Disagree, I like Ian at the monitor and RB swinging. Ian stops swinging to talk and it decreases the swings and data or lengthens the video. I think RB is better at the player / feel side and Ian is better talking through the technology and science (though it’s clear RB is knowledgeable as well).
After having been fit @ TXG with the Diamana TB 50 , Ive never looked back. My swing speed is in the 95 range and Im hitting my G425 Max 15 ish yards further and straighter ,, the 65 gram Ventus Blue was great but the lighter shaft seems to have given me back a little lost distance. Thanks guys ,, keep em coming !
I can absolutely tell you stokes gained was measurably improved when I added 10-15 yards to my tee balls early 2022 after a driver switch. Handicap started 2022 at 9.7 finished the year at 4.4. A massive improvement in anyone's books. No lessons, no additional rounds of golf or range work. Simply adding those yards transformed my scoring cuz iron misses were all closer to the greens as I had shorter irons in, which meant up and downs were easier. Well struck irons got closer to pins when my game was on. Goal for 2023 is handicap 2. I'm testing new drivers now as I'm still gaming the original Sim from 2021. Give me even 10 more yards and I will for sure hit 2 cap this year. Awesome channel guys!
I would love to watch them compare the stealth plus to C4. I watched crossfields test and I just don’t understand how they have the same ball speeds. Just uses the least optimized version of stealth lol
I’d like to see Crossfield get fit by Ian. Equipment manipulates player vs player manipulates equipment. It would really be one of those unstoppable force meets immovable object moments.
In fairness there are some people who are not shaft sensitive - they hit everything the same, I suspect Crossfield is one of those people. As TXG have said repeatedly over the years, the shaft is simply a timing device and the one thing that humans are very good at is reacting and adjusting when the timing feels slightly off. Give Ian a 100 shots with each driver and I suspect by the end the differences in the drivers would be minimal even if he had to adjust the settings of the head slightly to get what he wanted. I am lucky to have a club fitter near to me who is almost as good as TXG. I intend to go there for a new driver in the next 3 months. We will be experimenting with different weights and lengths. Should be interesting
Have you listened to the interview Matty and Ian did like a year and a half ago with Mark? He did say that shaft does matter but not to the extent that some people thinks it does in his opinion. So he isn’t fully shaft doesn’t matter but is more of a swing and strike are more important than the shaft. I agree with him on this point. A good strike with the “wrong” shaft will produce a better result than and bad strike with the “correct” shaft.
@@tylergrove7700 yea I agree with you but the shaft is a timing mechanism more then anything else. It’s something benefit your swing. The right shaft will help promote a better strike if fit correctly
I’ve also experienced a huge difference in my swing when it comes to shaft weight in irons - more so than Driver. Moving to heavier shafts have helped me better save and spend my power in the swing. It also changed my delivery from flippy to a much more ideal position with forward shaft lean. With a lighter shaft (which might be different for everyone), I simply can’t load and sequence my swing the same and end up using my arms
Very much had the same findings when switching to a stiffer and heavier shaft in my fairwaywood, while on occasion the lighter once would generate bombs the consistency just wasn't there - often becoming handsy and flip it to a hook. Heavier shafts allows me to synch the swing better, creating awareness where parts are, might loose a few yards on optimal hits but taking that every day if I'm just able to hit 1 more fairway each round.
For me, it was the opposite of you: went lighter on my irons (I'm +1/2"), and it resulted in no more flipping and a much more ideal impact position. Breathed new life into my irons. Amazing how one solution works for one person, and the opposite solution works for another. And this is the perfect example of why it's important for golfers to get fitted, and not base things solely on club/shaft reviews. I'll always see random people post "will this work for me?", and really the answer's always going to be "go get fitted by a good fitter and find out."
Crazy but I have gone to a 85 gram tour AD-BB in a ping G425 LST from a stock rogue 70x and it really changed for the better, took a noticeable amount of spin off mis hits, timing and loading of the shaft is far easier. I am 105mph on a good day and would encourage anyone to try different weighted shafts. I thought it was crazy to put what is a fairway wood weight shaft in a driver, but it works for me.
I would love to see you guys do a double-blind test, to see how a player & tester react to different weighted shafts. Personally, I always prefer if the fitter doesn't tell me anything about the weight/flex etc to ensure that I only react to what my hands are feeling in the swing.
Hi Ian & Ryan, Ian look no further Ryan is the perfect replacement for Matty, lovely clear analysis when reviewing, great 👍 interaction with you during chat, brings you back to the test perfectly, I was thinking of going Lighter with my Driver shaft after watching the Video you have both given me food for thought and won’t rush in to thinking lighter in better, Thanks Dickey
very interesting especially while i’m watching Willy Z add about 15 yards by going lighter and longer. if the mechanics are there it’s a tool to exploit but me personally i’ve found great success last season going into a heavy 70g TX profile and it keeps my drives on the planet a bit more. many ways to optimize especially when you guys are bringing great content to learn from
Videos like this are why I have enjoyed TXG for so long. Thanks guys! Oh and I’m in a 70g X shaft and use it because its so much more consistent than the 60g S I was using previously.
This literally just happened to me in a retro fit for my Ping G410 plus. I started off in a 55g shaft. While I got my longest carry with this shaft, I just couldn’t time it and my path got severely in to out. 7* at times 😱. Tbh I wasn’t swinging my best but gradually stepping up through the weights, I ended up in a 70g stiff flex. I was able to neutralised swing path and got dispersion down to 25 yards. I was just able to time the heavier shaft better, It just seemed to engage my muscle memory better. Just shows, Swing speed doesn’t define what weight shaft you should play. Get fitted, speak openly and honestly about your feels and misses, and through knowledge and the process of elimination you will find a combo for you. Watching your videos guys really helped me understand what I needed to achieve when I went into my fitting so cheers. Lastly to all the haters, focus on the content the channel has to offer. Matty is a big miss yes. But he made his choice and went off to explore new opportunities. Ian, Mikey and RB your doing a cracking job. 👍🏻
Yeah, I TOTALLY get the "Video Gamification" of the launch monitor when hitting on a screen.. When I've got fittings before on a launch monitor, I've asked the fitter to turn off the on-screen numbers for things like swing speed, ball speed, distance etc... It helps me stay out of my head if I can't even see the numbers while hitting..
