Repertoire: The BEST Dvorák "New World" Symphony
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2020
- Can there be a best version of Dvorák's perennially fresh Symphony No. 9? Probably not, but there are a heck of a lot of terrific ones, and I'm going down the list. Brace yourself, folks, this is a long one!
- Hudba
You: "Hello, this is Dave Hurwitz..."
My 10-year old son: "You watching him again!?"
It's become a daily ritual.
The Fricsay-Dvorak is completely new to me, I've seem to skip over it for years, which I see was a mistake. Just streamed it and I was blown away, by the performance and perhaps even more so for the overall balance of the orchestra. I was hearing some woodwind lines I never knew before existed, and I've even performed the work and they were still new to me. And Friscay and Co. also nail my favorite moment of the symphony, right at the 1:20 min mark of the 4th movement, the trombones are perfectly heavy on the downbeats and really drive the intensity of the moment.
I will also add that I'm a fan of Bernstein-DG version, even with the painstakingly slow Largo! That's all I'll say about that.
Thanks again for another great video, Dave! Cheers!
Please give my best to your son. Tell him that I understand completely.
I had the fortune to study conducting in Prague for a few years, and my teacher shared a great story about this piece:
Back in the day, Karajan conducted it with the Czech Philharmonic, in his usual manner - from memory and with his eyes closed. At the end of the Largo, he conducted the first of the final double bass chords, but completely forgot the last one! So after an unusually long silence, the principal double bass gave the cue and the basses played the final chord of the movement. Karajan bought him a beer after the concert.
Heartwarming
To be honest, this is a work I've been somewhat burned out on for a while now. There are countless recordings in my collection, plus it is played in concert so very often. But as far as I'm concerned, the Neumann digital and the Ancerl are the way to go. Although I did not need more recordings, this past week I received my copy of the complete Suitner set, on individual discs from Japan (including the overtures) and they are strong performances, indeed.
Quick story: when I was 16 or 17 I was staying at my grandmother's house on the lake for much of the Summer. I typically would stay up until the wee hours listening to classical music radio. Anyway, one night Arthur Hoehn was playing Dvorak's New World on his Music Through the Night program. Not long after the piece started a large thunderstorm blew in, which continued for some time, including during the Largo movement. To this day I cannot get this memory out of my head whenever I listen to this music. What can be more New World than a thunderstorm out on the prairie of the upper Midwest? (not too far from where Dvorak actually visited, mind you) Incidentally, the recording being played that night was the Colin Davis/Concertgebouw, which is another fine one.
Thanks for sharing this--a lovely story.
Thank you for making these videos! This is my favorite CZcams channel.
Wow, thank you!
Do you know Rodzinski’s album with the Royal Philharmonic, playing the Dvořák Ninth along with Tchaikovsky’s Fourth and Fifth? It’s my favorite performance of the Tchaikovsky Fifth. I listen mostly to that piece in the record, but the Dvořák is very good too. I think it’s an ideal conception of the Tchaikovsky Fifth: it avoids sentimental pops concert prettiness at one pole, and the hard-edged readings by Russian conductors like Mravinsky who seem to want to make it into The Rite of Spring at the opposite pole. I like it because it takes the music seriously, not making a decoration out of it, but it doesn’t try to make the music into something it’s not. Do you agree, and do you think he succeeds with the Dvořák in that way?
Well, now that I listen to Rodzinski’s Dvořák Ninth, I withdraw my question. The performance is OK, but it’s no Cleveland with Dohnanyi. A good demonstration of Rodzinski’s music, but not as much of Dvořák’d. I’ll stick to the Tchaikovsky Fifth here, even though he makes the big cut in the fourth movement.
Ooh! I’m listening to the Philharmonia Orchestra under Muti in the Tchaikovsky Fifth, per the recommendation at Classics Today. It has the characteristics I like in Rodzinski, but here at slower tempos and in a broader treatment. It’s very good! I really don’t know Muti’s work, but this record is terrific. My experience has been that most performers don’t get the Tchaikovsky Fifth right, but he certainly does.
learned so much from this vid, thank you! Love your channel.
Your videos have been in my recommended section for such a long time and DAMN am I happy I finally clicked! As a young adult in their 20's who can't get enough of classical music right now, this is a goldmine. Thank you for sharing!
Thank you so much for recommending Klemperer. I was brought up on the Karajan early recording, then moved on to Kubelik. The Klemperer recording is so, so beautiful, like hearing it for the first time again.
I'm glad you mentioned the Neumann...he did a very fine video of it in the early 80s, that a college friend played me one evening on LaserDisc! Having listened only to my Dorati recording on a Vox cassette up until then, I was blown away!
thank you dave. my fav has always been solti's recording with Chicago. now that I've given berstein a listen I think I've found a new favorite.
