks at force ghost of Jean-Luc*
"Dodger Picard"
@@flugelblarghen *myzenial remnant....force ghost
Waiting for the moment Picard says "Reconfigure" and an Enterprise forms around his body before he punches Borg cubes into the sun.
wow! can we have transformers in this too? maybe the Decepticons are behind the whole thing
Autobots! Roll out!
7 months late on this comment but I'd love to see you two discuss Deep Space 9
I want to see them talk about all of Star Trek, even the animated stuff
Patience, grasshopper.
How about deep space 69?
They should go through all the series and movies (the re:view format, not Plinkett)
Deep space nine is seriously underrated, I think it's even better than TNG.
Watching Mike struggle so hard to not make old people jokes is incredible
The passion in Rich's voice talking about his favourite episode killed me
IGottaFinishThatPresentationSoon His distaste with this depiction of star treck is palpable.
I thought he was going to start tearing up, cause I about did.
I haven't really seen a lot of TOS, but I feel is disappointment and anguish. Just fucking leave star trek alone!
GamenRyder said the entire internet.
Rich to Jay: "do you know Cardassian?"
Jay: "Like Kim and Khloe?"
Rich: _Hello darkness my old friend_ "no..."
I've had this happen several times. Is no one watching DS9?
@Spit Dragon ill make sure to schedule a doctors appointment pronto
Odo does a great kardashian neck trick
Gotta defend DS9 a bit. It is darker then most of the other Star Trek shows, however, it still has so much life and joy. It analyzes themes of loss and trauma while also contrasting with themes of healing and growth. Like I love Sisko and Jake's relationship, it is so loving nice. I love the character growth and development. Watching Picard frustrated me because it felt like everyone involved didn't understand that there is a difference between acknowledging dark or traumatic things, and writing like that is all there is. Grimdark is an awful trend and I hate it. DS9 acknowledges some of the sadder things of life and the world, but it never forgets to remind people of the wonderful aspects of life. That fundamentally, things can be bad, but they will get better, because life is good. DS9 just feels alive to me, and I love it for it.
DS9 taught us all the message that the future wasn't going to be easy, but it was a future worth fighting for.
Well said. I love DS9, even with how scary and dark things can get there was hope got a bright future. For as much pressure and how high of a death toll Sisko looks at he has plans for his future in a time of peace. We see how far people are willing to go for that peace. In The Pale Moonlight was fantastic.
DS9 also showed that the optimistic view of star trek doesn’t survive any kind of realistic setting and or the moment a stronger alien force or outer entity threatens it
as soon as the dominion come, star-fleet is literally faced with an enemy whose not only stronger then them, but then them and the romulans, the klingons and the federation itself all together.
Which was an interesting thing, that when actually faced with an enemy who was superior, how long do starfleet and federation ideals last... turns out not that, well not very long.
@Imperial Judesmen138
I would say they didn’t live up to those ideals as much as they thought they did, nor was the peaceful utopia so peaceful as we are told or shown...
the original series and TNG have many episodes where they show the federation and humanities blind spots or faults and that they may not be as perfect as everyone thinks and or wants...
But yeah the goal of those ideals is the thing to strive for and to fight for...
and yes that’s the point, it’s not hopeless...Picard for example never once suggest it’s hopeless, if anything picard’s struggle and journey in the series is to fix what was made wrong and try and bring some of that idealism back...
Now whether or not the series works in terms of writing (it has ups and downs) but to try and push this idea that Picard.
You know what roddenberry’s oringal utopia is...it’s not a goal that we all can strive to, it’s a lie/tansay that makes us think that one day we can achieve this, but never shows or explains how we do that in reality
so everyone just holds this idea with no idea how to bring it abut, what to do, and or how they’re going to put down millions f years of ingrained biological imperatives that contributes to our problems...
I’m more insulted by the lie/fantasy then reality, it’s just a feel good tool to assure you “oh it will get better...somehow..."
Well somehow doesn’t fix real life issues, optimism is great, when you have an actual plan, when you don't it’s just ignoring the real life shit that’s going to get us killed because you feel and hope things will magically somehow turn out all right.
DS9 is my favorite
DS9 Is gritty but because it's as Bashir puts it "Frontier medicine".
When Sisko says my favourite line "It's easy to be a saint in paradise" , he still acknowledges the existence of paradise.
