"I'd do it again in a heartbeat." | Astarion's heartfelt confession with the Gur - Baldur's Gate 3
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- čas přidán 7. 10. 2023
- #baldursgate3 #astarion #gaming #gur #game #playthrough #cutscene
It's scenes like these that make me love Astarion more. - Hry
![Astarion's Actor being chaotic for 7 minutes | Neil Newbon Streams BG3 [Compilation]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/L-8Jma5I8No/mqdefault.jpg)
I find it interesting the game recognizes the complexity of the situation regarding the spawn and doesn’t punish the players or Astarion whatever the choice as long as they aren’t doing it for selfish reasons. Some good, thoughtful writing there.
Yes, the decision about 7000 spawns fate is really hard.
I can’t kill them, it’s not fair, they’re just like Astarion, and some of them suffered even more, Astarion spent a year in the tomb without everything, but some of them for 200 years. And they deserve the same chance that Astarion got. And in the Underdark already everything is bad and danger, not likely they will make much worse, and there is a chance that most of them still will not survive or be killed.
By the way Astarion has a line of his opinion on this, he is still inclined not to kill them more.
@@katiatall Everything is NOT all bad in the Underdark and seven thousand immortal monsters who must act as carnivores to survive are absolutely going to make it much worse. People like to talk about what the spawn deserve, but everyone else deserves to not be put in danger for their sake. Put an end to their suffering, don't risk many more thousands of other lives for the sake of people who already died a long time ago.
I would always save them, just because I want to give them a chance and none of my characters would have the heart to deal with the fact they actively killed 7000 people much like Astarion.
I headcanon my main Tav, Kara, who is romancing Astarion gets the gang back together at the ending party and founds their own adventure guild with them. The first Headquarters are in the Underdark and their first mission is to investigate a cure for vampirism or find a place that could house 7000 vampires without too much trouble.
@@leila13dnd AFAIK, there are only two "canon" ways to "cure" Vampirism, and both are very costly and not really feasible for curing 7000+ vampires as you'd pretty much have to do the entire process on each individual vampire spawn one by one rather than as a group:
You either:
- Kill the vampire and then use a spell, such as True Ressurection, to bring the person back to life as a mortal.
Or:
- Use a Wish spell.
The only other possibility I could think of would be to petition the aid of a full-blown God of Death like Kelemvor to perform one hell of a Divine Intervention....but I suspect that even Kelemvor who is probably the "nicest" God associated with Death would likely just refuse.
@@Scott-ql2kx see I feel like ur underestimating drow here, especially since you can go with Astarion to the underdark to manage them lol
This is what I wish people remembered Astarion for, not some sexy vampire that is eye candy. But a man who has been broken and reforged to be the monster that protects not destroys.
Basically, instead of a "Guardian Angel", he is a "Guardian Devil" watching over Baldur's Gate from the shadows. Willing to dirty his own hands and make the hard choices so that nobody else has to. He's willing to do things that will make people hate him, all to protect them from becoming as broken as he is....or at least _was_ before we entered his life. And I really feel like in this particular scenario, especially if you romance Astarion, that you let him turn you into a vampire (in much the same way that Ascended Astarion does) and the two of you stick together and shoulder all of those burdens together, with you effectively acting as his moral compass and support if he ever begins to go astray or lose his way....so that you can remind Astarion that he's no longer alone, he's no longer Cazador's puppet, and he's no longer the victim. He's now the secret guardian who protects others from the shadows without any thought of reward or thanks, and if it ever starts to feel like it's too much....he will always have _you_ by his side to help stabilize him and remind him of what truly matters: that he's making a real difference in countless people's lives and helping them live their lives in safety and peace, never having to fear the "monsters in the shadows" anymore as Astarion is the one who hunts those "monsters in the shadows" before they can ever cause anyone harm.
I like options Say nothing with companions, they open themselves
Huh. I need to use it more...seems I talk over them too much lol
@@sabrinakosiorek9712 Yes. I just noticed the same.
