Are Backside Connectors Really The Future?
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- čas přidán 28. 05. 2024
- Leo Waldock from @KitGuruTech chats with Adam at CES 2024 about the backside connector trend for PC parts, and whether it's viable for all of these companies to try their own.
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#ces2024 #interview - Věda a technologie
I see Leo from KitGuru, I click.
We need Gordon back asap!!! Please get well soon!!!!
I really dislike back facing connectors because they add a lot of depth required to the case which is a no go for rackmount cases. Personally I would rather see horizontally mounted connectors because then you could access them from either side relatively easily. It would require a couple of inches of additional length bug given how most GPUs are longer anyway case manufacturers probably are already having to account for it anyway. For GPU power I would do the same. Instead of having this bend you have to worry about on the top of the GPU you could have it on the end of it and it would hide away nicely.
The simpler option for case compatibility is for all cases to include two different motherboard tray options that can be interchanged. The Be Quiet Silent Base 802 already has a motherboard tray that can be removed and inverted so it is possible to change the motherboard tray depending on whether the motherboard’s connectors are on the front or back.
I was thinking the same thing
Removable mobo trays are a nice feature to have, anyway; they make things easier to install outside the case (CPU, coolers), work well for standalone bench testing. So I like this suggestion.
I have an ATCS Coolermaster case with a removeable motherboard tray for an old gaming rig i have, they where common on cases in the early 2000s. It would make the costs a lot higher to include 2 trays but it is a neat feature.
@@initial_kd Including two different motherboard trays would be a lot cheaper for case manufacturers than making whole new cases just for motherboards with connectors on the back.
@@initial_kd Even back in early 2000s removable motherboard trays were quite a rarity only handful of Antec and Cooler Master cases had it. I had stacker 830 with removable tray(it supported both ATX and dead on arrival BTX form factor).
ATX does seem bonkers nowadays. The RAM is perpendicular to typical front-to-back airflow. And you have the hottest components, the CPU and GPU, on the same side of the board, without even the ability to cleanly put a "duct sheet" across the board to separate/guide their air. I'm convinced we'd come up with a sandwich-style design, and rotate the RAM slots 90°, if we started from scratch today.
Nice to see the discussion.
I personally don't care about the esthetics and I don't want the headache and wasted space for larger cases behind the board to hide cables
the only benefit i see in this is if it makes the "old" standard cheaper
17:00 Why not put the power adapters on the bottom of the GPU (where the PCIE connector is) instead of the top? There might be a minor issue with clearance but it should work?
Remember when the PCBs went to the edge of the card, with the power connectors on the end right next to the passthrough. That made for such a nice clean look.
It's going to have more case compatibility issues than the more hated ATX with huge GPU.
It's just opening the door to board manufacturers forcing their own case designs on consumers. Also likely to make things more difficult for DYI in favor of pre builts from 1st party or system integrators that fall in line.
Im not even worried about having cables in the front, so Im hoping it doesn't become mainstream.
Finally. Next GPU power plugs at the end of the card. Slim PSUs. Not boxes for towers. Less RGB. All in 2098
Can you imagine if cases didn't have windows and RGB and stuff and people just bought I dunno, monitors which have all the RGB you want and are cheaper and can even display images?
I can. When I play my 4k games with high fps I do not look at a glorified shoebox. I look at my monitor. Cheers.
Gigabyte used to use 60w fan headers on its old xtreme boards, not sure if they still do
Was interested for that on my next build.
Just use EPS 12V connectors for GPUs (like HPC cards already do). Two times the power rating compared to 8 pin PCIe connector so 2x8 pins should dandle 600W.
BTF is short for Back to Front? In which case should it not be called FTB (Front to Back) as that's where the sockets are going? As long as there is enough rear case clearance for the cables or right angle connectors are supplied then it's a flipping fantastic idea 😀
Well, why don't make a top shield, or side shield in the case for all the connections, like the rear breakout for the peripherals?
If you want, you can hide what's behind the internal shield.
That would be easy and you can build it outside first for testing, too.
Don't invent the wheel, we still have it.
What would make sense to ME is update ATX 12VO to be all backside power delivery connectors. It's pretty much going nowhere in the consumer space anyway. That said, I very much DO see reasons for some connections to be front side still.
