The Truth About the Chimp Genome (Humans & Chimps: Part 2) | The Creation Podcast: Episode 41
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- čas přidán 18. 05. 2024
- Have scientists proven human evolution from a "common apelike ancestor," or are we being told a clever, confusing story filled with farcical "facts?" What is chromosome fusion, and why does it matter when discussing matters of the Christian faith?
In the second installment of this two-part episode, ICR geneticist Dr. Jeff Tomkins and host Trey Bowling dig deeper into the science and expose the flaws of an anti-design approach to genetics.
Watch Part 1 here: • They Lied to Us? (Huma...
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Resources mentioned in this episode:
Creation Basics & Beyond, 2nd Edition | Purchase here: store.icr.org/creation-basics...
Chimps and Humans by Dr. Jeffrey P. Tomkins | Purchase here: store.icr.org/chimps-and-huma...
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Hope to see you next time on The Creation Podcast!
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Please keep this content coming! The truth needs to be shared and proclaimed!
Thanks for this episode.
Please consider using simple graphics so the explanations can be more accessible to more of us.
This is so interesting; however, it's a bit complex!!
I so very much appreciate what creation scientists are doing to help us all see through the farce of evolution. It’s awesome and wonderful guys.
Somre have suggested the 2a-2b fusion was engineered. In particular the teleomere fusion sequence was shortened to make it stable. And perhaps modifed along with the centromere to introduce new genetic functionality. This chromosome as I understand controls some brain functions and intelligence.
Evidence of manipulation and engineering is ignored.
Surely these pair of sexes 'colluded' to have collapsed its chromosomes yet likely believe why fork at ape's?!
wowww... love his work..
even at 98%, theres no way we could scientifically evolve from them
The 98% gap between chimp and human DNA as proclaimed by neo-Darwinists is just an optical illusion. If you express the difference by the number of nucleotides, the gap between chimps and humans would be much higher. Besides if you google and look at an actual photo of a chimpanzee then the magic behind that numbers manipulation suddenly disappears LOL.
A similar scenario happens when supermarket owners price their goods. If the item's MSRP is supposed to be $20 then they tag it as $19.99 to make it more sellable.
I wish to thank you for sharing this ( Humans & Chimps ) Podcast #41 video with me .
Great video I wish it was a little deeper but I am thankful you guys made this video.
Thank you for these podcasts. They are very informative! I do have an important question that I hope could be answered.
How do we as Creationists best respond to evolutionists who would counter the arguments presented in this video with:
When a BLAST report is run on internal telomeric sequences (forwards and backwards), we find hits all throughout the entire genome (as Dr. Tomkins has pointed out), but the fusion site is the only location where we find the entire head-to-head telomeric DNA sequences with the telomeric calling cards in both forwards and backwards.
In other words, they argue there is only one location in the entire genome that spans the entire query sequence - that is to say - the full density - that it encompasses the entire head-to-head arrangement. And it turns out to be the fusion site. The claim has been made that other hits only comprise half of the query of 150bp, and these are the normal telomeres either in forwards or in reverse, and (according to some evolutionists) the fusion site hits the entire query. Is this true? And if so - how does it affect the fusion site being an active promoter inside a highly essential gene?
As somebody who has engaged evolutionists and critics of YEC extensively on this topic, I do have my own thoughts on the above argument. But I would really appreciate an opinion from Dr. Tomkins on the matter - since he is well informed on this topic.
God bless!
Best in starting to go strait to where accidental lifes "rubber must meet the road" for ANY traction period in "origins"
Just allow for the perfect atomic structure of the material plane brought into time and space from "somewhere" as Hubble discovered...!
Then "life" according to the Globalist owned Ed. systems must have began ~ "by itself in an ancient sea"
This was addressed extensively in depth by Sir Frederick Hoyle:
this research you should read thru; DNA discussions with so called 'Evil-Lucien-ists' waaay jumps the gun when this mindset discusses Space travel when they have yet to invent flights origin = this is allowing them place when they have no place for they've no way to get there so call them on it...!