I love Solti's version: energetic, powerful, rugged and sinuous on one hand, and melodic and colorful on the other. I'm surprised you didn't mention it, Dave. As always, I love your surveys which, besides for being muscally informative, are also great teachers of the English language.
I completely agree with you. I guess Hurwits does not like the energy part of Solti's performances. He also does not mention the Mahler 2th with LSO, The Tchaikovsky 6th first recording with Chicago SO or Moussorgsky/Ravel - pictures at an exhibition. All absolutely top performances. So he does not likes Solti next to the other conductors performances. That's perfectly understandable isn't it?
@@robertjanwestendorp3718 Thanks for your comment. I also love that Tchaikovsky 6th; haven't heard that rendition of Mahler's second. I'm gono give it a listen
The New World is very special to me. It was the first classical CD I bought, done by an eastern European orchestra I've never heard of and was thrilling to me at the time and started my love of classical music. I already have Friscay and Reiner now and will add Klemperer and Bernstein, thanks David
Excellent survey. My first recording was Stokowski on a 1950s mono Lp, and I remember the tam tam passage you mentioned.
Thank you very much for the Bernstein recording. I grew with Kubelik and Karajan but this is something else. Indeed, it makes you renew your fate in the cosmos, as you say. Great discovery for me. Thank you!
Uauuu... Just listen to the version of Dohnanyi and Clevland. The sound is terrific. Such a groove! From first note to the last. The strings magnifying and those solemn moments of horns low register with trombone tuba and bassoon are thrilling. Until today the best I have heard! Thank you Dave!!!!
Dvorak's New World is really fun to play. I've done it numerous times. My mother grew up near the little town in Iowa (Spillville) where Dvorak spent time during the summer when he lived in the U.S. It's one of those places that's so small you'll miss it if you blink, but there's a fabulous little museum there that's worth a visit if you're in the area. One of the draws if that museum is the intricately carved clocks that were made by a couple of local brothers.
Wow. My two best ones I’ve heard just happened to be your 2 top! The largo in that Bernstein is still my benchmark for that movement
Pleaseee we need the Dvorak-Train tunes video!!! Thanks for your stellar, funny, wonderful, encyclopedic videos!
I just love Dohnanyi/Cleveland's New World Symphony. Probably my favorite classical CD. I agree that this symphony needs to have some zippiness. I look forward to hearing some of the other recordings you highlight.
I was astonished by the Klemperer recording. So well recorded too.
Picked up Bernstein thanks to you. I never considered it as I already had 4 versions but all I can say is Thank you. It's now my favorite 👍
Great to hear!
Excellent selection and entertaining video as always. It is a puzzle that Bernstein didn't record more Dvorak, as he had a clear affinity for the composer (at least when he was conducting the NYPO). The analysis accompanying his 1953 NY Stadium Symphony recording of the New World is also worth a listen.
Hi David. Once again a fine and very interesting video. I only discovered the new world symphony about two years ago, the first time I heard it was a Karajan Berlin Philharmonic recording. I love that performance, first of all, since its the first time I heard it, I was blown away by the strong melodies, and after the soft and slow opening the strings go padadadadam I was blown away. The Karajan performance is the first one I heard, so that's maybe why it's my favorite. I also have the Friscay version, I love that one too. The Friscay version, to me, seems to show a lot of emotion and beauty in the the softer slower parts, the second movement for instance is really intense there. The heavier impactful flashy bits is where I love Karajan. It seems so slick and on point and powerful, and since I have a rock/metal/popmusic background, I'm a sucker for great melodies of course, and recognizable tunes en snappy great performances with killer sound. That's what the Karajan does for me, the piece itself is much more than just that of course, I also think it are great melodies, very moving slower parts. The piece itself really grabbed me. I went to see it live last October with the Concertgebouworkest. It was an experience to hear It live. Wow. It was also my first ever classical music piece I saw (heard) live. First time hearing an orchestra live. What an experience.
I want to thank you with tears in my eyes for introducing me to the Fricsay recording - WOW it's like listening to the symphony for the first time. I've completely rediscovered this symphony. This version is going to be next to me for good.
Also, if you don't mind me saying, I think Solti's 1983 recording on Decca should also have been on your list. I bought this back in 1984 when I was 15 years old and it's been with me until today ever after I discovered and loved Ancerl and Kubelik. The Chicago Brass gives a performance at the beginning of the fourth movement that really shakes you. I wont forget hearing it for the first time on my Fisher 15" speakers I had then. Of course the entire recorded performance is wonderful in my opinion.
Sure, I totally understand your enthusiasm. Thanks for sharing.
