Traditions NitroFire Has Changed Muzzleloading
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- www.deeranddee... Have you ever missed what you thought was a dead-on shot while muzzleloading? Traditions partnered with Federal Premium and Hodgdon Powder to create the NitroFire, which is currently a legal muzzleloader in 21 states. See how it can change your muzzleloader season in this episode of HuntTech. Season 1. Episode 48.
Link: www.traditions...
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You should develop a system to seat the bullet in the cartridge. And use smokeless powder.
😂
Don't get me wrong I have show problem with what they have done they just shouldn't call it a Muzzleloader any longer
@@elm11958 It's a very cool Idea and firearm. That being said, I used to shoot muzzle loaders. Lyman Great Plains rifle.
Flintlock. That was a challenge.
This system should be for the regular season.
The reason I hunt muzzleloader season is for the challenge and with this set up not much of a challenge. I will stick with my cva muzzleloader. But don't get me wrong nice product but not for me.
Do you remember the remington caseless ammo, in which they built a rifle with electric ignition system? Yeah that didn't age well.
When you're so busy innovating muzzle loaders you accidentally almost invent a breech loader
No they did and you need a 4473 to own this
@@nathanaagesen9298 sounds like it defeats the purpose of a black powder firearm even certain metallic casing black powder guns don't require that
@@jean-lucpicard3012 yep. As long as it’s made before 1898 you’re good to go it’s considered an antique.
man this is the shittiest shotgun ive ever seen
@@SpencerShirey1998A lot of confusion about this. The ATF definitions for 18 U.S.C., § 921(A)(16)... and I am paraphrasing, If it is manufactured before 1898, and no modern self contained cartridge, or what the ATF refers to as "Fixed Ammo" is available for the firearm, then it is considered an antique. For example, I purchase a Winchester 1886 in 45/70 made in 1895. It is capable of loading/firing modern cartridge ammo available for the rifle, therefore it is not considered an antique. Same as an original Colt 1873 in .45 Colt. It is not defined as an antique.
I’ve got a 25 year old Traditions Deer Hunter in 54 cal and have always shot loose Goex , a couple different projectiles along the way. After finding a load the gun liked , I can shoot 4 shots without cleaning, and each shot touches the shot before . If you take the time to find the sweet spot, you’ll never need something like that . To me , that’s the fun in getting one dialed in. JMO .
agreed; i have a side hammer Thompson new englander in .54 i experiment with a roundball load and have that Hornady all lead great plains conical for a different load I use. the fun is experimenting and dialing it in.
Cool. My shotgun identifies as a muzzleloader, too. A pump muzzleloader.
Looks good but I'm gonna hold off until they sell the firesticks with the bullet seated in the case. 😉
I was thinking the same thing…😂
That wouldn’t be a muzzle loader. The projectile HAS to loaded from the muzzle to be considered a traditional weapon. I’m with you but rules are rules.
@@jackmasters9953 it was sarcasm...jack
@@ragnarragnarsson3128 - exactly right
LOL! What a great idea.
This is stretching the definition of muzzle loading pretty hard. I’m a pretty open minded guy when it comes to what kind of guns you hunt with, but this just feels like breech loader with an extra step.
imagine a bear charges at you and you forget to breach load the fuxing projectile
@@versipellissigma3290 First question: Why are you hunting a bear with a muzzleloader?
Second question: Why are you hunting a bear with a muzzleloader without a buddy with a slug gun or lever action?
@@georgewhitworth9742 im more thinking of someone who owns one of these. all thinking the guns cool n traditional, keeps it in his cabin in the woods for extra adventure feel when hes using his ipad pro to play fortnite. hears a noise outside grabs the gun chambers the powder only like a shotgun shell n gives the bear a tinnitus befor he eats him. Dudes last thoughts, "Damn hitmarker"
@@versipellissigma3290Please take your medicine. Or grow up. Cause you're either mentally not OK or a child
@@georgewhitworth9742 many of us hunt bear with traditional muzzleloaders, and with traditional bows, without backup.
