Proper Way To Set WALLBOARD For Shower
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- čas přidán 27. 05. 2017
- Do NOT set your wallboard after the liner to push liner folds close to wall...doing this forces you to put pan material against wallboard, embedding it into pan. If pan gets wet, your board wicks up water.
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StarrTile that's so wrong, and multiple views from a person only count as one, though they are being shown multiple ads, I wonder how many musicians are being super underpaid compared to what they made from selling an album or song download, maybe Congress could impose a minimum view value to keep the artists or contributors wage from becoming worthless , after all they're making money selling ads attached to your creative work
so youre asking the viewers to pay for your misinformation? ive been building showers for 32 years and i promise you dont know as much as you think.
@@scott9095 amen!
@@scott9095 Would you mind expanding on what you see that is misinformation? I could not find any comments from you other than this one.
@Dirk Dixon the people that are mouthing off as you put it are trying to keep you from making a dumb mistake. They have taken time to respond in hopes that people like yourself will understand that this is not a good idea or method.
You're literally the only one that explain this step in detail. Thanks for the info!
This video is three years old and still the best I have found for how to and an explanation for how things are done. I purchased my first home and have been working my way through projects and despised my master bath fiberglass shower. I thought I bit off more than I could chew but you gave me the confidence and knowledge to save myself thousands here in Alaska. I was really nervous (especially with cost of material here) to "waste" or ruin my materials by making simple mistakes that I learned to avoid from your videos. I poured my pan two days ago and hopefully wrapping up this shower by the end of the week. I just wanted to say thanks for the videos. They really are helpful!
StarrTile! I've been watching a bunch from your channel prepping to rework remodel my bathroom myself and you are the most insightful, you answer the most of my questions and curiousities, and you're the best at helping me over come my ineptitude by your displays of bad work you have to fix and your commentary on them! thank you so much for your efforts and contributions!
Been at it for 33 years as a contractor and always appreciate your videos. I've been redguarding the pan setting rock and redguarding that with no gap. Never had any problems but I'll start gapping. I like the concept
33 Hoax code!
Thanks for the many excellent videos you've produced. They are extremely well done. I like how you think about issues and don't just blindly accept 'current" wisdom. You've taught me a lot.
Bob.... I really enjoy these videos. Probably watched them several times over to make sure my shower remodel was done properly. We had mold constantly on our tiles. When I demolished it, everything was wrong. Cheap building contractor as the home is only 10 years old. Even had to replace the subfloor sheathing as well as wall insulation due to rot and mold.
Several tile contractors wanted to cut corners in their bids and didn't go with them. Went with one and still had to tell them certain things I wanted such as Regard, the height of the wallboard as in this video, and a few more. Overall, the job came out great.
My wife is extremely happy not to have any more mold on the tile!!! Thank you and I'll be sure to keep an eye out for future videos.
Cheers,
Joe
Thank you sir ;-)
Do you think it would be better to put the mesh along the gap at the bottom and then Redgard it? I feel like you wouldn’t be able to get the water proofing in that gap good enough to completely cover every inch. Wouldn’t there be an exploded end of the backer board facing the floor?
Okay so I'd like to start by saying I really enjoy your videos. Of all the folks I've seen post videos for tile advice, yours and and very few others are as helpful and well rounded. My name is Tanner Sutton and we own and operate a plumbing and flooring company here in western Oklahoma. So as far as preslope helping if any or at all, in my experience, the capillary action does take place in a shower floor mud (4 to 1, or deck mud, specifically shower floor mud though) however, if the red gurard membrane is installed from wall board and continued onto the floor mud until stopping around 6 inches around your drain, the only place water is able to go past tile is into the floor mud by the drain, at which time, when weep protection is also correctly installed, I've never seen water on any of my showers, wick all the way back up to the wall and saturating pan completely, before it enters the weep holes. In my experience, the water will always follow the path of least resistance, and the plumbing code the Oklahoma recognizes actually calls for a certain percentage of preslope to shower pan, and it's usually a steeper grade than finished shower floor itself. I dont have any videos, but the next tme I pour a pan and do my floor test, I will also test my weep protection and send you a video if weep holes draining long before complete shower pan saturation. Thanks again. Work hard my friend.
