The Left Wing: Leinster make La Rochelle statement - but should they be allowed sign Jordie Barrett?
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- čas přidán 15. 04. 2024
- Leinster's emphatic win over La Rochelle and their blockbuster signing of Jordie Barrett are up for discussion on the latest episode of The Left Wing.
Rúaidhrí O'Connor, Luke Fitzgerald and Will Slattery break down the key moments behind Leinster's victory and single out the key performers like Will Connors and Joe McCarthy.
Jacques Nienaber's influence on Leinster is also discussed before talk turns to the signing of All Blacks star Barrett.
The lads debate whether the signing should have been signed off by the IRFU and the worrying gulf that has emerged between the provinces.
Ulster and Connacht's heavy European defeats are also on the agenda.
Listen and follow on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. - Sport
It’s amazing how domination by one province is only a problem when it’s Leinster (it’s exactly the same with Dublin in GAA) I can remember in the early noughties when Munster provided 1 - 10 for the Irish team most weeks plus some subs, often in the same position as the starters, on top of this they had foreign talent like Jim Williams, Langford, then later Howlett, Cullen, Halstead Tipoki, Mafi etc etc etc. Add to that 2 Irish coaches in a row were Munster men along with the forwards coach and team manager, can you imagine the bitching if that was the case with Leinster nowadays for the Irish team. Back then Leinster struggled to compete at the time, Ulster similar and Connacht were the forgotten province but I don’t remember constant calls to change the whole structure to stop Munster winning all the time, amazing how this only happens when it’s Leinster.
Munster fan boys just cant take that leinster are a more successful team that play a superior brand of rugby,they had their day winning 2 heinikens and being bulk suppliers of irish team,its leinster time now.but munster can only point fingers and support anyone but leinster,pure jealousy
Munster ballsed it for themselves. Maybe 20 years ago a chip on your shoulder and a bit of cute hoor was enough to get overblown liginds to attract the best fans to fund a new stadium. All this Doctors and Dockers in the home of irish rugby. Kidney did nothing to build from the ground up. Mc Gan tried and was sacked. Penny tried to change their mind set but for nothing. The media in 09 were laughing at the cheek of leinster to show up in croke Park. Now they think the answer is pay POM Zebo Murray the big bucks and invite LaR to train in Con in an attempt to derail leinster. Munster won the URC and I was delighted but it was from 6th place in the league 24 points behind the leaders.. this says more about the league than this team. The answer is not to degrade leinster tho I think this would be a result for many Munster fans
@@amantedellopera1681yip, all Munster fans think exactly the same way
Long live begrudgery
Leinster are getting Snyman and Barrett, Munster are getting Billy Burns. That is pretty funny, to be fair
That IS funny!
Billy 'you had one job' Burns
They signed snyman and de Allende after the 2019 rwc, hypocrites
They also relase cash by getting rid of Frisch and RG and blowing the money on POM Murray Zebo. They waste so much energy on shoulder chips and sticking it to leinster with the La Roc flags .
If I were Frawley stick where you are. Joey Carberry should have stayed at Leinster no matter what. Was way more talented than Ross Byrne. Also a good fullback and better than Lamour.
But larmour way more durable! Joey looked good in a couple of appearances for Munster recently but he has played so little due to injuries. Larmour played for IRE against Scotland at FB was outstanding against La Rochelle still a young player at 26 he will be playing for Leinster & IRE for another 5 years
i used to agree with this, but not anymore with this signing. he is already third string at 10 and 12 and backup at 15. with barrett's arrival he will fall to backup in the 22 or 23 jersey too. ulster doesn't even have an out half for next season. above all he has to play to get selected for ireland and to improve his game
Carberry better than Larmour at 10 yes but at 15!???! Not a hope!
It’s not Leinster’s fault Munster can’t repay their debt on their stadium
Munster: Back-to-back seasons getting knocked out on the road before QF in Europe after butchering early season winnable games.....
Also Munster: waaaaaaah financial disparity is killing Irish rugby.
It's not just Munster who are falling behind
@@patman142yes that's right ulster shouldn't be under preforming yet they are too. Munster make me so angry they should be playing better than they are they butchered early games in the season. And then connacht losing to Bennaton in Challange Cup. The other provinces need to seriously up their game. Money is shared from leinster with the other provinces they need to do better maybe go hunting for quality coaches.
@@ciaranbrk you must have been really angry in the noughties
Leinster dont even own a stadium, they are given gifts from the irfu
Fair play for sorting out the audio quality. Way less popping these days on the YT version
Ive never heard so much shite, in all my days. So your saying Leinster to produce these players in their academy and then not allowed to use them. Its not on Leinster to also build the other 3 provances aswell as their own.