Can't compare what Steven Behr and JJ did, the former just added nuance to the universe by showing the least privileged part of a "perfect" society populated by imperfect beings trying to survive in an imperfect universe, the latter just rewrote it as generic popcorn sci-fi that doesn't know how stars works.
@@seanodeli7031 It's still the frontier (border would be a more accurate term if we step off the boundaries of Bashir's line) of the Federation, which precisely makes it the most important place, the frontier status being signified deeper by Bajor being the latest world to submit for membership, the wormhole literally the frontier/border between both galactic quadrants.
What the wormhole did was turn the station into a customs office in said frontier/border.
Tho you could argue the Dominion Wars, specially when Cardassia and the Breen joined forces with them, that makes both quadrants feel more like one.
Rich sounds lke he's either going to spontaneously cry OR laugh the entire time. You guys are awesome, thank you for what you do.
I love Rich, he sounds like the air being squeezed out a balloon end.
"Jay, do you remember Vaash?" "...no?" "OK, then the writers don't remember that."
Loved it.
I'm rewatching this today, having learned that Kurtzman's contract with CBS has been extended. "Anger" doesn't even begin to cover it.
CBS doesn't need ratings. They have a money printer and investment funds from money launderers.
Paramount only cares about putting out loads of crap to try and push their awful streaming service. Fuck if it is good or not.
@Mittens FastPaw Content is content. And if someone sees a series has multiple seasons, they can be tricked into watching it, cause "it has to be decent if it lasted multiple seasons"
If Kurtzman got involved with the Tolkein universe, world peace would be achieved by the mutual understanding and evolving love between a heroic elven prince and a tough but misunderstood orc who bond over their mutual jujitsu skills.
El’nor the Elf Samurai?
Please go back and review the entire series when it's over and call it "Half in the Borg."
This. Yes please.
Data was half in a borg
please don't
"The smudgy, disgusting fingerprints of J. J. Abrams and Alex Kurtzman."
Yup!
The smudgy, greasy, Cheeto-stained, cum-encrusted, disgusting fingerprints . . .
Very likely, considering the very shady things around him and the fact that he has no talent at all, he's greased various palms. And mind you, in Hollywood, that's 99.9% sure, to be a very disgusting thing. Years from now, when it does surface, you'll finally know and be disgusted.
I'm glad Mike didn't ever suggest JJ direct any movies.
You guys are dicks. JJ is a talented person and actually has made things people see unlike y'all
@@anthonymartensen3164 What kind of adult insists on being called "JJ"
Like Rich, I loved that moment with Lincoln and Uhura. That for me was far more progressive and hopeful than the far more often referenced "First interracial kiss". Which in context of its episode is basically both of them being victims of sexual assault, as telepaths mind controlled them to do it against their wills.
Remember when Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country had a similar situation where the Klingon Empire also experienced a catastrophe and required federation Aid, or at least peace? Remember how smart that movie handled the topic and the struggles of forgiving and aiding an enemy. Yeah just watch that instead.
But the Klingons weren't the Federation's enem... wait.
that movie is still so good. the only thing that doesn't hold up is the 1991 CGI for the floating pink Klingon blood.
Yep. I figured that after Cardassia was almost destroyed in the Dominion War and the Romulan sun exploded that we would see the Federation, Klingons, Romulans, and Cardassians set aside their differences to prevent two great powers of the quadrant from falling into chaos. Especially because the Dominion is still out there and probably smarting from their loss, not to mention the continuing Borg threat. All those people setting aside their differences would have just further cemented the message that tolerance and peace is best for everyone. But nah just have everyone regress into being petty assholes. That's what I want from my fiction: a world that's just a shitty as the one I live in.
I thought Rich Evans was over in China trying to find a cure for that new virus.
He already did.
@@thenamelessone6119 God bless Rich Evans, as we are not worthy of his greatness.
I thought he WAS the new virus?
@CYYLEE He aint never gonna find a cure for that one.
Rich Evans already has a cure. He just needs to laugh.
I hate how we can't just have nice things anymore. Everything has to be deconstructed into a dystopia. Nihilism is seen as wisdom reserved for the mature, and pissant misanthropy is worn like a badge of honor.
It will never change until Hollywood stops having political tests for parts and you have people making movies with views that aren't to the left of Marx.
@@tola6327
Another thing that would be great is people (fans and creators) either understanding who the fuck Marx was and what he actually said, or just shutting up about him forever so as not to dimly shoehorn his name into every conversation.
