The Most Controversial Mountaineering Accident of 2023
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- čas přidán 28. 10. 2023
- Two women Gina Marie Rzucidlo and Anna Gutu were both fighting for history in 2023. They were trying to become the first American woman to summit all fourteen 8,000'ers, but there competition between each other would lead to one of the most controversial accidents of 2023....This is their story.
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The most tragic part of these stories is that the Sherpas’ families have no more income and are then worse off than they already were. The families are forgotten about. It’s devastating.
Do you know if there’s a fund anywhere? I’d contribute. It’s unthinkable that a family loses a breadwinner and has no recourse.
A woman cares deeply about the lost income but not a lost man’s life.
@@axakal I can see that “most tragic” was possibly not the best choice of words, but is she not caring about a lost man’s life to care about his family? Sorrow is a burden no one can carry for another. But, to care about his family cares about and honors his life, do you not think? I imagine lost income prolongs and deepens the family’s suffering. Perhaps this could be changed. I don’t think there is less caring for a life.
Nepal government gives them some money, which doesn’t even cover the funeral. As a mother, having no income and children to feed must be terrifying. They do grow potatoes but that is not sufficient food and education costs money too.
To be fair, the sherpas can say NO. They're supposed to be the experts after all. In terms of their pay, they are compensated well, and make far far far more than the regional average income.
I believe the people that climb MT. EVEREST should carry life insurance on the people that assist, lead, and protect them so their families have some protection to support their family. They should also pay them to clean up the mess they leave behind. The mountain should be cared for and loved by leaving no foot print behind.
you can't clean up the death zone. otherwise they'd pick up the bodies.
Someking of agreement Yes, but I'm certain no life insurance company will ensure this. Who knows.
@@imatter4619everything is insurable, you just have to pay the price of the policy.
@@andrewthorsten3809 there’s documentaries on attempts, successful ones. The bodies are polluting the water so they have to try.
@@imatter4619 that’s great. Will stop them destroying a mountain for a personal warm feeling.
I know someone who summited Everest and some of these peaks-phenomenal climber and very passionate-and he was so mad when I asked him about this. For him climbing is the ultimate reminder that you’re a human, and that standing at the top of any mountain puts everything into perspective and makes you grateful for others-“unless, of course, you’re more focused on your reflection than the view”.
I climbed my first mountain recently. Not a big one, nor a particularly hard one in the grand scheme of things (Mt Leconte), but it certainly demanded respect, especially at freezing temperatures. And that’s what stuck with me the most. A mountain is a reminder that, no matter how big you think you are, you are very, very small. Despite being small, you can do great things, but only if you remember that nature can’t make mistakes, but you can, and sometimes one mistake is all you get.
ultimate reminder? come on man
RIP Tenjen. Absolute powerhouse of a mountaineer. Incredible record he got together with Kristin
Wait, so records are good now?
99% of the comments have been saying that climbing records are bad.
@@luckyspurs He was of the best climbers on earth, this was his job. He had many records, but he did them as a part of the job (but climbing was also a lifestyle and passion). I haven't seen your 99% of comments, I don't think records are bad, just don't lose sense and stop and try again if it's advised to, and bring down your litter - than your fine.
Suicide. Don't feel sorry was a choice
@@marie3539 Please read up on the economic situation of sherpas before you comment something like this - provided you are able to show empathy and imagine what it's like to grow up like that and to see no future for yourself or your family. You're probably another privileged person without a sense of how easy your life was.
@@Kareragirl nonsense, it is their free decision, just like us they like the money a bit too much.
Climbing such mountains should never become a recreational ‘badge collecting’ exercise.
Darwin takes care of hobbies like that.
There's literally no other reason to climb the mountain besides recreation. People are free to do what they want, if they wanna freeze to death on top if a mountain that's their choice innit.
@@Bob.martens
Darwin dealt with instances of biological circumstance. Not societal construct.
Common mistake.
@@levansegnaro4637no the reason is not all recreational…it is an excercise based on an enormous ego driven self centred mindset…
@@leeoliver424 ok gumby
It’s literally become pay to win. I feel sorry for the Sherpa who lost his life but have zero sympathy for someone who loses their life while risking others for their selfish reasons.
It's not "becoming", it's been that way forever. Everest is the worst example, but almost no westerners reach these peaks without the sherpas and it's all pay to play/win.
@@2011bluemanAnna was born in Ukraine. Besides, they both were very good climbers. There’s no denying that. I’m not sure why either of you have this idea they weren’t. If they weren’t women would you assume they were good? Is it bc they were chasing a title? This was an avalanche. An avalanche, I repeat. Pay to pay implies their money got them there and they were otherwise in over their head. Otherwise everything is Pay to win by its very nature so that would be a pointless thing to say. So what makes you think this wouldn’t have happened to someone else ? Are you implying the guide wasn’t a good enough climber? And before thinking about citing if they climbed slower xyz it still doesn’t prove that an avalanche could be avoided going slower. There’s been a few studies only in the past decade looking at avalanches in some of these freak situations and the data is starting look like that seen in the survivorship bias studies of ww2 planes. Avalanches are some of the most deadly by a wide margin at these remote places at altitude with no gentle run off or search parties readily available. The most violent incidents are far more difficult to predict. Hence my next point and what two way dialogues are necessary and vital.