One thing that's nice about being a new listener is that all these "old warhorses" are new. I love this work.
I must say, David, I appreciate your enthusiasm when describing your picks. It is infectious, and it definitely inspires one to check them out!
Thank you! That's my hope.
@@DavesClassicalGuide It's revived my enthusiasm for symphonies!
Super selection. Glad you mentioned Giulini, he generally gets overlooked unjustly. I think his recordings are as good as anyone's. I was surprised when he made your shortlist. Thumbs up!
I have to disagree with you on the Bernstein though. My taste for the scherzo is a slower pace. Klemperer once again has it right. Dvorak's charm is opened up in his hands.
You have no idea just how validated and relieved I felt, by you placing the Ferenc Fricsay & Berliner Philharmoniker recording at your second-ever favourite! I guess choosing that audio for my score-video of the piece paid off.
As a teen, in the middle of making the score-video, I was so captivated and floored by the recording's sheer clarity and intensity. Seriously, I had never been that impressed since Yoel Levi & Atlanta Symphony Orchestra's recording of 'Rite of Spring' (it's absolutely FANTASTIC).
At the same time, I was very put off by the decision to omit the exposition repeat, and I was anxious about it since the score-video was published. However, now that you talked about it in this video, I feel much better about it now, knowing that it's not a standalone error.
Speaking of which, I'm binging your videos right now. I gotta watch your Rite of Spring videos after this, and listen to Leonard Bernstein & New York Philharmonic's recording (the original one) while I'm at it.
Thanks for sharing this!
A really excellent video - ethusiasm communicated beautifully. Agree about the NYP Bernstein.,
I have nothing to add. All those mentioned are all my favorites. Bernstein NY is probably my all time favorite as well.
Another bang-up job. Dave Hurwitz's channel is a goldmine of knowledge, well-reasoned opinion and sheer fun for the classical music lover...
I agree 100%.
The Constantin Silvestri recording that’s part of his EMI box set is absolutely thrilling as is his Dvorak 7th. Truly inspired playing and conducting.
I agree!
Thanks, adding these to my too short list: Kondrashin and Kertesz
Kertesz Vienna or Kertesz London?
London !
Well, I have to laugh -- the UNIVERSE™ apparently has my back!!! I ordered, years ago, the Bernstein/Israel Philharmonic DGG New World Symphony from Amazon, and apparently someone (or a squirrel) stole it from my front porch, because it disappeared. Amazon gave me a refund and I don't remember what happened, but I bought something else instead. I have always loved that Eugene Ormandy/London Symphony recording, but wondered "Is it just ME?" Thank you again for another thrilling video! The Fricsay, again, is another revelation. I will simply have to purchase that glorious boxed set and have them all. What a wonderful discovery -- thank you again for these glorious insights.
I skimmed through it. I'm testing my stereo setup. Thank you very much. I've got the exact recording I like now.
I have the ones you presented and I love them. My favorites are: Ancerl live in Italy ´58 the best. and then Supraphon's studio "blu-spec cd". Besides those mentioned in your review I also like Dorati, Kondrashin, Kertesz / Vienna and London, Masur.
I just listened to the earlier Szell one from his Sony box set, and was mightily impressed. Am looking forward to the later performance.
So far it’s been Cleveland under Dohnanyi that’s really impressed me. What a record!
So many great recordings that you can talk about a boatload of great ones and still have more than a few in reserve. I hadn’t heard Bernstein/NyPO in ages, so thanks for lighting a fire under me to do so. Love it, although the Scherzo IS overdriven for me. And thanks for mentioning Suitner here (and elsewhere). When asked what Toscanini is desert island worthy, my increasingly smaller parcel would include his New World. It’s better recorded than most of his output, tightly argued and persuasive even when I’m not “in the mood” for AT. And I wouldn’t want to have missed Nicolai Malko’s first recording (Danish Radio sym.), which has the most miraculously intimate ending of the Largo mvt. His Philharmonia redo doesn’t replicate this. But my favorite “sleeper” is a live Czech PO one with Frantisek Stupka, which is now on a Supraphon digital download release. Craggy and lyrical, impulsive but affectionate, and with the sense that he had just discovered the work anew. There’s a short clip of him doing the end of the 8th....I would gladly trade many hours worth of Karajan videos to have something more than a 2 minute clip of Stupka! czcams.com/video/jxT3ppyNVPM/video.html
Wow, Thanks Dave.
Listening to the Klemperer Philharmonia recording right now. This scherzo...whoah. Klemp takes his time, but boy does he ever make those woodwinds sing!
I found your comments on the egregiousness of the DG Bernstein hilarious and your admiration for the Friscay very affecting. One conductor whom I think has done a great job with Dvorak's 7-9 is Previn with the LA Phil. on Telarc, but as you say there are so many good ones out there.
