The Value of Latin | Ryan Sellers | TEDxMemphis
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- čas přidán 23. 07. 2024
- Ryan Sellers discussion the modern importance of the Latin language despite being viewed as a "dead" language.
Ryan Sellers is a Latin teacher at Memphis University School. He currently serves on the Board of Directors of the Tennessee Foreign Language Teaching Association and as a Regional Vice-President of the Classical Association of the Middle West and South. He is the current Co-Chair of the CAMWS Latin Translation Contest and the former State Co-Chair of the Tennessee Junior Classical League. He has presented on a wide variety of pedagogical topics at conferences of organizations such as the American Classical League and the International Boys’ School Coalition, and he has published articles in the academic journals Classical World, Classical Outlook, and Teaching Classical Languages.
This talk was given at a TEDx event using the TED conference format but independently organized by a local community. Learn more at ted.com/tedx
Latin is not dead; it is immortal!
Denelle Bratcher that sounds like something you would say in Latin
I find this song very fitting:
"Some legends are told
Some turn to dust or to gold
But you will remember me
Remember me, for centuries!"
So is Kobe
@@spegnagmaglorious3590 Linguam Latiam mortuus non est; est ea immortalis!
@@thelreadtheunready4051 the eszet and the Latin are bringing me such joy
Very good speech! I am reactivating today what I learnt at school, forgot during decades after school, but now am relearning again. Latin is cool. Ryan is a very serious speaker with a good memory!
Wow this is brilliant! Now I want to take Latin more than ever before. There are just so many reasons. I love science, math & technology and Latin can help us all to be more logical, analytical, better problem solvers and the list goes on. Thanks.
et lingua latina pulcherrima est! (and Latin is of the utmost beauty!)
I'm learning both Italian and Latin, the amount of effort I need to do to grasp Latin from Lingua Latina per se Illustrata is very amusing, but totally worth it. It is like growing wings and being born into another existence. It's a lifelong pursuit, it kinda helps that my mother tongue is spanish. Once you know spanish, english and latin, it's like seeing through the matrix, literally. Knowing the origins of words is incredible. Also I must recommend everyone to a least try LLPSI and Italian Nature method by Jensen.
I agree with Mr. Sellers, I too have started studying Classical Latin, but, is it me, or does he sound like the character, Sheldon Cooper, on The Big Bang Theory? lol
I watch this every time I ask myself WHY THE F AM I STUDYING LATIN
Use "Lingua Latina Per Se Illustrata". One of the easiest and most natural books for learning a language I have ever seen
Salvē!
@@user-ls8ks7kv8cdo they have books like it for other languages? I’m already far enough in German to not need it, but if there was a book like it in Spanish I’d buy it
Fantastic insight. Having studied Latin for 10 years in England, I can confirm that it really does help for languages such as French, Spanish and especially Italian
True, but if you study any romance language it helps with all the other others. The effect is not exclusive to Latin.
@@RuthavecfluteI must say that, after intensely studying latin for 2 years, reading authentic Latin texts is like a math puzzle! I was never into the humanities, but the problem solving is what drew me into it. It allows me to think about language in a way I never have before.
He's right. I learned more grammar from 4 years of Latin classes than from 12 years of English in school.
That probably also has to do with English classes focusing a lot on literature and not talking about grammar, as well.
You would learn all that grammar if you took any other foreign language, there's nothing special about Latin. Besides, Latin grammar has many differences from English grammar that a lot of that knowledge is non-transferable.
@@vytah It varies, if you study english through latin your comprehension of english would be better. Translation, endless translation will do the trick.
Interesting that this comes out on youtube when I decide to start learning Latin again after putting it down for a while.
Thank you!
Great and concise lecture!
Ave Sellers. Gratias.
Excellent!
loved it, thank you! but wish you could have mentioned that 90% of medical dictionaries entries are Latin-Greek based? & all the biology terms, genus, species' names & anatomical terms... but I found your talk excellent! :) also, would love to know why the teaching of Latin must include all the conjugations, etc. for reading the classics, I know, but for vocabulary seems more important than all the horrible memorization of case endings, etc. or at least an "emphasis change", or perhaps courses such as LATIN for the MEDICAL FIELD for example, in Texas, all the rage now, for survival, is Spanish, of course, but the classics are being lost in k-12 :(
also, I have always wanted to publish a book I started but am not a classicist but a historian slash English teacher; but it's a coloring book, A-Z, with a couple of Latin words for each letter, with pretty pictures to color for kids, but with the English, Spanish, French, & German translations.... wish I could get a grant or some kind of backing, any thoughts?