Of course you must know of Michael Denton and myriads of others clear assessments of the complexity's of any living thing things...!
Once the reality of super mega suffisticated DNA existed and was understood to be the required orchestrator of any life ignoring the 1st & 2nd Laws of Thermodynamics with Rule of Entropy = IT WAS OVER right then since Crick N Miller
Like any great con job crooks at the top running and substidizing the scam never give up the con and this is Satanic with the only result IS Atheist MarXism/Communism's tyrannical PolitBuro Ending in their UN Agenda 21 + 2030 - NWO + OWG setup by the WEF/WHO's digital Great Reset and ~ "The Mark"
Why do you write: And it turns out to be the fusion site. As if they had other evidence that already identified the fusion site, and this is the final proof? No, the search for telomeres within the chromosomes, that would suggest this particular sequence was once the end of a chromosome, only gives them one likely candidate, and that is the site in Chromosome 2.
In other words, the sequence found, is the only evidence of it being a fusion site, there are not other evidence.
Now there are only 4 basepairs, and a telomere is characterized by a certain sequence of these basepairs, and other parts of the DNA, being billions of basepairs long, can have basepairing that statistically resembles telomere sequences.
After they identified this site, as a potential site for 2 chromosomes melting together. They look for the crossing point in the DNA. If a chromosome is an X, there is a place where the 2 lines come together yes? This place is called a centromer. The place where the lines meet in the X, does not have genes, it is called structural DNA, because it is used when cells divide.
Right, if the Chromosomes have fused, one X has fused to another X, by the end of the lines, they are now stuck, and there would be 2 places, where the lines meet. 2 Xes standing on top of each other so to speak, and 2 places where the lines come together, 2 centromeres in other words. One has then theoretically dissolved, and there is one centromere left and some extra long arms. They think they have identified that spot, but as is argued here, the proposed fossilised centromere, is only 41000 basepairs long, and a centromere is 250000 basepairs long, but more importantly, this sequence is a part of a gene, and so can never have been a centromere.
So I don't quite understand your predicament, you are asking; when there is only 1 place where this might have happened, how do we answer those that say it has? You are assuming that they are right. You have basically just been explained, that they seem to be wrong, that their assumptions, have not been verified.
Thus, the only likely candidate sequence for chromosome fusion, was a disappointment.
Great stuff! So glad that you are making this info available, which is otherwise very hard to find for a layperson. Greetings from Sweden.
Our pleasure! Thank you for watching from Sweden.
I agree, finding good scientific creation info is hard
A small difference at the outset of anything can have a profound difference in ultimate development like a 1% error in navigation can make get you way off on a long trip.
Great stuff! Thank you both very much!
I would like to hear something about the claim that Endogenous Retroviruses insertion shared by us and Chimpanzees prove we share a common ancestor.
@ related to chimps... Maybe the human wasn't really in love just in heat
@ Im mistaken the word CLAIM escaped my attention
@ but to. be serious isn't there a failsafe to avoid contamination?
Hey ICR sorry I'm a bit late. So glad to see this part 2! God bless you for your ministry to us 🙂🙏✝️
Better late than never! Glad you're here.
@@icrscience thanks! 😊
@@icrscience Hey! Thank you for all your work. Can Dr. Tomkins please respond to this argument being circulated by the evolutionary community:
"When a BLAST report is run on internal telomeric sequences (forwards and backwards), we find hits all throughout the entire genome (as Dr. Tomkins has pointed out), but the fusion site is the only location where we find the entire head-to-head telomeric DNA sequences with the telomeric calling cards in both forwards and backwards."
If this is the case, what is the best response? Thank you!
God bless.
Excellent
Looking forward to this, ICR! Can't wait!
Thanks!
We are NOT the result of a chromosomal catastrophe. 🌟
We are created in the image of God!