I am really enjoying your book on Dvorak
Thank you!
I grew up listening to progressive rock, original meaning not what they call prog rock today, also a lot of Jazz and Classical. Holst The Planets was a big favourite as a boy, along with Pictures of an Exhibition.
Gradually over the last fifteen years or so, my classical collection has grown, I've just turned 60. Big fan of Mahler.
Started watching your channel last few days and although still listening to Progressive Music, my love for Classical is growing. Still listening to Pink Floyd, King Crimson, Brian Eno, Jon Hassell, Miles Davis and hundreds of others.
Classical is growing originally through Morton Feldman, Terry Riley, Philip Glass and my love for Holst still holds along with Vaughan Williams. Love Mahler, Beethoven, Sibelius, Shostakovich.
Dvorak, I've had for some time but listened rarely until a few nights ago when I put on his The Wild Dove and First Symphony and suddenly I got it, so beautiful.
My copy is Pesek box set that as been re-released, mine is on Virgin but I'm sure it's the same recording with Royal Liverpool and Czech Philharmonic.
Just watched this and tonight I'll put this on which also as American Suite, looking forward to it with a renewed knowledge.
Just subscribed to your channel, well done, best on CZcams.
Thanks very much, and welcome!
I consider myself an Ormandy fan, but I was still stunned how great his Dvorak 9 is with the LSO. I bought it a thrift store for $1 and ended up feeling like it was the best dollar I ever spent. I’m looking forward to checking out his mono account when his huge mono set comes out next month.
Ah, vindication! Good to see several of my faves get props here (Kubelik, Fricsay and Bernstein's NY). Would have loved to hear your take on another I'm particularly fond of: Kondrashin with the Vienna Phil, mainly because it's one of the most passionate renditions of the finale I've ever heard. (Kondrashin's also by far my fave in Shostakovich's 8 - need a massage after that kind of intensity.)
I should have mentioned Kondrashin. It's pretty terrific, I agree, but there are just so many...
I can only agree with you on the Harnoncourt recording by the wonderful Concertgebouw! My first port of call. However, there is a sleeper I love almost as much: Zdenek Macal with the London Phil on a budget EMI disc-very fresh and a terrific performance. As with Harnoncourt, Macal takes the first movement repeat. My intro to the work on LP were the Szell you discussed (have to agree that his 7th was his best and one of my favorites) and Bruno Walter’s late recording. Talk about opposite points of view, but there you have it!
The train line from Berlin to Vienna, via Leipzig, Dresden and Prague, passes within a few yards on Dvořák's birth house - you see the house very clearly as you pass by on the train. I think the construction of this part of the line took place when the composer was a few years old - I would guess he would have been interested and hence maybe his later fascination with trains.
I’m pleased by how often Bernstein is mentioned in these reviews. The English critics seem to treat Bernstein as an eccentric, where he ought to be mentioned alongside the top European great conductors.
I listened to Bernstein’s account, and in this case I’m a little underwhelmed. I like the Fricsay a lot better. The New Yorkers play like it’s just another day at the office, and they’re not all that well in tune. Their Sibelius Second is a knockout, but here I like Fricsay’s tempos better - broader, more grandeur - and the Berlin Philharmonic plays with a sense of occasion. I give Bernstein a B, Fricsay an A-.
I Will give the Bernstein a listen. Thanks for the info.
Dave I have to say that my favourite New World is Kertesz and the Vienna Philharmonic. I can't think of a more viscerally exciting or moving performance. The woodwinds don't always make the most beautiful sounds and nor is the orchestra always *exactly* together in the Scherzo, but this recording just blazes from start to finish. Kertesz also proves that a more flowing tempo and a refusal to pull the music about can heighten expression in the Largo. I much prefer it to his later LSO recording.
Great talk David Thanks. I also swear by your two top recommendations Fricsay and Bernstein's FIRST version in NY. I would also point to Kondrashin with the Vienna Philharmonic and Iván Fischer and his Buidapest Festival Orchestra. It's a rollicking vibrating performance full of Magyar madness . I guess Hungarians understand the Czech idiom pretty well. The secret in Dvorák and perhaps in all Central European musical expression is to LET LOOSE WITHOUT SACRIFICING STRUCTURE. You pointed it out when discussing Dvorák's germanic musical form allied to his innate feel for the folk traditions of his fellow Slavs. A killer mix if you ask me. Keep up the good work. Cheers !
It's a great shame the Dvorak masterpieces are listened to the least by those who influenced the composer the MOST.
That's what is never mentioned, we get to enjoy the fruits of something that was inspired by the ancestors of people who don't even get to hear this masterpiece.