Great video !! Maybe I have overlooked a video somewhere or haven't come across it yet, but how far down do you screw in the wallboard? Looks like it screws into the pan liner and maybe silicone in the screw holes and then get coats of RedGard? Thanks for all you do
So leave a 1/8 or 1/4" gap between the cement board and shower pan. And also leave a 1/8 or 1/4" gap between the tile and shower pan? Is this correct? ( new to home improvements and slow learner) thank you for the video.
IDK how you know this stuff but you're like a tile guru. For someone like me, who's new in the home improvement industry, I appreciate the knowledge! 💪🏿💪🏿💪🏿
Bob, how thick of a gap for say 5/16 mosaic? Thanks for the educational videos. Getting geared up to do my own neo angle shower and corner tub in my log cabin.
Hi again, thanks for the speedy reply.
The wall tile meeting the floor tile on pan, how much gap do you allow for Grout, or would you advise Caulk. Do you grout corners also ??
Thanks again.
Leave about 1/8'' at that transition. Grout it in, and yes corners too. IF cracking occurs over the years, THEN you should caulk. My shower is 4 years old, no cracking & no caulk.
That's great news! I set my wall board on 2x4's before I started learning how to make a concrete pan in a 6'x4' shower. Now I've got about a 1" gap from wall board to pan. I thought I screwed up worse than I did. Beginners luck maybe.
Good video. What if there is a drain block or water testing by keeping water 3" for4 hours in the pan? Will the water not climb on the backer board and create wicking or does Redgurad do the sealing?
I have watched a lot of your videos and really helped me doing my shower from drain to shower pan etc
THIS was what I was looking for! Direct and to the point!!! THANK YOU!
The actual problem is the shower pan mortar bed is not draining the water away from the walls effectively. Two things can cause this, no or incorrect pre-slope or blocked weep holes. If your liner is sitting on a flat floor, it's the perfect recipe for water to pool and build up in the mortar bed. The water level in the motor bed rises and up the wall it goes.
Raising the board off the mortar bed is really not the solution and here is why. Let's say the wall is 1/4" off the bed, this space will either get filled with grout which is water permeable. It will bridge the floor and wall and up the water goes up the wall board.
Filling this space with silicone or siliconized grout won't work either. All the tile grout lines on the floor are saturated with water and they channel water toward this space. These grout lines will funnel water right under the silicone bead and up the wall the water goes.
A correct pre slope, top pre slope and clear weep holes will pull water away from the outer perimeter toward the drain and down the pipe. If you build it correctly it will work correctly.
Thank you for this video!!! Everyone talks about NOT PUTTING THE WALLBOARD IN THE PAN but no one shows how to go from there.
Great video. Is that grout or silicon or something else between the floor tile and the wall, at wall-tiling part towards the video's end? Thanks.
I was wondering the same thing
So I left the 3/4 gap at the bot5om and then tiled the floor. I stopped about 1/4 from the shower pan. Now I have 1/4 gap between the liner and tiles. Can this be left as is or do I need to get grout in there (some spots seem impossible for me to get grout in) to help pitch any water away from pan liner?
Do you silicone caulk or grout the wall ttle and floor tile joint Bob?
Do you recommend putting red guard on the wall board all the way up? Also the floor as well? Thanks
Soooo. I guess i need to raise ma wall in inch. The floorpan (40 mils) is in and the rock on the walls going down past the pan 6 inches i left vertical. No cuts on my plastic, folds only. So my rock is hung inside my pan and its 1/4 in off the plastic. So opps i hav not put in my finish floor or tile on top of that. So that means i need to cut the rock with my grinder, NOT cutting the plastic behind it, cut it high enough to miss the deckmud and the tile on top of it? Is that what yr saying to me? Let me know. I WAS gonna deckmud to tile height. Now im thinkin i might have to cut the wall and re red coat the bottom. OR .... can i just seal (tape and bed) the wall to the plastic pan then deckmud, then water proof it all. And tile on top of all that!? Info pls
So at 3:41 where it has that gap between the wall tile and the floor tile, so you eventually grout that gap in too? Or you silicone that gap?
So below that wall board gap is the wood plate of the wall framing?
Thanks for sharing many of your insightful videos! I agree with the principle of getting the wall board off the pan to eliminate wicking. However, with this approach, the bottom 1/4" or so grout for the wall tile is unsupported - does this create problems where the grout will deteriorate over time ? My concern is that I am installing subway tile on the vertical and I have many grout vertical grout lines that will hit the floor, will there be missing grout in the future since the bottom bit of grout is unsupported behind? Thanks again!
