Did Chaos Daemons Just Become the Best Army in 40k? | Pariah Nexus Dataslate Review
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- čas přidán 1. 07. 2024
- #warhammer40k #chaosdaemons #tabletopsimulator #40k
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Today I'll be going over some of the changes Chaos Daemons received with the latest Balance Dataslate & FAQ's for 10th Edition Warhammer 40k / Pariah Nexus. From our upgraded army rules for Greater Daemons, point drops & some of the general gameplay rules changes
I genuinely believe Chaos Daemons are poised to take the wh40k competitive tournament scene by storm by taking advantage of our hyper mobility & scoring potential, along with our generally great unit profiles from some of our Greater Daemons + other unit options
Let me know what YOU think though!
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/ @fatarchon
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Daemons were already one of the better armies in 10th Edition 40k (imho!) & now with the new dataslate we've received literally nothing but buffs. Sadly I can't say the same for some of the other Chaos armies (Chaos Space Marines especially got hit hard, but we'll look at them later). Chaos Knights luckily got some love & fortunately Death Guard, Thousand Sons & World Eaters got off lightly at least.
This is great for not only tournament play but even casual games of Warhammer 40k. Running a mono god army list has never been more viable, so if you're a huge Slaanesh fan or Nurgle fanatic etc you have way more options for writing up a good/fun army list. Want to spam Keeper of Secrets? Go on ahead!
I'd love to hear your guys' thoughts on how Chaos Daemons will perform in Pariah Nexus & beyond - am I crazy & overrating them? Are there any units you think will especially 'pop' with the new point adjustments? Let me know!
If you have any questions please post a comment below or email me through TheFatArchon@gmail.com
For Chaos Daemons tactics & army lists check out my "How to Get the Most out of Chaos Daemons in 2024" guide at:
• Getting the Most Out o...
For info on how to play Warhammer 40k through Tabletop Simulator, check out my latest TTS Tutorial at:
• How to Play Warhammer ...
TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Intro
00:52 Army Rule Changes
01:39 Why is that such a big deal?
03:30 Point Changes
07:11 General Rule Changes
08:41 Overall Thoughts
09:18 Mono Gods & List Variety
09:54 Fiends of Slaanesh are looking GREAT
10:40 The Best Part
11:12 Closing Thoughts
Thanks for watching!! - Hry
Chaos Daemons are looking the best they've looked all of 10th edition & I think we're poised to start taking over the top tables. The best part though: we're *fair*, nothing is obviously broken or OP so the odds of getting nerfed into the ground is pretty slim. That said I'd love to hear your guys' thoughts on the new Dataslate! It's sucks that CSM got hit so hard but I'll address them in another video
Either way, thank you guys for watching & let me know if I missed anything or you have any questions along the way!
Thanks for the shoutout! I do believe some enhancements will go up in points in the future. Other than that i see no immediate nerfs coming. Excited to get my daemons back on the table after grinding codex games with my csm!
Yeah Enhancements & potentially the GUO, at least for dataslates. When the codex drops then sky's the limit though. There's so many directions they could take the army (tho I'm betting we have a while hah)
I'm stoked to get more games in with my Daemons too. I was actually kinda sad when the CSM codex dropped because I was having so much fun with them but it was good to shake things up for a bit :P I'll still be playing both but I think for tournaments I'll prolly lean towards Daemons again
Appreciate ya Nick!
If the warp permits, I'll be playing my first game of Warhammer in a few weeks with my Daemons. I'm super hyped, and as a new player, I really appreciate how GW gave the Greater Daemons auras as well, really opens up for list building - For while I am mostly focusing on collecting units I find cool and enjoy painting, I am a rather competitive gamer :D
Thanks for all the videos!
Oh snap, best of luck on your match man!! Great to hear you'll get to enjoy all of 40k & not "just" the hobby side of things! Don't sweat winning or anything yet, that'll come naturally as you improve but yeah man I hope you have some fun :P Remember: scoring > all lol
battleshocked a riptide with a skull cannon after deepstriking within 3" of it w a keeper and fiends. then charged the fiends in and popped rr Wounds and tipped it over and just started to totally disturb his backline. they get distracted by the greaters then i let the fiends and bloodcrushers run amok. genuinely strong melee with shockingly good shooting coming from 3/4 greaters (GUO KoS and LoC) along with some hidden gems like nurgle and tzeentch grinders and even skull cannons. only a few more pieces to get left and im gonna be a hardcore daemon player and genuine threat.