Munster was told to create a proper system like Leinsters, but they didn't, and over spent well passed their means.
Here here. They wasted money on thomand park they didn't replace players they wasted excelent second rows like Ian nagle. Munster wasted it by not investing more in their academy
Let’s not forget Barrett is only coming in for 6 months.
When Munster signed Snyman and Dallende straight after winning the World Cup with SA no one was whinging
I noticed you avoided asking Rúaidhrí why he had been backing La Rochelle all week despite all the travel, despite the full stadium of Leinster fans, despite the arrival of Jacques Nienaber, and despite the greater need for Leinster to win.
He also said the Snyman should be going to Connacht when that story broke. What a goon.
Who cares. As my Granny said, paper doesn't refuse ink which can also transfer to a mic doesn't refuse a voice.
Luke cant dictate were players should go and play,barrett chose leinster,snyman wasnt wanted by munster,why would or should he be forced to go to ulster,connacht,in fact why would he want to go in the first place
i just want all the Provinces to do well
It’s only a six month contract and its great marketing for Leinster. It makes business sense for the Leinster brand. It’s a good idea to send some academy players to other clubs to learn and play rugby.
You fellas are brilliantly passionate analysts. Your passion is inspiring!
A draft system for 18/19 years olds would be a bad idea, the Leinster academy is the best in the world, leave them there. You could force Leinster to let go of the likes of Deegan, Penny and Russell (Molony before his Bath move) when they're around 24/25 which would strengthen other provinces and force Leinster to play even younger players in the international windows
Frawley much better call than Byrne for 10. Btw awful call for mom....think larmour possible but furlong fairly clearly most important influence in game
Why would any leinster player want to go play for munster/ ulster both are struggling teams,you would be going from a winning team to a mediocre team,i just cant see it...carberry being the poster boy as to exactly why a move like his can be detrimental to your career
No audio
Have to say that’s the best take on the Barrett issue.
Leinster have done nothing’s wrong but what are the IRFU thinking?
And a great point about Snyman, if Munster have to give him up to provide space for Irish players, how is he allowed move to Leinster where he’s still taking a spot from an Irish player?
I don't think anyone blamed Ross byrne for last year's final he was screaming for the ball to drop goal it's Al'alatoea who stupidly gave la rochelle the penalty and the leinster pack who stupidly ignored their fly half to try get a try. Also it's up to the other provinces to produce home players to build their academy Belfast is a huge city don't tell me you can't find quality players there. The provinces may need to upgrade their coaches and do smart head hunting the way leinster did with Joe Schmidt who was relatively unknown.
You have to align incentives with the behaviour you want. If there was a draft for academy players like Luke suggested, the Leinster academy would immediately slow down. Why would they work hard to create players for their rivals?
Did ye forget the audio lads
Let's not forget that Munster did sign Snyman, and also won the URC last year. If he had been fit over the last couple of years, then we might be having a different conversation over whether we can have one super province and three medium ones or not.
I think we were very close to having three really strong ones in the last couple of years. But Ulster players seem to have lost form and the management has turned into a mess, and Munster have had some bad luck.
Kitshoff leaving Ulster feels like a bit of a disaster, as does Munster losing Snyman, Carbery, and probably Frisch, as well as O'Mahony, and Murray too soon.
However, they also have players like Thomas Ahern coming through, who looks fantastic. And Crowley just getting into his stride.
Mentioning Ulster - they have the potential to do something similar to Leinster in terms of demographics etc. with proper management. They’ve existed in a closed shop and been an administrative disaster since basically the advent of professionalism. It will be very interesting to see what greater IRFU control will be able to do for them after their financial crisis in terms of reorganising their governance. Connacht have worked miracles with what they have but will always have natural disadvantages. Munster made a historic error in not moving to Cork, and being the only show in town in terms of professional sport in Ireland’s second city. If you were looking at a 25 year strategy for them it would not include remaining at Thomond park.
I think this is very valid. I'm a Munster fan and not from Cork. When you see Munster playing Paírc Uí Chaoimh against SA & Crusaders with 40,000 fans at the game you have to think where the growth lies in regular match attendances and fan base.
Bit of audio wouldn't go amiss
An excellent debate. Long overdue. I hope that the IRFU are listening.
glad you don't make the decisions in the IRFU 🤦♂️ guessing you are a bitter munster fan with no one left to support this season
Pity you didn't listen to it. Leinster people having an open discussion. Real rugby people. Your personalised remarks do you no credit. I could well be a real Leinster fan, who wants to ensure that up coming young Leinster players get experience and go on to play for Ireland, doing their club, family and country proud. The bigger picture.
