Lee Smolin: Quantum Gravity and Einstein's Unfinished Revolution | Lex Fridman Podcast #79
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- čas přidán 28. 04. 2024
- Lee Smolin is a theoretical physicist, co-inventor of loop quantum gravity, and a contributor of many interesting ideas to cosmology, quantum field theory, the foundations of quantum mechanics, theoretical biology, and the philosophy of science. He is the author of several books including one that critiques the state of physics and string theory called The Trouble with Physics, and his latest book, Einstein's Unfinished Revolution: The Search for What Lies Beyond the Quantum.
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Full episodes playlist:
• Lex Fridman Podcast
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EPISODE LINKS:
Books mentioned:
- Einstein's Unfinished Revolution by Lee Smolin: amzn.to/2TsF5c3
- The Trouble With Physics by Lee Smolin: amzn.to/2v1FMzy
- Against Method by Paul Feyerabend: amzn.to/2VOPXCD
OUTLINE:
0:00 - Introduction
3:03 - What is real?
5:03 - Scientific method and scientific progress
24:57 - Eric Weinstein and radical ideas in science
29:32 - Quantum mechanics and general relativity
47:24 - Sean Carroll and many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics
55:33 - Principles in science
57:24 - String theory
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I really enjoyed this conversation with Lee. Here's the outline:
0:00 - Introduction
3:03 - What is real?
5:03 - Scientific method and scientific progress
24:57 - Eric Weinstein and radical ideas in science
29:32 - Quantum mechanics and general relativity
47:24 - Sean Carroll and many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics
55:33 - Principles in science
57:24 - String theory
Lex, bud, you gotta let people finish their thoughts before you assault them with more questions.
Oooh, Lee Smolin. Still would have preferred Nima Arkani-Hamed, but this should be a great episode.
Thank you for this great interview! I really love it that you ask the most fundamental questions repeatedly, so we establish the answers! Really great job! Thank you!
Thanks! I suggested him recently in a comment to you, and coincidently or not, here he is! :) Your podcasts are excellent. :)
David Deutsch please!!!
He has a really clear categorization of his beliefs, assumptions, and level of expertise. It is refreshing to hear statements like "I haven't studied that theory sufficiently to comment on it".
absolutely
“...the theoretical physics community. This community has its respected academics,its naked emperors, it’s outcasts and its revolutionaries, it’s madmen and it’s dreamers.” - What a beautiful description!
This conversation is so good, I am enjoying listening to it multiple times. Lots of great insights to unpack in every listening. Thanks Lex!
Thanks, for being a bridge, between us and those leading brightest people.
Like Elon Musk and Joe Rogan
Thank you so much for having Dr. Smolin on. One of my favorite lecturers and writers on physics.
are his lecture available online?
Smolin is a genius and a great man. Humble, honest and sincere
Already looking forward to seeing the second appearance of Lee on your podcast. Great interview!
It would be awesome if you could get Terence Tao or Ed Witten!!
great suggestions
Nima Arkani Hamed, Juan Maldacena,...
Terry Tao, yessir!
Witten would be dooooooope!
That would be a next level conversation
Blessing us with great content Lex
As a layman, Lee Smolin is one of my favorite physicists. I've heard some of his lectures before, and his ideas are extremely refreshing in regards to the nature of reality, time, and philosophy of science. I only wish he was younger so he had more time to really follow through with them.
Lee is on the right track, but he hasn't yet gone far enough. Both quantum theory and relativity theory are flawed. Each has some incorrect assumptions. Melding those 2 theories won't eliminate those incorrect assumptions. But here's the good news. The theory all realists want already exists. My unifying physics theory, matter theory, is a realist theory which explains 23 fundamental physics observables the standard model can not explain. Also, matter theory permanently eliminates from physics theory the illogic of all 6 current professionally used physics theories. Search keywords: matter theory marostica.
This is a very good podcast in general. Lex raises the level of difficulty understanding the material, but still unwraps it into form for someone who wants to know more about a subject, but still lacks the technical understanding one would gain from studying the subject.
the luggage thing got me rolling on the floor
Wheels on the luggage. Wow, that statement was so profound!
Profound metaphore and bold statement?
