Dean Park Station Video 87 - How to Install an Incline Part 1
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- čas přidán 30. 06. 2024
- Part 1 of the Installing and Incline videos. I use woodland scenic foam risers to do the job. See how I go about it! Also....there's new on my Hornby Magazine debut!
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Thanks for sharing, after viewing your video, a few of these are now on my wanted list, very informative, and congrats on your Hornby magazine entry
Hi, thanks and glad you enjoyed the video ;-) Dave
Well done Dave on the Hornby article ! The new incline looks good,& nice that the HSTs are going up well ,probably one I'll store in my memory banks for my future layouts ....cheers Andy
Congratulations on your Hornby Magazine article Dave...another feather in your cap, and another fascinating and informative production on the building of your incline....everything done to perfection as always...Bob
Cheers Bob. I am really excited about the article. If you buy and read Hornby Magazine I hope you will enjoy my article. Dave
I do and I will Dave....Bob
About to fix down my two Woodland Scenics inclines. Your pair of videos are extremely helpful. Thank you.
Great update Dave, I have a layout under plan waiting to start building at it is multi level and this update on the inclines was just what I needed. Thank you and look forward to the next one!
Hi Rob. Yeah I am hoping it will help some of my longer trains up the inclines a bit easier. Laying the magnets as we speak...will update you soon. Dave
Super well done on the Mag. Looking forward to the photos and the read....! Regards,Geoff at Maryville Junction
This is really my favourite Channel!
Thanks for your nice Videos,
it is very enlightening,
Waiting for your latest update.
Dean Park Walkway
layout and inclines look amazing !! I don't do maths but they look great to me..well done on the Hornby mag..well deserved cheers dave
Nice update, it's coming along beautifully. Congratulations on the Hornby mag article, most deserved. I have powered both ends of my HST (Lima) and have no problem with a nine coach train on a similar incline. All the best Dave, David.
I bet that has some power!! lol Dave
It runs very well Dave.
Thanks so much for a great video inclines looking great and cleared a lit up. Well done on the mag appearance well deserved and long to
Congrats on the magazine appearance mate, well deserved indeed. Good to see someone using the incline system, wondered hpw it would work out and seems to do the trick.
Cheers. Yeah the layout incline system saves a lot of hassle! Dave
Hi there. I do not classify myself as an expert, but, at age 73, I have built quite a few largish model railways over all those years, and as you have discovered, the one thing that can really cause problems is multi level track design. However, a little trick that ?I discovered/read somewhere was one I have found very useful over my many years building layouts, and that magic trick is :-
CURVES are drag killers on gradients, so 1) avoid them if you can, or 2) if you can't then play it canny.......
My tactic that has worked well on many layouts is to 1) - (pretty obviously) keep as much of the gradient as straight as I can, and 2) minimise the radius of the curves I have to use. BUT the "clever" bit is to make the gradient VARIABLE depending on whether it is straight on on a curve. In other words, where the gradient is virtually straight track, INCREASE the grade along that part of the slope, and this allows you to LOWER the gradient where the curves occur, so balancing the drag effect to a great extent.
I know it means more work, but I have done this using the Woodlands scenic risers with reasonable success by using progressively extra layers of cork ballast (or other packing material) under the risers themselves along the straight lengths, allowing the gradient to return to the "standard 3% or whatever you have selected" on the curved sections.
I have been surprised at how well this process has worked on even the steepest of gradients, but dont forget to also allow for the train length when deciding where you can reasonably safely increase the actual grade to maybe 5-6% along a straight section, and even into a following curve, as the consist it is pulling is still on a straight section, so easier to pull !!!!!
Hope this is useful for you, or anyone indeed else involved in installing gradients that work as realistically as possible in our vastly "space limited" model railway world these days :-))))
Well done Dave I wondered what you were up to the incline looks great be nice to see it in the finished form with the banks well done with the mag I wonder if there going to ring me next as you,Richard,and me all started building our layouts at the same time I must now start to put some videos up of my tinsley layout again well done you deserve it .dave
Hi. Richards layout has been on the go since 2009. I started mine in late 2012. Hornby are keen to visit me again when the next phase is complete. Get uploading and you could be next lol. Cheers. Dave
Amazing what a difference one degree makes. Nice work. I had to scrap a long worked on helix for the same reason - none of my locos could make it up the hill!
Its the age old problem with trains...they don't like hills! ;-( Dave
Looking forward to Hornby Mag article and to incline part two!
