The Fireball Trap is glorious. Follow me on Twitter - / theoryfighter #theoryfighter #streetfighter #superturbo Music by Bongripper from their album Terminal
The 2 bits of tech that got me into fighting games was 1: Guile's charging, learning to use normal to move forward and back and learning when to go for offence or defense. 2: Slow projectiles, plenty of people when the start playing go for fast or flashy moves but when I noticed how some people panicked when a slow projectile came towards people, as sadistic as it sounds this is what started my love for characters that made people scared.
You can block for so long because a lot of games mids aren't the same ask m.bison(dictator) and guile's upside down kick... Dictator's signature knee move changes every game. It's used as a frame trap and a crushing blow.
I guess everyone has that simple thing that they find really engaging in a fighting game, huh? For me, it's walking. Be it backwards, or especially forwards, I love to walk and block- refusing to commit myself to an option, but keeping an eye on my opponent. I often try to see how often I can sneak a walk forward in and sort of just eke out an edge in the footsies game on my opponent by taking real estate from them, and lull them into a sense of comfort. It's low commitment to walk and block, but a lot of players at my level get massively thrown off by it, and it feels very good to know I won a match because I made my opponent walk back into a corner and put them on the defensive by doing no more than walking and finding out when and where they push buttons.
I really love charge inputs, but it's not what got me hooked. I got started with Smash spamming specials with friends and then I learnt combos and dodge reads in Brawlhalla.
When I was 10 to 12 years old, the SPD for Zangief was the one special move I never bothered to learn much because it was hard to do and he just seemed like such a weak character. When I was a bit older in my teens, the idea of tick throws captured my attention and I began to learn Zangief as a character, mostly in SFA3. I took a long break from fighting games in my 20s, only playing them sporadically on emulators, but when SF4 revived the genre, I found myself most interested in Zangief players such as Snake Eyez and Itabashi. Gief's been my main since SFV launched and I love the mind games of tick throws and air SPD's. Just another example of how one particular aspect of fighting games can really draw you in.
As a kid I was the only one of my friends that *could* SPD. I made it my mission borrowing SFII on SNES from Cameron and dominated after that. Too bad I've remained casual all these years...
I like mid rangers that's it i like playing axl on mid ranges Vega Rog Yuzu ig if you can call her that just having that space and options to work with Makes me go :D
Every "I learned I can SPD my way to Gold" story ever told. Because jumping and crackmonkeying the stick is a lot easier than trying to learn precision tech and combos.
@@helxis Yeah because online rankings like gold existed back in the 90s. And in SFV I was Ultra Diamond, not gold. It's just a story about how how a simple piece of tech sucked me into a new aspect of fighting games. I play all sorts of characters in fighting games and, yeah, tech and combos are a big part of it. That being said, if you doubt my skill, I'm happy to play you in a set in SF6. Just let me know.
my fav tech is setting up meaty-timing post-knockdown via a sequence of whiffs. as a grappler, its fun to use a command grab that leaves you full screen and whiff a HEAVY forward-moving special move to be right next to them when they wake-up every time you grab them EXCEPT the last time you grab them in the final round, after which you _instead_ whiff a LIGHT forward-moving special move to bait the opponent into thinking you’re gonna be right next to them again, so when the opponent does a wakeup DP or wakeup super to avoid losing the final round and make some space, you’re nowhere near them and can punish THEIR whiffed invincible reversal
What got me into fighting games was learning that there was a character called "Ragna the BLOODEDGE" it was so edgy, my middle schooler self couldn't resist.
I love Parry options in Fighting Games. You feel like such a master mind reading your opponent like that. Taht's also why I love playing Jin/Yoshimistu in Tekken
This is similar for me but specifically Soul Calibur's Guard Impacts. It just feels so good. Especially when two players who know each other well end up in a Guard Impact rally.
I'm kind of split - I really dislike the system in Soul Calibur because it's so easy to do: I understand there is a further meta around this that I don't understand due to not playing enough - but Ryu' parry in SF5 is the same: Parry isn't a special move that works if hit by an opponent, that's a counter(attack) move. A parry is the act of blocking perfectly and gaining some advantage due to it: Maybe you hold back and press forward the frame it hits you and thats a parry, maybe you don't block until the last frame and that counts as a parry - a parry is a minor feature of fighting games that shouldn't define a match, but should come naturally to both players. Parrying a hadoken should be easy, but if you can Evo#37 then it's too easy.
I could not care less about SF2 fireball frame traps, and I love how much you do care. I have so many little pieces of tech that I love that I want to rant for five minutes about, and it makes me so happy to see that in you. For me, it was doing armored mix-ups as Big Band in Skullgirls. Anti-airing someone from full screen is my favorite thing, and to this day I don’t love anything more than an anti-air command throw. Scaring people into one will never get old, and I love it. Probably not as in-depth or specific as yours, but that’s my favorite thing.
Projectiles are great for illustrating simple concepts to new players. It starts the conversation off, and you can talk to them about what to do next. Which is often just another fireball.
I laughed at that SKD tech thing at the beginning cause it's so true But I 100% agree on the thing with fireball traps. Such a cool spacing mindgame that's sort of been lost in fighting games
So I watch the video, love these type of things especially if i'm to learn something new and at the end i notice the bongripper track. Damn dude, love your taste in music as well. Awesome
I am VERY LATE to your channel and have spent the last hour binging, I would like to respond to pretty much every vid you have made about game mechanics and broken games... THANK YOU! I have often had this convo with folk about the "breaks" in games that made them what they are, and the fact that updates and sequels would take at least 6 months to be developed and then distributed to your arcade meant that games spent a lot more time in a certain state, which allowed for much more shenanigans. Nowadays, "anime" fighters are the accepted genre for unorthodox movement and breaks in the game. Meanwhile, people bitched and bitched about all the glitches an os in sf4 until the final result was... SF5! I have already wrote forever so I'll end with saying we share the exact same sentiments about OG Fighters. Could you make a vid about "Marvel Super Heroes" one day?
I've been playing fighters for half a decade and never even knew about this, and was able to use it immediately to my advantage in a game like uniclr. It's a very widely applicable tech and I can't stress enough how much I appreciated this video.
