Why NASCAR Fans Hate The Playoffs
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- čas přidán 5. 08. 2024
- We discuss the past, present & future of the NASCAR Playoff system.
The NASCAR playoffs is a championship playoff system used in NASCAR's three national series. The system was founded as 'The Chase for the Championship' on January 21, 2004, and was used exclusively in the NASCAR Cup Series from 2004 to 2015. Since 2016, NASCAR has also used the playoff system in the Xfinity Series and Gander RV & Outdoors Truck Series.
The NASCAR Cup Series version of the playoff system is often called the Chase for the Cup, and includes sixteen drivers that compete for the championship in the final ten races of the Cup Series. The first nine races are divided into three rounds, with four participants being eliminated after each round. The Xfinity Series Chase format is competed over seven races with twelve drivers. The Truck Series Chase also is seven races long, but only includes eight drivers.
On January 23, 2017, NASCAR announced that they would not be using the word "Chase", instead using the word "Playoffs."
The publicly stated purpose for the NASCAR playoff system was to make the NASCAR mid-season more competitive, and increase fan interest and television ratings. The timing coincides with the commencement of the college and National Football League seasons and the final month of Major League Baseball's regular season and Major League Baseball's Playoffs. Prior to this format, the Cup champion was sometimes determined mathematically prior to the season finale; a situation that existed in the lower-tier series, the Xfinity Series and Camping World Truck Series, until they received their own playoff formats in 2016.
By resetting and compressing the scoring of the top 10 (later 12, then 16) drivers, the chances of each of those drivers winning the championship was increased, while not precluding anyone with a legitimate chance of winning. The original choice of top 10 drivers was based on the historical analysis that no driver outside the top 10, with 10 races remaining in the season, had ever gone on to win the Championship. The expansion to top 16 in 2014 made the elimination rounds possible.
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The NASCAR 'Playoffs' not only undermine fan intelligence, it undermines driver skill/talent... And even worse, it undermines the entire history of the sport.
I think this anxiety ridden system is going to push a lot more older drivers to retirement.
it also makes it to where if you show up at the right time you can win it. I’m sure we’ve had more younger drivers win a championship since the playoffs than ever before in Nascar.
Several driver's have been robbed of multiple championship's, and it's actually infuriating when you are a fan a driver who gets outright robbed,
I'm not just talking about Harvick, but I'm talking about Jeff Gordon I was never a big fan of his but he was robbed multiple times.
This must stop.
@@BenMyattt I don't know if age has much to do with it, it's more so the lack of skill several of the recent champions have. Just look at the Xfinity series championship's Tyler Reddick absolutely stole.
Look at the 2020 Xfinity championship I mean Austin Cindric was very good in 2020 but Briscoe should have won it by a ton.
I'm not even gonna talk about cup.
Facts fr
"A driver could win 35 races and finish 2nd in the 36th and lose the championship" That situation being possible with the current system is the most obscene slap in the face to racing.
I felt ridiculous even saying it out loud.
A team can be undefeated until the super bowl and lose. These things happen. You have to show up. I’m not saying it’s perfect but it’s a lot better than what it’s been. I don’t want to know who’s going to win it all half way through the season.
You are correct. Its possible for a driver to win 35 races and finish second and lose the title. All it would take will be to shatter the longest winning streak in NASCAR history by 3.5 times. Keep in mind the longest modern era win streak is 4 which has not happen since 2007. Not to mention that in one season this driver would have to win as many races as only 23 drivers has ever won in there careers. Never mind while your complaints is technically warranted lets not like its highly probable. More like impossible.
Look. I get it. You don't like the playoff system. Im indifferent to it because at the end of the day its a fair system in terms of all the teams know the rules and compete under the same rules. I have seen the good and bad of all the championship formats since I watch NASCAR full time since 1997. No system will never be perfect. However for better or worse I do know this. Since the elimination format has happen. Im more aware and more hyped for the last 10 races of the season then pre 2003 where I know well championship is basically over.
@@BenMyattt don’t act like the old style of points didn’t result in some last race tension.
@@darthhull85 You’re correct.
2006 would’ve been Johnson over Kenseth by 4 points
2008 would’ve been Edwards over Johnson by 16 points
2009 would’ve been Johnson over Gordon by 66 points
2012 would’ve been Keselowski over Biffle by 19 points
All closer than the actual chase format.
NASCAR in 2011: Let's make the points system simpler
NASCAR in 2017: Let's make the points system way more confusing
This is EXACTLY what Tony Stewart warned us back in 2007, when he said that the outcome of a race could be scripted, like WWE Wrestling....
Jeff Gordon 1998 is The Perfect Example of Winston Cup Racing
The same could be said about 2007 Jeff Gordon and 2011 Carl Edward's. Both Situations had lost championships even after massive consistency
*Cough cough* Richard Petty 1967
Cough cough Alan kulwicki and Davey Allison and Bill Elliott 92
Seeing all these replies.. I could say peak NASCAR racing was the 20th century-early 21st (2000s)..
There is just too many flaws, gimmicks, controversies, and manipulation with this current format. The playoffs are actively hurting the sport. Just go back to back to full season version or any Chase format between 2004-2013. Just look how 2011 played out. More natural than what we have currently. Thats a Game Seven Moments.
The whole format needs to go
The only thing NASCAR hasn't tried is bringing back the old 90s point system....after they've staked the entire brand on some sort of playoff system I doubt they could ever do it.
NASCAR trying to manufacture drama. One of the draws to the sport was all the differences from other sports but NASCAR wanted more drama at the end of each year and throughout the year. Personally I liked the old system better. More authentic.
The new system is nothing short of a farce.
The truth hurts but it's necessary. Bring back old school NASCAR.
