Finally a system that is easy to install and doesn’t cut corners. Don’t know why so many are hating. If they only watched the entire video. This shows proper layout, drainage, membrane installation, vapor barrier on walls, wood blocking location for the seat, cement board installation, and sloping. What else do you need? The sloping hub kit with weeping insert is sweet! Nice job! 👍🏼
The end product - the floors are slightly wavy. Too much work to not have true flat floors. Also, the "vapor barrier" just allows for moisture to be trapped behind the plastic- there should be breathing room so nothing "grows" on and around the wood studs.
@@oliverleslie7382 Apparently not in yours, but in some states, the water barrier is required. You must comply or it won't pass. Arguing with the inspector about breathing room won't do you any good.
What a fantastic idea. After watching the entire video I understand the reasoning behind the double fall in the flooring. One for the membrane and one for the Tiles. Best set up I've seen so far and love the preset fall strips. Makes it so easy.
Also, one of my walls is an outside wall with furring strips and there is no 'gap' to tuck the liner into. If anyone else has this problem this may help. So, If I just folded the liner and stapled it to the wood framing, then the sheet rock will bulge slightly in this area. The liner is about 1/16, a triangle or 'hospital fold' will have 3 sheets up against the wall, So I used my oscillator to remove 3/16 from the wood so the liner will fit into this recessed area.
Roger Hale yes thank you someone knows what they are doing and I would never bring that board close to drain hod it above flood line or 3 inches above curb. Also just float everything
I stopped doing liner and mud pans years ago. Can order a custom one piece pan from KBRS and install it in an hour rather than a day. None of the issues with a mud slope.
great video thank you! questions...on the installation of the durock, we leave it half inch about shower pan? can I put durock on the floor over current plywood. finally we use leveling sticks twice then correct?
When you keep saying « mud » what is that please? Thanks Could you list of materials and tools you used please. What is the name of trap and shower tray you used please? Thanks
From one Foster to another, Hello. If you are interested the name Foster is scratched/etched into a prison cell wall in an old Gaol in Scotland, circa 1300. Cheers
Is that the origin of foster child? or are you just giving them a bad name? There is nothing worse than inscribing your name into public property! What foresight that guy had.
Is that the origin of Foster child? Must have been a hardened criminal to inscribe one's name onto public property; add another 10 years to the sentence!
My drain is thick/deep. Sits about 3/8 of an inch too high on top of the center ring of the pitch kit. Cut the ring? All the examples are for a very thin drain. Mine has a clean out, not sure what to do.
At around 10:50 you install wallboard, but you don't mention the clearance from the bottom of the lowest board to the pan itself. I've heard that resting the wallboard in the pan is a no-no. So how far up should the gap be? Relative to thickness of floor tile going in?
So... if the foundation has a pitch and the base after the liner has the same pitch, wouldn't the total pitch be the sum of both pitches? I'm certain it would be greater than 1/4 inch per foot. Also 40 mil is not the same as 40 mm
You need to look closer. 1.Never was it said the foundation had a pitch, mostly, its assumed level and to make fully sure the drain is level. 2. The pre-pitch stick is about 1/2 in down to 1/4in. Note that the stick comes up about 1/2 way up the 2x4 framing. 3. It looks like the Quick pitch stick accommodates the thickness of the pre-pitch stick to achieve the 1/4in fall. 4. I read 40 MIL written on the screen. So, 40 gauge is usually a reference to the thickness in thousandths of an inch. So, assuming this is the same, .040" thick, divided by .03937 (Metric conversion) gives you 1.016mm thick. Not sure where you're going there with that.
Hi Folks, Excellent video. It clears up a lot of questions, but it introduces a few for me ... I note that the first layer of dry pack is sloped, "Pre-pitch", so that when the liner is installed, it will drain. This much is clear. Then a second layer of dry pack is installed, above the liner and also sloped, "Quick-Pitch", so the floor proper will drain. This is also clear. What is not clear, is why not make "Pre-Pitch" the necessary 1:48 slope, and then the second layer of dry pack above the liner becomes uniform thickness, and the liner is pitched at maximum slope and maximum drainage? I don't see the benefit of splitting the slope between the two layers of dry pack. Can you please comment on this? Second, my plan is to install radiant floor heating with PEX tubing, so a uniform thickness of the second layer of dry pack is a great simplification to my installation, unless it is going to cause problems that I don't yet understand. Can you please comment on this? Finally, does anything change if I plan to add radiant floor heating, meaning can I simply bury the PEX conduits in the second layer of dry pack, or does radiant floor require something other than dry pack? Thanks for the help, Chris.