For me, Gatlings in Guilty Gear are what got me to really appreciate combos in fighting games. Not only are they very simple to understand and use, and thus make doing simple beginner combos feel intuitive, but it also made me appreciate each of those attacks more and realize the individual uses they each have.
Although i'm a sf guy, the time i got into combos was when I picked gg xx to learn since a friend who got me into fighting games adore the series. Most of the time i wasn't hooked cuz i like more of the slow neutral mind game aspect of it, so i played ino because she was hot and had some makoto bullshit going for her and i love makoto (if you start you keep harrasing till win lol). The moment i was hooked was randomly picking axl and finding out he was a Dhalsim who played super turbo ryu fire ball mind games, with a full screen throw. The combo aspect of him was a reward for clever mind game and that got me really hard into learning combos to make the called out jump ins scary. No wonder i play him on xrd despite being a low tier, the feel times i hit 6k, makes ppl loose half their health and it is super statisfying.
believe it or not I got into street fighter because in the 3ds' launch I only had SFIV 3D Edition. I didn't know what I was doing, but when I started doing the trials and I learned what a link was... I got hooked
Cool tech is the reason why I play characters with beast cannons (Answer, Cinder, Beowulf, Mika, etc.) in so many fighting games, or characters with weird setplay gimmicks. (Answer, Cinder, Kokonoe, etc.) It helps keep me focused on the match, because so much of playing them even decently requires knowing how to apply what you know about their moves in real time. I don't know how to optimize every confirm on every scroll/card setup combination for Answer, but I know enough to ad-lib a conversion regardless. To me, that's what makes tech so rewarding to learn. Knowing how to apply it in a match, in situations that you couldn't possibly lab out ahead of time. edit: now that I think about it, there could be an entire video on why the beast cannon is such a cool move, and why it's been replicated in so many other games since.
You know what got me invested? The fatigue system that The Immortal has on its close up fighting. Outside of sports fighting games, you never really see this mechanic, where an attack has larger startup times and longer lag the more tired the character is. It's meant to be an anti-spam measure since if you overdo it, you become open to attack if you even try. I experimented with the mechanic in my games but I never found a good balance of fast response and careful offensive play in my own testing. I definitely like how Fight Night Round 4 handles it. Get hit in the body and your stamina is slowly sapped from you, making it harder for you to mount an offense.
I love that you mentioned the SKD thing. I love reading his explanations for the sheer fascination that someone could come up with something that he does
Such a great little video. I'm gonna show this to my friends next time they ask how I'm able to enjoy these "button mashing" fighting games. It's such a hard case to make when people aren't into them lol
The first thing that got me into fighting games was the flowchart playstyle in SF2CE. On topic though, dodging and dashing/running from KOF made me stay. As for projectile traps, that's another good one. It's been in my subconscious for so long that I almost always do a light projectile after knocking down my opponent so that the projectile hits them in their wake up state(blocked or not), giving me free reign to pretty much do what I want.
Man, I'm in my early 30s and I have adored fighting games since playing sf2 with my dad on genesis and let me say: it's a travesty that you don't have 1m+ subs, the love you put into the content and the community is palpable. Signed, a newly gained fan! (And sub💜😂)
4:40 So assuming Guile has charge, he could've super chip killed right there, but he didn't. Is there any specific reason as to why someone shouldn't do that, especially at that close of range? I never really got into Super Turbo and I've only been playing fighters for six months so perhaps it's my lack of experience, because the only reason I can think of is nerves possibly screwing up the input execution
He was might be trying and lost charge due to being put in block stun, then had to wait. Maybe the flash kick was failed super. If i had to guess though... i'd say it was just nerves playing Daigo and being in the lead.
By experience, I would believe that it is because of blockstun, And also because of his close Daigo was to him, Guile's super is a charge Z motion, and during the frame you do foward to then do back again you leave yourself open to be hit, On a side note Golcar might of been sure that Daigo Expected him to do it so he could then punish and win the round.
@@venomoussmiley6216 The execution isn't extremely difficult if you renda cancel though, done right the motion is down back, down forward, up back kick and it has to be done quickly, so to me I would think the only option would be back jump or something because at that range I don't see that being reactable
Just started playing ST ryu and i love fireball trapping, not too good at conditioning people into not jumping after the 2nd fireball yet but i guess i'll figure it out eventually lol
When I played Tekken Tag Tournament, I would literally just run rings around other players using the sidestep mechanic, I felt very few other players used it - and it was so important to utilize in high level matches
Was expecting mentioning that you can use negative edge to os the second fireball if the first one whiffed. For me thing that got me hooked was the creative problem solving against another human, especially figuring out I could do a string and end it short into something else or choose not to and if it hit could hit confirm into something that knocked down and repeat.
To me, the hook to fighting games was learning matchup-fundamentals through Marvel Vs Capcom and King of Fighters when I was like in middle school, somewhere in like 2011. I have always found the approach to matchups and by extension considering team-composition in team-based fighting games a very interesting process. In a 1v1 fighter, matchups can generally range from good to bad, depending on how many tools you have to deal with whatever the opponent has. This mentality applies less to a game like MvC, where your team can be well-rounded, comprised of many archetypes that can deal with the weakness of one of your teammates. At that point, it's a question of what order you place your fighters in, how you manage the tagging in and out and what assists you put in to serve certain functions. Although the one that really sold it was King of Fighters and it did it because of the ways it restricted the classic recipe for team-fighters. Because you don't have assists and can't just swap in and out between your fighters all willy-nilly, suddenly it puts alot of emphesis on the order in which your team goes and that alone can have alot of thought put into it. Maybe you wanna put a character that is really good at meter-building as first, then place a character that makes good use of that meter as either the next or last in line. The way I always played was that I picked a super well-rounded team, comprising of a fundamental shoto, a grappler and a zoner, covering just about every base I can. It would eventually grow into a team-up of Kyo/Terry on the front (Haven't really sealed that in yet), Clark as the follow-up and Athena as an anchor due to her oppressive options with meter (Though Terry can do that too), with this composition adapting depending on what I am matched up against. These days, my interests lie in the mind-games of neutral and tend to favor games that have a really emphesize playing footsies, and it all stems from the days of learning to appreciate the art of considering the pros and cons of matchups back in the day.