Yeah man that Draught of Terror strat is crazy good when it goes off. That sounds like quite the wombo combo you got off too lol; I bet that Tau player thought it'd be a cake walk going into it 😜 I *was* playing CSM as my tournament army but I'm heavily considering swapping back to Daemons (prolly do both tbh!)
@fatarchon funny you say that. Im doing that exact same thing. My deceptors marines kept getting paired into heavy vehicles....
After I saw the increases to csm I said f that im switching to daemons
Cant believe the endless gift Great Unclean One didnt go up
This is great news. I just KNEW one day my favorite fraction would rise back to the top. I've got 4000+ points to touch up and play out. It's gonna be a great year.
Yeah man I've been painting the rest of my Daemons like a madman :P Pretty much got them done but I'm with you, incredibly excited to get them out on the table
Did some quick math, and I'm just short of having a full 2000pts of Pure Nurgle Daemons (Would make it easily without the rule of 3. They keep massacring the unit of size of Beasts of Nurgle, so jokes on me owning 10 converted ones). Anyway, I think this is a pretty exciting. I haven't played them in 40k often, so thanks for bringing the changes to our attention, Archon!
Daemons have become one of my favorite armies in 10th so hopefully you end up digging them too, ofc it comes down to preference / playstyle but they fit my style pretty well
& yeah GW loves pulling the rug on units like that hah. Luckily I 3D printed most of mine but yeah I ended up giving most of my BoN away once they changed the unit sizes. Chaos Spawn got screwed too, I had *15* from when you could run them in 5's but now they're terribad hah. Oh well, keeps things interesting... I guess :P
Mono Nurgle has never been more viable in 10th so you should be pretty set! GUO + Endless Gift is the real deal
Nice Vid, thanks. Already played a game with the new changes yesterday and absolutely love the fact we actually have an army rule now.
The enhancement thing is wild. Keeper of secrets-1 to hit 5+fnp with shining ageis and with soulstealer heals wounds on 3+ per MODEL. So charge unit of weak infantry like boyz or whatever, wipe it, then reliably heal back half your wounds it's broken as hell. Won't be long before it nerfed so enjoy it while it lasts.
Tbh I don't foresee it getting too nerfed anytime soon. Maybe some point hikes but I'm betting we'll have to wait until the codex before they really change at all (just my opinion obviously!). Either way, yes it's quite strong lol - what's funny too is the Soulstealer is the least popular enhancement but they're *all* fantastic!!
I have been summoned, also my GUO is so good now compared to the start of the edition. When I started my army with the goal of being mono nurgle it was not very good, but this entire edition I have only gotten better. Remember kids rule of cool is far more fun than the meta
Any Chance u can make a Video of your List Building Process for the new Daemons? Literally one of the most interesting parts of Warhammer for me.
I've been meaning to hit that topic for a long time now hah. I don't ever want to promise a video but for sure it's something I'm considering, so I'll see what I can do man. Now that GDs can replace Belakor I think we have way more options too
Alright, either way love your content mate. And Yes, I think there are a lot of valid lists now.
The shadow of chaos change for the greater daemons is awesome for those who like to mono army, it also makes it so Be’lakor while still being powerful isn’t requirement for shadow of chaos. I’m surprised there wasn’t some points increases to great unclean ones or at least the enhancement. While I think a lot of armies have been brought up from this new dataslate, only time will tell to see who comes out on top. I think chaos daemons won’t be in the top 3 but on the upper end of rankings.
I'd bet next dataslate they'll hike up the GUO points a bit (well, hopefully just the Enhancement as that's the only thing that makes him so good). I do wonder where Daemons will pan out rating wise, I wouldn't be surprised if it *was* top 3 but you're probably right. Definitely in the top ~1/4 or so I'd think though!
New subscriber here now. I play only chaos daemons. Started maybe a few months about but built up a 2K list
Love your videos really positive vibe. Would you ever consider doing like a tts gameplay commentary with ur daemons vs another competitive list kinda thing? I'd be really curious to listen to your overall thoughts and strategy when playing competitively. Just thinking out loud, keep up the great videos!!