Hi Dave hope your ok 😃
Nice to see your enthusiasm again by not being happy with your first attempt and modifying it so it works.
I do that on my layout I put down what I think I'll do only to find out it doesn't work lol 😃
Keep your good work up cheers Stevie 👍
Cheers Stevie. Yeah no point in putting up with it if you ain't happy! Cheers. Dave
Another great video - really liked how you used the foam incline. I was a bit surprised Woodland Scenics would be selling a 4% grade if it was a struggle for trains to get to the top! Looks like the 3% grade might be the answer. Looking forward to your next video on the Power Base, and your article in the next issue of the Hornby magazine (have to get the digital edition otherwise it won't be until January when the hard copy becomes available at the newsagent in Australia!)
Hi. 4% works ok for DMU's, 4-5 coach trains and some other multiple units. But the HST struggled at the very top due to the resistance of the wheels of the MK3 coaches as I mentioned in the video. Also, if an incline is curved it can be more of an effort for trains! Hope you enjoy my article, whenever you read it lol. Dave
You are right, living in Canada brings more space and I have used 2% inclines with the 16' that you mention on my own layout. When I lived in the UK there are no real grades but here in the Rockies the grades can be significant - an excuse for lots more locos and of course 'pushers' which add to the operations aspects. Great news on the magazine article - probably get that in December over here (!!) but looking forward to seeing it. Cheers!
Hi, cheers. Yeah I could model the Highlands Munroes....but in 25ft feet it might look a bit rubbish! lol
Look forward to the Hornby mag with your feature in it. Tip on those Hornby Mk3 coaches. Apply a little oil where the wheel pins sit in the bogies. Tried this with my rake of HAA hoppers and works a treat. Great feature. Looking to extend the inclines on my layout one is too servere. Will do this when the layout is extended soon. So will take your incline advice. I do find though that steam loco's struggle more up inclines.
Richard
Hi, yeah steam locos will struggle as they dont have the weight of the diesels...and they have larger wheels which slip.
I will look at your oil idea....so do I have to take the wheel off and lube the pointy pin?, or can I do it when the wheels are on the bogies?
Cheers
Dave
You can oil lube the wheels whilst they on the bogie frame. No need to take them off. I have modelling oil which has a needle like tube. Don't put too much on though. Of course if the carriages are powering internal lighting could be a problem with lighting contacts.
Richard
That's the one drag with inclines, 2% is the best but you need so much space. Congrats on the magazine article. -Mark
Yeah, 16ft required for the 2% incline! Clearly aimed at the US market where people have bigger houses and layouts lol. Cheers. Dave
There will also be an amazing preview of the magazine that has the layout on it
Hi Dave, I am building a layout approx 9x8 feet . Three main line tracks with one elevated. I have the tables covered with homosoate, not sure what it is called in Scotland but should help with the noise and once painted should look quite good. Given the size I am concerned that I will not be able to get up and down , there is also the question of a fiddle yard for the elevated section. The tables are 24" wide and I imagine overall the layout is much smaller than yours and therefore limited. Love your videos Cheers
Thank you for the tips
Hi Dave, I know you are very experienced and 3% may work fine for you. I on the other hand could not make 3% work when there was a curve involved. Eventually after tearing my hair out for a long time and trying various fixes, I went to 2% and it has worked perfectly ever since. One issue with the WS inclines is they can telegraph any irregularities in the table up to the track. It is subtle, but will cause miserable problems in the end. Things like seams between boards, s;ight variations in height like 1 mm can even cause problems. Just my 2 cents. I really enjoy your channel. Rob
Hi, sadly I could not fit in the 2% as it was 16ft long. Curved inclines are not ideal, but again, its all down to space! ;-( I wish I lived in the USA or Australia where houses were larger and thee was more space for a layout but here in little Britain we are packed in like sardines! lol I am hopeful my 3% will be fine. Its only very light locos (my class 85 for example) that struggle up with a rake of coaches. The DMU's, Class 50, 55's managed it. The Class 47 with the Scotrail push pull express is fine and the HST without the lit coaches does it ok. So I can say it does what I need. But I agree, the 2% would have been ideal! Dave
I wish that videos about layouts could include a Track Plan.
Hi, I wish I had the time to produce an electronic track plan to show in my layout videos. ;-( Even drawing a decent one out on the PC or by hand takes ages. Cheers. Dave
well done on mag appearance, it was due!
