Can animals grammar? - introduction to my animated series
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- čas přidán 30. 10. 2023
- Are animal signals word-like or even sentence-like? Are their sounds and signs somehow meaningful and structured? Let's spend some videos together exploring the possible linguistics of animal communication. In part 1 I'll introduce this series and the many grammatical animals we'll meet along the way.
Groups to support: docs.google.com/document/d/1t...
Subscribe for parts 2-8: czcams.com/users/subscription_...
Tip me once: www.ko-fi.com/NativLang
Patronize me per creation: / nativlang
~ Shortly and sweetly ~
I've been intrigued by animal language since my two older videos on "design features" and the bee waggle dance. After reading about how Campbell's monkeys suffix -oo to their calls, I read over 100 sources to figure out if animal signals and calls contain anything like human grammar. The answer was complicated and too long for my normal animations, but the story behind the research was fascinating.
(~SPOILERS for the series in the list below!)
I decided to retell a series with several more parts. Here's the basic storytelling structure, and what to expect from the rest of my latest big animated project:
1. (this introduction)
2. humans tried to teach nonhumans our grammars
3. humans expected more from nonhumans
4. humans tried to learn "wild" nonhuman grammars
5. nonhuman word-like signals
6. nonhuman sequences and sentence-like signals
7. human language as animal communication
8. birds, cetaceans and compositional syntax
Once finished I want to stitch everything together in one long animation.
~ Resources ~
Art, animation and music by me. I wrote a sources document to explain and back up claims and to credit all images, fonts and sounds:
docs.google.com/document/d/1r...
Within that document I share links to groups focused on animals, their habitats and the people who care for them. There's a narrative tie-in that will work well by the end of the series, but for now I'll just mention and link:
docs.google.com/document/d/1t...
My "Grammanimals" spreadsheet:
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...
Been a while since last time we gathered together here. 100 papers, 28000 words in notes, 1 spreadsheet and lots of artwork later, I'm excited to share the rest of this series with you!
i love your vids!!!! 🙏
Great, the lunglings are evolving
So great to see you back!
Have you investigated the outlook for machine learning analysis of animal communication? If we are to have any breakthroughs in this field, the ability to process immense amounts of data, combinging modalities (acoustic, visual, scent, touch etc.) that could be used for animal communication, and an analysis technique not confined to 'human thinking patterns' may be able to uncover things that have been hiding from us for a long time.
You should look up bunny the dog that uses a sound board to communicate. There's one video where she asks what she is then says she is human. Another where she says "more word please"
"Grammanimals" sounds like a young children's educational show on PBS. Waiting for the pilot episode.
Or on TVOkids (to the fellow Canadians that exist) tho growing up I was BIGG into both stations
WHO YOU GONNA CALL? GRAMM-ANIMALS!
Humanimals from Guardians of the Galaxy vol. 3
It's amazing that you wrote basically an entire dissertation's worth of material to make basically a movie/tv show on something no one talks about. Insane dedication.
It's like a studio-sized effort with teams and researchers, but it's going to better because it's singular to his vision.
We talk about it! Let us not diminish our own linguistic fascination as evidence by the comments :)
this was literally what ive been thinking of studying for my masters… it’s not well studied at all
Animal communication was literally *the reason* I began studying linguistics, so let's just say this is very exciting for me!
When I got my first dog, I was amazed at how much we understood each other. If he stretched and meowed like a cat, I knew that meant he was bored and wanted to play. When he wanted to go out, he would stand at the back door make a short, polite bark. If I ignored him long enough, he would shout what I knew meant "Hey, I gotta take a leak here!" Once, he tapped at the door twice and gave a short whine. I saw his buddy, our cat, outside. I opened the door, the cat came in and the dog followed him to the other room. I realized this creature with a brain the size of a tangerine had at least 3 modes of communicating with me about the back door. 🐕🐈⬛🧘♂
My dog absolutely understood grammar on some basic level.