I'd definitely consider something like that, that's actually a really good suggestion tbh. I can't ever promise videos (they take a lot more time then people might assume hah) but for sure I'll keep it in mind man! Appreciate the input
So happy with this update !
thank you for the great work Mr Archon
I love the way you explain things and your insight.
keep it up my guy :)
you may not have mentioned the 1 CP heroic intervention which is huge for a close combat army!! The tank shock nerf also is important, the grenade nerf etc... all those rules we cannot profit from
Great points! & yeah I agree pretty much all the Strategem changes did nothing but benefit us. Hell I'd say we're the biggest winners of any army when it comes to that (& we're up there with the new pivot rules too). Such a great dataslate for Daemons, not a single thing to complain about really
... Well, for Daemons that is 😜
"Rules that enable you to target a unit from your
army with a Stratagem for 0CP, but that do not specify
the name of the Stratagem (e.g. a Captain’s Rites of
Battle ability), instead reduce the CP cost of that use
of that Stratagem by 1CP."
Heroic Intervention is specifically named on units that have it on their card, so this change doesn't affect them? Or am I misreading something?
Having a crazy month at work so I got a bit behind watching the videos. Aside from the Lord of Change being the first model I ever got in 1994, I have zero Daemons in my collection. He's grown a lot since then.
Shoot, you're good Sellers! I got sucked into Elden Ring so wasn't busting out vids every other day so you picked a good time lmao
I *love* the OG Lord of Change model btw. He's so small & goofy, it's just oozing with charm. I'd love to get one & put it on a modern base to run in games, probably have to stack him in a mountain so he's tall enough but man that'd be awesome
Daemons aren't too terrible to get into. The Greater Daemons are expensive for sure but *all* of their Battleline & a fair bit of their other kits are still "only" $30USD which is wild for GW pricing. Still, the GDs are nigh mandatory so it sorta evens out I guess :P
I no longer have to call it Codex: Bel'Akor. My god. Nothing steams my hams like a mandatory epic hero.
Might pick up some daemonettes and fiends for my Chaos army and build up from there.
....might convert some Daughters of Khaine, just to make it extra confusing if I double dip and run them in AoS
Great Video. Sadly my Demons are going onto the shelf. I really like playing underdog armys and demons are top tier in my eyes. Time to print another army. Keep Up your awesome content
I know exactly where you're coming from lol, I love my underdogs too. Guess you could go to CSM if you wanted now that GW screwed us again 😜 (I joke, I joke, they're not *completely* screwed imho)
Maybe try winning with them before shelving them, see what you think!
Don't worry, stat-check called daemons as still the easiest army to get 99vp against. Even more than knights
@@fatarchonyou guessed right. Printing CSM at the moment😅
Couldn't agree more! Daemons are looking sooo good right now. Great video as always Archon
Thank you brother! Yeah man I'm in 7th heaven (7th Garden of Nurgle?)
The fact we got across the board buffs without going up even a single point is awesome hah
I played my first game ever of 40k with my Mono Slaanesh Army with the new rules and won by turn 2. The KoS with Soulstealer will just regen so much the other player will give up on killing it. Shalaxi is still causing morale issues too my opponent when she murders their tank in a single turn..
Woot, congrats on the win Nyssa!! KoS + Shalaxi is a hardcore combo, especially love the idea of boosting Shalaxi even further with the Keepers +1AP aura hah. It's funny to me how resilient they are considering they're Slaanesh but meh 😜
Love you vids although I’m really starting to hate the lord discordant 😂 surprised he didn’t make it into this vid! I’d love to see a vid on what value you can get out of cult marines in the new codex. You mentioned Rubrics and Plague in Vets but wondered if there is good use elsewhere
Hating the Lord Disco?!? That's it, you're blocked 😜 Man, I was really holding my breath GW would *finally* forgive his previous sins & give him a points drop but alas I guess we have another couple years before he atones himself
Appreciate the suggestion! That would be a fun topic to cover, no promises but I'll see what I can do
@@fatarchon noooo I take it back XD! But yeah he is too much for sure, and I do love the dedication to him haha. But GW were heavy handed in general with nerfs for chaos >.< poor havocs!
love your work.
great video, keep it up
Will plaguebearers be good since they have sticky obj and are a battle line unit that can do actions for the new battle line secondary missions? Curious on your thoughts.
