Importance of Prefilling and V-Grooving butt joints.
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- čas přidán 22. 01. 2021
- In this video we talk about the importance of v-grooving butt joints and prefilling any large gaps, cracks or holes.
Is this something you do on your jobs?
Let us know in the comments down below.
As a retired DYI homeowner, I like how you combine clear and concise information, without turning it into a social event, while actually doing the work. Very much like on-the-job training in many industries. While I have seen lots of great drywall CZcams channels, it is my opinion that your instructional methodology is best suited for me. Thank you for the time and effort you put into educating people like me.
Great vid. 97% of people will never understand what it takes to get to this level of work. The guy I learned from, on my first day said “this is an art form most people can never appreciate”. Getting PERFECT walls is not for the faint of heart, glad you help people understand.
Pretty sure 97% of people don't want to do this type of work...it's 10% actual building and 90% ticky tack bullshit. People were building for thousands of years without these kinds of techniques...
More like 94% dude
@@DragonAurora Right do you prefer the comfort and quality of modern homes or do you prefer huts
love ur comment
Thank you for posting. Part of my work is re-flattening walls during remodels, and yes the customers can tell. They've lived in the home for years and appreciate when it's brought up to standards many in this comment section may not appreciate.
Finally a drywaller on CZcams that knows what they’re doing
OMG... I have been doing this for years and have been called every name in the book for doing it. I would rip up sheets of 7/16 OSB for my joints and get some of the flattest and smoothest joints that you have ever seen. I don't know if he is covering this or not but here is another little tip: do not put the screws in the adjoining edges until the second sheet has been installed. This greatly reduces the squish out that happens when screws are too close to the edges.
What does OSB mean? New to this trade.
@@JoseFlores-xp9jp it’s particle board, like a piece of plywood but tiny strands. Google might be able to help
Damn good point about waiting to screw butt joint until both pieces are hung. That squish will tighten it up a tiny bit too not that it matters
@@JoseFlores-xp9jp oriented strand board. It’s the plywood that is made up of wood chips
You're supposed to hang drywall sheets vertically. The edges are already tapered for that reason. No butt joints.
I want this guy on my job. A true pro. All the best.
Hey there I'm a painter in Bellingham,wa. Thanks for the great video. I've found that most cracks that appear in drywall over time are from delamination at butt joints and large gaps not being prefilled. To fix them, I v-groove the effected areas, and fill the crevice with loctite power grab adhesive before doing the repair. This way the cracks won't reappear the way they would if they were just mudded over. Nice to see someone taking the time to do the prep that will ensure maximum life span of their work.
If there are cracks they usually need taped again it technically becomes a seam again.
For me watching pro boarders is a treat, I did it for a short time, 2 of us, my partner was a pro, I was greener than lime green. But the two of us would board a 2000sq ft home in 8 hrs, partner would go back in the evening and tape the entire home, 40 yrs ago without all the cool tools they have now. But like I said , I really enjoy watching pro's work regardless of the job.
🙏🏼 amen, I agree with you! I learned from a pro & he and I could completely board a 1800-2200 square foot place in 8-10 hours! They were some stupid fn cottages too, needed like 30ft of scaffolding cuz of vaulted entrance/ceiling!
Come on now.
@@Hamp72 some people really do have that work drive tho, you wouldnt understand
@@dillon7981 OK how many sheets does a 2000sq ft house take? I will tell you 145 sheets. I have been doing drywall since 1991. The most me and another man has ever hung, 2 of us was 119 sheets in 8 hrs. Back then we nailed everything. Now I have had a crew where we would go in and hang 179 sheets and tape it out in 9 hrs. You can't tell me nothing about drywall. I am Mr.Drywall. I have been in business for over 32 years. Haha blow that smoke somewhere else.
Pixar called, they want their stories back 😅😅😅
V-grooving the drywall reminds of how you prepare a joint for welding to get appropriate strength and bonding.
When I first moved into my condo, there were places here and there, mostly in corners, where it wasn't cracking, but you could see a certain wavyness and the surface felt hollow when you tapped on it. Sure enough, you could stick a screwdriver in and find a sizable pocket of air underneath where, when they taped it in 1958, no one bothered to pre-fill. Joints like that not only look terrible, but I would expect them to be vulnerable to penetration by fire, partially defeating the purpose of using drywall in the first place. I've cut out and filled those gaps whenever I've painted over the years; one great thing about drywall is that you can easily fix most flaws, no matter how sloppy the original job was.
Yeah, helped...I have an upstairs that was done with a friend years ago, and he said not to worry about gaps, that they'll get filled when they mud. Big mistake. But I think I've found a solution with your video. Pre-fill with quick set. And V-notch seams. Remove Paper fuzzies. Thanks. 👍
Out in northern Utah, I always prefill but haven’t routinely v’d out the butt joints. Too often the butt joint has barely enough room to get the screws into the framing behind so cutting away some of the paper would lessen the holding power of the screw. Thanks for your videos. It is great to see how other drywall pros do it!
Dont cut at the screws for maybe an inch..
