đž $4,000 Down The Drain! DON'T Do This Epic Fail!
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 26. 11. 2022
- Taryl came across a pretty simple yet costly issue regarding these specific Kohler engines. Something to lookout for that could cost you upwards of $4,000 if you don't install this simple part properly. So check it out for all the know-how regarding what to look for when dealing with this expensive $4,000 engine!
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i know the reason for the long piece of wire further is an anti clogged valve if the filter is too dirty further oil allows there is in the filter a valve if your filter gets clogged hate the valve open and there is further lubricated das den reason but a shorter filter is asking not to get oil
Taryl, Thanks for the thanksgiving video,
it was sweet to see your wonderful family, bless you
I fix stuff all the time on the side. YOU could say my sideline. This has happened to a number of my customers and they think that I could just wave a wand and make the engine run again. Will they are really surprised at the price for the fix. Crazy money for a simple maintenance item. The design by KOHLER is an ticked off engineer who got even with the company or the CEO made them do this design feature of this engine.
OIL is the life BLOOD of the engine. PERIOD.
I've seen this design a few times. For all of those wondering, the reason the center is longer is because the filter goes on the top of the engine and sits upside down. The center is a standpipe which along with the anti-drain back valve, keeps the filter full of oil when the engine is off to prevent dry starts. Without it, the oil pump would have to fill the entire filter with oil on every start before it would start suppling oil to the bearings.
Thanks for the explanation, that really helps m
that's exactly right and I thought Taryl would have known this to be honest...
Great explanation. Thanks. Taryl - is this a correct description of the design and are there other engines which have a similar design?
But older command singles donthave this and their filters also upside down
I could see that coming. I remember the old slant 6 chrysler engines.The filter was upside down with an even longer extention. A little shorter filter might go on fine but keep the bypass valve held shut.
Got a story about people that want parts for a mower that they don't know what it is.
A gentleman went into John Deere for a mower belt. The parts guy asked what model it was. Guy didn't know. Asked if he had the old belt. He didn't. Asked where he bought it. If he bought it there, they would have a record. He bought it at a box store. Meanwhile he is getting angry that they aren't giving him a belt. Keeps saying "all belts are the same, just give me a belt!" Finally the parts guy goes back to grab "a belt." Comes back with a combine rotor belt, drops it on the counter, and says "that'll be $1,100.00 please." The guy goes from shock to anger, to a loss of words, and leaves. Later that day, he comes back. He apologized and had the model number, what belt it was, and the old belt in hand. The parts guy apologized as well, and even printed out the procedure for belt replacement from the manual.
Common failure on this motor is dropped valve seats. The failure is caused by overheating in the exhaust port, the overheating is caused by the exhaust port liner warping and blocking the exhaust port, I've repaired 4 of these engines with the same problem, one was on a standby generator. 2 where on auction purchased equipment, made good money fixing and selling those. The other was a walk-in customer that was told by his dealer that his 2 year old exmark was not worth fixing and they offered him money for it on trade. He was intelligent enough to not trust them. 1 used cylinder head off a generator, one new piston a gasket set and a ring set because why not I'm in there anyway. And he was making money again a week later and only cost him an honest $850 for shop labor and parts. Btw these engines are also known for oil leaks due to crankcase gaskets being destroyed during assembly.
Kohler used to be a proud small engine manufacturer. Their cast iron single cylinder engines would run for years on end. Those days are over. I'll stick with Honda or Kawasaki.
@@quantumleap359 they all have their problems, the old Kohler's would last about 1000 hrs before burning excessive amounts of oil, Hondas are decent but keep in mind that the ones that have gained a good reputation are the single cylinder up to 389cc the twins are not great, the Kawasakis are ok but had oil issues on the vertical ones I have had several come in with worn out flywheel side crank bearings, they also fail because they have to have valve adjustments done and if they don't they go to zero valve lash one at least one cylinder which causes motor vibration and the connecting rod cap bolts loosen up and they throw a rod out the block I've seen half a dozen do that. My first choice is a Kohler command. I've seen them run reliability with as many as 4k hours with just oil changes. Keep in mind I'm only talking about commercial engines not the Kohler courage twins.