Loved this test!!! Most of us spend a lot more time on the range testing on our own than we do with our fitters. My fitter at Club Champion mentioned that most people pay more attention to the numbers than they do what they are actually feeling which I found true during my fittings. Once I started really paying attention to what I was feeling instead of looking for the numbers (I wanted to see) I have no doubt that it made his job much easier. The fitting made a total 180 and we were able to dial my clubs in instead of chasing numbers and my game has drastically improved.
@@ianfrasergolf I agree 110%… that is very hard to do when (we as consumers) watch your vids daily and the numbers are such a focus. To be honest, I really didn’t even know that I was doing it, my fitter did though! Probably because I was hitting shots that were very “atypical” of my normal misses which ended up being slices, whereas my normal miss on the course is a pull hook. I had no idea why that was happening.
While most people chase distance with drivers, I have always been about the FiR's, so I have always liked a heavier shaft over a light one. Plus my swing gets wild with a sub-60g shaft. I think more golfers who swing a stiff shaft, probably should try slightly heavier shafts, ie upper-60's to mid-70's.
Zalatoris just went to a longer driver with a lighter shaft. Ian, I would love to see you mess with shaft length, shaft weight, grips, and head weight to optimize your driver over a series of videos. Fitting outside of the box where convention is considered but not necessarily followed.
One thing i took from this is the fact that a person starts using the bay as a video game and you start changing your swing for different results. Which in hindsite is likely quite natural. Is it perhaps almost better to do a fitting without the screen on for a fitter to get accurate data on a golfer's swing? It might give a more accurate depicting of a golfer's reaction to different equipment and settings. A fitter can always turn it on after coming to a decision on the best equipment fit so that the customer can see the results.
Would love to get fitted with you guys would be such a great experience. Had 2 fittings recently at American golf in uk . Just felt like they wanted the next customer through the door. Watching all your videos is really helping. Thanks.
My only comment is because Ian wasn't looking at the data between shots, they never addressed how low in the head nearly all the strikes were with the lighter shaft. As mentioned, it likely had less droop, and was a solid 10-15mm low, creating higher spin. Right at the end of the second group of shots, Ian hit a few at or above the centerline, and suddenly he had nice draws with sub 2,000rpm spin. Seems like a slightly higher tee position could have been used after a few shots.
I think a simple rule of thumb would be the player who is long but needs control can go with a heavier shaft and a person who has control but not as long can go lighter. Some pros like Bubba and DJ can add shaft and if it reduces their distance 5 yards but reduces their dispersion by 20yds, its a no brainer. Consistency is key.
Good stuff. I got fitted and ended up with an XXIO Prime. My driving was pretty accurate but not very long (with a 44.5 in. shaft). I went up to 46 in. with the Prime's ultra lightweight head and shaft and added 8 mph and ~20 yards with a tiny bit more dispersion. I think that once I start playing with it the dispersion difference will be gone.
I swing in the 100 mph range and at 53 years old still manage to get it out there around 275. My spin rate is 2800ish with a bit low launch coming off a 9 degree driver. I’m about to embark on a shaft fitting/head fitting journey to try to find a little less spin with a tad more launch. Wish me luck. Oh. Btw. Great video!
Just ordered new Callaway Max D with 45 gram Vanquish PL regular shaft after a 30 minute fitting. Ball speed was great along with spin. Didnt get a chance to evaluate dispersion. Im a little bit nervous and getting cold feet on the shaft 😂. 87mph swing speed.
Not hit a ball since I herniated a disc in my neck but this video is me. Fuji VP90 in woods and rescue. Straight all day long. Might lose a couple of mph but it's countered by centre hits.
Currently deciding between the 70 vs 80g Smoke Black RDX for the Stealth Plus. Searched your page to review your tests and can’t believe you posted this only today. You are the Golf Gods! Thank You!
@@mikaelc5539 I went for the 80g, my average SS was 119 on the day it made little difference to my swing speed it was down on average .3mph but It was improving my launch conditions and dispersion as a result. I've always gone with 70 in the past so it took me about 200 balls on trackman to reach that decision to give a bigger data range. I went smoke black rdx 6.5 tipped 1 inch playing standard length. Currently have Mavrik SZ Triple Diamond with a Hulk Shaft which I may put the TM adaptor on and play with to see how it compares but the green/red may look odd.
Great vid, nice test between light and heavy. Here's one for you guys, how much difference does lightweight grips (i.e. 25g) vs heavy grips (i.e. 56g) make in the golf swing?? hmmm...
I got fitted for TSi3 when it was released at a big box store in the UK. The more time went on the more I grew tired of hitting it. Just boring. A 60 gram 6.0 RDX black shaft was the fit. I got so fed up with it that I went to GolfClubs4Cash in Edinburgh, and just went through every TM driver they had (Used to own M5 and SIM), putting them down to see what one I liked at address, and as long as it had a stiff shaft and decent grip, all was well. I went over to the Trackman bay place across from it, and hit 14 shots with it. The guy at the big box store said my carry was av 270, and I was like, yeah no bother, nice way to sell a driver, but I was knocking this M3 out to 270. I was having such a ball with it, I couldn't believe it. It has a Speeder 757 Evo tour spec in it. I have no idea what that is, and it defo felt more stiff. Looked up the weight of it, and it's a whopping 78g. A whole 18g more than my RDX black. Now I'm second guessing myself, and wondering how this will go long term. I shouldn't have ever looked up the weight lol - But I could hear the strike, and I felt like it was more pure, more often, whereas my TSi3 tends to stray a bit.
I’m new to golf and wasn’t getting along with the driver that came in my package set. A friend gave me his driver with a shorter stiffer and heavier shaft to try out. The result was MUCH improved accuracy. Almost exactly what you got on the simulator. My slice is all but vanished and 9-10 shots are down the line.my friend isn’t getting his club back and for sure I’ll not be looking at distance when I try out new clubs. Dispersion all the way.
A very interesting and helpful video, boys! You said it, just as I was thinking about it... strokes gained is surely the criterion that most people should be looking for in a fitting, especially a driver fitting. I'm looking forward to see how you introduce and develop this idea in future videos. Now, I'm looking even more forward to my driver fitting with Alex mid- March.
