ANDREW KING :PINK FLOYD'S FIRST MANAGER RECALLS SYD BARRETT'S GENIUS & "DEVASTATING" WITHDRAWAL
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- čas přidán 14. 10. 2023
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Andrew King and Peter Jenner were Pink Floyd's first managers.
Although I filmed the interview for the 2001 documentary "The PINK FLOYD AND SYD BARRETT STORY", it was never used. This is the first time these largely unedited "rushes" tapes have been seen.
#davidgilmour #sydbarrett #pinkfloyd #rogerwaters #richardwright #nickmason #peterjenner #andrewking
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Andrew's was my favourite interview of your series. His care for Syd the person, and respect for him as an artist are palpable.
I actually found the interviews with Nick Kent very interesting - he’s very vitriolic, but his outsider perspective gives a very different take on events and that was interesting.
Yes Nick is very interesting. Not a huge Roger fan!@@TimvanderLeeuw
Me too
I actually found it the most weird and guilt dominated. Peter Jenner, on the other hand, was relaxed, clear, insightful.
An abolutely essential perspective! This interview is fantastic. Since 20 years have passed by perhaps Mr. King may be more inclined to divulge those sensitive details?
John, once again, thank you for these interviews. They are a treasure to us Floyd fans. It is so painfully obvious of what Syd meant to everybody and what a huge tragedy this was. I can tell Andrew still feels this pain today.
Definitely the most emotionally intense interview
Of the collection of interviews, I enjoy Andrew King’s insights most.
This interview is gold. There's so much garbage information going around Pink Floyd, but John Edginton gets substantial, no-nonsense information from the horse's mouth.
It's nice to hear someone point out that Barrett's use of a cigarette lighter as a guitar slide was inspired by Keith Rowe's guitar work in AMM.
Thanks for appreciating. You’re very kind.
What a powerful interview--one of the best I've seen from someone who worked closely with Barrett. Thank you Andrew and John.
Thanks for the upload 🙏.
Andrew is a great guy, I live in the same town in Scotland as Andrew. He comes into my shop quite regularly. He is a very nice guy who always chats . He did a great Q&A in September at a local venue. Such an interesting life he has had. Hopefully he will publish his autobiography soon.✌️🙏
I can second this, Andrew was my next door neighbour in Twickenham. Lovely guy and very funny.
Great interview, as always, although Andrew does skirt around the elephant in the room, that being Syd’s drug use. It’s well known that Syd was a heavy user of Mandrax - which was widely used at the time. Mandrax is a sedative-hypnotic drug, which would account for his 1,000-yard stare, his cognitive impairment, slurred speech and depression. The sedative and hypnotic effects of methaqualone are greatly increased when it’s mixed with other central nervous system depressants such as alcohol or cannabis. It is also highly addictive and withdrawal symptoms are horrendous. At the time, it was considered a “love drug”, hence, I suppose, its popularity. I ran into many “Mandied” people in London at that time and the symptoms match. In my opinion, for what it’s worth, if you want to find the real key to “what happened to Syd”, look no further.
it always surprises me how much the well-known recollections downplay or flat-out ignore Mandrax
Good point
Syd's mandrax intake doesn't fit Roger Waters' narrative of the mental breakdown. If you look at their concert schedule in 67 it was pretty hectic, and the pressure was on Syd to keep coming up with new songs.
Syd never wanted to leave the band, but he didn't have Roger's drive and ambition.
@@jono1457-qd9ft Roger Waters' "narrative" is mostly bullshit. Do your research instead of buying into the myths foisted on us to make Pink Floyd sound more interesting.
“Got any Mandies?” Is now on at The Garrick Theatre.
Very moving interview. A compassionate man.
I am very much enjoying the set of Syd Barret and Pink Floyd interviews. Can anyone shed a light on the time Syd Barret was living at the Hilton Hotel, Park Lane, London. Prior to, around and beyond Sept 1975 (when the Hilton was bombed) I had a freelance residency playing guitar in a group at the London Hilton. We played half hour relief band spots in the 007 Bar on the mezzanine floor and the restaurant on the 26 floor and spent our 10 minute breaks moving via the elevators from from room to room with our guitars in tow (always via the closest pub 'The Mayfair') and regularly saw Syd in that period mainly in the Mezzanine foyers. We never actually had a conversation with Syd but as time went on and we (more or less at least once a night crossed paths with Syd) there was acknowledgement. (Nodding terms and the occasional good evening Syd). At that time Syd was overweight with close shaved hair and to me seemed a lonely and lost soul. It was a strange period at the London Hilton as every night for months after the bombing was chaotic with bomb scares, lift lock outs and evacuations. I wonder if anyone knows the circumstances of why Syd was living at the hotel during this period.