I take it you do not climb? Your Sherpa runs the show on the mountain. If they say no, it’s a no go. End of story. You’re making it sound like some ditzy “westerner” (despite literally one born in another country with a different background) paid and bossed everyone up ahead and she was carried on a throne up for a picture. Think about how illogical that sounds. It’s disrespectful to the deceased and their experienced guides. It was a tragic accident.
You westerners and your Sherpa fetish. You do know this is voluntary, and most are adrenaline junkies themselves right?
Google the definition of 'accident', I dare you. Some folks seem to have this extreme irrational drive to push themselves far beyond their limits. What makes one put themselves (and those they hire) into an extremely dangerous situation over and over?
If you go out on a race track in a race car, when you crash do you call it an accident?
You've gotta know you're not taking just a little risk doing such a sport every time you venture out on such an expedition.
Common sense tells me doing it multiple times seems rather selfish, even narcissistic.
I used to enjoy risky extreme sports, really pushing my own limits, and I still appreciate the skills, dedication and fitness required. But eventually I had to grow up and face the reality of my existence. I had some 'accidents'. I also had a child to raise. That was my most important responsibility. Yet I put myself in those 'accidental' situations willingly knowing the risk. Is that actually an accident? Or was it the just a result of my own decision to take such risks? I want to know my grandchildren, so I changed my thinking.
It's one thing to risk your own life, there's always one's family to consider as well. Being a family man, I'll never understand how some people justify these risks when they have young children, family or friends that love them.
But to ask, even pay others to save your ass or risk their own?
And what about all the trash and bodies this sport leaves behind? That hardly seems honorable or impressive at all. That's just sad and sick.
Rule #1 I learned as a very young child going camping is you always leave the place cleaner than when you came. That's having respect and honor for nature. If you can't do that you have no business going there! At least someone needs to pay hefty fines for the clean up. Maybe figured into the cost of everyone's permits, like insurance. It should be like superfund cleanup sites.
Leaving such a mess behind is undoubtably selfish.
Throughout my life I've seen Yosemite wrecked as well as many other once pristine places. It's getting more and more difficult to find untouched places. These Himalayas hardly seem like a pristine wilderness at all. Just like Yosemite, it's a freakin money pit, plain and simple. I've heard of lots of climbers who are astounded by the mess up there. What is the rationale or justification?
Do we call such behavior responsible? How is it not selfish? Or is it all in the name of surpassing ONE's limits?
Sherpas have more selfish interest then any. They do it for money. This is not to dump on Sherpas, but to show how ridiculous your comment is. We are all driven by self interest, and we all have a choice to say no.
They say Sherpas believe that the mountains speak their will through the weather and events that occur on them, and I gotta say, nothing sends a clearer message in that regard than two avalanches, one for each of them. It seems even the mountains themselves won't tolerate this kind of self-indulgence forever
Maybe Santa Claus landed and caused it also.
So why do Sherpas agree to go with people who are record chasing?
Is there competition between Sherpas, same as between other climbers?
@@luckyspursMoney, this is their livelihood. Not an insult to the sherpas, I'm sure they hate it a lot!
Actually there is a competition like that. A lot of sherpas want to become the fastest and greatest sherpa. Of courae there's the money factor (being able to provide for their families), but they're also into the competition thing. @@luckyspurs
@@luckyspurssherpas go to feed their families not glory
Nice to see Nims mentioned in the video, me and my family met him a few years ago and he's a lovely guy who dedicates a lot of his time to clearing up the rubbish left on Everest and body recovery
Rihanna donated 300k to him to support his efforts, that’s how I found out about him! He helps his community a lot! I loved his Netflix special.
" my family and I met".... grammar 101
@@jackiepowell7513 what a waste of 5 minutes for you to comment on that, I'm assuming by the edit of your comment too you made an error too! But if this makes you happier and makes your day better then who am I to judge ✌🏻
@@neave725show us a picture of the meeting, there should be several to choose from… otherwise I’m calling 🐂💩
@@jackiepowell7513you expect proper grammar from a CZcams hero??
As one of the US Indigenous Tribal members, my elders and grandfather instilled in me to respect mountainous regions, you must be in harmony with the mountains, always offer a prayer so you and the mountain are one. We were to never climb the mountains to compete, never set foot upon it in anger, and offer another prayer when you get to the top, if you take something from the mountain (deer, elk or medicinal herbs), leave something of personal value before going back down to the foot of the mountain. Of every mountains I've been on, I've always packed my garbage out, and it is disgusting the human waste that is being left on Mt Everest! Mil/Leo ret.