Ian, I want to see the second shot from the little island in the middle of the trap when you pushed one of the last ones right! Let's go TXG, woohoo!!!
Your best drives with the lighter shaft was the first one after changing and conversely your worst ones with the heavy shaft were after the change. Goes to show how much you change after changing a shaft, which is why, on demo days, if they change a shaft on you, hit several shots with the new shaft to get the feeling of the previous shaft out of your mind, unless it feels completely wrong.
Great test. I just got a heavier shaft and extra head weights to test this out. My best results seem to be my 50x with an extra 6g. But I'm the 60x with an extra 3g is pretty consistent. We'll see if the 60x can eliminate the pull hooks.
Loving their work by this duo! Coming along nicely now not as dry as before and one dimensional with mike partnering Ian. RB really helping Ian to drive the conversation as an equal partner. For mind v relevant and insightful for me as I have a lighter and heavier driver shaft and I always revert back to the stock lighter shaft with a softer flex. My clubhead speed is no slouch either!
I started with a 65 x diamana ahina, i experimented n put an 85 x ahina in my driver . I felt like I was hitting more fairways, but i definitely noticed a 3-4 mph decrease in speed. I switched to a comfortable middle ground n put a 75x in the driver and tipped n put the 85x in my 3wood. I think ultimately whatever u choose, u will subconsciously change ur swing to accommodate that shaft/feel
Nice vibe during this session. The presentation was well executed and questions answered. Well done. I find heavier shafts suit my swing. Heavier with mid flex. Best driver setup was a 88 gram shaft in my driver and 95 gram in my 3 and 5 wood. I if fortunate enough would appreciate a fitting to try extremes to see what work best. May end up some place in the middle. My driver is D6, woods and hybrids D4/5. Irons D4, Wedges D6. All heads are a bit heavier because of added weights or lead tape.
After watching a few videos since Matt’s departure it must be said...your content has maintained great value. Ryan has been a seamless change to the channel and brings a good knowledge base but questionable shirt choices.
😂😂😂 RB often leaves early in the morning so he gets dressed in the dark!! 😉. In all seriousness I’m so proud of Ryan and Mike for stepping up to the plate. They had no idea this would be something they were asked to do so kudos to them.
Such a great test!! I am doing same kind of test at the moment. My gamer shaft is Ventus Black 6x and I love it but I still wanna test if there is still something better for me that gives me tighter dispersion and bit more ball speed. In my early test runs I have noticed the same as you did that lighter shaft usually makes wider dispersion and higher ball speed. Keep up the good work!!
@@mikkoimp1857 Have you determined where the 155 ball speed is coming from? Are you maximizing your swing speed? Where is your strike? How is your swing path?
@@ianporzondek4414 Yes I have and this shaft testing thing is just fun experiment here in wintery and cold Finland when all the courses are closed at the moment.
It's interesting, I was a ventus blue TR 6x guy, but my paradym triple diamond came with a 77 gram extra stiff kai'li white and it is amazing. It's very straight, still get good launch and I don't seem to have lost any distance on the golf course. Heavier can be better.
Would also love a video showing the difference between the same player using the same setup, but going from senior flex to x flex to show how much and if shaft flex matters
Great concept, when I saw the title I was hoping for some of the more popular tour shafts or regularly available stock shafts: Ventus Black/Blue: 50 vs 60 vs 70 Tensei 1K: 50 vs 60 vs 70 HZRDUS Black/Blue 60 vs 70 etc. Would you guys consider doing a video on that? Thanks for the content! I’m not a TPT shaft guy and haven’t had access to those at any fittings.
Thx for the video. You contradicted what you said in the intro - I would like to see a 100% blind test. There's bias when you know which club you're hitting.
@@jasonthomsen4495 then have an average golfer who can't tell the difference do the test. Better yet, use a robot with 100 shots each. If you're going to make judgments based on stats, then you have to have a controlled test. Otherwise, there's bias.
@@squareman10 I think you're missing the point of this video. None of us are robots... the TXG boys aren't saying either option is better. They're just showing how different shaft weights impact Ian's swing as an example of how this is just one more element to consider when building clubs for any of us.
Funny this should pop up. I recently bought an epic speed and it came with a black tie 75g shaft that I shouldn’t get 3 feet off the ground, I’ve got a handcrafted lz 6.0 60gram shaft that’s at 45.25 playing length so it’s considerably lighter than 60g now and that was meant to be destined for the epic speed head. But out of curiosity I hit the driver with the 75g back tie in and I could launch it well, so well in fact it’s a better launch than my fitted shaft which surprised me not sure on distances yet but seems like there’s not much in it . Accuracy was better and dispersion too. 🤷🏻♂️
Great content. Really enjoyed how you related the feel and dispersion to what would be beneficial “on the course”. Great demonstration of how the chase for distance and ball speed comes with a caveat (consistency). Looking forward to the “strokes gained” idea.
With a heavy shaft the centrifugal force is greater and forces a smoother, more consisternt swing. P.S. You need a taller tee to get contact up into the middle of the face. The total distance difference was only 2 yards with the heavier shaft hitting it farther.
Good test. I am trying an Xcaliber mystic 45 vs my DIamana 60 s limited. I tried an Autoflex last week buy my quick tempo didn't work and Xcaliber has a stiff tip section. Hit a few today at the range and they were flying
Interesting you’re trying the TPT shaft. Have not seen you review it in past. I tried the 1st gen TPT several years ago but my fitter dropped the line right after my order so he installed the Tensei shaft instead. He dropped them due to multiple shaft failures by PGA Tour players as well as 2 of his customers. Hopefully the current TPT have resolved those issues, they were great feeling shafts, very similar to the old Matrix Ozik’s.
Love the videos but would like to see a comparison of ventus 6, 7 and 8 on weight. I feel the difference is too great here and a decision between 60, 70, 80g on distance, dispersion, feel is going to be more interesting.
I’ve been waiting to see something like this. Awesome video. I’m curious if you could share what the swingweight as on each of these two builds? I see you guys published the static weight of each but I’m curious what the swingweight was as well.
One thing that really comes into play with a heavy driver is fatigue. Over the course of 18 holes…somewhere in the back nine that thing will start to feel like a lead weight.
Nonsense. Irons and wedges weigh significantly more than even the heaviest of drivers on the market. 20 extra grams is not going to make you any more fatigued on the 10 shots you hit a driver over the span of 5 hours.