Thanks for this. I think King comes across very well, and his pain over what happened Syd is clearly so genuine
I've been wondering for years why there's videos with Peter but none with Andrew King. This is amazing!
Thanks for all your documentaries, John. They are all absolutely amazing. So glad I came across your channel.
Glad you like them!
What an intelligent and thoughtful interview, with an open, honest and very human interviewee. The best so far.
Much appreciated. Thanks !
I always wondered why Jenner's testimony was always present and King was completely absent. I thought it was a production's big mistake not to have the testimony of both. What a nice surprise and also how strange that they have never used this testimony. He's a pillar of this wonderful story. Thanks, John. greetings from Argentina.
Very potent example of hindsight in this interview. . The shame and regret about the way Syd was treated is so obvious. So sad.
Thank for for having interviews with members of my favorite band and one of the best bands in the world the best to me
Great interview,
Andrew King obviously still cares about Syd and is very affected by what happened.
Never seen an interview with Andrew before.
Thank you for sharing this.
I think Dark Globe is a completed work as is Here I Go, Dominoes, Terrapin and many others. A song doesn't need to be polished and shiny to be a great recording as he suggests.
Those closing comments about Sid not realising his mature work made me think how many that left us before they really got into the full swing of their creativity.
I suppose I should be just grateful that Sid and many others did put their work to wax.
Thank you for putting this interview out.
So interesting and special, particularly about the human side. Many thanks John, these are gems to every
lover of Syd
Brilliant! Ive been waiting to see this. Thanks John 👍
Thanks for recording and posting this important history.
Thank you so much yet again, John! Pure gold, and even more so. "You can see what happened to Syd in ten different ways, and explain it in ten different ways, and they're all partially true" - perhaps the most valid, perceptive and balanced comment ever uttered on the subject. And so emotional, honest and raw.
Another treasure you have here John!! Thanks.
It was lovely to hear Andrew King's memories and thoughtful reflections on Syd's creative talents, and their friendship. A welcome change from the sensationalised manner often encountered when Syd's life is discussed. Thank you for this interview!
Excelent and emotional interview thanks for share 👏🏻 syd❤
Best one yet John, thanks for sharing
Glad you enjoyed it
Excellent interview that gives valuable insights into Syd’s genius and the personal and artistic tragedy of his cataclysmic decline. Thanks for posting.
So good to get your appreciation. Thanks
Wonderful interview. So refreshing to hear someone who had direct experience with Syd to lift the mythological veil
( of sorts )
Thanks, John. I really enjoyed this one. Great interview. :)
Glad you enjoyed it!
ooooo awesome i've been waiting for this one! really good and humanizing interview - i love what he said about how many different, all partially true, ways there are to interpret what happened. it's quite interesting just how many people in this series say something to that effect regarding the nuance of it all, compared to the steadfast "he was crazy" narrative that so many other parties, including other band members, have really pushed into public opinion. super curious about the statement at 39:12 lol... can't help but feel it is related to that exact aforementioned discrepancy - i can imagine the band, or at least Waters, having been quite callous about it all at the time
Another great interview!
Thanks for reposting, John! This is one of my favorites of all your interviews
My pleasure!
@@JOHNEDGINTONDOCUMENTARIES - Hope you are well. As the decades roll on, these interviews you conducted 20 years ago remain the most enduring video documents on Syd and the early Floyd. What a treasure trove it all is! I only wish there were more in your archives. I watch all of these regularly and always find something new or compelling that I hadn't seen before
Thanks a million, John 👏
My pleasure !
Thank you John for sharing the story. Wonderful and sad.
One of my favourite ones yet John, very personal and touching.
Yes .. I agree. Very touching
Syd's work was one of the vein from which punk would hail from. So ironic that Pink Floyd itself would become opposite to that "punk" spirit. As he once said, "No rules, no rules."
Thats sounds like a quote from that Mathew blokes book.(Childhood freind of Syd).I met him in Cambridge a few years ago.Wish I coukd remember his second name.Interesting bunch of guys from a very artisticaly fertile time and place.Not sure it had much to do with punk though.Pioneering spirit maybe...but lyricaly and musicaly way, way beyond it.
Absolutely fascinating, John! Great documentary about my favorite Pink Floyd member...Syd. Keep up the great work.
Thanks !
andrew king is a really charming gent.
Completely agree.
It's hard to find his recent looks. Thanks for the interview!
Outstanding interview, very moving.
Thank you
John, your interviews are the best. I always learn something new every time I watch. Thanks so much for all of your great work!
Wow, thanks!
@@JOHNEDGINTONDOCUMENTARIES You're welcome, John. As a long time Pink Floyd fan, these interviews are absolute treasures.