@@quantumleap359 no there not so stop lying..I have a Kohler 7000 series 22 horsepower 725cc V Twin engine cast iron sleeves and it's designed after the Kohler command commercial pro engine..3 year unlimited hours warranty..so there you have it..sometimes it's best to research before you say anything because speculating or assuming doesn't cut it it means Nothing..
Just because the shorter filter doesn't hit doesn't necessarily mean it will work ok. If there are only a few thousands of an inch clearance it could cause a slower death than a catastrophic failure. Thanks for sharing.
I was thinking the exact same thing. I have to disagree with Taryl on that one. Why not just use the longest filter that will fit.
Agreed, even if it fits it still needs adequate oil flow.
I've bought after market filters for things, but I always put them side by side with the original and make sure they're the same.
Yup, that's the only way to go, even if you buy a stock filter out may have a version change
@David Wanklyn Exactly! Thank you.
Had to do the same thing for my small 30" mower. Has a Troybilt engine but for some reason you can barely find the OEM filter for this thing even when searching the part number labeled under the seat. The ones I did find were either sold out or on severe back order a month or two out so I went to Home Depot and grabbed a Briggs and Stratton filter. Check it and for the most part, everything was the same other than the B&S being about a 1/8 of an inch longer. Not an issue, just means I have to put in a little bit more oil to compensate.
you are a hero
Thank God my father always taught me to become completely familiar with anything I own and run. I make sure I know exactly what parts I need. If I'm not quite sure I take a picture of the part, machine, sn tag, and if possible take needed part with me to the store. Stuff is too spendy these days to be making completely avoidable mistakes. Most manuals will also guide you to the part that right if you care to read them.
To me that one short filter you screwed on. May not be fine. If the tube was only a 1/8" clearance from hitting the bottom of the filter. I would think there should be a certain clearance between from the tube and the bottom of the filter when screwing the filter on. For the right flow entering the filter. I would like a little more clearance than not enough. Great job TFA for problem solving the issue.
Great video, great advice. This is one thing that can get overlooked so easily on these small engines. I will always make sure I have the correct filter from now on! Thanks taryl!
chalk up a rare win for guys that dont change their oil? lol thank you Taryl !!!!
Iâm the king of using cheap automotive style filters on mowers, tractors, and atvs. Mainly due to price but also so I donât need to make a special trip to parts store or stock a ton of different filters. Iâve had great luck so far, if it seals and threads- run it. And everything gets rotella syn 5W40. But Iâve never seen a filter adapter like that one.
you are my favorite small engine guy, I love your sense of humour and the way you teach us in simple form. I always watch your videos before i start working on a small engine. You give great tips and tricks and show us how to make do with the tools we have at home. Thanks so much Taryl
I work at a farm store and we have a pretty good selection of kohler and briggs oil filters. People come up to me all the time asking for oil filters or sparkplugs and they dont have a model and serial number or they "think" they have a kohler or briggs. I just tell them sorry cant help you bring in your old filter or plugs or model/serial number. Im not going to guess.
Good for you. That is the correct answer.
Kohler had a bulletin recently. They could not get the longer, yellow filter 52 050 02 made any more. They stated it was OK to use the 12 050 01 short black filter on this engine. Last batch of engines we got had the black filter installed by the factory and have not had their first oil change yet and are under warranty. We had enough stock on the yellow ones we never ran out here.
Makes me wonder if they changed the design of the filter housing at some point.
....cutoff the UN threaded part, that inch and quarter, or so. DONE-ski.........filter away folks !
@@scottsatterthwaite4073 The reason for the standpipe is the filter is upside down. If it did not have it, the upper part of the filter would stay full of air, unless the lower pleats got really clogged. Chrysler slant 6 had this too. I have seen other upside down filters that did not have it.'
