Lets Learn to Waterstone Sharpen (Microscope Progression Gerber Strongarm BDZ1)
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
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props to Pete for showing him sharpening freehand when hes still trying to master it, a lot of peoples ego would get in the way and they would leave out mistakes etc.. great work Pete if you ever want a bit of help in any way hit me up
If you're ever hopelessly lost somewhere, just take out a knife and stone and start to sharpen your knife. Within minutes someone will come out of nowhere to tell you that you're doing it wrong and you can ask them for directions or a map.
Hilarious
💯🎯
No doubt it would be one of those axe guys.
But do you trust them to be good sources for "navgational information"?
The microscope progression is a great addition to your channel. And now waterstones too! You're knocking it out of the park, Pete!
Freehand on stones takes a bit of practice but man, once it "clicks" it really feels like you've unlocked a cheat code for your knives to never be dull again. I love my guided systems too but it's REALLY convenient being able to sharpen up a knife anywhere at basically any time as long as you've got even just a basic DMT folding diamond stone in your car or bag or something.
One of my biggest tips would be to make sure you're comfortable and in the right position for you to make the body movements you need to make. Trying to freehand on large stones at even slightly odd angles makes the whole thing a bit of a shit experience.
I generally sharpen on waterstones, but I picked up a guided system because when I've been hand sharpening for a while, my apex tends to get a bit wobbly -- wider in some areas than others, less sharp at the heel and the tip. Going over to the guided system is like a return to the factory edge, but I do get a sharper edge on the Shapton Glass than I do on my diamond stones in the guided system.
I don't like the way Bricky is looking at that sharpening stone
I can’t work out if it’s pornography or A Clockwork Orange style torture for poor Brickard
I'm sure Bricky's seen worse 😀
If brookie was looking stoned that would be sharp.
A microscope put me on another level of sharpening. Understanding why something isn't working is so important.
What magnification would you recommend to inspect an edge? I want to order a microscope, but don’t want to end up looking at atoms ;)
Not a super expert freehand sharpener myself, but the way you know when you've done enough is the same as it is with a fixed angle system --- you go until you get a burr, then repeat on the other side. As far as the tip/belly area goes, you have to raise your elbow to keep the edge bevel on the stone; keep your wrist locked, but raise your elbow. I'd also recommend that you slooow down and put more effort into maintaining a constant angle. IOW, fewer, better strokes.
Looks good mate,
I love freehand sharpening myself !
A little tip: put preassure on the edge trailing stroke, in your case when pulling towards you. That way, you avoid digging in the edge into the stone.
I also recommend elevating the stone, your hands need some freedom 😂
What an absolutely wholesome video, Pete. Thanks for sharing this.
I remember a few years back when i first decided i wanted to have one really nice knife for skinning and processing game that would take and hold a razor sharp edge without me needing to deal with disposable blades out in the field i decided it was time to learn how to properly hand sharpen a blade. Whelp, looking back i can see how incredibly optimistic and naive i was! Who was i that i would get one really nice knife that i could hand sharpen! I found a Gerber A.O. assist in s30v, back when s30v was nominally one of the choicest steels on the market! I believe it was your channel with the rope cutting tests that really started to introduce me to the performance differences between vanadium powered steels versus the buck 420hc which i had naively thought to be high-end cutlery! I ordered a set of water stones for a coarse-medium-fine-very fine progression and started grinding away. I had no coordination whatsoever, no idea how much or how long to sharpen each side on each stone, no sense for how to judge what was "sharp", no idea what wire edge/burr was or what to do about it, etc. I sharpened that s30v Gerber AO assist and put a gnarly convex edge on that knife with no sign of the factory secondary bevel to be found, i had no finger prints left on the tips of my fingers, did that thing where you catch the knife of the edge on a push stroke and bite into the stone edge first, necessitating going back to square one multiple times, but eventually i did get an edge sharp enough to bite into the top of my fingernail and slide a held sheet of paper. At that point I had developed this false sense of competence, that i could indeed have one nice knife that i could sharpen by hand.
Well, anyway, fast forward a day and when the first thing i cut (probably a zip tie) rolled the wire edge right over and put a small chip in the edge. I had sharpened at way too shallow an angle and had not minimized a burr or anything. I had spent two hours sharpening s30v on aluminum oxide water stones, thought i knew what i was doing, and destroyed the edge in 30 seconds. At that point, i realized that there was no way i would ever be able to sharpen one nice knife by hand....