@@tola6327 Yes, because actors write their own screenplays..
Quit the meth, conspiracy theories and bipolar political comments don't look good on anyone but Charlie Sheen.
@@tola6327 you're absolutely clueless if you think that neoliberal identity politics maniacs are even truly leftist, much less marxist
Amen brother. At least this is a solution to the Fermi Paradox.
When they made the joke about Data being Picards lovers, all I could think about was that one moment from the episode where Data and Picard are traveling to romulus to find Spock. ( Unification Part one, I think- ) And while they are waiting to reach romulus they end up staying in the same quarters, as Picard does his best to try and sleep, without being freaked out by data who's just standing in the corning of the room staring at him.
RLM Star Trek: Picard re:View drinking game: every time Rich says he'll give Picard "the benefit of the doubt," take three shots. (the goal here is to try and forget that you just watched Picard)
The Federation not helping the Romulans doesn't make sense. This is all happening post Dominon War, where the Romulans joining with the Federation and Klingons in an alliance is what saved the Alpha Quadrant.
Agreed. It’s like they said, no one writing this actually has much knowledge of the lore.
Gem Hadar!
Would've made more sense as the Cardassians. Probably lots of bad blood in the Federation.
Can you imagine if they gave this writing assignment to people who actually know what the show is about? Maybe even RLM? As opposed to those mouth breathers who can't even read or write because they likely never finished 10th grade and became "writers" "cause it was cool".
Also (Mike and Rich forget to bring this up) there's the whole parallel between the Romulan supernova and the Klingon moon of Praxis. We've already danced this whole fandango before in Star Trek VI - Kirk even plays the bad guy for a while with his "let them die" comment. Star trek VI was literally built around the idea that humanity is better than Kirk's moment of weakness and the few bad eggs like Admiral Cartwright who tried to destroy the Klingons rather than save them. Now apparently the Federation has fallen further than those xenophobic bigots.
So nobody remembers Jack Crusher? Dr. Beverly' Crusher's husband who died??? On TNG Picard outright said Jack was his best friend, and they both served together for years on the Stargazer. Picard felt guilty about his death because some situation happened on an away team mission where Picard had to make a command decision to leave Jack behind in order to save others. (Which perhaps explains why he distanced himself more from his crew later in life.) Even when Jack was still alive, Jean-Luc had a crush on Beverly, which made for some complicated, guilt- laced romantic tension throughout the TV show. I would argue Picard was much closer to Beverly than Data and knew her for a much longer period of time. Also, if the events of Nemesis are being referenced so much for the plot's sake with Data's sacrifice and B-4, I assume all the other lackluster TNG movies are also canon. That means that Picard is living in the same place where his brother and nephew were horribly burned to death in a fire (Generations.). Yet he's being haunted by dreams of Data...
"Jay, do you know Jack Crusher?"
"I thought his name was Wesley"
Yeah......lets move any nice location to live in the explored universe. I know, that vineyard where Robert and Rene got incinerated.........perfect! Like Picard, a man capable of so much deep thought would do such a thing............
And he decided to have an interview on that property...
@@buggerlugz6753 I could see him going there specifically because of that bad event, to reclaim their memory and remember them as they lived, not as they died. What happened was a tragedy, but there can also be good to remember.
@@deathsdentist Yes, I can see him living there to carry on the family business in their honor, but he should be dreaming of them every night, not Data lol
I love the idea of someone rushing into the smoldering remains of the Enterprise D on Veridian III to retrieve the Captain Picard Day banner.
So coming back to this after rewatching TNG, I think Picard had positive feelings towards Data, but not enough to make him a stand-out individual in Picard's life outside of the novelty. I'd say his strongest relationship with the formal crew was actually Worf. I know Mike and Rich don't care much about the Klingon politics, but those episodes really showed off a level of investment and respect in Worf that Picard didn't demonstrate in nearly any other character. Not saying Picard should've been having dreams about Worf instead, but that Picard did form bonds just in his own way and not like a Kirk or Sisko.
good point! like worf is the only character Picard would choose over star fleet
In TNG there are many examples where Picard stands up and defends each member of his crew; Worf and Data in particular because there were more episodes featuring their backstory. But he does this with Guinan, Barclay, Wesley and the host of alien civilizations. That is the beauty of his character. Picard would fight just as hard for the rights of a stranger as he would Geordi. it's why he is a model leader in this society.