Mine would be Cross up DPs RC in Blazblue, or Baiken's tk Youzansen RC in GG. Thanks to those I've researched quite a bit and now I'm able to enjoy watching and playing medium / high level matches.
I remember what got me into fighting games. When I was younger, the only fighter I played was Smash, specifically Melee. I had played other fighters before, but I had no real idea what I was doing with them. Anyways, like everyone, I played Smash because it as fun and being able to punch Pikachu as Ganondorf was an amazing concept. But after a while, I had become pretty good at the game. At least, I thought I was ( I was trash by competitive standards), but I was starting to want to learn how to get better and take advantage of Melee's advanced stuff. Along the way, I found an interesting video about 'spacing' that changed everything. At this point, I thought all spacing was just hitting your moves sweetspots. But this video went into so much more. It talked about using your dash dance and wavedash to move in and out of your opponents ranges to bait attacks or make them hesitant to attack. It talked about throwing quick, safe attacks just outside of your opponent's ranges to hit them in case they moved in or attacked you. It talked about the usefulness of pushes your opponent to the ledge. Basically, it was all about positioning yourself to attack your opponent's options, rather than just attacking your opponent. It was eye opening. I never thought about it that way Two things happened from that day. First, I began really enjoying Melee a lot more from then, thinking of things like this. Two, I had a moment where I realized that while I still liked the Nintendo element, I was really liking Melee more for this depth and interaction with my opponent more, and that other fighters could offer it to me. This was 2010, so I jumped on SFIV and Blazblue. I learned that the 'spacing' of smash was footsies in the FGC, and it was just as interesting here. In fact, it felt like there was more to the concept, like empty cancels. To this day, this part of neutral is my favorite part.
For me the thing ended up being realizing how I could abuse chip damage. Whether it was through managing to get a kill via it or if it was through making sure I had just slightly more health than the other person chip damage was one of the big things that really got me. Playing around the timer is a related thing that got me a lot. Because I realized that not only could I win this way but that people can get very desperate and frustrated with it. Sometimes this ends up working out poorly on my end but a decent enough amount of the time it results in people making risky decisions and just eating things. Things like this and just how hard Samsho's heavy slashes hit really got me into my fondness for very defensive, reactive play.
I think on the tech side of FG’s it was the idea of a block string. “Wait I want them to block this combo, so it sets up something else. I know the vid is two months old, but major nostalgia from the vid
My favorite fighting game tech is from the ORIGINAL Killer Instinct - special move cancels So you can do a Fierce Wind Kick with Jago if on a rooftop level and far away, and inputting the move again in reverse while its active to come out of it. It’s a great spacing set-up mechanic. Another is Glacius - if you used his fierce teleport uppercut, you can reverse it mid-move (with medium 4) and he will come up on the other side of opponent, which would hit every time and can’t be blocked (yes, it’s also a glitch) I’m also pretty sure that KI was the first game to introduce Cancels, but not 100% sure And I love Tekken characters that can reverse attacks - so especially Jun / Asuka / King
Great video! Though personally, I just love footsies, man. Players patiently testing the waters and fishing for each other to overextend and take a beating for it... that's fighting games. Nail-biting tension for the audience and a dry eyes everywhere, for one blink is all it takes for the outcome to present itself. Who a player is is tested in those moments, and anything can happen. "The answer lies in the heart of battle."
For me it was fadc. Sf4 was already kinda fun and watching daigo and specially tokido play was inspiring to a degree, when i found out watching a tournament (thx tokido) that i could shoryuken focus attack and cancel it into something else using dash, it was like opening a door for a whole new world of possibilities and i was hooked in fighting games. Than i heard fuzz about 3s and got to play it... Welp is my favorite Fighting game so needless to say, i adore parry, what makes the game turn into, and how the game keeps expanding on and on the more i play it (been 12 years lmao and still in love)
Old sf2 chunli could spin kick over the fireball but you had to execute it right before it hits. Only instance I remembered I could dodge fireball traps. Was very tricky to pull off and the spin kick was not fast enough before the ryu player could react.
I love counters/parries. I play low tier characters because they win due to enemies making a mistake. So you give me a character that punishes player with counters/throws or just being a strict "wait for the open" characters are my favorite. Styling/winning on an opponent is one thing. But to punish your opponent for making a mistake and their reaction is more to "I fucked up" is better than getting a "fuck you that's cheap" I love my set up/punish characters. Getting an opponent to learn and understand is more rewarding than a win. I even message people with "you've learned something!" Humbling your opponent feels better than winning. And hopefully that player will learn and become a better opponent in the future ^.^
For me was the shield grab in smash Brothers. As soon as I figured out you can shield some moves and instantly grab after, I was like, woah new techniques to punish?
I've instinctively known about this since World Warrior but hadn't realised the community gave it a name, as I've never been part of any fighting game community. The deeper the research goes the more it feels like work, the more endless it all seems and i get put off even picking up the controller (or stick). I've realised I only enjoy fighting games against the CPU, I prefer ai exploits to fighting other people.
I think it's throw mixups that made, and still make, fighting games to me. The first FG I invested heavily into was Guilty Gear Accent Core with Jam and boy a lot of people got murdered by repeated throws eaten by the fear of being opened up by some random EX puffballs into 50% life combos.
I was lucky my friend got SF2 for genesis as xmas gift, lended it to me and went on vacation. I had an entire summer vacation with the game in my hands. So I wanted to train and get better at the game so, I played a lot on versus mode and no timer, so I could practice special moves and combos
Hey so I really love your videos I'm working on doing analytical breakdowns on older fighting game titles and wanted to know if you'd want to work on a video together
For me as basic as it sounds it’s frame data. I remember seeing some tweet that jimmyjtran made that was on the line of “frame data isn’t a strict guideline to play the game but it’s a set of rules that you need to know when to follow or break” then it clicked when I saw him hatchet kick people 3 times in a row. I think doing things like “I’m minus and safe so I’m gonna DP” and “I’m plus but I’m gonna delay my string to catch your delay tech” is so fucking cool. Following and breaking the rules I think adds so much player expression.
