Dear @NicoLeonard, Grand Seiko IS Better Than Rolex
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- čas přidán 25. 02. 2023
- It’s time to, once and for all, put the matter to rest. This is for you, @NicoLeonard, because I’m going to prove to you the Grand Seiko is indeed better than Rolex.
Watch Nico’s video here! • What Your WATCH Says A...
Ask me a question over on Instagram: / andrew_morgan_watches
Catch more of me on the Watchfinder channel: / watchfinder
Here on Andrew Morgan Watches I want to bring you all the best on watches from my personal perspective. There's watch reviews, expert reactions, top 10 lists, the best and worst of the industry and a whole bunch of memes, too. So if you like Swiss watches, German watches, Japanese watches-whatever-you'll be sure to enjoy my channel! - Zábava
Point proven, Grand Seiko fans are very proud and protective, I’ve never seen a Hublot fanboy making comments or a video when someone didn’t like their favourite brand😂 All joking aside, absolutely great insightful video mate, well done! ❤️
To settle this madness. I would love to suggest Boxing Match between Nico and Andrew.
damn andrew actually sent the video to you before?
Grand seiko fans are the worst watch snobs out there tbh😅
@@rektison I'm game if you are @NicoLeonard 😅
😂
The fact that the Swiss chronometer competitions changed their rules to European only, after Seiko started taking over the top positions kind of says it all.
The European was like the kid that took the ball home when an opposition player became too good
Show me ONE mechanical (Grand) Seiko that does -2/+2 a day. There isn't one.
@@keesketsers5866 Grand Seiko spring drive does -1/+1 second a day......
@@keesketsers5866 burned LOL
@@ncode03 Hilarious accurate analogy 😆🤣
I don’t think they should be compared. One is a master watch maker and the other is the best salesman is the world
HE'S BEEN DEAD OVER 60 YEARS WHEN WILL YOU PEA BRAINS ADMIT THE MARKET DECIDES WINNERS VS LOSERS?ROLEX=WINNER!!GS=LOSERS LMAO
Yes lad 👏👏
Nailed it
They are both wanks for wankers, couple of hundred bucks worth of materials with a nice story about climbing mountains or swimming channels speaking of 'salesmen'.
Well Said!
Swiss person here. Wearing a skyflake. Most magnificent watch I have ever seen or worn.
Nico is like the first 2 seconds of the Rock’n’Roller Coaster at Disneyworld (now being retired); you find the initial sensation exhilarating, then your bladder reminds you, you drank too much iced coffee that morning. AMW is that amazing sensation you get when you get to the urinal and the floodgates burst, serene, and totally necessary.
😂😂😂 Brand new sentence!
I felt that to the deepest depths of my being!
Hahahaha, brilliant.
Brilliant! 😂😂😂
Outstanding evaluation, beautifully written. Teach me, Senpai!
First luxury watch was a GS snowflake, I’ve have always wanted a GS and after looking at omega, Rolex, Tudor, and GS. GS was by far the best for me. Not only a grail watch but the finishing was better then anything in the store and movement is better then anything currently in any Swiss watches. And the history is some of the best. I still want a omega and maybe a rolex, still want a Tudor, and a longines, and a GO, and about 2-3 dozen other watches but GS will always be near the top.
ONCE YOU GO ROLEX NOTHING ELSE COMPARES EVEN THE HOLY TRINITY THAT'S MADE UP OF CIRCLE JERK WATCHES
@@eagles4757 Why are you shouting ? Grand Seiko wipes it’s a** daily ! with the overrated, overhyped Rolex watches. And comparing Rolex to the holy trinity !? It can’t even come close to the history, finishing, complications, and movement innovations of the holy trinity group. The only area that Rolex is king at is Marketing, but not watch making.
Have a beautiful day.
@@eagles4757 this is foolish. But even fools can have their say I suppose
@@joeycan6801 NO ROLEX NO SWISS WATCH INDUSTRY FACTS 30% MARKET SHARE COULD HAVE 75% IF THEY WANTED LMAO
Never buy a watch because someone else likes it , it’s you who has to wear it , it can be Rolex , Tudor , seiko , hublo , invicta, or omega etc , it doesn’t matter as long as you love it and it makes you happy 👍
Rolex are a marketing machine. They do make some aesthetically good looking watches. When comes to movement and dial finishes the edge goes to GS without doubt🤔
GS CAN ONLY DREAM TO BE MENTIONED IN SAME BREATH AS THE KING ROLEX
@@eagles4757 LOL
@@eagles4757 I've owned both, and GS is better.
@@jesusreynosojimenez9930 I DOUBT IT LOL
@@eagles4757 Have a bad day. Go Niners!!
I've had the pleasure of visiting the Seiko museum in Tokyo. If you ever find yourself in that part of the world and you love watches, strongly recommend a visit. They really detail some of the intricate history of the brand, and honestly it was amazing. They have some really cool exhibits, such as some of the melted watches from the fire that happened in 1923. I'm back home now, but when I return to Japan I hope I will be able to revisit!
Ginza!!