Rich being the one explaining pronounciations to someone else is the greatest achievement of Picard.
I keep wondering why Mike doesn't just use subtitles, if he is so easily confused with names and words?
@@DisgruntledDoomer I just meant that Rich Evans is the one who gave us the words, "Folding Chable."
Yeah, I get the joke. But if Mike used subtitles, Rich wouldn't have to explain, etc.
One of the good things about the age of Star Trek that we live in is that whenever I listen to Mike and Rich talk about it, I'm immediately inspired to go back and watch the original shows.
*SHUT UP WESLEY!*
Lol
I had last week off from work so I signed up for Paramount + and watched about 45 episodes of the various old Trek series. It was glorious.
Here’s the thing: G type yellow stars, like our sun, don’t even go supernova to begin with. They become a red giant, and then a white dwarf. Stars large enough to go supernova are way too hot and too short lived to allow life to emerge around them. Because guess what - the emergence of life on a planet takes eons, too.
I would argue that the relationship between Data and Picard was at best a stepfather figure. We see Picard and Data bonding over things that Picard shows interests in like classical literature and theater so as that Data could better understand what it is to be a person. I remember several episodes where Picard and Data are on the holodeck and Picard is critiquing Data's Shakespeare performance, which usually consisted of him explaining the deeper meaning of the seen to us common people.
They should have had 74 cuts of Picard walking up the stairs in 9 seconds.
They already used 50 cuts in the dialogue scene which preceded that
Remember when Liam Neeson jumped over that fence?
„I believe he means television, sir. That particular form of entertainment did not last much beyond the year 2040.“ (Data in the episode „The Neutral Zone“)
Tbf we are already seeing TV die, but news in video format is still very much alive.
I can imagine news still existing, but something about the reporter and her interview style doesn't sit right. I want to think that kind of "gotcha" questioning with that presentation wouldn't be in fashion. It's not like they'd have to worry about ratings. Not to mention that she hates Romulans without justification.
Blame stupid Voyager, they had Neelix do a "cooking show" so the writers now think video content is canon now, when in reality watching a video show for them is probably in the same realm as a night serenade for us.
That explains it. Neelix reinvented television. 🙂
@@Yusuke_Denton The 24th century reporter was behaving like a 21st century reporter, manipulative and underhanded, thereby shattering Roddenberry's vision of a more enlightened future for humanity.
Just like Daj and her boyfriend in their scene together: they were bantering like a couple of narcissistic 21st century millennials, not conversing like two 24th century adults. "Girl, your replicator selection is so boring, like omigawd variety is the spice of life, hashtag tragic!" Fuck off.
In a world with FTL travel, supernovas can be avoided pretty easily.
In the Star Trek Online video game, the whole mess about how a Supernova would be a imminent threat to star systems light years away was explained away by the shock of the explosion being caught up by “subspecies anamolies” that could then send that shock at FTL speeds elsewhere in the galaxy. Yeah, it was dumb.
This droids blowing up Mars stuff seems like a tortured 9/11 analogy
What's even more annoying is they've already done a 9/11 analogy with the xindi arc in enterprise
I initially thought it was a Pearl Harbor reference, but knowing the track record of this show's "political commentary" 9/11 sounds more fitting for what these writers would wanna include.
The funny thing about that is Roberto Orci is the 9/11 truther, not Kurtzman. Unless he asked him for some help punching that plot point up.
JJ Abrams has the highest confirmed kills on sci fi series in the world
I hate that Penis-nosed idiot.
Jesse W wait what
If you could stop with the dog-whistle antisemitism that'd be great.
@@maxamillisman mfw a body part can now be culturally appropriated
@@kubli365 I was mostly talking about OP calling him JJ "Abraham".
Could've watched at least 3 more hours of Mike and Rich analyzing Star Trek, it never gets old.
I cannot believe it's been 3 years.
"Stop shitting on Star Trek, man". Rich sums up my feelings nicely.
"...thus making her Data and Picard's daughter"
"You're probably right"
😂
"Whatever stupid thing you can think of"
@@mustavogaia2655 oh my God that's pure genius
Definitely
Daj =Data + Jean Luc
I thought first it was Daesh...
Intel inside
"What do you know Jay?" is the greatest segment in history.
RLM should turn it into a regular gameshow miniseries
Jay what do you know about TNG?
Uhhh “Didnt he fuck the borg queen?”