A comment on the average player - The average arcade player in 92-95 knew safe jumps and other tech we take for granted now. Due to the nature of arcade culture players were forced to understand these fundamentals to compete. During the dark ages of fighting games - 99-2008 - most players didn't learn this stuff as they just played at home with their buddies. This same information was still available but you had to go and find it. I suppose the point is what qualifies as "average" has changed over the years dictated by how the games are played.
What got me invested was, I had the honour, as a scrub, to have lengthy sessions with the highest ranks at the time. What you see as a trap, for me, was just one part of it. Pros... No
Honestly my big issue with current day tech is that so much of this tech is scattered around discord servers and twitters that it can be hard to track down exact tech.
But ryu fireball was faster than most characters it was 2 frames higher...Also, your topic about the fireball is the reason why most fighting games including the new street fighter games now have invincibility mechanics to try not to stay in the loop or trap you are talking about...If you have a person like street fighter 4 version of Cody...he can avoid a lot of this stuff on your video...The only problem Sf4 Cody had was that he didn't have a strong wake up and/or neutral game...He had momentum when you are dominating the match with the tools he had in that street fighter game.
Why is it called "tech"? That always bugged me. Maybe it's because I'm not a native speaker. But honestly I think one of the many reasons fighting games are so inaccessible are all these weird terms that don't make sense by themselves.
@@toastedperfection2488 okay, that makes sense, but why are certain actions then called "teching"? Like in Dragon Ball FIghterz when your opponents drops the combo and you "tech" out of it.
@@Crowbar In that case, it's actually a short form of the word Technical, which is the official name in Street Fighter (and other fighting games) for specific game mechanics. Most games use the word technical for mechanics like instant recovery and escaping throws. Tech in this case is a verb referring to performing a throw technical, thus the "teching" gerund. So yeah in the vid the "tech" referred to technique but the stuff like teching out of combos or teching throws is a technical.
Most important skills by game: Frame-perfect reversal throw & option selects specifically for command grabs=SF2 series Glitch exploitation & custom combo optimization=Alpha series Parry set ups & kara everything=SF3 series Focus cancels and true frame traps=SF4 (all sf games have frame traps, but not as obscene as SF4) Paying for exclusive Chun Li outfits in cash and complaining about how much the game sucks= SF5 Capcom vs SNK 3 > SF6 =..(
not really. a lot of tech or exploits have been missing in old SF games due to game imbalance. Late in my serious SF Third strike gaming, I began to notice much power leaning into parrying, making a defensive player the best play style. turns out I was right, parrying is gone in newer SF games
You're really knowledgeable and make good core points, but you include too much purple prose in your scripts where you gush that something is so cool, so deep, etc. Try to avoid filler. Just say the thing you mean to say, and that's enough. If your script doesn't feel long enough, then try including more examples.
I mix it up, sometimes it's straight to the point and sometimes the context of an idea is what excites me. This was a video where the latter was more important to me. That being said, I'll take this onboard for sure.
Please bear in mind that the video is literally titled "MY FAVORITE..." Personally I enjoy hearing more personal point of view, where the passion is expressed outright. Though i won't argue against using more examples.
@@TheoryFighter I appreciate that you value my advice. I also write long form content and had similar issues early on. Plus I see it in a lot of other writer's work. I think it comes across as unprofessional, though I do see your understanding of the subject matter. Learning to articulate what you know is tough.
You need Jesus
You need Jesus
SodaPinez spread the word brother!
You need science.
Gief Grief if you think the Big Bang is a science then your the one who needs science my friend
@@fooladoo1076 I was really waiting for a "you need Jesus" chain but I guess not :/
The 2 bits of tech that got me into fighting games was 1: Guile's charging, learning to use normal to move forward and back and learning when to go for offence or defense. 2: Slow projectiles, plenty of people when the start playing go for fast or flashy moves but when I noticed how some people panicked when a slow projectile came towards people, as sadistic as it sounds this is what started my love for characters that made people scared.
Yo same, I love slow projectiles.
Number 2
SF 5 Laura
O_o
Learnin* how to do the air spinning bird kick by chaining the toe taps, that was one of favorite learning moments
Your channel logo is literally so needlessly metal and I love it.
It was blocking for me as a kid. After I found out how to block I was hooked to fighting games
You can block for so long because a lot of games mids aren't the same ask m.bison(dictator) and guile's upside down kick... Dictator's signature knee move changes every game. It's used as a frame trap and a crushing blow.
Newbies don't usually recognise how important that is...
@@OmegaTaishu no they don't especially spacing.
Mine was converting on overhead bouncer into an uppercut and feeling superior to my friends because I “had the most damaging combo”
Touche. I only knew blocking was backwards, but when I knew I could block in place by crouching and pressing backwards. My mind was blown.
I guess everyone has that simple thing that they find really engaging in a fighting game, huh? For me, it's walking. Be it backwards, or especially forwards, I love to walk and block- refusing to commit myself to an option, but keeping an eye on my opponent. I often try to see how often I can sneak a walk forward in and sort of just eke out an edge in the footsies game on my opponent by taking real estate from them, and lull them into a sense of comfort. It's low commitment to walk and block, but a lot of players at my level get massively thrown off by it, and it feels very good to know I won a match because I made my opponent walk back into a corner and put them on the defensive by doing no more than walking and finding out when and where they push buttons.
I really love charge inputs, but it's not what got me hooked. I got started with Smash spamming specials with friends and then I learnt combos and dodge reads in Brawlhalla.
execution
I find it very satisfying to do motion inputs, it feels super cool to have a special technique to do cool moves with unique properties
When I was 10 to 12 years old, the SPD for Zangief was the one special move I never bothered to learn much because it was hard to do and he just seemed like such a weak character. When I was a bit older in my teens, the idea of tick throws captured my attention and I began to learn Zangief as a character, mostly in SFA3. I took a long break from fighting games in my 20s, only playing them sporadically on emulators, but when SF4 revived the genre, I found myself most interested in Zangief players such as Snake Eyez and Itabashi. Gief's been my main since SFV launched and I love the mind games of tick throws and air SPD's. Just another example of how one particular aspect of fighting games can really draw you in.