They used to call it primitive weapons season when I started hunting. Everyone used caplocks and even flintlocks.. Some used original 100 yr old plus guns. Now they reverse engineered the muzzleloader into a modern weapon because of a must not fail must always win attitude in the field. I did not always fill my tag. Sometimes the gun didn't fire. It was all considered and excepted as part of the challenge. I hope they bring back a true primitive weapons ONLY season to my state and other states. There has even been discussions on stripping entries from the books that used ultra modern muzzleloaders to take the record. But before you get upset think how you would feel if you used a real muzzleloader to enter the books and then got dethroned by someone using an ultra modern 300 yrd capable "muzzleloader ". It's just not playing fair. Anyway I'll continue to use my old traditional guns because that's what I enjoy.
Muzzleloader seasons, unfortunately, have become single-shot (center fire) rifle seasons.
FYI, just purchased one. It shot the Smackdown carnivore with ridgeback sabot, 250gr polycarbonate tip. 2" groups with a 100gr charge at 100 yds. Swab between rounds. No regrets, love it. Great trigger, double safety.
Sweet!! Where did you find one? I've had no success.
Many WMA's in Tennessee are not allowing this rifle to be used during M.L season.
I hope no WMAs allow it during ML season.
Both the powder charge and projectile must be loaded from the muzzle to be considered a muzzle loader in TN. Until the definition is changed, doesn’t matter where you hunt in TN. Not legal for muzzle loading season.
@@davidrussell631 boohoo these female wardens out here dont know shit
@@davidrussell631 legal in TN
@@thomaspatt5226 yes, a new definition of muzzleloader went into effect for our TN ‘22-23 deer season that now requires only the projectile to be muzzle loaded.
Cool system, but it's a gun that becomes a paperweight the second federal discontinues the firestick cartridges
Someone else would very likely take over manufacture. It'll be annoying finding those plasticy ,neon orange or red cartridges all over like I do spent shotshells when I'm walking around in the woods. Seems I'm always finding spent cartridges and shotshells because nobody takes the initiative to PICK UP after themselves.
It's a nice product but in so honesty I have used pellets for a long time, my grouping had been dead. Never had a problem with my pellet busting apart messing up my shot. Nice product tho.
A bunch of people going to buy these a bunch of states are going to let people use them and then a bunch of states are going to take the use of them away but you'll only be able to use it after that for firearm season because it pretty much is a firearm you have to do a background check to get one hence firearm
Wow. Very interesting. But is it really a muzzleloader if the powder goes in from the breech?
The bullet is still loaded from the muzzle.
No. Its a thin line away from being a breech loader. Also, with a bullet being in barrel, it has my spidey senses tingling about how unsafe it is
@@JohnBuchin I was always taught that the projectile HAS to compress the charge to be safe and CONSISTENT!
@@jeffreyyoung4104 I'm sure this strategy helps significantly with loose powder poured in, but these are pellet based loads, which have air gaps anyways. The pellet is compressed from the binding agent holding it together.
It’s a single shot shot gun with a slug basically. I wldnt purchase one for the simple fact of have to buy the loads . Tradition and other manufacturers have a reputation of inventing this stuff then discontinue it . Just like the little cage that held the primers in certain inline guns . Now your stuck with a door stop .
Exactly. What happens if the firestick doesn't make the waves they want and they discontinue it. You're gun is basically worthless. If it was reloadable then you could salvage the firearm but if it was then they wouldn't sell the firesticks in the numbers to make money to produce them.
exactly my thought, i feel like this is going waaaay backwards. i mean if u need something for black powder get a ww1 trenchy
Should of made it a cartridge you barrel load with counterpart designed primer and firing pin caps to comply with muzzleloader laws. I'm scratching my head trying to figure out who this is for and why would I use this over a slug gun or a rifle.
Real men shoot there ball while Yepes got to use Nitro fart because they don’t know how to shoot a real muzzleloader.
What a joke.
And it’s FFL here in Tn.