Susan McDonald Nop
I would like to respond 5 years late to your question about why the conjugations. You see, Latin word order does not matter much. You can have a sentence like the following; "Susan amat familiam suam" (Susan loves her family). However, using the exact same vocabulary and even word order, Latin can completely change the meaning of the sentence; "Susanem amat familia sua" (Her family loves Susuan). As useful as the vocabulary is, what is far more useful is learning to decode the correct meaning of a passage, as this exercise of deduction teaches practitioners logic and reasoning.
i love the intro
RIP Kobe
amo hoc!
The pluperfect subjunctive, now how does that go again? I did know it. If it was the passive pluperfect subjunctive it would be relatively easy.
I'm interested in Latin, and languages more broadly, but this guy makes me want to yell "THE PLURAL OF ANECDOTE IS NOT DATA"" and "CORILLATION IS NOT CAUSATION" into his face. It's not surprising that people who are clever enough to succeed in business and other mentally challenging pursuits are clever enough to be good at Latin. That does not mean that Latin taught them those abilities. Think how many excellent Latin student there are who did not do anything notable with their lives. Think how many notable people there are who did not study Latin.
Funny how ironic it is that he doesn't get that since these are arguably Greco-Roman sentiments, what with Aristotle and logic
The valid benefits of studying languages I can think of are:
1. Ability to communicate in the target study language.
2. Ability to appreciate media and literature in the target study language.
3. Supposing target language is a close relative of an already acquired language, it can introduce some qualitative improvements to the already acquired language, but this requires the already acquired language to be at advanced level or higher.
best viewed at 1.25x
Wow. He sounds like a normal person, the 1x is like he is on mogadon and sulfur hexafluoride. Thank you.
Everything is better at 1,5
Wow! He does sound more normal.
Unbelievable! You were so right! HE goes from boring to energetic!
It can get quite amusing at times when watching at 0.5x.
Very good video ! Excelent. I do agrre that the Latin culture is not opposite of the technology , but comes within
Caecilius est in horto
Tausty Z Ancilla urnam portabat.
@@mmarr986 Dominus serva urnam cepit.
Caecilius is in the garden.
*Caecilius in horto est
Roma in Italia est, Italia in Europa est.
i seem to always come away from these videos thinking "well, that's ten minutes of my life i'm not getting back"
Parafox Don’t watch them then. Simples.
what are you doing that's so much better than learning?
❤️
mi piace dirlo: sono un Latin lover.
I wish Latin comes one again
Nōn sōlum ēvolvit Latīna sed adhūc lingua antīqua ipsa ūtitur ā multīs hominibus ut loquāntur, legānt, et scrībant.
@Marshmallow facts
@Marshmallow Nah. We see them in some Roman grammar books.
In Hoc Signo Vinces
qua die haec oratio habita est?
Golly, this looks like a fascinating video, but my TED card is full of punches.
well internet brought me here
Excellent talk, thank you. As I'm sure you yourself would agree, and so in no way is this a criticism, there is a "fundamental fundamental" I would mention: Latin is a very -learnable- language. And, I would add, very lovable, and in a unique way. I hope that the curious but brave will look into Foster's Ossa Latinitas Sola to find out what I mean. Or at least watch the 1939 Goodbye, Mr. Chips. Gratias tibi ago. Semper valeto.
Learnable. CZcams crossed out my attempt at emphasis.
John Rickert
Put asterisks
The issue with a lot of these arguments is that they don't apply to Latin exclusively. Learning any foreign language to fluency requires you to think logically and problem solve. Yes, Latin is highly inflected, but so are many modern languages - polish, finnish, russian, Icelandic, greek, etc. Secondly, Latin is helpful for learning the romance languages, but the modern romance languages are all much more similar to one another than any of them are to Latin. If you just learn, say, Italian, learning other romance languages would be even easier than if you know latin. Additionally, you still get all of the same insight into English vocabulary that you would if you studied Latin itself.