Rather, I needed MORE knives in all kinds of steels with various combinations of toughness, hardness, edge stability, stainlessness! Well, now i have a pile of manix 2s in every combination of steel it's ever been offered in, Creely Makos in rex121, magnacut, vanax, Bark river knives in 3v and Magnacut, Benchmade M4, 20cv, s90v, PM2s in s45vn, k390, and 10v, DBK knife in elmax, Seki city spyercos in zdp189, hap40, super gold 2, etc. Yes, that's the ticket, buy buy buy more knives, all sizes, all steels, all makes! I blame you Pete, you and all of your awesome videos cutting rope, talking about steel composition and putting high longevity rope-cutting edges on crazy super steels with your kme system. I just couldn't stop from trying to get my hands on everything!
But even more importantly is that i found Micheal Christy's sharpening videos and watched how he held small sized sharpening stones with diamond or cbn abrasives, or the spyderco ceramic ultrafine, and how he stropped using diamond or cbn compounds capable of cutting all of the high carbide supersteel magic ingredients, how he progressed through grits to set an edge, then refine the scratch patterns, checking each step to make sure the edge was apexed along the way. I found out that something like his technique of hold a 4-6" stone in one hand and carefully working the knife edge really worked well for me in getting the edge angle by feel. And then to sharpen until the burr could be just detectable on the other side, then change sides. And the bur minimization at the end of each refinement step by using very very very light alternating passes. Finally, the importance of good and proper stropping. I also got some good insight from some of BBB's videos as well.
So that said sharpening by hand has really become demystified for me, now that i've had lots of knives with various steels that i've practiced on and built my confidence. Waterstones and ceramics are fine for normal steel, maybe even up to 2-3% vanadium powdered steels. but when it comes to the high alloy PM tool steels, make sure you're using CBN or diamond abrasives. I really like the little venev diamond stones because they are easy to hold onto and they cut fast and leave a really nice polish on the bevel relative to their grit size. I'll sharpen anything up to 5" with one of those little stones. It makes it more affordable to have good abrasives because you don't need the giant bench top stones and you don't have to worry about a wobbly table causing your push stroke to accidently catch the edge directly into your water stone.
I spent all my knife budget mostly on the knives, so i've never been able to budget in a kme, tormek, or the like of those fancy sharpening systems, so i've always drooled over all the sharpening tools you've got in your shop. But i do feel that with a little manual effort i am able to get my knives just about as screaming sharp as they can get regardless of sharpening method. Now, ill throw a pocket-sized spyderco double stuff 2 (with the cbn course side) in my bag when i travel and i can resharpen all the knives at my moms or dads place, or when i'm out on a camping or hunting trip. It's pretty empowering!
What do you think about the fallkniven DC4 & CC4 sharpeners?
@@MB-jg4tr Well my opinion is worth every bit as much as you are paying for it, but the DC4 should be roughly equivalent to a spyderco doublestuff 2 and the CC4 should be roughly equivalent to the regular double stuff. I've had the spyderco stones but not the fallkniven, so i can't say to what degree of courseness or fineness the diamond and ceramics are on the fallkniven stones.
everything (spyderco and fallkniven) appears to come with a leather pouch that works well as a compound-holding strop to finalize your field sharpening.
@@ryewaldman2214 lol that's funny because I haven't used the Spyderco stones. But, I can vouch for the fallkniven ones, they're good and last a long time with regular proper use. And yes, the small leather stone sheath has one rough side out for compound. For the price and pocket friendly nature they're amazing.
@@MB-jg4tr i'm using it to maintain MagnaCut and S30V and elmax on the go. You can spray diamond compound in the sheath for stropping. Extremely Light full ass sharpening kit for the Outdoors. But be aware of your thumb Holding the stone. Cut myself, had to use dermabond
Hey Pete, good video I enjoyed watching and it's refreshing to see a true learning process.
I've got a few potential pointers, or at least some things to try out. I have been sharpening freehand for a good while now and I do it professionally (when I have the time 🤪)
First, I would recommend reversing how you hold the knife. So when you do your push stroke you would have the edge trailing, and pull stroke towards you would have the edge leading. I think this will greatly reduce any of those hiccups where your edge catches the stone.