This is a great idea however, illegal in Minnesota. To the DNR, a muzzle loader is a muzzle loader, you "don't load part of the charge through the breech." The fine print said, "legal in 21 states." I'm afraid you got a long way to go.☹
Yep same in Oregon
Muzzle Loader, NOT. It is a breech loading single shot. Load charge and primer into the breech and shove a projectile into the muzzle? It is breech loaded.
its actually both
The only thing that I think is cool about this is you can take your powder charge out that way if you're taking your gun in and out of the house everyday it don't get condensation and get you gunpowder wet keeps you from having misfires are hanging fire
and that is precisely why it was designed.
For only 5 times the price, you can save 5 seconds once or twice per day. I use blackhorn 209 and with magnum primers, 0 problems with hangfires in 8 years.
@@SeaPro360 I had the same problem with black horn but I will say I had a corrosion spot in my Barrel that would draw moisture to it like a damn sponge but that's my old muzzleloader that was the first one I ever and I use Pyrodex for a couple years which really f***** my Barrel plus I knew nothing of owning a Muzzleloader so therefore it was highly abused
@@danielmcbride4828 Only use Magnum primers with Black horn. NEVER those triple 7 low powered ones.
@@SeaPro360 I was
“Up next we updated our round with a brass casing so you can load with ease in your muzzle loader”
I feel like you can easily modify the plastic shell into a ragoler cartridge maybe even convert it into a shotgun shell I'm not even sure this count as a muzzle loader.
No, that's impossible with this gun. There is a lip inside the barrel where the bullet is seated after pushing it down through the muzzle.
@@DDHONLINE but it is possible to modify the barrel it's been done with old muzzle loader like the trap door rifle for example.
Can you still buy a muzzle loader off the shelf without paperwork?
If so, at what point do these design changes alter it's classification?
I liked it better when the smith carbine did it first. You know during the civil war. Plus the smith carbine looks better. Also you don’t have to do a 4473 with a background check like you do with this.
Not going to argue with anyone. All I can say is don’t knock it until you try it.
Like the idea but is it really a muzzleloader at this point indiana does not allow these for muzzleloader season
Let's see if I get this right . To unload this rifle you remove the powder charge and then push out the projectile Doesn't that,mean that the projectile is never seated against the powder charge ? Just thinking, maybe I got it wrong !!!!
Hi Henry - the bullet is seated against the charge, but there's a little lip in there that holds it in the same place for seating. Please check out the Traditions website for more information on this. Thanks for watching and subscribing to our channel!
That’s awesome. Does that work in a regular Traditions Buck tracker muzzleloader? I’m looking up the nitrofire I guess.
No, it does not. It requires one of the FireStick compatible muzzleloaders. So far, Traditions and CVA both offer guns that use this technology.
I've had 3 traditions rifles and they all sucked so bad it was embarrassing. I have a warrantied gun that's never been shot because traditions sucks so bad I just can't bring myself to shoot it.
It was hard enough to get a muzzleloader only season set aside in the State. When everything except the ignition mechanism goes down the barrel from the top of the muzzle, then it's a muzzleloader. Nitro Fire looks like a cool rifle, just not for muzzleloading season. 209 primers are stretching the limits as it is. IMO.
Didn't mention the the grain of powder being used? I have been using 150 grain of white hots for years in a Pursuit G4 and in an older Wolf 50 cal with great accuracy at 100 yards
Hi Billy - they come in 100 and 120 grain charges.
I’ve got a traditions muzzleloader and I must say I’m not a fan. I’ve tried several different projectiles of their brand and can’t get a continuous pattern. I’m a military trained marksman and shoot a lot. I like the muzzleloader but have had too many problems with it. About ready to take it back to the retailer and I have personally visited them 3 times about my problems. My Knight and CVA are just killing machines. My hunting buddy laughs because he knows one more problem and I’m wrapping this thing around a tree.
I had a CVA kit rifle that had a similar problem, I finally recrowned the rifle, and the problems went away.
I have no idea why the recrown worked, but there was nothing obvious with the crown before recrowning!