@@kourt2469 You’ve never gotten worse as a round progressed? Every practice swing, every full shot, all of the walking? Not just the driver. Every club. The driver just being the most sensitive relatively speaking. Most golfers are lucky to play once a week if they have work and family. I imagine your average golfer would like a nap after a round of golf. Personally, going with lighter clubs throughout the bag has helped my game quite a bit. That said. I feel that you are probably right. I was just thinking that no matter how good I was with a heavy driver, that by the last three or four holes of a round, I would be working really hard to keep that club in line.
Those TPT shafts are not cheap. $380 a pop for driver shafts. But the technology they use sounds excellent. I took their online fitting. With my swing speed of 85 if I wanted a heavier shaft and high rather than low trajectory, they recommended a 17 Hi. This weighs 62 grams with 3.9 torque. Interestingly, that is very close to my own Graphite Design Tour AD-IZ 6 stiff shaft that weighs 63 grams with 3.2 torque. Also not cheap shafts but I was lucky and got mine from the pro shop when they changed the fitting cart for just $100. I also have the GD Tour AD-IZ 5 R-1 shaft that weighs 54 grams with 4.5 torque. Supposedly the regular flex lighter shaft is what someone at my age with my swing speed should be using. I have been switching back and forth in PGA Superstore practice bays to check the data. But I think I prefer the heavier shaft and with everything set on standard have fewer shots to the right with it.
Definitely the heavier shaft in my irons tightened my grouping. It’s something a person at a golf store may not tell you because they are trying to fit you into something that may not suit your game.
@ Ian - let’s revisit Autoflex again. That is an alien shaft that is still a mystery. Would love you to test again and would appreciate your insight. Thinking of fitting into it but am on the fence. Cheers 👍💪✊🙏💯☝️🙌
I'd been playing a Aldila NV Rip'd 65 3.8 S. Fairly straight 90mph SS Tried lighter shafts & reg flex lost accuracy. Picked up what was sold as an Aldila Tour Green 65S which turned out to be a TS with 3.5 Midsize grip & D0 sw. (NV was D4) I thought it would be too stiff & nearly returned it. Amazingly I hit it very straight no loss of distance and out of the middle 9/10. The lamkin midsize grip is 62g 10g heavier than my normal grip. Could the heavier grip but lower swing weight hit the sweet spot for me?
How does the torque of the shaft fit into the equation? I believe that feature should also be explored if you want to square a clubhead at impact.....along with the weight of the shaft!
Great to use heavier shafts, Ian when are you going to expand this out to the fairway woods? Also would be interested if you could add length to offset some of the speed loss. Just remember the fatigue trade off if you carry. running 46in AV raw orange 78g mini driver playing at E1 and its a comfortable fairway finder.
Interesting. Just replaced my 40 gram driver shaft with a 70 gram shaft - both Senior flex. I actually hit the 70 gram further and straighter. The trajectory is lower on the 70 gram, but no big hooks or slices. Swing speed is 80-85.
Great video! Interesting to see that the strike location hadn’t deviated much from one shaft to the other. I’d be curious to see what the effects of total weight vs swing weight had on the swing dynamics. For instance; taking a shaft that you typically use, adding counterweights to trick the swingweight scale but increasing the total weight.
I have a Drago 45 in my 4W (my #2 club after D) and I feel like it's less of a consistent path, but man when you make contact it screams down the fairway. Sometimes it's longer than my driver.
Please keep this setup of RB at the monitor and Ian hitting the shots. Post-Matt, this is your best setup. Looking forward to more video like this!
Would love Mikey at the monitor with RB too
Agreed! Can’t stand Mikey.
Disagree, I like Ian at the monitor and RB swinging. Ian stops swinging to talk and it decreases the swings and data or lengthens the video. I think RB is better at the player / feel side and Ian is better talking through the technology and science (though it’s clear RB is knowledgeable as well).
Let’s just get Matt back so these videos are watchable again 😢
Would love to see a 60x vs 70s or something similar to see what the benefits of each might be!
This is the kind of test / video that puts TXG on a different level! Good job boys! 👍
This is txg, the roots and why we love this channel. More of this!
More of this coming, these are the videos we love to do.
After having been fit @ TXG with the Diamana TB 50 , Ive never looked back. My swing speed is in the 95 range and Im hitting my G425 Max 15 ish yards further and straighter ,, the 65 gram Ventus Blue was great but the lighter shaft seems to have given me back a little lost distance. Thanks guys ,, keep em coming !
Great to hear Brad!! 👍🏻
I can absolutely tell you stokes gained was measurably improved when I added 10-15 yards to my tee balls early 2022 after a driver switch. Handicap started 2022 at 9.7 finished the year at 4.4. A massive improvement in anyone's books. No lessons, no additional rounds of golf or range work. Simply adding those yards transformed my scoring cuz iron misses were all closer to the greens as I had shorter irons in, which meant up and downs were easier. Well struck irons got closer to pins when my game was on. Goal for 2023 is handicap 2. I'm testing new drivers now as I'm still gaming the original Sim from 2021. Give me even 10 more yards and I will for sure hit 2 cap this year. Awesome channel guys!
Another great video. This is why I like TXG. Let’s test and look at data…stark contrast from Crossfields “the shaft doesn’t matter” take.
I would love to watch them compare the stealth plus to C4. I watched crossfields test and I just don’t understand how they have the same ball speeds. Just uses the least optimized version of stealth lol
I’d like to see Crossfield get fit by Ian. Equipment manipulates player vs player manipulates equipment. It would really be one of those unstoppable force meets immovable object moments.
In fairness there are some people who are not shaft sensitive - they hit everything the same, I suspect Crossfield is one of those people. As TXG have said repeatedly over the years, the shaft is simply a timing device and the one thing that humans are very good at is reacting and adjusting when the timing feels slightly off. Give Ian a 100 shots with each driver and I suspect by the end the differences in the drivers would be minimal even if he had to adjust the settings of the head slightly to get what he wanted.