Second, I would angle the knife in relation to the stone. So instead of the edge being perpendicular to the stone, it would be at about 20-45 degrees (depending on your preference).
Third, on the tip I like to raise my elbow upwards as I move through the belly towards the tip. My elbow will move up as my arm and wrist stays locked.
Hope this helps, and you can see this stuff in action on one of my recent videos on my channel: czcams.com/video/G8gezAJzy-Q/video.html
Thanks for your wonderful content as always 🙏
- Dan
You should watch the Murray carter sharpening videos.
CarterCutlery
@@MB-jg4tr -- Japanese Knife Imports. I found John Broida's videos were much more helpful to me than Murray Carter's. Try both and see which one best meets your needs.
Good on ya for practicing hand sharpening mate - YES!!!
There's definitely an art in freehand sharpening. I've been at it for about 4 years and seem to go through phases. Ill go a couple of weeks where I get some excellent edges followed by a week or two of garbage edges. Love the video, Pete. Thanks for the content.
Always nice to see someone sharpening symmetrically with both hands 🙌
Regarding 13:05 I don't really have a better way. I kinda do the tactile thumb thing and rely on Zen - with sometimes mixed results.
Some stones have better feedback so you can hear and feel via the vibrations coming back to your fingertips through the blade when you are flat on the main edge bevel. I also cut angle guides out of timber (just figure out what angle I want, adjust for the grind angle, and set the chop saw to 14, 16, 18 degrees, cut a wood block, voila custom angle guide.). If you need a guide on calculating grind angle, I can send a link to an easy one I made.
Michael Christy rocks the knife back and forth every 2 or 3 passes to feel when the edge rocks flat and he resets that way, with trademark phenomenal results. Jared from NeevesKnives recommends putting a sharpie dot on the spot where your finger falls on the spine and then putting your finger on it "in position" while the ink is still wet - that way you mark your exact finger/blade contact point and can locate it each time you reset your hand position.
I think you did great Pete - way to go! Next step, Venev OCB Resin Bonded Diamond Bench-stone? 😁
Damn good job on the stones actually. ...One suggestion is that traditionally the soaking medium for a water stone is urine, give that a try next time. Animal or Human is equally acceptable for particle steels and cheap kitchen/SAK stainless, but cat is preferred for carbon steels and higher end non-particle stainless.
plus i’ll have something nice to drink afterwards!!
Yes they were actually called "urine stones"
It's awesome to see someone using both hands as well. I have the best results when the blade is facing me so that my Eyes can keep track of every Single stroke. If your Eyes cannot follow you're to fast and bite the Rock eventually
Sweet! To keep the Same Belly line and get that Tip The butt end has to come up, I never put my blade parallel with the stone I always keep it at 90 degree to the stone and angle the butt end and use circles to get tip. But thats minor changes on the belly anything works really as long as you keep the angle.
Good job. The sound and great tactile feel of using waterstones is half the fun.
An easy way to avoid those kind of "accidents" is to hold the blade at 45 degrees to the stone edge towards you. Like all/most of Japanese kitchen knife sharpening tutorials do. It's way way easier to hold an angle in that way too and in a rare chance the stone grabs the knife it tends to cause angle to decrease instead of increase which saves your edge
"Michael Christy" 😂😂😂👏👍 definitely busted Pete😂
Sorry - I am absolutely spamming you right now. Anyway, one more tip that's helped me a lot is finish with alternating strokes: At the end of your sharpening session do one pass per side, right at the edge angle. This will minimize bending and damaged metal remaining at the apex. Cheers Pete, great work. If you do this exact same thing with a diamond plate on one side, and the same finishing stone and strop it lightly, you'd have a pretty sick dual-grit edge 😁
Hei Pete, do yourself a favor and get a 240 gritt or a corse diamond stone and put it to work. That stone will take the guesswork out it the edge has a burr or not initially. Than follow up on your progression 700gritt 1000 and strop.
Second: you have to hold your knife firmly, lock the wrists and elbows and use major muscles to keep a better consistent angle.
So the theory 🤣 in practice I approve your method: scrape the knife against the stone until its the desired sharpness.
But the corse stone will definitely give you a boost. I think
Great video keep it up!
I’ve been sharpening knives 40+ years and have used a lot of different tools and methods. Everyone has their own way and whatever works for “you” is the best way.