@@tt756 yes!! Also very near to their flagship seiko boutique I believe :)
In my opinion I have always thought of Grand Seiko as the one that would give you the best bang for your buck. Yes they are very expensive but the fit and finish and polishing is unmatched. What makes them special is these people putting them together have a passion and love for it. I’m not say this is not true with Rolex but it “feels” more like Rolex as a company is saying our name will sell it stick our name on it and get it out the door. Also my biggest gripe is the way Rolex treats its customers if you have $35,000 you want to buy a gold Daytona they will laugh at you and tell you to piss off. I can walk into a Grand Seiko boutique and get almost any model I want or at least have it ordered.
Very much agree, we worked long and hard for our money, only for it to be dismissed by some employee in Rolex dealer. Sorry i do not sold my life, sweat, blood, and tears to be looked down upon by some employee.
Would like to point out that NONE of the reasons you present make Seiko a luxury brand. Something that is the "best bang for a buck" is almost always NOT a luxury brand by definition. You're entitled to like and buy grand Seiko but trying to classify them as something they are not isn't going to work. A fully loaded Camry is good band for the buck, does it's job well, and offers lots of luxury features. It is however, NOT a luxury car.
@@stevenc9207😅 . Clearly you never handled one
I love the idea of Grand Seiko,their craftsmanship and dials, but I just don't like any of their watch designs
The problem of buying a new GS is that you loose almost 50% of the value once you peel the stickers off, great watches and I would buy them used
Andrew 1, Nico 0 for this round. More please! Bravo to both!
I have a theory, you might not like it. Being a grey market dealer, Nico probably sells (mostly) watches that are not readily available at retail. Brands such as Rolex, Patek, AP (especially ROs) and RMs. So, consciously or subconsciously Nico hypes these brands up even further. Consciously, so that the more hype these brands generate, it's more profitable for his business. Subconsciously, as he handles these watches the most and also since they are more popular, they weigh on his judgement about quality. When Nico started on youtube he did not rave about RMs as he does now, which further validates my point.
He actually admitted to it in a video
I do wonder how many watches rm has sold vs how many promotional gifts they have given to celebrities to further hype the brand.
Nico is UK's Archie Luxury.
Sorry, I just can't watch videos with people who scream 🤷♀️🙈
It's not everyone's cuppa tea but the movement that fascinates me is Seiko's Spring Drive. It's among the world's most accurate, and it's smooth second hand moves constantly, corresponding to time itself. It reminds me of the old timey electric wall clocks that hung school hallways......in pre-quartz days.
My grail has always been a grand seiko spring drive
Not sure being the same as an old mains powered, or modern day battery powered quartz, wall clock is a great reason to want one, but whatever floats your boat.
Likewise I think the fast ticking of a high beat is actually ‘marking the moments of time’ much better than the randomness of a glide.
I am guessing this phrase will be the go to for GS fanboys in the years ahead.
I am now liking the glide less and less, and I have never got my head around it bring a quartz watch.
If you want accurate get a Seiko Astron or similar. You can have accuracy to +\- seconds per lifetime 😂
Real Top Trump Cards Winner 🏆
@@alfieakaronaldog Of course it's not the same as an old electric clock, only the smooth seconds hand is similar.
Ur a fanboy! Even saying Fanboys, is a comment without thought or meaning.....fanboy dumbass.
@@brinx8634 Errrrr it was only the smooth second hand that anyone was discussing 😂🤣😂
You are obviously the dumbass and the GS fanboy!
Do you even have a GS? I have two.
The Spring Drive is a quartz watch.
Stop being in denial and embrace it 😉
It’s a mechanically powered quartz watch …….. held on your wrist with an utterly shite bracelet!
EDIT: Brinx deleted his comment where he called me a dumbass 🙄
Hearing you say your favorite youtuber is Nico Leonard is like hearing Gordon Ramsay say his favorite restaurant is Dunkin’ Donuts.
You made me laugh. Thanks!
Grand Seiko is another level than Rolex. The proof is in the pudding. Rolex is so much about branding and demand as status object. Rolex is better on creating mental images and demand than creating watches. Rolex is good, but overrated and prices way to high compared to quality.
I have a Rolex sub and Grand Seiko White Birch. The Rolex makes me feel wealthy ( which im not ) But the Grand Seiko makes me feel wise ( which i am 😉😇 )
I think that settles the argument. 😂
Rolex people will steal you watch but GRand seiko people will ingnore you😅 so just you can wear gs with zero worried
What I like about a lot of Japanese brands, not just Seiko, is that they have a wide range of products for all price brackets. While Pilot has cheap G2s, they also have exquisite +$5000 pens much better than Montblanc
Yep. I have some Sailor pens. Exquisite.
A grand seiko paired with a Namiki pen is class
I'd love to own a Custom 823 one day.
@@arielcandoleta5347 A great pen for the money, the nibs are really special.
Rolex is great at selling Rolexes to people that care more about what people think about them than they care about watches. Grand Seiko is for people that care more about quality than prestige. I know this because I bought a Rolex before I knew about watches, and a Grand Seiko after I learned about watches but before they were becoming popular (I heard about them on a visit to Japan).
Yes! This is true. Rolex buyers are often investors and hungry for status, and not real enthusiasts is my impression.
Well said!