Well. it's a year late for you but I am entering this phase of planning for my own shower and considering the same thing. I agree that standing the wall board off of the pan is soundly logical, however the avoidance of back-butter on the lowest bit (1/4") of bottom tile makes less sense. By standing the backer board off the pan, Redgard (Hydroban or whatever) can be applied in such a way that it coats that gap-cavity, including the bottom of the backer board; this creates a capillary break between the shower pan and the backer board. As such, you are not relying upon physical separation as the sole means of wicking-prevention. Furthermore, filling that cavity, even with cementitious media like thinset, should have no impact if the Redgard (or whatever) is applied continuously. If water were to be wicked upward through such media it would logically meet the Redgarded bottom of the wall board and its upward ascension would be impeded. "But it could keep riding the thinset upwards past the gap and further up the wall, between the tile and backer board!" So what? Presumably, the Redgard goes all the way up the wall, so the relatively small number of vertical inches that the capillary action wicks moisture upward has no impact on the wall assembly behind the Redgard. If you only Regarded a couple of inches up the wall then this (and more) would be a problem. Lastly, I am using a more contemporary foam backerboard. Polystyrene itself is hydrophobic but I still like the idea of standing it off the pan for good measure, just in case some unforeseen physical forces encourage water to rise up the material. In any case, I would be curious to know what course you took and how things have worked out for you.
Ok so i've already red-garded but didnt leave the gap at the bottom of the hardie board, what should I do?
Thanks for your videos. My question: Is there a problem with using a quick-set type cement to speed up the drying/curing time?
Yes you could do that, and many Tiler's do, however I do not because the Cure time is still important... if I am in that much of a hurry that I cannot wait a day then I might do things sloppy
Your workis nothing shy of stellar! Thank you for posting such great videos!!
thank you sir
If you are using the oatey pan liner (fully water proof) under the mortar bed then why are you also red gaurding the mortar bed surface? I thought this was frowned upon and can trap moisture between the two water proof layers
If you look at his other videos, he doesn't redguard the whole mortar surface. He leaves a large area around the drain free, relying on the liner underneath the mortar.
But there, commenters say it's dumb not to redguard everywhere.
Anyway, I don't think trapped moisture in mortar has ever been an issue. It'll last decades submerged in water (e.g. under a tiled pool).
what about leveling the studs for cement board? Does the tile leveling systems replace or help with the need to get them plum and level?
It depends on how much they are off, the prep is the most important thing so that matters, leveling systems are not meant to take the place of prep, they are mint offset warped tile for tile that is staggered in half which is not really supposed to be... do your prep right and your tiling will go a lot easier
Thanks for all the great videos.....it’s obviously a labor of love!!! I have a question about Densshield backer board. A lot of timers in Our area (Southern AZ) are using it. It lends itself well to you method of keeping wallboard off the pan. However, Densshield (DS) Manufacturer says to run some of pan mortar up the wall, then stop bottom of DS just short of that small mortar strip and silicone caulk between DS and top of that mortar strip (hope I explained that well enough. What do you think of using DS in general and this method of having to run a small mortar strip 2”-6” above top of pan? Seems unnecessary to me?
How big of a gap do you leave at the floor level? One more question - do you install a vapor barrier between the sheetrock and studs? I see arguments for (protects the studs) and against (traps moisture and you risk mold growth) and I don't know which is the correct and best practice to avoid shower failure down the short road. Thanks! 🙂
Gap is about 3/4" to an inch..never moisture barrier AND waterproofing, one or the other.
Is the redguard at the ends of the pan actually on thr pan liner, where thr floor tile goes under the backer board?
Great Video,Red Guard is Junk,It takes to long to dry,Slowing down shower pan testing and takes along time to dry after the test for setting tile,I use Hydroban,Its bullet proof and stops all hydrostatic pressure that bleeds into the walls or pinholes,It dries in an hour ! Your videos are great and appreciated :) THANKS
Did you say once you can do regular cement on top of the floor UP TO the PVC liner? Like regular cement, PVC liner, then your mortar set to level and slope, then thinset and tile?
or does it have to be mortar above cement, below pvc liner?
