Clive of India was no sociopathic thug, but a British self-made success story | History Defended
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- čas přidán 16. 05. 2024
- Was Robert Clive a corrupt violent bully or a military genius and British hero? Historian Zareer Masini joins Steven Edginton in the latest episode of History Defended to find out the truth behind the controversial figure. Watch the full video above or listen to the discussion on your podcast app, with new episodes of History Defended released every Wednesday.
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The man for whom the phrase : 'embarrassment of riches' was invented.
The term is ‘nabob,’ from ‘nawab.’
Siraj ud dullahs grandfather murdered his own Nawab and bribed the Mughals to become the Nawab of Bengal,Siraj in turn was betrayed by his uncle Mir Jafar who collaborated with Clive to become the new Nawab. There are no good guys ... real life game of thrones
The British were the greater evils
So nice to hear a well-educated, unbiased person presenting a well-defined, impartial view of a multi-dimensional character like Clive.
Clive was a terrorist.
Next up:- Hitler was no mass murderer, but a German military leader, economist, and self-made success story.
Well balanced, history should always be considered comparatively. Clive was a man of his time, not perfect but then neither was nawab
The land of Fagin..The Artful Dodger..Oliver Twist..in Charles Dickens novel.
What about locals who suffered because of him?
@@abhishekkhandelwal3582 My friend,they were the same locals who didn’t care about the conflict between the Nawab and the Company because of the distance the monarchs created with the people.Let's just accept it-Monarchy is monarchy.Only a few rules the nation,the people suffer every time.Clive was pathetic,yes,but the Nawab,or any other monarch, was no less monstrous than him,if not more.
@@edwardkenway1743 Nawabs at best fought with other kashatriyas but Clive and his rogues wreck economic havoc and made indians poorer than dirt.
@@edwardkenway1743 if nawabs truly did the same things as clive did, england wouldn't have stepped into India in first place because there wouldn't be anything to steal
The British might or might not have wanted to improve India, but the British need to understand that one can't be accepting to a foreign race coming out of nowhere, all of a sudden arriving. There's a lack of trust and as a result it led to massacres. I'm glad my country is free now, I can't imagine the treatment I'd get if these were the British times and I hope modern day Britishers decrease the hate.
Britishers??? British*
@@SECRETORDEROFTHEKNIGHTSTEMPLAR Britisher
/ˈbrɪtɪʃə/
nounINFORMAL
plural noun: Britishers
(in North America and old-fashioned British English) a native or inhabitant of Britain.
I'm always surprised that nobody takes the base-line corruptions of local leaders into account when weighing foreign rule that enters an area. Especially Colonial rule. Nobody bothers to say "Yes, they conquered, but did they make life better for the average inhabitant?". We look at the actions of the local rulers and their extreme cruelties and decadence, dismiss it, and say "white people bad" without batting an eye at the things that went on without any outside influence. Because it is "fashionable" now to do this. That doesn't really balance the books, so to speak.
Because of modern left wing poltics. Everything now has to ve framed as anti white male. A shame, cos it takes away from proper history where we can understand people's motivations.
'peaceful' academic😂
our anti-british sentiment makes us think that our rulers were angels. there was something wrong with india. a nation so vast and rich yet so incompetent that we got raided so many rimes. our rulers were incompetent and not far-sighted at all
Clive was a terrorist.
in the case of India atleast, they didn't make the lives of the people better, they made it much worse
I live down the road fro where he is buried in a village called moreton say. I’ve always wondered what he was famous for.
Those time people live in chaos. War broke everywhere. Today we may just say Clive is bad guy but in those time who is strong, he is the king.
There were no women incarcerated in the infamous black hole of calcutta event.
Many British aristocrats such as Buckingham recorded accounts of the violent monopoly that excluded British business men, not just Indians, using criminal methods from conducting a civil life in India. He sent out personnel to be violent. This really is a misrepresentation, overly simplistic response and disappointing.
I've just finished Robert Harvey's lucid and well written biography of the great man. Truly fascinating look at a giant and the times in which he lived and died.