Bathrobe Warrior Depends on where you’re coming from. A speaker of any other European language learning the foreign language of English would find that logic gets them precisely nowhere.
And the fact that some people who studied latin later did great in life does not al all prove that latin was the reason they were succesfull.
dude needs some aqua
Italian and Spanish are closest to original Latin
Training and practice are important. You can’t hand someone a Tedx Talk and hope for the best.
Latin will be the language of the future.
I don't think so, but I hope so.
@@leonardofernandes2131 I think, therefore I am.
2:20 all the time... ALL the time! 😅
Gotta be honest here. I'm studying Latin in my on volition, but this talk almost made me not want to do it anymore. It's a really bad sell of it IMO.
Just bad argumentation and droning on about it being good because I said so.
vita sine Latine nihil est
Vivat linguae latinae!
Latina lingua aeterna est.
同意，慢慢学吧
本人以为学好古代汉语和方言更为明鉴。
why are there only 6 comments?
Salvete. Latina similis Lingua Lusitana est. Ego intelligo multum verba Latina.
How strange, as the Lusitanian language died out in the 2nd century AD.
WHERE ARE THE MACRONS!!!!!!! Long vowels are not to be ignored! lol
It bugs me how Latin teachers let students ignore short v. long vowels when it is ESSENTIAL to Latin!
I hate that too, and my teacher can't even give me a valid argument on why we should ignore them. Is there any specific rule for them, or do you just learn them by heart?
@@DaanLam Pretty much by heart. Not sure if maybe long vowels are more common with a certain stress, placement in word, definitions or kinds of words (places v. abstract concepts), etc. Dunno. I usually just memorize the dictionary entry.
@@osalas36 So I basically have to rememorize every word with macrons? Am I doomed?
@@DaanLam There are a few rules, but mostly you have to learn them by heart. It's useful to know those rules, though. For instance the vowel of the last syllable of a word, if followed by a single consonant other than s, is always shortened. When you learn it with the macrons, just as when you learn a French word, you learn it with its accents. It's not that hard, the only problem is that unfortunately many books don't use the macrons.
'Latin is a mathematical language.' Perhaps the worst statement ever conceived concerning Latin I have seen in a long time.
I stated the same sentiment above, before I saw that you had beaten me to it. He probably heard someone say this once and hasn't stopped repeating it since.
Why
because boiling down a language and its linguistic principles to math strips the language of its humanity. Languages, not even Latin, are not mathematical formulas to plug and play just because we teach them so poorly that they are often boiled down as such.@@binabina4445
Thanks for stating your opinion. Would you mind offering more evidence to support it?
I know nothing of Latin, but I'd like to know why you disagree with his opinion/statement before forming my own.
I love Latin, but I don't think it should be forced on students in school. Many (in fact I dare say most) students will probably never develop an interest or love for Latin no matter how much you make them use it. I was taught Mandarin in primary and secondary school as a second language as part of the national curriculum, and there is nothing worse than being constantly tested and punished for being bad at a language which is forced on you and you have no interest in! Many of my peers felt the same way, and this policy has had resulted in generations of my countrymen being turned off the language and avoiding it, even though most of us are ethnic Chinese.
I love languages and I'm really into Latin, but I completely disagree with what he said. This myth of Latin as the most logical, most effective, most powerful language is hard to die. As beautiful, fascinating and nuanced as it may be, it is just a language, neither better nor worse than the modern ones. Morever, considering it as a system of rules does not take into accout the vitality of the language and is not at all the most effective way to acquire it. Learning a modern, alive language (in the sense that it has a community of native speakers) would be probably much more useful and surely equally enriching.
Your last sentence is so spot on. Like, learn Latin if you have a huge passion for it, otherwise, yeah there are way more logical choices.
I agree with this point and sentiment, but I want Latin itself to become a true living language again with a community of dedicated speakers, and this isn't all that far from becoming reality. Latin isn't inherently better or worse than any other natural language, but it's vocabulary is closer to the original source than the transformed modern languages are, so it has that deeper connection with the way words were originally used, so even tho Romance languages are closer to eachother than to Latin, that is just because they all split off after losing much of this connection to the original interpretation of their vocabulary. Latin has been immortalized in a standardized form over the millennia, but if it were revived as a living language, it wouldn't just be a language of logical rules and patterns, but would have new ways of communication in the modern context too (but still tied to the standard form and wouldn't stray away again as late vulgar did to become modern Romance). It really is already used this way by the thriving and expanding community of Latin speakers online & around the world.