Not really because some people prefer to keep things simple and carry a bag. Sometimes simpler is better. Also, you need nice flat smooth flooring and no steps for wheels on a bag to make sense. It wouldn’t surprise me if they all considered adding wheels to their bags and then thought - no it’s easier without.
what are the wheels representing in this metaphor ?
Lex had harf time connecting but I hope he gives it a 2nd listen one day and get the WOW I got fron this podcast. Lee has some very good 1st principles ideas here❤️
Just found you Lex and want to say thanks for making this content from all my heroes in Physics easily accessible. KUDOS
At this point i'm pressing like before I watch the episode.
At this point I'm pressing like before I finish reading your comment.
That rather defeats the purpose of the Like button.
By far one of the greatest guests on the show. Thank you so much for this podcast Lex. The nature of time being more fundamental than space and events that cause events within the causality of the speed of light was a major breakthrough to me. The notion that the order of causality being a non-spatial property of time is revolutionary. Lee Smolin is an absolute genius.
I don't remember him actually mentioning the speed of light and I think that was deliberate. I think the problem with trying to use the speed of light as a way of understanding causality and emergent space from fundamental time is putting the cart before the horse; how do you define speed without first defining distance (space)?
Mein Gott, this is fantastic! Guest suggestions: Grigori Perelman; Edward Witten; Douglas Hofstadter; Cosma Rohilla Shalizi.
You'd have more luck reanimating Dirac's corpse for a podcast than getting Grigori Perelman to be involved in any kind of a conversation. Not that I wouldn't want that.
@@ProjectNoid Just you wait ;-)
@@lexfridman can you bring Joe Rogan??
@@ProjectNoid want what? reanimating Dirac's corpse?
@@AndDiracisHisProphet Yes, that too.
I take a shot of russian vodka whenever Lex says "linger".
Ice Cold Vodka
Lee Smolin is a great thinker of our time.
Great job Lex for bringing him onboard your ship for questioning :)
Love this podcast. I like your inclusion of philosophy.
Yet another fascinating talk. Thank you for the great content!
I like how his ideas emerges in popular literature, for example in Peter Watts books. By the way, it would be wonderful if Lex could invite him to this podcast.
not only the guest is important, the questions and bouncing of ideas is aswell. you do it very well.
Amazing interview, Lex. Thanks!
Lex, please, interview William Gibson. It is a wish dear to my heart.
Thank you for all the hours of ingenious interviews!
Lex we need a second part with Lee!!
Love you Lex! Keep it up
Great conversation; I love it. Thanks Lex.
Lee is among my top 5 favorite thinkers. I am not inclined to quarrel with him.
Keep up the great work lex! 👍🏻
I really enjoy the podcast you do ! Thank you Lex !
Wow, another big name, Lex. Please keep 'em coming!
amazing. been a fan of Lee's for years. never knew what he looked like though.
great conversation. enjoyed myself immensely. ty
haven't even gotten into the interview yet but DAMN great intro Lex.!
Thank you, Lex, again and again and again, for doing THIS!
Smolin is wonderful! What an exemplar!
Lee’s final statement beautifully expresses a general principle of science world being able to reorganise and see beyond some of the impactless divisions.
Excellent podcast Lex, you da man. A+
I enjoyed this conversation.
:-)
These podcasts are of great value to me.
:-)
I’d also very much love to hear Dr. Smolin discuss his ideas in depth with Sean Carroll on Sean’s podcast. I’ve said the same to Sean online.
That happened!
@@rohityadavade5528 Yes it did!
Lee is such a valuable influence to the physics community! ❤️
What an ambitious interview
So great to see Feyerabend taken seriously by such a brilliant mind as Professor Smolin. Feyerabend is not universally admired I think it's fair to say but his arguments are very important to take on board.
Thanks for writing the man's name in the comments. I've never heard that name and would never have been able to find his writing without your comment.
What a great and accurate description of the ethics and training required to be a good scientist.
Wonderful conversation 👍👌
really enjoyed listening to Lee Smolin
Way to go Lex, thanks
I really admire Mr. Smolin.
Wow great conversation! It would be cool if you could get a couple people from varying fields to converse together.
xD 10:15 Yo I'm a scientist!