Cheers! Cant wait! Dave
Great video mate the incline looks good I'm looking to try a helix on my layout so I can have a loco storage area underneath with a return track back up the helix. I have been having fun doing a diorama to practice my scenery techniques not sure if you have seen my videos on my channel of that but have made some rock faces that might look good either side of the incline track in that corner.
I shall check that out thanks. Dave
Great update Dave, the incline set works well, now are the gradients in % or in o degrees? looking forward to next video.
Woodland scenics use %. I worked it out at under 2 degrees.
Hi Dave, great video, I too have an incline to do for my layout which will be roughly the same dimensions as yours so your video has come along just in time. One thing I don't understand is that on the 'Woodland Scenics' box it says the system can be used with or without risers, what does that mean?Michael
hi. Risers are blocks that raise the track up, ie a 1" riser has the track 1" above the baseboard (They are flat, rectangular blocks). This is for people who already have a raised section and want to take it higher...if that makes any sense at all?! lol. You can also build up the 3% inclines to go higher etc, by padding them up with these risers. Its explained on the packaging. I will refer to it in my next video for you....hopefully that will make it a little clearer than the dribble I have just typed! ;-) Dave
Thanks Dave, yes that is a lot clearer now.
Michael
Hi Dave - I'm about to start an incline and this is my last chance to set the height of the upper deck. Currently the surface of the upper deck is 104mm above the surface of the baseboard but I heard you mention 95mm.
Is that the surface to surface height? And I'm guessing you've found it to be a comfortable height, taking pantographs into account?
Thanks for the great videos.
Hi I decided on this height as this was the height required to clear the Scalescenes tunnel mouths at the station. So it all stemmed from there. I didn't want it any lower as I would have struggled to get clearance for the Dapol OHLE masts arms etc. I wanted to use the WILLS retaining arched walls....but these are 85mm and was too low. Its all about compromises and making a decision on height and making it work. Cheers. Dave
If the HST is having trouble going up the incline have you thought about putting some weight over the driving wheels ,they do lead shot like the sort you use for fishing just have to find a space and glue them in .
there is very little room in there....its the newly tooled HST. It manages up, but not as easy as the 12 wheeled locos.
Hi mate looks good I'm thinking of using inclines instead of a helix to access track under my layout but not sure if that's a good idea?
I think The incline would work there....all of my locos go up the 3% incline with a rake of coaches without any issue. However the HST with MK3 coaches (with lights) can get a bit of wheel spin! Dave
Thank you for sharing. Question as to how you fixed the track to the cork,?
Hi On the incline I used epoxy resin that sets within 5-10 mins.
Whats power base? Layout looking nice as usual!
Got it.
Took me a while to work out what your percentages were referring to. Being old school, inclines to me are 1 in 50 or something ! Would using some light emery paper on the track up the incline create a little more grip, maybe even only on one side of the track?
Looks like a nice track you have there and it's bigger than the sardine tin you refer to elsewhere here !
What is 3% in old school? 1 in ?....I don't understand the 3% either! lol.
3% is 3 in 100 so it would be 1/33 which means one foot gained in height every 33 feet travelled.
MirVids Hi, thanks for that! Understood now! ;-)
You wouldn't think a 4% would be that much. I use the 2% and think the one I am doing with be around 20' when done. I guess that is why so many people build helix's. I try to stay away from them but I may have to build one.
Scott
its a nesseary evil for a lot of modellers. I wanted a raised section, so this is the only way I have the space to get trains from top to bottom. I could have had a 25 foot incline running the length of the layout, but that would have taken away most of the depth of the TMD etc. Its all about compromises lol. Dave.
Have you done any tests with steam loco's as I have mixed selection and would be grateful to see limitations of this slope
no tests with steam as they will rarely need to use it. but once the incline is completed I will try one out!
Dave what height did you make your upper level.
90mm to top, to allow clearance for the tunnel portals below. Sitting on 9mm ply.
🤠🖐🚂
Typo in the title,great vid though as always.
typo sorted. Cheers.
No prob.I didn't want to come across as picky git, someone else would have told you eventually.I have watched you from the start and have to say in all my years i have never seen anyone put as much thought into achieving accurate detail on a layout as you.
I am a modeler of some thirty years experience and have always dreamed of "doing" a model railway in the BR blue era, but have never had nor likely ever to have the space i would like to achieve my dream.
Keep doing what you are doing as your layout is my surrogate layout i cant have!.
wishing you all the best for the future.
Looking at the 1st run looks like you have a powering issue.. the second run looked okay..