When the Coventry Canal Society held boat rallies, a party trick was to do a figure of eight under that bridge. I saw single boats do it, but heard that it was once achieved by a breasted up pair. A previous correspondent was right, the boatmen would use a bollard by the bridge to pull the bow round.
The only way to manoeuvre the bow of a narrowboat (absent a bow thruster) is by driving the stern the other way to set up rotation about the centre of mass. With its stern constrained by a short tow, the manoeuverability of the motor is severely reduced as it has to carry the bow of the butty wherever it goes, also setting up counter-rotation in the butty which will bite later. A longer line like about half a boat length or so would reduce the coupling and make it a lot easier.
More correctly, a boat rotates about its lateral line of resistance, not the center of mass. With no wind or current, a narrowboat can be turned in little more than the boat's length. It can be quite slow, if the turn is in the direction that fights prop walk, bat rather easy otherwise. But the tow tie was way to short - the cross tie was fighting against the tow turning.
I often go around here with a pair. I drop one of the cross straps and get around around in one. You have to position yourself as far towards the pub as possible to start the turn and don't leave it late otherwise you'll corner yourself. If in doubt, go astern once the motor has started the turn - the butty will push the motor around and then drag the butty around with the motor.
@@mykaskin It was a pretty hypothetical question. I am a USA resident. The canal narrow boat life (as in live-aboard) in the UK fascinates me and we are in a total s*** storm over here, so getting away looks good. However, actual narrow boats are so narrow that it seems like a viable option would be to invest in a dual narrowboat option rather than a wide-beam boat that is restricted in many locks. So I was sort of wondering if there is a tradition of using a butty as additional living space or cargo space for narrowboating.
@@FinnMcRiangabra ah I see. Traditionally both boats were used for cargo with the family living in the back cabins. Modern boaters often start with a cabined motor boat but then need more room so get a butty of some sort - not always historic. However userstand that boating with a pair is not easy even when you know what you are doing! :)
came out of the lock straight ahead and should have steered left as soon as he could. The junction is designed to get working pair round in one, its very do-able, especially in the almost wind free day they had. The bloke on the butty is at the mercy of the motor, did his best but couldnt influence the outcome from the angle of turn taken by the motor.
they need a few bollards on the inside bank. go close on the inside throw the line over to hold the bow againt the breeze. as you come around switch bollards to keep the bow close. let line out as you move and have good control and can keep the rudder held over not pumping. 2 seconds of engine thrust is what makes it swing. or forward motion like a sail boat. unless its a real "barn door".
Cue the armchair experts (me included). This junction is tricky with a single boat, let alone a full length pair and speedwheel controls. To do this in one with a pair can come only with experience and there a little opportunities for that these days. I'd have had the butty on a longer tow, but would probably have fared no better. Gongoozlers always increase the chance of failure!
I know a lot about boats but nonthinking about narrow boats but it does seem to me there did not seem to be a plan to make this maneuver? They just tried to turn and got a bit of a mess. Still a day on the water is worth a hundred in an office! Cheers , thanks for sharing Warren
I would have thought that it may have been easier to have started the turn earlier because it would have given more space on the port side to allow the stern to swing round.
You were doing ok, and would have done it, if you had used one cross strap a little more power and let the butty push you round. Too many blokes tellin you what to do.
I had a good conversion with the couple onboard, they advised me not to get a butty, as it was a pain in the arse.................. I had one built in 2019.
@@normanday5064 You are of course correct Norman. I'm not sure why I wrote it that way because I knew it was a tow; must have had a brain cramp. My point to Gary is still valid in that only one of the two narrowboats has power, so going through separately would be problematic.
Jesus was a Freemason. So were Stalin, Hitler and Churchill. They were also all Jews. Don't worry about it buddy, the world really is not real. You'll see.
You did a fantastic job of manoeuvring both boats. Please don’t listen to any of the negative comments. It certainly couldn’t have been easy x
When the Coventry Canal Society held boat rallies, a party trick was to do a figure of eight under that bridge. I saw single boats do it, but heard that it was once achieved by a breasted up pair. A previous correspondent was right, the boatmen would use a bollard by the bridge to pull the bow round.
The only way to manoeuvre the bow of a narrowboat (absent a bow thruster) is by driving the stern the other way to set up rotation about the centre of mass. With its stern constrained by a short tow, the manoeuverability of the motor is severely reduced as it has to carry the bow of the butty wherever it goes, also setting up counter-rotation in the butty which will bite later. A longer line like about half a boat length or so would reduce the coupling and make it a lot easier.
More correctly, a boat rotates about its lateral line of resistance, not the center of mass.
With no wind or current, a narrowboat can be turned in little more than the boat's length. It can be quite slow, if the turn is in the direction that fights prop walk, bat rather easy otherwise.
But the tow tie was way to short - the cross tie was fighting against the tow turning.
I often go around here with a pair. I drop one of the cross straps and get around around in one. You have to position yourself as far towards the pub as possible to start the turn and don't leave it late otherwise you'll corner yourself. If in doubt, go astern once the motor has started the turn - the butty will push the motor around and then drag the butty around with the motor.
Is it a live-aboard pair?
