The Future of Zelda - Part 2: Combat
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- čas přidán 12. 05. 2024
- "A sword wields no strength unless the hand that holds it has courage."
- skeleton ghost guy
Zelda Jewelry and Monster Maze Pins:
joyouscrafts.com/collections/...
Notable Footage Credits:
Something About Zelda Ocarina of Time The FOREST TEMPLE
By: TerminalMontage
• Something About Zelda ...
Kusarigama [鎖鎌] Death on a Ball and Chain - NINJA TRUTH
By: NHK WORLD-JAPAN
• Skyward Sword HD: Earl...
ティアキン】ゼルダ工作勢が作るメタルギア兵器集【ゼルダの伝説】
By: ども【ティアキン工作】
• 【ティアキン】ゼルダ工作勢が作るメタルギア兵...
Eurogamer Article:
www.eurogamer.net/zelda-targe...
Special Thanks to:
- You!
#zelda #thelegendofzelda - Hry
Apologies for not making the weekend upload! I ran into some technical difficulties last night .
Anyway, have a great week!
Hey Mr. Don, I know this is off-topic of this vid, but I was told on your discord that the best way for you to see my message is to comment on your newest upload, so I'm asking it here...
It's been quite a while since we've seen any content about that 3D Dungeon you made. Have you worked on it at all? If so, could you make a video about it?
Have you had any ideas about making a new Dungeon? Would you allow us to give suggestions for any new Dungeon you might think up?
You're the only content creator I've found that's both into Zelda, & are able & willing to make a Zelda-inspired Dungeon, so it would be amazing to see your creativity shine on this subject once again! 😁
Kwaliteit boven kwantiteit
@@raphyangel9828 Hey there! I made a 3D dungeon once as a demonstration, but it was never rally functional. It was not made in a video game engine or anything like that. But who knows... maybe I'll get back to designing a dungeon some day. Maybe when the next Zelda gets announced ^^
@@MonsterMaze Hello there MM, near the end of the video you talked about not being able to block or parry with 2 handed weapons, dont know if you forgot but in totk you actually can if you fuse a shield to either a spear or greatsword.
@@EberTLOZ That is actually true, yeah. I forgot about that option, haha. You can do so many things in TotK, it's insane 😅
"Hold up calamity, let me pull up a new shield real quick."
-Champion of Hyrule
I love how in Wind Waker the music and notes change depending on your hits. I also thinking bringing back the hidden skills from Twilight Princess would be cool but in that game they could have been implemented better.
botw and totk has that first aspect! there’s a video by scruffy that details it
Yeah, specifically, them being optional has some problems since they can't count on the player having them, so enemies lose the ability to pressure you to use more advanced techniques later in the game. I think a good alternative would be to have items continue to serve that purpose instead. Make it so that powerful enough foes expect you to have these moves if you want to defeat them using only your sword, but you can use Link's tools/items to get around that if you don't have the moves or aren't much of a swordfighter.
Would be welcomed if they used hall effect joysticks which don’t drift, but at least there now exists hall effect controller options, and most likely others for the future even if the major companies don’t use
@@dhwtn2187 Nintendo patented a control stick design similar to hall-effect joysticks, but it uses a magnetic goo of some sort
I don't know the validity of this, but supposedly Link's sword swings in Wind Waker are actually sometimes purposively delayed a little by the game to make them always hit with timing that feels right with the music.
"The skyward strike could be considered the first iteration of the sword beam in 3D Zelda."
Fierce Diety Link: "Am I a joke to you?"
I was just thinking this
i like seeing enemies fight each other in video games, thats why muddle bud is my favorite totk item
Me too! I got so excited when inforst played totk and saw a construct attacking a chu chu. I did a double take! I didn’t realize that was going to happen!
I was similarly shocked when i was attacked from a Moblin that threw a Bokoblin at me
When you see a Stone Talus Fortress: :D
You'd love kid icarus uprising then
I have a few spots marked on my map where boko and construct camps are near enough to each other to start giant brawls. 😂
It's so useful!!!! I'd argue it's a vital item
My biggest problem (with Tears specifically) is that the issues with menu use in combat was already solved in Age of Calamity. You could access healing and secondary items (magic rods) from a radial menu that was quick and painless. It would be so simple to have four or so quick-swap slots for weapons and food in a menu. It couldve even replaced the material menu, and then fuse could be used contextually for arrows or weapon fusion.
My lord those little slash transitions are so slick
Haha thanks Daniel!
22:22 OBJECTION! The direction you attack did matter for certain monsters in Twilight Princess, like the giant clams in Lakebed Temple. You can't hit them with vertical slashes, but have to either thrust or slash horizontally, as the sword will repell from the clams shell and, given that water slows you down even with the Zora Tunic, gives them an opening to counterattack.
And obstacles, like walls, also wll violently repell your sword and stagger you, so striking in the right direction can give you an advantage in narrow places
23:01 And the heroes shade explicitly teaches you that the shield bash can be used to reflect magical attacks
Sustained. The logic is irrefutable.
Also while it didn't really matter there were more combat techniques to wolf link besides the basic combo, jump and midna thingie iirc since I remember when I last played it (GC version) there were combos you could do only while holding a direction like with Link's moveset. Again doesn't matter much when attack or don't is about as complex as wolf link gets but I digress.
@@ListlessWither There is a really cool TP mod that makes switching between wolf link and regular much faster as well as tweaks the combat a bit letting TP's vision on swordplay shine much better.
@@dave9515 I actually played with the former last I played mostly for convenience sake, haha
Sustained ^^
I want to be able to ditch the shield and give Link two swords, Master Sword in one hand blue Ancient sword in the other.
Full Gerudo fighting style.
I loved fusing gloom swords to shields and "dual wielding" while avoiding the gloom tax.
Okay Kirito I see you ⚔
Lloyd Irving wrote this post
@@KairuHakubi : 100 + 100 = 200. XD
If you fuse a shield to a two handed weapon in ToTK it lets you block with the weapon, but it should probably be a default ability that doesn't require fusing.
Indeed. I'm very curious to see what they will do next. Are they going to ditch the fuse mechanic altogether? Even after all the work they put into it? Or would it be too much of the same?
Fusing is so fun it would be hard to see it go. But it’s also incredibly clunky with all the stopping as you mentioned well in the video. So it’s going to be one of many hard decisions for the Zelda team going forward. There is so much good about TOTK and simultaneously not close to ideal either.
It's just such a big oversight that attacking with the weapon consumes durability of the fused shield
@@MonsterMazeknowing how Nintendo works, it's pretty likely they throw out the whole fuse system, since it was a core mechanic in TotK now, and Nintendo seldomly carries things over in the fear of making things to similar.
Duel wield with the ability to throw slick kicks and punches.
Riju looks cool with two swords, why not let us have that?
@@robuxyyyyyyyyyy4708 You can fuse a sword to a shield. And if you shield bash any time or perfect parry it does sword damage.
It _is_ dual wielding swords
7:01 To be fair, in the ReDead example you showed, the enemies are zombies, so they probably have no problem functioning with multiple arrows sticking out of them. They are animated with magic and don't rely on internal organs to live. It makes sense that cutting them to pieces with a sword would be more effective than shooting them with arrows.
Yesterday Zeltik and now Monster Maze uploads too? Hell yeah!
