Piston slap - the basics
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- čas přidán 25. 05. 2017
- This is part 1 of the piston slap series
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He drew a perfect circle free hand 3:45
I also was impressed by that!
Just like Michelangelo!
wow
According to michael chricton it takes a master artist to do so this guy should be fuckin awesome at drawing stick figures
yea when your draw a more perfect cylinder that what reality of its manufacturing allows.
Old Honda cars were notorious for this. Even my twin cam 1.6 dohc does it badly when cold, sounds like a bad rod or crank. It goes away when it's warm and hell no I ain't gonna fix it, it would take too much work and it's a thirty year old engine with 260k miles on it. It's been doing this for over 100,000 miles. Doesn't smoke and still gets thirty miles to the gallon so I ain't fucking with it. It actually runs really strong when it's warm.
You need a rebore dude
@@dirtygarageguy no he doesn´t. I had a Polo with one of those Volkswagen 1.4L engines that people say has piston slap when it comes out of the factory. I drove it for 160.000 miles with piston slap. Drove just normal. Only the sound wasn´t that nice. At the end it consumed about 1.5L oil in 10.000 miles. Which is okay for a 20 years old engine with that milage and piston slap. And if you end up in a garage that doesn´t work properly, things might be worse than before. So my opinion is also not to open an engine that runs okay.
I got piston slap only se it wen I want to poet new head on so I want to no if it's a problem to drive just like that
Nice work! That explains the noise coming from my early 600 monster :)
Thank you for explaining so clearly why part of the apron on the piston in my #1 cylinder shattered.
Nice Explanation, Thanks. Been working out an old CJ7 piston, wrist pin issue. Cheers!
I love these old videos! Cheers mate
Great video. I get it mainly on a weekend coming home drunk, I'm pissed and get a slap from the misses. As a result of this, I don't get any blowback🤕
I think my trick has some piston slap, on cold start when it's 50 deg or less it sounds like it is knocking until engine gets warm. Even louder around 30 deg
Man describes his whole entire love life with his wife in under 5 minutes
What?
Sounds more legit because of the accent
I thought that within 2 seconds of starting, then I saw your comment!
The funny part is that he knows way less than he thinks he does!
Nice video. Have a 4.3 Vortec on a 2000 S10, 160,000+ miles. Every startup that's cold or if its been sitting for 4 hours or more it knocks (almost a quick double knock sound, like a wrist pin maybe). Never for more than 27 seconds at a time. Done it for 5 years now without fail.
In the cab it sounds like a top end/lifter noise but outside you can tell its a knock.
I used to own a 2000 chevy silverado with the 5.3L it did the exact same thing . When I would first start it , it would sound good for maybe like 5 seconds ? (Its been awhile) then it would start to make quite a loud piston slapping noise for no more than 1 minute and then be perfectly fine for the rest of the day.
My 4.3 does the same I’m assuming it’s piston slap should I be worried or just add some Lucas and send her
@@israelcontreras5378 I'm still driving mine. Have not done a thing and nothing has changed. Oil changes have been very regular.
I had this issue on a BMW F800ST. 1 year old 2000 miles on the clock. Slapping from cold start then reduced as it warmed. Eventually BMW agreed and the cylinder head upward was replaced. After they had the bike for around 6 weeks, as soon as I got it back, sold it. I will stick to Japanese bikes now.
Yup 👍
Great explanation! Thank you, sir!
Nice rain in the background.
great video once again have you ever thought about doing one about restrictor kits for bigger bikes and your thoughts etc? keep up the great work!
Your videos are great
Cool vids Mate. Keep up the good wood work. Can you do video on a good all rounder piston ( forge vs Cast) say for a Four Stroke motorbike ( advantages ) Pros & Cons. I love Mums Garrage on your White board. Lol
Followed. Love this channel 👍
Very helpful!! Thank you!! You just a new subscriber!
Welcome to the channel
Good explained video 👍👏
Got a brand new T100 Bonnie....500mls.....just after its first cold start of the day.....before riding off while its warming up.....around a minute after starting....I hear a tapping sound....or light rattle.....soon as the idle revs stabilise after it warms say 2 mins the noise goes......starting to think piston slap.....does or can it go on warm up...
Dealer says as long as it goes ignore it....dont like that idea.
Love to hear your thoughts Sir.
Im rebuildeing a camaro 3.4 V6 and the pistons were wheavily scuffed on one side of the pistons in one bank only. Why would that be?
Do you know of a way to diagnose piston slap without engine dismantle?
My cbr900rr fireblade makes a rattly noise under load that stops at around 7k revs.
Its only under load, no other time.