I am lucky to have a club fitter near to me who is almost as good as TXG. I intend to go there for a new driver in the next 3 months. We will be experimenting with different weights and lengths. Should be interesting
Have you listened to the interview Matty and Ian did like a year and a half ago with Mark? He did say that shaft does matter but not to the extent that some people thinks it does in his opinion. So he isn’t fully shaft doesn’t matter but is more of a swing and strike are more important than the shaft. I agree with him on this point. A good strike with the “wrong” shaft will produce a better result than and bad strike with the “correct” shaft.
@@tylergrove7700 yea I agree with you but the shaft is a timing mechanism more then anything else. It’s something benefit your swing. The right shaft will help promote a better strike if fit correctly
I’ve also experienced a huge difference in my swing when it comes to shaft weight in irons - more so than Driver.
Moving to heavier shafts have helped me better save and spend my power in the swing. It also changed my delivery from flippy to a much more ideal position with forward shaft lean.
With a lighter shaft (which might be different for everyone), I simply can’t load and sequence my swing the same and end up using my arms
Very much had the same findings when switching to a stiffer and heavier shaft in my fairwaywood, while on occasion the lighter once would generate bombs the consistency just wasn't there - often becoming handsy and flip it to a hook. Heavier shafts allows me to synch the swing better, creating awareness where parts are, might loose a few yards on optimal hits but taking that every day if I'm just able to hit 1 more fairway each round.
For me, it was the opposite of you: went lighter on my irons (I'm +1/2"), and it resulted in no more flipping and a much more ideal impact position. Breathed new life into my irons. Amazing how one solution works for one person, and the opposite solution works for another.
And this is the perfect example of why it's important for golfers to get fitted, and not base things solely on club/shaft reviews. I'll always see random people post "will this work for me?", and really the answer's always going to be "go get fitted by a good fitter and find out."
Crazy but I have gone to a 85 gram tour AD-BB in a ping G425 LST from a stock rogue 70x and it really changed for the better, took a noticeable amount of spin off mis hits, timing and loading of the shaft is far easier. I am 105mph on a good day and would encourage anyone to try different weighted shafts. I thought it was crazy to put what is a fairway wood weight shaft in a driver, but it works for me.
@@vivianoldfield9914 Wild. Different strokes for different folks for sure!
Same for me, lighter shafts gave the odd great shot, but dispersion and timing were lost. I like to feel the weight swinging
The commentary and discussion back and forth from a technical perspective is just so, so, soooo much better now. This was awesome
I would love to see you guys do a double-blind test, to see how a player & tester react to different weighted shafts. Personally, I always prefer if the fitter doesn't tell me anything about the weight/flex etc to ensure that I only react to what my hands are feeling in the swing.
Hi Ian & Ryan, Ian look no further Ryan is the perfect replacement for Matty, lovely clear analysis when reviewing, great 👍 interaction with you during chat, brings you back to the test perfectly, I was thinking of going Lighter with my Driver shaft after watching the Video you have both given me food for thought and won’t rush in to thinking lighter in better, Thanks Dickey
Literally searching driver shafts by weight right now. Great timing
very interesting especially while i’m watching Willy Z add about 15 yards by going lighter and longer. if the mechanics are there it’s a tool to exploit but me personally i’ve found great success last season going into a heavy 70g TX profile and it keeps my drives on the planet a bit more. many ways to optimize especially when you guys are bringing great content to learn from
I like the rotation of Mike,Rb, Ian swinging- getting different speed perspectives
Videos like this are why I have enjoyed TXG for so long. Thanks guys! Oh and I’m in a 70g X shaft and use it because its so much more consistent than the 60g S I was using previously.
I am gaming Tensi 1K in my STZ @ 44 inches tipped 3\4 to allow for the extra weight in the head , to bring the swing weight to D-2 It's a bomber
The break down of why things happen or what is happening dynamically is why your channel has the best content
Thanks Eric!! 👍🏻
Lol "still a good line to the green from there". Can say that to a customer, maybe no to your boss. Love it RB.
😂😂 RB is a company man!!
This literally just happened to me in a retro fit for my Ping G410 plus. I started off in a 55g shaft. While I got my longest carry with this shaft, I just couldn’t time it and my path got severely in to out. 7* at times 😱. Tbh I wasn’t swinging my best but gradually stepping up through the weights, I ended up in a 70g stiff flex. I was able to neutralised swing path and got dispersion down to 25 yards. I was just able to time the heavier shaft better, It just seemed to engage my muscle memory better. Just shows, Swing speed doesn’t define what weight shaft you should play. Get fitted, speak openly and honestly about your feels and misses, and through knowledge and the process of elimination you will find a combo for you.
Watching your videos guys really helped me understand what I needed to achieve when I went into my fitting so cheers.
Lastly to all the haters, focus on the content the channel has to offer. Matty is a big miss yes. But he made his choice and went off to explore new opportunities.
Ian, Mikey and RB your doing a cracking job. 👍🏻
Yeah, I TOTALLY get the "Video Gamification" of the launch monitor when hitting on a screen.. When I've got fittings before on a launch monitor, I've asked the fitter to turn off the on-screen numbers for things like swing speed, ball speed, distance etc... It helps me stay out of my head if I can't even see the numbers while hitting..
Loved this test!!! Most of us spend a lot more time on the range testing on our own than we do with our fitters. My fitter at Club Champion mentioned that most people pay more attention to the numbers than they do what they are actually feeling which I found true during my fittings. Once I started really paying attention to what I was feeling instead of looking for the numbers (I wanted to see) I have no doubt that it made his job much easier. The fitting made a total 180 and we were able to dial my clubs in instead of chasing numbers and my game has drastically improved.
Great to hear Brian!! Great advice to pay attention to what you feel and not the numbers, that’s the fitters job.
@@ianfrasergolf I agree 110%… that is very hard to do when (we as consumers) watch your vids daily and the numbers are such a focus. To be honest, I really didn’t even know that I was doing it, my fitter did though! Probably because I was hitting shots that were very “atypical” of my normal misses which ended up being slices, whereas my normal miss on the course is a pull hook. I had no idea why that was happening.
While most people chase distance with drivers, I have always been about the FiR's, so I have always liked a heavier shaft over a light one. Plus my swing gets wild with a sub-60g shaft. I think more golfers who swing a stiff shaft, probably should try slightly heavier shafts, ie upper-60's to mid-70's.