As a die hard Dale Sr. fan, Jeff Gordon should have 7 titles, not Jimmie Johnson
You're just mad that Jimmie is better
@@leonardgregory3730 Lol if you're gonna "get" me, come up with something better
@@sawchiefs29 Jimmie is better but ok
@@leonardgregory3730 No he's not
@@sawchiefs29 Jimmie has 83 wins and 7 championships but I ain't arguing with your opinion anymore but I personally think Jimmie is better
The NASCAR playoffs might be the most unfair system to determine a champion in any sport ever. I'm from Europe and I love watching all forms of racing. I must say, while I do like the racing itself, I just can't get hooked with NASCAR and take it seriously, because of how random the championship is. And because everything is manufactured and doesn't happen organically, I feel no rush, no anxiety for who will win, I just don't care. And the funniest part actually is that NASCAR, because it's a stock series, it's probably one of the most competitive racing series out there, so in many ways, the playoffs aren't even needed to make things exciting, because they already were.
The original chase was very exciting and I would take that any day of the week. This current "playoff" format is atrocious though
I'm a Fan of the 2004-2013 Chase Format because it provided a Balance of Wins, Consistency, and Entertainment. Yes the 2004-2013 Format, made Jimmie dominate NASCAR (Jimmie Fan btw, but Biasness Aside), Yes it did not Crown a Season Long Champion, but it did crown a Deserving Champion, a Champion who worked their Ass off, Jimmie's 5 Straight + 1 more, Tony's 2011 Comeback Title, Kurt's 2004 Title, Brad's 2012 Title, etc.
Instead of Going back to A Season Long Points Format, we go back and use the 2004-2013 Chase Format, and use a Combination of the 2004-2013 Chase format, and the 2017-Present Points format. How does it work for Seeding we Go with the 2004-2006 Chase Format, for Bonus Points for Wins we go with the 2007-2010 Chase Format, for Field Size we go with the 2011-2013 Chase Format, the Overall Points Format and Bonus Points entering the Chase we go with the 2017-Present Points Format
With that out of the way. Here's my Ideal Points Format:
1st - 60
2nd - 50
3rd - 45
4th - 40
5th - 35
6th - 34
7th - 33
8th - 32
9th - 31
10th - 30
11th - 29
12th - 28
13th - 27
14th - 26
15th - 25
16th - 24
17th - 23
18th - 22
19th - 21
20th - 20
21st - 19
22nd - 18
23rd - 17
24th - 16
25th - 15
26th - 14
27th - 13
28th - 12
29th - 11
30th - 10
31st - 9
32nd - 8
33rd - 7
34th - 6
35th - 5
36th - 4
37th - 3
38th - 2
39th and 40th - 1
For Stage Points (Same as Always for Stages 1 and 2)
I'm bringing back Bonus Points as well:
• 5 Points for Leading a Lap
• 5 Points for Leading the Most Laps
• 5 Points for Winning a Race
• No Bonus Points for Stage Wins
For The Chase, here is my Points format after the last Regular Season Race:
• For Each Regular Season Race Win, 3 Bonus Points
• Top 10 in The Points after the last Regular Season Race, make it in the Chase, along with 3 Wild Cards Who make it off of Wins, Wild Cards should be within the Top 11-20 in Points.
• Points Reset to 1500
• Seeding is Based on where you were after Race 26 (ala 2004-2006 Chase Format)
• The Top 10 in Points after the last Regular Season Race, get these Bonus Points entering the Chase
1st - 25
2nd - 20
3rd - 18
4th - 15
5th - 12
6th - 10
7th - 8
8th - 6
9th - 5
10th - 4
• 3 Wild Cards, don't Recieve any Bonus Points after Race 26
Here's an Example Chase Points format:
1st Seed - 1500 + 25 Bonus Points for being the #1 Seed + 4 Regular Season Wins = 1537
2nd Seed - 1500 + 20 Bonus Points for being the #2 Seed + 5 Regular Season Wins = 1535
And So on
• No Eliminations
• No Win and You're In
• 26 Regular Season Races and 10 Chase Races (With no Eliminations or Win and You're In)
• 13 Drivers
• No One Race to Decide a Champion
Jeff Gordon won 7 Cup Championships the same way Richard Petty and Dale Earnhardt did.
The Playoffs is all about winning and yet Matt Crafton won a championship without winning a single race.
And don’t forget Ryan Newman ALMOST won the Sprint Cup (when he was with RCR) back in 2014, doing the same thing, had it not been for Kevin Harvick...