What they did with Zangief and command grabs in general in SFV was a big reason why I never bothered with the game.
As a kid I was the only one of my friends that *could* SPD. I made it my mission borrowing SFII on SNES from Cameron and dominated after that. Too bad I've remained casual all these years...
I like mid rangers
that's it
i like playing axl on mid ranges
Vega
Rog
Yuzu ig if you can call her that
just having that space and options to work with Makes me go :D
Every "I learned I can SPD my way to Gold" story ever told. Because jumping and crackmonkeying the stick is a lot easier than trying to learn precision tech and combos.
@@helxis Yeah because online rankings like gold existed back in the 90s. And in SFV I was Ultra Diamond, not gold. It's just a story about how how a simple piece of tech sucked me into a new aspect of fighting games. I play all sorts of characters in fighting games and, yeah, tech and combos are a big part of it. That being said, if you doubt my skill, I'm happy to play you in a set in SF6. Just let me know.
Not exactly the same situation, but the talk of timing and conditioning reminds me a lot of Ryu's SAIII from 3S.
Or canceling akumas red fireball with sa3 so the opponent can't see the fireball during a potential chip out
It kinda is. Most FB setups, like denjin, start from a knockout or DP. Denjin is a fireball 😂
Ye
my fav tech is setting up meaty-timing post-knockdown via a sequence of whiffs. as a grappler, its fun to use a command grab that leaves you full screen and whiff a HEAVY forward-moving special move to be right next to them when they wake-up every time you grab them EXCEPT the last time you grab them in the final round, after which you _instead_ whiff a LIGHT forward-moving special move to bait the opponent into thinking you’re gonna be right next to them again, so when the opponent does a wakeup DP or wakeup super to avoid losing the final round and make some space, you’re nowhere near them and can punish THEIR whiffed invincible reversal
What got me into fighting games was learning that there was a character called "Ragna the BLOODEDGE" it was so edgy, my middle schooler self couldn't resist.
Sin kiske, the pupil of sol badguy did it for me
Ragna THE Bloodedge
AKA
Carnage HITBOX
XD
Damn this comment makes me feel old, i was 24 when Blazblue first came out, lol.
Haha Johnny cage go brrr
I love Parry options in Fighting Games. You feel like such a master mind reading your opponent like that. Taht's also why I love playing Jin/Yoshimistu in Tekken
Same
Then I found Baiken and Anji in Guilty Gear...
KOU
This is similar for me but specifically Soul Calibur's Guard Impacts. It just feels so good. Especially when two players who know each other well end up in a Guard Impact rally.
I'm kind of split - I really dislike the system in Soul Calibur because it's so easy to do: I understand there is a further meta around this that I don't understand due to not playing enough - but Ryu' parry in SF5 is the same: Parry isn't a special move that works if hit by an opponent, that's a counter(attack) move.
A parry is the act of blocking perfectly and gaining some advantage due to it: Maybe you hold back and press forward the frame it hits you and thats a parry, maybe you don't block until the last frame and that counts as a parry - a parry is a minor feature of fighting games that shouldn't define a match, but should come naturally to both players.
Parrying a hadoken should be easy, but if you can Evo#37 then it's too easy.
@@Ramsey276one baiken is awesome
tk youzansen is my current goal
I could not care less about SF2 fireball frame traps, and I love how much you do care. I have so many little pieces of tech that I love that I want to rant for five minutes about, and it makes me so happy to see that in you.
For me, it was doing armored mix-ups as Big Band in Skullgirls. Anti-airing someone from full screen is my favorite thing, and to this day I don’t love anything more than an anti-air command throw. Scaring people into one will never get old, and I love it. Probably not as in-depth or specific as yours, but that’s my favorite thing.
Jumping back cancel to a hurricane kick was the go to escape if you were also a shoto
Projectiles are great for illustrating simple concepts to new players. It starts the conversation off, and you can talk to them about what to do next. Which is often just another fireball.
I laughed at that SKD tech thing at the beginning cause it's so true
But I 100% agree on the thing with fireball traps. Such a cool spacing mindgame that's sort of been lost in fighting games
So I watch the video, love these type of things especially if i'm to learn something new and at the end i notice the bongripper track. Damn dude, love your taste in music as well. Awesome
you got a subscriber for life because Bongripper
I am VERY LATE to your channel and have spent the last hour binging, I would like to respond to pretty much every vid you have made about game mechanics and broken games...
THANK YOU! I have often had this convo with folk about the "breaks" in games that made them what they are, and the fact that updates and sequels would take at least 6 months to be developed and then distributed to your arcade meant that games spent a lot more time in a certain state, which allowed for much more shenanigans. Nowadays, "anime" fighters are the accepted genre for unorthodox movement and breaks in the game. Meanwhile, people bitched and bitched about all the glitches an os in sf4 until the final result was... SF5!
I have already wrote forever so I'll end with saying we share the exact same sentiments about OG Fighters. Could you make a vid about "Marvel Super Heroes" one day?
I've been playing fighters for half a decade and never even knew about this, and was able to use it immediately to my advantage in a game like uniclr. It's a very widely applicable tech and I can't stress enough how much I appreciated this video.
For me, Gatlings in Guilty Gear are what got me to really appreciate combos in fighting games. Not only are they very simple to understand and use, and thus make doing simple beginner combos feel intuitive, but it also made me appreciate each of those attacks more and realize the individual uses they each have.
Although i'm a sf guy, the time i got into combos was when I picked gg xx to learn since a friend who got me into fighting games adore the series. Most of the time i wasn't hooked cuz i like more of the slow neutral mind game aspect of it, so i played ino because she was hot and had some makoto bullshit going for her and i love makoto (if you start you keep harrasing till win lol). The moment i was hooked was randomly picking axl and finding out he was a Dhalsim who played super turbo ryu fire ball mind games, with a full screen throw. The combo aspect of him was a reward for clever mind game and that got me really hard into learning combos to make the called out jump ins scary. No wonder i play him on xrd despite being a low tier, the feel times i hit 6k, makes ppl loose half their health and it is super statisfying.