Zalatoris just went to a longer driver with a lighter shaft. Ian, I would love to see you mess with shaft length, shaft weight, grips, and head weight to optimize your driver over a series of videos. Fitting outside of the box where convention is considered but not necessarily followed.
We filmed a ton of videos with me doing that last year Thomas. Head back to around Feb March last year and you’ll see plenty.
One thing i took from this is the fact that a person starts using the bay as a video game and you start changing your swing for different results. Which in hindsite is likely quite natural. Is it perhaps almost better to do a fitting without the screen on for a fitter to get accurate data on a golfer's swing? It might give a more accurate depicting of a golfer's reaction to different equipment and settings. A fitter can always turn it on after coming to a decision on the best equipment fit so that the customer can see the results.
Makes sense!
Content is getting better and better.. I love the start in end sound effects
Would love to get fitted with you guys would be such a great experience. Had 2 fittings recently at American golf in uk . Just felt like they wanted the next customer through the door. Watching all your videos is really helping. Thanks.
My only comment is because Ian wasn't looking at the data between shots, they never addressed how low in the head nearly all the strikes were with the lighter shaft. As mentioned, it likely had less droop, and was a solid 10-15mm low, creating higher spin. Right at the end of the second group of shots, Ian hit a few at or above the centerline, and suddenly he had nice draws with sub 2,000rpm spin. Seems like a slightly higher tee position could have been used after a few shots.
Spoken like a true student of the TXG channel! I like it.
I think a simple rule of thumb would be the player who is long but needs control can go with a heavier shaft and a person who has control but not as long can go lighter. Some pros like Bubba and DJ can add shaft and if it reduces their distance 5 yards but reduces their dispersion by 20yds, its a no brainer. Consistency is key.
Loving the content these days. Keep it coming
Thank you!! 🙏🏻
Good stuff. I got fitted and ended up with an XXIO Prime. My driving was pretty accurate but not very long (with a 44.5 in. shaft). I went up to 46 in. with the Prime's ultra lightweight head and shaft and added 8 mph and ~20 yards with a tiny bit more dispersion. I think that once I start playing with it the dispersion difference will be gone.
Could maybe even cut it down if you're not getting on with it and try finding that sweet spot of accuracy and distance?
I swing in the 100 mph range and at 53 years old still manage to get it out there around 275. My spin rate is 2800ish with a bit low launch coming off a 9 degree driver. I’m about to embark on a shaft fitting/head fitting journey to try to find a little less spin with a tad more launch. Wish me luck. Oh. Btw. Great video!
What did you get, how was it?
Great test, I look forward to seeing how the lower swing speed is affected by the shaft.
Agreed. Ian has probably fits a heavy profile.
great review. This answers the question, what a whimpier shaft does for: more length, more dispersion.
Just ordered new Callaway Max D with 45 gram Vanquish PL regular shaft after a 30 minute fitting. Ball speed was great along with spin. Didnt get a chance to evaluate dispersion. Im a little bit nervous and getting cold feet on the shaft 😂. 87mph swing speed.
Would love to see a demo using a counterbalance weight inserted in the shaft and compare results with the same shaft minus counterbalancing.
🤯 Every video has such great info! Love the detail breakdowns we've been having
Peak TXG here.
Lighter flex creates can help the path come from the inside?
Cool!
Not hit a ball since I herniated a disc in my neck but this video is me. Fuji VP90 in woods and rescue. Straight all day long. Might lose a couple of mph but it's countered by centre hits.
This says a lot for the shaft manufactures and their consistency! They are doing a really good job to help out all speed golfers.
Currently deciding between the 70 vs 80g Smoke Black RDX for the Stealth Plus. Searched your page to review your tests and can’t believe you posted this only today. You are the Golf Gods! Thank You!
👊🏻
What did you decide on - 70 or 80? I'm looking at the same scenario, RDX black in a Rad Speed XB in 6.5 or TX flex. 110-115 swing speed.
@@mikaelc5539 I went for the 80g, my average SS was 119 on the day it made little difference to my swing speed it was down on average .3mph but It was improving my launch conditions and dispersion as a result. I've always gone with 70 in the past so it took me about 200 balls on trackman to reach that decision to give a bigger data range. I went smoke black rdx 6.5 tipped 1 inch playing standard length. Currently have Mavrik SZ Triple Diamond with a Hulk Shaft which I may put the TM adaptor on and play with to see how it compares but the green/red may look odd.
Great vid, nice test between light and heavy. Here's one for you guys, how much difference does lightweight grips (i.e. 25g) vs heavy grips (i.e. 56g) make in the golf swing?? hmmm...
I got fitted for TSi3 when it was released at a big box store in the UK. The more time went on the more I grew tired of hitting it. Just boring. A 60 gram 6.0 RDX black shaft was the fit. I got so fed up with it that I went to GolfClubs4Cash in Edinburgh, and just went through every TM driver they had (Used to own M5 and SIM), putting them down to see what one I liked at address, and as long as it had a stiff shaft and decent grip, all was well. I went over to the Trackman bay place across from it, and hit 14 shots with it. The guy at the big box store said my carry was av 270, and I was like, yeah no bother, nice way to sell a driver, but I was knocking this M3 out to 270. I was having such a ball with it, I couldn't believe it. It has a Speeder 757 Evo tour spec in it. I have no idea what that is, and it defo felt more stiff. Looked up the weight of it, and it's a whopping 78g. A whole 18g more than my RDX black. Now I'm second guessing myself, and wondering how this will go long term. I shouldn't have ever looked up the weight lol - But I could hear the strike, and I felt like it was more pure, more often, whereas my TSi3 tends to stray a bit.
I’m new to golf and wasn’t getting along with the driver that came in my package set. A friend gave me his driver with a shorter stiffer and heavier shaft to try out. The result was MUCH improved accuracy. Almost exactly what you got on the simulator. My slice is all but vanished and 9-10 shots are down the line.my friend isn’t getting his club back and for sure I’ll not be looking at distance when I try out new clubs. Dispersion all the way.
"I'd never know I was using an 86g shaft if you'd not told me", said Ian as he stood there winded after making only the first few swings.
:)
🥵🥵😂
A very interesting and helpful video, boys!
You said it, just as I was thinking about it... strokes gained is surely the criterion that most people should be looking for in a fitting, especially a driver fitting.