Been laughing so hard all day since i listen the podcast this morning. I search it in video just for this part 😂😂😂
It's even funnier when contrasted with his overall slow manner of speaking. So unexpected :)
Such a good discussion
Yoooooooo! On a Saturday night!?!? We love you lex! SALUTE
Lee's idea of each type of particle or molecule having its own "view" of the universe, and thus linking every single one of these particles with one another of the same type, and differentiates them from other particles with other "views", because they have different properties. And creates a kind of cosmic web of objects of the same type with one another, which could possibly explain things such as quantum entanglement and instantaneous action at a distance, is really fascinating.
Which also offers a predictive model for understanding memory; what Feyman described as 'last weeks potato remembering what a skin cell should be'
Very much enjoyed this conversation. Makes me feel normal.
It may sound lazy, but it would be nice if you put links in the description to the podcasts you recommend also listening to in the podcast intro.
One of the most brilliant minds I’ve listen to in 2020,Thank you for this podcast Lex. Conversations like these give me hope for a better tomorrow. Understanding reality is a very beautiful abstraction. Reality itself is a special force that exist with in the universal truth of human nature. Love everything you do, god bless you!
Had to bring god into the equation
LoL 😂 ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️wash your hands
The luggage thing came to mind about months ago while carrying hockey equipment. I had to fumble the whole way out from of the car open the doors hurt my back twist and turned with the strap on the bag. I made my thoughts very present in clear to other people I don’t think they understood what I was trying to tell them. How long did it take to put wheels on a bag? How long does it take to have a robotic bag to tracks and follows you through a parking lot, shopping centre, airport, or mall? I don’t belong here! I’m sad 😞
What about the breakthroughs in thermodynamics that took place from the late-18th to the 19th centuries that enabled developments/ applications in chemistry, states of matter, and inventions such as the steam engine?
It just seems Lex can get all the big daddies on his broadcast. Here is the challenge, Shinichi Mochizuki.
Wonder if you ever could interview Neil Turok, i realy like his views, and thanks for a amazing channel.
Amazing as usual 😁😁😁😁
What a kind man. I’m very impressed.
25:06 About the Luggage: Flat Surfaces are a relatively modern invention. Before that you had bricks and mud and uneven floorboards. So, It wasn't a fact of nobody had thought of it. The fact was that it wasn't practical back then.
Expanding this idea to thoughts, it also may be the case that: It simply is not practical to think in a more "correct" way until certain "surfaces" of thought have been "flattened".
I don't know what that means, but, meh. Whatever. !
"Flat Surfaces are a modern invention" - Better lay off that crack pipe
Zenchess
Would you be happier if I said: the wide adoption of flat surfaces into almost all facets of life-
@@skierpage tru tru
@@skierpage very nice.
Went looking for this comment and found it. Before uniform surfaces people did use carts and wagons. I believe your metaphor is more accurate which alleviates the accusation of human nature as being naturally flawed (original sin). The expansion of your metaphor defines how ideas are reduced from complexity which provides a landscape for information that is new or significant to be expressed, recognized, and adopted. The inaccuracy of the metaphor is anywhere these newly flattened surfaces are perceived as totally detached from the process of applying new information for that was how it found the significance. It was why the surfaces were flattened.
What appears be an ultimate appeal through understanding to intuition seems to reify the foundational reality of our sense perception complex .
Third, but first at heart.
Your content is excellent.
You inspire the world to pursue knowledge and higher learning.
Education is critical to saving the universe.
Why does the universe need saving
Lex Fridman. Many thanks for sharing the statements of such a wise scientist, seeker of the answer to the question: what is closer to the truth?
I love these conversations, they are so interesting. Regarding Smolin's definition of realism, he says it is a belief. Beliefs are creations of the human mind.
realism, yes. reality? to be determined
great podcast
Instaliked based on title alone
One of the most beautiful people and one of the most beautiful podcasts ever made Lex. He has a fantastic mind. It's absolutely fantastic you found him and were able to get him.
Fascinating thx
Hi Folks! Many of the concepts discussed here can be further explored in the work of Carlo Ravelli. I recently finished reading his book Helgoland, and many of the points/clarifications that Lee is trying to get across to Lex are much clearer to me having read that book. I encourage others to explore that as well. The book is beautifully written and digestible to the non-specialist.