If you started a sentence with 'Do you want to go...' his ears pricked up, and he'd stare at you with great intensity. He absolutely knew that this was the start of an Important Sentence. The fact he didn't go mental was evidence that he knew that the next part of the sentence would tell him where you were offering to take him. If you finished with 'for a ride in the car,' he'd be keen but subdued. Finish it with 'to Granny's', [where he'd get lunch] or 'to the quarry [our local park]' and he'd go ballistic. He knew exactly what the sentence starter meant, and what the finisher meant, and that they were different parts of the meaning (the first that he was going to go on a trip, the second specifying where). To me, that's not so different from a human.
If you altered the word order, say, into Yoda-speak, would your dog still have understood? For example: "For a ride in the car, want to go, do you?"
(I realize that's difficult to understand even for some native English speakers, lol)
@@aidanb.c.2325 From my experience and understanding, dogs understand specific words, such as "you", "want", "go", and "car/Granny's/quarry" in the sentences and so they understand regardless of the order. My dog can tell when people are talking to her versus to other people or even when they talk about her but not towards her.
@@aidanb.c.2325 Interesting question, and he passed away 10 years ago so I can't test it. I'm pretty sure if you just said 'Grannie's?' he would be suddenly alert but a bit confused. He would have needed more context for it to truly set him off.
I'll also add that we did occasionally ask him if he wanted to go to the Quarry in a flat deadpan voice to see if he would still understand (e.g. was he using other cues to figure out what you were communicating like your voice tone) and he did still understand. He was a very clever little dog, and I definitely miss him.
And let us never forget that human language IS animal communication!
And that squids (who communicate by color) are so distantly related to us that humans and mockingbirds are almost the same, from a squid point of view.
Of course, most of these are either sounds and visual cues and patterns. If we explore the chemical sensorium, even animals that extensively vocalize also use olfaction, gustation, and a myriad other ways mediated by chemicals that don't usually fall under the purview of a common understanding of "communication".
I didn't even think about that! How cool!
Humans use such things to communicate as well. It would be interesting to see if insects have grammar using only their pheremones.
My cat Gertrude is sometimes vocal. And when she greets me after a long day of work, her meows are clipped into the syllables of my name. It's cute and also fascinating because perhaps with her age (10 years) Gertrude has picked up on human speech by listening to my parents.
Your dedication and love for art and linguistics are amazing! Though I study language and literature in college, linguistics has always been difficult for me, but you always manage to keep things fun. Thank you for your hard work!
I was ready to sit down for 56 minutes.
The immediate answer is yes, for the simple reason that human beings are also animals, hence at least one animal species is known to possess language and all its features. But the prospect that other species might also exhibit some degree of language is indeed intriguing.
Sounds like it's going to be a very fun series!
I did an evolution of language class for undergrad and we did a lot of discussing of this kind of thing and it is always fascinating, so I'm excited to see what you have in store!
I hope this series will cover mice communication. I'm always curious what they're trying to communicate to me when they're caught in a trap. Those cute little furry faces with their squeaks. I'm assuming it's as simple as "let me go", but who knows for sure.
THANK YOU! I want to share my love for this stuff. I follow loads of "talking animal" channels and there's always "skeptics" in the comments who think being contrarian is the same as critical thought. Seen the same attitude from certified animal trainers, who really should know better!
Because healthy skepticism *requires* that we entertain the idea that something might be true, even if it seems unbelievable. I'm ecstatic to see more people caring about animal cognition. They're our neighbors, friends, often our housemates. We do other animals a great disservice by considering them "lesser" because they can't speak in the same ways we do.
I'm looking forward to your assessment on ape language studies. As a biological anthropologist, I was always fascinated by them. But I found the more I researched the topic, the more I felt they did a disservice to our fellow apes. The focus always seemed to be "How human are they?" and "What can and can't they do in terms of understanding and employing human grammatical symbols?" rather than "What forms of language (if at all) do apes utilize in the wild?" and "What use do apes have for language and how does that vary by species, population, and environment?" Seems like we spent so much time debating how human-like Kanzi, Koko, Nim, Sherman, Austin, and others were, we forgot to see what makes bonobos, gorillas, and chimpanzees special in their own right.
And also, why were orangutans and gibbons so often left out of the discussion? (I'm being rhetorical. I know the answer to that.)