I'm looking forward to see how you introduce and develop this idea in future videos.
Now, I'm looking even more forward to my driver fitting with Alex mid- March.
Ian, I want to see the second shot from the little island in the middle of the trap when you pushed one of the last ones right! Let's go TXG, woohoo!!!
Your best drives with the lighter shaft was the first one after changing and conversely your worst ones with the heavy shaft were after the change. Goes to show how much you change after changing a shaft, which is why, on demo days, if they change a shaft on you, hit several shots with the new shaft to get the feeling of the previous shaft out of your mind, unless it feels completely wrong.
Great test. I just got a heavier shaft and extra head weights to test this out. My best results seem to be my 50x with an extra 6g. But I'm the 60x with an extra 3g is pretty consistent. We'll see if the 60x can eliminate the pull hooks.
That is such a great swing - wish I could have that beautiful temp and power combination
Loving their work by this duo! Coming along nicely now not as dry as before and one dimensional with mike partnering Ian. RB really helping Ian to drive the conversation as an equal partner. For mind v relevant and insightful for me as I have a lighter and heavier driver shaft and I always revert back to the stock lighter shaft with a softer flex. My clubhead speed is no slouch either!
You guys put out the best breakdowns
I started with a 65 x diamana ahina, i experimented n put an 85 x ahina in my driver . I felt like I was hitting more fairways, but i definitely noticed a 3-4 mph decrease in speed. I switched to a comfortable middle ground n put a 75x in the driver and tipped n put the 85x in my 3wood. I think ultimately whatever u choose, u will subconsciously change ur swing to accommodate that shaft/feel
Nice vibe during this session. The presentation was well executed and questions answered. Well done. I find heavier shafts suit my swing. Heavier with mid flex. Best driver setup was a 88 gram shaft in my driver and 95 gram in my 3 and 5 wood. I if fortunate enough would appreciate a fitting to try extremes to see what work best. May end up some place in the middle. My driver is D6, woods and hybrids D4/5. Irons D4, Wedges D6. All heads are a bit heavier because of added weights or lead tape.
After watching a few videos since Matt’s departure it must be said...your content has maintained great value. Ryan has been a seamless change to the channel and brings a good knowledge base but questionable shirt choices.
😂😂😂 RB often leaves early in the morning so he gets dressed in the dark!! 😉. In all seriousness I’m so proud of Ryan and Mike for stepping up to the plate. They had no idea this would be something they were asked to do so kudos to them.
@@ianfrasergolf You got to get him some Galvin Green so he fits in haha!
Did I miss something? Is matty boy gone for good?
@@BombproofCraftsman Yes, he left with the Club Champion acquisition. He has his only channel Matt Blois Golf and a similar IG.
Would love a video explaining swing weight in depth. I think plenty of golfers don’t really understand and don’t know what it might influence
they have already done it
Such a great test!! I am doing same kind of test at the moment. My gamer shaft is Ventus Black 6x and I love it but I still wanna test if there is still something better for me that gives me tighter dispersion and bit more ball speed. In my early test runs I have noticed the same as you did that lighter shaft usually makes wider dispersion and higher ball speed. Keep up the good work!!
Do you not have tight dispersion with the Ventus Black? What is your ball speed?
@@ianporzondek4414 Yea I have and I am pretty sure that I am not gonna change away from Ventus. Ball speed is atm +155mph.
@@mikkoimp1857 Have you determined where the 155 ball speed is coming from? Are you maximizing your swing speed? Where is your strike? How is your swing path?
@@ianporzondek4414 Yes I have and this shaft testing thing is just fun experiment here in wintery and cold Finland when all the courses are closed at the moment.
Mind bending details makes my day… Thank you
…bring on the 430 please
Miayazki c Kua 43gram light weight shafts still works for my cleveland launcher driver and fairway woods
Great video. I've been wondering about this exact thing as my driver shaft is pretty heavy (80g)
PS, great job R.B.!! I think we're really going to enjoy your insights in the TXG content, Awesome!
SG would be huge in the fitting process
Great way to start the weekend!
👊🏻
It's interesting, I was a ventus blue TR 6x guy, but my paradym triple diamond came with a 77 gram extra stiff kai'li white and it is amazing. It's very straight, still get good launch and I don't seem to have lost any distance on the golf course. Heavier can be better.
Would also love a video showing the difference between the same player using the same setup, but going from senior flex to x flex to show how much and if shaft flex matters
This is really interesting, and is really helpful with golfers looking to maximise distance.
Great concept, when I saw the title I was hoping for some of the more popular tour shafts or regularly available stock shafts:
Ventus Black/Blue: 50 vs 60 vs 70
Tensei 1K: 50 vs 60 vs 70
HZRDUS Black/Blue 60 vs 70 etc.
Would you guys consider doing a video on that? Thanks for the content! I’m not a TPT shaft guy and haven’t had access to those at any fittings.
Fascinating stuff! Lots of great food for thought packed in this one. Thank!
Thx for the video. You contradicted what you said in the intro - I would like to see a 100% blind test. There's bias when you know which club you're hitting.
The heavy one was 42g heavier. He'd feel the difference as soon as he picked it up.
@@jasonthomsen4495 then have an average golfer who can't tell the difference do the test. Better yet, use a robot with 100 shots each. If you're going to make judgments based on stats, then you have to have a controlled test. Otherwise, there's bias.
@@squareman10 I think you're missing the point of this video. None of us are robots... the TXG boys aren't saying either option is better. They're just showing how different shaft weights impact Ian's swing as an example of how this is just one more element to consider when building clubs for any of us.
Interesting results, but I think it also shows what has been stated in the past about the shaft being a timing device.
Loving the amount of content guys, please keep it up!
Funny this should pop up. I recently bought an epic speed and it came with a black tie 75g shaft that I shouldn’t get 3 feet off the ground, I’ve got a handcrafted lz 6.0 60gram shaft that’s at 45.25 playing length so it’s considerably lighter than 60g now and that was meant to be destined for the epic speed head. But out of curiosity I hit the driver with the 75g back tie in and I could launch it well, so well in fact it’s a better launch than my fitted shaft which surprised me not sure on distances yet but seems like there’s not much in it . Accuracy was better and dispersion too. 🤷🏻♂️
Great content. Really enjoyed how you related the feel and dispersion to what would be beneficial “on the course”. Great demonstration of how the chase for distance and ball speed comes with a caveat (consistency). Looking forward to the “strokes gained” idea.