How far up do you go on your hardie from floor so that it doesnt get wet like you said
Question, so that small gap at bottom behind last wall tile. (Looks like about half an inch) Will water and moisture not eventually get back in that space and just grow mold?
Sure you could caulk the wall tile to floor tile interface, but all caulk fails eventually.
So you create constant mold space the entire perimeter of the shower.
Have you pulled apart old showers made this way and seen mold growing in that gap?
I'm assuming you red quard the very bottom of the wall board, but still just seems to me that gap is gonna grow and hide mold.
Thats immediately where my head went could you basically want a tight 90 at the bottom for water proofing. This guy does stuff different than I do though.
Fill gap with water proof concrete never water touch drywall keeping wall dry forever
This is the comment I was looking for, feels like a sandwich between pan and redgard. Why not let it sit on exposed pan, then seal with tape. All water coming down wall board will have somewhere to go.
By the magix of your generosity and CZcams I didnt have to build a dozen showers to figure that out. Thank you!
YW
how do you hold your ledger board on the wall after you already used the redgaurd? do you remove the ledger once top tiles are dry, drill in the screws in and re apply the redgaurd to those screw areas?
A dab of silicone into the holes after removing ledger board
Hey Bob,
What is a comfortable spacing between the wallboard and the pan, also what is a comfortable spacing between the mortar and the top of the drain for thin-set and tile?
I set wallboard about 3/4'' above pan.
Mortar is about 3/8' roughly before drain cap, thinset & tile lets tile rise slightly above cap.
maybe this was already asked , I have a concrete slab and wood stud walls going to do mud bed and cement board on the walls , what is the procedure for that. Thanks for any info
Do you just redguard the gap at the bottom between the pan and cement board or do you put a mesh and thin set then redguard how does the redguard adhere to the rubber membrane
Thanks
The Red Guard adheres to the mortar, the liner, and underneath the backerboard just fine, use a large brush
So I had to leave out of state, so let my brother finish my bathroom project, he’s been flipping houses for 10 yrs. I came home to find out that he used green board drywall for my stand up shower, but mentioned to me it would work if I redgard the whole shower, it has its shower bed shower Liner. So my question is that correct to use that green board drywall? I’ve always thought to use cement board as a shower wall water proof barrier then tiling of course need opinion before tearing down drywall?
3:54 (for example) Do you then caulk that small gap between the wall tiles and the floor tile?
He said it’s really up to you, but not needed.
Your proud of your work..... And you should be. Nicely done bud.🙂
You are saving me thousands of dollars! Thanks for the videos!
How do you attach the backboard to the vinyl liner on the walls without putting screws/hole in the liner ?
What is directly below the backerboard on the wall and the floor (is that the shower liner I see)? When you've finished tiling, do you caulk the tile where the wall tile meets the floor tile?
I would assume yes.
ok so wall board is not into pan..but wall 2 by 4 sill plate and blcoking is still there behind redguard??? framing member behind membrane, wall board would be behind membrane? i dont see your idea as the missing link...help me understand sir
It looks like you grouted under the wall board when grouting the shower floor, is that correct? and what type of wall board do you use?
That's a line of clear silicone that you see. He either used hardi backer or duraroc. Same thing except hardi backer is lighter and easier to cut.
Does the Redguard get coated on the mud pan (or is the redguard just coating the backerboard)?
All places
You actually took the time to answer me?! You really rock man I seriously appreciate you pal
What if (after the shower is done and in use) the drain clogs with hair or whatever and you wind up with 2-3 inches of water in the bottom of the shower? Wouldn't the water reach the wallboard (and wick) then? I think I will redguard the bottom edges of the wall board and even about curb height on the backside of the wallboard. I guess if you caulk the seam where the wall tile comes down to the floor tile it wouldn't be as likely either.
Is the wallboard and floor "mudded" with thinset or joint compound in this video?
No
How do you grout that little bottom gap? Do you make to grout a little more watery so it can get into that 3/4” gap in back of the tile? I’m concerned if I just grout to cover the lines that it will fall out since there is nothing in back of it.
The mortar is up against the liner, so too will the floor tile...perhaps with a minor space there, same as your grout lines, no difference..it's all grouted. The wall tile sits almost to floor and that line is grouted as is the wall, you could then caulk in that area, but no water will want to get in there anyway.. Not sure I answered the question.