@@JOHNEDGINTONDOCUMENTARIES thank you for recording a piece of history. i am watching from Houston Texas
A truly amazing insight and interview
Thanks so much for your appreciation!
Wishing you a most enjoyable week!Emotional and another viewpoint on what happened with Syd.
imho ... the most insightful of these interviews ... critical thinking about culture/s, individual creative expression and the multiplicity of perception
Amazing piece of history here told by someone who was actually there! Thanks for the video.
My pleasure!
I put this on the other day as I went to bed, pretty sure I got through it all though. I will listen to it once more. Thank you for this. King's point about the solo work being more like non-finalized drafts, seems like a very important piece of all this to me. Yes, I think it shows the inside of the artist's head, where the creative process is still at the mid-point, and the work is still gestating. I would contrast all of the solo work to Piper, wherein there is a real feeling, to me, that the music and lyric have been 'melted down,' from a sort of prior creative enormity.
If piper were from the solo album era, it would be far denser with lyrical and musical ideas, and although it would have an important/recognizable spark, it would be unshaven and lacking focus
But I think that with the solo work, the aesthetic has to be with just being as content as you can , with just seeing the unformed creative spark. No musical idea or lyrical idea seems left out - it is all unedited, rough, and sometimes gratingly so. I cannot tell how it should have been edited. I just get the sense that something it incomplete
And unfortunately, I also get the sense that something is wrong. There seems to be something physically or biologically damaged, to my ear, in regard to the way that poor Syd strummed the guitar and sang, on those solo works. So perhaps, there is something about that which also 'competes' (perhaps not a good word) with the more or less objective fact of the creative incompleteness. It is difficult to understand which factor comes before which, in the whole ontology of it
Amazing, John. I always wondered why Andrew was not in the film. Thank you very much for sharing these with us, sir.
My pleasure!
Dear John, - Fascinating interviews, from the point of view as a documentation on the mindset, culture and mentality in those times in how people coped and understood mental breakdown and effects of drugs, which people didn't know much of then ( rather than a Pink Floyd story ).
It is interesting that there is also a kind of mantra from the band members, regards some specific anecdotes. People around get criticised when one of them has severe mental breakdown, or even guilt, when it is beyond their control. Andrew seems to portray that, the long confusion and stress it causes and 'powerlessness'. Andrew seems to have been really traumatised by it - and not much advice or support in those days. Credit to Andrew King for how thoughtful about the legacy and the human being at the same time.
Great interview. Great interviewee!
Thank you so much !
Thanks again ! @davidandhelen4657 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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AMM guitarist is Keith Rowe.
Andrew , thank you so much for your commentary about Syd Barrett . I indeed think Syd was a genius with his music and song writing and lyrics .
I have followed the Pink Floyd Band all the way through starting with Syd and moving through with David Gilmours exceptional guitar work and Roger Waters exceptional participation to make the band continue to flow!
@32:57 very touching and incredibly sad. A poetic memory which this gentleman has kept quite keen in his mind's eye over the years, the vision of Syd, the hint of madness, the aullusion os his having been touched by the grace of something more. One gets a sense of the gravity of Syd's leaving by his emotional response and how big the ripple appears to have been in the lives of the ancillary characters.
the only sad part is associates (who aren't artists) creating more 'lore' about a real artist
Thank you very much ,never heard this guy
This is excellent. Thanks for uploading John. As I recall, none of this footage featuring Andrew found it’s way into the “Syd Barrett Story” Documentary. Why was that John?
Hindsight is a wonderful thing . In 2001 .. there were clearly some hasty decisions taken in the intensity of a very tight edit schedule to deliver doc to bbc .. I recall that we had a 65 min cut which featured Andrew..but when forced to cut to 50 mins by the execs we took decision to leave in Peter Jenner and take out Andrew. I'm delighted I managed to retrieve the old tapes here.
@@JOHNEDGINTONDOCUMENTARIES sure glad you did John !! Thanx 😊😊
Keith Rowe. Used to play the guitar with a transistor radio.
Syd was the real deal.
What a real human who had a real mental breakdown ?
@@allaboutthebclicksinnit1148 He means Syd did not compromise on his beliefs when it came to the music business I believe.
@@CheeseCrumbs00 I guess not but due to his state, what he believed or made became irrelevant unfortunately.
Also, i seems in the early days of the TOTP appearances, none of the band wanted to be a singles pop band either.
I guess there's a choice, to take a contract or not. Seems EMI decided that having a Gilmour was a better option than struggling with someone not the full ticket, even if his ideas of getting a saxophone payer and banjo player were creative and we never saw much of that 'real deal' in the end .