We need Nintendo Black Crisis to upload and complete the triforce
Does Hyrule Gamer’s upload count?
Putting a hunger meter or a “full” meter for links diet might also help out, you can’t eat when link is too full
A 20 second cooldown would've been more straightforward. And it could exclude uncooked ingredients
@@viktorthevictor6240 yeah that could definitely work!!!
only being able to eat meals (not raw ingredients) and drastically limiting the number of meals you're able to carry (like 15 max) would be the solution i'd like to see, if real-time healing isn't an option. most players would reserve those meal slots for buff foods. it would also encourage armor purchases a LOT more so you don't have to waste meal inventory on weather resistance. i would also like to see elixirs be a much beefier option when it comes to buffs (like making level 3 only possible on elixirs, halving the duration time on all buff foods, things like that) because most elixirs don't heal
It would be a more drastic change, but I'd like if meals could only be eaten at the campfire itself (semi-realistic since food spoils over time), while potions could still be portable but with a limit to how many potions you could carry (maybe 5-10). That way you keep the cooking mechanic creativity but also create more restrictions for combat, plus potions require monster parts which are typically harder to get than plants etc. This could also let the potions be selectable from a wheel similar to in Skyward Sword, although a smoother UI option would be better
You saying my boy the champion needs to go on a diet!? /j
One idea I’ve had is for the game to track your progress and style of combat and have your enemies adapt to it. For example, if you obtain stronger weapons, more durable enemies start appearing. Frequently use stealth? Enemies start employing a bloodhound-like creature that can sniff you out. Flee too often? Faster enemies will catch up to you. This would not only ramp up the difficulty, but it would force the players to experiment with different gameplay styles and keep the experience fresh.
if they're going to insist on continuing to do big open world games, this is a fantastic idea
it bugs me how it's basically impossible to get to see "the early game version" of very remote areas, because you'd have to go to them directly from the start of the game, and not fight anything, because killing enemies is what ramps up the "bump every enemy up one color" mechanic. at least in TotK they changed it so it wasn't uniform across all enemies.
What I hated most about the BOTW to TOTK transition was the champion/sage's abilities. In the former I used them ALL the time in exploration and almost every combat encounter, they were worth the effort of getting and upgrading. While the latter,,, it felt just useful enough for the temple/dungeon's gimmick and that's about it, I very rarely used them outside of where you get them because of just how bs and circumstantial they all are.
PS, I love you bringing up AoC. That game's combat, though niche to the genre, was incredible.
Tulin is always useful to cover more distance in the air. But yes, the other sages are situational. I like using Mineru to walk over a large gloom patch, Yunobo for destroying rocks in caves and as a projectile on flying machines, Riju basically never besides Queen Gibdo rematches. Sidon is always active though because I want to buff my big stash of Zora weapons before a boss fight. Saves time and durability. :D
It's a bit annoying that you need to turn them off every time you wanna repair weapons with rock octorocks.
@@Hammerbruder99 i honestly never use sages and sometimes i forget they even exist
the only reason i might summon them is when i have a cool combo in mind or to break rocks with yunobo or riju
You used them all the time in BotW because, aside from Revali's Gale -- which is just as useful as Tulin -- is the only one you need to go out of your way to trigger. The other three just 'happen' when you do whatever they're connected to, and personally, I find them frustrating because in order to save them for when I actually want to use them, I need to dig into the inventory and turn them off, since they aren't part of any of the quick-inventory slots. I like the champion summons because they actually fight alongside you rather than acting like an assist in a fighting game.
PS: AoC's combat is exactly what you should expect from any given Warriors game.
For me it was the opposite. I thought BotW's champion abilities were pretty boring (except for Revali's Gale) and simply trivialized the game. Mipha was just a fairy on steroids. Daruk was just an auto-parry and Urbosa was just a ridiculously broken screen nuke that I always accidentally used whenever I went for a charge attack.
The sages on the other hand all had significantly more interesting utility. Aside from generally being your companions in battle and fighting alongside you, their abilities help in tons of different ways.
Tulin:
-his gust of wind can throw around enemies and combined with ice arrows, you can easily shove an entire enemy camp into a river to drown them instantly.
-his gust of wind is also a tremendous boost to Link's movement speed
Yunobo:
-can set stuff on fire (really useful in combination with Tulin's ability, when you set grass on fire to create an updraft)
-can break armored enemies
-helps you save up durability, by effortlessly killing smaller enemies like ChuChus, Keese, small Frox etc.
-can blow up rock walls at no cost
-attaches himself to vehicles and serves as a canon (which is absolutely busted on the right vehicle and can kill tanky enemies like Moldugas in like 5 seconds)
Riju:
-her aura can help you navigate the Depths or the Thunderhead Isles, since it makes the ground visible
-essentially a recharging bomb arrow
-also a recharging shock arrow, so you can not only deal massive damage regularly, but it has a huge area of effect, doesn't harm Link AND it disarms all enemies
-can also be used against armored enemies and rock walls
Sidon:
-his bubble can be activated to protect you (which isn't too useful for one-handed weapons, but super OP for two-handed weapons)
-the projectile has high damage and pierces enemies, allowing you to deal massive damage to a group of enemies
-the projectile is also a very potent ore breaker for that exact reason. It's even better than Riju or Yunobo, since he doesn't scatter the ore everywhere.
-the bubble makes Link wet for a very long time, allowing Link to clear the entire Gerudo or Goron Questline without ever needing to make a potion of equip specific armor
-the bubble boosts electrical attacks and gives you access to huge AoE Shock explosions without requiring water or rain
-it also doubles the attack power of Zora Weapons, making them the most powerful weapon type in the game
Mineru:
-easy access to bullet time
-really versatile due to her fuse mechanic
-allows you to easily traverse the depths or pools of lava
-best miner of the sages
-insanely useful overworld boss killer, since her shield ability just tanks everything and her range allows you to just slap the weakpoints of a talus or hinox by simply standing in front of them and attacking
one thing i think twilight princess doesn't get enough love for is the fact that it introduced motion controlled aiming which solved a lot of the issues with the older systems, it really made the hookshot and the bow a lot more fun in my opinion
I would love a mix of ToTK, Hyrule Warriors Age of Calamity, WW & TP.
I really hoped ToTK added sword skills, spear skills, etc. Having variations on top of the physics of fusing wouldve made the experimentation in combat more expressive imo.
2:11 that’s too much milk for one person to have on them
You can never have too much milk with you
nah, dude just has different Flavors depending on his mood...some days he wants Chocolate milk, other days he wants +20Hearts milk...
21:43
fun fact
running while swording also originated from a beta version of ocarina of time
we also have evidence that you could crouch without the shield out like in wind waker
post oot zelda games actually owes a LOT of their specific changes to ocarina of time
Yes, I saw that in the beta footage as well. Very cool. OoT had a lot of scrapped ideas.
Here's how I would fix the combat while staying as close to the current system as possible.
Flurry Rush: I really like your idea of having it as a thing that charges up like in Age of calamity.
Switching weapons, bows, and shields: happens in real time, no pausing. can mark specific ones to appear at the front of the list, possibly even only allowing switching to marked weapons. could be upgradeable how many you can mark. can open the menu to pause the game and change marks, but cannot switch weapons or shields in the menu.