StarrTile so that final gap at bottom of wall tile will not be grouted or caulked right? That is the part that is not so clear.
:)...You do a great job!...I Use Mapei grout which always has a matching caulk...I use the sanded caulk for the inside corners especially at the floor and walls in the shower...It helps deal with movement and gives a clean look...I started using the Pink waterproofer because of your usage...here in the philly area; too few guys want to do it right; they just want to get paid...I see you, as a business owner myself, want to stand by your work...If only all the owners could get together and be a single entity...:)...
Do you grout that gap on the bottom row of tile? Also, is there any harm in pouring the floor and tiling it before putting the walls up?
You need to install the waterproof membrane before laying any tile. The membrane for the floor needs to go up the walls. I like to have the membrane no lower than 6" above the top of the curb. For that reason, I don't see how it would be possible to install the walls after laying the floor tile.
@@YouDriveUSuccess i THINK when I commented this, I was asking if you could put the cement board on after pouring the floor.
@starrtile when the water penetrates through the tile and grout, where does it go? Does it just get stagnant under the tile since you've redguarded your upper mortar bed?
The weep holes in this case, don't go into effect since they are still a couple inches down where your liner is.
I believe you have made your own point....when you said that the weep holes are a couple of inches of mortar down, whereas a waterproof shower pan surface it's only a quarter to maybe 3/8 of an inch from said surface, and therefore it can dry out but the 2in of mortar cannot 👍
@@StarrTile Ah okay. I didn't know that was a thing. Thanks!
Starr Tile, forgive me if you've already addressed this question. I've followed you're advice on the gap between mortar bed and hardieboard. I've Redguarded everything like you did. When I go to tile my floor, do I want my thinset to go all the way back in that gap to the wall (pan membrane (that is refguarded) or should I stop the thinset just before hitting the membrane wall? Hope that makes sense. Thanks! You have really helped me over this bathroom project.
Thinset for tile on floor..so yeah if you need thinset into gap to secure tile then yes... but you're not filling the Gap
Any concern about water getting in that gap behind the bottom tile and smelling bad?
The very small amount of water that could possibly get back there would most likely dissipate over time, I don't have a concern that it will stagnate in that area, but then again there is grout and sealer and most people will caulk the bottom anyway
How is perforation take place if you redguard the pan?
Keep preaching Bob! There is absolutely NO reason whatsoever for your wall board to touch the deck or the floor tile!!! I wish the rest would get this one VERY important detail.
You’re absolutely right. Thank you for great ideas.*****
This just answered a piece of my puzzle thank you!
How much do you usually charge per square foot?
Bob, I never used redguard but want to use it over a shower pan, (mortar bed). However I do not know how to apply it when it comes to the drain. Do you temporarily plug the channels and weep holes and coat over the drain flange?
There should be a slight gap where drain barrel ( threaded part ) is and your pan mortar...you can use a brush to get in there to seal up that area, but tape off the drain cap & rim first.
Got it and thanks
When adding the wall tile a void is left at the base were everything meets. Is this back filled? If back filled, what is it back filled with? If not filled, why, wouldn't this cause problems?
Indeed, thinking about it a bit:
Perimeter Wall tile first THEN the floor tile creates a built-in barrier at the apex of the joint with the floor tile capturing/pinching the wall tile in place.
I’d still leave the backer-board gap just in case he’s right about the wicking action, And I’d still put a vapor barrier insulation and still red guard at all.
He doesn’t usually avoid answering well thought out questions like yours though, plus it’s been two years since he posted this so I don’t think he would anyways.
Almost a year on your comment & yet? I am replying to your comment...scratches head🥴
This was an excellent HOW TO video!!! I would like to see you do more of these in your current videos even if you have done videos of them before or at least put links to old videos if don't want to do another same HOW TO video. Thank YOU
What is the wall is floated with fat mud?. Is it ok to float the wall all the way down to the mortar bed?? Or should I still leave a space?
I'm not one to float walls because walls don't degrade or fail, it doesn't make your shower any better to have fat mud on there versus a cement backer board or even sheetrock, as long as the whole thing is waterproofed he would not matter the makeup and prep material.
But to your specific question I would never marry my pan with my walls because we can action could occur if you don't waterproof correctly
So what do you do with the gap where the wall tile meets the floor tile? Is it supposed to be grouted or filled with silicone where the tiles meet? Or do you leave the gap open so that water flows in and out? Thank you!