Better way? For myself, yes, for you probably not: As someone who spent some time in engineering school to learn how to file metal properly, the one thing we learned there, is to be concentrated on each stroke. (reduces the chances of mishaps)
And to only take off material in one direction. There are several reasons and only the first one is file related:
Files have "pockets" (for a lack of a better word as a non native english speaker) and that's where the material that gets taken off is in until the file leaves the metal.
So pulling it back means pulling those metal pieces over the surface and scratching it up.
The other reasons are: if you only need to concentrate on one direction you have a small break evertime you lift and bring it back into starting position.
And the third one may not be for everybody: when i take off material in both directions it means i make a convex surface. (There are people on the internet who say they get it flat in both directions but i am not among them)
If i only take off material in one direction i can make that flat.
But you do you, as they say, and your results look like it's working for you.
Nice job using both hands... free hand sharpening is one of those things you learn by trial and error and people have their own methods of doing it, but just few tips that ain't too hard to grasp.. after doing that back and forth movement to raise the burr, do say 10 steady strokes with both edge leading and then reverse edge trailing strokes to get that consistent scratch pattern i always finish every stone by doing first 10 strokes per side then 5 then 3 then 1 for few times to get that really even apex.. also sharpening the belly and the tip its better to raise the handle than drive the knife tip into the stone.
Nice work. It's amazing how many people struggle to sharpen a knife. It's not rocket science
I am under the impression that if you have a good angle established on the blade, it shouldn't take too long to bring out an edge. That also depends on how far you are taking the edge. I've seen and once or twice brought a blade to a polish finish/edge. That's some extra work. Your edges look pretty good under the microscope.
Thank you for this avalanche of new content.
If you don't mind a suggestion😊? Try moving the stone mount over to one side. Maybe you can get your hands down to the water easier.Pretty good edge on your freehand. Im 57yrs young and i've been sharpening since i was about 8yrs old. I still learn something new to this day.
I'm tellin ya, you'll have a better result with going all the way heal to tip, back and forth. it's easier to keep consistent and the scratches will be looking and cutting better. lower pressure will help keep your angle more than a bunch of pressure too, i promise. Great video, always love a good sharpenin vid from you.
That looks good and very uniform scratch pattern.
Really like the in op micro review.
Excellent addition to see the progressions in detail.
Cool ! I'm certainly no pro but try to lift your elbow for the tip. With practice and concentration you should be able to feel when the edge is in contact with the stone. Also : since you already master a great sharpening system in your shoes I would prioritize learning :
- how to strop properly , to get to hair whittling sharpness
- how to sharpen smallish blades (5'' or under) holding the stone in one hand, for when you don't have access to your system or are in a hurry. Being good at that is very useful in my experience, and you can get phenomenal results really quickly (as shown by King Christy himself).
Do it till you raise a burr, Pete. Then you switch and do the other side. After you raise a burr on the other side, move up to the next stone.
Pete the Chad of sharpening 🙌
I’ve been hand sharpening for just short of 40 years and now more than ever totally transfixed by it.
I feel like at some point(since he basically gave us an easter egg), we will get an edit of Basel's borthole when he switches to the magnifier....and i am here for it...
When sharpening near the tip of the blade lift the handle end up some. It’ll help you actually sharpen the tip of the blade.
I freehand sharpen 8 or 9 yrs, the best way to do it is the way that gets you results. Muscle memory and consistency. 👍👍🔪
Awesome job man. It’s definitely a hard skill to learn and master. I’m mostly a guided system guy but I mess around in stone every note and then and it’s really hard.
Everyone has to find their own way with freehand sharpening. But if you were interested in a really good overview of Japanese water stone technique, I don't think John Broida of Japanese Knife Imports videos from a bazillion years ago have really been bettered. I specifically mention this as he addresses several things you ran into such as the tip and how to avoid flipping the knife over on the stone
Another shout out for John Broida. His older freehand videos are far and away the best on the subject on CZcams. Much better than Murray Carter.
Howdy Pete! Try raising your elbow when approaching the tip, that should make it easier for you.
I’m trying to learn how to freehand, have a work sharp bench stone and funny enough the strong arm is the main knife I want to sharpen since it arrived dull
We need to get you a nice Cerax 1000 maybe a nice big 'green brick of joy' and a decent 800 grit. Then down the road a 5000+ grit. A flattening stone, a nice leather board strop. And then 'operation turnover' will be complete. We will have successfully dehorsed u from the jigs, tormecs & ts provs and turned u into a master Japanese whetstone sharpener. Maybe get the male version of the kimono too (forget what they are called).