Fusing arrows: Selecting the material happens in real time, can set a "default fuse" that happens automatically without having to select it (goodbye 999 bokoblin horns!). Like with weapons, you mark a material for it to show up in the fuse menu, so you don't have to scroll through 100+ useless fuses to find the one you want.
Healing: can only eat food at campfires. Make the status effects last longer to compensate. Only elixirs can be used during combats, and limit elixirs to the number of bottles you own (which of course you can find more of). Dedicated elixir button, Enemies do less damage, armor upgrades also have significantly less effect on damage resistance.
I'd also want to vastly increase the moves that you can do, as in Twilight Princess. I don't know why they did it this way. It would sort of make sense if they had made TotK first, to keep focus on the fusing and devices features... but BotW came first! With three different weapon types, they'd only need like two or three special moves per type to feel very satisfying, and unlocking them would have fit very neatly with the whole amnesia/memory recovery theme. Then for TotK they could have had him having to relearn the moves because of the new arm. New arm = new muscle memory, right?
Ah well...
With regards to healing: I like cooking, but I think that food and potions should function differently. Potions could work more like they used to in Skyward Sword (maybe with a dedicated button for healing), but they should add a camping mechanic for food; you can make and eat a meal when you rest at a campfire, and it provides overhealth a little bit like the extra maximum hearts, but instead, while you have a pool of them available, you heal over time. Ie: a quarter heart every four seconds or something to that effect. It'd be kind of cool if there was other stuff you could do while camping (maybe like in Xenoblade Chronicles 2: Torna), like being able to talk with companions or talk about the world and so on. It'd be really cool if raiding dungeons required some degree of planning around the camping mechanic, possibly with some integration of the physics / building mechanics that I hadn't considered. Ie: Maybe dungeons could contain "zones" that individually functioned like old Zelda dungeons but you would have to make expeditions between them and that's when you camp, consuming resources on your trip, and occasionally coming across problems you had to solve with the physics system to get across a chasm in a free-form way.
Not sure if that's a bridge too far (no pun intended), but I think it'd be interesting at least.
Bugger. I thought of some more things immediately after posting my comment. There's a few other systems that could be added:
You have to learn meals by eating them several times, and maybe you would have to do quests for villagers to get them to cook new meals for you. I think the mechanic would feel extremely different even in BoTW if it was something earned over your journey, and it's always good to have something encouraging players to explore.
Maybe there could be an item that you could unlock that let you carry around one meal away from a campsite (if indeed, camp cooking was implemented)
mmmmm… I think that solution is just a tad too cumbersome and complicated. I don’t think the learning recipes thing would work either, given the current system is already so organic in the way you simply experiment to found out what you can make.
as for the camping system, perhaps a bit of it would be cool, but having it be the centre of a prep system is a bit too far down the rpg well for Zelda, at least for my tastes. Though being able to set up and camp and talk to npcs could be neat… Hmmmmm… must think on that more….
I think a system like Horizon Forbidden West could map well to Zelda; dedicated healing potions/berries that you have a limited supply of, with food providing minor healing and other kinds of buffs (I.e increased damage with certain weapon types, elemental damage resistance, etc)
This video really made me appreciate the unique attributes of each Legend of Zelda's combat. Ocarina set the standard, Wind Waker was the smoothest, Twilight Princess the most well balanced, Skyward Sword theost ergonomic and Breath of the Wild the most comprehensive. Each of them brings something special to the table.
I'd personally like to see the Breath of the Wild combat system combined with Skyward Sword's swordplay on a Switch 2 with Joycons that don't drift.
Game changing
Skyward sword's directional sword swings would have greatly benefited from Twilight princess' advanced sword techniques.
@@darkdagger5237 or at least, if the wiimote+nunchuk had more buttons. Honestly even the current modern day standard of four face buttons, four D-pad buttons, four shoulder buttons, and two joystick clicks is not enough. We need at least two more buttons. though I realize there's some appeal to "I can just show "UP" on the screen and the player will hit the topmost of the buttons arranged in a square, it doesn't have to be memorizing a letter" but... just do like n64, with the dedicated C-buttons in a nice arrangement, and two more action-buttons below that.
but yeah SS suffered the most due to having.. what, four buttons total? sometimes they tried to let you use start and select, but that was awkward.
One more button would have allowed a "move sword but don't slash" button, which you would hold while moving your sword and only release it when you INTEND to slash. Without that, the Stalmasters are basically impossible to survive on hard mode. Eventually, they will move to a configuration that your current sword position cannot slash to without quickly moving to the opposite side first, and if you do that, you slash that direction, and get punished.
@@KairuHakubi I was talking about a software solution to the problem but you are right that having a button to reposition your sword would make the controls way smoother.
@@darkdagger5237 man you actually read all that? I was really blathering there. Glad it contained a point.
31:08 You're raising a good point and it does feel like BotW and TotK are taking a step back in regards to swordplay, but I think there's a very valid reason behind that. The main design theory of the games seems to be simple, universal, context sensitive actions, meaning that the actions you can do are limited but change depending on who or what you impose them on. A great example of that is boomerangs: There is no additional, dedicated action for throwing boomerangs. The throw you perform is the one you perform on any other weapon, it's just that this weapon tends to fly back to you and you get to catch it - with _catching_ not being an additional action either, just the simple "pick up"-action at the right time. It wouldn't have mattered if it's a boomerang coming back to you, or a weapon dropping down from above - you caught it at the right time, that's the action. It's just that the combination of those already implemented actions creates a classic boomerang action like the ones you've seen in Ocarina of Time or Twilight Princess.
I really like that about the games and I'm glad they followed it so strictly (even if it came at the cost of not being able to sit down on chairs or petting dogs 😭) but this also means that you just couldn't have mechanics that would allow for combos or special scripted attacks like in Wind Waker or Twilight Princess. For example, it would make no sense that jumping to the side would make Link _roll_ to the side the second time. It's the *jump* button, why does it make you *roll?*
Well, it was good in BotW and TotK, but I wouldn't mind if they went back on it in the next game or did something similar like what you showed in Hyrule Warriors, though. However, that means that the next game must be fundamentally different from BotW and TotK. That's important to keep in mind.
Either way, another great video. You're doing great!
THAT Masterfull music choice at the begining
Ok, novel length comment coming up. Breaking combat up piece by piece.
Swordplay.
Link should absolutely return to being able to string together long combos. The statement that he’s an incredible swordsmen and knight loses something when he can only string together 4 strikes. I would love to see an expandable move set like Twilight’s, and if the physics-based combat is returning then the Ending Blow is a must have, nothing kills the flow of combat like a ragdolling foe you can’t strike.
Bullet time.
Yes for bows, no for swords (unless part of an unlocked supermove). Having that little bit of aim assist when using archery is fantastic, especially since we can now aim for individual parts of an enemy’s body. In fact, I wouldn’t mind seeing it expanded to being able to knock weapons from an enemy’s hand, though even in its current form it does need a gentle nerfing, perhaps by increasing the stamina cost or making each successive shot cost more stamina.
Durability.
If it returns I would prefer it be restricted to scavenged enemy gear a la Bayonetta than applying to everything, this could be balanced by allowing ‘blin-made weapons deal more damage. My immediate thought after getting the broken Master Sword at the beginning of Tears was that it would be a constant unbreakable presence in Link’s arsenal, balanced out with lower stats until the moment of reforging came along. Clearly I was wrong but you see what lines I was thinking along there.
Food and Potions.