Strokes gained will be interesting as well with the old vs. new. Great idea
With a heavy shaft the centrifugal force is greater and forces a smoother, more consisternt swing. P.S. You need a taller tee to get contact up into the middle of the face. The total distance difference was only 2 yards with the heavier shaft hitting it farther.
Would like to see a light and heavy shaft that are the same cpm (flex) that would be a better test to isolate just weight.
Yes
Good test. I am trying an Xcaliber mystic 45 vs my DIamana 60 s limited. I tried an Autoflex last week buy my quick tempo didn't work and Xcaliber has a stiff tip section. Hit a few today at the range and they were flying
Interesting you’re trying the TPT shaft. Have not seen you review it in past. I tried the 1st gen TPT several years ago but my fitter dropped the line right after my order so he installed the Tensei shaft instead. He dropped them due to multiple shaft failures by PGA Tour players as well as 2 of his customers. Hopefully the current TPT have resolved those issues, they were great feeling shafts, very similar to the old Matrix Ozik’s.
Love the videos but would like to see a comparison of ventus 6, 7 and 8 on weight. I feel the difference is too great here and a decision between 60, 70, 80g on distance, dispersion, feel is going to be more interesting.
I’ve been waiting to see something like this. Awesome video. I’m curious if you could share what the swingweight as on each of these two builds?
I see you guys published the static weight of each but I’m curious what the swingweight was as well.
One thing that really comes into play with a heavy driver is fatigue. Over the course of 18 holes…somewhere in the back nine that thing will start to feel like a lead weight.
Depends on how strong the player is.
Nonsense. Irons and wedges weigh significantly more than even the heaviest of drivers on the market. 20 extra grams is not going to make you any more fatigued on the 10 shots you hit a driver over the span of 5 hours.
@@kourt2469 Good point.
@@kourt2469 You’ve never gotten worse as a round progressed? Every practice swing, every full shot, all of the walking? Not just the driver. Every club. The driver just being the most sensitive relatively speaking.
Most golfers are lucky to play once a week if they have work and family.
I imagine your average golfer would like a nap after a round of golf.
Personally, going with lighter clubs throughout the bag has helped my game quite a bit.
That said. I feel that you are probably right.
I was just thinking that no matter how good I was with a heavy driver, that by the last three or four holes of a round, I would be working really hard to keep that club in line.
Those TPT shafts are not cheap. $380 a pop for driver shafts. But the technology they use sounds excellent. I took their online fitting. With my swing speed of 85 if I wanted a heavier shaft and high rather than low trajectory, they recommended a 17 Hi. This weighs 62 grams with 3.9 torque. Interestingly, that is very close to my own Graphite Design Tour AD-IZ 6 stiff shaft that weighs 63 grams with 3.2 torque. Also not cheap shafts but I was lucky and got mine from the pro shop when they changed the fitting cart for just $100. I also have the GD Tour AD-IZ 5 R-1 shaft that weighs 54 grams with 4.5 torque. Supposedly the regular flex lighter shaft is what someone at my age with my swing speed should be using. I have been switching back and forth in PGA Superstore practice bays to check the data. But I think I prefer the heavier shaft and with everything set on standard have fewer shots to the right with it.
Great video, would love to see a similar video but for irons shafts..
I switched to a much lighter shaft and it pretty much fixed my hook. Hitting it a lot farther too. My swing speed is around 100 mph
I run the OG SIM with HZRDUS Shaft.. It's like hitting a 2-iron blade.
"trees are 90% air" what I always tell myself lolol
Definitely the heavier shaft in my irons tightened my grouping. It’s something a person at a golf store may not tell you because they are trying to fit you into something that may not suit your game.
Just cranking out the good content!!
Nice job on this video guys.
Ian you will find it tough with a heavy shaft in a hot humid weather !
@ Ian - let’s revisit Autoflex again.
That is an alien shaft that is still a mystery. Would love you to test again and would appreciate your insight. Thinking of fitting into it but am on the fence. Cheers 👍💪✊🙏💯☝️🙌
I'd been playing a Aldila NV Rip'd 65 3.8 S. Fairly straight 90mph SS
Tried lighter shafts & reg flex lost accuracy.
Picked up what was sold as an Aldila Tour Green 65S which turned out to be a TS with 3.5 Midsize grip & D0 sw. (NV was D4)
I thought it would be too stiff & nearly returned it.
Amazingly I hit it very straight no loss of distance and out of the middle 9/10.
The lamkin midsize grip is 62g 10g heavier than my normal grip.
Could the heavier grip but lower swing weight hit the sweet spot for me?
If I am fitting Ian, my next step would be to have him hit a 72-76 gram shaft with a similar profile to that TPT 14 LO shaft.
How does the torque of the shaft fit into the equation? I believe that feature should also be explored if you want to square a clubhead at impact.....along with the weight of the shaft!
If your going to comepair light verses heavy shafts make the torque the same. 50g stiff shaft is not wippy'
@@stuartanderson2528 Stuart, my point was made to illustrate the influence of torque on any shaft.
Great to use heavier shafts, Ian when are you going to expand this out to the fairway woods? Also would be interested if you could add length to offset some of the speed loss. Just remember the fatigue trade off if you carry. running 46in AV raw orange 78g mini driver playing at E1 and its a comfortable fairway finder.
Interesting. Just replaced my 40 gram driver shaft with a 70 gram shaft - both Senior flex. I actually hit the 70 gram further and straighter. The trajectory is lower on the 70 gram, but no big hooks or slices. Swing speed is 80-85.
I would love to have a proper fitting. Would be interested to see how a club fitting can impact a mid handicapper like myself….
Great video! Interesting to see that the strike location hadn’t deviated much from one shaft to the other.
I’d be curious to see what the effects of total weight vs swing weight had on the swing dynamics. For instance; taking a shaft that you typically use, adding counterweights to trick the swingweight scale but increasing the total weight.
I have a Drago 45 in my 4W (my #2 club after D) and I feel like it's less of a consistent path, but man when you make contact it screams down the fairway. Sometimes it's longer than my driver.
Ian, why not game that exact config? Great Drives! Great video gentlemen!