A combination of easy-as-hell builds, lower pricing (and better value), more games and game genres on PC will gain more PC gaming marketshare. In the coming years, things like DLSS, FSR, Ray, and path tracing will also leapfrog the visuals of most console gaming unless the consoles go full bore on those technologies. Lower pricing on 2K and 4K displays at 144hz or higher (not OLEDs) and more successful PC ports (the least realistic item on this long list) will also be significant factors.
I want to see the pce-e for the vga at the back of the mobo
I don't like the idea of putting changeable things on the back like SSD/nvme etc. Stuff that you have to take off, like 24pin etc, to remove the motherboard from the case I think is a good idea to have it on the back. The only issue I have is that older cases will become obsolete overnight. I don't plan on changing my D8000 any time soon.
Why just pins? Shift the CPU and GPU to the back side for a more clean look.
Even better turn the motherboard back side to front, you get a plain look.
At that point your just having the regular case and board but now with a window on the 'back side' instead of the front side.
@@initial_kd that's the joke
lol
Petty and childish Leo is the best Leo 😂
How much more does it cost having the plugs on the rear?
hundreds of dollars, probably. If adding a couple push buttons and a GHASP segment display for boot error codes adds a similar amount
Backside connectors require extra space compared to front facing connectors.
Some may be fine with that, some not. It's mostly for the looks. Regular cables don't impact cooling. And it's not like you have to reconnect something daily. Not even monthly. And then PSU can move around as well so slightly easier connection is not given. So I would consider this low priority.
Sing with me:
Since the M screw standard, you have to break out the big guns - only accessible to the US DoD - to set a standard.
AT(X) was a fluke. The reality is USB or SD card standards - confusing at best.
top man leo
It will save my back in the long run
Adjustable desk changed it for me during pandemic. If you have the desk, get one appliance with two motors- they can be found for 150-200 bucks
Bacon, tomato, and …fennel?
Maybe foccacia 🤔
@@zivzulander damb straight, if I want veggies I would order a salad!
Fungus (mushrooms)
Feta 😋
no not really unless it. is general standard to interline with all the parts withiut costing more than the regular one
If you put all the connectors on the back, that's the motherboard with a rear mounted CPU...
Back side connectors need much more space behind the motherboard, making the case unnecessary wide. I prefer standardizing on 90 degree angled motherboard connectors for 24 pin and USB.
It's an extra two centimeters it's not that deep
It is stupid. Every connection is on the front side (excluding some m.2 slots on the backside). And then this is no longer the case, but some are front, some back, and the only benefit really is it looks better (who cares). It would be better to design a whole new standard (taking into account add in cards getting bigger and needing more power) than botching this together.
Personally can't wait for this to become accessible in various boards and GPUs .. tired of cables at the front
Why can't they just do 2x300watt plugs theres no way a gpu is going to use more than 600watts in the next decade.
Back side connectors are a silly idea, being able to get at all the connectors from the same side as all the other stuff just makes so much more sense.
And while I am at it - wtf. does anyone want the extra cost and complexity of RGB decorative lights and so on. Or the cost and fragility of a window or windows on a case, neither of all that makes for a system that runs better it is just waste at best and points of failures at worse.
I've never tested my build on the motherboard box. I know people that do that. I'm not one of them. Next, I can't believe Maingear got a patent for this. or more like I can't believe that someone at the patent office went yeah let us give them a patent. I like standards. So all of them getting together and agreeing on a standard would be good. I especially like ASUS's BTF advanced if it became a standard because I don't want to run cables to my GPU. I get why kitguru had issues with Asus but they need to separate their personal feelings from the technical analysis. Asus could be the scummiest company in the world but if their engineering is good it is good.
Regarding patents: They can't possibly be read for merit by any patent office around the world. There are more writers than readers (clerks at any patent office, US, EU,...)
My only issue is the pins. They need to be changed to be more robust connectors that won't bend or break when you unpack the mobo out of the box and set it on your desk.
Maybe move the pins to the draw side? If the motherboard is just hard plastic sockets, it will be much more durable.
@@WilReid possibly. Just what they showed at CES for a couple of channels, the pin connectors for power and fans were bent just being picked up and sat down. They could even case the with a plastic shroud to protect them as well. I personally like the project zero concept, as it allows for better air flow with less interference.
Yeah, putting a raised, firm plastic fence around the perimeter of raw-pins connectors seems very reasonable.