Knight made good muzzleloaders. Very accurate. Even their less expensive model "Wolverine". Maybe I just got lucky. I use #11 caps. I buy new #11 caps and powder for hunting every two years. I use the old stuff for target practice. Then use the new stuff to sight in everything just before hunting season
Remington took this one step further with their 700 blackpowder.
I wonder how hard it is to buy the firesticks and how much they are
2 - 3 bucks each & they do not want you reloading them
but
you CAN reload them
We have a case of each charge at my store. 100 and 120 gr loads. I don't remember the price off the to of my head though.
@@waptek2 , I would think that once used ,they'd be deformed . I wouldn't do it honestly .
What bullet starter is that?
Wait until you see the price of those firesticks. Want to take a look at that before you run out and buy one of these.
Single shot 12 ga slug made complicated
Out here in Nevada we’re not allowed scopes on our black powder rifle‘s so does it come with iron sites
How come you guys never shoot groups in your commercials? Is it because your guns shoot sub 12" groups?
Muzzle-Breach Loader?
I would like to see this rifle with the Traditions Vortek StrikerFire System.
Can you use the fire stick in any break action muzzleloader?
No. They are only for muzzleloaders built for FireStick technology.
This rifle can't be used in VT
The fact that this exists completely baffles me
Would love to see one with a shorter barrel easier hunting in blinds and tree stands are in thick cover
Less accurate
@@tippy8358 My 1st muzzle loader was a 21" traditions boltaction 100 grains triple 7 295 grain cva hollow point was a 1" MOA gun
@@merlinnorris817 ya I’m talking 18 down to 16
Did I miss something? She said the bullet sits on a "shelf" in the barrel. The stick leaves a large void between the powder charge and the bullet then? How is that SAFE?
No ... there is no void. Hard to describe it other than the "shelf" is more of a slight lip that is tight to the charge once seated. We have shot this gun extensively and have not only not had any problems, we are very impressed with the accuracy.
But I don't know if I would consider this a Muzzleloader it's more like half a muzzleloader
If you buy this online, it has to go to an FFL . So, not really a "muzzleloader " is it !
@@pg981 if you buy it in person you have to do a background check that's why it's considered a firearm technically that's the reason I didn't buy it mainly because I'm not sure if my States legal and even if it is how long will it be legal that and it takes away from the fun of having an actual muzzleloader
@@danielmcbride4828 Agree 👍
Wow, not even for the sake of using it as a muzzleloader, this is an interesting firearm to have....
Want one of these and out of stock everywhere...what's going on
This rifle is not legal in Michigan, you have to load the powder in the barrel along with the bullet
It's nice to see that black powder shooters are beginning to catch up. Maybe in the next seven years they will discover the metallic cartridge! JK guys, shooting bp looks like it can be quite fun.
What about a north west compliant version ????
Unfortunately the ATF calls this 1A firearm. Therefore I would have to find it privately or else I can't get it
Pretty cool but kinda defeats the purpose of "traditional" hunting. The only thing being g loaded down the muzzle is the bullet. So it is technically a muzzleloader but if your powder and primer are contained in a cartridge doesn't that make it a cartridge rifle or breechloader? Seems kinda like cheating. Eighther way it's still a neat concept. If only they would have thought of the in the mid 1800s. ....... Oh wait a minute........
How do you find out if it’s legal for Ohio?
Can the "firestick" be reloaded and used again?
No, it cannot
So you have created a single shot 12 gauge shotgun that not primitive muzzle loading seasons were meant for I should probably use a Ruger Number One in 06 a do the same thing only cleaner an more accurate
close ,, its a 28 gauge blank driven, fully rifled "32" gauge ( 50 cal)
Do you have to fill out ATF 4473 form at the dealership where you bought the muzzleloader from?
Yes you do
Do you load it from the muzzle?
Yes, the bullet is still loaded/seated from the muzzle.
@@DDHONLINE and the propellant?
who still uses loose loads? Never had a problem with pellets on a cva and powerbelt sabots
I use loose loads and get 2420fps out of 105 grains of blackhorn 209 vs your 3 cakes at 1600fps with a 280 grain projectile. If you do the little bit extra work it pays off .