Talich, Ancerl, Neumann, Belolavek, Kertesz, Kubelik, Fricsay, and Toscanini I have them all. Now I will have to take a listen to Bernstein. And I recall a radio broadcast of James Levine at Chicago ,which was thrilling,
Hello Dave. I’ve only just come across your channel and watched a couple of videos. In this one, your mention of the difficult triangle part reminded me that I was once asked to play it “cold” so to speak. I was 2nd trombone in an amateur orchestra and before the final rehearsal on the afternoon of the concert, the percussionist called in sick. The conductor asked for a volunteer from the trombone section (since we were not involved in the 3rd movement). I can’t remember whether it was me who said yes, or my two colleagues who said no, but it was a very scary moment, just as you described it. Also of note in this symphony, is that the poor tuba player only has 14 notes if I remember correctly. These being the 7 notes of the opening chorale of the second movement, repeated towards the end of the movement. Thank you for a very entertaining survey.
Welcome! and you're very welcome. Yes, the tuba part is notorious--originally there wasn't one, but Walter Damrosch (IIRC) suggested that Dvorak put it in. I've seen performances where the conductor let the tubist play along with the third trombone in the finale too, just to give him a little more. It doesn't hurt.
@@DavesClassicalGuide i am inclined to think this 'dvorak forgot the tuba part' is hogwash. he was too careful a composer to do that.
David, I’m hearing the 9th right now on the radio. I’ve avoided playing it in many moons because I’ve heard it so many times. Besides, it seems a week or two doesn’t go by without some Orchestra playing it. But listening to it now prompted me to write you. My favorite is the 8th, but what a great Symphony this is. I even hear a Beethoven influence. Do I not hear a nod to Beethoven’s 9th, in fact? I’m not a musician, so I can’t point out where it appears in both Symphonies. In the Dvorak it introduces the Scherzo, I think, followed with triangle and bells maybe?
(I’m buying your train steam release/cymbal interpretation!) You nailed it with the great Te Deum composers! I love every one you mentioned. Your closing sounded like a take on the Schaefer beer commercial.
Yes, you got the Beethoven resemblance to the Scherzo of the Ninth! Good job!
Minor key, but I never thought of it as an unhappy piece. It's melancholy in a nostalgic way, like Elgar. Delicious sighs, not mournful ones. Dvorak's Germanic inspiration has often tricked me into identifying some casually overheard snatch of his music as Brahms. But he takes the "developmental" so lightly that it no longer challenges one to "musical analysis" as Beethoven and Brahms do or did. What you say about trains is a revelation. I have Karajan 1964; Barbirolli; Neeme Järvi; Davis Concertgebouw 1978. I'll look out for Dohnanyi, Szell, Harnoncourt, Fricsay, and BERNSTEIN NYPh. I like how your talk moves from Bernstein at the nadir and ends with him at the summit. Now I'm listening to Klemperer on CZcams.
Just got to end of 1st mvt Klemperer. It has great swing and dynamism, contrary to the stereotype of him as golemesque.
I love Fricsay's 1960 BPO Dvorak 9th to death but I recently heard his 1953 mono RIAS rec and it's even more sensational.
Dave, I believe that the Bernstein/NY Phil is one of the best Dvorak 9th I’ve ever heard. The first movement was a revelation. The 9th is one of my favorite so I’ve heard many version. The 2nd was almost unearthly. It moved me greatly. The 3rd was great but I’ve heard it’s equal (but I can’t tell you who because I don’t have the grasp that you do). However, the uneven tempi of the 4th threw me. I felt it was, for the most part, a bit slow. The ending was back to the tempo I’m used to. I don’t have a score but I bet there were not the rits he took throughout the movement. Overall, it was thrilling but the 4th movement let me down.
One another note, I want to thank you for all your wonderful videos. I have an MA in music from a long, long time ago but I made my living in IT. I’m retired now and music is still my first love though. You have helped me take up from where I am and progress greatly. Your knowledge astounds me. Thank you for sharing.
While crawling on my knees and looking through a bin of used CDs stored below the main shelves at my local record store, I came across the Philips live recording of Dvořák's "New World" by the Wiener Philharmoniker conducted by Seiji Ozawa in 1991. I don't see it mentioned here among the acclaimed. It fit my budget, since I paid for it less than a third of the cost of a cup of coffee at a coffee shop. I don't profess any special critical talent, but, to my ears, this recording is amazingly beautiful, both in sound and performance.
Enjoy it then!
Saw your review on Classicstoday of the Novak pianoconcerto. Sounds great. Listened to his orchestral works, wonderful stuff (on the eternal longing is great, a bit like Suk). Maybe you can give a talk about his music? And maybe a chat on Rautavaara (i know you did a talk on the Arcticus symph), he is a bit forgotten these days (already), he was a great composer.