A seat With the fasteners screws angled down just broke your vapor barrier and a place for water to flow. All that work for nothing.. no sealer on the concrete board. Good thing concrete board does not wick water and create a good home for mold
@@dewwick111 First of all...... he was being sarcastic. Secondly...... Starr is an ......well, he's not the star you think he is. lol He's not the star HE thinks he is. lol
Anyone else notice the waviness of the joint between the wall and the shower floor? Guess what happens when you cut things that are the same sloe to different lengths? You end up with a different height at the end.
Question regarding the Quick-pitch grade sticks .... the shorter sticks will be less tall against the wall than the longer (corner sticks) and create a downward curve in the wall tile in the middle of the wall. Is there any way to prevent the mid-wall swag using this system? I really like the curb system!! The "concrete" board .... eee-gad!!!
I noticed that too. I think it has to do with screeding technique. If you were to screed by laying a longer screeding stick over the pitch sticks (rather than the float), you'd be able to keep it more uniform.
If using structural screws, you could be alright. But that is obviously dependent on the studs used, or those blocks that were retrofit in between the studs..
bdog0720 you are absolutely right! And that is why i am willing to purchase a pan just because it fits my house. If i have a luxuary house, that will be a different story!
I don't mind this built up pan but I have a one piece plastic pan upstairs that I've used for almost 50 years now without any leaks EXCEPT for that which came out of the tile walls because they didn't have the right construction materials back then. If it works, it works and if I can avoid all this work, I will. Life is short ... .
Certainly, just make sure your plumber can install the drain at the proper location or there are no steel or framing members in the way. That's why they call this type of work "custom".
Waoo look real easy when a real profesional doing work but when someone try without training is a nightmare when all house is destroy by water leak everywhere 🥵
You 40 mil plastic thickness is not 40 millimeter! It's 40 milli-inch. 40 millimeter = 1.57" Thanks for the video. In today's market, clients are requiring the orange "---------" products.
I have ripped out many of these pans. They all stink of sour feet. No one builds showers like this anymore. The effort is absolutely crazy. Water always ends up directly under the cement contained by the membrane. These showers always have a smell.
I'm confused...the wall board is in the pan liner . There are videos everywhere saying to avoid wall board in the liner because the boards will absorb water. How can it be avoided?
I'm not an expert, but there's a gap between the wall board and the base of the pan 13:17. Also, the floor goes UNDER the wall board. I believe those are the critical parts, so the water doesn't "wick" up the wall. In bad installs, the wall board will sit flush with the bottom of the floor, or worse, flush and behind the shower floor. This is an example of how to do it wrong: czcams.com/video/9poai93PUZI/video.html&t=15m13s
very poor. The mortar in the preslope will not pack well at 1/8in thickness. These sticks should be like 3x as thick around the drain. The drain should also be elevated much more.
The hot mop just takes place of the liner. This kit runs about $170 vs Hot mop@ 250.00, min start price. If you're retrofitting a shower and it's located on a second floor, I'd hate to see someone lugging buckets of tar over your hard wood floors. I's just an accident waiting to happen.
@@rudjeep1 Never said it was an unreliable system or that it was invented yesterday. I addressed the cost, as far as speed of installation, I'd say hot mopping is as time consuming. I just think it creates a horrible mess, and the only time I'd consider it is in new construction.
Yeah, the screws should bee structural screws with a good shear rating... That retrofit would only help of you know there are studs, otherwise, the weight is on tile and drywall... In a plastic anchor sleeve... Pretty sketchy
Mistakes 1 - No protection for cooper line on the other side of the wall ( Critical ) 2 - No backing for SH Pan and walls ( Critical ) 3 - No 1" Gap at the end of corners to let SH pan Inside ( Optional ) 4 - No SH Pan for the Seat ( Critical ) Good: The SH pan Pitch is perfect, I like this plastic stuff concept, but not very common the industry
this might be ok for a diy. how much does all this crap cost? the seat thing looks more like a shelve for ladies to put their legs up and shave. the perimeter doesnt look level, and the float job was pretty bad for having pre formed screeds and for promotion of a product. pass
99% use wood curbs. Of that 99% I would say maybe 10% use actual mortar curbs. I've never seen brick, I think that's a regional thing. I would say brick and block is stupid and more time consuming. Have fun setting brick on wood subfloor or concrete slabs, then wrapping a shower pan liner around block/brick and fastening it. Ramset some treated lumber or screw down with 2 or 3 pieces of wood, wrap your liner, presto. While you're laying that brick, I'll be done pouring my bed and having a beer.