Any time I have the option to let companions do stuff I do. Like let Wyll kick the door to the burning inn.
@@primadeluxe4910I didn't have wyll with me for that moment in my first playthrough, only talking to him after did I realise that was something he should be there for in my other good playthroughs
I usually allow them to unless people will die or I think the outcome is more toxic then where we started. Like Lea zel and the Queen inside of the inquisition room. Like I'll respect lae zel and what she wants but if caving in to the queen hurts all of us and our group I won't stand by.
He had to face a terrible decision and then the consequences for said decision. He didn't flinch nor make up flimsy justifications. He spoke from the heart. I respect him for that.
I see him as horribly broken rather than evil honestly
It's a fine line. Many times he is one decision from Evil.
He’s a man in transition. He ls free for the first time and you see his darker proclivities that he’s developed through trauma and his awful master but, there is a tenacious light within him too. The player can either enable those proclivities or nurture that inner light.
@@ReplicatorFifth well put and agreed- couldn't have said it better myself
I’d say he’s pretty evil. Not to take away from the good writing and nuance he has, mind you, just that the things he does and why he does them aren’t really excusable, no matter how bad he’s had it.
@@thelettucebarrel7784 The thing is, the process of becoming a vampire at all tends to be a very corruptive influence by itself. If Astarion were cured of his vampirism (and since he's an Elf he'd still have a very long life ahead of him with his mortality restored), I suspect his darker aspects would likely fade rather quickly.
OOOH that's powerful. Astarion really does have a great heart, much as he would love to deny it.
It's worth noting that even at the start of the game, he isn't all that averse to helping people, he only dislikes helping people when there's no reward involved or mentioned. And he knows how it feels to be a victim, during his time spent under Cazador's thumb he was always a victim, so he's fine with sparing others from experiencing that same trauma and pain. He's a broken man trapped "alone" in the shadows for so long that he'd started to forget what it felt like to have people he could truly _trust_ and rely on, and once you prove to him that you've got his back no matter what, he repays your faith in him in spades. Hell, look at when he negotiates with you on who/what he's allowed to feed on. Whatever choice you make, he does legitimately try to abide by said agreement (so in that instance I often permit him to feed on those who attack or threaten us, but if he wants to feed on any of us, he has to first ask and receive our permission). Hell, if he accidentally kills you after "going overboard" if you let him feed on you, he doesn't disapprove even if you punch him for it because he knows he deserves at least that much for accidentally killing you and that you'd be totally justified in doing far worse or even trying to kill him in return, so one punch is a small price to pay by comparison.
jesus fucking CHRIST, Neil 😭
like he NEVER misses
Every line he's delivered in this game has been top tier. Like... a masterclass in voice acting.
Originally I destroyed all the spawn bc I thought it was just way too dangerous to release 7000 vampires at once into the Underdark but Astarion was so upset and guilty about it the next day I had to go back and save them. Underdark be dammned, I need my boy to HEAL.
Underdark is already dammed place with a lot of dangerous people and creatures
7000 spawns won't make much difference, and they might be killed very quickly, anyway.
But we are not gods to decide who lives and who dies. They deserve a chance, and so does Astarion.
(my opinion)
There's something really powerful in realizing that he's probably one of the only people who would have given them a chance as well.
@@katiatallYes! Now that Cazador is dead all the spawn essentially have the same freedom Astarion was granted thanks to the worm. They deserve the same chance he got. It's kinda beautiful if you think about. Yes they went through unimaginable horrors, but now they get a second chance.