This 2023 feels like a "Let's go to 8000m mountains and risk the lives of us and our crews" for something these girls could have done TOGETHER. People climbing for clout without using their brain has been such a 2023 thing honestly.
Why should they climb together? They both wanted to be the first woman to do all the summits. Why should they climb together just because they are female? Would you say the same to men mountaineers who compete against each other?
@@rl7012yes, the exact same advice. The mountain doesn't care if you are female or male or nonbinary.
If they were climbing together they may well have ended up being in the same avalanche. Mountaineering is an inherently dangerous activity.
@@TG-ju3nd And if they had climbed together it still would not have saved them from the avalanche. Avalanche's don't care if someone is in a small group or a larger group, it wipes out everything before it indiscriminately. To suggest that the avalanche would have avoided them if only the women had banded together is ludicrous.
@@rl7012to suggest the immense rush they were both in as a result of the competition wasn’t at all a factor in this is ridiculous. If they were climbing together, maybe they wouldn’t have been climbing at the insane rates they were or taking the shortcuts they did. Maybe they would have. But they were both on the mountain that day at that time because they were so desperate to beat each other.
That message by Dr. Tracee Metcalf shown at the very end hits the nail on the head. These competitions need to stop. Mountain climbing is a social sport, not a competitive one. That's why there's nobody keeping score. When climbing these beautiful, albeit incredibly perilous wonders of nature... people need to learn to put their egos aside, otherwise tragedies like this will continue to happen. My sincere condolences to the victims' families and loved ones.
Respectfully, I completely disagree. Climbing is *extremely* competitive, and has been for literally hundreds of years.
What do you mean nobody’s keeping score? Of course they are.
Mt. Everest is sometimes known as the libertarian's graveyard.
@@nigellax454there’s healthy competition and then there’s stuff like this. Plus Dr. Metcalfe is now the closest to achieving the record since Gutu and Rzucidlo died in this incident. I imagine her climbing philosophy has helped her achieve her 9 summits without having to turn things into a dangerous competition. And I’m sure she’d preferred things to not have played out this way. Even the other climbers there that day said it became a toxic competition in the final summit.
Edit: correction about Tracee Metcalfe’s record
"I appreciate when people acknowledge the years of effort and dedication associated with Aleš Česen, Luka Stražar and my ascent of Latok I (7145m) in 2018, but I don’t agree with the concept of awards in alpine climbing. To award a trophy is to signify that something is the best, implying others are not as worthy. Alpine climbing is a subjective activity; it’s artistic, serious, and there are no winners or losers. Alpinism is, in the words of Voytek Kurtyka, ‘the art of freedom.’" - Tom Livingstone on being awarded the Piolet d'Or after climbing Latok I
7:12 It’s sick to talk about ‘competition’ or records when a selfie-seeking woman was literally pulled uphill by a climber who lost his life
So she was "Assisted " . Then she cannot claim a record by anymeans. Having a Sherpa pull her along? She needs to start paying support for the Sherpa family who lost his life.
How true that is 👌@@2nickles647
@@2nickles647 Maybe it's his fault for taking the risk?
The sherpas typically get summit bonuses of around $1500 USD. That’s 3 months typical salary in Nepal….
I wish the Sherpas were more the focus of the praise and not as much the white people who pay them to get there
A) as so many men
B) as so many men
There's a lot of places where people shouldn't be assholes to other people, but climbing any of the 8000m peaks with this problem is ridiculous.
One doesn't leave zero character behind..
As I have found, climber types are some of the cruelest A-holes you'll ever have the misfortune to be stuck with.
Not all climber are but it's true most of the ones on Everest and looking for fame these days are as reaching the top is all they care about and pay lots of money for other people to take responsibility for them
It takes a different breed of people who aspire to something so dangerous. It must take a measure of arrogance and courage to make it to the top. I don't think they care about popularity, just accolades.
@@miapdx503 Most if not all the climber/hill walkers I know do it for many more reasons other than just ticking a box and moving on
Beautiful scenery, fresh air and exercise, the people you meet and the places you travel, the list goes on so to base an opinion of a group of people from the ones making videos and having movies made about them gives a very one sided opinion
The majority of people climbing these 8000m peaks are not real climbers but people with enough money to tick that box and have others do 99% of the climbing for them
Knowing your limits is far more important than your bank balance in the death zone
@@Target..1 it's sad what is happening to the 8-thousanders, especially Everest but I don't see anything happening as Nepal is making a lot of profit from the permits, not to mention the expedition companies that are not helping for the matter, if anything Nims did more damage than the good he's being portrayed as doing
I've not met a climber that wasn't driven by their own ego, psychopaths...
Awards should only come if you do it all yourself. Set your own runs and everything. They should also pay a rescue deposit for emergency services and strict guidelines for when no one will come for you.