Obviously these matters are not in your thinking. Pity.
@@niallrooneyable you aren't a leinster fan thou or you'd know ROC does not like leinster.... Leo Cullen has been managing tje young talent coming thru at leinster for years ... that's why he is a massively better manager than ROG .... the two players coming in are around for 1 year and will bring massive experience to the squad .... keep your sad comments to yourself
He's irish decent,got loads of family in ireland so why not
His Dad worked there on a dairy farm,when jordie was 4yrs old,and Dad played rugby there as well, jordie want's to catch up with family,and Friends he made all those yrs ago, Hurricane's supporter here,plesed for him, hopefully he'll come back with new and different idea's
Maybe a sliding scale with CCs . Or semi CCs and not the kind of ones to give POM and Zebo a pension plan. Get the 5050 contracts out for Ahearn Edogbo Gleason the Murrays Forde etc..
Getting a bit tedious now. For a journalist to actually suggest we need four crap teams.
Leinster have won one European Cup in a decade. I don't hear Kiwi pundits saying the Crusaders should be shitter.
Only in Irish Rugby would someone suggest uniform mediocrity as a solution.
Same with Dublin and Limerick. Nation of moany holes who would rather cry than take a beating with dignity.
Barrett, Snyman , Lowe, Gibson Park...who else wants to play and how many more can..?
Honestly is the best policy. Good one Lads.
Non-sense converstation, do you think these foreign players have no say in where they play? These are not cattle
What would be the point of giving more Leinster players to Munster. They were given the most talented young outhalf in the country, 2 double world cup winning coaches 2 double world cup winning players and all those resources were squandered. Any Leinster academy players career would die as soon as he walks into thomond.
Snyman hasn't played though... surely there's an element of cutting Munster's losses to it.
In the last 8 years Connacht, Leinster and Munster have all won URC. Ulster also have a Heineken Cup though that was 1999 but they have been competitive most of the time since. That said Leinster are superb at producing young talent so there is a gap. Munster with young players like Brian Gleeson, Ruadhan Quinn, Evan O'Connell, Tom Ahern, the Edogbo brothers and others look as if their time could be coming although front row reinforcements may be required.
Connacht & Ulster do need help. Both are good outlets for a lot of players and are a lot stronger than say Welsh sides. Help all the Provinces but Leinster's success brings in a lot of cash for IRFU to redistribute so dont take it for granted or we could be back to the mostly losing 1990's at provincial and International level..
Whinging about RGS and Barrett is balls... the biggest signings this year are Jaques N and Tyler B.
Be allowed?
Should the Independent be allowed to ask such stupid questions?
Lots of points aired in this programme but no conclusions offered . For me as an outsider I'm asking myself is Ireland rugby in a good shape , yes . Are the provinces in good shape , Leinster are , the other three are not . Good governance by the I R F U need to get there act together to solve this problem . Overall not a bad place to be in .
punish success at your pearl
Jordie Barrett, great signing for Leinster and will benefit IRFU, URC ,and champions cup.
Jordie is coming up, because he wants to play rugby for Leinster,but also,to catch up with family and friends he made 20 plus yrs ago,when his dad worked on a dairy farm and played rugby while the family were up there,
Good for jordie,and be good for Leinster an NZ/Hurricane's in the long run,
Leinster get a double world Cup winning coach..Connacht get Johnny sextons brother .
McCarthy was the best player on the pitch against La Rochelle. He should have had MoM.
I usually like these guys, but they were hard to listen to today. Irish begrudgery at it's best. Leinster is regarded around the world as one of the top 2 or 3 clubs in the world. 20 years of excellent management and planning has got them to this point. 90 %+ of their squad is home grown. They have taken Ireland to the top of the table. We are now the equals of S Africa, France, and N Zealand. This is something I would never have thought possible in my lifetime. Leinster have brought us here, and all they get is grief from Irish rugby pundits. Any other country would give their left testicle to have a team like Leinster, but not Ireland. Pathetic.
As a Leinster fan, the IRFU do need to support the other clubs and allow them to develop more. We need the competitiveness and its isn't Leinsters job to fix this..
Support the other clubs ? Are you confusing the 4 Provinces with AIL rugby clubs?
@@slugger7520 You know what I mean
Why are Leinster letting Jenkins go? Anyone?
Because he has been ineffectual for the duration of his stay other than the first 3 games. They gave Ross Molony the time that Jenkins could have thrived in last season and he ended up being rusty in the knockouts. They must not have thought he was the guy for them as a result. I'd say Neinaber has a different view but it's too late now.
