Western Martial Artists Try Chinese Hook Swords!
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2024
- Start Learning Swordsmanship!
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The perfect sequel to Seki Sensei’s exploration of HEMA weapons.
Was just about to comment this. I hope they do more of it.
I love those things. There's a trick that if you can hook them in one motion you can do a deadly strike
8:15 THATS IT
Theyre so badass.
The thing where you hook the tips together and swing it almost like a chain, that's a real move for those. Also, the guard and the "pommel" are sharpened, so they're good for getting close and punching with the guard and icepicking with the pommel.
I'd like to see them messing around with that in a possible future video on them. It was really fun to watch though!
I'm a practitioner of Chinese Swordsmanship as well as a Hemaist, Hutougou(Tiger Head Hooks Shuang Gou means "Twin/Double Hooks") we most likely a performance weapons meant for actors and stage performers there is very little historical basis on them.
For the Martial assuming they were used, both on the battlefield and bandit (Late Qing Dynasty)raid they would have fought Dao(Chinese Saber) specify Niuwei and Yanling Dao, both specialized on the Cut instead of thrust so pairing it against a saber was pretty good for what it was meant for(Messers might have been closer though!)
Bro, I've been trying to find decent Chinese sword practitioners who actually spar like hema, do yall do videos? I'd love to see Chinese sword fighting in action!
@@ScottGrow117 I know one, and I really really hope she starts a Chinese swordsmanship class.
@@ScottGrow117 I have a video of me and my friend doing Jian and Scabbard vs Sword and Buckler, We were going lower intensity cause we were both tired. I could try to record a higher intensity fight today if you want czcams.com/video/Jpt_FFljBrM/video.html
@@ScottGrow117
czcams.com/video/Jpt_FFljBrM/video.html
this is of Jian and Scabbard vs Arming Sword and Buckler
Its low intensity cause we were both tired
@@ScottGrow117我是Hema爱好者，在中国我们有苗刀（tow hand sword of Ming dynasty)中国剑（Chinese sword)进行对抗练习，但是很遗憾这些武器的技术体系并没有很适合现代竞技体育
Sidenote about the chinese word ShuangGuo. It just means dual hook. You have hook in one hand and hook in other hand. Much hook.
Its pinyin is actually Shuang Gou 双钩，
S not Z fyi
@@shinjiikari1021 thanks, I'm shit at keeping track of those similar consonant sounds, I'll edit the comment
@@shinjiikari1021 thanks, I'm shit at keeping track of those similar consonant sounds, I'll edit the comment
@@AmazingMrMe123 no problem!
Bro didnt even set any traps, let alone do the right parry punish. Nuxia mains everywhere are crying 💀
i've seen people using the hook to extend the range of the weapon since the crescent is also sharp. But i've always wonder, what happens if it misses or gets blocked?
Now that has been answered. its DEATH
It's a hit or miss move, you either inflict damage or die
I have trained with these little bit before I am not expert of them by any means. And they require high skill but as far as I know about them. So if they blocked it will hopefully bounce back and you can catch if not you might loose the one of them yes. But there is a way of catching it and usually after the first 360 spin you catch them back. They very dangerous weapons for the user because how many extension blades on that weapon. They don’t recommend it for beginner students they usually practice by high level students or masters. I have cut myself so many times with training steel ones, fall and roll on the ground can’t even remember. Like I said I am or expert with them at all. A beginner if anything but.😊
@@VideoTRChannel thx for the info. Now i know
My understanding is that double hookswords were sometimes used by law enforcement (more swat team level not regular cop stuff) and different kind of Dao or saber was one of the most likely weapons to be facing.
I havent tested it out in sparting yet but in theory double hooks are supposed to be able to manage double sabers by tying up both of their weapons with one of yours and having the other free to attack.
Not really plausible against saber and buckler.
The spike at the bottom is really nice if your opponent is trying to get super close to you and helps protect the wrist against certain cuts.
One of the biggest issues with the hooks is they arent a good everyday carry because their is no way to sheath the damn things so you have to just carry in your hand or have an awkward box atrapped to your side kinda like a bowcase. They dont hold up to polearms or twohanders for war so they wind up being a veeery niche weapon. Very useful in their niche, but inherently niche.
There are also a bunch of different kinds. Some have a stabbing point and a smaller protrusion thats more picklike than hook like for example.
FINALLY, I have waited for you guys to try this weapon. Great video.
I work in a metal fab shop with a big laser cutter.
I could get a pair of these cut for you for about the cost of materials, in just about any thickness of sheet steel.
There'd be no edge at all and we can bevel the points so they can't poke anybody.
I'd charge about $50 plus materials plus shipping.