Smolin has an attractive thoughtfulness and intellect. I like how he sometimes struggles to articulate the deeper constructs his brilliant mind is bubbling up to consciousness.
I think it's available right here and now to experience the absolute reality. Meditators have done it for thousands of years.
Regarding 'Einstein carried his luggage' at 25:00 it might be interesting to check Robert Shiller's 'Narrative Economics' pp. 38-39 about suitcases with wheels. Shiller writes that the patent for trunks on wheels is from 1887 and he tells how it finally succeeded and went viral when flight crews adopted the Rollaboards in the 1990s.
I am at the least 2,009 years 3 months, 23 days, 12 hours, 17 minutes, 43 seconds ahead of the world. Time to get a new watch.
Lee and Lex, Quantum Gravity and the theory, mathematic, laws, reproducible experiments and observations that underpinned it, is crucial for an empirical real true Quantum Theory of Gravity that would finish Einstein's Revolution in physics. The Mathematics that we have today can't solve the problem of quantum gravitation.
Mathematics is invented and discovered. That's my personal experience. I've invented/discovered a completely new mathematics in the course of my 30-year-long basic research on Quantum Gravity in Singapore. I called it Majulah Matematika in honour of my home country Singapore. I use it to solve one of the most difficult conundrums in physics- the True Nature of Gravity.
Here is one of the many solutions that my new mathematics has derived: A Computer Universe that is real. It is run by Quantum Gravitational Computation, Quantum Gravitational Entanglement and Quantum Gravitation covering the entire Universe. An empirical Theory of Quantum Gravity is the key. And it will led us to understanding of how and why Gravity works. It will also at the same time, debunk and invalidate String Theory, Loop Quantum Gravity, M Theory, Theory of General Relativity and all failed and wrong theories of gravity. But it will proved and validate Einstein's Hidden Variables and EPR's authors Einstein, Podolsky and Rosen correct. The Hidden variables are: Quantum Gravity, Quantum Anti-Gravity, Quantum Neutral Gravity, the macroscopic cosmic scale Gravitational Quantum Entanglement and Gravitational Quantum Computation. All these would complete the Quantum Foundation, Unification of Gravity with Quantum Mechanics and the realization of Theory of Everything in Physics.
I have discovered and cracked the code of the true nature of Gravity in my over 30 years of basic research works in Singapore. This discovery/invention/theory of mine include THE GOD EQUATION - THE TRINITY Equations, Laws and Codes For QUANTUM GRAVITATION , QUANTUM GRAVITATIONAL ENTANGLE MENT and GRAVITATIONAL QUANTUM COMPUTATION that pave the way for Theory of Everything in Physics: - THE 3-in-1 HOLY GRAILS of Physics:
1. Quantum Anti-Gravity/Spin Up Quantum Gravitational Entanglement/0 Rhu Bit or R Bit:
QAG = ∆QGOρ < ∆QGFρ = ↑α
2. Quantum Gravity/Spin Down Quantum Gravitational Entanglement/1 Rhu Bit or R Bit:
QG = ∆QGOρ > ∆QGFρ = ↓α
3. Quantum Neutral Gravity/Superposition Quantum Gravitational Entanglement/01 and/or 10 Rhu Bit or R Bit:
QNG = ∆QGOρ = ∆QGFρ = ↑↓α
We now have a working Quantum Theory of Gravity that is testable and complete with reproducible empirical experiments with the same results if repeated over and over again and again, confirmed by empirical observations in nature with 7-Sigma level results, guided by empirical Laws, Cosmic/Universal Computation and physical/mathematical Trinity God Equations that are predictive, precise and does no collapse even in high energies of Big Bang and singularity of Black Hole. FYI: Quantum Gravity or Quantum Gravitation have three types that are equivalent to and manifested by Quantum Computational Gravitation- the biggest and most powerful Computer Software Program and Hardware in the Universe and Quantum Gravitational Entanglement - a Quantum Entanglement at Macroscopic Cosmic Scale namely: 1. Quantum Anti-Gravity = Spin Up Quantum Entanglement State; 2. Quantum Neutral Gravity = Superposition Quantum Entanglement State; and 3. Quantum Gravity = Spin Down Quantum Entanglement State.