20:57 I could not agree more w/ Rich! Star Trek is supposed to be inspirational, a goal to aim for; not the crap you see in Picard.
welcome to 2020 where race is ALL the matters
@@ThePsycoDolphin "I've always loved a good story. I believed that stories helped us to ennoble ourselves, to fix what was broken in us, and to help us become the people we dreamed of being. Lies that told a deeper truth."
If you cannot get that you should stop watching any media as it obviously cannot affect you and is a waste of your time.
I remember as a kid thinking Star Trek was interesting but I never got into it. Then I watched some again when I was older and thinking it was really good. I can’t claim to be a fan but even a casual viewer like me understands that universes basic rules. Violence is a last resort and only to stop the threat. Not to kill if possible. Not to cripple if possible. Most people in the 23rd and 24th century are enlightened and don’t dwell on petty things for the most part. Generally speaking everyone gets along. And most importantly there is a huge emphasis on solving problems with logic. Just watching the trailers to the show told me everything I needed to know about this.
Star Trek isn’t an action series. It isn’t meant to be a series that is set in a dystopia. It’s supposed to be a peak into humanities hypothetical future should humanity choose to come together and focus all of our efforts on growing mankind, Developing technology, divorcing ourselves from the pettier things like Greed, xenophobia, warmongering and so on. In short the show is a “hey look how great we out descendants could have it if we stop being dipshits and start improving things.” That is a message that we need to have now more than ever and yet in the face of divisive times and political turmoil we are given a show that instead says “humanity is never gonna improve. Anything good we do will be undone and eventually we will be the same idiots we are today but with fancier stuff to blow each other up with”. The fuck kind of message is that? Nihilistic, pessimistic, cynical and borderline offensive to anyone with any knowledge of the setting. Even though I’m not a huge fan of the series, it depresses me to see because it’s the same damn thing with Star Wars.
"Do you know what the trouble is? The trouble is Earth. On Earth there is no poverty, no crime, no war. You look out the window of Starfleet Headquarters and you see paradise. It's easy to be a saint in paradise, but the Maquis do not live in paradise. Out there in the demilitarized zone all the problems haven't been solved yet. Out there, there are no saints, just people. Angry, scared, determined people who are going to do whatever it takes to survive, whether it meets with Federation approval or not."
-Benjamin Sisko
DS9 wasn't darker because Starfleet was a bunch of cunts, it was darker because it took place in the fringes of civilized space, away from the ideal society and the ability to just fly away at the end of the episode. Also, Garak is best character.
Cardassians were the best DS9 characters overall. Garak, Gul-Dukat, and Damar to the lesser extent, were all great.
@@andrzejsugier Odo was the best imo.
TNG was a ray of hope. DS9 was the darkness surrounding that ray of hope. ST:P is just hopeless.
DS9 was junk.
@@ryanm7263
"Am I bothering you, captain?"
"No, please Mr. Worf, come in."
"It is over. Admiral Henry has called an end to any more hearings on this matter."
"That's good."
"Admiral Satie has left the Enterprise."
"We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. And then, before you can blink an eye, suddenly, it threatens to start all over again."
"I believed her. I-I HELPED her! I did not see what she was."
"Mr. Worf, villains who twirl their mustaches are easy to spot. Those who clothe themselves in good deeds are well-camouflaged."
"I think, after yesterday, people will not be so ready to trust her."
"Maybe. But she or someone like her will always be with us, waiting for the right climate in which to flourish - spreading fear in the name of righteousness. Vigilance, Mr. Worf. That is the price we have to continually pay."
- Worf and Picard, discussing both the investigations and the misguidedness of Admiral Satie
Racism and Xenophobia, Especially against the Romulans was a part of TNG from the outset. And showed that we must constantly fight against falling into that nature. Picard was one of the people in the federation fighting for peace and understanding, but there was a strong sentiment in the common citizen in starfleet, against them. What they are doing with the Federation not wanting to help the Romulans didn't get invented in this new show. It was always there.
"Earl Grey"
...
"Decaf"
Star Trek: Decaffeinated
Which he never drunk. That bothered me so much.
Wolf Lord Bradley drank*
@@kevinluna3257 dronk?
Drenk, surely.
Droken?
Even DS9, though much darker, still held the values of the Federation as important. Two instances I would hold up are the episode "In the Pale Moonlight", and Quark and Garak's conversation in "The Way of the Warrior".