Great answer, I like the bit you say you bought a Rolex before you knew about watches and a GS after you learned about watches, that’s almost poetic 😁👍🏻
WRONG ROLEX OWNS GS IN EVERY WAY LMAO
The only people who seem to care so damn much about what other people think are non-Rolex owners or Rolex haters. People who enjoy Rolex watches don't give a shit. I've always found statements like yours fascinating, considering most Rolex owners -- myself being an example -- own several other watch brands, such as: Cartier, Jaeger-LeCoultre and Omega. Rolex is a brand for watch lovers AND rich people. So your argument is never going to hold any water...just some food for thought. Personally, I'm passing on the Jap watches (except for maybe the Spring Drive). It's just a taste/class thing.
This is what I commented after watching Niko’s video:
Unfortunately even Niko says stupid things sometimes. It’s not just Seiko that says Grand in front of it. It’s absolutely different level of precision and finishing including lots of hand finishing. Nico needs to visit GS factory to see how much work of the very selected polishing masters is needed to do zaratsu polishing of tens of facets of 44gs case to make it shine like a diamond. If he does that he will understand that GS is priced very moderately.
I personally am a fan of both brands. I hope to someday own pieces from each.
Good luck with that! I can guarantee you can buy a GS today, Rolex ...
@@kernicterus1233I own both and absolutely love them both.
My Pepsi is sturdy, perfectly proportioned and just feels like a workhorse that will last the rest of time. There’s a special feeling I get when winding my Rolex.
I also have a spring drive Sakura, absolutely stunning, even photos don’t do it justice. In person it glimmers like a diamond. So much so that you can still read the watch in near dark conditions. The detail in the dial is incredible, something Rolex can’t touch. And the sweeping hand is something I just stare at all the time, admiring the perfect sweep.
Having said that, the watch I am more likely to buy again is probably Rolex, probably because I’m a sucker for marketing 😂
😂 “If you were to pit a nation known for precision raking and choreographed walking against one known for chocolate and cheese, who do you think would win a watch finishing competition?” Dying… 😂😂😂
🤣🤣🤣🤣👌
To be fair, the chocolate and cheese nation are also known for making great mechanical clocks and watches.
I have a Rolex Submariner and a Grand Seiko white Birch (SD). For me, the Japanese brand is head and shoulders above Rolex when looking at the price points they sit in.
When buying a Rolex, you are doing so for the brand name and the history. They are brilliant watches, but far from the best in the market.
Grand Seiko are much newer as a brand (in it’s current form) and lack the brand identify that Rolex has. There is no comparison there. However, GS offer better dials, a wider range of movements (all industry leading), a greater selection of build materials/finishing options and far greater value for money.
rolex and history in the same sentence🤣😂🤣😂😂
Rolex made a decision to restrict the distribution of their product, raise prices and feed us Tudors To placate the people who could not afford the new prices. I reject this policy in Whole. I have moved my attention to Omega and Grand Seiko. My last four watches that I have purchased are a Speedmaster, Seamaster professional 300, The Grand Seiko Spring Drive, & a Grand Seiko With an 18 karat gold bezel. I will not purchase another Rolex. And personally I hope the speculators lose their asses.
The Skyflake is my most recent purchase & I have to say it is a cut above my Rolex watches in standard. It's definitely the most beautifully finished watch I own.
AND IT WILL BE THE FIRST YOU SELL OFF LMAO
@@eagles4757 Strange concept, but some people keep watches.
@@jamesrobert4106 WILL SEE JAMIE WILL SEE LOL
Well in mate 👏 I have a speedy but just purchased a skyflake. Beautiful watch
Nico is the very definition of a one trick pony and certainly a joke that gets boring really fast.
That 👆
Nico totally sucks.
Grand Seiko's marketing is centered around things their brand and products are doing right now. Rolex's marketing is centered around things their brand and products did 50 years ago.
Nothing wrong with heritage, but as a customer of a product I'm more excited by the promise of tangibles the brand is offering to me today rather than a vague offer to feel "connected" to stuff that happened a half century prior.
It's thanks to Andrew that I have a recent obsession with Grand Seiko, although I've been a huge fan of Japanese culture and thinking for about 20 years. I look at them with the same sense of captivation that I do a Vacheron Constantin Cornes De Vache or Patrimony, a JLC Reverso, or A Lange & Sohne 1815. While I don't doubt the appeal of a Rolex, they don't raise my pulse the same way. I'm glad there are people out there that love them, I'm just glad I'm not one of them.
YOUR GLAD YOU DON'T LOVE THE BEST WATCH BRAND IN THE WORLD OK LOL
@@eagles4757 they’re the most popular, and the best selling luxury watch brand. They don’t make the best watches. And I agree I’m glad I’m not one of them as well. Although I wouldn’t say no to an explorer 2
@@wisamal-hakim5531 LOL ROLEX=BEST
@@eagles4757 best brand coz why coz people just bought it? coz it was well advertise? the best watch should have the best movement and the watch itself!!!
@@eagles4757 haha thats all you need to say
Nico is not a watch expert in regards to quality, just an expert on selling value because that's what he's in the industry for to sell watches, and with Rolex he can probably make the highest mark up so promotes them more over far better watches techically like Grand Seiko
lol Rolex is nr 1 but such a margin he can’t even affect its market position.