"maybe you're just built like that" god your accent plus your lingo is a 🔥 and hilarious combination. I love it.
believe it or not I got into street fighter because in the 3ds' launch I only had SFIV 3D Edition. I didn't know what I was doing, but when I started doing the trials and I learned what a link was... I got hooked
Idk why CZcams has recommenders me three of your videos now, but I’ll take it as a sign. Subbed!
Cool tech is the reason why I play characters with beast cannons (Answer, Cinder, Beowulf, Mika, etc.) in so many fighting games, or characters with weird setplay gimmicks. (Answer, Cinder, Kokonoe, etc.)
It helps keep me focused on the match, because so much of playing them even decently requires knowing how to apply what you know about their moves in real time. I don't know how to optimize every confirm on every scroll/card setup combination for Answer, but I know enough to ad-lib a conversion regardless. To me, that's what makes tech so rewarding to learn. Knowing how to apply it in a match, in situations that you couldn't possibly lab out ahead of time.
edit: now that I think about it, there could be an entire video on why the beast cannon is such a cool move, and why it's been replicated in so many other games since.
Thanks for actually putting the outro music in the description. These guys are crushing as fuck.
This was a refreshing video on my recommendations!
You know what got me invested? The fatigue system that The Immortal has on its close up fighting. Outside of sports fighting games, you never really see this mechanic, where an attack has larger startup times and longer lag the more tired the character is. It's meant to be an anti-spam measure since if you overdo it, you become open to attack if you even try. I experimented with the mechanic in my games but I never found a good balance of fast response and careful offensive play in my own testing. I definitely like how Fight Night Round 4 handles it. Get hit in the body and your stamina is slowly sapped from you, making it harder for you to mount an offense.
I love that you mentioned the SKD thing. I love reading his explanations for the sheer fascination that someone could come up with something that he does
I love coming to these videos,1 you talk about Tech and specific mechanics with a passion and 2 you always have the best Doom tracks backing them
Such a great little video.
I'm gonna show this to my friends next time they ask how I'm able to enjoy these "button mashing" fighting games.
It's such a hard case to make when people aren't into them lol
The first time I comboed into Ride The Lightning was when I knew I loved fighting games.
The first thing that got me into fighting games was the flowchart playstyle in SF2CE.
On topic though, dodging and dashing/running from KOF made me stay. As for projectile traps, that's another good one. It's been in my subconscious for so long that I almost always do a light projectile after knocking down my opponent so that the projectile hits them in their wake up state(blocked or not), giving me free reign to pretty much do what I want.
Man, I'm in my early 30s and I have adored fighting games since playing sf2 with my dad on genesis and let me say: it's a travesty that you don't have 1m+ subs, the love you put into the content and the community is palpable. Signed, a newly gained fan! (And sub💜😂)
need more videos like this, great job!
Nice and simple one frametrap pressure tech with risk reward in your favor, I like it. Also seems useful for explaining things to newer players.
4:40 So assuming Guile has charge, he could've super chip killed right there, but he didn't. Is there any specific reason as to why someone shouldn't do that, especially at that close of range?
I never really got into Super Turbo and I've only been playing fighters for six months so perhaps it's my lack of experience, because the only reason I can think of is nerves possibly screwing up the input execution
He was might be trying and lost charge due to being put in block stun, then had to wait. Maybe the flash kick was failed super. If i had to guess though... i'd say it was just nerves playing Daigo and being in the lead.
By experience, I would believe that it is because of blockstun, And also because of his close Daigo was to him, Guile's super is a charge Z motion, and during the frame you do foward to then do back again you leave yourself open to be hit, On a side note Golcar might of been sure that Daigo Expected him to do it so he could then punish and win the round.
@@venomoussmiley6216 The execution isn't extremely difficult if you renda cancel though, done right the motion is down back, down forward, up back kick and it has to be done quickly, so to me I would think the only option would be back jump or something because at that range I don't see that being reactable
No. It’s just hard to execute fast and good when you’re under much pressure
@@delatroy But if you have charge, it's literally down forward, plink lP to up back..?
My favorite tech is definitely command dashes. Zeku in sfv is my fave because his command dash has a lot of potential
Just started playing ST ryu and i love fireball trapping, not too good at conditioning people into not jumping after the 2nd fireball yet but i guess i'll figure it out eventually lol
Sick ass music choice. Upvoted just for that.
I got hooked on Tekken due to its side step capabilities. Free movement seems to be what I go after in fighting games.
When I played Tekken Tag Tournament, I would literally just run rings around other players using the sidestep mechanic, I felt very few other players used it - and it was so important to utilize in high level matches
The thing that got me hooked on fighting games was yoshimitsu. Wait, I can be a troll WHILE playing a fighting game!? I found my spirit animal
Was expecting mentioning that you can use negative edge to os the second fireball if the first one whiffed. For me thing that got me hooked was the creative problem solving against another human, especially figuring out I could do a string and end it short into something else or choose not to and if it hit could hit confirm into something that knocked down and repeat.
To me, the hook to fighting games was learning matchup-fundamentals through Marvel Vs Capcom and King of Fighters when I was like in middle school, somewhere in like 2011. I have always found the approach to matchups and by extension considering team-composition in team-based fighting games a very interesting process. In a 1v1 fighter, matchups can generally range from good to bad, depending on how many tools you have to deal with whatever the opponent has. This mentality applies less to a game like MvC, where your team can be well-rounded, comprised of many archetypes that can deal with the weakness of one of your teammates. At that point, it's a question of what order you place your fighters in, how you manage the tagging in and out and what assists you put in to serve certain functions.
Although the one that really sold it was King of Fighters and it did it because of the ways it restricted the classic recipe for team-fighters. Because you don't have assists and can't just swap in and out between your fighters all willy-nilly, suddenly it puts alot of emphesis on the order in which your team goes and that alone can have alot of thought put into it. Maybe you wanna put a character that is really good at meter-building as first, then place a character that makes good use of that meter as either the next or last in line. The way I always played was that I picked a super well-rounded team, comprising of a fundamental shoto, a grappler and a zoner, covering just about every base I can. It would eventually grow into a team-up of Kyo/Terry on the front (Haven't really sealed that in yet), Clark as the follow-up and Athena as an anchor due to her oppressive options with meter (Though Terry can do that too), with this composition adapting depending on what I am matched up against.
