How Are MTB Components Tested? | FOX Factory R&D Facility Tour
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- čas přidán 2. 06. 2024
- Join Anna Cipullo as she tours the @FOXFACTORY R&D facility with Andrew Taylor, taking a closer look at all the machinery that is used to stress test Fox and Race Face components. Andrew Taylor is one of Fox's test engineers who moved over from testing suspension for powered vehicles to testing components for bikes. Today we find out how Fox Factory test not only their suspension but also Race Face handlebars and wheels too. They test the components for lateral stiffness, torsional stiffness, fatigue, and more!
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⏱️ Timestamps ⏱️
00:00 - Welcome To The Fox Factory R&D Facility
00:34 - Andrew Taylor | Test Engineer At Fox Racing
01:24 - Seat Post Duty Cycle
02:27 - Oil Fill Bottom Out Fatigue Test
03:38 - Side Load Test
04:13 - Lock Out Duty Cycle
05:06 - Spring Fatigue Test
05:53 - Fork Torsional Stiffness Test
08:02 - Fork Friction Test
09:41 - Brake Fatigue Test
11:44 - Profile Test
13:11 - Wheel Lateral Stiffness Test
13:58 - Handlebar Fatigue Test
15:08 - Wheel Driving Machine
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What suspension are you using at the moment? Let us know in the comments below!
Rock shox and RST abandoned fox because maintenance was hell.
Fox Float Performance 34 120mm and Rockshox Judy Silver 120mm. Not comparable 🫠
im using a Marzocchi bomber z2 with 140mm travel on my orbea laufey ;)
Marzocchi shiver dc
FOX 38 LSC/Hsc and Fox DHX2.
I've got a set of marzocchi dirt jump forks from 2003 they've bin serviced twice in 21 years and they still look new internally ! Also a old hope disc brake set from 98 or 99 that still works well 👍 they don't make em like they used to 😂
I understand you perfectly, I have a 2003 Dirt jump fork, I recently changed the oil and seals on it after 21 years of use, it works like new💪
I also had some Marzocchi dirt jump forks on a Mondraker hardrail/jump bike from around 2006..absolutely indestructable those forks..fully agree everything made to fail these days 🤦♂️
Had aquried a set of 03's as well. They were seized. Quick lower disassembly, wipe down and fresh oil and theyre mint. Companies dont make em like they used too. Still running its original seals and theyre perfect
I could watch suspension videos all day, every day.
Great content 🤙
Glad you like them!
Muito legal! Observei que os testes em laboratórios são sempre sem areias, lamas e demais sujeiras que as bikes são submetidas nas trilhas, acredito que isso influencia no desgaste do produto. Grande abraço do Brasil!
Foi o que imaginei.
wow. this is one of the reasons why forks and shocks are expensive. testing and research and developmentent cost a lot for us to enjoy. Love this kind of videos. Watching from Philipines.
Nope that stuff has paid for itself 1,000 x over. It's just greed now.
Yeah my friend got few things from guy that worked in greyp. Ohlins 36, price on bike24 1600€, price for manufacturer on receipt he gave us 400€ without tax.
Same goes for rs, and my formula fork. Now do your math. Prices of forks and shocks are pure greed bullshit, nothing less.
Really informative, I need more of them, carbon frames durability tests would be awesome !!!
That was very interesting for us engineering nerds. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it! We love opportunities to go and capture stuff like this :)
I was expecting comments from fellow transfer dropper posts owners 💀😈
"Oh so now they are testing them?"
😂😂😂
Did not heard good things about their droppers. I'm fine with their suspensions but went an alternative route for my dropper !
I find it amazing that all this testing and development is done on the products to make an awesome product. Then all that good work it's wasted by bad assembly process. For example I have a brand new Fox 38 that wasn't riding the best, a quick Google search says too much grease in negative air chamber. Got fork serviced, it was full of grease and transfer ports blocked. Fork is now amazing, but shouldn't need to get brand fork serviced when first setting up
On my HT I’m running a Rockshock Yari 140mm with 35 mm stantions. It seems to ride higher in the travel the way I have it set up to keep it from diving for majority of riding. On My FS running a Marzocchi Bomber Z1 at 140mm travel with 36mm stantions, mated up with a Fox Float X shock in the rear. I had to run quite a bit faster rebound on the Marzocchi to prevent it from packing up and changing the geo. Both forks are pretty easy to get dialed in to how I want them to feel. The Marzocchi is a little more plush throughout its travel which I like on the full sus, seems to complement the Float X very well. Been thinking about volume reducers for both in the future. I’m 225lbs so even though I’m running 140mm travel forks I like the beefier stantions on both, gives a more precise and composed feel.
@gmbntech I wonder what all of that testing has told them about creaking CSU's ! Somehow the cause of this super common problem has evaded all of these machines & experts.
Very interesting my lady.
Keepemcoming
Don't make it weird dude
@@jawide626 the only person here who's weird is you try and
Fool people by keeping your mouth shut.
All that testing and every Fox Transfer sticks when you get on the bike. You have to grab the seat and give it a nudge EVERY SINGLE TIME. Even after back from a rebuild. I have a Bike Yoke droppers that's only been serviced once in 4 years and it's never had an issue. Why?
Can say the same for the Reverb. Impossible to get it down without basically impaling yourself. I'll try a OneUp next time.
so its not just me? lol
Ive seen several Fox forks will have their lowers fail where the arc meets the lower leg...some also have a tendency to squeak at the steerer tube
On the seatpost test rig, why wouldn't they test thedropper locked in the top position under load before pressing the lever to make it go down again. Pressing the lever in, allowing it to extend and then dropping it again without allowing it to lock out under load isn't representative of real world conditions.
They did not show all the benches. Sure they do this kind of test.