@@coinholio6863 give me 50$ for patreon and I’ll explain in detail. I’ll even give you pictures as to the correct way of doing it. My shower drains will never leak. Guarantee it
i was with you until you started with the so called moisture barrier ....biggest mistake in the history of shower stall building or and bathroom wall for that matter
Finally a system that is easy to install and doesn’t cut corners. Don’t know why so many are hating. If they only watched the entire video. This shows proper layout, drainage, membrane installation, vapor barrier on walls, wood blocking location for the seat, cement board installation, and sloping. What else do you need? The sloping hub kit with weeping insert is sweet!
Nice job! 👍🏼
Was that cap?😝
The end product - the floors are slightly wavy. Too much work to not have true flat floors. Also, the "vapor barrier" just allows for moisture to be trapped behind the plastic- there should be breathing room so nothing "grows" on and around the wood studs.
@@oliverleslie7382 Apparently not in yours, but in some states, the water barrier is required. You must comply or it won't pass. Arguing with the inspector about breathing room won't do you any good.
@@ejnl72 well we all should comply with regional dynamics... but it doesn't make it right. Cant use pvc, pex tubing or romex where I'm at...
@@oliverleslie7382 You used it? The floors are slightly wavy?
What a fantastic idea. After watching the entire video I understand the reasoning behind the double fall in the flooring. One for the membrane and one for the Tiles. Best set up I've seen so far and love the preset fall strips. Makes it so easy.
TERRIBLE IDEA...USE WEDI OR SCHLUTER KERDI PRODUCTS FROM HOME DEPOT OR THE TILE SHOP
@@Mrcrisis2012 Fuck home depot!!!
Wow !!! Awesome job. Thank you for your tips.
Also, one of my walls is an outside wall with furring strips and there is no 'gap' to tuck the liner into.
If anyone else has this problem this may help.
So, If I just folded the liner and stapled it to the wood framing, then the sheet rock will bulge slightly in this area.
The liner is about 1/16, a triangle or 'hospital fold' will have 3 sheets up against the wall, So I used my oscillator to remove 3/16 from the wood so the liner will fit into this recessed area.
You can also put down a bed of tile adhesive with a notched trowel onto the concrete in between your screeding rails to make a bonded screed.
You should also, always put 2x8 blocking between the studs, at the bottom of the walls.
Yep and notch studs back with wood chisel a good 1/4 at least the thickness of rubber membrane this stops wall board from flaring out on bottom
Roger Hale yes thank you someone knows what they are doing and I would never bring that board close to drain hod it above flood line or 3 inches above curb. Also just float everything
substitute for kirb perfect (for curb) is welded aluminum wire mesh
Great video, thank You!
I stopped doing liner and mud pans years ago. Can order a custom one piece pan from KBRS and install it in an hour rather than a day. None of the issues with a mud slope.
Dude. Awesome stuff. Looking forward to doing this soon!
Do not follow this video handyman ok
great video thank you! questions...on the installation of the durock, we leave it half inch about shower pan? can I put durock on the floor over current plywood. finally we use leveling sticks twice then correct?
You can put wp calking behind angles has to help them crease better
What kind of motor mix do you normally use for this?
Nice brother professional work done right thanks for the ideas
Thank you!
Yes THANK YOU!
Marshall town and Ridgid tools Nice..Same ones i use...
If you are allergic to latex what other thin set can you use for the shower seat?
When you keep saying « mud » what is that please? Thanks
Could you list of materials and tools you used please. What is the name of trap and shower tray you used please? Thanks
From one Foster to another, Hello.
If you are interested the name Foster is scratched/etched into a prison cell wall in an old Gaol in Scotland, circa 1300. Cheers
Is that the origin of foster child? or are you just giving them a bad name? There is nothing worse than inscribing your name into public property! What foresight that guy had.