Its less prenounced when engine is warm too and there is no smoke or loss of performance
Best way to hear piston slap is to listen to a cold start of chevrolet 3400 or 3100 v6. They make tons of slap noise
czcams.com/video/R8c4hxpjdlY/video.html 3400 piston slap
Verified. I had the 3400 3.4L in a 2000 Grand Am GT. Way back when. Lucas will help with Slap and Tick. Been playing with Risolone Hy-per Lube, Risolone Engine High Mileage Engine Treatment, Lucas, and STP. Attempting Prolong, and potentially RVS Technology next. RVS is suppose to fill metal scores for 40 to 50 K.
@@bobbyscalchi4013 how did it go?
@@johndonajelon21 @John Donajelon
Actually just changed my oil yesterday lol. I stopped using additives about a year or two ago. Vehicle is a 2009 Lexus RX 350 with the 3.5L 2GRFE V6 motor. Great motor other than the slap and tick in the cold. She slaps and ticks just below 40 degrees lightly and loud below 30 for anywhere between 30 seconds to a minute then quiets down. Not absolutely certain but from what I have read and researched of that motor on cold start ups is due to two reasons? Clearance of piston to cylinder walls cold and or wrist pin clearances which an create rod knock or piston slap. Also VVTI may possibly lacking oil flow on valves in upper cylinder on start up due to some pin locking the oil galleys out? Maybe an anti drain back valve can circumvent such?
Tried all of the above except for RVS Tech. Including a quart of MMO in the crankcase in winter. Didnt notice much audibles performance difference or MPG differences other than with Risoline HyperLube or other Risolone products. Those seemed to make things just a little bit quieter but not significantly. I would recommend those two despite being viscosity modifiers. I thought Prolong AMFT for sure would quiet it or provide added lubricity. The BITOG (Bob is the oil guy) members steered me away from further using any additives. I have no scientific data to report. I did take two UOA samples to report to Blackstone for analysis last Feb for wear metal and elements but never sent them in. Maybe I will this year at next oil change in February? I even tried running 5W20 instead of 5w30 for a few cycles. Straight and mixing the two for a 5W 25. Tried 0w40 and 0w30 for a cycle too.
I switched over from Castrol Edge to either QSFS, PP, or PUP exclusively since they have the best contents and additive packages to them they have about 200 PPM of Molybdenum and good cleaning properties. Great SOPUS products. Also now running Fram Ultra Synthetic filters instead of Toyota OEM. Those filters are rated for 20k miles and I change them at 15k. What I'm noticing is the engine runs a bit quieter for the first like thousand miles after an oil change.. I'm still changing my oil at 5,000 miles as per manufactures reccomendations. All three of those oils when I drain them still have a lot of clairity left in the oil and probably can be run till about 7,000 miles.
I haven't been doing this also recently but last year for about a good year and a half I was running two-stroke oil in my gasoline at a ratio of 640:1 or 1 oz for every 5 gallons of gas as an upper cylinder lubricant with no ill effects on the motor performance or emissions and catalytic converter.
I'm going to say I reccomend those top tier oils mentioned above as well as using top-tier gasoline. If you're going to use an additive try using the Rislone HyperLube Or maybe a little MMO in the crankcase to thin things out a little in cold flow wise in winter.
Thanks.
Hello! Answer me, please-is connecting rod knocks all the time engine works-on cold, hot, iddle, high rpm, when loaded and unloaded, or no? Thank You much in advance, greetings from Ukraine!
I had a newer Murica freedom truck with a GM 5.3 V8 that had piston slap on start up. Dealer said it was a normal thing and I shouldn't worry about it. uhhhhhhh Yeah I'll just glaze over the fact my cylinders are wearing prematurely.
Would u demand that the motor be rebuilt if your new motor had piston slap?
you inspire me
that's what I tell my left hand, she's a sweetheart she is.
I like the bass and the vice jesus.
its the buddy christ lol
Offset cylinder-yz450f???
I had piston slap till i took some of dels expert advice and lathered it up with copper grease. No more noise so problems clearly solved.
How did you go about doing that?
Thank you for your clear explanations. Since my car a45 amg comes with forge pistons, unlike after market pistons will have designs to mitigate the slap, wouldn’t it wear out way faster?
Kinda hard to understand this question, but forged are stronger than cast pistons. Regardless, the actual pistons are hardly ever what wears out when something goes wrong in the engine. So no, I don’t think after market pistons have any designs to mitigate piston slap. Slip is usually just a result of an abused or well used engine.
Me Miyago great. I get what you mean. Thank you!!
My piston slap on my 97 Chevy Tahoe 5.7 350 sounds like Ike beating Tina on a cold day.
If the wrong piston rings were installed in an engine that required a smaller gap and the current gap on the rings on that engine is larger, I understand there will be loss of compression and excessive crankcase pressure but would the larger gap cause the piston to slap?
No. Piston rings are floating and dont suspend the piston in the bore
Hi, I've just had my head gaskets done, head skimmed the whole deal. New gaskets etc etc. No I have my vehicle back I have piston slap? Which I never had before? Is this due to the repair or over heating?
could be a clearance issue between piston and skimmed head.