More detailed information could be found on the published papers 2 years ago in London, Paris, and Zurich, online and at the two scientific Journals ACADEMIA and REAL TRUE NATURE. Alternatively, you can google the name of the author ROEL REAL ROVIRA to arrive at the published paper on Quantum Gravity.
Most recently, additional two well respected scientific journals namely NATURE and the AMERICAN PHYSICAL SOCIETY APS Physical Review Journals have officially invited this author to submit manuscripts on his Research on Quantum Gravity for publication for PRX QUANTUM in preparation for a celebration for International Year of Quantum IYQ 2025 to showcase the best papers of the year.
Quantum Gravitation is governed by and follow the Trinity Laws, Mathematics and Physics of Quantum Gravitation, Gravitational Quantum Computation and Quantum Gravitational Entanglement. We now have a new Laws of Physics and two newly discovered Fundamental Forces of Nature - The Quantum Neutral Gravity and Quantum Anti-Gravity which completed the heart of the Quantum Theory of Gravity published in London. Paris and Zurich last December 2022 as follows:
1. First Law of Quantum Gravitation: Rovira’s Universal Law of Quantum Gravitation:
“The greater mass density of gravitating Quantum Objects than the Quantum
Gravitational Field causes a downward acceleration of the Quantum Objects in a
Quantum Gravitational Field instantaneously mediated by Graviton.”
- Roel Real Rovira
Equation for Quantum Gravity, and Spin Down Quantum Gravitational Entanglement:
QG = ∆QGOρ > ∆QGFρ = ↓α
Where:
QG is Quantum Gravity in Rovira (value of downward acceleration force due to quantum gravity) in kg.
∆QGOρ is Differential Change in greater mass density of Quantum Gravitating Objects than the mass density of Quantum Gravitational Field in kg/m2 or g/cm3.
∆QGFρ is Differential Change in mass density of Quantum Gravitational Field in kg/m2 or g/cm3.
↓α is the Resultant Downward Acceleration of Gravitating Quantum Objects in mtr/sec.
2. Second Law of Quantum Gravitation: Rovira’s Universal Law of Quantum Anti-Gravity.
“The lesser mass density of gravitating Quantum Objects than the Quantum Gravitational
Field causes an upward acceleration of the Quantum Objects in a Quantum Gravitational
Field instantaneously mediated by Graviton.”
-Roel Real Rovira
Equation for Quantum Anti-Gravity/Spin Up Quantum Gravitational Entanglement:
QAG = ∆QGOρ < ∆QGFρ = ↑α
Where:
QAG is Quantum Anti-Gravity in Rovira (value of upward acceleration force due to quantum anti-gravity) in kg.
∆QGOρ is Differential Change in lesser mass density of Quantum Anti-Gravitating Objects than the mass density of Quantum Gravitational Field in kg/m2 or g/cm3.
∆QGFρ is Differential Change in mass density of Quantum Gravitational Field in kg/m2 or g/cm3.
↑α is the Resultant Upward Acceleration of Anti-Gravitating Quantum Objects in mtr/sec.
3. Third Law of Quantum Gravitation: Rovira’s Law of Quantum Neutral Gravitation.
“The equal mass density of gravitating Quantum Objects and the Quantum Gravitational
Field causes a zero acceleration or floating or hoovering of the gravitating Quantum Objects
in a Quantum Gravitational Field, instantaneously mediated by Graviton.”
- Roel real Rovira
Equation for Quantum Neutral Gravity and Superposition Quantum Gravitational Entanglement:
QNG = ∆QGOρ = ∆QGFρ = ↑↓α
Where:
QNG is Quantum Neutral Gravity in Rovira (value of zero acceleration force due to quantum neutral gravity) in kg.
∆QGOρ is Differential Change in equal mass density of Quantum Neutral Gravitating Objects to the mass density of Quantum Gravitational Field in kg/m2 or g/cm3.
∆QGFρ is Differential Change in mass density of Quantum Gravitational Field in kg/m2 or g/cm3.
↑↓0α is the Resultant zero acceleration or non-acceleration of Neutral Gravitating Quantum Objects in mtr/sec.
For more detailed information on these 3-in-1 Trinity Laws and Equations for Quantum Gravitation, Gravitational Quantum Computation, and Quantum Gravitational Entanglement - The Real True Nature of Quantum Gravitation, look it up at the two scientific journals ACADEMIA and REAL TRUE NATURE or google the name of the author ROEL REAL ROVIRA.