I'll write my 3 points here:
Disclaimer:
The only purpose of this comment is to address properly the stigmatization that, sometimes, acquaintances do to someone (by labeling them "with mental issues" or "crazy"), when, in fact, there has probably been disappointment and depression.
End of Disclaimer
A) Waters labelled Barrett "Crazy" (when all other interviews, like the ones in this channel, say he wasn't crazy at all; only depressed, mostly; that's Syd's friends and family narrative). So the label seems a bit overdramatized. (Only Waters amatteurly said 'schizophrenic' when there has never been such a medical diagnosis).
B) they NEVER approached Syd (nor did they say "sorry"). Not even in the 80s or 90s. That's the kind of distance that grow between old band mates who had friction/competition between them (like in many bands from the 60s, 70s). That's not the kind of distance with "a friend who is depressed" (I'm siding with the friends' n family, not the official narrative, here).
C) for the cause of Syds "depression", when analyzing the pre-1968 era, everything fits into place if you add the "there was strain in the band with Syd's one-person success" hypothesis.
If that strain had been related to the demand of the industry, then it might have been manifested in "not giving enough support to Syd" (or even worse, taking the opportunity to pressure him to go; particularly Waters, who - I think - wanted to 'Set the Controls For the Heart of the Band', to convey more attention towards the rest of the band, not only to Barrett. I, personally like Waters' music; I just think it is more fair for Syd [and for all of the Syds in the world] if Waters made that point clear).
This ego-battle happen in many bands, but in this case, it is a little different:
Syd went uncommunicative (unwilling to defend himself from friends stabbing in the back) and Waters put out his narrative, without appearing any answer by Syd.
I say Syd was disappointed with his band mates, also lost his major achievement and lost all of his friends (and father), and was so depressed, he went into a not fighting back state.
schizophrenia does seem to fit most of the accounts I've heard, and I have first hand experience of it knowing a few people who suffered, medication for it also causes diabetes which Syd had
@@NickSBailey I assume you are addressing item A).
I used to think like you, for a long time.
But after careful consideration of all accounts and all the facts, I realized there were more amount of people who knew Syd well and said the contrary to the narrative of Roger Waters. You could argue these acquaintances knew Syd even better than the Pink Floyd members; mainly Syd's family members and Syd's friends after PF, for instance.
Also, if you read the comments made by the creator of these videos (John) there are several arguments that disregard the schizophrenia hypothesis based on several causes. It has an overarching and diffuse definition, and practically anyone, including a guy who is a bit depressed (for any of several reasons, discussed elsewhere) could fall into that category. Syd's family members do admit that they are all in the (now widely known) 'autistic spectrum', and if you know anything about it, you'll realize why there is support for a case of misclassification.
So Syd, apparently, was not 'crazy'. And in item B) I address the question "if he had been crazy, why would you call him 'crazy' inside a song to be played all around the world?.. is that the way lifetime friends treat each other?".
That, combined with item C) [ I could add more evidence in this item ] points to a different and more complete hypothesis.
@@tomtaba5564agree, how cruel some of those songs are- the ‘lunatic is on the grass’. Dark and scary and so horrible. No empathy. Shame.
The lyrics are crude and juvenile. Imagine being treated as that type of "muse'.
There was a recent interview with Syd's sister on fingal's cave podcast. She talks about her brother being lost to drugs and him never recovering. It was clearly far more than depression.
We ALL need to upload more interviews! Libraries will digitize old reels/tapes for free!
Would be cool if they would release the "Roger Barrett" labeled Bo Diddley record for us fans.
Particularly candid interview here. No doubt, King felt responsible in some small way.
I get the feeling he felt responsible in a big way
I like this person. Great guy.
39:29 20 years passed away. Let King talk about Syd leaving Pink Floyd :D
man, i hope one day he can clarify that
Thank you
Lets channel some new syd compositions😅
They (the Band / Management) had more than enough of Syd songs, which they could have included on 'Saucerful'. This would made it the classic album, it should have been.
Clearly moved at 20:00.
Best one. John did you ever find out who lived at Earls court or interviewed someone who lived there with Syd?
Yes. Duggie Fields. His interview is here
czcams.com/video/bfaZ7IKztKs/video.html
Brilliant. Loved that. Rosemary Breen recently did a podcast/interview last month which was very insightful.
Syd is often compared to English Romantic poets such as Keats, but to me he has always seemed more like a rock n roll Rimbaud, since the French poet walked away from his sensational early success.
King's testimony provides an important perspective here. I did find, however, that he became less articulate after he puffed on that joint.
Not a joint my friend .. a self-rolled cigarette.