This comment is SOOOO cliche and juvenile.
1- nobody gives you awards, kiddo. This isn’t kindergarten.
2- there are no “runs”. This isn’t skiing.
3- you do pay a rescue fee. However it’s not a deposit. You don’t get it back.
4- there are requirements, and pack restrictions, and all sorts of rules you have to follow.
Do you only win the Super Bowl if you painted the lines yourself?
Do you only get the Cy Young award if you mowed the grass and dragged the field yourself?
What about nascar? Do you have to change your own tires and gas?
What about hotel? Do you take the bag out to the dumpster? What about the dumpster? Do you take it to the landfill yourself???
Grow up dude.
Be objective.
@@fkUTube449
“A respond to your barf”???
What are you…12 years old, or something?
Listen kid. If you think my correlation didn’t make sense, then explain yourself.
Explain why it doesn’t work and how the correlation isn’t fair.
SUBSTANTIATE YOURSELF!!!
It’s this thing adults do to validate their emotions.
All you’re doing is:
“Nu huh….that’s wrong cause..we’ll…ummmmm…….
Cause I say so!
That’s it!
Yeah…I sure told you”
🙄
Get over yourself, drama queen.
I never said to encourage ego and nobody wants extra risk to life.
Try to follow along, kiddo and stop manipulating because you’re stumped.
A climber uses assistance in order to summit…exactly like a NASCAR driver uses assistance to win a race.
Prove me wrong.
(With facts…not emotions. Drama queen. 🙄)
@@sendthis9480 Girlie was still short-roped towards her summit though, all for the ego boost of being the "first" to do an arbitrary something. Like yeah there's no formal award but western climbing has always been aaall about being first to do this and that, that's how this whole mess started. What a weird comparison between being shortroped and changing tires and gas, the proper equivalent would be if someone was pressing the pedal and calculating your turns for you while you handle the wheel.
You aren't objective either. Climbing fixed lines is much different than climbing a peak with just your non Sherpa team@@sendthis9480
I hate climbers like this. I can't believe being the second American woman to do this would be such a horrible thing that you should die and kill others for it. The truth is they still aren't the first women to achieve this feat. The distinction of being American women (or women/person of any other nationality) is only a technicality to get a manufactured first.
Also, getting dragged up a mountain shouldn't count for anything.
There was no killing at the hands of any woman or man in this story. It seems as though you have little to no understanding of basic reality let alone what it takes to summit these 8k m peaks.
Yeah, my Sherpa can pull me harder than your Sherpa. The Norwegian climber had different pull assist per hour per witnesses.
@@tomk3732 you don't have a sherpa my guess is you live in a city far away from mountains
@@taotracy4431 I live right next to the mountains. I train before expeditions by climbing once a week. Plus running etc.
@@taotracy4431When it comes to ignorance you should only speak for yourself. However, you don't have to state it as it is overly apparent. What it takes is not to be a jackaz racing up the mountain and then refusing to turn around when advised. When you don't then the outcome rests on you.
The fact that the authorities closed off the mountain after the avalanches, which makes recovery of Rzucidlos body impossible until spring 2024, shows that it IS possible to prevent ambitious climbers from sacrificing their lives to their ambition.
If conditions were so dangerous, why was the mountain not closed off earlier?
Money
Its crazy to me how so many people generally take 2-3 months to summit Everest or K2 or many of the 8kers and yet Tenjen completed 14 peaks in those 3 months!!! This year alone he completed 17 summits and was 80m from his 18th when the avalanche claimed his life. That guy was a machine. But if the weather was good and an unexpected avalanche took his life, was it really either of the womens fault? He was the expert and if it wasnt safe he could of and should have said No. Granted the allure of $$$ can influence you making bad decisions... But Tenjen is definitely a legend and not many people will ever match his accomplishments!!
Wtf is an eightker? That makes no sense.
It's an 8000er (Eight Thousander). That's what they call the 14 mountains that are at least 8000 meters tall...
But if she refused to turn around. Could he have just left her there? That’s something to think about. She made him literally pull her up the mountain
@@karenchahal8346 I mean there are many cases of Sherpas leaving climbers on the mountain when they are dying or disoriented and making bad decisions. Generally speaking in most cases moving quickly up the mountain is safer than slower in many ways, but if the conditions were that dangerous then he could have and should have said no we can't climb it's not safe. Idk how many other people were pushing for the summit that day. I don't know if anyone else made the summit that day. Idk how many people turned back. Those are all things that would help us know better what happened here. In the end its a tragedy and rather you're a top notch Sherpa, an Instagram climber or lifelong mountaineer it makes no difference in that it's sad to see these people lose their lives on the mountain. They understand the risks, at least to a degree, but I always hope every climber makes it back safely.
14 in 3 months is absolutely incredible, but most of those 3 months are spent acclimatising to the altitude, which is how people can climb several in a season.