Isn't revisionism marvellous! The torygraph empire lovers will be delighted that Edgington has uncovered Mr "There is no evidence" Masini
If Clive was black, the left wing would ne giving him posthumous medals. Seems painful to the left that white men are not demons.
At the time Britain thought he was a thief
A vicious murderous thief
He was known as a vandal in rural Shropshire who ran a gang of protection racket targeting shop owners. Empire apologists have made him into a saint.
Very informative.
Ambitious😱
Obviously, a man who is ambitious & capable as Robert Clive was, was going to upset many people & vested interests either intentionally or incidentally! However, he was also a man of his times, so how can we two & a half centuries or more after he lived & in the places in which he resided & worked, hence impartially then judge him??!!
Life, people, societies & their criterion of values from varying points throughout History were always very different, constantly changing & often contrary to those what are familiar & acceptable to us nowadays!
Such comparisons are difficult to draw accurately, & raises doubts as to their serious relevance to anyone or anything! Consequently, it perhaps prompts one to thus ask the obvious question as to why should they then bother in the first place, to make it, at all?! For what good purpose, or else authentic knowledge would they glean from doing it?!!
Exactly. Hitler, Stalin and Mao were products of their time, as was Chengez Khan. Mass extermination was part of mainstream politics in the 20th century,
The problem with that point is that it seems to insinuate that corruption and cruelty were things that were acceptable in those times, they weren't!
Now, Clive was a corrupt man, considered so by the Indians of the time and the Brits as well.
Another Indian origin historian, who is very keen to defend his colonial masters in a proper British accent to get some praise from the masters' community.
There is a good living in it.
Just perhaps he is sincere in his view. I wonder how the change in regime impacted on the ability to prosper and personal freedoms of ordinary people. In a parallel universe of Ireland we always bash Cromwell. But for ordinary people the legal changes in status from a sort of serf to a Tennant could be argued to be a marginal improvement in leading to many personal rights and escape from tedious older obligations.
There’s always many perspectives. The day we ditch Cromwell bashing will be a milestone in our growth of confidence as a nation. Perhaps it’s a bit like that in clives case? It’s an I’ll wind etc…
He’s actually quite original. Unlike Shashi Tharoor (with his ridiculously pompous English accent) and Partha Chatterjee (with his slightly cliched Asian accent) who continue to deride the British in India, without acknowledging any of their achievements. 👍🏻
A brown sepoy.
Much of the history of the world is about one nation invading another and the cruel treatment of the conquered, this was completely normal for the times , I don't think that the British were particularly barbaric for the time, many in the western world seem to be going through a period of self loathing and guilt ridden hand wringing, for those who made disparaging remarks about the historian being interviewed, I am English born and educated in India, in my early years spoke with an Anglo Indian accent, a number of Indian colleagues of my father went to boarding school and then university in the U.K and had exactly the same manner of speaking as this gentleman .Britain should be proud of it's history
Bahut Jaan Hain aap ki baat and looks mein.
Thanks for putting this up, it's good to see unbiased history in this day and age
Shussh
@@krishanmohanpratapsinghgau80🤫
The Islamic mughals massacres of the Hindus is more horrendous.
More than Maratha?
Just because others did it doesn’t justify the harm British did to india.
Muslims will take blood of britishers... We still don't take the revenge of 190 horrific years.
@@onemancinema4215Marathas are real heroes❤
Which massacre?
Ummm yeah. From the occupier's perspective..."successful" but, ugh. Tyranny.
Please don't forget what he did to the Indians. What British raj did to the Indians!!!
What did he do? Deliver them from the vile government of Siraj ud-Daulah?
@@malpreece5008 India should deliver the Brits from the vile government of Boris Johnson.
@@kicksomeup6998 Perhaps they should! But then again, I’m not sure Narendra Modi is much better!
@@kicksomeup6998 : Maybe Rishi Sunak soon will do that?!! Then afterwards he can rescue India from Narendra Modi & his BNP Wallahs too?!!