@@JOHNEDGINTONDOCUMENTARIES Ah, okay. It seemed as if the cameraman was trying to hide it, hence my suspicion. Not that I would have anything against it, mind. I myself often become more articulate after a puff or two.
hahahahahaahh well he isn't a sixties person for no reason
Rimbaud had nothing like “early success” before he gave up poetry and took off to Africa. There were early murmurings about his work but it didn’t become truly recognized until after he died.
Perhaps not to the public at large, but to the demimonde of Paris poetry, the young Rimbaud was indeed well-known. Verlaine made sure of that.@@JorgeVelezMusic
12:47 same technique was rife in the 90s also .
I remember playing Astronomy Domine on guitar and being bliwn away that a lush song was simply made up of the 3 consecutive half-steps
and that it's rock n roll, not Classical music
nice poster
just my 2 cents. Is it possible that Syd Barret was gaslighted and ostracized by his bandmates and his and their associates ? Maybe stemming from jealousy and insecurities of Syd.
Bingo
@@captainfeedback1agree
Sure they got rid of the songwriter, lead guitarist, lead vocalist, because of egos. They replaced Syd because he couldn't perform. They were surviving on money they earned performing live. All these conspiracy theories are nonsense.
Make an interview about Kevin Ayers
Im reading the big Julian p Dark globe syd barrett and pink floyd story book for the 3rd time (as I do with books about important and good music of rock stars like 13 floor Elevators, small faces Steve Marriott, )as I've read Rob Chapman s syd barrett s book 3 x) Julians lost in the woods book -my 1st syd barrett book which use the same photos as dark globe but hasn't as many photos ,it writes about Jenner more that I've forgot about king until this
I think Andrew is being a bit hard on himself regarding the flyer
"I remember very well the night mixing Chapter 11 - I remember very very well"
Um... Chapter 11?? 🤣
he calls it the Binson "Echorette" as well 😁
He corrected himself
chapter 11's a bankruptcy thing or something isn't it? rofl it's a long time ago it's easy to get muddled
Interesting that when Syd went off the rails, Blackhill dropped Floyd and managed Barrett as a solo act. Jenner got bitten on the arse when he tried to get him to record. It wasn’t happening
I used to know a guy who was the life of the party and then he did a bunch of purple double barrel acid one night and it must have cooked his mind because he was a totally different after - he didn't smile anymore and was always deadly serious after - it was actually pritty freaky how he turned into another person from one day to the next.
That’s what happens when you’re a dumbass who takes drugs
@@billjim334What's your excuse then?
What year was this done ?
2001
Wow, Scream Thy Last Scream isn't on an actual release? Like, I know Moonhead and Embryo aren't on anything proper. Point me at the Sky. But for some reason I thought Scream Thy Last Scream was.
All the tracks you mention are now on the official The Early Years boxed set
Who is the "Pip" to whom Andrew King referred?
Pip Carter. A friend from Cambridge
@@jameshowell1512 Thank you!
Pip did lights for the band.
Umm, where does one go to buy ones self into the charts?
back in the day you went round the record shops and bought up the singles. Sometimes didn't take too many to get into the top 20.
@@operator6471 ah! Cheeky!
Also I’m curious to know, how did Sid get the name Sid?
Actually what one would do is go to radio stations...which were once independently owned entities influenced by the record labels, yes, but not entirely fucking owned by them like they all are now. So you'd go and pay the DJ under the table, and he'd spin your record depending on how much you paid him. This process was called "Payola"
Nowadays you pay youtube, FB, Spotify and Clear Channel who has a monopoly on radio stations.
Is PIP still alive let's get his side of the story
Pip died in 1988...
(It's Will Ferrel without the frizzy jewfro!)
But, it is where the Gong crew got it right (psychedelics). have a focal human the journey seems to channel through. Syd just seemed to do 20 when half was enough.
just be ye addicted to wine not much as the g'book says. (so to speak)
Any decent trance starts this way.
Umm.....
I wish they’d get to it.
God the interviewer voice sounds a lot like David Guilmour's voice haha
And wasn’t Joe Boyd the first manager of Pink Floyd? Or at least, producer…
He produced the first singles
he never managed the band. Blackhill Enterprises (Andrew & Peter) were the management team throughout the Syd era
@@coldacre but he was the producer of their first output Arnold Lane.
£200 spent to hype Arnold Layne into the charts? So where are those 600 copies of the single? That is someone's pension if you don't flood the market.
in a way this sort of oral history is priceless... especially as we only get further out from these events... but it is a frustrating interview as the interviewer is so timid and avoids pressing for more details and clarity at key moments... if I had a question it would be do you remember the moment Syd's personality changed and in what way... this is obviously hinted at but left unexpressed by King as he isn't prompted to share the memory...