These days, my interests lie in the mind-games of neutral and tend to favor games that have a really emphesize playing footsies, and it all stems from the days of learning to appreciate the art of considering the pros and cons of matchups back in the day.
Mine would be Cross up DPs RC in Blazblue, or Baiken's tk Youzansen RC in GG.
Thanks to those I've researched quite a bit and now I'm able to enjoy watching and playing medium / high level matches.
I remember what got me into fighting games. When I was younger, the only fighter I played was Smash, specifically Melee. I had played other fighters before, but I had no real idea what I was doing with them. Anyways, like everyone, I played Smash because it as fun and being able to punch Pikachu as Ganondorf was an amazing concept. But after a while, I had become pretty good at the game. At least, I thought I was ( I was trash by competitive standards), but I was starting to want to learn how to get better and take advantage of Melee's advanced stuff. Along the way, I found an interesting video about 'spacing' that changed everything.
At this point, I thought all spacing was just hitting your moves sweetspots. But this video went into so much more. It talked about using your dash dance and wavedash to move in and out of your opponents ranges to bait attacks or make them hesitant to attack. It talked about throwing quick, safe attacks just outside of your opponent's ranges to hit them in case they moved in or attacked you. It talked about the usefulness of pushes your opponent to the ledge. Basically, it was all about positioning yourself to attack your opponent's options, rather than just attacking your opponent. It was eye opening. I never thought about it that way
Two things happened from that day. First, I began really enjoying Melee a lot more from then, thinking of things like this. Two, I had a moment where I realized that while I still liked the Nintendo element, I was really liking Melee more for this depth and interaction with my opponent more, and that other fighters could offer it to me. This was 2010, so I jumped on SFIV and Blazblue. I learned that the 'spacing' of smash was footsies in the FGC, and it was just as interesting here. In fact, it felt like there was more to the concept, like empty cancels. To this day, this part of neutral is my favorite part.
For me the thing ended up being realizing how I could abuse chip damage. Whether it was through managing to get a kill via it or if it was through making sure I had just slightly more health than the other person chip damage was one of the big things that really got me. Playing around the timer is a related thing that got me a lot. Because I realized that not only could I win this way but that people can get very desperate and frustrated with it. Sometimes this ends up working out poorly on my end but a decent enough amount of the time it results in people making risky decisions and just eating things. Things like this and just how hard Samsho's heavy slashes hit really got me into my fondness for very defensive, reactive play.
Soul Calibur's counter mindgames are my ambrosia
Awesome video!!
Omg you're commentary is so well thought out and intelligent, and it's all about fighting games! Amazing content
The day i realized i loved fighting games was the day i learned how to SRK in SF2T. And yes, I'm still a ken main to this day lol
I think on the tech side of FG’s it was the idea of a block string.
“Wait I want them to block this combo, so it sets up something else.
I know the vid is two months old, but major nostalgia from the vid
What got me into smash was dodging on the ground and in air.
THE fundamental.
And a big part why SFV never did it for me. Along with cheap damage kill.
lol wut first off its critical damage, second off any special in sf2 could chip kill you
@@Cataphr4ct you didn't get it. Read again.
My favorite fighting game tech is from the ORIGINAL Killer Instinct - special move cancels
So you can do a Fierce Wind Kick with Jago if on a rooftop level and far away, and inputting the move again in reverse while its active to come out of it. It’s a great spacing set-up mechanic.
Another is Glacius - if you used his fierce teleport uppercut, you can reverse it mid-move (with medium 4) and he will come up on the other side of opponent, which would hit every time and can’t be blocked (yes, it’s also a glitch)
I’m also pretty sure that KI was the first game to introduce Cancels, but not 100% sure
And I love Tekken characters that can reverse attacks - so especially Jun / Asuka / King
Great video! Though personally, I just love footsies, man.
Players patiently testing the waters and fishing for each other to overextend and take a beating for it... that's fighting games. Nail-biting tension for the audience and a dry eyes everywhere, for one blink is all it takes for the outcome to present itself. Who a player is is tested in those moments, and anything can happen.
"The answer lies in the heart of battle."
For me it was fadc. Sf4 was already kinda fun and watching daigo and specially tokido play was inspiring to a degree, when i found out watching a tournament (thx tokido) that i could shoryuken focus attack and cancel it into something else using dash, it was like opening a door for a whole new world of possibilities and i was hooked in fighting games. Than i heard fuzz about 3s and got to play it... Welp is my favorite Fighting game so needless to say, i adore parry, what makes the game turn into, and how the game keeps expanding on and on the more i play it (been 12 years lmao and still in love)
Old sf2 chunli could spin kick over the fireball but you had to execute it right before it hits. Only instance I remembered I could dodge fireball traps. Was very tricky to pull off and the spin kick was not fast enough before the ryu player could react.
Cool channel!
Deathcore and fighting games 🤗😊
My god I never knew old street fighter games had this much tech!
My favourite tech is dashblocking in UNICLR, but a close second would be Slayer's backdash cancelling in Guilty Gear
Came for the sf knowledge. Stayed for the awesome bgm
Would be dope if you could break down sf6's sagejump parry OS
The demos were great
I love counters/parries.
I play low tier characters because they win due to enemies making a mistake.
So you give me a character that punishes player with counters/throws or just being a strict "wait for the open" characters are my favorite.
Styling/winning on an opponent is one thing. But to punish your opponent for making a mistake and their reaction is more to "I fucked up" is better than getting a "fuck you that's cheap"
I love my set up/punish characters. Getting an opponent to learn and understand is more rewarding than a win. I even message people with "you've learned something!"
Humbling your opponent feels better than winning.
And hopefully that player will learn and become a better opponent in the future ^.^
For me was the shield grab in smash Brothers. As soon as I figured out you can shield some moves and instantly grab after, I was like, woah new techniques to punish?