Restricting their use to a slow-mo menu as opposed to pausing really needs to come back, it’s simply overpowered as of now. For cooked food I think restricting its bonuses to more grounded options like regenerating health or stamina makes more sense than cooked bananas being the secret to super strength. Over the top effects like increased defense and attack, or even adding elemental qualities to weapons could easily roll into magic potions the player brews. Slapping a fullness meter that only applies to food and potions I feel is the final step to balancing.
Crafting.
If this returns then I’d really like to see it expanded. Tears tells me that monster fangs and claws make good arrowheads, but despite all the wood in my inventory I can’t make any arrows for myself outside of Quick Fuse. Maybe we could also make our own bombs, both standard models and possibly ones that deal less damage in exchange for elemental effects: fire bombs that act like fireworks, shock bombs that create massive electrical fields on ignition.
Empty bottles.
The part 3 to the above 2 points, but why not make these a standard crafting component used in the manufacture of homemade potions, bombs and whatnot for the busy hero-on-the-go?
Arial shenanigans.
I would do dearly love to see Link become a little friendlier with the universe’s Z-axis now that on demand jumping is a thing. Perhaps even giving him Mario-style triple jumps and back/side flips could be a part of this, with what kind of attack he uses being dependent on what kind of jump he does.
Expanded arsenal.
I feel that the Era of the Wild games were a little hit and miss with regards to all the weapons Link can use. Does it matter that Link can wield axes, hammers, great swords and spears now if they all pull from the same 4 move sets? Including more esoteric options like whips would be nice, as would giving all weapons options in exploration: axes cut down trees and hammers bust up rocks, why not pole vaulting with spears or grabbing distant things with whips? I’m more ambivalent on this but to be honest as I didn’t feel giving Link so many weapon options made the game better once the shock wore off, but with a little tweaking I would still love to see the system return.
…I think that’s everything I wanted to say, apart from a quick “thank you” if you made it this far.
You don't get a "finisher" but you can change directions each swing in OoT.
Also, crouch stabbing is actually amazing. It does the damage of whatever your last attack was, so if you jump slash with Biggoron Sword, even if you switch back to the Master Sword, it will do Biggoron Sword jump slash damage every crouch stab.
25:06 Red Steel 2 is proof motion controls didn't get in the way and they could have done it.
Also came to comments to point out that crouch stab is useful. Aside from the glitch being the fastest way to deal damage (cus a glitch isn't part of the system really) it's a pretty fast attack that lets you go back to shielding quickly, and it can slip under stalfos shields meaning if you've got good timing or enough hearts you can end those fights a lot quicker than waiting for them to attack first.
The crouch stab keeping the previous damage value sounds more like a bug than a feature.
@@lapiswolf2780 It is.
Something that a lot of people overlook when talking about BotW is that it made bows a generally useful and effective combat tool for the first time in *the entire series* . In every single game that came before it, the bow was just another puzzle item that you *could* use in combat, but it was too clunky and awkward and ineffective to bother pulling it out for anything other than enemies that require it. BotW was the first time you could expect the bow to show up in pretty much every combat
Twilight Princess made the bow also really usefull, especially for horseback missions, Gerudo Desert, the great fairy trial and the Temple of Time
in phantom hourglass (and spirit track), bow is actually quite effective in normal combat as it can be quickly drawn and you can shoot an arrow really fast. I used to use it even outside of puzzles due to its long range and superior firepower.
The bow is quite powerful in Zelda 1, Wind Waker and Twilight Princess.
@@FabulousJejmaze Yeah, you cheese several levels of cave of ordeals just by standing on the overhanging cliff and firing bomb arrows. I get his point and yeah, bows are super potent, but really a think BOTW systems more nerfed melee weapons. If you have a good melee weapon of several ones break with the number of enemies in the game, you can get blindsided, quickly and smacked around especially at the beginning when you low stamina so sprinting to a good position is harder.
What do you mean? The bow is useful in all the past games if you just target the enemy. Every majoras mask boss is completely cheesed by it. Hell, just being able to shoot a flying enemy fast and immediately switch was useful in oot. TP had completely overpowered bomb arrows.
The sword beam was present in Majora's Mask with the Fierce Diety mask.
Also the Ending Blow is just the down thrust, but as a contextual command, so I wouldn't consider BotW it's first appearance in a 3d game.
Fair enough
I want to point out something I’ve never seen anyone mention on this topic. In OoT and MM, even though you could do sweet looking combos with the sword, they were not very functional. Since enemies were invincible during their “getting hit” animation, you couldn’t actually do damage again until they recovered making the combo attack pretty much useless. Wind Waker was the first game in the series where sword combos could actually hit consecutively and thus worked as you would expect. To me that is a big part of what made the games combat so much more satisfying.
I agree with all the changes you suggest and the shortcomings of the current formula. The only other big change I suggest is somewhat extraneous to combat, but... Enemy Variety. One of the biggest downsides to BOTW and TOTK's combat is the lack of a variety of enemies. No matter how good the combat system may be, if you're fighting the same enemies over and over again, it will grow stail. IMHO, the next zelda title needs to have far more variety and a better paced evolution of enemies to continually test you in new and interesting ways.
The windup in TP is tied to the spin attack charge not requiring a swing first. The windup animation takes place before the player releases the b button.
I think the section on the strengths and weaknesses on BOTW & TOTK combat is very interesting to see. As someone who very much so isn't a gamer and TOTK is kinda the only video game that I play on the regular, it was interesting that several of the weaknesses you mentioned are things that I personally like, for the same reasons a hardcore fan would't. I think it would be a good idea in the future to have the combat system in general be easier or harder depending on the challenge level, instead of just the enemies, so that both ppl who enjoy difficult game challenges and casual players can have those benefits. My perspective on the flurry rush comes from it me taking a while to get it down and I have a harder time with it than other parts, so I hadn't considered that it would be too easy for others, which is a very interesting perspective.
I agree, I’m not the most mechanically skilled player so flurry rushes are hard for me - sometimes I get the timing right but don’t pull off the dodge, other times I mistime and do it too early or too late and miss the window. Personally, I like the flurry rush as is right now - it’s a small bone for casuals/more mechanically challenged. Instead we can have more options for more skilled players to pull off more difficult moves or tone down the power of the flurry rush a bit. Making the timing tighter might be helpful, but if this was any context, T’aloh Naeg Shrine was actually hair-pulling levels of frustrating because I could not time the flurry rush right (I eventually got the hang of perfect parry but flurry rushes still elude me for some reason).
I'm totally not a "hardcore/pro gamer" myself. But I do enjoy when there is a certain flow to a fight. And in BotW/TotK that flow felt a little off because the points I mentioned. But to each their own of course ^^
Part of the reason Flurry Rushes may have taken time to get the hang of in some cases is because it's a Directional Dodge mechanic, which is not what most games use. Most games use Contact-Based dodging, meaning your success requires you to dodge through the enemy's hutbox while your i-frames are active. This encourages you to pretty much slam your face into most attacks to ensure contact happens during the dodge and not slightly before or after.