Grand Seiko is fantastic but they just don’t sell as well. I
@@patrik3450 rolex is 100% hype. Go over to the website watchcharts and see that rolex, patek and all other turds are falling in price since Dec 2021. The watch flipping market bubble hyperinflated by ZIRP is coming crashing down, and more pain coming.
one thing I would like to point out though how each of these watchmakers treat their consumers. While "high end luxury" watchmakers like patek make you feel like YOU should feel privileged to don one of their watches, and will only sell you invite only, Japanese watchmakers feel privileged to serve you. If you visit any of the GS boutiques in Japan, THEY will feel privileged for you to try one of their watches. Many luxury swiss watchmakers don't even have a price on their website, because they very well know the value is "perceived" and all bs, and swing wildly almost everyday.
Nico is expert in regards to quality. Unlike a lot of ADs', Nico spent his early years servicing watches, where he learned a lot about the actual movements and build quality.
The finishing and innovation is better with Grand Seiko.
Not open for debate.
Rolex have become boring status symbols - I don’t need or lust after one.
There’s much more fun to be had.
Grand Seiko... Rolex... duke it out right here. Which is better?
Grand Seiko...by far
GS. No contest. Nico is a nob anyway.
Rolex is a mid tier watchmaker at best.... GS has the most accurate movement...period!!!! Spring drive.
Rolex makes watches out of precious metals and gems to camouflage their average movements
As you might remember I got mugged for my Rolex so I have a downer on them BUT...
The submariner always went badly out of regulation within 3 months
The metal bezel Daytona Cosmograph the paint came off the numbers on the bezel
The Gold oyster date the crown fell off the face
The yacht master the crown tube unscrewed from the body instead of the crown unscrewing from the tube
SO - not "good"
Citizen's The Citizen - solar power, washi paper dial, super titanium, and finishing on par with GS... but half the price. However... The Citizen are JDM import faff, and Rolex are unobtainium at sensible money/wait times. So GS it is.
On a serious note, my mate has a GMT quartz GS and an Air King. The Roller ain't even close on finishing
It's not only Grand Seiko, though. There is a case to be made for Omega, IWC and JLC. They are "better" in maaaany ways.
@@windsurfer_LA Personally, I feel Rolex is the most hyped watchmaker at the moment. And obviously that means stupidly high expectations for everyone involved. For that and many other reasons, I would rather buy an Omega, IWC or a JLC than a Rolex. Not to mention all the other brands at a higher or lower price point. But to each their own, I guess.
I'm generally into the tool watches and the affordable niche. Couple weeks ago I walked 5th Ave in NYC and having looked at all the major luxury brands (I skipped Jacob & Co) for the frist time. My impressions is that Grand Seiko is one of only brands in luxury niche if money was no object I'd go for. For example something like SBGY007 exceptional has fit and finish, the dial's texture and color was outstanding, plus the accuracy of the spring drive seems like they are in a league of their own. I don't care for divers but Blancpain Fifty Fathoms was pretty neat as well, and seem odd everyone focuses on Rolex subs.
IWC wasn't bad for Fliegers but seems like Sinn, Stowa or Laco would be more practical.
I agree with every point here.
Fifty Fathoms was the first diver anyways...
I would watch the linked video if I enjoyed inviting people into my living room to shout at me. I don't.
The more I understand about their watches and their ethos the more I respect that Grand Seiko has this name.
In terms of trajectory they certainly seem to be heading in a very strong direction (certainly compared to Rolex!). They have their own distinctive style, insane finishing, deliver value, listen to customers and innovate.
They do make too many (not great looking) watches, on this point I have to agree with our friend Nico.
However, they make beautiful unique dials and I think this, alongside that attention to detail, is why in 5-10 years they will build wider respect from the community.
I hope they continue to invest and harness quartz, not just because it is more attainable, but because they are such good watches in their own right. I actually hope one of these will be my next watch.
As much as even some watch people say they look at their phone for the time wouldn’t it be amazing if your watch as beautiful as it was accurate.
Walt Odetes wrote the definitive article on Rolex finishing decades ago. They've always been an entry level luxury watch.
Too funny, love both you and Nico. Thanks for making the watch world a better more informed place
Thanks 😁
One thing is for sure Rolex is a marketing genius and GS has a lot to learn in the marketing department
Grand Seiko is a better brand, I've never seen anybody that really likes Rolex watches for what they are, they just like that brand because it's an indicator of being rich and having that kind of social status 🤢🤮 most Rolex owners are a%&holes to be honest 😊
Also Nico owns a Grand Seiko, he showed it on his interview with SWG. He said all I said about GS is just acting and actually I appreciate the brand.
GS IS A NOTHING BRAND
See ? This is what we want from watch CZcamsrs...some gentle fun and needling along with some actual useful information ( i had no clue about Japan and the Julian vs Gregorian calendar thing) . All week we have seen a few not to be named channels sniping at each other accompanied by angry live streams. No, that not what I want. Cheers Andrew!