@@endoalley680 huh?
@@kennethmabus381 If the screw head is in the butt joint because of a poor sheetrock measurement, start Veeing maybe 3/4" to either side of the screw.
@@endoalley680 so if someone uses trim tex buttboard should they v cut the joint?
It’s a 16th of an inch your cutting off the edge that is furry and uneven ,,, I see what your saying , but only if the cut was too far in , as far as weakening, everybody has thoughts I’m not owning yours, I enjoy the think pool .. ps and I’ve been wrong many times in my life :)
Nice to see someone who really knows their trade and prides themselves on doing the beat job possible.
I've been recently v grooving my butt joints and on small jobs applying compound 20 sheetrock on my first coat , applying a fiberglass mesh tape. Again only on smaller jobs to help speed up the process. On all jobs v grooving your butts and applying prefill of any kind is a great choice. I don't think I'll be using durabond any time soon, that stuff is not sandable at any stage. Maybe for filling larger holes in plaster repair jobs. I give this guy credit, very confident and great overall working attitude. Great video. Cheers
so good to see people doing quality work
Allways good to see a tradesman takes pride in his profession thumbs up buddy
Nothing compares to watching a pro as he explains what he's doing and why, plus some things to watch out for and how to avoid problems. Great video now I will go struggle to do a passable job. It won't be my first rodeo but I have never prefilled before so it should make this a little easier.
This that he is doing ain't exactly rocket science. A cub learns this his first day on the job with a professional crew.
@@endoalley680 "Pro" is not short for "Rocket Scientist." It is, in fact, great to watch a professional at anything explain what they do and why, if it's drywall or rocket science, it's all gravy.
@@endoalley680 cool superiority complex.
@@simplyengineering2350 I just see real pros doing the work pretty much all day every day. Everybody V-cuts joints and prefills.
@@endoalley680 That's exactly what someone with a superiority complex would say. Cheers. ^_^
I wish our finishers would watch and learn, that's the way to get ready for tape. Nice work.
I been doing this for the past 20 years and had so many debate with other guys about this. Finally i found a person that really unstable it. My uncle taught me how to do joint compound in 97 and 5 years later i challenged him and my cousin on this , but couldn't win the debate, specially against your master
👍. I prefill with Durabond 90....Every time...awesome advice...never v-grooved before, but will now...Thanks !
thumbs up. im a concrete guy but need work in winter lol. took a drywall job. good to watch some folks that know what they are doing. thanks i learned a lot
Straight up artistry and being a master of your craft
Iv never even heard of doing this. Muding my first bathroom tomorrow. DIY. Glad I found this.
In this video we get to see how craftsman set up a job for a superior finish product, hats off to you!!!
I learn something new everyday! Much love from Canada!👍🏽🤙🏽😁
Great video. First pro validation of pre-filling I started doing rehabbing plaster and lathe walls
My man I would LOVE to work for you. I wish I could get guys to understand that prepping a job first just like this will make it a better job. Guys just don't understand this but I do. Great job my man! 👍👍
Been a taper going on 32 years now. Nice seeing these young bucks taking their time and doing it correctly! You V-groove your butts , it saves on time through your first and second coats , and you use way less mud from trying to float out a hump! Seen so many tapers NOT do this......which hurts them in the end.
@@ViperStruck1not at saving mud and making transition less noticeable
@@ViperStruck1 companies dnt give it that taper or edge because the edges would break easier during transport and wouldn't have the surface to apply the paper that holds 2 together for transportation and yes now in days nothing last past 7 years that's what they mean by lifetime warranty if things lasted for ever we wouldn't have jobs this is more for detail finishers or diy not production
just had to do this same trick as a repair to the ceiling at my aunts house in Virginia. It worked great !
Great content. I am from Hawaii's Big Island and about to embark on some drywall mudding but this! Changes my game plan
OMG!!! I learned a ton from this video. Thank you for the education!
Great video. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience. i usually pre fill big gaps and breakage. But I like your thought on grooving out joints and will incorporate that into my work.
I'm from eastern Iowa. I did drywalling many years ago. Someone asked me to help them so I thought I would do a quick refresher. yours was excellent. Thanks.
I'm from VT and have been prefilling of large gaps & butt joints for years with Durabond 90 hard set . However I go one step further on my butt joints. I spread the durabond on the butt joint then I put a double layer ( offset slightly ) of fine mesh tape,then coating right on top of that with a light coat of the same durabond mix. Then after it's dried I 1st coat with heavy weight black lid Profoam compound , 2nd & 3 rd coat finishes I use light weight mud. This method has served me well for decades ,where butt joints that break over moving area's such as doors and windows I've never had a call back for a cracked butt joint ever. Love that you also take the extra time and effort to take care of your customer vs the guy working / thinking it's by the sq.ft so he needs to quickly slam it out and run .
Nice to watch a professional work.
I'm a novice and this was very helpful information. Thank you from Seattle.
Craftmanship is not cheap, but worth the extra $$$. Been doing the V with the 90 hardest for years now. Great for repair base.
