Solid Brake Discs vs. “Floating” Brake Discs | The Shop Manual
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- čas přidán 13. 01. 2023
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When it comes to motorcycle brakes, there are regular solid discs and then what’s referred to as “floating” discs. What’s the difference, and are floating rotors really better, and if so, why? Find out in this episode of The Shop Manual.
Check out Common Tread to learn how to replace your own brake pads: rvz.la/3w1FFQh - Auta a dopravní prostředky
In need of brake discs, pads, fluid, hoses, bleeders, or other brake components and tools? RevZilla has you covered. rvz.la/3XmsdCs
You guys don't carry the Galfer Rotors I used for my bike. So I had to grab them from FuelMoto USA. :
Only thing I would have liked to hear Ari comment on is Buell's design with the rotor on the outside of the rim. I remember reading about it years ago and it sounded like a pretty solid improvement for brakes. At least in street applications. Great video as always though!
i thought you guys were gonna discuss the potential danger of floating discs. not sure what would cause the floating discs to push the pistons back causing no brakes for few pumps until pistons are back to where they should. never knew this could happen until a rider at my local track died because of brake failure. he had a tank slap and as a result, no brakes. not entirely sure what the exact explanation but according to other riders, tank slap caused the floating discs to push the pistons back. this is quite uncommon, i would really appreciate if you guys can explain this in detail.
@@yobkit1982 This happened to me on my R6. Didn't know it was caused by the floating rotors though. Got a tank slapper and then didn't need my brakes until I was coming up on a hairpin. Luckily I was taking it easy after the tank slapper and had time to mash my brakes until I got some breaking action back. Scary stuff.
@yobkit1982 the floating disks vs non floating don't make any difference in terms of pushing pads back after a tank slapper.
It happens either way
I use my feet and sandals as brakes
Sandals are free floating too.
Ok Fred F.
I use my hands
First the boots, then the socks (but not for long), lastly the skin and flesh and bone.☠️
Sometimes I add tomato sauce to my soles of my flip flops. It helps with horsepower and stoppies
I like Ari’s clear and accurate presentations of technical topics in contrast to so many on CZcams that are simply making stuff up.
Or blowing stuff way out of proportion
I agree..
Down to Earth explanation!! Keep em' coming. I've talked to him in person. He's a genuine asset to Moto community. 🤙 Keep it up Ari.
@@Cxs1a3 Like the “secret feature” that LRN2DIY and several others claimed about “locking” drill chucks. Complete BS.
Ari and Ryan F9 are moto goats 🐐
Not a motorbike guy but I'm an MTB fanatic. We have this argument all the time. Floaters say "but heat dissipation, weight, looks pretty" while solids say "budget friendly, simple". Some of you may not believe it but on a good DH run discs get hot, even on a push bike. They will offer burns and boil the rain. As a result, floaters are becoming more popular and we're seeing DOT 5.1 brakes becoming the most in thing with Hope and SRAM being incredibly popular choices. With that said, the simpler and less maintainance heavy mineral oil brakes have picked their game up, both Magura and Shimano have really upped the formulas for their mineral oils while ensuring they won't hurt older models.
My initial thought going into this video was, "yeah, obviously a 200kg bike doing 100km/h and over will want floaters, those beasts make a brake glow". Just like MTB, solid discs on motorcycles seem to be a budget offering or a lower performance offering. It makes sense, sure a set of £50 Tektro solid rotors work but a pair of Hope floating rotors at £100 a pair do it better, seems very intuitive that as speed and mass increase, that superior performance becomes less of a desire and more of a requirement.
Overall a very informative video and very well produced. No guff, no gimmicks, just pure information and some beautifully engineered examples, I wish MTB had discs as sexy as those.
As someone whose only gotten into bikes in the last 5 years, videos like this are super interesting. Maybe not something i think about when im working or riding my bike - but very cool to know all the advancements we have made over time.😁 Also just general bike knowledge is crazy helpful!
If you want something to blow your mind, stainless steel brake hoses. I replaced mine a couple years ago and the cost was roughly the same as the OEM rubber ones, but they'll both last much longer and they give much better feedback to me while I'm braking. Plus, the fact that I was able to get one that matched my bike's paint scheme was an added bonus. Those things look and perform amazingly.
@@SmallSpoonBrigadethis is one of the absolute best mods ever. I’m actually surprised almost no bikes come with them as standard.