Extremely. Plaguebearers are a staple in competitive play, both for me & other tournament players (pretty much every GT+ list I've seen brings one). I usually just keep them at home to screen my DZ but what's great is they can withstand most of the normal skirmishers that come your way, or at least tie them up long enough that you can just ignore them. It's esp beautiful when your opponent spends 2 turns whittling them down just for you to pass a BS test & start regening back to near full 😜
So yes, I'd highly recommend a squad of them for almost every list
@@fatarchon awesome currently my list has 2
I wonder how a monogod Tzeentch list would look like now admittedly. Is it still Lord of Change spam? Been trying to get into playing them for a long while, but I genuinely don't know where to start even.
Hmm, you don't see all that much mono Tzeentch BUT the ones I have seen don't spam LoC. I think you'd go something along the lines of Kairos + LoC + Changeling & Fateskimmer (or DP?) with some pinks & a boatload of Flamers / Screamers. Prolly include a Soul Grinder or two for more heavy firepower. Maybe a Burning Chariot for the ignore cover too
So yeah you don't at all have to just spam Greater Daemons with them! You can always toss in Belakor if you wanted to go that route too
@@fatarchon Are there any penalties for mixing in daemons from other gods? Or I just have to use Belakor for it all to work out?
Neither! Currently there is absolutely zero downside to mixing gods, with or without Belakor. So go wild man
Could you recommend a few early purchases to make if im just getting into 40k and want to make a daemon army? I like all the different gods pretty equally, maybe preferring Tzeentch a bit, but I dont want to buy units that wouldn't ever benefit me building an army.
Sure man! So one thing to keep in mind is that all of the Battleline kits are some of the cheapest GW sells (they're universally $30 I do believe), so I'd def pick up at least one kit for each of the gods you like. That'd let you use them for allies on the future too.
I'd strongly recommend a Greater Daemon or 3 (lol). I'd say the GUO is the best but if I'm being honest his playstyle is kinda boring to some people so it's debateable if he's worth getting early. Otherwise you really can't go wrong with any of them. Lord of Change is great for ranged play so if you want to mainly go Tzeentch he's great. One tip I'd give is to build whatever GD you pickup with the named characters head & then magnetize their loadout. That way you can use them generic or epic. Keeper is very strong & could double as Shalaxi for example. For straight up murder I'd say either Shalaxi or Bloodthirster (or Skarbrand but he's a separate kit)
Beyond those tips.. If you get the Combat Patrol you'd have a good Khorne base to build off of. Otherwise I'd deeeefinitely look at getting some Flamers & Nurglings as they work in every army. Pro tip for Nurglings is to split their sprues when building so you get x2-3 models per box, just gotta buy bases
Screamers are great for objectives but not much else. Otherwise Seekers are incredibly cheap (both pts / irl) & make s tier move block or scouts
If you get Pink Horrors be sure to pickup some Blue Horrors for when they split. Can be a hidden cost of them
Hope that helps man! I have a video on collecting Daemons you might enjoy too FYI 😜
Hey FA,
Absolutely love the content man; always watch and would love to support you financially when I can.
Here’s a 2000 list I have come up with for a game coming up in early July.
What do you think???
Massively appreciate all your feedback 🙌🙌
Daemons June 2024 (2000 Points)
Chaos Daemons
Daemonic Incursion
Strike Force (2000 Points)
CHARACTERS
Bloodthirster (325 Points)
• 1x Great axe of Khorne
1x Hellfire breath
• Enhancements: A’rgath, The King of Blades
Great Unclean One (260 Points)
• 1x Bilesword
1x Plague flail
1x Putrid vomit
• Enhancements: The Endless Gift
Shalaxi Helbane (450 Points)
• 1x Lash of Slaanesh
1x Pavane of Slaanesh
1x Snapping claws
1x Soulpiercer
Skarbrand (305 Points)
• Warlord
• 1x Bellow of endless fury
1x Slaughter and Carnage
The Changeling (90 Points)
• 1x Infernal Flames
1x The Trickster’s Staff
BATTLELINE
Bloodletters (120 Points)
• 1x Bloodreaper
• 1x Hellblade
• 9x Bloodletter
• 9x Hellblade
Nurglings (40 Points)
• 3x Nurgling Swarm
• 3x Diseased claws and teeth
Nurglings (40 Points)
• 3x Nurgling Swarm
• 3x Diseased claws and teeth
Plaguebearers (110 Points)
• 1x Plagueridden
• 1x Plaguesword
• 9x Plaguebearer
• 1x Instrument of Chaos
9x Plaguesword
Plaguebearers (110 Points)
• 1x Plagueridden
• 1x Plaguesword
• 9x Plaguebearer
• 1x Instrument of Chaos
9x Plaguesword
OTHER DATASHEETS
Beasts of Nurgle (70 Points)
• 1x Putrid appendages
Seekers (80 Points)
• 1x Heartseeker
• 1x Lashing tongue
1x Slashing claws
• 4x Seeker
• 1x Instrument of Chaos
4x Lashing tongue
4x Slashing claws
Exported with App Version: v1.17.0 (40), Data Version: v430
Appreciate the appreciation man! Glad to hear you're digging the channel, never thought I'd have "fans" for something lol
As for the list, this is all just my opinion obviously / we all have our styles buuuut...