Static X babyyyyy
2018 mustang GT has problems with this, even on engines with 500-2000 miles. Good old Ford, lowering the quality on one of their better products.
I remember my 2004 Oldsmobile Alero had minor piston slap, but only when cold. GM installed short skirt pistons for fuel economy, but luckily the engines typically didn't fail prematurely.
thank you so much sir
Please so what is the main part that causes piston slap
Hello I have oil pushing out of my dip stick and oil fill cap please help
Please do a video of offset cylinder bores relatively to the crankshaft. I think it has to do with engine efficiency on the power stroke
I said at the end of the video
Really I must have missed that sorry. In my 125 engine i think the piston pin and the cylinder bore are offest. I think the piston pin is to reduce the force to the con rod and offeset cylinders for efficiency, is that true or am I missing something here?
I have fabricated and installed teflon buttons on piston skirts for people who thought it worked.
I heard static-X in the beginning you are awsome
I thought it was Korn? what sng is it of Static-x ?
Agreed
squidypie listen to Wisconsin death trip
Hell yeah. Great choice for a intro.
I get a slap on cold starts. Then goes away after about a min. Does that seem normal? I have a bjild LS3.
Yes
I got the strangest sound in my honda spree 49cc 2 stroke.. sounds like its in the motor, ive greased everything i can find...
It's not a consistent tick like a rod knock, and it doesn't always do it.. think if there was a metal washer vibrating on a metal rod..
kling kling kling.. 6400 miles.. runs strong.
I've got a good one,
planed obsolescence.. I would like to hear your opinion, is it a thing in the motorbike industry??
"is it a thing in the motorbike industry?" - no not really
Idle slap smoothes out on reving. Is it timing ?
No. It's momentum.
You can apply this whole explanation to old dodgy Sheilas.
Fuck sake I cant even escape ozzy man through engine building
Oh boy I can't wait to get into another argument!!
My latest 2.2liter 4 banger is at .005 piston to skirt clearance.
We'll be at the dyno first of the year my clown friend!!!
Would you consider piston slap to be a problem if it only happens on cold starts and last less that 20 seconds?
Piston slap always occurs - you're talking about piston slap you can hear
@@dirtygarageguy
I get a pop or slap sound on dead cold start ups, it takes about 5 seconds into the engine running to start popping and the dissapears all together after about 10-20 seconds.
Its very irratic, doesnt have a beat if yoy know what I mean.
Ive been told its "piston skirt slap" and not to worry about it 🤷♂️
What is it that does this? Car or bike?
@@dirtygarageguy its a car
I have a newly built coyote motor, and I think it might have piston slap. Can a motor run good for a long time with piston slap?
Absolutely corvettes have this issue and run fine for many years.
You also get that when the person that was building the motor didn't turn it over and taper the bottom of the Damned block antedates up the side of the piston looking like that
Matt help me out here man;
Is it safe to say that piston skirt will always touch the opposite side of crank rotation? And if so does this happen because lighter objects react bigger to inertial effects, assuming the skirt is lighter than the piston head so skirt makes a counter rotation to the crank rotation where piston head wants to rotate the same way as the crank does?
And since rpm moves so fast how can piston skirt find the time to touch the other side of the cylinder?
I'm a bit lost here, can you break this down into smaller questions?
Can piston slapping only happen during a cold start? I have a 2000 Honda Accord special edition with 247,000 miles and I only notice this sound on cold start but when the engine gets warmed up a little bit it goes away, it also becomes more present if I press the gas pedal a little bit.
LOL 247k dude your engine is fooked. You don't have cylinders, you have elliptic cylinders LOL
I highly doubt that's an original engine buddy
Did you ever find out what is it was , I'm having the same issue with my 99 civic
From Iraq well done
Gudgeon pins? Did I hear a niner in there?
Why piston is not in straight cylindrical structur
My Mk.I Focus has this. It kind of sounds like a faint diesel rattle.
Is that the same as piston knocking?
No. Knocking is uncontrolled combustion
Abom79 poster, nice.
clash at the bash! Abom and Keith 'geterdone' Fenner
That is the music of my heep.
Does the piston slap increase when you press the gas?
Mine only happens when idle and low revs with high load (climbing road)
HI, i know this vid is old but i need some help, I've got movement in the piston when its a tdc. there is slight movement when i push son the top left right on the piston. the bores are tapered by default. how much of an issue is this if the piston only moves a bit right at the top of the bore?