LOL F that tick tock crap LOL as for the HVHP cable and connectors scrap it Id prefer 4 old 8 pin connectors ( 6+2 ) sticking out the back or side not the top the way they are facing the glass panel or come up with a bigger stronger that dont melt
Stupid, backside connection? Why not modular the PC casing ... You just need to plug the whole new motherboard in and no backside cables at all. Can do the same for PSU and GPU or anything you can think of. Just like "Lego Blocks", you just need to snap them up and any future upgrade will be very convenient.
backside connectors are going to cost too much for the end user...more headache than its worth. i can see this possibly be a dead format in less than 2 years.
All I hear is excuses not to do this, but in reality, most of the objections can be overcome easily. It's no different than cases that won't support certain video cards due to length. There will be growing pains, but 5 years from now no one will have front mounted power cables.
Yes, I'm disgusted by that attitude from tech people. They should never oppose advancement. Plus the concept that keeps getting bandied around that it's hard to come up with new standards and the companies could never get together is pure poppycock. They do it all the time. Thunderbolt and Magsafe are recent examples and it serves all our interests.
No.. I don't want monopoly
This is just classic overengineering at it's finest. There's zero issues with how things are done currently, and almost every case made won't be able to use this. People generally keep cases for a very very long time too as there's no reason to really change it if it works well.
18:00 so you prefer dumb 12 V NGridia HPC connector ? While not liking the Asus GC-HPCE ?
You know ( probably ) better than me, that Asus is using that connector reliably in servers for 600W and it also has some reserve.
While the cables and dumb 12V NGridia connector is at the edge already. I am saying BIG HARD NO !
Especialy when you also have the problem with clearance between fat GPUs and the side of the case with the standard Nvidia cables ( ofc most ppl would like to use some 90° or even 180° adapter to be able to fit it to the case more comfortably.
Also, why to critisie the unability to have "bigger" reserve on the Asus connector ( I bet you dont know the reserve eitherway ), why not to critisie why the GPUs are consuming a fkng half KILOWATT ??? Is this a "progress" ? Just make them more efficient on better nodes and with lower power consumption !
PS and. XBOX are for children. PC’will always be here.
Not children I respect they aren't. My entire life they've been trash.
What? This isn't even a video to bring up stupid console wars.
Not a big deal, gpu power cable and AIO water tube ruin the clean visual already 😑
Backside connectors are ridiculous, unnecessary, add complexity when trying to select parts and add unnecessary cost.
Backside connectors are dumb, because obsessing over cable management for airflow is dumb. Also because side panels were dumb in the first place. RGB is garbage.
And now with the backside connectors, everyone does realize there are cases with left and right side glass panels, yes? So moving the ugly to the other side doesn't accomplish anything.
This isn't even all that innovative for how disruptive it is.
The only "solution" needed is giving appropriate room around a damn header to actually plug into it.
Lastly, I can't trust Asus to solve even trivial issues. Just yesterday I rebuilt a Z790-V in a Torrent Compact. Now, almost all decent modern PSUs supply dual 8pin EPS cables. The board however only has a connector for 8 pin + 4 pin. No big deal right? Except that Asus in its engineering brilliance placed that 4 pin directly beside a standoff screw. Meaning I had to choose between either screwing the board down first and then connecting the EPS 12V cables (which I did and it took 2 to 3 minutes to insert them in 0 space) or break the one 8 pin into 4+4 and have live 12V dangling around in the case in a bad way. Disassembling that PC in the future is going to be an absolute 100% nightmare requiring extra long needle nose pliers most likely, or possibly just cutting something, because the motherboard cannot be taken out before removing the EPS cables now because the screw is covered.
Also, back to front sounds like ass to mouth.
Oh, and 12V HP needs to be 100% scrapped too. Maybe even dissolve PCISIG at this point since they cannot even design a freaking plug.
No, and it's a stupid idea
Why
Backside Connectors are shit
The 12VHPWR connector is garbage, it needs to die. If Nvidia thinks it's a great connector than they need to offer an unconditional warranty of burned connectors.
Most cases already have a huge cut out for accesing the CPU socket, the most annoying and ugly cables are the front panel, fan, and RGB headers. Could just move those to the back and have them layed down. Would be genius, beautiful, not require new cases.