Copyright 2022 ROEL REAL ROVIRA. All Rights Reserved.
Amazing and beautiful thanks Lex
Dear Mr Fridman and Professor Smollin, Thanks to you Mr Fridman, you offer a platform for global debate. Professor Smollin has stimulated my thinking into realizing (rightly or wrongly) that what time is basically is the ‘consciousness’ of the universe. What do I mean by that? What I mean is that time allows the mind to comprehend the series of events that follow one after into what we call the past. The present is time showing us its face in fleeting images of unfolding events. Nature has evolved what we call time as simply the way one can put cascading events into a pattern. Time allows events to be categorized. Because it is invisible, we have trouble defining it, but it is really the tool that nature has devised to show the continuum of existence. Professor Smollin may be correct in saying the future has not been mapped out. My theoretical ideas are what comes out of my brain when I pose the question of what time is. Whether or not it is relevant, only time will tell!
There is a quantum leap between "time allows events to happen in sequence" and "time is the consciousness of the universe". One does not follow from the other.
@@empyrionin GGGGGGGGGGreat to hear from you. What I believe is that what we percieve as consciousness is in fact what the universe provides for all and everything to tune in to for its instructions per se on how to live or exist. Time is most likely the wheels and motor of consciousness. Nothing can move without time, not thoughts, hot material
objects, not the progression of all things.
This fine gentleman is a hero. Physics should listen to the man.
Lex-please ask a theoretical physicist, such as Lee Smolin, more interesting and in-depth physics questions-so we can learn much more about physics
Deep stuff. Loved the style of questioning..
Wonderful Lex! And thanks so much Prof Lee!
Theoretical and Practical Approach at the same time, and let the Nature open the secret.
Hope we, Homosapiens could pass the very now challenges peacefully, wisely...
I like Lee Smolin, but I subscribed because the intro by Lex totally reminds me of Rod Serling.
0:52 What's the correct pronunciation of "Susskind"?
I think when Smolin speaks of there being no “scientific method”, he has in mind an old dream that you could define an algorithm for scientific progress. And I think he’s right that that is impossible.
agree. There's no formula. When I entered grad school nobody gave me the Scientist's Creed. (although actually a Creed could be a good thing, just not an algorithm)
By this comment I can tell you agree that Lex did not get a definitive answer out of Lee as to why he doesn't think the scientific method exists. I wish he had pursued it more.
40:33 "Action at a distance" involves waves that transmit energy and information.
Water: The water waves. Sound: The air molecules wave. EMF: The photons wave. Gravity: The Space-Time fabric waves.
I can visualize "Action at a distance" as Holograms - a directed "Action at a distance". Photons can now be steered using the physics of waves to display images in midair, real holograms; no opaque background is needed. Watch "Holograms are real (and I just talked to one)", an updated report on hologram technology called "SolidLight", published by CNET on February, 12, 2023.
I love how this guy doesn't take anything as certain forever, even if it seems so as proven here and now, doesn't mean it won't change later. I also wonder if some of our 'constants' change depending on place in the universe, not just time. So much we don't know and many so called scientists ought to make sure they remember that every day.
great intrview
was hoping for discussion of Smolin's concept of cosmological natural selection
You are doing grate a lots of great jobs
Listening to these podcasts is like a great book. Reading it just once and thinking you caught everything is not logical.
Lex has a nice humility about him.
Why does time enter in Einsteins equations and not relative time ( the speed of time relative to a reference ) this way it would feel more like a space coordinate, the C factor would disapear. Actually everything seems only to exists relative to somethings else, length, time, speed
Thank you.
Would love to se Ed Witten on the podcast!
lex reaction at 18:38 hahaha amazing
As I watch this one morning it brings an old question in my mind. Something that I can only describe as crystilazation. Is there some force arriving from a quantum level. That sort of makes one point in space the same as that which is around it. Like if you had a ton of sticks on a plane all formed in the shape of a plus all about a foot long. If there is one set of sticks in the shape of a v that will snap to a plus given a big enough plane? I mean it may not work like that but I have always wondered if it happens and under what conditions it would occur.
Language is by far the most important invention followed by writing and saving that writting then math or along w it