@@alanoneill3167 It makes no sense since Molony is going and the coaches need to get the best out of Jenkins. He helped leinster win a QF against LR in Champions cup. Poor management that they couldn't get more from him
@richy3084 Oh yeah I agree. And its a shame because it looks like Neinaber could have gotten the best out of him. My point is that I think the decision for him to go pre-dates recent matches and probably goes back to last season tbh. Just too late to change it now.
Overthunk??
There wuz.
I think rugby shoukd be left to private sugar daddies to spend millions. That way English and French clubs can rule the roost, year about.😅
MC carthy will be a great player just at times he needs to take a deep breath he gives away a lot of penalites
Very pessimistic views instead of showing more optimism. Could be more optimistic of the changes.
The model is broken as the stronger you are the more financially advantageous it is and that disadvantages the other provinces based on the current model. It’s not good for some excellent ‘bench’ players hanging around hoping for a game. Fitz has a good assessment there including the POM situation. It’s looking unbalanced now and not equitable. Needs to be sorted in the interests of good competition.
Ireland appear to be addicted to feeling like they are progressing via Leinster being Ireland v2.0 and their advantages over all other sides in Europe transferring from that over to the Ireland team for 3½ years of a world cup cycle. The likes of Freeman, Mitchell, Furbank, Coles, Dingwall, Finn Smith and prospects like Langdon, Sleightholme and Pearson are being taken to their limit at the moment at Saints - playing in a small squad with a tight cap, tasked with beating clubs that have equal or greater spending power than them in back to back weeks...
...and England will get the benefits of the physical and mental toughness that breeds when it counts.
England are not afraid of losing games to progress, developing optionality in how they select and play. They came back from a way better run at RWC 23 that anyone expected, went back to the drawing board, changed how and who they play. It took them 3 matches to get to a point where they dominated "best team in the world" Ireland on all the stats. Ireland played the same squad the same way, trying to land a first B2B Slam as a consolation prize - and failed again.
It isn't working. Ireland are going to disappoint again at the next RWC or reach a first semi and behave like they won it.
Adversity is what lifted Ireland to the level of where they could finally beat the big Southern Hemisphere teams. No Irish provinces into the knock outs in Europe in 2016. England dominant in the 2016 six nations - Ireland first reached #1 two years later.
Have a read of the IRFU rugby business plan (I can’t remember the name of the doc but it’s publicly available)
A lot of the main targets are for us to win 6nations. Theyre more lucrative for prize money, cheaper to take part etc. keeps regular cash flow and helps us build Irish rugby overall in a very sustainable manner.
6nations are also a better regular target that allows us to bring lots of great talent through every year. Unlike Aus for example who’s recent WC selection (which massively backfired) was quite clearly a plan to start building for a wc in another 4 years. Horrible for their players. Horrible for their fans and horrible financially.
It would be great to win WCs and all, but financially, logistically and for player development it’s not the ideal North Star for the over all betterment of Irish rugby.
All that said, we still *should* be placing better at WC’s given how well oiled we are as a rugby nation. We also got goosed by the draw last year.
You say they failed to back to back grand slams, sure so has everyone in 6 Nations history. Also, dont forget, it was an English foot in touch, and the try scored on the 3rd phase after the foot was in touch that took the geand slam away. They still done back to back 6 Nations.
@@paulM-gs7jz The link to how a "Leinster first" policy suits being competitive in the 6 Nations is obvious - players wrapped in cotton wool, minimal adaption between how they train and play - how that grows Irish rugby as a whole, less clear - what are the growth metrics?
@@jasonwall5012 B2B grand slams was the opportunity for redemption - to go down in history. Arguably a much bigger challenge than a RWC semi, but they failed - at international level results matter, excuses don't. If & when an Ireland squad surpasses their achievements,they will become a footnote. Nobody celebrates the 2007 England squad despite being a touch decision away from winning the first back to back world cups.
@@robw7676 take a look at the prior mentioned document. We could also simply explore the growth of Irish rugby through results in the last 15 years. We punch well above our weight and are the envy of most nations regarding how the game is structured from schoolboy upwards. The metrics that matter to the IRFU are mostly being met across irish rigby. Sure we have kiwis in tbeir prime leaving to play here. We’ve wc winning coaches joining clubs here. It’s an exceptionally well operated sports union.
kelleher, Healy. Ryan, Henshaw, .O'Brien, VDF Conan, and the Australian Tighthead (if they get him) would all start for any of the other provinces. Deegan Penny, Frawley, Harry Byrne would start got Ulster and Connacht. Says it all about the IRFU's policy
Lads forget snyman Munster wanted him out! He is after costing them so much and nothing in replay.. most days he played he looked lethargic! Never the player he was in SA jersey!
I think he will play very well for leinster,i think he will be better suited to their style,