With Directional Dodging, you have to move against the enemy's attack direction, typically sidestepping vertical attacks and backflipping away from sweeping ones. The catch is, barely any games that use this ever bother to actually TELL you that's important. XD Somehow they never consider that so many other games use contact-based dodging and that might confuse players, making them think they're horrible at timing when they're really just misinformed. I didn't even really notice it in BotW, but when I saw Phantom Ganon's flying slice, where he changes which one he does randomly, I finally noticed that they'd been using a strict directional system the whole time. It wasn't just timing. The tutorials have you DO both dodges, but don't make a point of commenting on why.
@@MonsterMaze That makes perfect sense. Especially with what you pointed out in the vid, I can definitely see how that would be frustrating.
@@theoaremevano3227 Interesting, I didn't know that. Thanks for sharing
You could just add a real-time quick select menu for meals that works similar to the adventure pouch from skyward sword, then limit the meal inventory to around 8 so they can be easily displayed in a circle, rebalance ingredient abundance to compensate for limited inventory, and maybe force players to use 5 ingredients per meal making meals more expensive overall.
one thing that i really appreciate about twilight princess's swordplay is that you can swing your sword while walking (which iirc is not present in any other zelda game!). it's such a minor addition but i like how it keeps link moving without stopping dead in his tracks every time i swing the sword - esp in the wii version, where the input lag feels much less noticeable since you're physically waggling the wiimote lol
it was so satisfying running around just mowing the grass...
29:12 note. Hitting an enemy’s shield does not drain your weapons durability in TOTK, but it did in BOTW
Never knew that! God, there is so much to learn about these games
Leave it to Nintendo to find a way to make the combat worse in some way, for no reason.
seriously? I noticed that hitting certain objects such as zonai devices and (maybe?) materials no longer consumed durability but I never would have guessed in a million years that this would also apply that to enemy shields...
@@mykeyboardismelting6856 materials from your inventory *do* consume durability on hit, which is unlike botw.
But something like hitting a tree with a blunt weapon doesn’t consume durability in totk
@@ACW-dn9wb You want to have your already fragile weapons to break faster?
As long as my weapons don't break as soon as I look at them wrong, I'm a happy camper
I still think TOTK had the perfect ability to fix it. They could have added a better way to repair weapons than the super clumsy and silly way you can technically do it. Secondly they could have still had weapons break imo but allowed for a top tier that didn’t break and the master sword kinda becomes just another weapon the way they do it in the last 2 games. There could be 3 tiers. 1 tier breaks easier. 2nd tier doesn’t break or you can repair it (in a non annoying way). And 3rd tier is Master Sword that needs to have something more than it doesn’t break but you can’t use it for a long time! Like that seems so clumsy to me.
You are always so good at bringing up perspectives and details that I never would’ve thought of or noticed. Great video!
23:19 -- Fun fact: Those of us who played Twilight Princess on the Wii got to have free aim while moving a whole generation earlier than you stated here. We just had to cope with mirror Hyrule in exchange.
Also being able to control swings and having dedicated combo routes even simple adds a lot to a game as well as the choreography and effects like the hitstop that was applied with attacks in windwaker and TP really made landing blows super satisfying no matter what especially that sound effect that played when you hit an enemy selling how strong and brutal your swings were. BOTW and TOTK really were major steps back outside of environment and bow combat which only can make up for what was lost through exploits.
Dunno if anyone noticed this, but in BotW and TotK, you can actually change which direction Link does his charged spin attack (1 handed weapons only). If you hold the button down after doing one normal swing, he’ll stop and charge but with the sword on the other side, therefore releasing and spinning in the opposite direction.
Amazing breakdown of everything. You highlighted things I hadn't even thought about before (or wasn't even aware of), but things that had totally influenced feelings all the same. Incredibly thorough, fair, articulate and clear. ⭐
Omg you went insane with the editing of this video, always on point MM, thank u ❤️
Thank you for bringing up Age of Calamity in this. Something I notice major Zelda CZcamsrs tend to do in videos discussing the series as a whole tend to conpletly ignore both AoC and HW. So im glad that it was mentioned in the video, and even got the spotlight for one part.
People really need to treat the 2nd entry in the BotW Trilogy with more respect.
_Non canon_ as *confirmed* in the official japanese timeline page for The Legend of Zelda.
The Food Eat system in BotW/TotK is just… exquisite. Absolutely perfect. 10/10, incredibly delightful.
Nice, thanks for the vid. Appreciated the reflection on where sword play in particular has come from and where it's gone, I find myself agreeing I hope there's more focus on it in the future.
This was actually a really great overview for Zelda combat, and was happy to get this retrospective. Thanks for the nice video MM. 💫
It’s always a good day when you upload! Can’t wait to watch it!
Loved this, really cool to see the evolution of the swordplay. And you brought up some great points about Breath and Tears that I wasn’t aware of.
The cuts to sad Link as soon as you mention moving over to "the bad stuff" is gold! xD
I've always been more partial to the combat in the 2d Zeldas because I like the simplicity, but out of the 3d Zeldas I absolutely adore Skyward Sword's combat. How each fight feels like a puzzle in of itself rather than playing the waiting game of Oot/MM or the constant menu system during midbattle in Botw/Totk. I appreciate that Zelda's combat isn't too complex and is more forgiving than a lot of other games. Especially if you have slow reflexes like me.
I see a Monster Maze Video, I click as fast as I could. I really love yout videos! Keep on and I cannot wait for your Story Critique!
10:31 The crouching stab was great at getting through enemy defenses, if you didn't want to do the waiting game. In particular, I always used it on Dark Link.
I smashed his foot with the hammer. Timed right, it'd keep catching him off guard. XD
I was looking for a zelda video i haven't seen and here we go 5 minutes ago lol, thank you monstermaze as always
Just wanted to comment on how top tier tour, thoughtful and perfectly presented your videos are. you're truly a cut above my man.
thanks for all your work. brilliant as always.
And yes, sword play. a must in the next game.
Very thorough, loved it!
I appreciate this sea of words! You hit on most every point I would comment on. The exact problems with Link's moveset, orientation, Flurry Rush, menus, pacing, ragdolling from hits, all of it. :D It's a solid point of reference for all of this stuff that I can always Link back to.
When it comes to solving the menu problems, other games have definitely presented good solutions. Scarlet Nexus handles hits in an exemplary way. By holding the right bumper, all four face buttons switch to the various powers you can activate, and absolutely no slowing of time or popups are necessary to be able to use it, and there's zero delay. On top of that, activating the same power but with the left bumper instead burns some of the meter to do a distinct attack. On top of that, double-tapping the right bumper can switch over to a whole second palette of other powers, giving you access to 16 total options with no gameplay interruptions of any kind.
This basic idea can be traced back a ways too, to games like Phantasy Star Online, with its front/back palette of 3 buttons, which, in turn, can be traced back to Zelda itself and the simple, but effective option to reprogram a button input, so I think a very similar setup would end up fitting Zelda just fine. Imagine being able to select Link's main items that quickly, and even have a combat-specific use for an item that could be more fluid than awkwardly pulling the item out and using it normally.
When it comes to guarding, I tend to describe Twilight Princess's method as a 'layered guard' system, and I actually think this suits Zelda better than trying to replicate the intentionally oppressive feel of Dark Souls. One problem with having blocking fail based on a numerical system/meter like having stamina or shield durability limits is that players unfamiliar with the game won't have a good sense of what to expect from most enemies and bosses. If a player guards just one or two times against a sufficiently powerful foe, and their guard fails with catastrophic consequences, they're likely to quickly move away from guarding altogether because of how volatile it can be. This fits well with Dark Souls for many reasons, but isn't a one-size-fits-all solution for every game.