@@huntforlife3997 And I may blow my face off. I know my limits and like to be safe.
Hodgdon 777 ffg: 2,126 fps; 45 fps; 1 4/8 inches. This is what I am getting for 250-grain Hornady SST. Now with that being said I use 295 grain Powerbelt accupoint.
My friend used to use loose but things got damp and he did not have a 209 primer. If it works for you then deer down.
I do. 120 grains (volume) of BH 209 with a 225 grain .40 cal bonded lead core. I’m getting almost 2600 fps. 1” groups at 100 are common.
@@gamedinnah I don't shoot 100 to much. Where I hunt I am only able to get 50 yard shots. Thick here in New Hampshire. But at 50 the thing is dead nuts. I'm sure about 25 or so grains are not burned but that is the way I started with it. So one and done so far.
This is NOT a muzzleloader anymore. Muzzleloaders have already advanced as far as they need to. Pellet charges, shotgun primers, scopes and 200 yards.
This is getting as bad as archery. Putting rangefinding scopes on a bow. Basically doing everything they can to take the challenge away, which is pretty much the main reason for using a bow or muzzleloader. I'm actually surprised a broadhead company hasn't come out with an exploding tip or something.
Sorry Traditions you are still miles behind CVA!
Love this idea....well done!!!
Not legal yet in New Hampshire.
Is this even legal in CO?
Why not sell re fillable re usable brass or aluminum fire sticks? They could of easily done that but instead theyde rather have it be one time use to get you to have to keep buying more. One of the biggest draws of black powder is how cheap it is to shoot but when your making it so we got to buy one time use individual sticks for each shot its defeating the purpose. Yall are touting its one time use factory made as a advantage because its the same load everytime but guess what if it was refillable someone could easily fill each one to the same load themselves and they would have the ability to choose hotter or colder loads than the one the factory offers. That really sucks thry don't make a reusable version. If they did now that would be cool especially with a over under.
This would be illegal during my states muzzy season, powder has to be loaded from the front.....
Very little smoke after the shot what's up with that?
its not black powder , its smokeless with filler
@@waptek2 it's hard to say how I feel about that.
It's hogdons version of black horn 209. Far less smoke then traditional powder.
How can that even qualify as a " primitive weapon "?
@@illinidave not at all
It doesn't even come close to the regulations of traditional muzzle loader season in Oregon
@@sgtslippyfist6345 what can you guys hunt with there as far as muzzle loader? im in nc so we can use inlines but not sure if this one will remain legal or not. i think since you still load through the muzzle its going to be allowed. but we have a huge deer population.
@@bullofthewoods9374 we can use inlines if: they have open sights, loose powder, lead bullets, open ignition, no sabot, bullet can't exceed twice the diameter in length. I shoot a 50 cal Thompson center Hawkins rifle with williams rear tang peep sight and 370grn maxi ball 90grn fff goex
@@sgtslippyfist6345 open ignition? no cap
Is it a muzzleloader if you dont load it from tue muzzle, 🎉 you made a shot gun
Just carry your normal rifle. What's the difference?
So far, it is allowed in 21 states during muzzleloader seasons.
The difference is the projectile is still loaded from the muzzle. All they did was waterproof your powder.
Legal to hunt with in NH?
NH is reviewing its regulations to create clarification around NitroFire & FireStick use for hunting since it’s a new innovation in muzzleloading.
@@DDHONLINE is it legal to hunt with this anywhere in the US right now?
@@jimb3137 Yes - it is legal in 22 states during their muzzleloader seasons. When states see how it is still a muzzle-loading rifle, they typically allow it, especially for the states (nearly all of them) that allow in-line rifles during muzzleloader season. For example, Minnesota just legalized it. Please go to the Traditions website for more detailed information.
Only way, its a good way to go, is if its components are readily available all the time.
but they lie about them not being reloadable
Thats NOT a muzzle loader.
This is a breech loaded not a muzzle loader !
I hope these get banned for all Muzzle Loader seasons. It's completely pointless to try and market this as a muzzle loader. It's a single shot rifle in whatever caliber it shoots at.