One thing, this video makes me really glad I never ran out of the yellow ones. I always knew there was something funky with this arrangement, and with OE filters, at least you can blame the OE if something goes wrong.
Thank You for information and advice. People need to be warned to be alert and check what filter they use or install on the mower
YUP, it means to actually read the owners manual, which would give the proper part#
I wonder why Kohler had that long tube on the filter mount. When they make something oddball they should use a different thread size to make certain only the correct filter fits.
Because that would make too much sense. Engineers aren't sensible.
I always buy lawn equipment with Briggs engines. I converted my new John Deere Z345R (22hp Briggs) with a Briggs 594271 Remote Oil Filter Adapter, and a longer Motorcraft FL-400S filter, to alleviate the mess those puny filters leave when changing oil, and to give the engine a little more oil capacity. I used the same Motorcraft filter on my old Craftsman YTS3000 (21hp Briggs) with no problems at all. I looked up the internal specs on the stubby OEM and Motorcraft filters. They are the same in all respects.
đ đđ€Łđđ đđ€Ł Briggs? You have to be joking
I cross referenced a Honda GXV530 engines oil filter part number 15400-PFB-004 to a Ryco Z142A oil filter which was only 10 millimetres taller than me OEM oil filter & increased the capacity of the oiling system by 100 mLs or something.
It worked & it was cheaper than the OEM oil filter !
Thank you for the heads up I learned something different today
I hope we get a rebuild video of this engine.
Lol, it's junk now, no one will rebuild that or can
Not sure if it's possible to save this one. looks like the bottom of the cylinder bore had pieces broke off.
@@dekoldrick He said he was able to get a short block even though they are discontinued.
I would love to see that!!
Good information Taryl, thanks for all you do brother. đ
Great info, thanks
Thanks for the video Taryl
Good video as always Tayrl. I hope you do a short block video on that engine that be very interesting.
Love the sound effects!!! Good info. Thx
longer(extra capacity) filters should be used when possible.
Only issue is it can take an extra second or more to fill the larger volume in the filter if itâs draining back. To large can be an issue but a bit bigger wonât hurt.
No more short blocks because they all sold out. Because they all blew up.
@@FishFind3000 that what the anti drain back valve is for
Taryl, as always, you predicted all my questions and even vocalized them as I would have and answered them all expertly. Happy Holidays to my favorite handy family.
wow I never thought about that with oil filters.. thanks Taro..
It happened again... I learned something new! Thanks again Taryl for the information. I've never seen one of these.
Taryl, another great and very informative video. Just came in from walking my doggy Cloey. Here in southeastern Michigan, it is a cool damp drizzly morning. Got me a hot cup of black coffee and relaxing in my easy chair watching Taryl explain why the very expensive Kohle EFI engine went BANG! Taryl, I am sure this very insightful bit of information will save some folks a disaster like the one sitting on your work bench. Gosh, I love your videos! Thanks for doing weekly videos I aways look forward to watching them. Now off to the 20% off Black Friday Sale and see what I can buy myself.
That was a good one Taryl!, thanks from Australia.We are going into summer season now.
ANOTHER GREAT VIDEO.Thank you for posting this very educational post, MERRY CHRISTMAS 2022 ,from massachusetts
Thanks Taryl, this reminder to keep solid technique is well placed. I will look closer at new parts. Man, that's a big fancy dinner there.
Sounds like yâall found the Unobtanium mine! Nice job finding the short block, looking forward to the follow up video!
Hi Taryl , Want to Wish you & Family a Happy New year 2023.. May the New Year be very prosperous with Health , Peace , Happiness and keep those Great Videos coming !!! Thanks for helping us little guys who like to repair as a side hustle as i caught the bug and its addicting but great enjoyment when i fix the Mowers !!! Also do you allow people to visit your shop if they want to spend a day or two learn some repairing techniques ? Regards
I'm very thankful for what I've learned from this man
I'm just amazed that long azz filter pipe doesn't have any small bypass holes in it towards the end of the pipe where it's kind of smooth. Or even a small notch to prevent that issue
Yeah, cross drill that tube near the end so it can't be blocked.