Is that the origin of Foster child? Must have been a hardened criminal to inscribe one's name onto public property; add another 10 years to the sentence!
Very well explained thank you
DO YOU HAVE ANY VIDEOS ON THE PROCESS TO PRODUCE THE DRY PACK? IE. WHAT KIND OF MIX, HOW MUCH WATER, HOW MUCH SAND, WHAT ARE THE RATIOS?
Well done, thank you
Where can I find this sheet
If the preslope is already 1/4" per foot, won't the quick pitch sticks on top make it 1/2" per foot?
Warning, if following the step of connection between bed liner and drain by using plumbing putty, you will have a major leak in a very near future.
What is the preferred method?
@@ericsmith8913 100 percent silicone only
My drain is thick/deep. Sits about 3/8 of an inch too high on top of the center ring of the pitch kit. Cut the ring? All the examples are for a very thin drain. Mine has a clean out, not sure what to do.
@1:54 - It is NOT a 40 "millimeter" shower liner. It is a 40 MIL liner. A mil is equal to a thou - 0.001" which is VERY different than a millimeter.
good job
At around 10:50 you install wallboard, but you don't mention the clearance from the bottom of the lowest board to the pan itself. I've heard that resting the wallboard in the pan is a no-no. So how far up should the gap be? Relative to thickness of floor tile going in?
Is there tile on the underside of the seat?
Excelente
So... if the foundation has a pitch and the base after the liner has the same pitch, wouldn't the total pitch be the sum of both pitches? I'm certain it would be greater than 1/4 inch per foot. Also 40 mil is not the same as 40 mm
40 mm = 1,57 inch. This can't be the thickness of the vinyl sheet. Maybe 0,40 mm?
You need to look closer.
1.Never was it said the foundation had a pitch, mostly, its assumed level and to make fully sure the drain is level.
2. The pre-pitch stick is about 1/2 in down to 1/4in. Note that the stick comes up about 1/2 way up the 2x4 framing.
3. It looks like the Quick pitch stick accommodates the thickness of the pre-pitch stick to achieve the 1/4in fall.
4. I read 40 MIL written on the screen. So, 40 gauge is usually a reference to the thickness in thousandths of an inch. So, assuming this is the same,
.040" thick, divided by .03937 (Metric conversion) gives you 1.016mm thick. Not sure where you're going there with that.
Thanks. Nice.
Hi Folks,
Excellent video. It clears up a lot of questions, but it introduces a few for me ...
I note that the first layer of dry pack is sloped, "Pre-pitch", so that when the liner is installed, it will drain. This much is clear. Then a second layer of dry pack is installed, above the liner and also sloped, "Quick-Pitch", so the floor proper will drain. This is also clear. What is not clear, is why not make "Pre-Pitch" the necessary 1:48 slope, and then the second layer of dry pack above the liner becomes uniform thickness, and the liner is pitched at maximum slope and maximum drainage? I don't see the benefit of splitting the slope between the two layers of dry pack. Can you please comment on this?
Second, my plan is to install radiant floor heating with PEX tubing, so a uniform thickness of the second layer of dry pack is a great simplification to my installation, unless it is going to cause problems that I don't yet understand. Can you please comment on this?
Finally, does anything change if I plan to add radiant floor heating, meaning can I simply bury the PEX conduits in the second layer of dry pack, or does radiant floor require something other than dry pack?
Thanks for the help,
Chris.
Oops, one more question ... Is the same material used for both layers of dry pack?
Thanks for the help,
Chris.
What is the weight capacity of the seats installed in this video?
Not for American!!!!!
This made every other shower video look shitty. Best and easiest instructional video by far.
Nice!! Where can you purchase “Curb Perfect” products?
Were i cam bay this material plastic in new jersey
Home Depot lo vende o donde venden cerámica
Good morning 😄☀️
How useless is this?
A seat With the fasteners screws angled down just broke your vapor barrier and a place for water to flow. All that work for nothing..
no sealer on the concrete board. Good thing concrete board does not wick water and create a good home for mold
concrete board DOES wick. czcams.com/video/9poai93PUZI/video.html
@@dewwick111 First of all...... he was being sarcastic. Secondly...... Starr is an ......well, he's not the star you think he is. lol He's not the star HE thinks he is. lol
Ok, thanks. I'm not a fan of anyone on here. I just watch the videos (like many I suspect) to try to get information.