Intressting, verry intressting 👍 I practice freehand sharpening myself, using diamond plates, ceramic composite stones, water stones, diamond rods, ceramic rods and a strop with diamond compound.
Great video mate! I would say elevate your stone so you can get your whole hand on the knife’s handle, which will help with the knife not catching. The other thing is I have had success with rather than twisting the knife away from perpendicular when getting the tip, keep the knife perpendicular and raise the knife butt higher than the tip to sharpen the tip.
A tip for the tip is don't turn the knife, lift the handle (your elbow).
youre pretty good with stones imo
Thumbmeat 12:30 . I'm going to name a child Thumbmeat.
Let’s not, and say we did! Lol...
I’m spoiled with fix angle sharpeners. I don’t even know where my old stones are...
This was very interesting and I appreciated the breakdown of how you held the angle against the stones. I kinda want to try stone sharpening out. How much should you pay for a decent set? They’re pretty cheap online but I don’t know if that’s from a lack of quality or if they’re just generally that affordable, I had expected them to cost a lot more
Thanks for the video. Nice final fantasy 13 music
You have to lock your wrist and use your other hand to stabilize the angle.
You should try with the blade facing you. That may be more comfortable.
Good one!
Entertaining and informative. 😊
Pleasant for once to watch a youtuber not being a pro (or simply showing us that doing things that he isn't a pro at ) .
Yes, keeping correct angle while going from flat to belly to tip makes brains knot
One thing that I know tho is that often the bevel (of the V) will have to look different on the belly and even more on the tip than on the the flat because its angle should not change, but the blade's geometry it's applied on does change (from knife to knife they're different). Meaning you'll often get wider/higher bevels on the belly and tip and that's perfectly ok and the result of maintaining correct angle , disregarding any aesthetic consideration that may, in fact, be error inducing. And this means removing quite a lot more steel from those parts of the blade , and quite more delicate work actually.
Freehand sharpening isn't easy
(and the worst kind of edge to sharpen is a scandi. You think it's the easiest? It's HORRIBLE , you realize how hard it's actually to keep this huge bevel flat on the stone , very very frustrating .Try it !)
09:10 I believe this is textile lint from when you rub the blade onto your sleeves, not bur
10:21 you need to flatten your stone my dood
10:50 it may not be of extreme importance but grit from the previous stone(s) is contaminating the finer grit stone you're using . Better not have different grit in the same bath ..but perhaps that's too much autism
13:24 I would not use my thumb on the "blade hand" and i would definitely not "attack" the stone perpendicularly like this. I reckon the part where you sharpen the belly aznd tip digs into the center of the stone, and then when you go back to flat part of the edge you have both sides of the stones higher than the center rubbing on the blade and perhaps that's when the edge catches on those high spots .. If I'm being clear. What do you think?
I know I'm not particularly good at free hand but I always go diagonal and try to cover as much as the stone as I can
Ok you've done it, I'm going to sharpen now
i really like this video
thanks my dude trying to make something for everyone lately! except the tip down people I suppose
I'm not entirely convinced on having a flat stone, as only up until recently are you not making a convex edge due to jigs existing. All sort of silly to tweak out about a Nagura stone and the go to a strop that rounds your flat edge right over to a convex.
I still used to get excellent edges with my old stone like 15 years ago that was pretty dished out after a few hundred sharpenings
Oh sweet summer child. You think it’s not hurting your thumb… until you put some serious time on stones sharpening a bag full of knives and all of a sudden you see streaks of red on a white stone. Even finer stones grind fingers as well as steel. It sneaks up on ya, and you won’t really know you’ve gone to far until it happens. Careful with those digits. :-)
While this is mostly geared to chef knives, the fundamentals still apply
czcams.com/play/PLEBF55079F53216AB.html
Nice work !