This playoff format sucks in my opinion I wish they would go back to the winston format every other racing series and racetrack in the country have the full season format because THATS HOW YOU DESIDE A CHAMPION playoff systems dont belong in racing EVER
I think people were complaining long before this year's playoff outcome, but after Harvick won 9 races, and didn't even make the final four. That's when it really hit the boiling point. I agree that I wouldn't like to see a champion crowned halfway through the season, but you can see where it can get ridiculous at times. They changed the playoff format to keep Jimmie Johnson from winning. Inadvertently when you think about it. It screwed Carl Edwards numerous times.Kept Jeff Gordon from winning more titles. It helped Kyle Busch win his first championship. In relation to that championship though. People can't complain that they gave him a playoff waiver for missing a quarter, or more of the season when they gave one to Matt Kenseth, and Ryan Newman this season, and nobody complained. Regardless of whether, or not they made the playoffs. You just can't manufacture game 7 moments like NASCAR is trying to do. I'm waiting for the year where you have dominant drivers who all make the Championship 4, and just dogfight it out for the title at Phoenix. This year was a pretty good Championship 4. Chase Elliott really stepped up. Hamlin was consistent as well until the playoffs hit. Keselowski was having silently his best season. Joey Logano had been making his case as well. The only stain was Kevin Harvick not making it. Aside from this year having its disappointments, but still being satisfying when the race actually comes. It's easy to see how disappointing the playoff format has been in recent years. From its early beginnings as the Chase to what it is today. It no longer rewards consistency. Winning is valued above everything else, and whilst I can admit that that is what it is about at the end of the day. You can still make a catastrophic mistake, and miss the whole thing if 16 drivers are just slightly better than you once, or even deep into the playoffs. Hell I'd argue that the only time consistency really matters is making it into the playoffs, and earlier on in the rounds. Even then if 16 other drivers win a race, and you don't despite having better stats. You don't make it, and it's upsetting. Just look at Cole Custer. He's a great driver, but this was not a season where he should have made the playoffs. If I had to pick any rookie it would have been Tyler Reddick. He was consistent, and he was running towards the front. Even Christopher Bell tightened it up towards the end of the season. Some may say that Austin Dillon didn't even deserve to make the playoffs this year, but when you look at what he was doing. He was quietly having one of his best seasons, and he stepped up in the playoffs. If anything this playoff format helps us determine when a driver has a fluke season. That's not the only thing I want talk about though. I want to talk about an epic all-season battle just like the older seasons. The closest in the modern era we've ever gotten to a back, and forth battle was in Xfinity back in 2019. Maybe when the Gen 7 comes out we can have a talk about great racing, and hard battles all throughout the season, but right now I just don't see it happening. Just got to hope for the best, and maybe the right changes will be made. By the way this channel is super underrated. Hopefully you get more subscribers in this new year. (Edit: I made this comment before I watched the video so I'm glad I've been doing my homework in recent years. Great video buddy!)
What brought me to NASCAR to begin with was Richard Petty, Dale Earnhardt, and Jeff Gordon. I was late to know about Earnhardt's passing. I watched replays of most 80s-90s seasons. Racing was a priority. No manipulation for entertainment. I liked most of the drivers of that era. Amazing storylines and rivals. Then when I came across 1992 season, unbelievable how it come to see 6 drivers have mathmatic shot of winning the championship. Alan the underdog and Awesome Bill swapped leads a lot and lost count how many lead changes occured between those two. Alan just needed to lead the most laps just so he can overwhelm Elliott even he won the race. Winning the championship back then was very prestigious. The prestige of winning the championship today doesn't have the excitement as it once was. Harvick who raced at the final years of Winston title sponsorship, didn't care about missing out on a chance to compete for a title, winning a championship could of been a bonus. What NASCAR today is a complete joke. This isn't the NASCAR I fallen in love with back in the early 2000s. I don't buy into championships these days because entertainment and luck matters more than someone who put together a great season. Jeff Gordon, Carl Edwards, and Kevin Harvick deserve more titles rewarded for their consistency. But they all robbed in favor of entertainment. Shame on you NASCAR
The Winston Cup era was the peak of NASCAR
I'm pretty new when it comes to NASCAR. I randomly turned the TV on one Sunday afternoon in 2016, and watched the Folds of Honor QuikTrip 500 from beginning to end. I remembered hearing the name Jimmie Johnson from a decade prior, and with how well he was dominating the race, I decided he was going to be "my guy" for that season. He wound up winning the race and the Sprint Cup that year, so it was a pretty cool introduction year for me.
I think my problems with the playoffs come down to two things. First of all, it's really confusing, and what happens if someone gets really hot in the second half of the season? Someone could win all of the final races in a row, but they don't matter. It's just very odd to me, and I'd rather just have the entire season be for points, and if someone comes out ahead in the middle of the season, too bad. Everyone else should try harder next year. I'm not a fan of all of the extra point accumulation, except I do like lap leaders getting SOMETHING for it.
I'm a newbie though, and despite watching since 2016, I don't watch too consistently, especially with all of the drama that ALL sports started getting into.
This channel is underrated bro
Greatly appreciate it, man. Hopefully we can get a few more subs.
NO ONE'S SEASON SHOULD BE DICIDED BY ONE RACE. If you must have a playoff, use the points total of the playoff races to determine the champion.
I'm a Fan of the 2004-2013 Chase Format because it provided a Balance of Wins, Consistency, and Entertainment. Yes the 2004-2013 Format, made Jimmie dominate NASCAR (Jimmie Fan btw, but Biasness Aside), Yes it did not Crown a Season Long Champion, but it did crown a Deserving Champion, a Champion who worked their Ass off, Jimmie's 5 Straight + 1 more, Tony's 2011 Comeback Title, Kurt's 2004 Title, Brad's 2012 Title, etc.
Instead of Going back to A Season Long Points Format, we go back and use the 2004-2013 Chase Format, and use a Combination of the 2004-2013 Chase format, and the 2017-Present Points format.
Here's my Ideal Points Format:
1st - 60
2nd - 50
3rd - 45
4th - 40
5th - 35
6th - 34
7th - 33
8th - 32
9th - 31
10th - 30
11th - 29
12th - 28
13th - 27
14th - 26
15th - 25
16th - 24
17th - 23
18th - 22
19th - 21
20th - 20
21st - 19
22nd - 18
23rd - 17
24th - 16
25th - 15
26th - 14
27th - 13
28th - 12
29th - 11
30th - 10
31st - 9
32nd - 8
33rd - 7
34th - 6
35th - 5
36th - 4
37th - 3
38th - 2
39th and 40th - 1
For Stage Points (Same as Always for Stages 1 and 2)
I'm bringing back Bonus Points as well:
• 5 Points for Leading a Lap
• 5 Points for Leading the Most Laps
• 5 Points for Winning a Race
• No Bonus Points for Stage Wins
For The Chase, here is my Points format after the last Regular Season Race:
• For Each Regular Season Race Win, 3 Bonus Points
• Top 10 in The Points after the last Regular Season Race, make it in the Chase, along with 3 Wild Cards Who make it off of Wins, Wild Cards should be within the Top 11-20 in Points.