"In the Pale Moonlight" Sisko completely betrays the ideas of the federation and of his position. But he does it to save BILLIONS of lives. He chooses the lives and well being of people over everything else, which I think can at least be argued to be a moral thing to do. And even then he feels the weight of that betrayal.
As to Quark and Garak's conversation. They use the metaphor of Root Beer to discuss how they feel like they have been contaminated by the Federation and their beliefs. Each coming from a culture where you lie, cheat and steal as a matter of course and some version of "The strong do as they wish, the weak suffer what they must" exists as the standard, are initially sickened and bewildered by the Federation's version of humanism. Yet the more they are around it, the more those kinds of ideas have grown on them.
For beliefs or messages to mean anything, they must be challenged in some way so they those ideas can be shown to survive and be correct. I think DS9 did that. Afterward, I think the wheels fell off.
Well said!
I figured that after DS9 that the most natural course of events would be peace and cordial relations between the Federation (and Klingons) and the Romulans. I also figured that the Cardassians may have been so damaged by the Dominion War that they would have decided joining the Federation was the best option. Instead it seems that despite all the horror they went through they immediately started distrusting one another again. What a bunch of bullshit.
In walks Doctor Wesley crusher to turn off Picards Hollow Deck program as if was malfunctioning and interfering with Picards Alzheimer's treatment. the end
I would complain about that soyboy returning to ruin the franchise, except it's long since been ruined
Rich Evans: "I didn't hate it..." Put that review on the dvd box cover.
@@gnarlin4964 That's how you get them... You produce some utter shite, so that your next pustule of a show looks better in comparison.
Keeping up with the Cardassians. Coming this fall to CBS All Access.
I always thought that species needed a good masseuse for those tense neck muscles.
Somehow that might be better than the Kardashians.
I do hope so.
@@barkydogable it might be better than star trek picard
Now I'm just imagining real housewives of Cardassia, and it's just a bunch of catty cardassian ladies trying to poison, blow up, or transporter malfunction each other to an early grave over giant glasses of Kanar.
I couldn't even care less about Star Trek, I'm just here to listen to Mike and Rich tear Alex Kurtzmann apart.
It's almost impressive how a man can so consistently
make junk worse and still look that smug.
Rich: "I'll give them the benefit of the doubt!".
Slowly dies with each Picard episode.
I really just want a show with Mike and Rich rambling about random Star Trek episodes for an hour.
Robbie Stanton make it a podcast!
We all did. And it was splendid.
Commentary tracks of these two beautiful bastards talking over Next Gen episodes would please me to no end.
Please, no. They got numerous details wrong in this and showed clips completely out of context to spin their narrative.
"BELIEVABILITY IS EVERTHING. IT IS THE MOST ESSENTIAL ELEMENT OF ANY STAR TREK STORY." (Roddenberry in "Writers/Directors Guide" of TNG. Yes, he used capital letters!!!)
This would be the writers' guide that said Data speaks formally because he was raised by a planet of East Asians, that Tasha Yar's childhood spent hiding from rape gangs turns her into a child at heart who's best friends with Wesley Crusher, that there should and would never be any stories about Klingons or Romulans at war or anything at all about Vulcans, that the Ferengi would be the defining villains of _The Next Generation..._ It wasn't exactly gospel even on that show.
@@MegaZeta Good point about the TNG Writer's Guide not being gospel. However, let me dig up a copy of the 1967 Writer's Guide. 'CAN YOU FIND THE MAJOR STAR TREK ERROR IN THE FOLLOWING "TEASER" FROM A STORY OUTLINE? PLEASE CHECK ONE: Inaccurate Terminology; Scientifically Incorrect; Unbelievable; Concept Weak. ANSWER: UNBELIEVABLE. Simply because we've learned during a full season of making visual science fiction that believability of characters, their actions and reactions, is our greatest need and is the most important angle factor.' FYI, It's talking about why Captain Kirk is not allowed to hug random females on the bridge whilst commanding the Enterprise in the middle of a crisis--because a U.S. Navy Captain wouldn't!
TNG is Berman Trek , Roddenberry had very little if anything to do with it.mHe had many health issues at that time.. Berman could only write about wars.
@Paul Johnson False obtuseness isn't clever. Quite obviously, their point is that Gene Roddenberry didn't always follow his own guideline. That wasn't difficult to follow.
@@djackson4657 You say that like the majority of the TNG is about war... oh wait.