Wonderful discussion, compressing so much info. I still have a four foot shelf of "New World" LPs in the garage that gets an occasional visit for those versions I can't find on CD.. The scherzo of the Bernstein NY still astonishes, an entire orchestra having a panic attack. Was it Alfred Frankenstein who in reviewing the record said the scherzo broke off the tail of a ceramic cat on one of his speakers? A runner up for Bernstein's scherzo is Silvestri's with the ONRDF. A similarly feverish tempo, orchestra a little frayed, mono sound, but Silvestri had the measure of Dvorak.
I agree totally.
I can see that Mr. Hurwitz is not going to be easy on my wallet. I downloaded the remastered Bernstein NYPO in audiophile FLAC and ordered the Fricsay. Have yet to hear the latter, but the Bernstein is everything David said it would be. (I'm pretty sure I remember unpacking and shelving both recordings on LP from my days working after high school in a Philly record shop.) Still a fan of the Rowicki cycle, but always happy to have more great versions like these.
One of my earliest classical music memories was hearing the Talich recording over the radio I was totally enthralled. Of course, Ancerl's conception is similar and he has better sound, but I had to have the Talich LP.
Love so many of those versions, but the one i love the most is vaclav talich with the czech philharmonic
Not me.
Love your reviews, Dave. Can you do a VERY underrated symphony, Rachmaninoff 1? The vitriol it attracted almost ended its composer's career before it began. Robert Simpson called it 'a large scale masterpiece', cut out to be 'the strongest by a Russian since Tchaikovsky'. There are some extraordinarily brilliant interpretations too, Maazel's with the Berlin Philharmonic show that orchestra playing like a house on fire, the best Berlin Phil performance I've ever heard.
Oh yes, I do plan to do it. I've played it myself and it was great fun.
well, the vitriol was not due to the score, but to the fact that alexander glazunof conducted it in a state of inebriation, thus making it a mish mash. yes, it is lucky rachmaninoff finally regained his stride and became the second greatest classical composter to come out of russia.
My first Dvorak 9th has been conducted by Zubin Mehta with the Los Angeles Phiharmonic. And I still like it. But we can't go wrong with Fricsay, Kubelik, Ancerl, Sejna, Talich, Mackerras.
My favorite is still the first I ever heard -- James Levine with Chicago on RCA. Just crackles with excitement.
Others crackle more.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Thanks for responding. Which do you think are of a similar style, but better? I've hard the Dohnanyi and the Kubelik (on DG) and I like them, but not as much as the Levine. Which of the others should I most hear if I love the Levine?
I attended one presentation of this symphony conducted by...ta da...Yehudi Menuhin (of all people)! It was a Grand Occasion!
One of my favorite Dvorak "train" pieces: The Golden Spinning Wheel.
Yes, I feel a talk coming on...
Love Chalablala on this one!
@@DavesClassicalGuide it would be fantastic if you could give a talk on the Tone Poems... I love Dvorak's music, but for some reason I find it difficult to get "into" the Tone Poems. I have a feeling that you will be able to provide the key to unlock them...
@@emileswanepoel3553 That's very kind of you. I will do them, hopefully soon.
I would also add Järvi in Cincinnati! There's a freshness and excitement about it, and it is very well recorded! You hear the bass lines in that one too.
David Kelly The same applies to the Dvorak 6th that recorded with the Royal Scottish National Orchestra. Jarvi certainly has a special affinity for the music.
@@edwinbelete76 I was referring to Paavo!
Paavo Jarvi with the Royal Philharmonic is excellent (the recording though is rather too bright or brittle for my ears).
I do feel strongly for either recording of Tennstedt with the BPO in this work, sometimes the recording quality isn't as good as others, or sometimes the orchestral textures aren't quite clear, but the whole performances are so thrillingly propulsive and ebullient.
Personally never been fond of Bernstein, I feel that the NYPO plays like hot fire, but musically it just doesn't move me. Too often I feel like it just don't have enough breath.
an interesting and entertaining review once again. How did you know about the train obsession, by the way? his letters? If I may offer a suggestion from young people's perspective 'sick' means amazing nowadays:-)
I do hear the continuation of the canon in performances other than Klemperer's. Now that I know what to listen for, I hear it in Neumann with Cz Ph, and Bernstein with NY Ph.