• Points Reset to 1500
• Seeding is Based on where you were after Race 26 (ala 2004-2006 Chase Format)
• The Top 10 in Points after the last Regular Season Race, get these Bonus Points entering the Chase
1st - 25
2nd - 20
3rd - 18
4th - 15
5th - 12
6th - 10
7th - 8
8th - 6
9th - 5
10th - 4
• 3 Wild Cards, don't Recieve any Bonus Points after Race 26
Here's an Example Chase Points format:
1st Seed - 1500 + 25 Bonus Points for being the #1 Seed + 4 Regular Season Wins = 1537
2nd Seed - 1500 + 20 Bonus Points for being the #2 Seed + 5 Regular Season Wins = 1535
And So on
• No Eliminations
• No One Race to Decide A Champion
• 26 Regular Season Races, 10 Race Chase with no Eliminations
• 13 Drivers
• No Win and You're in
NASCAR needs to get rid of this Bullshit of a Playoff Elimination Format. At least in the Chase Points Still Mattered
Dead on.
Nascar still refuses to listen to the fans.
Give me back the old days of Winston Cup Racing.The way it is now a driver that hasn't even been in the top twenty-five in points all year can luck up and get a win and knock some out of the playoffs who may not have one but has been consistent all year and is probably in the top five in points.Not fair at all!!
One of the worst chase casualties was Gordon in 2014. As far as his own racing goes, he had a near-perfect round of 8, finishing 2nd in 2 of the 3 races and was on track to win the other, had Keselowski not drove into him, which he couldn't control. The fact that another driver's boneheaded move can instantly take you out of competition is absurd.
Playoffs do not belong in any form of motorsport period. Its not stick n ball sports. Its always been about consistency over an entire season and that's the only fair way of awarding the best driver. Gimmicks for ratings undermine the integrity of the sport and drive the pure racing fans away.
It’s wild that fans are still defending the playoffs when this years’ 3rd and 5th in points are facing elimination from getting in because they haven’t won a damn race. But the likes of Austin Cindric is in because he won the Daytona 500 on the last lap.
Only thing worse than the Chase/Playoffs is the asinine "Stages".
These aren't heat races, and if you don't have the attention span to watch an entire race, then this sport isn't for you.
I think stages without cautions are alright. I like the idea of earning points by running well throughout the entire race, not just your finishing position
@@ianperry9598 I agree. I like the incentive to do well throughout and not just at the end of the race, but I wish they wouldn’t have cautions. Just kills the pacing and feel. Teams get to plan stops around these cautions. I’d rather them have to plan more green flag stops with more risk.
This makes me want to throw up. Ive followed nascar for 40 yrs and I have never really cared for harvick but what happened to him last year was criminal.
If it isn’t broken, then don’t fix it. NASCAR tried to fix some thing that wasn’t broken during its most popular era, and destroyed it. The problem is that no one in charge wants to come out and say it’s screwed up so we can start working on the problem that should have never been in the first place.
Well fans have some blame on that too because nascar thought it was broken lol, a lot of fans complained about how kenseth won the championship in 2003. I don't care for it but to say a driver was robbed of a championship is total bs. They would be robbed if the rules for the championship were changed mid season but they are not. They know the deal going into it and the ones that work the system the best get it done. They are all under the same rules. I would rather have full season points and just more points toward winning races but I doubt that will ever happen. Even with full season points luck has a lot to do with it. MARK Martin also mentioned this in an interview at the beginning of 1999 season. Shoot a system that just awarded point s to the top 5 by a big margin compared to other finishing positions would be better than this. I'm gonna watch regardless. Everything doesn't have to be perfect. If your team makes it to the final 4 and then with all the pressure knowing that your season rides on this one race and you perform and don't choke and win under all that pressure then to me I would say you are championship worthy. I know luck plays into it, always has, but you had to have done something correctly many times to make the final 4. A lot of people didn't like that Earnhardt was champion in 1993 because rusty won 4 more races then he did, same thing in 1996 when terry labonte only won 2 races compared to Gordon with 10 in 1996. Terry beat him for the championship. There will be nothing to please everyone. I know a lot of people that love the playoffs and a lot that do not like it. I would love for them to go back to full season points but I can't change that so I deal with it. If it bothered me that bad I would stop watching and go watch f1 which would just turn into a nap. F1 probably has the least amount of passing of any motorsport I have ever seen, but to defend that it's called racing not passing. Tony Stewart words, not mine. To each their own
2014 was the exception to consistency being less of a factor. Ryan Newman nearly won the championship off of consistency. And if Harvick wouldn't have won Phoenix, he probably WOULD'VE won off consistency.
How so?
The NASCAR Football League has been hurting the sport more than helping. The fact that NASCAR is still trying to be like football despite the BS gimmicks and BS, it’s just sad. There is a reason why it’s hated. It’s supposed to produce “entertainment” like ball sports and WWE and it does NOT belong in any form of Motorsports!
Chase-Wise, the 10 race elimination chase in Cup only was good because points at least mattered for 10 weeks. Deep down, it doesn’t belong in Motorsports. The fake entertainment gimmicks and broken system needs to GO! No more WWE! No more Ball Sports in Racing! As a Motorsports fanatic, enough is enough! Honestly if NASCAR was smart enough after 2013’s “Spin Gate”, they would know that the chase has been a problematic issue and would go back to what worked. But because NASCAR (thanks to Brainless France and other idiots) is so DESPERATE for attention, fake excitement and fake entertainment, that’s why it’s still around. The Chase (I refuse to say the P word. It’s a filthy word to say in my mouth as a Motorsports fan) is a FAILURE!
I think the TV partners are even more to blame. They also wanted this. Do you think they will ever go back to full season points?