While Twilight Princess may seem like it goes easy with this kind of guard system, a game like Ninja Gaiden (2004/5), which uses the same system, shows that it absolutely can be a challenge. Enemies just need to be more adept at using their four main attack options right, and having decent attack variety and layering.
1: Light attacks- can be blocked as much as you like. They aren't meant to break guards; they're meant to try to hit when your guard is down.
2: Heavy attacks- will break guard but leave Link open like the Darknut's attacks.
3: Excessive attacks- just like blocking with a spear in Souls, you can block, but with some damage bleeding through. attacks that hits extremely hard, or magic attacks that aren't super-powerful, like fireballs fall into this category.
4: Piercing attacks- specifically powerful magic and the throw attacks Ninja Gaiden was infamous for
This kind of system allows for enemies to be a lot more aggressive because you're able to keep guarding so long as you can mechanically recover, and doesn't discourage guarding against powerful foes because it stays consistent, but also isn't overpowered since it can be bypassed in many ways. It also keeps enemy threat level from multiplying fast just from raw numbers (which multiplies the failure points for your guard to break from stamina or durability. More hits means more perfect successes needed to avoid that.)
In regards to the cooking/healing I like the suggestion of an Estus style system (even a MH style system where you can make them but you can't pause the game and do so could work if balanced right) I would add that camping should be have a greater emphasis & have it so that your hearts don't replenish without making a meal-this would be a way to keep the healing food aspect while still separating it from combat & could create a nice excuse for more cosy by the fire vibes in the next game hopefully with a steed instead of a handle with two fans lol.
Something else semi-related to this topic I've been personally deliberating is a system in which the Master Sword becomes a handle of sorts for a totk style fuse/crafting mechanic. With the idea being you can have an indestructible handle that can function as a blade in a pinch similar to having your knife in RE4 if you somehow run out of bullets but a bit more useful.
It would be in a way that each botw/totk style weapon: Swords, Spears, Hammers & Boomerangs(?) or maybe a new dual wielding dagger system like what sage Riju uses would each be their own weapon category on the d-pad but if the blade breaks when fighting an enemy the weapon reverts to a functional but severely weakened version of that weapon but if there's a horn laying around you can immediately re-attach it to get a proper weapon instead of the current system of either having to switch weapons entirely or find a weapon on the ground to do the same thing to.
Now in an ideal world I would implement a similar system for bows and shields too with like for shields attack, light, heavy & maybe a special type shield as the 4th for things like rockets (or their equivalent) and for bows multishot, zoom, long bows (the ones with straighter shots maybe rebalanced with a longer windup) and shortbows.
42:00 I HAVE AN IDEA FOR THE HEALING SYSTEM. it’s mostly based off of skyward sword but I also combined a bit of the totk and rdr2 ui design. Let’s say you have the ability wheel from totk. You press L1 to use an ability, and hold it to pull up the wheel. Add a feature where you can press R1 while in the wheel to change pages like in rdr2 or skyward sword to switch to healing items. You can hotkey meals you make from your meal menu (you can’t eat directly from the pause menu). You select a meal like you would an ability and close the menu. You would then hold the meal in your hand, with a pop up saying to push A to eat. The eating would happen in real time so you have to space the enemy. You can put the meal away by drawing your sword and shield to guard if you mistimed pulling the meal out. You can instantly bring it back to your hand however by pressing L1, because now healing works like abilities do. This keeps all the same ui. It just adds on new features, and also removes eating from the pause menu. It also allows the cooking mechanic to completely stay unchanged.
I gotta agree with you on inventory management. I like games that punish you for trying to heal at the wrong time.
Note about Wind Waker's parrying: you can choose which retaliation link will perform based on what direction you're holding the control stick when you hit the A prompt
I really liked the combat from twilight princess, and I think it perfectly suited the style of game Zelda was at that point. The core of Zelda games has always been the puzzles interspiced with exploration and combat. And TP‘s combat was very strategic, especially against shielded opponents, and made you think about which move to use to get past their guard. Kind of like a puzzle.
Probably the biggest reason the combat in Zelda games has never really been great compared to other combat systems in other game series is simply the Zelda team doesn’t care about it enough to commit more effort. Other devs from other franchises make sure to fine tune the combat so it’s satisfying, intuitive, and rewarding for the player. It feels like the Zelda team just gets the combat system to a working functional state then just go ehh good enough then moves on. Also, combat has never been their expertise so I don’t think they even know how to make a great combat system and they probably don’t care enough to learn either
It's a shame too because the creator of Dark Souls has stated that early Zelda (mainly Oot) inspired his work. It would be incredible if the roles were reversed, and Zelda took some inspiration from the Soulsborne genre here and there. Not outright copy what they do of course, but simply taking some inspiration from some of their mechanics.
@@MonsterMaze yeah like they don't even need to add much to add more depth too. Just simply having a heavy/light attack and simple combo chains would make a world of difference. The swordplay at the moment is a bit stiff and repetitive. The soulsborne games and monster hunter games would definitely be places I wish they would take inspiration from.
I think even adding the directional inputs to botw and totk like twilight princess would make the combat leagues better than it is now, you could even add directional blocking like skyward sword to the enemies so each enemy is a bit more interesting
I love your idea for healing/cooking, if healing is taken away from dishes, and limit the number of actual healing items. Also, the Yiga Earthquake move is my favorite part of TotK, i just repeatedly use it to knock an enemy back really far away, its fun to send them flying so easily. Im not great at the combat of the games, but i still have fun
One redeeming quality of the wind waker timed parry you didn't mention is that it's only triggered when you aren't shielding. Defs agree with everything else you raised tho!
Thank you for such an amazing and insightful video! Keep it up!
PS. I nearly collapsed into fits of laughter when the "with Iggy Pop over here" comment was made
@@ERie-ul7kg I'm glad you got the reference haha xD
It's been an excellent video as always!
New monster maze video!!! Always makes my day
At 2:11 I thought all of those milk meals were some kinda of mod, I didn't knew that was an actual recipe in BotW and TotK
Crucify me here but God after playing through BOTW and TOTK combat the combat of past zelda games feels so boring...? Like wdym I can't jump into the air spam bomb arrows, flurry rush, stasis the enemy, Urbosa's fury them or make a demonic machine of death. Older zelda games u just swing a sword 😭
That is true, but I personally enjoy the amount of control that the older games gave us. The archery of the new games is definitely much better, but I really enjoyed how snappy and responsive the sword felt in the older games.
For example I like the ability to control the direction of the swing, and especially the thrust attack (I think that should definitely come back unless spears make a return)
And finally, the dodge rolling was really fun, even if it was very overshadowed by just shielding.
Also, I haven't watched the video yet, I'm sure he'll talk about what I just said.
true, and most likely the nezt title will have us looking back at botw/totk the same way
I really love the flexibility of these games fr. I think they can improve how fluid it plays though. But yeah these games have the best combat imo.
The older games has magic & sword skills
Then get good and better I know you still love it
Great video. I don't hyper focus on the combat on Zelda games, so to see this little additions and subtractions the evolution and revolution of Zelda games was fasinating. I can't believe I didn't even think about the pacing of the BotW or Tears fights. It's a lot of menus which break the pace, but I suppose for people like me I didn't mind on one hand because...it gave me a minute to think. But I understand for people trying to get in on the action, and they take ONE hit it's immersion breaking. Also brilliant points on the shield - I LOVE Zelda and you brought up so many amazing points I failed to even think about. Sheilds being broken, to finally some enemies staggering Link with a follow up, or like Skyward Sword - they're breakable!