Love your lengthy introduction leading up to the recordings. 12:40
15:50 - Reiner
16:36 - Klemperer
18:26 - Guilini
19:12 - Suitner
20:20 - Mackerras
21:22 - Ancerl
23:39 - Kubelik
25:40 - Ormandy (LSO)
26:45 - Szell
27:39 - Dohnanyi
28:29 - Harnoncourt
29:57 - Fricsay
31:40 - Bernstein (NY)
Another sleeper and almost never mentioned: Böhm's 1977 (correction: 1978) recording with Vienna on DG. It's similar to Klemperer's as in letting you hear textures you barely otherwise notice. And great energy despite tempos being more on the slow-ish side. All in my opinion, of course 😅
Boehm recorded it in 1979. I have it on lp. It's a really great recording. Much better is Boehm's live recording from the same year from Salzburg, also with the VPO.
@@dvorakslavenskiples It looks like the truth is in-between. Recorded 1978, released 1979, according to the lone source I could find on the net.
love to hear you on dvorak;s train moments
I think I did that.
@@DavesClassicalGuide yes, you pointed out the start of his 7th symphony. i meant on other pieces? thanks
@@DavesClassicalGuide i'll take your word for that.
Another great chat, with well chosen recommendations for a work that, in my view, has been over-recorded egregiously. I really like the Bernstein/NYPO(such energy, with the first movement exposition repeat) on Sony, and I enjoyed the Ormandy/LSO performance on LP. Ancerl, Neumann (digital), Kubelik/BPO, Harnoncourt, Szell, and Dohnanyi are all great, but I have great affection for the Giulini/CSO on DG; thoughtful and expressive but with rhythmic acuity where called for, superbly played and well engineered. I just put Fricsay/BPO on my iPhone. One recording that was highly touted in the UK is the Kondrashin/VPO on Decca; it's OK but I don't see what the fuss was about. Any thoughts on that?
See below. It's very good, but not the be-all and end-all.
I'm also very fond of Giulini/Chicago. The elegance of his conception really synergies with the Mack Truck power of the CSO. He takes the exposition repeat, too!
For me, Walter will always be the best New Worldian. I love that it was still prominently numbered the 5th when Bruno recorded it with the Columbia Symphony Orchestra. The performance is dramatic with a a driving rhythm. The New World deserves every ounce of its smash hit success, snobs be damned. Dvorak’s most serious, Brahmsian masterpiece, good ole No. 7, bores me to tears. Szell is a close 2nd for me on Dvorak 9.
Wow. I find Walter very tired and stodgy--it was the end of his career and I think it shows. No so the 8th(s), however.
I knew we’d eventually disagree strongly on something! I actually like Stokowski a lot here too. As with so much of his other work, you just have to remember it becomes a Stokowski composition. I think Szell elicits a performance that is unstintingly faithful to the work’s intent while still being very exciting. I haven’t heard the Mackerras but I will soon - I bought and adore the Beethoven cycle you praised (and the great Kletzki cycle too)!
@@DavesClassicalGuide Walter's 8th is wonderful!
Szell's Dvorak is great. The Slavonic Dances recording is just spectacular!
I have adored the Kondrashin VPO since I was a child BUT there is an unbelievable editing mistake in the Scherzo, bar 41, a whole beat missing...! It is right in the repetition...
"The symphony for people who don't care for Classical music." I have a version for solo classical guitar that is incredible, by Kazuhito Yamashita, RCA. And I have Solit's, which I like.
I’ve never been able to come to terms with Bernstein’s tempo in the Scherzo. Simply too fast by a third. Perhaps the tempo is a reference to Dvorak’s fascination for trains...as in a tempo one might take if they had a train to catch. 😱
When I was 20 or something,I came across Giulini's New world ,then I became a great fan of Maestro Giulini and classical music.I still love Giulini's version,but I sometimes feel there 're some parts in this symphony that are boring for me. Now I really love
Dvorak 8th.I feel giulini's 8th is the best for me.
Thanks so much for this informative video, Mr. Hurwitz! I've been enjoying your channel tremendously. One quick question that perhaps you can answer regarding Otmar Suitner's recording of the New World Symphony. In the final moments of the symphony, Suitner seems to take the concluding fanfare at double time, which was pretty jarring the first time I heard it, since most conductors take it slower and give it a more spacious, heroic feeling. Do you know what I'm referring to, and do you happen to know whether or not it's timed that way in the score? Thank you again for sharing your expertise and insights.
The main tempo of the finale is Allegro con fuoco. In the passage you indicate, Dvorak asks for a slower tempo at the elegiac horn solo, a slower tempo still at the big crescendo initially (Maestoso), followed by a sudden return to the main tempo (Allegro con fuoco) for the conclusion. Some conductors may play it a bit faster than that, some slower, given that there are so many tempo fluctuations throughout the movement. Suitner is pretty accurate, and I like the extra jolt of energy. Incidentally, you can check all of this out easily for yourself at IMSLP online. If you have never visited that site or looked at a score, and have a little time, I urge you to try. You don't need any experience or even much ability to read music--it's just an excellent learning exercise.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Thanks so much for your response! I'll definitely investigate IMSLP online. I listen to a great deal of classical music, and have since I was a teenager, but while I'm able to read music and have often wondered what the composer asks for (versus what I hear on disc), I've not been aware of a cost-effective resource that would allow me to know. Many thanks once again!