@@racegrubb2152 unfortunately, that’s the case. TV partners is also ruining NASCAR.
As a Motorsports fanatic, I believe all racing series should have full-season points to crown it. But sadly, TV wants fakeness to please stupid and gullible people
Anybody else notice how its referred to as the playoffs even though its not a ball sport. Never heard anyone use the word play to describe ANYTHING in nascar. 200 mph is not a game. No matter how you frame it...
At least call it the Raceoffs!
The Whole format Needs a Fix Bruh
I'm a Fan of the 2004-2013 Chase Format because it provided a Balance of Wins, Consistency, and Entertainment. Yes the 2004-2013 Format, made Jimmie dominate NASCAR (Jimmie Fan btw, but Biasness Aside), Yes it did not Crown a Season Long Champion, but it did crown a Deserving Champion, a Champion who worked their Ass off, Jimmie's 5 Straight + 1 more, Tony's 2011 Comeback Title, Kurt's 2004 Title, Brad's 2012 Title, etc.
Instead of Going back to A Season Long Points Format, we go back and use the 2004-2013 Chase Format, and use a Combination of the 2004-2013 Chase format, and the 2017-Present Points format.
Here's my Ideal Points Format:
1st - 60
2nd - 50
3rd - 45
4th - 40
5th - 35
6th - 34
7th - 33
8th - 32
9th - 31
10th - 30
11th - 29
12th - 28
13th - 27
14th - 26
15th - 25
16th - 24
17th - 23
18th - 22
19th - 21
20th - 20
21st - 19
22nd - 18
23rd - 17
24th - 16
25th - 15
26th - 14
27th - 13
28th - 12
29th - 11
30th - 10
31st - 9
32nd - 8
33rd - 7
34th - 6
35th - 5
36th - 4
37th - 3
38th - 2
39th and 40th - 1
For Stage Points (Same as Always for Stages 1 and 2)
I'm bringing back Bonus Points as well:
• 5 Points for Leading a Lap
• 5 Points for Leading the Most Laps
• 5 Points for Winning a Race
• No Bonus Points for Stage Wins
For The Chase, here is my Points format after the last Regular Season Race:
• For Each Regular Season Race Win, 3 Bonus Points
• Top 10 in The Points after the last Regular Season Race, make it in the Chase, along with 3 Wild Cards Who make it off of Wins, Wild Cards should be within the Top 11-20 in Points.
• Points Reset to 1500
• Seeding is Based on where you were after Race 26 (ala 2004-2006 Chase Format)
• The Top 10 in Points after the last Regular Season Race, get these Bonus Points entering the Chase
1st - 25
2nd - 20
3rd - 18
4th - 15
5th - 12
6th - 10
7th - 8
8th - 6
9th - 5
10th - 4
• 3 Wild Cards, don't Recieve any Bonus Points after Race 26
Here's an Example Chase Points format:
1st Seed - 1500 + 25 Bonus Points for being the #1 Seed + 4 Regular Season Wins = 1537
2nd Seed - 1500 + 20 Bonus Points for being the #2 Seed + 5 Regular Season Wins = 1535
And So on
• No Eliminations
• No One Race to Decide A Champion
• 26 Regular Season Races, 10 Race Chase with no Eliminations
• 13 Drivers
• No Win and You're in
NASCAR needs to get rid of this Bullshit of a Playoff Elimination Format. At least in the Chase Points Still Mattered
Would Love A Vid On Spingate
This video had a lot more spingate content but had to cut it due to copyright issues.
I think a lone video could be great.
NASCAR has become an embarrassment in motorsports simply because of the Playoffs.
I'm new to your channel, but I really like the content and production. Keep up the great work!
As for the playoffs, it's part of the reason I pretty much gave up on NASCAR for almost 20 years. During that time I took a trip to the Knoxville Nationals and loved it so it was specifically NASCAR that I stopped enjoying and not racing in general. Like everyone else has said, it's about consistency, or it should be. I'd say that a driver who finished in the top 5 every single race except for a couple had a more impressive season than a driver who wins a handful of races that just happen to be the ones that matter and had an average finish of like 22. I also know that it's not going anywhere so I've slowly begun to embrace NASCAR again, when the races are shown on Fox (I refuse to pay for cable or satellite).
All of the teams face the same challenges each season so that's the only way I can justify its existence. Everyone knows the format going in. I would love a return to the golden days of NASCAR which awesomely coincided with my childhood, but I'm a realistic person so.....
I didn't know about Jeff Gordon not winning 2 championships that he would've under the system of my youth, but I find that kind of info fascinating. A video listing every time that happened would be cool.
Thank you!
Gordon would’ve won in 2004, 2007 and 2014 which would’ve tied him with Petty and Earnhardt.
Every other auto racing sport uses what is known as a “Year in points total” aka the Winston Cup format. Ratings are actually down in the playoffs. Go watch Slapshoes’s video on how the playoffs are bad
Hey man i like your vids a lot. A lot of quality and nice cut. You have a lot of knowledge and i like your voice.
Greetings from Germany :)
Germany?
That’s awesome!
Thank you for the compliments.
@@fivewidesports no problem. Keep it up and stay healthy m8 xD
@@fivewidesports yeah im from a city called "Essen" in the Ruhrgebiet of germany, i love all kinds of racing and nascar is sooo underrated here in Europe. We have F1 and WEC and stuff like this but nascar is soo rough and dirty in comparison. I like that a lot. So pls keep it up and make a lot more videos like this 👍
This channel is underrated as hell, great video as always. How do you not have more subs?
Thanks, man. Hopefully we hit that 1000 mark soon!