I really appreciate the offer, unfortunately without having them heat treated they wouldn't be sparring safe. But that would be a cool display piece 😁
@@SellswordArts oh yeah, that probably wouldn't work out then. We mostly work with A36 structural steel which is pretty low carbon. I'm not sure it would even take a heat treat
My top 5 favorite weapon from shadow fight 2, nostalgia hits hard
There is a similar European weapon. The Gunterrodt Sword-Axe.
Sadly there is only one trainer out there by Purpleheart and its proportioned wrong because they based it on an image of an angled one as though it was flat. But you can tell its wrong when you look at other images from Heinrich von Gunterrod fencing manual.
Ah... finally, the
*Halberd sword!*
@@BarsusDraco More Battle-Axe Sword.
There is no war in Ba Sing Se!
My exact thoughts lol
Oh wow, 6:30 in- DOPE. That would be game over/night night for sure.
I wonder how a hook sword would pair with a buckler. Especially the Gou-Rang hook buckler.
These are meant to control long weapons like spears and swords. Try to keep them in front of you to tangle with the hooks and guards and then close distance to punch using the sharpened guard more often. Also once you hook, twist it to “grasp” the opponent’s blade. You can also use the sharpened bottom of the hook swords ice pick style. We train these in Baguazhang.
Thanks for making a video about this! I think you didn't see my comment (and neither will see this one), but I asked you about your opinion on them, once you're an inspiration of mine for swordsmanship!
As a kung fu practitioner, you guys did pretty well with this. The hooks are meant to draw down the enemy's shield or weapon, while the other comes in for a strike. So yes, these weapons are meant to be used as a pair and not single.
Also, yes, the 2 hooks do come together to form it into a whip. While the curved blade on the hand guard slices open the opponent, the footwork for this Is similar to that has the praying mantis style. Also these ones were too short.
I've never seen anyone actually spar with hook swords. Only stage performances. They're really formidable weapons though even in the hands of someone untrained seemingly
I've played around with a pair of dummy hook swords and I'm pretty sure I'd have gutted myself with real ones.
When fighting a single weapon, with these it's worth it to try to attack the weapon. If you manage to get in a cross block, you can immediately step in while the other person tries to pull out their weapon, and strike with the crescent cross guard or dagger pommel.
The amount of hype I felt when this video dropped is immeasurable
I love that little jumping attack at 6:36. It looked like you were saying "respect my distance while I rearrange my feet."
I think it would be cool to make a set of swords that can be attached at their bases together to make one double-sided sword... One slicing sword and one as a dagger shaft for reach. It would be cool if someone made something like this and It had a quick release.
While I'm overall less experienced in HEMA than these two gentlemen, I've spent quite a lot of time sparring with hook swords Some of these bouts can be seen on my own channel.
Here are my takeaways:
-They're absolutely right about the saber playing to the strengths of the hooks. Cuts are much easier to deal with than thrusts, as they give you a bigger opening to bind. Against something like a rapier, conversely, the hook swords are extremely hard to use, do to the ease of disengaging with a rapier.
-The real star of the Hook Sword Show, IMHO, is not the hook; it's all that business by the crossguard, which make hook swords very very effective in a bind. The crescent is great for parrying and binding, and the dagger point is very effective once you've gotten into a bind. My typical strategy with the hook swords to wait for my opponent to cut, and try to use the opening to press into a bind where those shorter blades can be deployed.
-Conversely, grabbing with the hook often works to your opponent's advantage - because the hook is on the end of the sword, you end up putting the end of your lever against the middle of your opponent's, and they have more control over your weapon than you have over theirs.
-Where I have found the hook sneaky and useful is when your opponent is trying to escape the bind. If, for example I can get the middle part of he sword over my opponent's neck and shoulder, they're effectively trapped - if they press forward, they run into the crescent blade. If they retreat backward, they run into the hook.
-The lack of a thrusting point is a huge weakness. However, I've seen some variants which had thrusting points emerging from the hook, and that may have been the more common version in the hook swords' heyday of the late Qing dynasty.
That was a lot. Great video, and you guys have some of the most stylish jackets I've seen in HEMA.
I know of steel trainers that are relatively safe to train with, but they were custom made in China by "people who know people" in Beijing. Kind of hard to find. They weren't battlefield weapons - other weapons like the Dao, Miaodao, and Jian were more common . Like so much in Chinese martial arts most of their actual use is lost; only forms remain. Several wars over the last 130+ years notably the Opium Wars, the horrible Taiping Rebellion, Sino-French and Sino-Japanese wars, the Boxer Rebellion, Civil wars, the Japanese Occupation, mpre Civil war, and the decades-long suppression of Chinese martial arts by the Communists nearly wiped out the fighting martial arts in China. We are lucky to have as much left as we do.