There is another TED talk about the value of the constructed language Esperanto as a propaedeutic for teaching children how to learn a foreign language, as well as conferring knowledge about basic grammar-parts of speech, tenses, and so on. In other words, there is little about Latin _per_ _sē_ that gives special learning advantages.
The whole premise of these talks is, perhaps, a problem. Learning stuff, at least for adults, rarely has 'practical' or material advantages in our world. Life isn't a trade school. We learn stuff because it makes the world a bigger place, full of new delights with each new thing we learn. Learn Latin because you think it's cool, or because you are fascinated by the Roman world, or to better understand classical references in other books you read (or better appreciate Rowling's language games in Harry Potter). Or learn Esperanto (which at least has a smaller time investment), or Novial or Lojban or Latino Sine flexione. Or Spanish, because people speak it in your city. Or Japanese, because you love anime.
Latin isn't killing me. Those pants though...
Your point is well-taken. What do you think the chances are that he can read Vergil?
@@carlnilson273 Low. Seems to me he's one of the grammar-translation guys. Knows Latin morphology and syntax better than his own mother, yet he couldn't read a single page of authentic classical text. If this presentation is anything to judge by, then I'm sure he contributes nothing to his field of study, just teaches conjugations and grades students' translations. He talked for nearly ten minutes and said pretty much nothing. That alone tells you all you need to know.
@@volimNestea actually no. He is my Latin teacher right now and he is quite good at translating classical text. He teaches Vergil.
@@cullenl2508 Fair enough I suppose. Let me just tell you this though. If you're learning Latin solely with the goal of one day being able to translate well, by all means do that. But you'll forever only be a simple translator, and if you're like this guy, i.e. teaching Vergil as you say, you'll just be going over the same exact lines of text year after year after year. And in the end you will have read a relatively small amount of Latin literature. There's a lot more to Latin literature than Virgil and Cicero, who's works are significant for their style but are lacking in substance. Therefore, if you dedicate your life to those two, that's what you'll be missing out on.
I didn't know a lizard could smile.
Hoc totum verum est: de Lingua Latina !!!! (en latín)
*- This is the whole TRUTH about Latin language !!!!* (english)
*- Questa è tutta una verità sulla lingua latina !!!!* (italiano)
*- Esta es toda una verdad sobre el idioma latino !!!!* (español)
*- Acesta este un adevăr întreg despre limba latină !!!!* (română)
*- To jest cała prawda o języku łacińskim !!!!* (polski)
Fascinating that his insight regarding the diversity of the coliseum crowd touched nothing on the universality of depravity in humankind, this world needs Jesus!
this dude’s cadence is so weird
He has a little Forrest Gump coming through
I'm not sure how I feel about this man's sales pitch. I'm not trying to buy a language, good sir.
You don't need to sell the bones of my spoken word back to me.
No western languages use declension though. Wouldn't it be better to learn Spanish instead
Greek does, and so do most Slavic languages. Also Icelandic and Faroese.
Biologists have to learn Latin; the genitive case, in particular, is used in scientific names. E.g. Adelges tsugae is an insect that feeds on trees of the genus Tsuga (a Japanese word, but declined as if it were Latin).
Nordic languages too. Isn't non-declined languages in the west the exception?
How do you define western?
German??
Latin is extremely important yet not crucial. Many successful people did very well in their fields without knowledge of Latin.
English is 60 percent ..Greek....hello...more so than Latin!
I took Greek and French and did very well on my SATs
You are a proud greek human arent you!?
Nearly all of the Latin in English comes via French, not directly from Latin. It arrived in England with the Normans, who spoke their own Nordic influenced dialect of Old French, a language much closer to medieval Vulgar (i.e. Common) Latin than modern French.
About 80% of the entire English vocabulary is non-Germanic. French/Latin is about 80% of that portion, the remaining 20% being mostly Greek (and that mostly via French/Latin), Ecclesiastical Latin, and words from other European and Asian languages. There are, strangely, very few words with a Celtic origin. (French and Spanish also have very few words with a Celtic source.)