And you've just discovered the problem. If you had a bypass hole, you've totally negated any reason for having the extended neck in the first place.
I will never understand engineers.
@@cujoedaman The extended neck is probably to prevent screwing on a short filter. đ
@@cujoedaman it makes sense when you think about it. I bet that longer neck allows for there to be further separation between the output when the input so the oil will go through more the filter membrane. Itâs probably more important on these high horsepower engines.
@@cujoedaman ....right....i'd use angle grinder, and cutoff the UN threaded part. modern ' engineers' just like to change things, every week.......grandpa would SPANK THEIR ASS.....
Thank you
Good information
Keep the videos coming I love to watch all of them .
Taryl is nothing short of a smaller engine genius *thanks so much*
I am loving the "Oil Guard" system on my Vanguard and also on my Kawasaki- both Ferris mowers. Nice, easy cartridge filter and almost 7 quarts of oil and the easiest oil change that there is.
I bought a filter from car quest for my 04 ford ranger twice and both times it wouldnât flow oil it showed pressure on the gauge but you could here the lifters rattled bad and when I tried to take the filter off it had pressure built up after the engine was off several minutes I ended up going to a different store and didnât have any problems with there filter itâs a good thing I noticed the lifter noise because it didnât have any noise before is the only reason I did notice it thanks for sharing
Thanx for the info so very glad I have an m18 !
thanks
Good show as usual đ
I have a Kohler 7000 series 22 horsepower 725cc V Twin engine in my tractor..brand new replacement same Kohler engine would cost $2,000..so no room for mistakes..
Paul from Seattle! Well north a Hour,, Love your antics !
Awesome video !!! I canât wait to see your next video!!!!
Nice info
Yeah Taryl, I gotta play lawn mower detective on our 2013 Cub Cadet LTX1050 with a Kohler Sv725-3021 on it. It locked up all the sudden with white smoke coming out from the bottom. Just haven't had time to tear it down the rest of the way. Probably about a $1,500 to $2,000 engine.
I'd just alot of new parts on that mower and it was running great until that happened.
So easy to become complacent with a simple procedure that can be so mundane. Thanks Taryl for keeping us on our toes đ
When doing oil changes on Kohler's I used ph3614 size filters ph3614 is the fram part number but and cross compatible filter will do, it's the same height as the taller Kohler filter but much cheaper. Infact I used to buy Toyota filters by the case because all of my vehicles used that filter and from the dealership the filters only cost $3.29 each when bought by the case. The only time I used the smaller Kohler brand filters is when the machine that it's installed on doesn't have the room to do so.
Smart man!! Its Just A oil filter in the circulation of the rest of the oil, it can and will do "only" so much. if the motor blew because of starving for oil, what happened to a;; the rest of the oil in the engine?????
@@charliereed4642 did I say anything about the filter causing an oil starvation problem? Oh btw a pressure lube motor WILL fail if it loses oil pressure and still has a full crankcase of oil
Taryl, LOVE your videos! One question: What is the proper way to break-in a NEW small engine? I am in the process of replacing the 79cc engine in my 'Southland' Chineseium lawn edger with a 212cc Predator. With a new car, the way it WAS DONE was to NOT drive it at a CONSTANT SPEED, but to drive it for 500miles while constantly varying the speed. From what I understand, today's car engines are already broken-in when they leave the factory. Any advice would be greatly appreciated,want this Predator to last a good long time. THANK YOU!
Great video good to know for those that don't . definitely a bad day on that one .
thank you taryl, alot of people i find not understanding that very fact of oil and filters..and that motor got a dam plastic timing chain!!!đźđźđđ
top stuff Taryl Dactal mate and yep a costly mistake some people can make and that,s for sure and luckily you saved a engine with a Short Block Replacement and once swapped over it should be right as rain again and cheers from Australia đšđđŠđ to your area.