I doubt water will flow in & out, the gap is left as is
Grout! Push it in! LOL
So you did a concrete floor? I assume in that gap on the wall behind the wall board is a rubber liner?... so the redguard will stick fine to the rubber liner?
Do you use the water prove robber use underneath the paint
Ok, so I understand why not to allow the wall board to touch the pan.
However I see a problem with the "gap". All i see happening there is water seeping behind that wall tile and accumulating and then any number of nasty mold and mildew is going to grow behind there. Impossible to clean it.
That does not seem like a good solution to me. Who wants hidden mold sources all along their shower floor corners?
Caulking would work for a time, then fail and moisture will get back there.
I don't get it.
???
Well first of all the wall tile overlaps the floor tile so there's positive water flow going the opposite from the wall... secondly where the wall meets the floor tile should have it be of caulking... and lastly if any water whatsoever gets into that void it will dissipate same as any water anywhere you leave it...
Plus mold needs three things to flourish, air, moisture, and food
@@StarrTile so if you do run say durock all they way to the top of the tile or Oakley liner where's the the mold going to get the food?
It sure is refreshing to see proper way over failed way scenarios!
Hey Bob, with the shower pan, how did you seal between the pan and the Hardbacker?
If there is a gap like you have between the wall and the mortar bed, obviously it must be sealed but is redgard ok to use over the pan liner? to make a seal?
if you are worried about that gap, apply a bead of a sealant like silicone or kerdi fix about 3" up from the bottom before you screw the backer boards on. The red gard will seal it off but it wouldn't hurt to apply a sealant.
NC Tile Guy would a fiberglass tape with aqua defense or similar work as well?
My tile person has poured against the backer boards and what you're saying makes sense. Can I just cut the board above the cemented area to create that space and then use the red water proofing compound? Reply soon would be appreciated as he'll probably come back within couple of days to finish the job.
Yes that sounds reasonable & logical.
If your waterproofing it shouldn’t matter if it goes on the floor right?
If waterproofing fails the shower will fail either way?
Hey Bob! Do not want to start off on a wrong foot. I like all the songs you play in the intro. And to get to the matter, There is red guard applied and water does not pass through that to get to the wall board. What do you say to that?
I like this guy. No bs here
Sorry this isn’t related to pan liners but I was hoping to get your recommendation on ceramic tile sealer. One that hopefully doesn’t change the color of my grout. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thank you!
It's not really the tile that you were using seal for but more for the grout... stain-proof is the best on the market
Thank you a lot sir i know what's u talking about bcz u are a real trademans on field doing hard work 👍👍👍👍
How far off floor (shower pan) is wall board. If you can't put screws 6-8 inches up the wall because of the pan liner, what holds the bottom part of the board tight against studs?
We are assuming that you will be waterproofing your wallboard, fillng your fasteners with something and then regarding over that, therefore it makes your fasteners a relevant to the equation... I guess my lowest one is probably about that mark, maybe 4 or 5 in but doesn't really matter as long as it's it's flat as possible..
The height off the pan of the wallboard depends on the size of the tile that you will be using, I usually make it about a 1/2" to 3/4"
Love your videos and your pride in your work and technical precision, the only thing I wonder about is putting redguard on top of a poured base of sand mix which is supposed to allow water to pass through and is meant to secondarily drain any penetrating water down to a pitched pan liner and to the drain, making its way in through the slot/cut threads of the finish drain piece. Is water supposed to get down to the liner or is that just in case it ever makes its way down that far? (I'm told you have to use sandmix instead of concrete because the sandmix pour allows water to get through the pack and to the pitched liner) I was always told though to skim the entire base with thinset then make sure all the mortar lines go continuously to the drain.
Also, if a square drain ever had to be unthreaded for some reason the mortar would have to be busted out around the drain so it could spin, whereas a round drain could just spin out, I work with whatever is preferred, but I do like running my tile over the plastic of a round drain, then, with longer stainless steel screws, set the round drain plate over the tiles for a clean look. Any rough edges on the stainless plate have to be sanded smooth though. Not sure why the drains don't just come that way, to have a smooth finish plate over the tile cuts ?