If they want to provide a smooth feeling on the fork, why brand new bushings needs a recalibration/burnishing to correct the tolerances and reach this goal?
Exactly this, they can do it but some Excel sheet said that it’s not viable. Funny thing is that they will sell you burnishing tool or do it for you per warranty request if you’re persistent enough. Same goes for the amount of grease in the negative chamber, same problem since 2015.
I love that they test sideload on a shock, so painful to watch it flex. :D (I always wondered about it.)
What an interesting place love to work somewhere like that! Didn't realise Fox tested more than just their products uve just changed my new emtbs carbon bars to burgtec high rise 38s so scared of them snapping me! I'm just getting back into riding so not 100% sure with today's carbon yet but won't sell them I'll use them later on something else
Hi Andrew,regards from Blighty
I am kind of curious about the service life on MTB products. I had a 2010 Ford Raptor (the vehicle the engineer in this video mentioned working on before moving over to MTBs). The year I had ran Fox triple bypass rears with front internal bypass shocks. Around 12 inches of travel in the real about 11 in the front. I have buddies with 100000 miles on the shocks and they are still running pretty strong. That is on a 3 ton truck that can do 80+ mph offroad.
My bikes run a variety of Fox and Rockshox products that have a recommended service life of 50 hours.
I know it is apples to cannonballs but how are they managing to get such great life out of their automotive products and so little life comparatively out of the MTB ones? Is it a case of the MTB stuff being pushed to the limits whilst the oem automotive stuff is dialed back a little.... like a race tuned engine (on the mtb suspension) vs a tractor trailer diesel (on the oem auto stuff)?
Would say because of weight. Lighter parts are less durable and need more maintenance.
Oil volume
My guess is that truck shocks will have more, tighter, and more durable seals compared to mountain bikes, which will greatly decrease contamination from all the crap that exists outside, but significantly increase friction. The added friction ends up being meaningless because, as you said, the truck wheights 3 tons, which is 40 times the weight of a mountain bike rider.
Well, for one it's the fact that those service intervals are essentially peak performance intervals. You can absolutely run the suspension longer, but performance will eventually degrade. You could have serviced those triple bypasses more frequently and they would have also done better.
Two, it's oil volume and design. Those forks have to be light so we don't have 50lb+ bikes and the suspension has to not have stiction, because they only have rider weight to overcome it. So, they skimp on support parts
What about real conditions like dust and mud, cold and heat? In clean lab you can make much more cycles then in real ride.
True, but it's not like these brands don't do plenty of outdoor testing too and years of heritage and learnings about how long components and suspension systems last in the real world :)
If you look at the shock at 4:05, the label says "Salt Spray." So, they are doing environmental testing in the lab, which is not shown in this video.
Would honestly like to know the stiffness comparison between the new 32 SC and the competition. My first gen 32 SC is like riding a wet pool noodle lol
This is why bike components (Fox-Rockshock etc) are expensive 😱. Lots of R&D goes into them.
I wonder how they do all that testing and their $1,000+ forks still creak.
they should be introducing dirt /mud in their tests! real world should have already accelerated the wear on these!
I have a Fox Rythm 36 up front and Fox Float x in the rear on a Trek Fuel EX 8 Gen 6
Holy Jesus that sounds amazing. I just have a stock trek marlin 6 with custom pedals haha that sounds like a dream bike!
They test so much and then the x2 comes leaking from the factory. 2 weeks after the service, its noisy again.
Not related to the video, but a suspension question on the less.... why do shocks get hot on long descents? I had always heard that it is because the air is being compressed in them.. Boyle's law and all that. This made sense to me until I was doing bunny hops in the street outside my house this morning. If they heat up under compression, shouldn't they cool down under rebound? The expansion off gases coming out of a spray can is what cools it down.... and that is how AC and fridges work. I realise it is not going to be perfectly one for one but still.
I get that in a vehicles suspension large quantities of fluid are being forced through small holes to create the damping, and that the fluid is heated by friction... is the same thing causing the heating in the MTB shock? I admit my knowledge of MTB dampers is fairly rudimentary.
Moving molecules generate heat. Compression or Expansion.
My understanding is its mainly the oil in the damper being forced through small holes at pressure. This generates heat and this builds up on a long decent. That's my some shocks have a piggy back reservoir to increase the volume of oil and reducing the chance of it getting too hot.
My performance elite setup is stil working fine after 5 years without any servicing
Nice! Although you may find that a little bit of a service on it has it coming back with performance that you'd forgotten it could get! 5 years is quite a while, but if it ain't broke, don't fix it!
Maintenance isn’t waiting until something bad happens, servicing should be done way before that which is why intervals are set. I don’t see the point in paying top dollar for a high performance fork and then losing said performance by neglecting it.
1:47 Why not test it at an angle? Similar to what the shock test did.
There are a number of tests not shown :)
@@gmbntech Ok, good, I suspected that might be the case.
Damn my transfer dropper failed right out of the box according to this fall dude
I guess they never bothered to test the X2 before releasing it.
That is a lot of pumping
There is more pumping going on than in my local gym.
Unfortunately Fox are still unable to stop creaking on brand new forks, maybe some R&D money could be spent on that 🤷♂️
Using my wheels as suspension.
How the hell did the 2021-23 X2 make it past these tests?
Surprised there is no environmental contamination testing to get some real world durability data.
Pins on the battery connectors for SRAM derailleurs need more testing, absolute junk design.
Laterally stiff and vertically compliant....😴
Since your going downhill mostly and now have cheater bikes why not just put motorcycle shocks on a mountain bike? It would suck if you have to go uphill but would be awesome going downhill.
That's all these are scaled down though since they don't need to deal with the extra weight of the massive bike and the engine :)
@@gmbntech it still would be awesome to try out a bike with motorcycle shocks on it.