Dear lord .like a million steps.
Is a better video on tile coach channel
I will say at least they don't run screws through their liner and ruin it like Starr tile.
Why are you so obsessed with that guy?
If it is waterproofed, that's a moot point.
lol thats funny as fuck. that guy is a hack a best. i commented on one of his videos calling him a helper gone wild. he deleted it.
No water proofing?
Anyone else notice the waviness of the joint between the wall and the shower floor?
Guess what happens when you cut things that are the same sloe to different lengths?
You end up with a different height at the end.
Thanks Master 😁
excellant thanks
Question regarding the Quick-pitch grade sticks .... the shorter sticks will be less tall against the wall than the longer (corner sticks) and create a downward curve in the wall tile in the middle of the wall. Is there any way to prevent the mid-wall swag using this system? I really like the curb system!! The "concrete" board .... eee-gad!!!
I noticed that too. I think it has to do with screeding technique. If you were to screed by laying a longer screeding stick over the pitch sticks (rather than the float), you'd be able to keep it more uniform.
good system
I would rather use 100% Silicone not Plumbers Putty.
That seat good for someone. Under 100lbs. Or use as a shelf
How to replace a shower plastic drain
If using structural screws, you could be alright. But that is obviously dependent on the studs used, or those blocks that were retrofit in between the studs..
Can we just purchase a shower pan and call it a day!
I agree! I need a 29" X 60"---$340 to have it custom made....vs. all this??
You can’t tile a pan. The difference between a lazy job and expert. You won’t find a pan in a luxury home.
bdog0720 you are absolutely right! And that is why i am willing to purchase a pan just because it fits my house. If i have a luxuary house, that will be a different story!
I don't mind this built up pan but I have a one piece plastic pan upstairs that I've used for almost 50 years now without any leaks EXCEPT for that which came out of the tile walls because they didn't have the right construction materials back then. If it works, it works and if I can avoid all this work, I will. Life is short ... .
Certainly, just make sure your plumber can install the drain at the proper location or there are no steel or framing members in the way. That's why they call this type of work "custom".
Nice
Hahaha...why you don't show how you did the folding liner on the 21° angles....so funny....!
Waoo look real easy when a real profesional doing work but when someone try without training is a nightmare when all house is destroy by water leak everywhere 🥵
You're not making a shower for me!
thanks
Nothing stopping the water from backing up underneath the liner
You did notice that the liner runs up the wall, right? and that the pan was filled with water to check for leaks? or what exactly do you mean?
See plumber's putty added at 5:03
You 40 mil plastic thickness is not 40 millimeter! It's 40 milli-inch. 40 millimeter = 1.57"
Thanks for the video. In today's market, clients are requiring the orange "---------" products.
Before you attempt these systems be sure the bank will cover the cost of the increase in your mortgage???
Its only 200 dollars for the whole system including pen liner, and it will save you few hours of work.
@@ruslanotarov9727 Phewww...No kidding! OMG lol...
This video is a total no no👎👎👎
I have ripped out many of these pans. They all stink of sour feet. No one builds showers like this anymore. The effort is absolutely crazy. Water always ends up directly under the cement contained by the membrane. These showers always have a smell.
Could you perhaps recommend an alternative then? Might be more useful of a comment.
@@lucidjade Schluter Kerdi system.
I'm confused...the wall board is in the pan liner . There are videos everywhere saying to avoid wall board in the liner because the boards will absorb water.
How can it be avoided?
I'm not an expert, but there's a gap between the wall board and the base of the pan 13:17. Also, the floor goes UNDER the wall board. I believe those are the critical parts, so the water doesn't "wick" up the wall. In bad installs, the wall board will sit flush with the bottom of the floor, or worse, flush and behind the shower floor. This is an example of how to do it wrong: czcams.com/video/9poai93PUZI/video.html&t=15m13s
@@rickmancuso1260 Thank you I started on mine already. I went back and trimmed the wall boards then installed the floor.
40mm vinyl? Ha! I'm done.
Installer vs Craftsman... This is what you do when your customer is spending half mil or more on their house.
You must be the guy that puts drywall behind his shower tile.