I sort of see what you mean, I think you are being a little hard on the interviewer because "he's not doing what I want". As far as the music goes his personality isn't really the issue.
But its true it would be nice, but maybe impossible, for somebody to say "here's a transcription of a conservation with Syd". When Jerry Shirley says that Syd showed up at 8Am to go to the club, and he invites him in, one wonders what kind of conversation you have with somebody who isn't even aware of what time of day it was. Gilmour says when he says stuff you couldn't quite make out what he was getting at, but nobody is giving examples. But then I don't remember conservations from my early twenties either. Even weird ones.
@@user-jp5nc8zf7m near the beginning King is laughing telling the story about trying to help buy a chart placement for 'Arnold Layne' and the interviewer doesn't seem to know whether he should laugh or ask a question and seems to completely stop the interview and start again... I laughed... I would have thought it was a good opportunity to ask 'was this a pretty standard practice for bands in the 60's?'
Anyway I do agree ones memories of what one did in ones 20's 50 years ago while also on copious amounts of mind altering chemicals will lead to some vague memories...
@@MercuriusHibernicusI was thinking the exact same thing at the exact same time. When he said it I was like "wait, what did he just say". But you combine that with what Nick Kent says about the music industry, and frankly what I've seen in other docs, then its not a surprise.
It WAS a surprise that he said it so matter of factly, so I share Johns surprise at it, likely he had no idea what to do with that, and frankly I still don't know.
That should be a documentary in and of itself. I just watched the beginning of the documentary on Journey, and this marketing guy goes "you've got six weeks to get it into the charts or its dead". Combine that with whats known as 'payola' and there you have it.
The whole thing is a scam, I remember Roger Waters saying that 'the charts' decided in the nineties that they'd no longer include old songs in the charts, and thats largely why Dark Side is no longer considered one of the top albums.
Genesis said they 'tried' several times to get Carpet Crawlers into the charts, I know they made a new video with both Phil and Peter singing, but they don't say exactly what 'getting into the charts' means. I think some songs are just THAT good, however, I remember a guy saying that Bohemian Rhapsody became a hit after a DJ played it over and over again for an entire weekend.
I can't remember the other song, but a guy said the DJ played it every night at the exact same time UNTIL it became a hit.
So that doesn't surprise me, it DOES surprise me that he'd openly admit it. But I'm in canada and grew up in the eighties. People of an age may remember a guy named Wayne Gretsky. His first game a guy nailed him at centre ice, that guy was dropped out of the league and never played again.
Gretsky was known for the 'wraparound goal', meaning doing the EXACT same thing every time, so these goalies must be real idiots or......you can guess. Hockey at that time took off big in america and every player was making money. Now, if I mentioned to canadians that hockey was as fixed as wrestling, they'd tar and feather me.
But its called show business for a reason.
@MercuriusHibernicus
Perhaps...
But may I ask you this: have you seen any other interviews on youtube with Andrew King talking about Pink Floyd & Syd?
I believe the answer is no. This is an extremely rare interview. I'm guessing part of the reason Andrew King agreed to it is he knew Edginton would be respectful & sensitive, & not necessarily push & prod into every corner. Otherwise, Andrew King would likely have done what he did with (presumably) all the other interview requests & simply turned it down.
38:36 Andrew King literally says, after the question about Syd's departure "It was very complicated & there are still things there which I don't feel easy in talking about". Andrew King clearly knows, remembers & **feels** a great deal that he's unwilling to discuss. Sometimes pushing too hard with pointed questions only alienates the person being interviewed, & they ultimately become less forthcoming & less willing to reveal & share.
@@tothelighthouse9843 Perhaps... my opinion is that it's a lost opportunity for the historical record... perhaps this interview suffers for being done in the 2000 era... but time only marches on... all dust and guitars...
I thought I'd missed this one but I guess it was just up. In fairness, you'd have to be an idiot at the time to think of NOT trying to push Rick to join Syd and off they go. From what I"ve heard Roger has been Roger since day one, so I"m imagining Roger with no songwriting, lyric writing or bass playing ability and I don't think anybody would want to work with him. The guy wrote some of the most brilliant lyrics, but seems like the last guy to want to 'manage'.
THAT may be what he doesn't want to say. I haven't seen the girlfriend or sister videos yet, but this was the closest to somebody telling stories about Syd without a 'wall' coming up between the interviewer and interviewee. Its like the other guys don't want to get emotional, which is understandable. But hearing him talk about his ex or late wife blaming the music business, well, I always tend to give a lot of credibility to the women around who usually don't get much attention in these matters. THe music industry really did damage both to artists AND music AND the audience. I was listening to some no name band nobody has heard of the other week and it was just brilliant. THese stories are interesting, but its not the case that 'very few people were doing the important music'. We just never HEARD of them.