You have to give me more info than that. What engine is it? Miles etc
@@dirtygarageguy Nice one, its VQ35DE from a Nissan 350z 2003. engine has already been rebuilt and failed on the dyno with a spun bearing on cylinder 6. cause was a faulty oil seal on the new valve cover. am just putting it all back together again and in one of the cylinders the piston has a slight rock from 12 -6 o'clock. when at top dead centre. I dont know whether to ignore it and continue with the build or spend a few hundred getting the spare block i have re bored. its about 3mm. :/
3mm mean its rocks by about that much lol
sorry for the poor explanation lol
On just one cylinder? If it's one cylinder then you have a problem, I don't know what the clearance is for a 350Z, but the manual will tell you what its limit is
@@dirtygarageguy Thank you, I have just checked and its the same on all pistons. I did not clock it fist time I rebuilt the engine. so slightly shat :D
piston wobble vid
czcams.com/users/shortsTMxUij1E3kI
I get a tick tick tick slap slap slap type of noise, just assumed as I'm sure many do that's it's a slack timing chain, and needs a new tensioner. Wonder if it's that instead. When I get the engine out and stripped I can have a look at the wear patterns on the pistons.
You need to measure your cylinder and pistons, but mainly the cylinders
Would that need a expensive vernier calliper of some sort ? Nothing I have in my tooling would do I feel.
@@memybikeni9931 a tape measure should suffice
When will it slap the most, when you are riding the torque og topend power ?
when the engine is cold. As for which stroke and engine load , that'll be in the next video - matt
Why don’t pistons have rings on the skirt side not to seal exhaust gases but to purely absorb the shock and prevent piston slap at all temperatures. To act as a kind of spring
Because rings are smaller in OD than a piston
Hi there. Your description misses the real reason for piston slap. Here is what happens. On the compression stroke, the piston is driven upwards by the con-rod and crankshaft turning. This force is obviously driving the piston against the opposite side of the cylinder wall to the direction of the force. At TDC, the ignited fuel charge then pushes the piston down but the con-rod has now moved across the TDC position so the force shifts the entire piston to push against the other side of the cylinder wall to drive the con-rod down. This side thrust flip-flops the piston every time, from one side to the other, as TDC is passed on the firing stroke. So the con-rod action is the reason it occurs. Different ignition timing can change the amount of noise as can having the centre line of the cylinder moved slightly forward in relation to the crankshaft axis. The more direct downward push on the piston at TDC reduces the resultant side thrust on the piston. This is called a De-Saxe arrangement....
Lol no it doesn't
SUZUKI Jumper??
Do you still respond to comments?
yes
lets hear the noise
after 275k my volvo b230f is starting a bit of this
and that's 275k miles
3:44 OMG you just did it
my imagination runs a way with me .(i am 72).
Rupert Graves?
I'll take that
So how do you stop the annoying ticking noise then?
From piston slap?
@@dirtygarageguy Yes how do you stop the ticking?
1) ticking isn't usually as its described, are you sure that's piston slap?
2) how old is the engine
3) what engine is it?
@@dirtygarageguy It's a 2.0 from a 2010 Kia forte coupe. Has 130k obit. Manual. I changed, plugs, coils, filters, ran some engine quieter through it. Changed the oil with recommend oil. Still has that ticking noise. Not sure what it is??
Maybe your valve clearances... 130k is a lot.
Leonardo da Vinci!
Use highest octane fuel you can get and it will go away. Cheap gas makes engine slap.
Makes engines slap?
Are you next to a babbling brook?
Pay no attention to the stoner Jesus statue on the bench
He looks all the time at the same point where the little Jesus points at
Is piston slap always harmful? I have a brand new 2018 GT and it seems like atleast 80% of them have piston slap when cold. You can hear it here. Would appreciate your insight on this czcams.com/video/vqq4VxdTf68/video.html
Yes. Its always harmful. Its called lateral thrusting and is not what you want in a reciprocating anything. Engines that run high temperatures (high power) have to have large clearances because of this. This is why F1 cars are pre-heated before start-up
Here is what the cylinder wall looked like in a 2018 GT I saw at a shop imgur.com/rTmhvJU would you say that block needs to be replaced?
Replaced? Don't you mean bored and honed? And no one can tell from a picture - unless you mean the huge scores LOL
They have a spray in cylinder liner I dont know if they can be bored and honed or if a piston would fit properly after that. Not sure about engine building but yea I mean those score marks on that cylinder.
What the hell is that background noise rainy England or something
Read up on THURST. It is ALWAYS OPPOSITE OV RAT
ATION. At dwell the THRUST is no more
I think this is meant to say -
Read up on thrust. It is always opposite of rotation. At dwell the thrust is no more.
Right, what?
@@dirtygarageguy kenetics,potential energy.check it out.compression stroke,exaust stroke r thrust after dwell
@@jaydeebrickey9071 I still don't understand what you're getting at?
বাহ
english?
Yes I'm English
Raining like a bitch there i hear.
Today was ok but the rest of the week has been shit
Drop some lucas oil in there and slap will be gone :D