It's truly sad for mountain climbing to become so toxic. Use to be, you'd hear of climbers helping each other reach the summit if they couldn't do it themselves, they'd cheer on others. True that some people are "paying" to climb and be carried up the mountain but not all who pay are carried up. Many do have to climb themselves too. It's hard for me (a non-climber) to begrudge anyone who actually goes up the mountain even if you're helped by everyone carrying your stuff. It's sad that other climbers don't just ignore that. Competition should NOT ever be on a mountain side, especially one that goes into the death zone. Yes, there are those who "compete" against each other but are still friendly. That's usually what you see but that's being replaced by snobs and toxic behavior from BOTH sides of the argument. Sad. Shameful.
Yes, back in the ‘old days’ (not really too many years ago!) only the select few who had properly trained for high altitude climbing were able to obtain permits. But now, if you have enough money, you can get one too. And that is how greed was introduced to Everest 😔
Crazy how both teams got hit on 2 different places and "only" 1 team member of the women died with them. That's a crazy way of the mountain giving this competition a middlefinger.
Absolutely sad for sure but they knew what they were facing and took the risk intentionally.
Some people climb mountains so they can see the world, while other people climb mountains so the world can see them. Tragic
Well put
Ego's can be dangerous if not kept in check. All of what happened was avoidable.
RIP 🙏
and your RIP Is from a clearly vapid and smarmy perspective
same story as the remote control Titanic mini-sub implosion...toxic ego of the business owner ignored reported dangers of his device and killed a group of overly trusting rich people
Ego does not nothing in this situation. They can be following all the rules, and an avalanche happens either way.
They could’ve stopped climbing went back, and an avalanche could’ve happen on their spot on the way back.
I just came off Manaslu. I checked the weather in mountains around and I was sure season was over. Weather was terrible. They went to the top of Cho Oyu late - very late - at the end of season.
Both women were not very experienced. Neither Sherpa had any authority - they listened to clients way too much (!)
They only could do this because they had LOTS of oxygen. Lots of $$$.
Also they were maybe 80m *vertical* from the top - no way they were just 80m horizontal.
Both looked for "fame".
As Messner said, most of what now happens on 8000ers is not Alpinism - its some kind of a show!
not experienced XD what are you talking about. i guess what's most important is that you feel superior to dead people.
Very well said, Tom. These competitions really need to stop. Mountain climbing is a social sport, not a competitive one -- hence why there's nobody keeping score. When climbing these magnificent, albeit incredibly perilous wonders of nature... people need to learn to put their egos aside, otherwise tragedies like this will continue to happen. 25,000 feet up on a treacherous mountain peak is the very last place people should be chasing clout.
@@Strype13 So your conclusion is that if egos are magically put aside no more tragedies in alpinism or mountaineering will occur. hmmm sounds a bit egotistical for a inexperienced nobody to have the ultimate answer for all participance of a sport you know little to nothing about.
@@Strype13 mountain climbing has always been competitive. what do you think Edmund Hillary et al were climbing for?
@@taotracy4431 the truth is you have to have a bit of an ego to decide you want to climb the tallest mountains in the world. it's not a social stroll in the park like that one weirdo claimed. i wonder if they've ever met any mountain climbers, lol.
“Her infectious laugh could get the whole room smiling”
Come on, we all know you’re just dying to say it: “She lit up rooms”.
🤣🤣🤣
I don't get it. What am I missing?
@@Strype13 There used to be a meme going around where if a storyteller described a character with cliches like “he was an avid hiker/outdoorsman/etc”, “she/he was the life of the party”, “he/she had a smile that lit up rooms”, he’s actually dooming said character to a horrible death sometime later in the story.
yeah, because "would give you the last shirt off her back" wouldn't be credible in such altitudes:) oh wait, she wouldn't, she's selfish as hell, so it really comes down to "lighting up a room".. i swear, when someone described me in one of those phrases after my death, everyone would laugh!:D
Can’t just say she likes to party now can they 😂
This is not the most controversial mountaineering accident of 2023. The incident, where several people climbed past a dying Sherpa, without giving a crap, made international headlines.
Really appreciate you giving us photos of the Sherpas, who are the REAL heroes
I love how you list your main source where you obtained 99% of your information as 'further reading material'. 👏
That'll be why he couldn't explain how the rivalry had in anyway contributed to the deaths or avalanches then.
Dr. Metcalfe is an impressive lady. Her qoute at the end of this video epitomizes wisdom.
I’ve climbed on the east side of the US and the west, the beauty of mountains is undeniable. This week I climbed in Alaska, and there’s something different about it, the cold, the remoteness, the gear, it’s awesome, but these big mountains are terrifying. Mountains are best climbed safe
Definitely agree, even a long hike without that much elevation gain at a lower height can lead to injuries. But on top of a mountain, I've only been on a 2k, there is just so much volatility
Too many people on the mountain (pretty much all the famous mountains, not just K2 or Everest), too many guide outfits that just aren't up to leading people into danger, and too many folks aiming to go from 0 climbing to summitting killer mountains in a year or two.