My thought on the fusing of Chromosome 2 was stated in Genesis, when God limited the lifespan of man to 120 years. I have no educational background in this field and no scientific basis for this idea…
From what I understand, the fusion could not occur naturally and would have had to be modified by an outside agent…
Says it all in the first sentence! "We discuss the science that confirms scripture"! BUT we will ignore all the masses and masses of proper scientific information that shows the Bible is wrong!
Because Science that doesn't support God's word is wrong and will instead destroy actual functional systems of science.
You still around? LOL you really like putting your foot in your mouth. "masses of proper scientific information"? Lets see some then. I'll wait.
The Bible îs the Word of God. If scientific data seem to contradict it, sooner or later it will be proven wrong. God made all chromosomes, al DNA, all the organelles of the cell.We humans cannot make the smallest useful protein and we lecture Him about chromosomes and find errors in His Word! We should better read His Word and learn from IT, and then speak
@@farcovidiu3110 You clearly don't have the faintest idea what you are talking about!!
@@twosheds1749 I am a doctor and I work with vaccines. Some of them are proteins obtained through genetic engineering. I should have been clearer and said that in experiments like that of Miller and Urey a few amino acids were obtained, and in later attempts like that of Prof. L. Cronin, branched products with few peptide bonds were obtained, rightfully called biological garbage by Prof Tour (not to mention homochirality which is necessary for life). So we are truly far behind the Creator concerning proteins, as I have mentioned. As for the Bible ,there is no place here for the hard issues, which seem to contradict some scientific data (of course these issues also could be addressed), but instead I would like to mention something truly important about this book. It makes some interesting statements that are worth considering. For example, it is written in John 3:16 that God so loved the world, that gave his only Son, so that whoever believe in him may have eternal life. If this is true, this is what we lose by arguing against the Bible. I pray that you and many others will consider this offer that the Bible makes.
Great
So, chromosome 2 was supposed to have fused sometime between when we split off from chimps and now. I’m curious, has anyone looked into what repercussions splitting the chromosome at the telomere-telomere “fusion” site would have? Since it’s a created and functional component in our worldview, I would assume that it would be detrimental. Does the evolutionary worldview presume that splitting it would leave two functional chromosomes? Also, would they think that doing so might give clues to the physiology of supposed pre-human ancestors after the split from chimps, or what do you suppose would be their view on that?
No, splitting it would not leave two functional chromosomes, since the vestigial centromere is degraded by virtue of its roughly five to seven million years of being a proverbial "fifth wheel". It is non-functional, full stop. The paltry rudimentary genetic function which Tomkins crows about in his creationist publication record is not convincing to anyone outside of ICR. This is just an effort to keep the wool over the eyes of this flock. Go to BioLogos for actual information about such matter from Christians who happen to be qualified scientists. Tomkins is doing YEC apologetics with a veneer of scientific language, and that is all.
@@AnthroJoe
you say: degraded by virtue of its roughly five to seven million years of being a proverbial "fifth wheel"
on the contrary, there is NO degraded centromere there to begin with.
even if we grant superfast "degradation" of a non-functional piece of genome (which is infinitely much slower than say, a specifically disadvantageous piece of genome), we should have left with something more than alphoid sequences as a remnant - which as it happens, are often not associated with centromeres but are present throughout the genome.
what's more, the alphoid sequences in question "are diverse, form three separate sub-groups in alignment analyses, and do not cluster with known functional human centromeric alphoid elements"
overall, surprisingly little "evidence" for fusion.
and as for the "paltry rudimentary genetic function" statement, it screams of prejudice and salt, im afraid.
The fusion never happened and here's why. If that fusion took place who would that first human procreate with. We would need 2 events giving opposite sexes at the same place and time. That would be a miracle.
That so called fusion point is so degraded I almost can't believe scientists adhere to the theory of a fusion point.
God bless
That fusion point overlaps a gene responsible for development in the womb.
I need a “ good “ genetics book , help please ❤
@ 48 - 2 =46 /1+1=2 /. Fused =1 +46 =47 or am I brain damaged?