I love how Mike has an "old man yelling at clouds" moment about Dahjs name.
In Star Trek Online, the story continues and you find out it's a bunch of villainous aliens we've seen before, that started the supernova from the JJ movies. In STO, they spend a whole story arc helping the Romulans, now the Romulan Republic, start a new life on a planet they just colonised, while you fight what's left of the Tal Shiar and the Romulan Star Empire. A fucking free to play MMO game made a better fitting sequel premise to most of these ideas that the JJ movies set in motion, than the actual "canon" high budget Trek series featuring some of the main cast.
STO did so much good with Star Trek. Now Paramount is forcing them to change things to fit the new stuff and write stories for it instead. Thus trying to kill it as well.
I haven't played the game but it was the Iconians right?
If they wanted a reason to explain why the Federation had such a hard time helping the Romulans in Picard all they had to say was that their resources were still stretched from helping the Cardassians rebuild after the Dominion War.
Some other thing which bothered me:
I suspect that they shot everything in 16:9 and then some producer came by and said it must look more cinematic, crop it.
The shot at San Francisco, every skyscraper is chopped off. The shot of the Eiffel Tower, the antenna is chopped off. Inside the archive, the banner is chopped off in nearly every scene.
There's that. But also, who has a 21:9 TV anyways? Not many. I get the wider aspect ratio for cinema, but I rather have my TV shows fill up the whole screen. I actually thought my TV did something wrong when I saw the black bars top and bottom.
@@genx-tv Well it allows for a wider picture. That is counterintuitive, because the black bars seem to HIDE a part of the screen, but actually it's a gain in width. In a film that's shot for 21:9 you couldn't just take away the black bars and show what's underneath. It would look weird and destroy composition.
@@NikHem343 They should've done it 2:1, Netflix-style. S1 of Discovery was 2:1 and looked quite good that way, then S2 went all the way 21:9, and it's not like it's a problem, but 21:9 is I feel just unnecessarily wide for content that will never be shown on anything but a TV screen.
GenX TV Even cinemas have 16:9 screens.
So they probably shot it at 1.85:1 and changed to to 2.35:1 in post
Man, rich coming in with that Abraham Lincoln reference made me tear up.
That’s the perfect description for Star Trek, and one of the many reasons I’ve loved the series since I was little watching it with my brother. They always acted like we did.
My brother is white and I’m half black, but we never gave a crap about that, we always knew we were family.
And the vision of the future where everyone was based on the ideal that were all marvelous in our own way, is the only future I want to believe in.
Me too, but fuck all that, EXPLOSIONS!!!
"Star Trek: There Is No Hope"
And there is the perfect illustration of why Americans are having a fundamental cultural problem with Star Trek Picard. You have forgotten what Lincoln experienced and represented at the time at which he made his great speech at Gettysburg and wheel, dealed, - sometimes lied, cajoled, bargained and threatened - recalcitrant and self-interested politicians until something remarkable was achieved. Your nation went through, as it is sometimes described, an ordeal by fire to reach the dream of an end to slavery and the notion of equal rights for all - and the country literally broke in two and set brother against brother in the bloodiest conflict you have ever known as a nation. Yet, when turned into monuments and speeches recited in civics class, your nation has done a remarkable job of transforming that reality into a more perfect image: also of papering over the inconvenient truth that 1876 was a truer conclusion to the process: a capitulation to the still simmering resentments and racism under the surface of the South; old adversaries in blue and gray now shaking hands at reunions and declaring themselves all Americans now - while back in Alabama, Jim Crow holds sway planting trees with strange fruit... It's not a unique problem to the USA - many places begin to romanticise their past as the experiences fade into nostalgia - but few do so well at making the darkest aspects of their society vanish into patriotic pride.
Why does this suggest a cultural misunderstanding of 'Picard'? Note the topic of the very first episode: Dunkirk. That reference isn't made at all lightly, and means perhaps far more than some viewers realise. In the show itself, this perception is exemplified for us by the blank reaction of the holonet interviewer: she may know the name, the event, but not the significance. To Britons, French, Belgians and Poles who have connection to the evacuation of the beach at Dunkirk, it still today has a powerful resonance. The term 'the Dunkirk Spirit' (you might also hear 'the Spirit of the Blitz'), and to an American ear it might evoke the idea of patriotic pride in a rescue achieved in the nick of time, cheerful celebration of ingenuity. Nothing could be further from the truth. That moment was seared into the national psyche. The Dunkirk Spirit is a far more fatalistic attitude - one your Civil War ancestors knew quite well and often expressed themselves, to the effect of: now things are very bad, perhaps the worst they have ever been, and like as not they are going to get even worse. There is little likelihood or expectation of success or rescue. There is no real escape, there is no turning back, little chance of unexpected aid. So we carry on anyway, because what else is there to do?