And it kind of makes you forget that these are 'just guys'. How interesting would it have been if Syd had been one of the guitarists to show up and replace Anthony Phillips in Genesis:)
Syd Barrett is one of, maybe the most, interesting, influential, innovative, original and at the same time tragic stories of the mid to late sixties music business. Syd had everything:- great looking bloke, hugely charismatic, naturally charming, brilliant guitar player, genuinely original song writer, and artist. Fried his Brain with too much LSD. The arguments will go on about did he permanently destroy an already naturally faulty and damaged Brain🤷🏽♂️🤷🏽♂️
the Badfinger tragedy was pretty dreadful.
I think these guys (the band & King; not Jenner) were afraid of Syd:
-of his creativity
-of his capacity in execution
-of his good looks
-of his control (even the interview starts with King slipping the comment that "Syd was pretty dominant, then" 2:40 )
All this, being 2 years younger than the rest of the band..
And they let others destroy him (in a way they wouldn't have let a real friend) in that famous Cromwell Road appartment.
There are accounts of what some others did to him in that famous appartment (Storm Thorgerson included).
In the following videoclip (of Vegetable Man)
there is a violent sequence between Syd Barrett and Roger Waters:
czcams.com/video/9-flYjakTS8/video.html
it was apparently recorded in december 1967.
Duggie Fields says "he saw nothing" [but admits that chain spiking LSD in the tea was done to other people], and says it with a weird smile. Again, the band did not intervene [it was impossible that they didn't know of that].
Then, they record a song about a "Crazy Diamond".
I think the word "Crazy" does not fit in the real picture.
"Dominating Diamond", if you like.
"Weird Diamond", could be.. find the word that rhymes better. But not "crazy".
I think the band could have admitted that they had had a childish/vengeful attitude towards Syd.
But that would ruin the "He just went mad" story.
In fact, they do admit that they didn't help much during The Madcap Laughs sessions, because "they wanted to punish him".
@@tomtaba5564 Syd was an adult who did what he wanted. Nobody could stop him from his massive drug use.
@@tomtaba5564 I mean I don't know how you expect people that didn't live with him to magically take him away from the bad influences.
His schizophrenia manifested as well and so yeah by the time they wrote that song he was crazy.
There's no way the band wanted to lose the creative force behind their success. But they had no control over the guy. Gilmour bailed on LSD after getting scared but said syd wasn't afraid of it at all and jumped in deeper.
All I have to say is unless you are in a band with somebody difficult I don't really think anyone has the right to Monday morning quarterback Syds situation. I was in a band where a member was strung out and losing his mind but he was only the drummer. If I ever had some dude who was the song writer trying to sabotage the songs because he's either trying to be way too avant garde or lost his way it be horrifying. Especially if the band was on a good label and had great potential. Id probably booted Syd too. How the rest of the guys plus Dave got on well and eventually did records like dark side is just remarkable.
@@vonclohk507 I agree that, how they managed to do Dark Side, WYWH, ... is remarkable.
I think that if you:
1) boot the Syd character (being that you were deep friends),
2) then afterwards, it wouldn't be ok if you just call him "crazy" for not being able to cope with the situation.
You are in line to being called heartless, or self-centered.
But Syd never did that to him.. it wasn't his style.
The more you delve into the issue you realize there seemed to be friction with the bandmates. Even Waters still says things such as "I don't know why he is called the f**cking father of Space Rock". There seemed to be a conflict with the bandmates, and a self-destructive behaviour afterwards. The result is an introverted Syd who doesn't confront them (and a bunch of guys who are not introverted and didn't publish the issue in a fair way; they even reinforced the narrative penning him "crazy diamond", which is like a stab in the back and a flower at the same time).
He's right that those albums should have been finished properly
Syd wasnt well enough for that too happen.
@@crisprtalk6963 The songs that were done properly sounded great, (Vegetable Man is amazing), whereas on the contrary, on the Barrett LP it sounds as if DG was purposely trying to make Syd sound crazy by leaving in mistakes and things
Huzzah. God this man needs to tell everything he knows in a book. He cared for Syd. The true story I believe is really fucked up. And not cool. Sad. Great job. Johnny w philly
By crikey - nomination for the "Dullest Figure in Psychedelia". But well done for persevering, and thanks, anyway.
I see your point.
The problem with diagnosing schizophrenia is that, at a young age, the person may not exhibit strong indications of schizophrenia or even that their strange behaviour is just put down to kids doing odd things. It manifests itself at a later age.
Syd clearly had signs early on and his demand avoidance seems to have been a thing all along.