I’ve been biking for many years and I still learn from Ari :)
Would be cool to see a video on maintenance of semi-floating discs, especially for people who live in cooler/wetter climates.
What maintenance? 👀
@@curbkreature7488 Over time the rivets can get dirt and corrosion in them seizing them up, you can also replace them if damaged or badly corroded.
@@curbkreature7488 Also good maintenance of brakes include using fine sandpaper or scotch brite to clean old brake dust from the surface of the discs themselves.
Best way to do it is to make sure you keep the bobbin/ rivit free moving . Use a 10mm bolt and nut out through the hole and turn it clockwise and anticlockwise to keep them free moving . Do this once a year ..I would not bother with sandpaper on rotor unless you are installing new pads as they work better with your pad material on the rotor/disc . Caliper maintenance is so important and lots of videos on CZcams about it .
Blow my mind. I've been riding for 30 years and always though "floating" referred to the caliper, not the disk!
You are doing God's work, Ari. Thank you, thank you, thank you.....
I've been riding two wheeled motorized vehicles for over 50 years and, honestly, I've got underwear that are older than Ari. But I always learn something from the little (ok BIG) twerp, and this one is something I've always wondered about. Thanks for the always great, and informative, (and entertaining) vids!
Maybe you and Ari could do a collab video on skids !!!
@@MuscleBandit Well played!!
I think you should replace your underwear.
Wot brand is your long lasting underwear? Yamaha 😂?
And I’m not ashamed to say.. now I know, and it only took 4 minutes 46 seconds. Thank you Ari
THANK YOU. I can't believe the number of posts on bike groups where someone will show their discs from a street bike and there will be lateral movement, and SO MANY of the replies are "it's a floating rotor, it's fine bro". NO. Full-floating and semi-floating are different and when your semi-floater becomes a full-floater, that's when it's time to replace it. Thanks for giving me my new go-to video on this topic!
I had a set of PFM Brakes, full floaters & discs are cast iron, not stainless, which cool a lot quicker. Replaced the discs & rebuilt the 2 x 6 piston calipers when I sold the bike @ 120,000 klms. Discs had about 80,000 klms & needed replacing due to wear. Bike was a 1580cc Big Block Stroker Motor Gen2 Hayabusa. I'm the inventor of the Thermoelectric Boost Cooling & Charging System. Just click on the avatar & enjoy the ride on the 2019 Kawasaki H2SXSE+
On my dirtbike I was gonna to replace my floating roder with a factory one but never mind and you drove straight through my home state Wyoming
This show never disappoints. Great job guys!
Basically your brake system is a heat converter.
I like that explanation, easy, simple, and understable.
Absolutely EPIC video! This had to be so dang hard to record and catalog. Great work by Ari and editing team!
Amazingly well explained guys. Your channel is becoming one of my favourites. Keep going 👍✌️✌️
Ever since I bought my first special Ducati a 1997 996 SPS that came with cast iron fully floating rotors I've loved those jingly jangly full floaters 😍😍😍
Abosolutaly love this series. "The Shop Manual" is the only reason I had subscribed to this channel. Unfortunatly though, I dont understand why you guys started bombarding our subscription feed with riding-gear review videos which no one is interested in (reflected in views of those videos). I then had no option but to unsuscribe. Please make more of such great informative videos and less of riding gear videos. There are millions of riders like me, who wants to learn more about their bikes but aren't interested in any of those gears you review, simply becuase we don't live in USA or Canada.
Thanks Ari! Great presentation in so little time. I finally understand what the differences are.
I love these 'Reader's Digest' condensed lessons. Keep them going! Maybe print out the transcripts into a book format with pictures.
This was a great video. Very straightforward, and it answered a few questions that I have had for a while.
The absolutely best video I've watched on the subject. Ari these videos are an incredible resource, huge props to you and the team. I've been tracking my heavy BMW on solid discs for years now, braking from 155 mph to 40 at COTA in the advanced group, I'm surprised how well my rotors have held up. Definitely looking to upgrade to semi-floating rotors soon!
Nice to see you here 😄but actually BMW's front discs on the XR are semi floating. They are still mounted on bobbins and have play in all directions, simply the hub is not present as the wheel takes care of that. No real reason to upgrade to anything different.
@@AntaresSQ01 oh wow, I just went to the garage and checked. They wiggle for sure! Amazing that after all these years I'm just learning this. Thanks!