You can lead every lap of every race and then blow a tire/engine on the last lap of the last race at Phoenix (or get taken out) and not be the champion. That’s asinine. There’s no need for a playoff format in NASCAR because everyone races against the same people every week! The most deserving driver should win. It’s foolish to try to add suspense to it. I think most fans would be on the same page.
I’m a die hard Chase Elliott fan. Kevin Harvick didn’t even make the final 4 the year Chase got the title! It should have been Denny Hamlin vs Kevin Harvick for the title. They dominated the entire season. Chase just got hot when he needed to. Exactly like Tony Stewart and Kyle Busch did. And like this year. Until Kurt Busch withdrew his playoff waiver because of his injury, Ryan Blaney who was 2nd in points last week wasn’t in the playoffs. I don’t like the playoff format to begin with. The win and you’re in system is flawed/garbage too. A nobody could win tonight at Daytona and knock him right out.
As we end another year, it's just funny how I used to watch races all the time, and now I won't even watch the championship race. But NASCAR will never admit their folly and just continue to flush themselves down the toilet. What they don't seem to realize is that by creating playoffs they (a) just turned themselves into every other sport, when in the past it was one of the few sports where the most points=champion, and there wasn't any argument over who won and (b) they actually cannibalized themselves, because by turning the regular season irrelevant, why would I sit there and watch when I know all my favorite guy needs is one win to qualify? Before the playoffs, each race mattered, because a DNF was a big deal. Now as long as you have your win, who cares, it's just a bad race and you move on.
Your video's are top notch, 100k plus coming man 😛
We can only hope 😁
6:31 Ryan Newman, would Bowyer not have intentionally wrecked, likely would've won the race. He was over a second in the lead with the laps winding down.
NASCAR playoffs are a joke. I’m not a Gordon fan, but he was robbed twice when if the traditional points format was used he would have 6 championships. He was more deserving than Kurt Busch in 2004 and he would have finished with more points than Johnson in 2007. He would have had 300 more points than Johnson in 07. I just don’t think you can have a bracket when you are running races with more than 2 drivers on the track. It’s a terrible and flawed system
When you become a corporation based sport that was driven by loyal fan base you can count the day before the bottom drops out
To me another thing to consider is every year since the elimination and playoff style formats from 2014-present have had the champion ALWAYS finish 1st. For 10 seasons straight and possibly 11 this coming year. I dont feel like that just happens by chance
NASCAR ensures that one of the final four will always win to artificially create a, "Coming down to the wire," scenario.
I never had a issue with the play offs but it screwed Harvick
No moron it didn't Harvick had the same chance as everyone else
It also screwed Gordon more or less too
I definitely agree... NO PLAYOFFS... GO BACK TO OLD SCHOOL RACING.....
definetly i still miss the pre 04 winston format
You want a Full season points Format ? The best format that Promotes both winning and consistency, use F1 Points
Still way better than watching only one car win in f-1 every week. That sport is broken as hell.
True
@five wide sports please do a video on Jimmie Johnson’s Career please this would be so good.
Brian France set Nascar back like 15 years.
I miss Winston cup racing. What a time😢
Go, Back, To The Original Chase Points Format, With The 2004-2006 10 Driver/2004-2006 10 Driver Format.
NASCAR, Get Rid Of The Playoffs System/Elimination Format.
Because, The Playoffs Belongs To Other Sports.
Not NASCAR.
I'm a Fan of the 2004-2013 Chase Format because it provided a Balance of Wins, Consistency, and Entertainment. Yes the 2004-2013 Format, made Jimmie dominate NASCAR (Jimmie Fan btw, but Biasness Aside), Yes it did not Crown a Season Long Champion, but it did crown a Deserving Champion, a Champion who worked their Ass off, Jimmie's 5 Straight + 1 more, Tony's 2011 Comeback Title, Kurt's 2004 Title, Brad's 2012 Title, etc.
Instead of Going back to A Season Long Points Format, we go back and use the 2004-2013 Chase Format, and use a Combination of the 2004-2013 Chase format, and the 2017-Present Points format.
• 2004-2006 Format In Terms of Seeding and Gap to the Leader
• 2007-2010 Format in Terms of Bonus Points for Wins and Field Size
• 2011-2013 Format in Terms of Wild Cards
Here's my Ideal Points Format:
1st - 60
2nd - 50
3rd - 45
4th - 40
5th - 35
6th - 34
7th - 33
8th - 32
9th - 31
10th - 30
11th - 29
12th - 28
13th - 27
14th - 26
15th - 25
16th - 24
17th - 23
18th - 22
19th - 21
20th - 20
21st - 19
22nd - 18
23rd - 17
24th - 16
25th - 15
26th - 14
27th - 13
28th - 12
29th - 11
30th - 10
31st - 9
32nd - 8
33rd - 7
34th - 6
35th - 5
36th - 4
37th - 3
38th - 2
39th and 40th - 1
For Stage Points (Same as Always for Stages 1 and 2)
I'm bringing back Bonus Points as well:
• 5 Points for Leading a Lap
• 5 Points for Leading the Most Laps
• 5 Points for Winning a Race
• No Bonus Points for Stage Wins
For The Chase, here is my Points format after the last Regular Season Race:
• For Each Regular Season Race Win, 3 Bonus Points
• Top 10 in Points within 150 points of the Leader after the last Regular Season Race, make it in the Chase, along with 3 Wild Cards Who make it off of Wins, Wild Cards are within the Top 11-20 in Points.