Hi, I'm new here, and your content is amazing. I am SO EXCITED to watch your videos on Zelda dungeons!
Excellent video
50 minutes for just the combat aspect ? Dude thanks a lot
A few corrections about combat in the 64 Zeldas:
Your swing animations, and hitboxes in general, do actually matter, it's just so rarely required that most players can skip over learning them. For example, there's a strat to consistently bypass Dark Link's guard with a well timed reverse finisher. Since his shield is in the right hand, the reverse finisher at max range can sneak under it because it's a rising diagonal from the opposite side. Crouch stab can also get under some of the other enemies' shields (to say nothing of the value of power crouch stabs, lol.)
Similarly, attacks that you can block can bypass your shield depending on their angles. A good example would be the Lizalfos slashes going over the Deku Shield as child Link. These can be blocked by turtle shielding with the Hylian Shield, since it covers directly above you.
Also, transformation masks definitely change combat in MM. Even setting aside attack speed, you've got stuff like the Goron Pound that actually lets you dodge and counter low attacks. It's a cool way to deal with Wolfos, since you can dodge their swipes and then land on their tails as they spin to one-shot them.
Just wanted to point these out since they're pretty often overlooked aspects of the game that add depth to the combat system, and address common complaints about it. But again, since the game never outright requires them, most people (understandably) don't know they're there.
Glad you finally made this video MonsterMaze! The combat issues and the things TOTK/BOTW took out from previous Zelda games has been my biggest issue with them (llrr issues is 2nd place). It pissed me off so much that there wasnt TP level of detail to the combat, not even controllable directional attacks that even OOT on N64 had. Amd the lack of enemy variety didnt help things. But im glad you adressed them in a way that brings the idea of a potential future that merges all the best aspects of all the 3D Zelda games, both old an new, together. Thats a big step closer to getting an Ultimate Definitive Zelda experience.
I'm glad you mentioned Age of Calamity, because I was going to mention it here lol
Being able to influence things like direction and combos leading into final strong hits felt so nice in the game- and it felt like a Breath of fresh air after playing Breath of the Wild. I kept wanting to go back into BotW or TotK and do some of the cool combos I'd do in Age of Calamity but between the menus disrupting the flow and the mechanics being slightly different, it just didn't add up. I do think that AoC having the healing on a quick select menu, only allowing a finishing move after you've weakened an enemy, and some restriction to a special attack were also great additions to the combat formula of Link. I've always liked to think of AoC Link as "Lore-Accurate" BotW/TotK Link- being able to clobber through enemies.
As an aside, I played a special playthrough of Master Mode BotW that I highly encourage others to try if it feels like menus disrupt the pacing (especially with healing). I played a whole playthrough where I split the entire food catalogue into "Food I Could Reasonably Eat While Walking" and "Food I Would Probably Need to Sit/Stop to Eat". I restricted myself to only being able to eat "full meals" while at a campfire, a stable, an inn, or otherwise "safe place"- which led me to using many more potions, skewers, and raw food while fighting. I called it the "Family Dinner" Mode, and it made me look at my food/meals that I carried in a very different light. (This, paired with "Beauty Sleep" where every two days, I needed to find a safe place for Link to rest like a campfire or stable; No Fast Travel, and No Map led to a very very interesting playthrough).
I definitely like the idea of keeping food more for buffs, and using things like secret techniques/empty bottles as reasons to explore. It worked back then, it'd work even better in open-world Zelda :)
Awesome bro. That was cool
Great ideas. 100% behind u
Wow. Some really great observations about Breath and Tears I hadn't thought of but agree with. As someone who doesn't get much time to play, I do appreciate the crutch of the menu pause to change weapons or heal, if for only the brief moment to think about the situation, but you're right about the fluidity of the combat. I'd be happy with some limitations to the menu access in combat though to have a more immersive and challenging experience. Well done and well thought-through video. Thanks!
Ceave's review of TOTK had a good solution to the combat and menu problems.
Basically you can map different items and abilities to the directional buttons. So if you want to fuse bomb flowers to your arrows mid fight you can map fuse and bomb flowers to two of the directional buttons. During the fight you equip your bow, press the fuse button, press the bomb button, and now you don't have to go through a long menu to fuse a bomb. Or if you want to switch swords mid battle you can map different swords to the directional buttons. This also fixes the Sage abilities because you don't have to chase Riju around to use her ability when you can just press a button to activate it.
Love your videos,you are my favourite Zelda CZcamsr ever. 😆
Thank you!
I think I agree with you a most things, though what I think is truely lacking and what has been my biggest problem with the latest two games is enemy variety, not in in terms of looks and esthetics, but in terms of gameplay. The games with the best combat usually have different strategies that are more efficient to take out different enemies. Previous games had more enemy variety on that aspect. For example, in Wind Waker, many enemies had better ways to be taken down than just the sword. Deku Babas died in one hit to the boomerang, you could stun enemies with said boomerang but also the leaf if you had it equipped, you could guarantee a spoil with the grappling hook, arrows were good against Armos, using elemental arrows were a blessing but also drained your magic quickly, etc. Majora's Mask (N64) also has a ton of different ways you can approach fighting in different forms. Dinofols, Captain Keeta and even Majora's Incarnation are weak to the goron pound, Igos and his two henchmen are weak to deku bubbles, both Twinmold are weak to their opposite color's elemental arrows, etc. TP might not have as much variety with its items, in fact most of them are useless for combat, but it had more variety in terms of its sword play. That said, for most of the game, regular enemies die from 4 hits followed up by an ending blow at most. It's only during the last 4th of the game that you truely start seeing variety within the enemies. Oh and yeah wolf fighting is pretty sad. BotW didn't have any of that unfortunately, and TotK had gibdos which resisted regular attacks but were weak to elemental ones, but that's it really. Most enemies and bosses in that game are just either an arrow count check or a flurry rush test.
I 100% agree. More enemies are always a good thing. I would prefer that over all the color/elemental variations.
@@MonsterMaze Oh, and somebody probably mentionned this, but the crouch stab in OoT is super broken. It doesn't have a base damage value, so it copies the properties of the last attack you do. So ifthe last attack you did was a jump slash, then your crouch stabs do jump slash damage until you do something else. But that's not the funniest thing, it also works for other weapons like sticks, the hammer and the Biggoron Sword. So if you swing your hammer once, as long as you don't do any other attack, you can start breaking boulders by crouch stabbing with the Master Sword for example. It also works in MM but only on the Japanese version.
@@TheHyruleArchives Damn, that is nuts, haha. I do remember hearing a story that you could beat Ganondorf really really fast with the crouching stab, but I honestly thought that was just a rumor at the time ^^
@@MonsterMaze Oh yeah, not just Ganondorf, but Ganon as well. If you jump slash with the Master Sword before the transformation cutscene, you can use the hammer or the Biggoron Sword to crouch stab Ganon's tail, which will do Master Sword jump slash damage, which is what hurts Ganon the most, and finish the first phase in 3 hits instead of 10. It's hilarious
Brilliant video MonsterMaze! :)
10:34 nah crouch stabbing was incredibly useful because of how it stores the damage of the previous attack you did. EX: if you did a jump attack with a deku stick immediately followed by a crouch stab, that jump attack damage will be applied to the crouch stab.