If you romance Astarion and do the good route an ending you can choose is to move to the underdark together to guide the spawn
I don't understand why people think 7k vampire spawns are a danger to the UNDERDARK. Half of them are going to be dead - killed by drow, duegar or some horrifying wildlife - by the time they find a place to settle, the rest might make the place more safe and civilized. The underdark is not a peaceful, quiet place
I don’t understand how anyone could ascend Astarion when this is what he becomes when you don’t. He shows his true colors, his depth of regret and emotion, his true kindness that he never was able to show anyone before, because kindness meant vulnerability and vulnerability meant death, or worse. The growth he goes through in this game if you just love and encourage him and show him he’s safe and strong enough to become something more…ugh I’m too invested in this 😅
I love him your honor 😭
Can never kill them. If Astarion can do well, so can they but it is nice to see his reaction and how Neil delivers it.
Stephen Rooney wrote this quest line and character so well and Neil Newbon did so well bringing him to life. I like how the end acknowledges that either destroying the spawn or releasing them is a complicated moral quandary. I still like going with Astarion in the end to guide the spawn. Much happier ending in the epilogue
He is so beautiful, inside and out.
Oh wow. Never imagined this is where the choice would've led to. Thank you for sharing!
So apparently letting the spawn live is an oathbreaking event for Oath of the Ancients paladins, which seems contradictory to the longer explanation of their tenants mentioning "acts of mercy, kindness, and forgiveness." But Astarion's line about not sending the gur down into the dark may explain the game makers' thought process when they chose to draw a line there.
Oath of the Ancients is very anti-undead. Just like druids these guys think the undead are aborminations that need to be destroyed.
It's a potential oathbreaking event depending on how you go about it. I've seen some OAPs where releasing doesn't break. And some that it does. I think you have to have your character recognize that even if they are spawn, they are also innocent people that deserve mercy, kindness, and forgiveness.
Not only for Oath of Ancients for two other oaths paladins as well.
@@Louves192sure, in theory they are anti-undead, but the fact that it isn't an oathbreaking event to even tolerate Astarion as a companion in the first place shows that's not a hard and fast rule. What is the difference between letting one spawn live and letting 7,000 spawn live? If the reasoning is that Astarion is experienced and can control himself, then you're condemning thousands of people before they've even been given a chance. It just feels inconsistent to me.
In the patch 5 extra content, it turns out that the spawn did sort of cause a wave of destruction, which not only killed some innocent people but which also killed some of the spawn.
Wow, even as a dedicated Astarion romancer, I was beginning to feel like it was a little unfair how much more recognition Neil is getting over the rest of the cast, but now I’m reminded of why. I’ve finished the game 3 times and never even considered not sparing the spawn, because if he deserves a chance, why don’t they? But the conviction he has behind his words in this makes me think I’ve been making the wrong choice.
I found out if you let the spawn live you can get an extra scene later on in the game when exploring the sewers where you can find Gandrel with his two children, both turned into spawn. They are complaining to their dad how much the hunger hurts and he's devastated to see then like this. But you can convince him to let his children drink animal blood instead. He's resistant to the idea at first but he doesn't want his children to suffer and eventually kill a human for their blood so he agrees.
It was honestly one of the most powerful scenes in the game for me and I'm surprised I don't see more people talk about it. Because up until then I really did NOT like Gandrel or any of the Gur. I hated how afraid he made Astarion in Act 1. I REALLY hated Ulma and how she blamed Astarion for things that were literally outside his control. But that scene with Gandrel and his kids made me empathize with him as someone who also loves a vampire spawn and just wants to see them safe and fed while also not hurting innocents in order to do so. 💔 Now he knows what it's like, knows the same pain. He is forced to see vampire spawn as people now, instead of monsters. The kids even thank us for sparing them. 🥺 They still want to live, despite everything. And with Cazador dead they aren't bound to any master anymore, just like Astarion. They have all the same opportunities now he does. Ugh, gods the writing in this game ❤.
I actually had Astarion with me in my party at the time we ran into Gandrel and his kids. Was disappointed he didn't have anything specific to say about it. :( Although I suppose maybe seeing the spawn children again with their dad was all too emotionally overwhelming for him and he didn't know what to say, which is honestly pretty understandable and realistic. ❤
If you tell Gandrel he should put his kids out of their misery, he will tell you they all had enough misery already and he will protect them. Made me see him in a very different light, since the other Gur are really mad at you for not killing the spawn - and by extend their children. He is just a very sweet and protective dad.