Mountaineering is about the journey, not the summit. The same mountain and the same trail can deliver multiple journeys, all with different results. It's about completing the self, not the hike, but if both happen you are the winner of all.
Thank you for covering this difficult as it is, we learn hard lessons from the mistakes of others. Before I got sick my climbing partner and I always read mountaineering accident reports both for our area and in the world at large to learn from the hard mistakes of others. I did the same in my flight training and many commercial pilots also review the accident reports from airlines & civil aviation to likewise glean lessons and prepare should something similar happen to them in the future.
Competition has no place on a mountain, she will teach you the hard way how to be humble
I don't think the competition really had anything to do with their deaths. Sounds like they had good conditions and freak accidents killed them. Perhaps after the first avalanche, the second woman should have turned back, but I don't know if one avalanche increases the risks of others. If they weren't rushing, they probably wouldn't have been caught by avalanches, but if they'd delayed by hours or days, maybe they would have got hit by other avalanches - I don't know. Doesn't sound like the competitiveness is to blame though.
@@David-ud9ju NOOOOO, conditions were terrible! Terrible. Wind speed was like over 100km/h. It was shocking how within few days it went from no wind on local 8000ers to hurricane wind.
The Cho Oyu mountain was closed for a long time - some even speculated it will be closed for the whole season. But Chinese finally opened it very late. This was good for me as we expected 100s of people to go to Manaslu where I was towards end of season.
Now these women summited Cho Oyu LATE. At the very end of the season and quickly went to Shiska - super late. Bu that time season was over and weather went way, way down.
If they had experience and it was NOT a race - they would have either waited for better weather or called it a day & climbed it in say spring season next year.
So their race had a LOT to do with what did happen.
Bro... did you even watch the video ?? @@David-ud9ju
As a retired firefighter I will say that everybody knew what they were getting into.
Why would anyone put there life on the line to climb an insignificant mountain. She had to die for me to even know about this mountain, and only because of a random youtube recommendation. And after typing this I've completely forgotten her name and the name of the mountain.
This is the best comment. It's the truth.
All this is true, but these are personal goals. And they might have some sway in the mountineering community.
I'm not a climber but have always had great respect for them. As an observer, it seems to me that ego and a hyper-competitive nature are elements that an experienced elite climber would work hard to eliminate from the challenges they undertake when there are so many other factors over which they don't have control.
If you compete with death, death always wins.
Death always wins; sooner or later.
@@craigbritton1089 There are only two unavoidable things in life - death and taxes (unless you decide not to pay them of course).
If that was the case everyone who climbed Everest would be dead
I miss the days when anyone climbing the himalayas did it for themselves and not for their instagram 😂😂
It just reminds you that mindset can be the difference between life and death. They absolutely preach this in every single video of 8000ers.
I really enjoy your videos, so thank you for putting out such great content. There’s something so interesting about mountains and climbing them. The physical and mental strength they have to be able to climb.
Physical and mental strength...and conviction (faith) that they are not going to fall? I believe that the "high" mountainaneers experience must be something truly special!
These strange, brave souls fascinate me and I pray for their safe return home always and for those mountaineers who lost their lives, may they know "Heaven!"
I just subscribed a couple days ago I really am liking your videos. I try to hit the like button on all your videos I'm sorry for the ones I missed.
A direct reflection/scale model of life nowadays... sad how many times you see the same decisions over and over nowadays.
Nowadays? Bollocks. Always.
If you're getting short roped to the top you didn't climb the mountain
Strong and Independent waymens
This story deserves a lot more than 10 minutes.
You’re free to tell it.
But then the channel would have to do research from more than one source and not present it in a simplistic way designed to get thousands of comments trashing the two women and mocking their deaths.
Which seems to be all this channel goes for.
Every time I watch a mountaineering video I think more and more that there are some places on Earth that humans really shouldn't even try to go
"Play stupid games, win stupid prizes"
Competition is a good thing, but little did they realize: they were competing for darwin awards. 😁
I like how these folks carried to the top of various summits by Sherpas and cell-phone for extraction the moment their noses gets cold somehow feel accomplished.
8000m mountaineering is the playground of the rich
How about being the best you can, rather than beat your peer.
Surely, "dying doing what you love", and being loved and revered by all is simply NOT AS GOOD as being alive and taking care to not take actions that may cause death. Oh, but of course unless you are really "living life on the edge" you are not really living. I think I'll go make myself some pufferfish sushi now.
I'm confused, two women in a competition to be the first to summit all 8 thousanders and one or both are " inexperienced"? If Thirteen summits isn't good enough experience I don't know what is.
Crazy story, as usual!