@@claykearney1969 must be :)
@14:30 My 250+lbs ass would tear that twig seat clean off the wall! Is there a seat in the real world designed for humans?
very poor. The mortar in the preslope will not pack well at 1/8in thickness. These sticks should be like 3x as thick around the drain. The drain should also be elevated much more.
Its connected to a center ring for that very reason (Jeeze)
@@michaelstapleton7224 nope. The pre pitch sticks do NOT connect to a centering ring. Learn what you are talking about.
@@michaelcarton3299 12:04?
@@ak0792 those are not the pre slope sticks. Those are for the final slope. Look at the 17 min mark.
@@michaelcarton3299 gotcha you mean at 3 minutes
1/8 of an inch at the drain, a disaster waiting to happen. 🤦🏽♂️
why?
looked great
How about just paying a hot mopper to come in and do it right ? Faster, cheaper
hot mop is trush
The hot mop just takes place of the liner. This kit runs about $170 vs Hot mop@ 250.00, min start price. If you're retrofitting a shower and it's located on a second floor, I'd hate to see someone lugging buckets of tar over your hard wood floors. I's just an accident waiting to happen.
Hot mopping has been done for decades. Done properly it is fool proof and more reliable.
@@rudjeep1 Never said it was an unreliable system or that it was invented yesterday. I addressed the cost, as far as speed of installation, I'd say hot mopping is as time consuming. I just think it creates a horrible mess, and the only time I'd consider it is in new construction.
So with this system you’re left with uneven pan unless your pan is a square. If one side of your pan is longer this is junk.
1:54 40 mil refers to 0.04" lol, 40 millimeters would be over 1 1/2"!!!!
Use the Schluter system eliminates the old pan liner and duraroc Schluter system a superior installation
So expensive.....
Linear drain shower composite
*
Damn there making our trade to easy ! WTF
Those seats dont look like they will hold much weight
Yeah, the screws should bee structural screws with a good shear rating... That retrofit would only help of you know there are studs, otherwise, the weight is on tile and drywall... In a plastic anchor sleeve... Pretty sketchy
nothing that 6 cinder blocks and 3 end cap cant fix.
I think those shower seats look hideous
Agreed. Buy a teak shower seat from Amazon if you really need something.
Mistakes
1 - No protection for cooper line on the other side of the wall ( Critical )
2 - No backing for SH Pan and walls ( Critical )
3 - No 1" Gap at the end of corners to let SH pan Inside ( Optional )
4 - No SH Pan for the Seat ( Critical )
Good: The SH pan Pitch is perfect, I like this plastic stuff concept, but not very common the industry
no corners cut ... sorry for pun
El acabado quedó muy bien pero demasiado trabajo e inseguridad de esos productos de plastico.
I’ll take Schluter bases any day this is a combination of obsolete technology
this might be ok for a diy. how much does all this crap cost? the seat thing looks more like a shelve for ladies to put their legs up and shave. the perimeter doesnt look level, and the float job was pretty bad for having pre formed screeds and for promotion of a product. pass
Anyone else think this is too damn much?
Тяп ляп
Your talking a lot of advance stuff for armature plumbers and for being Goof Proof
Wood curb? No thanks... Bricks work way better...
Goof Proof LOL..
Always do wood curbs never had a leak wrap it in hardi backer and waterproof properly with red guard or Schluter no problems
99% use wood curbs. Of that 99% I would say maybe 10% use actual mortar curbs.
I've never seen brick, I think that's a regional thing. I would say brick and block is stupid and more time consuming. Have fun setting brick on wood subfloor or concrete slabs, then wrapping a shower pan liner around block/brick and fastening it.
Ramset some treated lumber or screw down with 2 or 3 pieces of wood, wrap your liner, presto. While you're laying that brick, I'll be done pouring my bed and having a beer.
The Schluter system is much more durable
Pre pitch hahahaha get outta here...learn how to do a pan
I agree!
Putting an x over the bolt holes is improper way of doing it. Stop doing it.
Explain, please?
@@coinholio6863 give me 50$ for patreon and I’ll explain in detail. I’ll even give you pictures as to the correct way of doing it. My shower drains will never leak. Guarantee it
i was with you until you started with the so called moisture barrier ....biggest mistake in the history of shower stall building or and bathroom wall for that matter