Actually, what _is_ the answer to that … the exclusion of orangutans and gibbons? Difficulty of working with vis-a-vis learning with language? Less social and therefore less willing to interact with humans?
This sounds like such a labor of love, and I’m so excited to see what you have in store!
I learned Chicken in my teens. Emden Goose in my twenties. Hawai'i-Japanese twig-tail cats about 10. Now, I only understand English, Japanese, some Hawai'ian and Spanish. But I can listen and hear language. I would love to have a 30 yr old swan teach me the things I don't know!!!!
It is really convenient how Spanish, Japanese and Hawaiian have the same 5 vowels and many of the same consonants! BTW no 'okina in the word "Hawaiian", only in "Hawai'i" but not in English constructs.
This is actually a subject which has been an on and off fascination for me for years. Love your videos, and excited to see what is to come.
The "Children of Time" books have some interesting ideas on non-human languages.
Can't say enough about how amazing your videos and animation style are, and the charming, fun commentary complements them perfectly. Thank you so much!
Yes!! Please more!
Personally, I’d say they can use grammar in their own way. I’d love to watch more about this type of thing!
Super excited for the following episodes! ❤
this is an incredible project that makes me proud to support you. I'm excited to see where this goes!
Finally, it's here! It's starting! I could hardly wait to see what you cook up and teach us :)
Thank you for updating! You're one of my fav channels
Wasn’t sure how much I would like this, but after this intro video I am excited for more!
Thanks, CZcams, for the bell notification feature. I want to watch all of these as soon as they go up.
I love the idea of illustrating this original research with a journal.
Ohhhhh this is gonna be incredible! I'm super keen for this, thank you for your hard work and dedication
I can't wait to see how this turns out! Language of any type is fascinating and when I was a child I simply decided that mathematics was another language, which made it easier for me to have an interest in it since I already enjoyed languages. I'm curious to see what the animal kingdom has in store for us!
Excited! Thanks for sharing the details of your preparation processes,it's really fascinating
I don't know that I've been this eager to watch CZcams content in a long time. Really looking forward to this one!
Missed ya man. So glad you're back 🙂 and what an interesting video! Watching this while recovering from COVID so you've already helped me heaps as always. Cheers bro 😊
Fascinating! Really looking forward to it, Josh!
I've been waiting my whole life for this series
*-vibrates in impatient excitement-*
I can't stop smiling
Yay, a new series!! I'm very excited to watch the next episode!
I love how You Tube notifies me about videos i want to see 8 days after they're posted.
Me: 2 weeks
Lucky you. Took me 2 months 😅
I specifically remember reading a news article about a scholar in Japan who found out that Japanese tits(bird) have to structure their sounds in certain order or else it wouldn't mean anything, and my first reaction was like: Is this bird's basic word order? 🤩🤩🤩
Oooh yes! This is gonna be so awesome. Really looking forward to the rest of this series! :D
I've been missing you! But this is great! I'm only a couple minutes in and had to stop and express my enthusiasm! 🎉 (I've been watching your videos for years! ❤)
The fact is that we probably started out somewhere along the continuum you're going to discuss here and evolution turbocharged our vocal abilities for whatever reasons - evolutionary or environmental pressures/selection (sexual or otherwise), any number of other factors. Fascinated to see where this goes!
Lovely!! Thank you!! I can’t wait to see these episodes 😄
So excited for this series!
So glad to see you back! I didn't get this recommended to me when it was released despite being subscribed 😢
I'm so excited for the full video, and I hope it's a long one!
Can't wait for the next part. Animal communication always fascinated me.
I'm hyped for what's coming next!
Yesss! I'm looking so much forward to this series!
I'm in, this topic is 100% in my wheelhouse and I'll be waiting to see this episode...in between freeing critters from traps, moving turtles across roads, and free insects from accidental visits into the gazebo 😉 ❤
So exited for the full series
😆 Yessss!
I cannot wait for the rest of this series!!! 😍
Honestly one of the most underrated channels. Great work!
wow - really looking forward to this series!!
Yay! You're back. Missed you.