On the other hand 80% of the 4,000 or so most frequently used English words in daily use are Germanic, mostly from Low German languages, represented today by Flemish/Dutch, Frisian, and other northern and coastal languages and dialects, and also from Old Danish and Old Norwegian dialects (Norse, or North Germanic).
English is:
26% Celtic-Germanic;
4% Proper names;
29% Latin;
29% French (or Anglo-French);
6% Greek;
6% Other languages, mostly Romance.
Globally, 51% of the English words have Italic roots.
Latin can’t be dead! It’s still “Roman” around! 🤓
Latin didn't contribute to science like Greek language
Let's introduce latin in some country as official language. Cuba crosses my mind.
Hahaha the way this guy attempts to use ancient Rome as justification for todays Mass migration which is un-matched in all of human history, is laughable. The fact is that upon the opening of the Colosseum many of the dignitaries of the various provinces of Rome would have been invited to come to Rome in celebration of the opening of such an architectural achievement. Not only for their own entertainment but mainly as a reminder of the power and sophistication of Rome... They are reminding the vessels that not only is it better being under Roman rule (because look at the technology we have) but also a reminder that it would not be wise to attempt some kind of revolt against a power capable of constructing such wonders.
I am so sick of people trying to use and distort ancient examples to justify modern behavior...
Exactly my thoughts. shameless ideological propgaganda.
I find it interesting how this generation believes that latin isnt as important as the last 3000 years of generations believed.
1) He missed the best reasons for learning Latin: Ovid, Vergil, Horace, and Catullus.
2) He gave an excellent reason to avoid the study of Latin: J.K. Rowling.
3) Very few things are less mathematical than Latin.
4) He should not have spoken dismissively of Book 4 of the Aeneid, or its grammar.
5) No more grappling with issues, please.
6) He made some good points.
That is fascinating how people praise Latin and at the same time deprecate Esperanto, which is much more structured, regular and consistent than Latin and any national language. Other than that, Esperanto is easier and at the same time much more expressive and intuitive! It is LIVING language with approximately 2 millions of speakers, and there are even native speakers. I'm a big fan of Latin too, but in my opinion Esperanto is just a so much better option: 90% of learners would left learning Latin as soon as they realize how difficult it is, while one can learn like 10x more Esperanto in the same portion of time. And Esperanto has 80% Latin vocabulary, although its' structure/grammar is absolutely different.
Did we go to the moon because it was easy?
It never died! Heck it is still used by the Holy Roman Catholic Church today.
The introducer killed my interest. Bla bla bla
Both English and German ought to be Romance languages for they both also belonged to the Roman Empire! How is this to be explained?
no, being part of an empire does not make you the same language familiy.
The Germanic languages predate contact with the Romans. There are some words that come into German from Latin, like das Fenster, window (from fenstra in Latin) but an evolution of a language is independent of whether or not it was part of a given territory at some point in time, though contact with other peoples can certainly influence the course it takes.
Germania and Britannia were "under" Roman rule- meaning Germany was only partially explored and conquered by Romans, while Great Britain was so far away from Romeand kept so much of its own identity (especially in Scotland) that there was not as much language influence. Latin was also not the main language of the mass population of conquered lands.
English and German are influenced by both Romanic and Germanic languages, for example, the word 'freedom' is Germanic, but 'liberty' comes directly from Latin
I agree, but only the ROmance country should learn Latin. No need the entire world
Nothing is eternal besides G-d
Eternally dead language
Only to those whose souls have died.
I had latin for many years and it did not help me with anything. A waste of time
That's probably because you had bad teachers just like the twit in the video.
@@betos-08 So latin is useful for everyone... as long as they make something that involves latin in some way. Nice argument
@@betos-08 Show me something that can't be bought with money, then I'll show two that are not improved or accelerated with latin.
Yes, I agree
@@betos-081. I looked at it but i don´t see why it should be better than any other latin book. 2. Of Course i never used latin. I don´t have a time machine and neither do i live in the Vatican. I never learned a romance language because i have to learn latin instead. Why should I read something in Latin when everything is available in English? Latin is way to impractical for the purporse of reading. You getting the exact same Information way faster in English. It is a useless dead language that besides some very few historians and linguists no one really needs.
J.K Rowling and Mark Zuckerberg??? Yea, now I'm never learning Latin.
I'd rather learn Russian.