Totally agree 👍🏻
Thanks 😁
As I'm Watching your Video (Strictly due to the Title and Dying to hear your Thoughts), I'm also Enjoying a Beautiful T-Bone. As I hear you talking, I'm Cutting and taking my first Bite, when I noticed your Voice Sounded Very Familiar to me. I looked up and Noticed A Young British Man I haven't seen before and Said to Myself "Boy, his Voice Soundsssssssssss..................... Hey⚠️ it's My guy from Watch Finders,,,,, The Talking Hands😃👍. It was A Cool Moment 😎
Hello!
My first video from your channel, what a fun one! I have both a Grand Seiko and a Rolex and the GS is indeed better finished, has a nicer dial, and is just as accurate as the Rolex and basically half the price. Can‘t go wrong with either watch!
This is not an A or B decision for me. I find the design of Grand Seiko much better by far. Also that they offer the more interesting movement technology. You can debate whether it's really necessary, but at least I find it remarkable that a lot of manual labor goes into the manufacturing process.
What I like about Rolex is the impeccable craftsmanship and legendary reliability/longevity. While the designs have withstood the test of time, the date magnifier is a detail that regularly stuns me.
@@windsurfer_LA spoken like a true Luddite
I wasn't aware of that guy's opinions on GS, but I had already removed him from my suggestions long ago cause his shorts always came up in my feed and he was insufferable in ALL of them. Even more glad I did that now that I learned this new detail.
You want to really set Nico off, phone him and ask him if he has any Hublot’s with a second hand “sweep” like GS? On second hand, don’t do that; he might fly in just to light you on fire. Lol. Love it! Love my GS and my Rolex equally for different reasons.
I wanted to like Rolex, I really did. But I always get this feeling I’d be doing the company a favor if I bought one of their substandard products and that doesn’t lead to progress.
Ill admit it, I'm a Grand Seiko fan! Their watches are beautiful works of art and the spring drive is an electromechanical piece of genius!
Which one/s do you have?
I just when gs ad and rater buy a seiko since i all ready have rolex:)
Some good points well made. It raises questions like should 'Uprising' be filed under 'M' for 'Marley' or 'W' for 'Wailers'. Also minidiscs are great!
😂
Small correction;
Seiko means "Accuracy "in Kanji 精工.
Many people outside Japan misunderstand meaning of Seiko as success because identical pronunciation but different Kanji
成功(Success).It is a easy mistake.
At this point it’s not GS vs Rolex anymore. It’s Nico-tine vs Andrew.
Well done and not offensive as usual. Thanks Andrew .Alsop thanks to Niko for encouraging me hold my Grand Seiko collection very tightly.
Andrew we love you
Nizar
Phenomenal content, thank you for sharing. Over the years of collecting I have been blessed to have owned several Grand Seikos and Rolex models. Although I am a Rolex fanboy I can honestly say without any hesitation Grand Seiko is in a league of their own. Damn you !!! now I have the need to look for another :0(
I’ve locked my sights on Grand Seiko lately. It’s watches are so impressive. And those dials! Going to visit a GS boutique in Miami next month. Can’t wait!
Grand Seiko’s worst enemy is Seiko. The name does not sufficiently differentiate them from the mainstream brand. Swing and a miss on the part of their marketing department. Japanese product naming is a running joke - Pocari Sweat, Men’s Fudge, and Crunky Nude Balls are just a few examples. Remember, Nissan (then Datsun) fully intended to export a sports car to the U.S. in the ‘60s, named the Fair Lady. Only under strenuous objections from the U.S. did they relent and name it the 240Z. On top of the naming, Seiko has been driving the main brand upscale to where there is now pricing overlap between Seiko and GS. And, Seiko puts Spring Drive movements in higher end Seikos. The parent company named them “soup” and “better soup”, and then started blending the soups together. It’s a shame.
Toyota selected Lexis. But in reality everyone knows its a Toyota with a different badge. But agreed Grand Toyota would have been pretty lame.
@@sunrisejak2709stupidest logic I've heard. The toyota crown is better than a bmw hatchback while costing the same, obvious choice but ofc you just say whatever your daddy nico says
Citizen with “The Citizen” and just slapping on the eagle logo on the face is even worse.
As a bearings distributor, I have to remind that the biggest bearing brand from Germany is FAG, so not the most clever either.
Best example like toyota and lexu not so much diferent i rather buy seiko then gs o tudor
Nico is an embarrassment as a whole for the watch community, period.
I can count the number of times that I used a loupe to look at my watches on one hand, but you look at a watch while it's on your wrist hundreds or thousands of times. I'm not a huge fan of Rolex, but the least you can say is that they have timeless and well balanced designs. GS has beautiful dials and case finishing, but the overal designs are less timeless and balanced in my opinion. Have tried a few on but never found one that made me want to pull the trigger.
"A Grand Seiko owner licks the lid of a yogurt pot where a Rolex owner throws it away"
That's genius and yes I lick the lids of yogurt pots. In fact its the first thing I do. Thank you for this.
Seiko and grand seiko are the only ones who actually try to innovate and try to add value to watch chronology. Look at there spring drive and kinetic watch movements.
Seiko is an extremely good precision engineering company.