Totally agree on the Bernstein 1e choice, the largo is unsurpassed warm en beautiful. So, so beautiful performance also as a whole. Also love the Dohnanyi and the Kubelik. But I can not pass on too often how I think the Solti with the Chicago SO on DECCA has an energy and crescendo moments no one has equalled yet. It belongs among the others absolutely.
You're really in the minority with the Solti.
Than if I am in the minority I must be stupid?
Dear Dave, you have no idea how you excited me with your comments about Dvorak and trains. I had no idea train rhythms (not to mention hissing steam!!) influenced Dvorak. You MUST follow this up with another talk. Thank you so much.
You may want to have a look at my book on Dvorak, where I identify many "train tunes" in his works.
Thank you, I will definitely check that out.@@DavesClassicalGuide
Mr H when you said there's no possibility of disagreement and dispute in your final choices, that pause and grin are just hysterical (my wife wondered why I was laughing so much). To paraphrase W.S. Gilbert:
'And I expect you'll all agree
That he was right to so decree
And I am right,
And you are right,
And all is right as right can be!'
Anyway glad you mentioned the Mackerras (the coupling of the 7th is no mere makeweight either I think). I also rather like Kondrashin with the VPO - the rubato he employes never seems gratutious and is effective and I particularly like the way the timpani cut through at key points. Cheers again
LOL! And another vote for Kondrashin.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Another vote for Kondrashin from me. It's exciting.
Also for Kertesz's first recording (with the VPO).
A guilty pleasure: Giulini with the Concertgebouw Orchestra. I know, it's "wrong" - too slow. But so beautiful - perfect alternative for some special days ;-)
“I Left My Triangle in Brooklyn” as sung by Tony Bennett.
I wish I had found these videos before wasting my money on so many mediocre or even bad recordings. I will never buy another cd before listening to your sage advice again!
Glad I could help!
I feel one of the greatest recordings of the new world symphony is George Solti with the Chicago symphony orch
I remember when it came out it had an odd electronic blip in it that I found rather annoying--I wonder of they fixed it? But it is an exciting performance.
@@DavesClassicalGuide As for Japanese edition CD, I believe it's fixed (That's the only version I own).
Hello Mr. Hurwitz, I watched your video very carefully, I am very pleased that many of my own preferences were shown in your presentation. Now, what do you think of the recording by István Kertész and the Vienna Philharmonic?
Kind regards.
It's good, but not great.
On the streaming services the Ormandy/London Symphony Orchestra recording the third movement is on mono. Is it in mono on the CD as well? I listened on headphones and could tell right away that it wasn't stereo.
I just listened to the Bernstein/NY Phil. recording. It is a great recording but I found the tempos to be too fast for my taste these days. It worked in the finale but sounded rushed elsewhere. It is just a matter of taste. I own several recordings of it with Szell, Ormandy and Kubelik/BPO being my favorites.
sorry, just one more obso. after listening to the nyp/bernstein recording, i listened to one by the cso under a shallnotbenamed conductor. i know you think the nyp/b. is the best, is that simply because of the brilliance of the musical performance and/or what dvorak might have wanted the 3rd to sound like? what sort of markings did he have on the 3rd movement score? thanks, dave
The score is readily available on IMSLP. Feel free to check it out yourself.
I forgot to mention: a nine from Dvorak that I really like is the one from Suitner with the Staatskappelle!
Have you heard it dear David?
Of course.
Could you do Bruckner 9? Pretty please? ;)
Eventually! What's the rush? By the time I get to it another 50 or 60 will have been released, with at least seven or eight new completions of the finale.
Just purchased Bernstein’s New World symphony recording mentioned in this review. Wow, how did I miss this back in the 60s and 70s? Bernstein was one of my go to conductors. I was too preoccupied with the Dvorak performed by the Czech born Szell and Kubelik. Shame on me.
Oswald Kabasta recording is not mentioned. This wrong in War 2 conductor made one of the most exciting recording of the work ever made.
No, he didn't. That's one of those silly cult pronouncements that the Kabasta lemmings have been parroting for years.
Whatever the reason, I've always liked the one Bohm did late in his career with the Vienna Phil. But, how can even choose!
Exactly...
I guarantee you that when Sony gets around to doing a complete Ormandy box, as they bloody well should, that that New World will NOT be in there. The major labels are so reliable in this regard that I'd bet my life on it.