Please share the most up to date info on Chromosome 2.
Stupid question, but if 2 chromosomes fused, wouldn't that leave 47 chromosomes, not 46. I may just be showing my ignorance, but it really isn't adding up any way I look at it
17:00 closing thoughts
Does The Holy Bible Tell us how many chromosomes that Adam had when God formed him from the dust of the earth? How about Eve? How many chromosomes did the Nephilim have (Genesis 6:1ff)? In other words, should we assume that humans always had 23? Thanks.
In sports it's important to study your opponents. Same thing with the debate about creation and evolution. If you only study one side, you won't know the answers to questions you will be asked. Some are so hard set in their thinking nothing will convince them anything on the other side can be true. That said, the more you study both sides the more you come to the conclusion God does indeed exist and created everything. But again, some will not be shaken from their views about the way the they see it. At best you might get them to say, well, we don't know the answer to that till we learn more. If you believe in God and the Bible, you might need more time, same as those who don't. But we already have the Bible and it's the perfect handbook for life. Maybe that's a one sided argument. But it's what I believe.
Amen
Selling books, that's what it is all about!😀
Address the arguments. The “other side” sells books and makes videos too. Charles Darwin wrote a book, what does that prove? Did Darwin posit his theory to write books for money? Yeah, you’re a hypocrite.
@@sliglusamelius8578 But Darwin didn't use video clips to sell his books. Don't trust people who pretend to be christians and want to sell you something.
@@georg7120
Darwin sold something. Don’t trust him. There were no CZcams videos in Darwin’s day, good gravy you’re making atheists look even stupider that I already think they are.
The amount of info given here, for free, is sufficient. If you want more, purchase the research.
👍🇬🇧😊
Awesome
The adds of poop are disgusting .
The guys are either lying or are complete fools.
Everything is made from the same stuff
🤣
Tomkins recycling the same rubbish that’s already been debunked 🤦🏼♂️ Trey, you should ask Dr Tomkins if he wants to debate me and watch him run 😂
Can we just dump darwinism from science all together and reinstate scripture as the standard in our public schools!
When did science confirm a 6 day creation of the universe?
Look up 'evidence for a young earth' and also 'evidence for a young universe'
What can your science tell us about how the moon formed?
Nothing cant create anything from nothing.
It did not.
@@AnthroJoe When did science confirm the bodily resurrection of Jesus?
Total nonsense
I would say chromosomal fusion has nothing to do with the Christian faith based on the Bible.
Only you who selectively insist on a literalist interpretation of the Bible where if fits your political agenda feel the compulsion to twist the facts to fit your false narrative.
It’s a really weird hill to die on. But obviously it pays. So go on leading people down the path of losing trust in the church.
The Bible should be taken literally and only figuratively when the verse forces us into that interpretation. People such as yourself who claim to be Christian and yet compromise their faith in order to fit in to the world are leading people astray. One day you may wake up and realize it. That you have been on a dark path leading to emptiness and have been trying to lead others down that same path. Wake up!
Stop trying to be a friend of the world and a friend of God because it does not work that way. Either you love one and hate the other or vise versa. God's word is clear.
The only reason people are losing trust in the church is because people like you keep trying to push evolution. Thank God for channels like ICR who are helping us understand the truth of the bible in all regards. People such as yourself fail to realize that the devil is the god of this world and as such is leading many people away from God. You should humble yourself before God instead of fighting him. Your pride will only lead you to destruction.
Judging by your channel I would say that you are an atheist. What would make you think you can interpret the bible better than christians? The bible is for us. Given by God to His people to be interpreted through the guidance and wisdom of the Holy Spirit. An atheist does not have the Spirit of God and therefore cannot properly interpret its message.
".... feel the ompulsion to twist the facts to fit your false narrative..."
Oh the hypocrisy in that statement.
If you lose trust in the church don't blame ministries like ICR. Look at the rebellion in your own heart.