It's as if the mountain, not wanting to be summited by those two women, denied them the achieving of their objective for good.
I’m thinking there’s really not an “easiest” 8000 meter peak anywhere. All peaks of this size kill.
Anything 45% with avalanches is going to be absolutely deadly.
It pretty much takes the concept of skill keeping you safe entirely out of it. If one happens, you die; whether you're the greatest mountaineer of all-time or the worst.
I can’t begin to understand what people find to be fun or enjoyable about mountain climbing. You spend tons of money to freeze to do death, or (fall to death if you’re lucky I guess) and you can win nothing in the end. You just get to say you went to a big freezing hill with snow and almost died
That's quite an outcome on the final afternoon..wild
@7:13 "there was no fixed roap but tingen lama took the lead climbing with 2 axes and PULLED SIDLA WITH ROPES"!! How can you claim to have climbed a mountain if someone else is pulling you up?? Disgrace
Got a feeling you couldn't take one step being "pulled up" one of these mountains.
Not saying I think anyone trying to climb one is sensible. But even being "pulled up" isn't the easy thing you and half the commenters seem to think it is.
@@luckyspurs I would rather make it to a base camp by myself carrying MY OWN STUFF then being pulled and dragged to the peak. Thats no accomplishment, if I want to accomplish something I want to do it myself. Would a bench press PR be considered if your spotter did all the lifting?
Prayers to the Sherpas families.
Money couldn't save their lives. Inflated egos causes death in some cases.
Wow. How sad.
Sad but kind of cool as well
Or is it glorious?
Not bashing on mountaineering in general, but a competition like that in a life threatening environment is such poor sportsmanship. Real athletes should have teamed up, supported each other and shared the glory.
I'm not sure how compassionate the experienced climber would be when trying to share with some poseur ...
Weren't there 50+ people climbing that day.
You don't summit in groups of 50, unless you think women should only climb together, even in a group of over 50 men and only 2 women.
Prideful. Dying for something so trivial.
Sometimes competition is not wise
But sad some have no thoughts of others ever and it took this to show it
Dr.Tracee Metlcalf said it best : Social media attention and the 'summit fever' taking attention away from the whole experience is sad...
So why do I know her name, where was she quoted (in a book, press interview or instagram post) and why has she climbed so many 8,000m plus mountains herself.
She's literally only good luck with avalanches away from being the woman the people in this comments section are mocking, instead of these two.
It's a shame how egos get involved and cause so much destruction and loss
Without a broken trail, fixed ropes and ladders put in by sherpas these superclimbers don't go anywhere. In reality they should be called tourists.
I really don't understand the climbing world. How can you say "I climbed K2 in XX time" or whatever the record is when you had the best climbing Sherpa's in the world leading you up? That would be like saying "I won my first nascar event" when you had Richard Petty sitting on your lap controlling the peddles and steering wheel.
So sad to compete and not cooperate. Very toxic. If they could have done it together in a safe way. I’m sorry for the families of the sherpas.
As someone who's an avid mountaineer and alpine climber I find the way expeditions are done nowadays in the Himalayas and Karakoram around these major 8000's absolutely disgusting. These "High Profile Climbers" pay pitiful wages to low income communities while providing the bare minimum equipment for porters, and helpers to setup base-camp, advanced camp, to setup fixed lines and break trails. The 8000M peaks are incredibly challenging feats of mountaineering and if you can't climb the peak without requiring a massive team of others to risk their lives setting up lines and ladders for your summit push then you shouldn't be on the mountain in the first place.
I have the utmost respect for all the Sherpas, porters, helpers and locals who make these expeditions possible and do their best to bring income in to otherwise poor communities. For the foreigners however I have absolutely no sympathy or respect, the amount of waste left, the disrespect for local communities and traditions is horrid and I detest the economy of "professional guiding" that advertises things like "premium base camp offices with wifi" and expedited progress so you don't have to take 60+ days of vacation. I detest everything that companies like Elite Exped stand for and hate what they are doing in the mountaineering scene.
Hillary and Tenzing couldn't climb Everest without "requiring a massive team of others to risk their lives setting up lines and ladders for their summit push".
Do you have any idea how little the people who summit peaks do on the way up, compared to the people who aren't attempting to summit.
Their reason is as important to them as your reason is to you. Who is wrong? Everyone.
Yeah I totally agree, if things would have been different then it would have turned out differently.
Zero respect for climbers. Litter the mountain with all their trash while trying to get their name in the record books
Working together was always an option
Omg there are so many controversial mountaineering accidents.
these names are really hard to remember
There are factors not to be controlled on such 8k+ mountains. You can be the best and still die ..its a kind of russian roulette..do it often enough and your number comes up. Maybe these climbers do this to need to feel alive😮
Yeah but there was an avalanche watch issued only a couple of days before the climb due to heavy snowfall. It seems they went very late in the season during a time that wouldn't be recommended just for a prayer to beat the other. These are very dangerous mountains and neglecting to control the few things you actually can is a terrible idea that often ends in death.