The style of CMA I study has forms for these and other traditional weapons, but it's mostly for training attributes and body mechanics. When the system was developed firearms were common, so the weapons taught as weapons are primarily the walking stick, the staff, and knives. Swords existed but weren't a factor on the battlefield or everyday life by that point.
Id Like To See More Leg Sweeping. Really Fun To watch.
Next time you mess around, try those hook swords against spear & shield, or sword & shield. I would be particularly interested in how those hooks can engage a larger shield, and can they be used to create openings.
Bro I have been researching these because I am getting some and you post a video of it as soon as I need some information
I never used them, but I felt that you were under utilising two tactics:
Both ends are essentially hooks. Use them! Try to trap a blade with them, or manipulate the opponents body with them.
Whenever you have two short weapons and face a long weapon, seek the bind with one weapon and keep it until you can hit with the other.
Would love to see this again but with someone who really knows how to use the hook swords. I think that'd be interesting.
I'd love to see you using a Jian or a Dao:)
I'd actually kinda like to see them try out wind-fire wheels. More potential for silliness.
I think it would be cool to see you use Maori weaponry, like comparing the Maori staff (taiaha) to say a standard staff. As well as seeing how the footwork compares to western armed combat
What would happen if you used 2 smaller swords against the 2 hook swords?
My understanding is that's exactly what the hookswords were designed to beat, the two smaller swords would probably have a bad time.
Definitely worth playing with.
I don’t know about you but I believe the purpose of the 🪝 is hook opponent sword pull out the way hit with other sword. Perhaps you can try that next time
I love the Hook Swords. I think the only sword i love more is the Indian Urumi. Such a bad ass weapon.
I love these blades, I first saw them in avatar the last air bender. In regards of weapons to try I think polarm, or halberd.
I am SO EXITED FOR THIS
Butterly Swords or JIan. A ginunting or panabas would be awesome as well.
I'd love to see some traditional spear work, tube spear or gladius and full size shield but I 100% appreciate that only one of those things are swords lol
I'm curious to see how effective they would be against polearms. They might give you more advantages than a sword. Probably won't give you as many advantages as a shield or another polearm, but it would be interesting to see.
I would like to see you try a 3 section staff.
My chair fell on me when watching it broke
I remember a old video of a tournament fight between twin hooks and a katana user. It was an impressive showcase of the weapons and one of few examples where a spinning attack was used properly.
As a swordsmith, I could offer you to make either sharp or training version of them.
If you'd like to contact us at contact@sellswordarts.com We can talk more about this. It sounds interesting!
I think they said "yeah".
Just kidding, it was fun to watch you guys !
I am new to hema,but i do combat sport for sometime.
Why don't you guys move laterally? Like taking opponents side to get off from his power side?
Note: i never sparred in hema so i have no idea if its possible or not,i am just asking as it looks linear.
Forgive me if i sound rude,my first language is not English.
Our space doesn't allow it
@@SellswordArts thanks for the reply man
I'd love to see how you'd approach fighting with Indian katar/push-daggers. I don't know how easily you could get safe training versions, though.
I’d like to see longswords or other hema weapons also be in the olympics, because having just foil, épee and sabre feels a bit too limited for me.
It's too sporty. They don't like pure combat sports in the Olympics. Which is fine, the Olympics is corrupt and destroys whatever city they go to. Combat sports should do their own Olympics. It could be a purely martial competition, with mma, karate vs taekwondo, shaolin vs Krav Maga, all manner of armed combat from daggers to harnischfechten and everything in between, from any country. We could pit escrima against kungfu dao fighting and all kinds of combination fights. To hell with the Olympics.
fu tao are cool weapons! How about trying the yue ya chan!
I feel like these would be good ship-board weapons. Total speculation on my part, but I can see them being popular with pirates.
What technical requirements would you have for steel trainers - weight, bevel, steel, heat treatment if it's not mild steel, so on and so forth?
Have always wanted to see those in action!
Have you guys happen to have tried using the dual Kama yet? (I beleive thay is what the Dual small sythes are called)
1:23 you might be able to commission it from a blacksmith (yes blacksmiths still exist)
This is super interesting!
was the rounded end of the hook sword sharpened historically? if not maybe we shouldn't be counting the stabs? and i get that pommel strikes and hitting with the flat of a blade can be very practical but ehh you know.
I also like to think that these are what the designers based the key blades in kingdom of hearts on. they look really similar!!
Shotel next!
What a coincidence...
@@SellswordArts 🧙 🤣
I know it's usually whack but could dual wielding these be a place for one of them to be held in reverse grip?