I don't really think of Rolex and Grand Seiko as competitors, actually. GS are much more dress watch oriented while Rolex (and Tudor) focus on tough but desirable watches. Grand Seiko horology is literally world beating though.
I'd quite happily have both brands represented in a collection. All I need now is the loot to make it happen!
I've liked the way Seikos and Grand Seikos(since i found them) looked compared to other watches. They just smack of timeless elegance in some pieces and rugged durability in others. I admit I'm wearing an Orient these days as a beater.
Absolutely brilliant and informative video. Thank you! I personally have always viewed Rolex more as a well made tool watch originally whose prices crept up over the decades due to the status symbol they became. GS on the other hand was created from the beginning to be what they are with clear intentions. That is, to make the most highly engineered and beautifully crafted watches as possible.
P.S. The seiko of Seikosha （精工舎）is not (成功 - means success), but it's (精工）which roughly translates to exquisitely crafted, delicately beautiful.
Thanks for watching! I got the success thing from seikos website 😅
Looks like the site was going for the wordplay!
The Seiko museum in Ginza translates "Seikosha" into English as "House of Precision", in line with what you mentioned Ray. Thanks for the videos Andrew & co., love em!
Another fun memory from that museum that I haven't been able to find referenced online is one of Kintaro Hattori's mottos, calligraphed by the man himself: "To Live is to Work"
Love to see how you’re growing on your new channel Adrian! 🎉
I think you’re looking for a different channel 😂
@@AndrewMorganWatches You might be right, Antonio 🤔
"As useful as a waterproof tampon"....I'm stealing that!
“As useful as a waterproof tampon.” I’m stealing that😂
I don't care what Nico thinks. He's crude, obnoxious and not entertaining.
*I WAS WEARING MY SUBMARINER* when I met a guy in a supermarket wearing a Grand Seiko Snowflake
There is no comparison - the Rolex is to a Grand Seiko what a Lada is to a Bentley
@@windsurfer_LA - I've owned 4 Rolex and if I have to be honest with myself - they were all sh!t. I bought them cos I was young and insecure and I wanted to prove the badly dyslexic boy who went to school in second-hand clothes and holes in his shoes had "made it". they are well-marketed trash.
The submariner always went badly out of regulation within 3 months
The metal bezel Daytona Cosmograph the paint came off the numbers on the bezel
The Gold oyster date the crown fell off the face
The yacht master the crown tube unscrewed from the body instead of the crown unscrewing from the tube
I will agree the designs are nice, but the actual watches are trash for the money. They are the NFT of the watch world.
@@windsurfer_LA - They were all bought new between 1990 and 2005 mostly from Watches of Switzerland. Equally, I LIKE the designs, I really do. But the finish quality and build quality is maybe worth the £1850 I paid for the Submariner - but it has to be laughed at for the "whatever" price they are selling for today.
If they were still £2500 ish I would not be dissing them.
@@windsurfer_LA - TBH at the time I didn't care, cos to ME a Rolex was the pinnacle of watches, so I knew no different. It was when I met the guy with GS in the supermarket line in front of me with this glinting shining amazing thing on his writs I thought "Ive been deluding myself"
Then 6 months later I suffered brain damage in a mugging for the Cosmograph and sold the other 3 to Watchfinder JUST before the prices went sky high.
At that point my bitterness at Rolex kinda crystalised. But the faults are the faults, and they should not happen - also the ratchet on the submariner's bezel stopped working but I think that was just dirt in the mechanism.
@Piccalilli I’m no Rolex lover but I have a hard time believing your experience with them.
Lemme be honest with you. I once couldnt care less about watch. One day after binging content about 3d printing, which brought me to escapement, which brought me to watchfinder video about grand seiko snowflake, i fell in love.
Especially considering i was once the "failure" compared to my peers in uni who turns into biglaw lawyers or now a partners of their own firms, i toil hard, being in house staff, until one day reach the in house level in MNC that make me being courted by my successful peers even though my payrate were still Seiko level.
GS resonates with me.
Then my stepfather died, as stepson i inherit nothing but he left me his watch, a quartz chronograph seiko engraved with company name and his name for decades of service. It is my treasure, one i cherised more than a lot of more expensive watches gifted to me from time to time.
So yeah, you did convert me to grand seiko fanboyism
The reordering of the minidisc collection bit has absolutely done me in 😂😂
😁
Nico is an equivalent to a teenager yelling I am rich... That is the kind demographic he is aiming for... His content is borderline unbearable to anyone who is older than 14.
Thank you for your kind message ❤️ Hope you have a lovely day
Nico does what he does brilliantly, and so does Andrew. Obviously to pass such a comment you must now be 15 years old.
@NationalPlate Exactly👍🏼 He's just a watch flipper who happens to have a youtube channel that's backed by a big Company that makes YT videos consisting of editors, content creators, marketers, and he's just a puppet of that show.
Anyone sad enough to rant and bitch about watch preferences is someone I don't want to know.
Like both and would love to own either. If you love watches you aren't going to be bothered about residuals or what other people think of what is on your wrist. Except of course if the people who do notice are wearing balaclavas and holding machetes. Then I would probably think "damn.everyone knows what a rolex looks like. Should have worn the gs".