• Points Reset to 1500
• Seeding is Based on where you were after Race 26 (ala 2004-2006 Chase Format)
• The Top 10 in Points after the last Regular Season Race, get these Bonus Points entering the Chase
1st - 25
2nd - 20
3rd - 18
4th - 15
5th - 12
6th - 10
7th - 8
8th - 6
9th - 5
10th - 4
• 3 Wild Cards, don't Recieve any Bonus Points after Race 26
Here's an Example Chase Points format:
1st Seed - 1500 + 25 Bonus Points for being the #1 Seed + 4 Regular Season Wins = 1537
2nd Seed - 1500 + 20 Bonus Points for being the #2 Seed + 5 Regular Season Wins = 1535
And So on
• No Eliminations
• No One Race to Decide A Champion
• 26 Regular Season Races, 10 Race Chase with no Eliminations
• 13 Drivers
• No Win and You're in
NASCAR needs to get rid of this Bullshit of a Playoff Elimination Format. At least in the Chase Points Still Mattered
@@aldouscoroza Exactly.
You speak my language! This is what I'm saying to everyone, but they say "if you don't like it don't watch."... it's more than that... it's the motorsport I grew up with and loved!!! It was so much better when it was all about consistency. The last real champion of the Cup series was 2003.
14:16-14:34 👏👏👏👏👏
Great documentaries
Thank you, Pat!
Tony Stewart was the only one I’d say is deserved out of those. He came alive in the chase and dominated.
🟠Thank you to everyone who has subscribed, but there’s work to do!
ONLY 1.4% of our viewers are subscribed
98.6% of our viewers are not subscribed
We would greatly appreciate you hitting that button. It gives us much more motivation to keep pushing out content.
I subscribed! This is one of the greatest NASCAR Channels on CZcams right now! Love the long form content. You really dive into the nuances of all aspects of the sport. I got emotional watching your Gordon video. I believe your channel will grow immensely.
@@ERICSDIECAST Greatly appreciate you, Eric!
@@fivewidesports I like they play offs
Can you do a video on kevin Harvick I don't like him but he has an interesting story
First off... thank you for saying that motorsports don't need playoffs. Too many arguments come up where NASCAR is compared to football, basketball, or baseball and NEVER other motorsports or even racing in general.
Unfortunately, I don't believe that NASCAR wants to win back their original core fan base. They want entertainment, even if they have to manufacture it through a playoff system, phantom cautions (to their credit, there are less of those), stages, etc. to achieve it. We are antiquated in their eyes and they would rather opt for surface level "entertainment" that requires the person to not really think about what they are seeing, rather than provide a quality motor sport. At the end of the day it is all fluff and no real substance.
I really try to just enjoy the individual races for what they are, but it is growing more and more difficult. I also realize that the more I continue to watch, the more I enable them to continue down this path. I don't think it will be long before I step away altogether.
The David freese highlight got me emotional
Carl Edward never won a title tragically
I did a Hypothetical Scenario in which NASCAR would still use the 2011-2013 Chase Format in 2015. And in 2015 Carl Edwards would make the Chase in the 11th Seed. Carl Edwards would be the 2015 NASCAR Sprint Cup Champion in his 1st year with JGR after Joey Logano Crashed out at Both Martinsville and Texas. Carl, Despite Winning only 2 Races in the Season (the Coke 600 and the Southern 500) was Consistent in the Chase
Today in 2023, Joey logano is a two time champ, but according to the Winston cup format, he’d have none.
Only two drivers under the WC format would’ve won both that era and the current era and that is Truex Jr in 2017 and Larson in 2021.
Scrap this playoff system, award consistent driving and the old school fans would teach the young causals how it works.
But the young casuals don’t have the attention span to watch a 3-4 hour average race these days.
Just make it consistency like it used to be. End stages and use the 40 35 34 33 etc point system with +5 and +10 for lead laps again
Ok, Look.
If NASCAR Didn't Overused The Chase Format, All Because Of Brian France...
NASCAR, Needs To Seriously Bring Back, The Original Chase Format, With The 2004-2006 10 Driver Format/2004-2013 10 Chase Race Format.
But, As For The Xfinity Series And Truck Series, Full Season Points Format, Like In The Past.
Trucks and Xfinity better off without playoffs.
@@chromediesel444 I Agree.
As much as I dislike artificially resetting the points, I would be elated if NASCAR went back to the 04 Chase format. Top 10 in points; no win and you automatically advance; keep stage points, but remove stage cautions at ALL races; add bonus points for winning the pole and races. That'd be a huge W by NASCAR in my book.
Was a fan .
Waiting for the next gen car to see if racing gets better
What’s the mandatory yellow ?
Nascar added the playoffs to stop Kyle Busch from winning every championship its quite sad really
I bet they regret it now that they see he wouldn’t have won shit
Actually without the playoffs I don't think Kyle Busch would have a championship. At least that's what I heard somewhere.
@@4_14_fan under the full season format he scored the most points in 18 and 19. I think you could probably say he would have won 18 but their is no clear winner for 19.
@@4_14_fan please don’t make up baseless facts
@@beastslayer2413 I said I heard it somewhere, I didn't come up with it
The difference between Nascar and the major league team sports in North America.
Don't make the playoffs you go home, loser of a round goes home. In Nascar you get eliminated from the big prize, but still get to race but it means nothing really.
Watched from 1984 to 2009 in Canada, every race wasn't easily available. We went to bars to get them to hook it up on their satellite if we couldn't get it on tv.
We were cheering for our driver's to get to the top 10 or 5 in points. Didn't care who was going to be the champ if it wasn't our guy.
Once that was taken away with the silly season, we just stopped watching.
We were Canadian diehard fans, now I don't even know who most of the driver's are anymore.
You want elimination, then send teams home, and have the last teams standing fight it out in a bull ring, that will make good tv 😂
It's like the People who made the 2004 Format knew what they were doing
They did?
Would Stewart have done better if he kept Grubb as Crew Chief? I know there were off track problems towards the end of the career.
Harvick should be the 2015 and 2020 champion
I agree with the 2020 champion but with the 2015 champion I like the out come of 2015
How? Joey Logano won 6 races to Kevin Harvicks 3.