45:29 something worth noting here is that if you keep the button for wands/healing pressed for too long in Age of Calamity, the menu itself will stay up, but the game will eventually return to normal speed
I wanna expand on what monster maze said about learning optional sword skills. What if there were different swordsman schools you could go to learn different moves or styles of movement. Like if you go to a sheika school to learn faster but lighter hitting strikes. Go to a goron school to learn shield skills and defensive stances, zora school to learn spearmenship, and rito school to learn more effectively use a bow. Go to gerudo school to learn two handed weapons. And you can't simply buy the next skill with rupees but rather actually use the skills you learned in a test of combat. And certain schools could go well together. Like learning two hand weapons then going back to goron school to learn use heavy weapons in a more defensive style.
You can block with 2-handed and long weapons in TotK by fusing a shield onto them. You can also attack with a shield by fusing a weapon or monster part onto it, allowing you to essentially dual-wield.
Enemies in BotW & TotK are too often damage sponges that just eat your time to defeat for no real reason. Some changes I'd make to the BotW/TotK combat would be to halve the HP & damage of all enemies, and to halve the distance you need to be within to aggro them. If they're using a shield, make it breakable with damage (but you lose the ability to collect it if you break it). I'd also halve the number of variants per enemy from 4 to 2 and add more non-humanoid enemies, like tektites. Maybe also increase the window for a Shield Parry to match the window for dodging for a Flurry Rush.
I think I agree with Don a bit here instead actually and would invert the timing, make Parrying easier since it has less reward but make flurry rush way more strict since its reward is so great.
@@ListlessWither I wouldn't reduce the timing for Flurry Rush because combat already takes way too long. I just want to get back to exploring.
@@thajocoth That's fair. I just personally dislike the easiness of flurry in comparison to its reward compared to parrying.
Though I think a bigger improvement imo to flurry rush would be fixing how jank it is. Maybe less time spent watching link jump through the air and an actual unique animation finisher instead of the current mash the button and see him attack a bunch. There should be just a quick cool animation that gets all the damage in for you and get you back to the fight sooner.
I'd like enemies to maybe be better at responding to shield parries or perfect dodges depending on how they fight. Heavy types would be more vulnerable to evasive counters, while lighter ones would only really be hit by shield parries. Medium enemies might be able to deal with both, depending on what attack they were using, but only the more skilled medium enemies like Stalfos.
I love this series 🔥
In TOTK I think gloom should have infected all world ingredients. You can cook a poison to add damage to weapons, but you can only cook healing meals with ingredients bought from merchants. Yeah you could just buy a ton, but you’d have to earn those rupees first. Also, blupees should drop hearts. Incentives cave exploration and heals!
29:06
Attacking an enemy shield doesn't use weapon durability. You can tell by the color of the sparks. Blue = no durability use, orange = durability use. This applies to mining ore deposits as well.
I've always felt that the biggest problem with BOTW/TOTK is that you simply get too many materials as they are the only reward for exploration besides spirit orbs. If they restricted the amount of food items you could find and maybe shrunk down the world a little they could really curate the Gameplay experience a bit more
"wws parry is based entirely on the enemies attack"
soooooo
like botws flurry rush
but without the terrible hitbox and overuse of slowmo that would make a modern movie blush
As usual another great video with some great editing. Wanted to ask will there be a part 3? Perhaps about how exploration and world building could be implemented in the next game and what you would like to see?
Even tho i'm sure we also agree on Zelda needing at last a little more structures and boundaries.
Yes, there will be a part 3, which is indeed about exploration and the open world etc. But I'm going to do a coupe of shorter videos first, because this video took ages, haha.
Hey man i just wanna say youre doing a great job and I wish you the best, cheers
On the topic of aerial attacks, I think bringing back the Roc's Feather could potentially help with that.
The other day I realized that the Roc's feather could essentially be used to form an upward air gust when paragliding.
Normal jumps could also be enhanced by the feather, letting you jump higher and stronger. The enhanced jump could be enabled/disabled with a toggle on the ability wheel.
But after proposing this idea, someone responded with the idea of the feather simply giving you a double jump, which I think is probably the better idea (we can keep the paraglider gust though).
I think you could still use it as an enhanced jump if you wanted to, maybe if you activate the feather before jumping. If you pair this with sword play, you could potentially do a lot of interesting things.
- Use your sword during an enhanced jump to do an uppercut.
- Use your sword at the same time as a double jump to essentially do a Luma spin from Mario Galaxy
- Use the feather during a sword plunge to speed up your descent
- Use the feather during a jump attack to launch yourself further forward.
These are just some of the ideas of things you could use the roc's feather for, but it could act entirely differently and still open a lot of movement and attack possibilities!
Man, the transitions between OoT and Elden Ring is like time traveling. We've come so far!
Regarding cooking, I came up with a fairly similar idea.
Healing in battle should be restricted to Elixirs/Potions/Soups, which you can only carry as much as your # of bottles allow.
As for meals-- it doesn't make sense that you're able to transport so many plated meals everywhere you go. One solution would be to make meals based on weight. Instead of a set number of meal slots, each meal would have a weight to it. The bigger meals would have more weight, while roasted shrooms and cooked meat would have much lower weight.
I think my preferred solution would be to make it so you can only eat meals _at_ cooking pots. So whenever you cook a meal, unless it's a soup, you're gonna have to eat it where you made it. Perhaps you could have your own portable pot that you can use outside of combat to prepare for a battle. Instead of doing a bunch of eating _in_ battle, you'd take a bit longer to prepare instead. Cook up some soups or potions for healing mid-battle, and cook up a meal to give you a buff.
When eating in real-time during battle, you can either use potions, or raw ingredients. Raw ingredients would do very minimal health regen. They'd be quicker to eat than elixirs, but you have a cool-down before you can eat another material (represents chewing & swallowing). But in stressful battles, it's possible that this ability could just barely save you from death.
Many raw materials wouldn't even be able to be eaten, simplifying the menu of materials to choose from. Only Mushrooms, vegetables, and fruits would be able to be eaten raw. Meats, salt, herbs, and flowers must be cooked into meals.
I'm not sure how roasted materials could play into this idea... maybe they have to be eaten on the spot, just like other meals.
48:07 You can block attacks with two handed weapons and spears if you fuse a shield to it, sacrificing damage from a stronger fuse for blocking unless you use a lynel shield which does add attack. It's easy to never learn about this, I learned about it after finishing the game.
Also props for bringing out Age of Calamity, super underrated game that is so fun and fresh.
Something that I think would have helped a lot with BOTW's inventory management was the introduction of some sort of autoselect feature when a weapon broke or was thrown. Like maybe you have a set of three reload slots where you can put weapons from your inventory, and then during combat if your weapon breaks Link will automatically pull out the weapon from the reload slot and so forth. You could probably also make this work for eating meals as well with a few tweaks.
I think this would let you add an element of planning for a battle to each encounter, where you fill up your slots based on how you think the fight will go, while also minimizing the amount of menuing required during combat. It would probably pair well with a system where assigning items to these slots happened in real-time, so you were encouraged to do it outside of combat.