I HAVE 5 ROLEX WATCHES AND MAYBE 2 TIMES IN 20 YEARS SOMEONE ASKED IS THAT A ROLEX EVERYBODY WHO SAYS PEOPLE ONLY BUY ROLEX FOR STATUS IS HATERS WE BUY THEM BECAUSE DOLLAR FOR DOLLAR NOT A BETTER WATCH IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!
Who is Nico Leonard? Greetings from a fellow Civil Engineer.
Love your videos! As a Japanese I need to tell you Seiko-sha means "house of precision" though.
We have so many homophones haha
I ordered an AP for my 65th, it didn't arrive on time ( & still hasn't), so I bought a GS. 3-Day Chronograph GMT SBGC221. Wow, thanks to AP blasting off into some orbit, I ended up with a fantastic gem. The quality of GS is finally standing on it's own merits. The name is out there and the quality is famous. Rolex? how unimaginitive can we get. It's excellent yet gets a yawn rather too fast. GS, people will ask me, why did you pick this watch?, which gives me an excuse to embellish the already good story!. Thanks Andrew!.... another cool shot.
5:30 Nico's furious sounding speech on the black and white TV and retro sounding audio reminds me of a Hitlers hate speech. XD
Nico also says that L.U.Chopard is trash. So anything he says is just outright wrong.
@NicoLeonard Having seen several videos on your channel,before this video , and another, where Andrew thanks you for help, I thought you were too populistic, if this is the right word. But I have so much trust in Andrew , that even resubscribed to your channel. Good to see two civilized men arguing about something though passionately but with complete respect to each other . Well done guys.
The only problem with Grand Seiko is Grand Seiko. You see in a marketing perspective it is not very good because at the end of the day it appears that it is still a Seiko that people can buy for $200. When TOYOTA made a premium automobile they do not call it Grand TOYOTA. It is Lexus. Same as Nissan and so many other brands
Well, to be honest, if I won the lottery tomorrow morning (the only realistic way I would spend that much money on a watch) I would buy, and I kid you not, exactly none of these watches. For one, Rolex strikes me as either a snob's watch, or an "investor's" watch, none of which I would care to be associated with. Secondly, while I definitely love the smooth sweep of a spring drive and doubly love the mastery which they create the beautiful dials, I find the rest of the Grand Seiko watch to be impossibly dull. Yes, they are superb quality, yes, the hands are perfect mirror finish. But they don't speak to me.
I would instead go towards an Omega, or an Zenith, or hopefully an AP if fate smiled upon me. Something smart and understated, that few people would recognise in the blink of an eye.
Although, there's always that Seiko Kodo... But they were kind enough to make that a limited edition so as to remove it from the field of possibilities.
EVERYMAN NEEDS A ROLEX YOU MUST NOT BE ONE LMAO
@@eagles4757 you can safely go home and tell your mother "see, they were right when they told you smoking during pregnancy is a bad idea"
@@OctavianDunare YOU JEALOUS?
@@eagles4757 Not at all. I like my neurons healthy and fully functional.
I can listen to this guy talk all day about watches, the passion really shines through, and the voice is just so iconic
Thank you!
The bottom misspelled text was great. The funny additions to your informative elements make me stick around and want to hear/see more. Great job as always
Thanks very much 😊
I love Rolex, and I always have. Never bought or even considered buying a GS even though I have a couple of Rolexes.
But even then, I wholeheartedly agree that GS is better than Rolex in terms of pure watch quality. While you can definitely enjoy the beautiful craftsmanship of Rolex watches under a loupe, I can gurantee you that the finishing on GS watches are so pristine, you can admire their intricacy even from a distance.
The average delay in a year is more accurate than a Rolex watch! Hahaha this really made me chuckle.
These days Grand Seiko feels more like the enthusiast brand, where Rolex has become more image and clout etc (not that this has negatively affected the watches, which are still tops)... an image issue, not an issue with the watches. I think the same can be said for a lot of higher end brands which have gone from being well known among watch lovers, to now being well known by the general public, more for their price tags and the famous people that wear them than for any horological innovation.
Rolex has always been about clout. That’s the entire point of the brand. Watch people know Patek / AP / VC etc and many of these pieces are more expensive than an oyster but they don’t have as much clout to Joe Public as the little crown.
I love GS, but I wish their Bamboo GMT (SBGJ259) had a thinner case. 14 mm is a bit thick, especially when you consider Rolex's GMT II is 12.1 mm. It probably has something to do with the sapphire case back, something that looks cool, but I could do without it.
I have tried on that watch and it sits low on the wrist, but yes it is thicker than the Rolex and I am sure if GS decides to invest in similar Rolex robotic/computer automation instead of more human assembled the size can get to Rolex thin, or if they used thier current GS watchmaking standard the price would jump up a bit for the extra man hours
@@MegaFclef I can assure you grand Seiko has plenty of automatic/robotic manufacturing. They are not cutting out cases from raw steel, by hand. I’m betting if you got rid of the sapphire case back, you would gain at least a millimeter there.
@@MegaFclef sorry to bring it to you but gs isn’t hand made dude 😂
That was *quite* the match there, not to mention compact history lesson on Seiko. 'Course, you couldn't have done it without Nico, bless his Crown-lovin' heart.