Good honest advice Taryl. Great job fella. đđ§đŹđ§
I actually have one of these engines I installed it on a cub cadet tank LZ I always make sure I use the original Kohler all filter, exact part number thank you for the video you reinforce my belief that you should always go back with the same oil filter
I see you have a John Deere Sabre mower there behind you, I have one similar that I bought new in 97 and I am still using it. And it takes that same 1348 filter you showed, which happens to be the same filter my Dodge Neon takes so that works out nicely.
Your the BEST Taryl !!
Thanks for the headsup . I had a problem with an inter heaader.just 1000 hrs Engine, and iveco engine dropped off a gudgeon pin.circlip,they wouldn't come to paying anything we lost $ 60,000. Companies will do anything not to lose money.
4K and a plastic cam gear. If you check an oil filter parts book for thread and height, you can often get a larger filter with more medium. Then you have to worry about things like check valves. Engineering will often be willing to help you out. Good video, thanks. I've used Wix on my Isuzu diesel since 94 and no mechanical failures.
My old kolher had a short one fitted when I got it, and the guy told me he had just serviced it just before I got it, but I always go through my new purchases before I run them I found out mine was to small so I changed it and saved myself a lot of money and pain in the rear with a cheapskate who bought a chineseeasiam knock of oil filter that you for making a excellent video cheers Taryl
Good day Taryl from Ontario. Boy interesting video
U know from now I will be checking every filter, even I have right one. Never that.
Good video Thanks
First two things to check immediately after changing the oil + Filter in any engine. Oil pressure idiot light/gauge pressure and that oil is not spewing everywhere after startup of the engine. I learned this forty years ago because I screwed up many years ago. Thankfully the engine did not cost 4K then, although it was on a car engine.
Interesting, I always wondered why they had different sized filters, and how important it is to use the correct one. I wonder if the same scenario has happened with cars/trucks.
The way you explain the jobs you do always keeps me tuned in and laughing all the way through đđđ
Ran into this on some of the newer vehicle engines. Newer GM 4 cylinder truck engines have the oil filter bypass valve built into the oil filter adapter. If you screw on a non OEM filter with the bypass valve built into the filter, you could end up damaging the engine. Most of the vehicle manufactures have or are putting out factory TSBs to use OEM filters only. Why risk blowing up your engine for a cheap filter that may not operate the same as the OEM filter?
Very good vid.probably a good # of these engs out theređ
Good video !
Great video! The other thing I noticed is that the filter is on top of the motor. How big of mess does that make when changing the oil??
I'd say you need to lay a rag or two around the filter for sure. It's going to dump excess oil for sure.
Great video, as usual, enjoy watching them high switch a few short blocks in my career doing that thatâs for sure but thatâs great that you let the people know about the oil filters and getting the right one. Great job.đ
Very Important Indeed.
I used the same oil filter on my Nissan Xterra on my Husqvarna 23hp Briggs engine. It was just a little longer Fram Xguard.
The filter does not make a mess when changing it. At 3:00 You will see the spring loaded plastic shield that rises up as you unscrew the filter. It stays in contact with the filter gasket and causes the oil in the filter to drain back into the engine. The longer nipple is needed to keep that filter centered over the fitting while itâs completely unscrewed and draining. Once it drains you lift the filter and tip it up while keeping it over the fitting.
I cannot believe someone doesnât notice that the filter has bottomed out too soon and that their last few turns are very difficult as they are crushing part of the filter.
Your explanation seems logical, Captain.
I also ran into some that have a certain spring pressure built in them , luckily they also have a auto oil shut down if low on oil which wouldn't allow it to start . Only one I've ran into and I believe it needed7 or 8 lbs to operate but the one he had was 6 or less . đ€
I've seen several of these engines in truck mount commercial carpet steam cleaners with over 2000 hours in my shop. We use 1348 Napa filters on them, obviously no problems as of yet...
Taryl
knows all and fixes all great info.đđTom
Tarly ???
I wouldn't recommend the shorter filter either with seemingly some clearance!!