Does the mountaineering community ever raise money for guides and their families, especially the families of guides who lost their lives? Considering the expense of climbing an 8,000er, I know climbers have plenty of money. Just forgoing one climb one year and giving the money to a family in a poor country could make a huge difference in their lives.
Just glancing at some numbers on Google, it looks like the average cost of climbing Everest is about 6x higher than the average annual income in Nepal.
Only one I know of was sir Edmund Hillary
Mountaineering is a dangerous activity, extreme mountaineering is an extremely dangerous activity. I hope that, when all of the information is known we can learn all we can about this tragedy to make sure to take better care to avoid future mishaps. Unfortunately, with extreme mountaineering and competition, it appears that adequate caution was not taken and climbers and crew took too many risks.
Geez, mountain climbing has gotten so trashy!
The real story is not the race but the amazing skills of the Sherpas who do this as a job. The few times I've helped someone before the paramedics arrive (not on a mountain) I feel pretty full of myself. Then the paramedics arrive. Yes I helped, but compared to EMTs? I know absolutely nothing. I could tell a story, sound like I'd really done something, but it would be bunk. It' the difference between a band aid and a surgeon. If you can pay a Sherpa to get you to the top of an 8000er that's amazing, and well done, but it's the Sherpas who're the stars. I'm very sorry for the families of these two women. I've climbed a few mountains. Nothing technical, sometimes it was really really hard. I mentioned to a friend that I'd walked to the train station with another climber and he knew, "It's amazing isn't it? You ache and you've just done this thing. You feel incredible. How did you feel about the people around you?" Interesting question. I guess I kind of wanted them to know, so they could climb whatever mountain they could. I wasn't better than anyone, I didn't beat anyone, if anything I wanted to share. That other climber? She completely humbles me in all the climbs she's done. Instead of competing with someone trying to do the same thing, perhaps the best response is Let's do this together.
It's their job.
Its very sad😢.
I live in area full on mountain area , we get self centred full of bucks drop kicks coming through all the time ,, lve no respect for them ..
It's one thing to watch your posts when you don't know the people being talked about. It's totally another when you know all of the people being talked about and you realized that most of what you posted about some of them is misinformed and to post up what a Dr. says about climbing makes the report sound like gossip unless she knew the women personally which I take it she didn't she should have kept her mouth shut. Good Luck to her moving forward. I am just sick how this has been reported about both women.
That's because you're a woman
This channel seems to know it's audience sadly.
99% of the commenters appear to be here because they enjoy mocking people who die and 90% seem to particularly hate women. It's extremely off-putting.
I agree, it’s really awful the way it’s been reported, and the comments are even worse. It’s obvious that most of the commenters think they’re superior and lack empathy, almost as if they have NPD with sociopathic traits. 😵💫
..And their Sherpas, always 🙏 But thankfully today, they are paid well and know their mountain goddess, her rages and limits😢
Rip legends
Seems like both of them had an ego problem.
Nevertheless there's no indication at all, the their deaths were in any way related to their competition.
It were avalnches and mountaineering is/can be dangerous. Simple as that.
apparently big mountains and big egos don’t mix. i think we can all learn something from that.
Ego does nothing in the story. The avalanche is.
They can race or play it safe. You can delay the trip or you can advance your trip. An avalanche can happen at any moment at any place in that zone.
"go alone and you'll go fast, go together and you'll go far".
Those two ambitious wemon cost a lot of people who knew them a lot of pain and sorrow. My heart goes out to all the people who loved and supported thier dreams .grace and mercy to the family's affected as well. There are no winners here
The mountain wasn't having any part of their childish games. Reminded them who the real boss is.
As time goes on the "firsts" have to become more and more niche, and the likelihood of your name becoming known or of there being any mass interest in being a record holder becomes less and less. The stakes vs risk balance seems bonkers given how little significance would be given to such a record.
I can assure you, judging by your diagram, the way to camp 3 does not look like a 10-15 degree slope, more like 35-45 particularly near the approach.
Mfw you said my hometown and I went to school with ginas sister small word prayers to their family. Their last name is pronounced RA-SID-LOW
What a ridiculous, avoidable, and reckless loss of life. Both women dead over a vain accomplishment or silly designation that only a tiny community is even aware of. Also, nowadays clients are essentially being carried up these mountains.
Well damn
Competition? it’s not dating site
What am I missing, how did they cause these avalanches? Or what was dangerous about their ascent? I thought avalanche is a natural occurrence?
Sadly, this channel seems to cater a lot of it's videos to people who want to laugh at people, especially women, dying.
So they had to make out an avalanche was somehow linked to the climbers wanting to break a record, even though it wasn't.
Wish this was longer hate the short ones
In my eyes this is not mountaineering, this is craving for admiration and media presence of the "I have been there tourists"!