None of them could have stopped his schizophrenia, it's not possible.
"I've been looking all over the place for a place for me,
But it ain't anywhere, it just ain't anywhere
Vegetable man, vegetable man,
He's the kind of person, you just gonna see him if you can,
Vegetable man"
I cannot emphasise enough the fact that there has never been any evidence of Syd having schizophrenia. It’s all been amateur diagnosing by Roger Waters in particular. Syd’s sister Rosemary is very clear on this.
@@JOHNEDGINTONDOCUMENTARIES except all the signs of the disease, John. His withdrawal, described very well in this video, is also nothing like LSD would cause. He wasnt diagnosed at the time, fact. As I just said, almost impossible at an early age. Later he has all the signs. This is my opinion and based on the evidence. You may have an alternative opinion but there is a LOT of evidence for schizophrenia.
HIs lyrics even display a disjointed quality to them. Duggie Fields essentially says the same thing in your interview. Millions of people took LSD and it didn't have this effect on them. Syd had an underlying condition, whatever it was. He was withdrawing and avoidant before the LSD. His lyrics were disjointed already. If it wasn't "schizophrenia" specifically he had some form of personality disorder, sadly.
Early signs and symptoms may include problems with thinking, behavior and emotions.
Thinking:
Problems with thinking and reasoning
Bizarre ideas or speech
Confusing dreams or television for reality
Behavior:
Withdrawal from friends and family
Trouble sleeping
Lack of motivation - for example, showing up as a drop in performance at school
Not meeting daily expectations, such as bathing or dressing
Bizarre behavior
Violent or aggressive behavior or agitation
Recreational drug or nicotine use
Emotions:
Irritability or depressed mood
Lack of emotion, or emotions inappropriate for the situation
Strange anxieties and fears
Excessive suspicion of others
the problem with quoting lyrics from 'Vegetable Man' is you do not know Syd's intentions, was it a cry for help or was it satire or a joke? you don't know... you're projecting your beliefs and ideas upon someone to crystallize them... to place them in a box and say look... that's what he is... 'schizophrenia' is a term made up by the pharmaceutical industry so they can sell drugs which incapacitate people... they do not cure anyone... there is no scientific basis to the diagnosis or the accompanying drug...
@@papalaz4444244 The issue is that schizophrenia is almost a catch all for ANYTHING weird. I do find it VERY odd that Syds brother could say 'he's fine'. And Nick says some guy says 'are you sure this is syds problem'.
Keep in mind psychiatry is like music theory, it describes things AFTER the fact. As I said elsewhere, he likely had 'Sydism'. The problem with psychiatry is that into describes SYMPTOMS and WHAT people are thinking, not 'how' they are thinking it.
But certainly I see nothing the band could have done, and they were more sympathetic later on than, say, the Genesis guys were for guys they elbowed out of the way. The very fact that EVERYBODY says 'we tried' kind of says it all. You can't FORCE somebody to do something. But like Nick Kent says, the eternal question is "what was going on in that mans mind".
Even Rosemary admits to that neighbours claims that Syd at one point attacked his mother and had to be hauled away a few times in the eighties till his brain 'calmed down' when he got old. But schizophrenia is quite a catch all statement now. Its just as quick to just say he was 'nuts'. And living in a pretty insane world, I don't mean that perjoratively.
They thought that without Syd, the PF wouldn't go far. And the choice was wrong, but he doesn't admit it.
It was a lot more complicated than that with a lot more shades of grey, not least being Andrew and Peter’s care for Syd as a human being. But if you want to view it simply as a choice, who could blame Andrew and Peter for sticking with Syd. Syd played lead guitar, sang most of the vocals, and wrote 90 percent of the material. Not to mention being handsome and charismatic. The rest of the band had shown very little indication that they would be able to step up without Syd. Andrew and Peter’s decision to stick with Syd was entirely logical at the time.
It was never ‘as good’ after Syd left…
90% of people would have bet on a future career for solo Syd, vs. Floyd without him, at that time. It's not complicated. It took the post-Syd Floyd group several albums before they made anything as fresh or vital (Metal, I'd argue) or critically as successful as that first album.
Something that has ALWAYS been clear is that they NEVER would have made it without Syd, the fact that they went on to continue the success is what makes the story so ironic. It is incredible what they went on to do but without their origins it wouldn’t have happened and there was no reason in 1968 to think that the band would continue to write psychedelic pop which was what was making them go mainstream. He’s wrong now but was right then and all they achieved is still largely owed to Syd as they could not have done it without the start he gave them.
@@MrBooYa-yd5erBut, but...Roger was there, from the beginning. And, who made it happen afterwards, was Roger...