I have it written down here. The 1348 NAPA Gold. They have a Silver model also.
Great detective work to figure that one out.
The dealer should always ask the customer for serial numbers and engine numbers of the engine before even handing them a filter. The other issue is people are buying their filters off the internet and they will just type in oil filter for Kohler engine and will pick the one they think is correct.
That John Deere Sabre Pro mower behind you brings back memories of the ones my dad sold alongside John Deere tractors in the UK, we also had Euro Pro versions in the UK which were certain models chosen by John Deere from a Italian manufacturer known as Castell Garden (who are now part of Stiga corporation) they were the budget range machines and did eventually get turned into John Deere colours until John Deere decided to introduce the budget X series machines based on your L series machines like the L105.
Ha i actually been using a Subaru filter on my intek for 3 seasons now.
Had one laying around and was curious. Fit perfectly and is about 1 inch longer. I figured more filter = better...
An oil pressure gauge would have flagged a problem.
I put a pressure gauge on every pressurized small engine for this exact reason at start up, and to monitor while using them. Simple to do, and cheap insurance.
Never trust the counter person. Always take the part number off the part you are replacing.
That long thread is a standpipe. It's designed to keep oil from draining back, to prevent the system from having to fill the filter back up on startup.
Can you make a follow up video after you fix it? Great video as always!
Help ! What is best belts that will disengage or slip when loosen on a older snow blower?? I disengage drive belt , very loose but still grabs! Tried blue kevlar belts , still grabs !
Taryl, If I were changing an oil filter and went to an auto parts store without first finding what I need and this happened, is it the parts guys fault? No, no it is not. If the new part does not match the old one, I would go back to the parts store and got the right one.
My conclusion, it is the person that changed the filter is the one at fault! Not the parts guy.
It's not the space shuttle but it is a Kroler! LOL
That tube keeps these inverted filters from draining, helps minimize time to build oil pressure during start up...
Good video there Terrell let the people know what's going on very expensive OWI
I've found over the years, small engine shops won't even lookup parts without me having the equipment's BRAND, MODEL, and SERIAL NUMBERS. I now carry that info in my wallet, in case I need parts/info.
Right next to the family pictures lol.
Exactly. They donât want someone angrily storming back in trying to get money for something that got screwed up.
Puzzled that lookup gives different filter number on Jack's vs partstree.
Iâve found that more oil doesnât necessarily mean a cooler running engine, it just takes more time to heat up, but the extra inch of tin on the oil filter doesnât make any difference. I just use the stock Briggs filter and 30w oil exclusively.
did this myself in my first year in business had a short filter with a different thread in it Napa filter that threaded in the single cylinder kohler engines fine but as I found out was not the same as the twin engine filter 3k later out of my pocket she was running again I now buy filters from briggs and kohler instead of chancing the wrong filter
I would take off the oil filter and take it into the shop and replace like for like, absolutely great video, keep up the great work my friend
This video is a great example of the quality person Taryl is.
Showing folks how to do things the correct way when he could be making $$$ by not saying a word...
I recently bought a cub cadet XT1 42â with a Kohler KS595 engine and have to do break in oil and filter change. I searched for a cross reference of Kohler OEM oil filter 1205001 and ordered a Fram PH8172 from their Amazon store. I went to an auto parts store and they tried to sell me one that didnât have 3/4â-16 thread. It was an STP M20x1.5 Thd. I wasnât taking the chance.
i watch all the videos and know a lot of them he is right they would better watch more of his videos and I know he is right I know everything about engines and you can learn a lot from them
Iâm surprised that Koehler when they designed that type of oil system didnât make some kind of a bypass system in case something like this happened. Most filters have a bypass built in, in case the filter gets plugged up. Seems like it would make sense to have something similar designed into such an expensive engine.
Edit: After watching more of this video, it seems that just making that center pickup tube a little bit longer so it wouldnât seal (and then leak all over) might be all it needed. Just make sure the longer filter would still work but the shorter ones would leak would prevent that problem.