The most common comment made about Grand Seiko: "iT's BEttEr thAN RoLex!" - that says it all 😉
Well that has a lot to do with the perception of Swish watchmaking being better than Japanese watching now doesn't it. It would be one thing if the two were perceived the same but they are not. Therefore certain watch collectors/enthusiasts will continue highlighting the engineering of GS vs Rolex or any other swiss brand until the stigma changes which will probably never happen. Just a thought Btw love your content Adrian
How’s the new Grand Seiko 😂
Indeed. The fact that GS is compared to Rolex seems to be the greatest achievement so far. 🤷♂️
@@hugohernandez3651 ONLY IDIOTS COMPARE THEM LOL
"For a real challenge, they glue smashed pots back together"
Your videos are a treasure of these analogies. I was shaving and that one needed a pause for a moment.
As a mod of nico's discord server, I proudly display my hublot everytime he's in the voice chat to ward him away, you should try it sometime with your grand seiko
Got 3 rolex. Feel like an idiot wearing them, especially with all the negative press these days. Now, my 3 Seiko's that's another (safe haven) story. Damn good watches.
Like you got seiko Or gs is like have a g shock is normal but rolex😮
"with all the negative press these days" - Negative press? LOL. You mean from a few blowhard CZcamsrs? No one in real life cares. If people did, Rolex would not be the largest luxury watchmaker in the world.
I have both a Rolex and a Grand Seiko. My GS keeps better time, I mean... if you think that's what a watch is for 🤷♀️ Arguably, my G-shock is the better watch
Honestly the only watch that holds a candle movement-wise to Grand Seiko in Rolex range is the Sky-Dweller which are beauties. I love precious metal watches and yes Rolex got those, however if we talking movement, casework, fine dial details, and total overall finish... then Rolex can't touch Grand Seiko. My only gripe with GS are their bracelets which IMO needs to be made to match the case's quality.
Look at the SwissWatchGang video with Nico, and see what Nico also owns :P .
On a personal note, the only thing I don't like about Grand Seiko, is the fact that it calls itself Grand. Maybe something like Nissan and Infinity, or Toyota and Lexus would have been nicer.
To settle this madness. I would love to suggest Boxing Match between Nico and Andrew.
Andrew, PLEASE write the sequel to "Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy". The world needs you. :)
IMHO, European made vs Japan made battle is really complicated and deeper than just product quality comparison. It happened on all product, like watches: Rolex, etc. vs Seiko etc.; cars: Mercy, etc. vs Toyota, etc.
First of all, European and Japanese have a different engineering philosophy. European engineer assume the consumer will abide the user manual to treat their valuable, so they can focus more on how to make things luxurious. In other hand, Japanese engineer assume the consumer will not abide the user manual, so they focus more on reliability and put luxury on top of it. (ex Rolex vs Seiko, Toyota vs Mercy)
Second, European and Japanese have a different definition of "luxury". Off course both of them consider exclusivity by limiting their product quantity. For European, to consider a brand as a "luxury" brand, one brand need to only produce luxury product, not allowed to make affordable product. But for Japanese, it is not a problem for them if one brand produce both affordable and luxury product, as long as those product have fair differences.
That is why I consider high-end European watch as a jewelry, not as a watch with high functionality & reliability like high-end Japanese watch.
Third, actually the debate is deeper than that. It might relate to racism. European is widely consider as the most advance civilization (before you argue about the US, the US majority ancestor is basically European migrant. Other continent? basically European colonized all of them in the past). Because of this, there is a general sentiment that European product is better than other.
My conclusion is, if you are an ultra fan-boy or a die hard haters of Seiko. Please consider my points. You will think differently.
As always ..magnetic content and presentation. Such great Insights and Info, Mr.Morgan. Huge fan of yours since 2017 when I first discovered The Watchfinder and Co.
Thanks very much for your continued support 😊
I almost spilled my red beetroot soup at the "efficient as a waterproof tampon". you deserve all Nico's subscribers and many more.
Stepping aside from the discussion for a moment. Different cultures do different things differently and as as we learn from those differences cross pollination of ideas ensues with some ideas going back to those who seeded them. WARNING OFF TOPIC. Indian cuisine for example. When I relocated to a different part of Blighty back in the day from the Midlands I had difficulty getting a takeaway that was anything like the taste from my old home so I got some recipe books and made my curry's from scratch and experimented over the years until I found something that reminded me of home. Having refined and evolved my recipe more over the years and shared it with my mates in the Midlands some of them preferred it to the takeaway, and some do not and that's completely fine because we all have different tastes, and that's my point. ON TOPIC. Different watch companies develop things in different ways taking ideas from somewhere else and refining them in different ways, some potential buyers may like them and some may not. We are all different, "I'm not " I hear some one say in the background.
Now I want a curry
@@AndrewMorganWatches Oddly so did I when I was writing the comment. So I got a takeaway for a change, it wasn't as good as my recipe though but it didn't take two and a half hours to make either, which was nice.
@@anthonystevens8683 swings and roundabouts!
Don't forget, Rolex has a bit of Hattori technology in it 😏
The yogurt line has me rolling 😂