For the walls I like a vapor barrier over the studs and over the pan liner running up the wall. I Iike the studs notched 1/4" in the corners so the membrane doesn't cause a bow in the walls where it is folded, then durarock screwed over the barrier and like you show off the poured base. I like 2x12 blocking between the studs sonic can secure the wallboard solid at the bottom, every 8," 8" off the floor, which I think if people did that they wouldn't be tempted to rely on the poured base to make the wallboard solid against movement. I do think they also put it down before pouring because it's easy to get a level grade line on a board then on a rubber membrane, which is why I also glue my membrane to the perimeter blocking and up and over the curb after also applying a good coat of the membrane adhesive to the wood, then it stays tight and you can snap some nice red snap lines in it. I make a level reference line 10" up the wall before I begin, which I use for my preliminary pour to establish a pitch for the membrane to the drain, , measure down and snap my lines. Then after installing the membrane I just work level from my leveled drain to my furthest point and figure 1/4" higher on the wall for foot of run, and make a mark on the membrane on the wall. Then i just measure down from my reference line, which is easier than trying to mark the underside of a level 2" off the floor. Also leveling the drain with the drain in is important, if the drain base is leveled, because of thread pitches, the final install of the drain will be out of level, in which case the upper portion of the drain base plate will have to be shimmed evenly all around to relevel the finished drain piece. With a round drain the plate can sit on top of the tile and though the threads are pitched, the final outcome is a drain plate always perfect with the floor.
Also, I fill my silicone my seams and corners between wallboard and set mesh tape, then when dry skin coat with thinset and drag my tile lines on the wall, then back butter the tile. I've removed tile on a job for a plumber around a valve and the red waterproofing liner came off the wall like a fruit rollup, taking tiles off the wall with it, whereas the tile adhesive to the liner was good, that left me thinking waterproofing behind a cement board offered the best tile bond to the wall while preventing and sweating of the masonry tile board, maybe 1/4" hardi is better with blocking moisture that could come through. I hate denshield unless it's a little bit of tile just above a fiberglass surround, since any sheetrock product just pushes in behind the tile in the event you have to take any off the wall down the road, and if it ever gets wet it's ruined or moldy
I much prefer you made a video of everything you wrote .... l need visual to understand anything you said. I’m sure there is great content in your instructions.
In a small shower 6 by 7 feet. I plan on red guarding shower area. Should I moisture barrier behind the remaining walls? Many Thanks
lol my shower floor is 48 x 36 ...inches!!! ...6x7 feet would be HUGE for me lol
Since I'm not a high end guy I have question? I don't want a tile base so if I use a shower pan (I have no one to impress about my shower) will I have these water problems? I'm a DYI guy changing my third bath into a shower. I'm looking to use a 30by 60 pan.
If you were talking about a fiberglass pan then I am not a fan of those, they crack and or stain over time. Cultured marble pans are much better but have kind of gone out with the 80s and 90s.
The custom shower pans they sell nowadays are very pricey, you can easily spend $400 or $800 depending on the size
Thanks. Good info. What material is your wallboard? Drywall, greenboard, Durock? What is your board of choice?
If you were waterproof and everything then whatever use for wallboard is irrelevant, my go-to product is green board but there is a backer board out there called Triton.. a little hard to get but I like it alot
Hello Bob,I just came upon your channel while browsing. I started with watch your channel when April came aboard. Let me commend you, on the patient you had to teach a female who wanted to learn. You really do GREAT work. Your now my #1 channel!!!!!!!
Thank you !
Definitely makes sense, do you usually redguard the floor even though you have a shower pan liner?
The liner protects the floor against water, the Redgard protects the mortar against water.
StarrTile , Im not understanding how the redguard will protect the mortar from water. If the redguard is under the tile and under the mortar?
Redgard is on top of pan material ( mortar )...then tile on top.
StarrTile ok I seen in your previous videos you did not read guard the entire shower pan over the mortar do you now think you should read guard the entire shower pan if so do you have a video on it how far do you read guard around the drain I seen your previous videos where you said you didn’t want to make a mold sandwich
DO IT YOURSELF ITS EASY .. I was also wondering about this. Some people put redgard on the mudpan, others say no way its gonna get mold. Can somebody please explain which is best?
Currently ripping out our shower for this reason exactly. THANK YOU sir! Our tile and green board was clearly put on the slab before the shower floor was done. Not gonna use green board but thank you for showing the proper way to do it!