The sharpened handguard allows you to "punch," defensively the sharpened pommel lets you get a strong forward shanking motion, the hook is stowed out of the way so it doesn't hook your other blade while still being able to be 'swung' out in an admittedly restrictive range. Do you lose too much with the second blade being shortened or is there anything there worth messing around with?
Can you react to the dual in 1948 hamlet
Try to use them as a samurai, or for quick cuts, I don't see a Chinese fighting head-on like that, the corners are more for grabbing and cutting, like a quick attack.
It’s weird but, I can see a lot of merit on these. If I’m looking at this correctly, it could be used like a reverse kopesh. Kinda like a sword with a small axe head. I’d modify the practice swords to have a rounded notch in both of the swords to see if they would work better for the swinging purposes. Cause that was really intimidating. Maybe if the hooked part had one sloping forward and one backward would make it easier to not hit with the flat of the blade 🤷♂️ Another question is how difficult would it be to try and lock you opponent’s blade between the hooked ends and use the spiked pommels to jab the face of your opponent or the bladed guards to slice the opponent’s wrist? The first time you accidentally locked the blades, it also made me think of the goofy Batleth from Star Trek.
Saber and dagger isn't a thing?
Is that just because you're thrusting less with a saber?
The way I've had it explained to me is because when Saber really started to get going, it was usually the side arm to a larger weapon or a gun, meaning most of the techniques were based on the context of having to draw it quickly. Drawing and using one weapon is a lot faster than two. Rapier and dagger doesnt have this problem because it was the main weapon and drawn before the fight/duel really got going. I might be wrong with this, because this is a retelling and is probably misremembered
@BibsideonStatue so it's because nobody invented the style and technique and not because dagger interferes with saber in some way?
Isn't this because saber is mostly cavalry weapon/sidearm? They were rather late to the game, footsoldiers would be using guns or something big enough to stop cavalry.
@@disparatedesperado9317 that's how I've had it explained to me. At my fencing club I've actually used a polish Saber and a parrying dagger against longsword and it worked well, except for the fact that my opponent was much better than me skill wise.
These look rad as hell.
Two things i would like to say First love the rules you guys have for your comments and second is what are your opinions are the blade weapons in monster hunter world like the twin swords and long sword even the great sword from monster hunter especially the twin swords since one of the two stances for fighting use reverse grip would love to know your opinion?
Myself and three other guys do weekly HEMA practices (informally, only one of us has any formal HEMA training, the rest of us have experience in other combat groups or just trained on our own), and one of them, Adam, has a pair of polypropylene hooked swords, which he is really good with; I have a video of him using them against Brock who was using a rapier. Brock, who has a few years of experience training in Italian Rapier, along with longsword and saber, was having a hard time using rapier against the hook-swords, but probably largely because of the intimidation factor, and Adam is quite intimidating with them. 😅
czcams.com/users/shortsEb9URfiW3Xg?feature=share
You can also see the full video at; czcams.com/video/UXC-K7FV510/video.html
Also, Brock was just wearing his HEMA jacket, pants, gloves, and mask that he usually wears, no additional rigid plates, and Adam's hooked-swords have a sharper point on the hooks compared to those you'll were using.
with its difficulty of stowage, I don’t really see a niche where you’d pick this over either a sword or a polearm. my guess is it’s a dueling novelty
I could see it being used for police work, where the goal is to disarm rather than to kill.
The pommels are sharpened and so are the hand guards, so I think for civilian defense there might be some use, since you can punch and do a lot of damage if you’re at close range?
@@beantownbanshees the two swords plus the hooks/sharpened handle would make them harder to stow tho
@@ReallyRealBenMills mebbe? it’s such close range that I feel like a mancatcher-type weapon would be the safer. plus the entire thing’s sharp
@@oscaranderson5719 I’m not familiar with how they were traditionally carried but I would assume it would make storing them in a more typical way difficult, yeah
Very good, very good.
Thumbnail has a typo "Westetn"
Thanks
For sharp hook swords, is the inside of the hook sharp?
In theory this would be the best sword design but would require an immense amount of training.
"All swords are sticks" ... While I'm over here thinking a longsword is very specifically not a stick, but perhaps a self-tasing snake... I'm at a weird point in my swordsman journey... but yeah, basically all swords are sticks.
try reverse grip in the next vid lmao
What is your height brother?? I am curious.
5’ 5”. (165.1 cm)
@@OttoRoesch28weird, I legitimately thought he was USA short (still a ways taller than me), but no, same height as me
Try some Filipino swords.
If you can’t find a real one, just make one
Westent?
I know these are Chinese, but I can never get over their absolute Kingdom Hearts energy xD Might have to buy myself a pair, maybe more.
I am 3 minutes into the video and there is a way to increase your reach with hook swords that you're not using.