Personally I'd never run Bloodletters naked. They kinda suck without support from a Bloodmaster or Skulltaker &, optimally, a Rendmaster
You have a decent chunk of Khorne so I totally would consider the Rendmaster tho you could prolly eek by without one
To get the points for all that, if you went that route, I'd consider dropping one of the Plaguebearers + potentially downgrade Shalaxi to a KoS. That'd give you... 270pt I believe
Shalaxi is still banging tho so just dropping the PBs would give you some extra points to work with, but I do think she's a tad overcosted
Hope that helps brother!!
Love your work... and chaos is kind of fucked, so ...;. appreciate your thoughts.
Meanwhile stat-check pretty mucb calls them still the easiest army to get 99 against
So for 105 pts you get 15 attacks on 3s, so 10 S5 AP2 D2 hits, it kills like 3 MEQs, maybe 1 TEQ. What am I not getting about fiends
It's more than just damage imho, just overall efficiency for the points. With the - 1tH aura they're not that far behind even Bloodcrushers at survivability (though for sure Crushers are still superior), which also helps the rest of your army survive. I think the big advantage is having the Beast kw so they're able to move through walls to help with actions or counter charging while offering way more than Flesh Hounds or similar beasts.
UnitCrunch gives them a 60% chance of wiping a 5-man MEQ squad which is fair for the cost & with Dev Wounds they can do decent damage into any profile. Sure it's not the flashiest output ever but they're *105pt* so you can throw them away as a distraction or objective holder & not feel bad about it
Maybe I am overrating them but for my playstyle at least I always rate point efficiency highly!
@@fatarchon so let's compare them to BCs. For 5 pts more you get 3 models that hit harder, are tougher, that deep strike better, and synergize with Skarbrand and Khorne, the statistical best mono faction to date. You are still running nurglings, which have a better aura
Too much energy, I like you videos from 1 month better. But that might just be a personal thing
Nah that's fair man, even I've noticed it's changed over time. Tbh it's kinda hard to control hah / it helps me get through the vids in under 2hrs 😜 but everyone has their own tastes so I get it!
@@fatarchon thank you for listening to me! It means much, regardless if you end up changing anything or not. For other youtubers I don‘t really care, but I really like your style so it meant something to me.
Enhancenemts don't work by default now, because Big Daemons don't actually produce Shadow Of Chaos. They allow you to receive benefits from your army rule and detachment rule, but Shadow Of Chaos is only generated by controlling objectives and Belakor, same as before
Hmmmm, you might've missed the 2nd half of the Daemon changes tbh. The first part says:
"While an enemy unit is within your army’s Shadow of Chaos **and/or it is within 6" of one or more Bloodthirster, Keeper of Secrets.....**, each time that unit takes a Battle-shock test, subtract 1 from that test" so enemies would suffer
Then the 2nd half of the dataslate for profile changes says each GD has a 6" SoC aura that effects their own God's units (including themselves!):
DATASHEETS Bloodthirster and Skarbrand, Abilities Add the following to both datasheets: ‘Greater Daemon of Khorne (Aura): While a friendly Khorne Legiones Daemonica unit is within 6" of this model, that unit is within your army’s Shadow of Chaos.’
They got a glowup but they are far from the best.
Yeah I agree, even though I had to go with the clickbait title mwhaha. Either way they're still 'up there'!