@@FinnMcRiangabra mine or this one in the video? Mine is a working motor and accommodation on the butty
@@mykaskin It was a pretty hypothetical question. I am a USA resident. The canal narrow boat life (as in live-aboard) in the UK fascinates me and we are in a total s*** storm over here, so getting away looks good. However, actual narrow boats are so narrow that it seems like a viable option would be to invest in a dual narrowboat option rather than a wide-beam boat that is restricted in many locks.
So I was sort of wondering if there is a tradition of using a butty as additional living space or cargo space for narrowboating.
@@FinnMcRiangabra ah I see. Traditionally both boats were used for cargo with the family living in the back cabins. Modern boaters often start with a cabined motor boat but then need more room so get a butty of some sort - not always historic. However userstand that boating with a pair is not easy even when you know what you are doing! :)
i am 78 y o worked the L&L with abutty for 30 yrs you have too shorter rope between boats.
I agree and also maybe she started the first turn far too late.
Answered my question
If it was easy it wouldn't be fun.
And nobody got hurt.
I guess not every one knows how to use a barge pole but he did get it going right. 👍
Actually this turn is easy for a pair - if you know how to do it. We did it several times - in both derections - with no problem at all with our pair.
Cumming out of lock take a long front line walk under the roving bridge there is a hook to loosely attach the rope which will pull the boats round.
came out of the lock straight ahead and should have steered left as soon as he could. The junction is designed to get working pair round in one, its very do-able, especially in the almost wind free day they had.
The bloke on the butty is at the mercy of the motor, did his best but couldnt influence the outcome from the angle of turn taken by the motor.
DIDNT RELEASE A CROSS TIE EITHER ,you do sutton stop turn on one tie only
they need a few bollards on the inside bank. go close on the inside throw the line over to hold the bow againt the breeze. as you come around switch bollards to keep the bow close. let line out as you move and have good control and can keep the rudder held over not pumping. 2 seconds of engine thrust is what makes it swing. or forward motion like a sail boat. unless its a real "barn door".
Cue the armchair experts (me included). This junction is tricky with a single boat, let alone a full length pair and speedwheel controls. To do this in one with a pair can come only with experience and there a little opportunities for that these days. I'd have had the butty on a longer tow, but would probably have fared no better.
Gongoozlers always increase the chance of failure!
A small jet ski tied to the bow of the first boat could have easily facilitated the maneuver.
😂
I know a lot about boats but nonthinking about narrow boats but it does seem to me there did not seem to be a plan to make this maneuver? They just tried to turn and got a bit of a mess. Still a day on the water is worth a hundred in an office! Cheers , thanks for sharing Warren
I doubt if they learned much, as they poled the tow around the corner.
For some reason, this reminds me of Congress.
I would have thought that it may have been easier to have started the turn earlier because it would have given more space on the port side to allow the stern to swing round.
The butty should push the towing boats stern round as you turn ino the bend but we dont always get it right even the most exeperienced
I can't help wondering if the tow line should be that short? It appears to be adversely effecting the maneuverability of both boats!
You were doing ok, and would have done it, if you had used one cross strap a little more power and let the butty push you round. Too many blokes tellin you what to do.
This is one of the hardest corners on the cut,your better of pulling than pushing with a long tow rope or tie them together side by side.
Should have come over to the left a bit more to allow for the swing.
MEMORIES OF 40 YRS AGO RUNNING BEXHILL AND BRIGHTON BUT I NEVER MADE THIS KIND OFV HASH :)
50' of boat, 12 HP...doomed right from the get go.
Tow line too short?
NEVER KEEP YOUR BUTTY ON BOTH CROSS TIES WHEN SHARP TURNING, YOU RELEASE THE ONE OPPOSITE YOUR TURN
Before anybody criticises, you try it.
I had a good conversion with the couple onboard, they advised me not to get a butty, as it was a pain in the arse.................. I had one built in 2019.
That couple have not got a clue on operating a boat and butty tell ‘em to look at other vlogs posts
They might learn a bit
Here is a good idea....Try each boat by itself rather than tied together LOL
(Edit:) Since the back one has no source of propulsion that might be tough.
I think you will find that it is a tow rather than a push, see prop was at 1.40.@@garrettswoodworx1873
@@normanday5064 You are of course correct Norman. I'm not sure why I wrote it that way because I knew it was a tow; must have had a brain cramp. My point to Gary is still valid in that only one of the two narrowboats has power, so going through separately would be problematic.
Bow thruster....!!!
Why???? What is the purpose of all that line??
Not to much planning if the camera man has to helpl>>> LOL
It was good that he was there.
Are all barge people thick 🤔
Or do you have to be thick to own a barge.
Whatever you think of them I am sure they know the difference between Narrow boats and barges!
What does "butty" mean?
A butty normally don't have an engine and get pushed or pulled.
@@peteon4wheels627 Thanks. Makes more sense of what is going on.
The problem with a butty is that no one knows what the stupid word means...because it's stupid.
A lot to be said for a bow thruster here
@i. rob And why sully a traditional historic boat with one?
What about a pony and rope. Or doubling up.
Pl
Just a friendly heads up... Last days warning! JESUS is coming! Repent from any sin and make JESUS your LORD and SAVIOR! TIME IS ALMOST UP!
Thank god! I've been waiting for years
Jesus was a Freemason. So were Stalin, Hitler and Churchill. They were also all Jews.
Don't worry about it buddy, the world really is not real. You'll see.