Great knowledge Ari!!! I learn something from every Shop Manual episode!👍😎
Thank you Ari, for a clear no-nonsense video on how discs work in motorcycle brakes. Les in UK
Always enjoy the knowledge gained by watching these videos
I very informative Video. I’ve been writing motorcycles for over 30 years and I only just found this out today, goes to show you can teach an old dog new tricks.
I had worn pads thinking that was my issue with braking performance. Put in a new set and has the same issue, low performance braking with some pulsing. Also found them to wear out incredibly fast
Ended up having sand in the rivets and my rotors become solid. Cleaned them out and it's all back to normal
I was actually wondering about this but not enough to do my own research. And here we are. Short video. Perfectly explained. Thank you!
My '04 Vstrom has these types of semi-floating discs. I've always wondered why, it's nice to know now. Awesome content.
I appreciate your open minded demonstration of information as well as your analytical approach and how it is presented in a manner that helps beginners learn. 🤙
Thanks Ari! Even my old '99 Bandit 1200 has semi-floating rotors on the front... and now I know why!
This is goood. I don't delve into MC related stuff that much nowadays (despite having 269 HP bike power in the garage) but when the quality is superior (or there is lovely recorded exhaust sound), I listen. This seems to be a superb channel.
This was a great video. Extremely informative without too much jargon or feeling as if you’re being thrown all this information.
Another masterpiece from Ari......short but precise !! We love you Ari !!!
brilliant film. Informative, to the point, and engaging. Great work guys!
Awesome way of explaining the differences . Brilliant Ari , Cheers mate
I Have been watching this guy since 2016 on motorcyclist, good to see he is still doing great!
So very interesting that just yesterday I was looking at my bike and considering my floating disks and how very far we’ve come since I first started riding sports bikes back in the late ‘70’s, brilliant leaps in technology with this definitely not being the least. Maybe a general tech comparison between the two times would be interesting, brakes, carbs to injectors, fluids, tyres, there’s been quite a bit in my time. Thanks Ari, you and your mate Zac put out the best videos of what you do and you have no equal there mate. Take care and come on down back down under mate, we’ve got more than just the great ocean road, tho it is pretty schmick lol, the old road, the forest road, the putty road, all surrounding Sydney and enough to blow anyone’s mind with the beauty and sheer intensity of the corners, you’re always welcome mate, stay cool and take care Ari, thanks again mate, 11 out of 10 👍😎👌👅
nice presentation there ..Ari !..for so many years, I knew of the ventilation aspect (ventilated discs) but not of the expansion aspect (floating disc). Now I know that.. and thanks for differentiating between semi floating and floating!
Short, sweet and on point.
Great video, I love it ♥♥
I noticed one of my front rotors on my adventure bike was very lose. Upon inspection I saw that three rivets had bent flanges. This likely happened during an offroad steep and slippery leaf filled ditch mishap years ago. Took some work to flatten the rivet flanges back on the affected rivets. Bottom line, if you’re off roading with a bike with floating rotors keep in mind they’re more delicate and can be easily damaged from lateral forces.
A very timely topic as I'm waiting for it to warm up to go replace my rear pads. I'll be checking out the rotor as well.
> the rivets that secure the rotor to the carrier are either clamped right out use spring washers
I've read somewhere that when the rivets are clamped tight (without spring washers), heat expansion of the rotor can actually cause it to break the rivets - since tight rivets leave no room for it to expand. That problem is unlikely to happen during normal street riding, but then you don't really need floating discs for street riding anyway.
This is what I've been curious about for so long! Thanks Ari!
Very good presentation of the subject. Thanks.
just like usual, easy to understand. Thanks a lot Ari
Outstanding explanation as always Ari.
Good to see you on the job !
Very nice explaination Ari. Great job!
This is what I call informative video. I have learned a new thing, thank you.
Great presentation which is clear and precise.
Thanks as I learnt something new today.
I’ve always wondered about this. Great explanation
Happy New Year, Ari!
I have had this on my 07 zx10r for years. Great addition
Awesome video as always Ari and team!
Never really thought much about my brake hardware..dual floating and 4 pot, my RX4 always impresses.
Wow this was so nicely explained, I didn’t know any of this.
Clear and concise, skipping all the bs and hot take opinions.