Biology (particularly entomology, particularly myrmecology) and linguistics are my two special interests. A while ago I found an article talking about weaver ants potentially having grammar based on chemical signals, but I can't find it anywhere for the life of me! Animal grammar is such an interesting topic...
So cool! Looking forward to great content! I love animals! 😀
Honestly... this fellow being so skilled in language should listen to and document the animal languages. They'll be group specific but he'd finally just document the languages that people have known but couldn't understand or comprehend.
It would also be a big breakthrough. Deer, monkeys, etc. Especially if it's honest and accurate.
neat! I'm really excited for such a unique premise!
Hyped for this series
Excited to see this series
Let's goooooo - I'm so ready for this massively understudied discussion!
This looks absolutely tremendous…I can’t wait!
Roger Liebi's book "the origin and development of languages" gives some convincing arguments on animal sounds being incomparable to human language. It will be interesting to see your take on the topic!
Can’t wait to see next parts!
Wow... I'm excited about this one.
Just blew my mind, I am about to jump into that rabbit hole ahead of time as the extra reading before we get to the second video!
Always a good day when there's a NativLang video
I had read Daniel J. Siegel's book on Mind< A Journey to the Heart of Being Human. It was a multidisciplinary study at Berkeley to define the concept of mind. The mathematicians considered the brain and its surrounding environment and other persons around as a complex system and that Mind was an emergent phenomenon of that complex system since parts of how we process come from other beings around us with whom we swap information. It would not surprise me that we gather understanding from other beings in interspecies communication, and it will be a treat as you develop and present this study. As an adult i have learned that cats and horses seem to say a lot with just a few gestures without vocalizing. I would wonder if the vocalizations are to reach beyond vision in a sharing of information and what role the rest of the senses play in communication between minds of all types.
I have wanted to study linguistics and become a researcher on animal communication ever since I first came across the concept.
It's my dream be able to decode and translate my cats communication and vice versa so I can finally explain why they aren't supposed to jump on the table😂
Even if you could, I doubt your cats will listen to you 😂
Mother cats teach their kittens. The are specific behaviors they do for correcting unruly kits. Look into those.
Damn, why did this not show up in my recommended? Always a good day when NativLang uploads another linguistic tale.
I was waiting for your next video, and just when I start to lose hope:
This
I have no words but :D
whoa, I am excited for this project!
I dont think I've been this excited in a while. I would also be interested in seeing an improvised rant about all the gramimals
Oh my gosh, I'm so excited for this!
Wow! I'm an armchair linguist and philologist, and my girlfriend is an armchair biologist! This is an excellent marriage of two separate fields. I love this. Showing her after her nap!
❤
I'm so excited to see the work ❤
Grammanimals is hands down the best portmanteau.
I’m excited for this project
This is very fascinating!
I'm so excited by this! I'm actually defending my MSc thesis on American lobster ethology (it's a comprehensive ethogram) next week! I've always loved languages and communication systems, so I'm hyped!
VERY interesting. Your videos are so well done. Thank you
This is one of the highest quality content ive seen in a long time. its a shame the algorithm didnt pick it up YET
I was in a linguistics class and we learned about Prarie Dogs and their language! It amazed me and i deeped dived into it for months. Language is amazing
i am so excited for this!!!!
The word "Grammar" being used as a verb is a big trigger for me and I didn't even know about it until this very video.
It's true, in the immortal words of Calvin and Hobbs, "Verbing weirds language"
I am extremely impatient, that's a wonderful project!! Here's for the algorithm
Amazing stuff, thank you!
Thanks for the heads-up - have started to clear space in my schedule...
Before deciding to rather study plants I always wanted to go into animal communication, so for me this is an amazing project!
nativlang talking animals series *LETS GOOOOOOO*
This is going to be amazing!
Ooo. I am very excited for this.
Really looking forward to this
I am very excited!!!!
Oh my goodness, all my favorite channels are uploading
wake up babe new NativLang video about animals dropped
This is extremrly exciting.
Sounds exciting!
Thank you for this video! 😀💐
I hope you talk about how different regions might influence the language or how dialects might exist between the same species!