Part of the reason muzzle loader season is still around is because the tradition of it, and how it paved the way for modern firearms. Part of that struggle is all the things that come with inlines and true muzzle loaders. Sorry but not excited or even pumped for it. The optima V2 I have slays deer every year, and has for a few years now.
Okay sure but why?
Not sold on this, no better than the powder charges and 209 primers imo not much of a difference.
Single shot rifle
This is a disappointing ad in several ways:
(1) They never stated what accuracy the shooter should expect is possible if they do their part. To get my money, they should say they designed this to be a 100 yard gun with 3-shot groups averaging 2.5 inches or a 200 maximum gun with 4 inch groups as examples. If they can't give a rough idea on what we should expect for accuracy then why should we waste our time and money chasing accuracy at the range that can't be achieved?
(2) They never showed the top end of the "fire stick" in detail that I saw. That was obviously intentional. It would have been nice to see this to see how it's different from a plastic crimped shotgun slug, which is obviously not a muzzleloader. (3) Didn't mention the calibers it comes in. I did see 50 cal on their barrel however. Knight is running a 209 primer sleeve around their primers they also promote as a "waterproof" system but they finally admitted to me in a phone call with their main shop manager two years ago that the system was mostly for "marketing purposes" and their non-waterproof system was more accurate. I bought their non-waterproof bolt setup for their Disk rifle and accuracy when from like 7 inch groups at 50 yards to 2-3 inches at 100 yards. Ever since I am very wary of claims of being "waterproof". My 2 cents.
Gee you might have to practice a little bit with cap and ball / powder, now who would want to do that?
Hmmm... don't know ... Probably the same 6 million bowhunters who don't want to practice with cedar shafts, Bear razorheads and an osage-orange recurve? LOL
Cant use that in Tn, with the way the Law is written...
👍
THAT AINT MUZZLE LOADING........
Send me a nitrofire muzzleloader
Barrel says “ made in Spain “. No thanks! Buy American!
Traditional "Muzzle" loader
Jeepers...muzzle loading has finally been ruined with reinventing breech loading.
If ya gotta go this route, just use brass....
Buy a brenneke before this
I for one hope every state outlaws this junk!
Why
It certainly has . . since it really isn't muzzleloading . . .
this is stupid, my accuracy is fine with pellets or loose powder in my inline, this just a gimmick to sell plastic tubes with powder already in them that you can overcharge for.
I don't get it. If you are going to shoot this, then why don't you just get a modern rifle and stay out of my hunting season? Since I'm actually challenging myself. Yeah I actually play the game without cheat codes.
That's like a breech load with too many steps
It’s just an inferior slug gun now.
Doesn't this mean it becomes a firearm?
Yes you have to do a 4473 aft calls this a firearm not a muzzle loader
Do yourself a favor and get a Woodman Arms Patriot.
They are illegal in Tennessee
Yes- at this time, TN, WI and IND are the only 3 Midwestern states that have not yet legalized it. Everyone else has, including MN just this past season. Please see the link for a map to all of the states that have allowed it, plus those who are reviewing it.
Stop claiming it’s a more accurate method when it is obviously not. Every gun prefers a different amount of powder charge and bullet weight to achieve that specific guns best accuracy. With a fire stick you have a set powder charge so if your gun shoots like crap there’s very little you can do.
u can change projectiles. powder charge is the same. two pellets is two pellets. if you use loose powder then i agree with you but pellets are pretty much the same every shot in my cva. not sure about a traditions but i know what you mean. i never change pellets but i have found different bullets do shot different even at same weight
Solution for all the mad haters. Take a paper bag for tea. Pre load your measurements. Load as normal when it’s time to and there you go. You now have a nitro system of your own. What’s next? Gonna hate that the 50cal air guns can out perform your regular muzzleloader and is usually legal for muzzleloader season in some states? Half the time the local hunters here that complain about the nitro hunt over corn and such too. Every advantage you have does not need explanation.
Muzzleloader my ass. Should not be legal for muzzleloader season