You sir, have a new fan! 👏🏼
And let's not forget the cool cooling effect the semi-floating rotors get when you stop, and that is the legendary popping sound of the rivets singing while cooling down :D
Best sound ever to boost ones ego for going toooooooooo fast :D
Well said. Very informative. Thanks for the brake rotor lesson.
I will listen to anything he says after witnessing his side car racing video. How they didn’t tip over due to the weight of his gigantic cojones defies the laws of physics.
Good simple video, thank you.
More! More! More! Miss ya guys and your shop videos ❤
Glad to see you back.
Wow! I didn't notice this. Thanks. I learned something new today. 😊
Nice and short still to the point with no waffle love it.
Thanks! Saw an auto video last week with floating rotors on an AMG, and didn’t know what they were talking about.
Great vid, as always Ari
it's always nice to see you ari
Excellent explanation, thank you!!
Was literally just having a discussion about this a couple hours ago. Your timing couldn’t be better
love this dude so much, been watching him since the early days of mc garage
Very good and clear presentation..now i understand
And not only is the overall weight of the motorcycle reduced, but it also reduces the unsupported weight, making the suspension work better and allowing the wheel to stay in contact with the ground for longer by reducing inertia, which improves grip. and stability
Which explains why nearly all Harleys have solid rotors. I know a few do now, but other brands have had them for decades. It's these details like brakes and suspension and real chain drive that make a real difference but too many HD owners don't know enough to demand them.
Your sponsor sounds like a rejected catchphrase for Lightening McQueen. "Yeah!! KERSHAW!!"
Thanks for breaking it down Ari!
Thx Ari for another informative and interesting video.
Thanks! I needed that. Good info.
good and clear as usual, top marks. I have solid discs on my 1985 Moto Guzzi, for the type of rides I do with that (long relaxed tours, loaded) the braking power is OK but I have had issues. Even after precision grinding, wear pattern is not uniform across the disks. I guess it is a matter of mounting tolerances (disc to wheel to fork to caliper).
I have floating disks on my 916 and that is entirely different world....but of course these two bikes are at the opposite ends of the type of utilization
Hey Ari, can you please do a breakdown of what “backing it in” is and and if it’s bad for your bike? Thanks!
do it all the time on my mt09. learned on my husky te510 motard and xr400 motard. Its fun sliding the back out when entering a corner.
"Backing it in" usually refers to diving into a corner hard with the rear end loose because you were so heavy breaking that the rear wheel is traveling faster then the front. This is also the same/similar to in Drifting they call a "rear entry". They again, dive so hard into the corner the car rotates to the point of the front being behind the rear for a second or two as the car spins the rear wheels to regain control.
as for bad for your bike... Not "really", however, doing anything this dramatic and hard on the components is going to cause wear and tear, so in a way Yes, its bad for your tires, brakes, suspension and possibly for you if you mess up and cause a high side and throw yourself off like a motogp racer in the rain.
Always look forward to your videos
Easy enough. I need to go back and catch some of the older episodes for some winter time maintenance.
Extremely well explained.
Excellent video. Thank you.
Decreased unsprung weight has several benefits as well. Way back in the day, I rode a Suzuki GS850 shaft drive motorcycle. The original tire was a Dunlop. A Continental tire of the same size and rating weighed about 5 pounds less. That helped reduce the unsprung weight penalty of the shaft drive and made the bike much more controllable on rough roads. The Suzuki also had two steel front rotors and it would have been nice to dropped 8 pounds of unsprung weight on the front wheel as well. But, didn't have technology then.
So well explained.
OMG, I learned something. This was very good.
Interesting, thanks for the video
Greetings from France
Great info. Keep up the good work!
Really well explained and presented
Thanks
Nick Australia
Thanks man for the information
Very well explained.
Didn't understand before, now I do. Thanks. 👍
Good work Ari! need these form my ktm 1290 sar
Wet discs have been around a long time but due to corporate pressure they are not an option due to the length of time between pad changes, but the wet disc is the clear number 1 form of braking as it allows the best control of the braking and the best stopping distance . Macpherson tractors were the first to invent the wet disc , housing the disc brake and caliper in a sealed container filled with hydraulic fluid and the pad had a 10mm wide groove cut into the pad allowing the fluid to flow through the pad whilst the pad was being forced into the disc rotor.
Best presenter, look forward to these videos
NICE explanation
Thank you for teaching me an interesting fact today. 👍
That was a great explanation.