By the way, I'd love to hear your thoughts on sharpening rods! I use ceramic rods with corundum in them, they're from the German company "IOXIO". Usually I go F360, F1000, F1300, F3000 and then stropping with paste that's rated for F6000 and F8000. Yes, it's overkill, but you know how it is with us knife-nuts 🤓
You really need to dress those stones every time, which means grinding off the top layer of each water stone with a designated dressing or other corse stone
Otherwise I love your technique and everything else that would just help you got the most even flat grind you can
Bricky > all sharpening stones
Leave the blade on the stone, don't slice of the stone. This comes in handy when you're sharpening the tip! Let the edge face you
Really one's technique should be so good that you can make the knife as sharp as it needs to be on 400 grit if it's not sharp enough on 400 Grit then you don't have a good enough technique.
The grits that go after 400 and not for sharpening by pros they are for polishing the edge to make the knife look better.
Bricky has a look of astonishment & alarm on his face ! That's right, you could be replaced by those 2 sexy looking stones that spend all their time in the water !
Love your videos! What, in your opinion, is the best factory magnacut folding knife, as far as performance? I would love to see the James Brand Kline and Kershaw Dividend tested with magnacut blades. Thanks!
i probably havent had enough to say for certain yet. I’m looking at those fancy tactile turns for when I’ve got a bit of cash again
More micro-scratchiness! 😍
There's scalpel sharp and then there is hatchet sharp, it depends on the use. Deep thoughts.
Scalpels aren't actually that sharp.
Another interesting video. Thanks. I notice that on both the water stones and using controlled angle systems like the KME that you are a back and forward sharpener rather than one direction only. What are your thoughts on this approach versus the one way approach? For me it seems more efficient, but I can also understand the purists who say things like "never sharpen on to the edge" (or away from it).
Does the Tormek compound smell pretty good like maybe a strong pinecone? I bought a WEN like 10 years ago that I never use, but the compound smells REALLY good like some sort of spices and pinecone
Great stuff.
Educational, entertaining; delivered with humility. Thanks for your work. Where can I buy the microscope?
I think i paid $50 for it from catch of the day sot com - appears brandless/generic 50x - 500x scope
@@CedricAdathat’s a bargain we all benefit from, good catch
Uncle Randy doesnt use pull through sharpeners?
🎶 I free hand sharpen, I buy American 🎶
I tried to waterstone a VG-10 Endura and it somehow put some patina on it where I had put some masking tape which got wet...
Isn't VG-10 supposed to be quite corrosion-resistant ?
Great video series!
Get yourself some good splash and go stones like shapton glass. So much more versatility since you don't have to lug all that water around. And about 10 times less messy.
I use a Shapton Kiro-Maku 320 for re-establishing my apex, and then Shapton Glass 1000 for refining and Shapton Glass 6000 for polishing. Followed by a quick blast on the strop with the green Veritas compound. A cheapo 300 diamond stone for flattening and a Naniwa Nagura to get a slurry started and to clean off the steel that gets embedded in my stones.
I'm really following Kyle Noseworthy here. I used to use messy King soaking stones, but the Shapton splash and goes are a world away. And even though the Shapton glass are pretty thin, they wear really slowly, so I don't think there's a financial disadvangage here. And they work great on the supersteels as well.
Still not as sharp as some would hope. It probably does not shave? Mine was shaving sharp from factory, never got it that sharp again!?
Hi boss！Can you test Kunwu's Vanax?It is a "affordable Vanax”.And It is made by Chinese company.But,It is vanax!wish you new video!
Put the stones away and use that Tormek !!! It’s much faster and easier. That’s why you bought it… leave the stones to the Samurai of the world. Love the videos man
....
Less pressure! Pushing too hard makes dangerous mistakes more likely. Looks like you're already got things down really well besides that.
Comment for engagement
recognition and appreciation
What microscope are you using?
tHaT 240hC iS tHe BeSt StEeL tO EvEr eXiSt.
Nice 👌
What kinda of microscope is that ? Thanks
Do you by chance have German-speaking ancestors? Just noticed you used the word "Schmutz" several times 😃
Waterstone sharpening seems like a cool skill to develop but a senseless waste of time when diamond and ceramic is readily available.
Alot of people do things in this world like watch tv, spend time on social media, drink, smoke, and so on and all those are "a senseless waste of time" yet they do that so taking the time to learn a new skill that has a practical application like learning how to use waterstones to sharpening is a much better use of time.
@@Horde334 I'm actually a pretty big fan of learning unusual skills. I've been learning to sharpen on rocks and abrasives you find in the woods. The bottom of coffee mugs and the top of car windows are so much easier.
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