Tile is not supposed to go on greenboard incase you were gonna get it to use
@Chris Reynolds
It would not matter what the backer board is if you waterproof the surface, it could be half in cardboard and no water would get through if you waterproof. Schluter allows for Kerdi to be on sheetrock because it is waterproof...c'mon buddy, THINK
Okay but why not just use durock for the added insurance
@Ibm4325 ...Insurance of what ???? Walls don't fail so not sure what good durock would do better or insure you against
my exact question... now I can do the next step on my weekend work project!
Love love LOVE this video!! My dad told me that the wall board should be in the pan so the water has a continuous path to the drain, but it went against everything I felt deep in my heart. I am a beginner DIY-er, so I live by these videos!!! I was also wondering (as was my dad) how to handle that gap, and this video made me feel much more confident in handling the next steps in my DIY shower remodel! Thank you!!
Stop asking your Dad about matters you yourself have figured out. Seems like he could do well to ask you.🥳🤪
Not sure if this was props or a dis, but I was able to complete my tile shower in one month, while 6 months pregnant. So far, still love it!! My dad says it looks even better than the one he did 🙌🏼
how long does the concrete have to cure before you can apply the redgard?
As long as possible. I'm relegated to about 3 days with a fan on it 24/7, but ideally about a week
Great job, brother!!!
Thanks
How much space do you leave between the backer board and the pan?
Depends on tile thickness, but about 1/2'' to 1''
Hi, I did your recommendation of hanging wallboard at least 1" off the pan floor but the thing is I have a 3x5 shower with the drain to the left side right under neath the shower head. So I used the goof proof pre slope and quick slope guides which end up with the back side of the shower much higher than the drain side. I now have about a 2 and a half inch gap from pan to the board on the lower end of slope which is by the drain side about 3 feet long, looking at it from the front of shower long wall being the 5 feet across. All from following your step on how not to hand wall board. What do I do now? I am very concerned! 🤔
I never talk about using Pitch Perfect in conjunction with The Gap, plus I never talk about the Gap being at least one inch, I say at least 3/4 up to 1 inch... in fact I rarely if ever even speak about Pitch Perfect. But more importantly I cannot know how you decided to do your particular job, everything can be manipulated in such a way to make it work. Sounds like you'll need to do it over if you're not pleased with it.
@@StarrTile Hi, Thanks for the reply. I am not putting blame on your method. I am simply saying I follewed your advise and I end up with this issue. Even if I did not use pitch perfect the results would be the same because my drain is to one side under the shower head so the slope would naturally be towards the drain. But now that I have done the mud bed and my cement boards are up is their anything I can do to fix the issue or can I just put my 12x24 tiles on like that and the bottom bigger gap will just be covered but not butter behind that portion on tile. What would you do in my situation? I apologize if my first comment seemed putting blame I was simply speaking of my situation. Thank you!
@@californiaitis1255 there is a few ways you can go about rectifying the situation, if it were me I would probably get some type of Dremel tool and go up on the wall board you said already and cut it out about 12 or 14 in up, then measure and reset new wall board with the proper size all the way around, the fact that you're drain is off to the left or the right is irrelevant if you plan accordingly
@@StarrTile I think what I'll do and it might work is put a half inch about 3 feet long stick under the board and fill the bottom part with mortar mud basically the same as making a curb on the other side just so I can fill the 2" gap with something for the tile to grab onto at the bottom. As soon as I'm done with I'll remove the stick still leaving a half in gap between board and mud. What do you think. The other way seems to much work!
How much gap do you put between the wallboard and the grout?
Distance between wallboard and grout doesn't make any sense....
I leave a gap of about 3/4 to maybe one inch between the wall board and the shower pan, then the shower pan tile goes in and the distance is closed to maybe 1\2"....wall tile goes on leaving about 1/8" gap for grout
The messaging is a bit confusing on this.
Your video description says this:
"Do NOT set your wallboard after the liner to push liner folds close to wall"
BUT, in the video, the wallboard appears to be doing exactly that, except you have a gap between the liner floor and the wallboard.
Which is it?
Do you:
1. Put the pan liner first
2. Add the sloped mud bed
3. Add wallboard with a gap so it's not touching the ground
4. Red Guard everything, doubling up on corners and cracks
or
Does the pan liner somehow sit on top of the wallboard which is what the description implies we should do? If so, how do you ensure a smooth surface to tile on?