@@Be.authentic_ Harvick did better in almost every other category. Led 1000 more laps, better avg finish, 1 more top 10, it would've been close though.
@@thatpaintschemeguy8 yes because Kyle Busch missing 11 races and being able to win the title is totally logical 🙄
I feel like nascar is trying to create that “Game 7” moment every single year and I hate it it’s fine to have it where some years the championship isn’t very interesting but the years where it is it’s crazy and it will always be remembered by fans I feel like Nascar is in a very tough spot going forward because they are going to lose all of their big names to retirement and the level of talent is going to drop like a rock also I have a very hard time cheering for any of the new drivers because of their lack of personality also I hate how the media turns false drama on the track and tries to hype it up like it’s gonna be this HUGE rivalry that’s not gonna just go away in 2 weeks Nascar can’t really do anything about that though if nascar continues to try to create that game 7 feel every single year and the amount of character starts to diminish Nascar is going to be in a very bad place going forward because everyone knows they’re trying very hard to create drama through the “game 7” moments and making a huge deal with minor stuff on track and the lack of personality coming up
A driver is never gonna win 35 races in a row.
No but virtually year in and year out the best driver all year doesn't win. Manufactured sports is no different than the WWE.
Motor racing is not a ball sport, it shouldn't be treated accordingly.
A tournament format can work for drag racing but that's about that.
NASCAR has managed to become more of a farce than post-2010 Formula 1.
At the time, I thought Newman almost winning the championship off of consistency was cool. And then Kyle Busch wins it the next year while missing a third of the season made me realize how stupid this is. Him getting a waiver set a baaaad precedent. I've also defended stage racing (which it sometimes can be good) because of the current car, but it better be gone with the next gen car.
Is there a reason NASCAR wont adopt the F1 or Indy format?
Kyle Busch would not have won the cup in 2015, had he missed some races “The PLAYOFFS” had not made it possible
Nascar refuses to end this nonsense....I just don't know why? Maybe when they are downsized to the point of not even getting TV deal they will wake up and fix this mess?
Well the TV partners wanted this crap, it isn't just nascar
@@racegrubb2152 OK Fine but even the TV Partners must be losing their asses by now?
@@SNeal5966 I would agree on that for sure. I don't get it either, maybe with the new tv deal it will change. I'm sure the sponsors like it because attention for the 16 teams at the start but with ratings going down even during the end of year does it really matter. Or at least give the final round a full 3 races or 4 races to decide the champ rather than just one. I wish they would go back to full season points. Not sure if that will help ratings or not though. I think that is just a piece of it
I still say if Bowyer had clipped the wall hard enough to pop a tire then he'd had less controversy.
2020 saw a Ryan Newman "win" the "championship" They aren't going to scrap it.
Nascar are destroying the sport. Changing the position of the number is gonna piss off a lot of fans. Why are they insisting on changing everything and wrecking it?🙄
This dude is very underrated
Thanks, Tofi. We’ll get there someday.
@@fivewidesports and i will be there to watch
I am a fan of Kyle Busch, but there is no way in hell he deserved the title in 2015 over Kevin Harvick
look no further than larsons 2017 season he won 4 races ad shouldve challenged for the title but the system screwed him over cuz he blew an engine in kansas in the round of 12 although he performed way higher than 12th all season long
Nailed it!
The nascar playoffs are the worst thing to hit mankind since the holocaust…
Phelps, O'Donnel, Miller, anyone who treats as sports entertainment should be out of NASCAR for their attrocities. Replace with people who can treat NASCAR as a legitimate motorsports.
Loooovvvve this channel.
Appreciate it, Rusty. We’ll keep pumping out more content!
Correction: 2006 JJ would have beaten Matt Kenseth by 4 points without the Chase
But who's counting
I don't like the win and your in system
Nobody stands behind their mistakes like NASCAR. They have driven away more fans than they've attracted with this chase/playoff/stage/green-white-checker crap.
The playoffs is completely stupid it's not a real way to crown a season champion so imo and I've been a fan for nearly 40 years ..a playoff champion is not the real champion so they are not REAL champions sorry jimmi you may have gotten 2 or 3 but never 7
Upvoted for BeastQuake
They robbed Jeff Gordon and ruined NASCAR
I don't care about championships anymore because Jeff Gordon's great seasons didn't get reward with a title. Instead he got 3rd in 2004, 2nd in 2007, and eliminated a race before finale in 2014 only finish 6th in the final standings. Only to have a mediocre 2015 season and get to race for the championship at Homestead. NASCAR is ran by people who never strapped in a racecar for few season
Nobody wants to watch their favorite driver do well all season only to have a mechanical problem or a flat tire end his season instantly. Where's the entertainment when the wins and losses don't feel earned, and when the final race ultimately makes the rest of the season meaningless?
A driver could have 9 Wins and still Lose Trash
Been a nascar fan since 1975 and I have no problem with the chase
You're the only one then. You would have to pay me to watch current nascar. It has sucked since 08
Been a fan since 1999 and I have a big problem with it
I have been a fan since 95 I have a problem with it
@@nascarandrc8296 no fan
@@Be.authentic_ no fan
Even though fans hate the playoffs and I don’t care about it, I can agree on one thing, it puts on a great show. Great vid man!!! I have one request, can you make a video on the rise of Chase Elliott please? Once again, awesome video.
Chase Elliott video is definitely on the coming soon list!
Of course it's the Chase Elliott fan who "doesn't care" about the playoffs lol.
@@4_14_fan um hm! That’s right!!
@@fivewidesports thanks man!! I’m pumped up!!
@@christianrobertsracing1 lol
this is why i don't watch NASCAR as much like i used cuz of playoff system dont like and never will like it .
Thr playoff system ruined Nascar and stage racing killed it.