@@Louves192Gandrel is so very sweet. I legit feel bad for judging him so harshly in Act 1. This game is amazing at making you look at characters in a completely different perspective from your first impression of them.
That's really interesting and sad, really puts Gandrel into a different light.
People probably don't talk much about it because most of us kill Gandrel all the way back in Act 1😔
I only recently learned that you don't have to kill him to protect Astarion. I thought if I didn't kill him, he would find Astarion in my camp and take him to Cazador. I'm doing my first playthrough right now that I didn't kill Gandrel.
@@GabbyIsFineAlso if you meet Gandrel not knowing Astarion is a vampire and then ask Astarion why he asks so many questions, Astarion will just STAB GANDREL WITHOUT ANY WARNING. So it another way to. You know. NOT know about act 3 Gandrel.
Heartbreaking
I always free spawns
It never made sense to me... you don't complete the ritual because it's wrong to kill 7000 souls for power, but then you... kill them anyway for nothing? I also always free them.
@@LadyEmaleth I think so too, but there is a nuance, if you perform the ritual, the souls will go to hell to the devil for eternal torment, but if you just kill them, the souls will find peace, I guess.
the cruellest thing is to just leave them in cages, which I don't understand.
Dang I saved all of them, I think the gur go to the underdark with them because when i checked back at the gur camp afterwards they were all gone, and grandel is in the sewers with his kids. The boy takes it badly and the girl is thankful that you gave them another chance. Really sad either way tho
Love or hate him(I can not do the latter), he does have some sense of morality.
I saved them bc I saw how tortured he was after seeing what became of his victims, besides they were rational still, and it's the underdark, how BAD can it be
Man deserves the award and more
Nice, thanks for sharing. i missed that, because i choosed another answer ^^
nice, hadnt seen that version of this scene yet
He needs a hug.
woow I didn't expect such deep morality from him, nice!
To save their kids means letting 7000 hungry ass vamps onto the world. They’re upset with you either way? And while I would like to save the kids, I don’t like the idea of sending so many vampires down into the Underdark to wreck havoc.
They could probably meet and work with Omeluum and work something out since both would be trying to find ways to get nutrition other than the traditional ways
@@Rinchan181 that.... would be a very interesting connection. I'm making a note of that, thanks.
The underdark is gonna wreck havoc on them. The poor bastards just existed in their cells the whole time and are starved. One horde of hook horrors and half of them are dead.
@@Louves192And in patch 5 we find out that this is more or less what happens. A bunch of them die or are lost. A bunch of them end up making a little community with Astarion and his siblings as their leaders, they all seem relatively content, but still, a bunch of them just don't make jt
1:15 awful 😢 but he did do a mercy, no one should see their children like that. After 200 years, Astarion is still human...er.., elf. Ypu know what I mean.
if you save them and dont kill their father in Act 1 you can encounter them later in the Underdark, they're with their dad and you can convince him to let them feed on animals. The little girl thanks you and the family seems much happier together
If I kill the spawns then I always do the ritual. Without it those lifes are just wasted
Will we see the Vampire ascended and turning you githyanki Tav Scene ?
sorry, i don't think i can
my playthrough is already set for the vampire spawn ending
I really dislike Ulma. She’s such a judgmental Monday morning quarterback.
I killed her my first playthrough lol.
same, no matter what you do she'll blame Astarion for things that were outside his control
On one hand I get it but I'm also annoyed at her because of her lack of sympathy. Freeing the spawns is the best outcome in my opinion because I think they deserve a chance, but also you get to have petty revenge on Ulma by forcing her to feel sympathy for the monsters she hunts. And it's very satisfying to be like "oh, you're mad I released the spawns? I thought you wanted your kids freed" 😊
To be fair, he did kidnap her children. Yes, he had absolutely no choice in the matter, but still, I get why she's mad