I've instinctively known about this since World Warrior but hadn't realised the community gave it a name, as I've never been part of any fighting game community. The deeper the research goes the more it feels like work, the more endless it all seems and i get put off even picking up the controller (or stick). I've realised I only enjoy fighting games against the CPU, I prefer ai exploits to fighting other people.
Most awesome gaming moment of my life was executing my first Street Fighter 2 fireball with Ken! I felt like a wizard.
I think it's throw mixups that made, and still make, fighting games to me. The first FG I invested heavily into was Guilty Gear Accent Core with Jam and boy a lot of people got murdered by repeated throws eaten by the fear of being opened up by some random EX puffballs into 50% life combos.
I was lucky my friend got SF2 for genesis as xmas gift, lended it to me and went on vacation. I had an entire summer vacation with the game in my hands. So I wanted to train and get better at the game so, I played a lot on versus mode and no timer, so I could practice special moves and combos
Hey so I really love your videos I'm working on doing analytical breakdowns on older fighting game titles and wanted to know if you'd want to work on a video together
I liked your video because it was good content. I subbed because doom metal.
What's the music track on this video?
my favorite ST tech is Chun LI
For me as basic as it sounds it’s frame data. I remember seeing some tweet that jimmyjtran made that was on the line of “frame data isn’t a strict guideline to play the game but it’s a set of rules that you need to know when to follow or break” then it clicked when I saw him hatchet kick people 3 times in a row. I think doing things like “I’m minus and safe so I’m gonna DP” and “I’m plus but I’m gonna delay my string to catch your delay tech” is so fucking cool. Following and breaking the rules I think adds so much player expression.
I wish you could talk about USFII TFC
A comment on the average player - The average arcade player in 92-95 knew safe jumps and other tech we take for granted now. Due to the nature of arcade culture players were forced to understand these fundamentals to compete.
During the dark ages of fighting games - 99-2008 - most players didn't learn this stuff as they just played at home with their buddies. This same information was still available but you had to go and find it.
I suppose the point is what qualifies as "average" has changed over the years dictated by how the games are played.
If you read the old srk forums, this stuff has been around forever since sf2
Damn that guile lost a craptop of health from giefs larriot
The thing that got me hooked is spamming hadoken
hype
Name for first game? Thanks
What got me invested was, I had the honour, as a scrub, to have lengthy sessions with the highest ranks at the time. What you see as a trap, for me, was just one part of it. Pros... No
This was punishing in hyper fighting.
Can anyone tell me the name of the game at 0:34?
Thanks
Granblue Fantasy Versus
@@RushStudios101 thank you!
what band is playing in the back ground
Bongripper
@@TheoryFighter fucking SICK i saw that band like 3 times here in chicago
Honestly my big issue with current day tech is that so much of this tech is scattered around discord servers and twitters that it can be hard to track down exact tech.
But ryu fireball was faster than most characters it was 2 frames higher...Also, your topic about the fireball is the reason why most fighting games including the new street fighter games now have invincibility mechanics to try not to stay in the loop or trap you are talking about...If you have a person like street fighter 4 version of Cody...he can avoid a lot of this stuff on your video...The only problem Sf4 Cody had was that he didn't have a strong wake up and/or neutral game...He had momentum when you are dominating the match with the tools he had in that street fighter game.
Why is it called "tech"? That always bugged me. Maybe it's because I'm not a native speaker. But honestly I think one of the many reasons fighting games are so inaccessible are all these weird terms that don't make sense by themselves.
Tech
Technique
@@toastedperfection2488 okay, that makes sense, but why are certain actions then called "teching"? Like in Dragon Ball FIghterz when your opponents drops the combo and you "tech" out of it.
@@Crowbar In that case, it's actually a short form of the word Technical, which is the official name in Street Fighter (and other fighting games) for specific game mechanics. Most games use the word technical for mechanics like instant recovery and escaping throws.
Tech in this case is a verb referring to performing a throw technical, thus the "teching" gerund.
So yeah in the vid the "tech" referred to technique but the stuff like teching out of combos or teching throws is a technical.
@@FishyAshB thanks man
Years later, Guilty Gear evolves the "fireball trap" into FRC/YRC fireball trap.
I can probably guess you prefer ST over SFV.
Just frame inputs
Most important skills by game:
Frame-perfect reversal throw & option selects specifically for command grabs=SF2 series
Glitch exploitation & custom combo optimization=Alpha series
Parry set ups & kara everything=SF3 series
Focus cancels and true frame traps=SF4 (all sf games have frame traps, but not as obscene as SF4)
Paying for exclusive Chun Li outfits in cash and complaining about how much the game sucks= SF5
Capcom vs SNK 3 > SF6
=..(
Roman Cancels. :D
My favorite fighting game tech is turning off the console when I lose. Take that everyone.
For me it was OS safe jumps in SF4
There are wayyy too many os's in 4.
Well setup after combo hard knock down in sf4 is really stupid. .. hmmmm
not really. a lot of tech or exploits have been missing in old SF games due to game imbalance. Late in my serious SF Third strike gaming, I began to notice much power leaning into parrying, making a defensive player the best play style. turns out I was right, parrying is gone in newer SF games
Make a a video with good ST content, and an ST thumbnail. Get a like and comment.
second
You're really knowledgeable and make good core points, but you include too much purple prose in your scripts where you gush that something is so cool, so deep, etc. Try to avoid filler. Just say the thing you mean to say, and that's enough. If your script doesn't feel long enough, then try including more examples.
I mix it up, sometimes it's straight to the point and sometimes the context of an idea is what excites me. This was a video where the latter was more important to me. That being said, I'll take this onboard for sure.
Please bear in mind that the video is literally titled "MY FAVORITE..."
Personally I enjoy hearing more personal point of view, where the passion is expressed outright.
Though i won't argue against using more examples.
@@TheoryFighter I appreciate that you value my advice. I also write long form content and had similar issues early on. Plus I see it in a lot of other writer's work. I think it comes across as unprofessional, though I do see your understanding of the subject matter. Learning to articulate what you know is tough.
damn those were some boring matches
Wow. I hate literally everything about this concept to my very core.