@@theoraclerules5056 I think he can barely rescue his own appearance, let alone rescue India.
Dude looks like a brown Jeremy Corbyn.
Robert Clive is the real founder of India
India already existed and was a thriving economy. Listen to Shastri Tharoor. Roberta Clive helped the evil monarchs and the bankrupt ‘aristocrats’ loot India and become wealthy so that they could support their decadent lifestyles.
Defeated by Mahad ji Scindia in 1771 at allahabad after which maratha freed shah Alam from Britsh imprisonment
Clive of India was hungry for Indias natural resources.... 😆
It was fabulously wealthy before western civilization fixed it
@@julianshepherd2038 And how was wealth distribution? No-one disputes the wealth of the Maharajahs.
@@julianshepherd2038 it was indeed and then a hole was found which somehow started leaking wealth into England!
@@elkpaz560 Whatever might have been wealth distribution, no one went hungry and died of hunger as happened during british empire. More than the number of people died in WW1 and WW2, people died of starvation.
@@abhishekkhandelwal3582bhai don't even bother the British will never accept the wrongs they did in India. They even named him Clive of India as if he belonged to the country when all he did was make sure most of the country belonged to him. When he was accused of corruption in India his defence was I was offered gifts and told I could take whatever I wanted and gentlemen I was modest and only took a couple hundred thousand pounds worth of stuff. He forgot to mention that both leaders at the time where on the British payroll. On CZcams there's a lecture called the history of British India. Everything is outlined there. Shashi Tharoor said it best. The sun will never set on the British empire because God can't even trust the British in the dark.
Clive beat the Indians at their own slimey game
It made my stomach churn ...but isnt that what good presentation supposed to do😮 right or wrong is a different debate altogether
Tell me this is a propaganda video…
100% brother
Today's digital world anywhere and everywhere truth speaking or writing Karo and Maro and jhoot bolo jiyo.
He was a successful thug
A perfect person is full as dishwater. Clive mastered his weaknesses to more good than harm. We should be proud of Clive.
millions of dead Indian artisans, though he was not alone in vandalizing India and local powers would have allied with any bloodhound to do that dirty job of impoverishing their people. He was himself of low extraction with a very low life expectancy so he played as well as he could the only game life has taught him.
Wasn't Julian Assange a bit self-made journalist?
Look what happened to him ...
Journalists today, dhuuu ....
Well is his statue still in Britain ,, what a shame.
Trying to glorify bad rule of British Govt in India...this is ridiculous
Churchill was not considered at that time a sociopath or Dictator like Hitler..or Franco..or Pinochet..but yeah..Birds of a Feather.. FOR QUEEN AND COUNTRY..
`Birds of a feather' doesn't make any sense in this context. He didn't flock together with facist leaders, he actively fought them...
@@nickelmouse451 Churchill is a monster who has the blood of many Indians on his hands.The genocidal British empire was based on drug trafficking and the Industrialization of the west was possible only because of colonialism and imperialism.
The queen is dead and the country is dying.
He was a king
What a joke... Yes Clive was a holy man who never fought a battle or killed anyone and he came to india as a flag bearer of humanity who preached everyone to love each other.. 😂😂😂😂
This is very biased highly in accurate this guy is not accurate in his assessment
Care to back up that claim with some hard evidence?
what crazy misinformation is this.... ? lol
British raj
@@Ultra_timelord The British Raj? This only came into existence & happened 100 years or so after Robert Clive’s age & times!
@@theoraclerules5056 nope
@@Concerned_one Yep! The British 🇬🇧 Raj, 1858-1947 (Imperial Raj - Imperatrix/Imperator Indiae 1877-1947 - Empress/Emperor of India)
Hahahaha
Long live British Raj!
😂😂😂🤡
The British raj is long dead lol.
Not only british raj is dead, current UK is US puppet since Suez canal crisis.
While india is more of an independent nation.
The definition of purposeful ignorance; this piece of nonsense.