My grandfather was on that beach, suffering from a head injury, and saw men crying, gone mad with desperation, riding like maniacs through the streets on horseback. Men lined up at the beachheads, and naval officers ordered them to embark onto little boats left or right. If you went the opposite way to where you were sent, they shot them in the head with a revolver - and the next Tommy moved along. My grandfather survived, but he never forgot. Patrick Stewart's father was at Dunkirk, and the post-traumatic stress began to unravel him, until all Stewart knew was an abusive alcoholic. That is the reality of life, before they build the statues and have the ceremonies.
So, it may not be the kind of Star Trek that you were expecting or used to, but I think that it is a valid and in some ways even more powerful one that perhaps is more necessary for an audience elsewhere that has become too comfortable and too complacent about the society represented, and about themselves. I hope that, while utterly depressing, this insight has been of use. Live long and prosper!
@@MinesAGuinness What exactly are you comparing to Dunkirk? What contemporary situation could possibly inspire that kind of fatalism? Hmm?
I enjoyed your fatuous take on the postbellum American South. It's amazing. People like you learn all the wrong lessons.
@@ShellShockerSporanox I have to say that I am somewhat surprised that you have taken my commentary as some kind of political attack upon your person. My statement implied no such intent - it merely intended to inform as to the allusions made in a fictional TV show to an historical event with which some may not be fully conversant, as you yourself are not. My aim was purely to help. If you would like to tell us better what occurred at Dunkirk or the impact on survivors and upon collective memory, please continue.
"What exactly are you comparing to Dunkirk? What contemporary situation could possibly inspire that kind of fatalism? Hmm?" Well, not a 'contemporary situation' at all - and I'm not comparing it to anything: the show is. It compares it to a fictional event of rescuing Romulans from an imminent supernova. To what else could you be referring, if not that imaginary disaster? Do try to keep up, and try to recall who is saying what.
"I enjoyed your fatuous take on the postbellum American South..." Now, this is the moment when - after a statement of contention is made - you were supposed to detail your counterpoint. As it is, all we are left to ponder is the word 'fatuous' and the lack of context. Are you somehow attempting to argue that the Civil War did not have a traumatic effect upon the Union? Or that the Union did not discover reserves of determination beyond any that it had previously imagined? Or that the Union didn't face its 'ordeal by fire' by marching into the flames and out the other side? You may by arguing the well-expounded theory (made by Eric Foner and others) to the contrary that - far from survive the ordeal and reunited - that the Union was restored not renewed and hopeful, but compromised by the very forces that had rebelled and corrupted it, to reemerge as Jim Crow, and covered up in a facade of patriotic pomp and circumstance to paper over the divisions and to avoid facing them for another 100 years. I wasn't: but I offer it in case you were not able to vocalise your opinion and needed some help. Perhaps you didn't understand something, but were too embarrassed to ask a question? Perhaps the issue is that you come from a different perspective? Perhaps you wish to argue for the honor of the Southlands? Or you wanted to make a point that: 'The Civil War wasn't about slavery - it was about ethics in video-game journalism...'? If so, then do so. Don't leave us in suspense!
"People like you..." People like who? Star Trek fans? I have absolutely no idea. I would be curious to hear you elaborate. Rather odd to hear use of such language that suggests that one group of people are 'all alike' in character. Surely, you are not upset that I do not express exactly the same ideas as you; expressing anger that people won't do what you tell them; or advocating that we should all think alike? That would veer dangerously into the sphere of snowflakery. I'm sure you would agree that this would be undesirable in a free society.
@19:47 Rich makes the best argument for why the original Star Trek encapsulated hope for a future without prejudices. Wonderful Rich Evans moment!
coming from picard season 3, it’s amazing how accurate some of these predictions were
I was just thinking that. Many of their S01 predictions didn't pan out, but they were frighteningly close to the mark with S03.
Yeah scrolled through to see if someone referenced his Picard DNA throwaway comment. He was spot on with that one