Correct… on higher end jobs. Definitely NOT for a basement suite for a rental. Too costly to do.
Absolutely, I’ve been doing this for 25 years!
From Kalamazoo Michigan and I always prefill! I’m working on getting in habit of v grooving though! Your videos are very descriptive and 10/10 👍🏽
this professional man knows what he is doing so watch and learn people
Hi from Germany. V-Shaping is absolute Standard here!
I think most would do prefill as well. To me it is common sense.
With Uniflott Plaster Knauf claimedin the past, you wouldon`t even need to tape. But at the dusty edges you should apply deep sealer to reach good adhesion.
In daily life I think people don`t make sure to separate walls & ceilings from each other with silicontape, so cracks could be an issue then.
I am about to put drywall on our roof. Here I use deep sealer and tape because the roof is said to be kind of "moving" way more than walls & ceilings.
Strictly separated surfaces from each other. With Silicontape there is a sharp "haircrack" only. Hardly to be recognized, like it a lot.
Not a sheet rocker but have done a lot of home repair remodel jobs over the years(VA, FL, OK). Did not know v-groving/pre-filling was a thing. Makes so much sense, I real, “now why didn’t I think of that”, moment.
As a painter, it's my dream to have drywall installed by guys like you. Great job and holy shit how do you keep your site so clean and uncluttered. Really wish everyone was like you
It’s about time, very important step very important your now my hero
same here my man always v grooving, nice steady hand keep it up and thanks
Cool video! I did some dry wall work in my basement a year ago. It was my first time. I was humbled. I told myself I’d never do it again. But.. of course here I am about to start mudding a bedroom I just built. I prefilled my joints on my first time. I will be pre filling joints today also. It just makes sense. I also am going to try v-grooving my butt joints. Thanks for sharing your skills!
What bothered you the most about it? (Most people is the sanding factor.)
I usually use a sponge & warm/steaming water between coats so I dont have dust
Next time hang the sheets vertical buddy. The edges are tapered for that reason. That's how we do it here.
Drywall finisher since 1990. Started back back in Guam with tapetech tools. I like what you're doing and I'm your new subscriber. Keep it up.
Thanks for the kind words! Since 1990 eh?! Daamn! I was born in 87. Lol. You've been drywalling almost as long as I've been alive.
I'm sorry to hear that. 🤣 Keep up the hard work!
Thanks guys, super informative. Keep it up!
I was a journeyman taper for many years. Everything was backfilled with Durabond 90 before taping. Seams, butt joints nails. Less shrinkage. And our rockers alway cut a tapered bevel on the butt joints.
Hang em vertical buddy. No butt joints. Edges are tapered for that reason. That's how we do it here.
I like when my snip stays in one strip when I cut my butts. Most satisfying to see all the strings on the floor after I'm done. Great video Bro. More people need to know they can't jump to get tape on.
Thanks man. I've seen people tape over disgusting buttjoints before. Haha. You get what you pay for. A solid base coat lays a good foundation for your tape. Keep up the good work!
I can. My base is the sheetrock.
I appreciate you showing me that - so create a small v joint and use hot mud to pre-fill the joints and gaps against the wall it looks like the makings of a better job to me.
Great video! Love the straight forward explication. You just gained a new sub!!!🤩
Love seeing how you do it over there Brian, cant believe you guys get recessed edges on the ends of your sheets, thats awesome! We only get square ends in AUS, so try to avoid the but joints where we can.
Well to clarify the butt ends of the sheet dont come recessed. We use Trim-Tex buttboard in order to achieve that. You might possible be able to order it in AUS but I'm not sure if it meets your building code.
Learn something new every day. Nice trick with the v groves
Good advice and nice techniques. V out and prefill with hot mud!
I'm in Nova Scotia and I no longer do this professionally, and my brother who did this for 40 years recently passed away. He taught me most everything you showed here, except when prefilling we also used fibre tape with the 90 min compound. Loved your video.
I am a DYIer and in the process of a full (to the studs) remodel of a bathroom. It has been a monster so far. 1955 home with multiple layers of plaster (actual concrete) and steel mesh to remove. There is not one level spot in the room when I started, but I have done the best I can to get it level and flat. BUT, I have some gaps and a few damaged areas (one where the cut out saw got away from me).
I have watched at least 100 hours of video and THIS ONE actually address the things I want to know.
Thank You!
I just sat down from checking my screws, scraping any edges sticking up, cutting the edges of damaged areas and removing any loose drywall. Plan to do my prefill tomorrow!
I have a house from 1920, and the upstairs walls have a terrible texture on top of crumbling plaster. Definitely thinking of knocking the walls down to the studs, adding some plugs and insulation, and drywalling. Any words of advice?
@@wrifraff Goggles and face mask. You may consider getting a dumpster. You will have WAYYYY more mess than you can imagine, and it's heavy. You will also have rough cut lumber. Two ways of addressing. First use a string line to determine crowns and cups in the wall. You want to flatten the wall 1) Attach studs to the studs with front edge of new studs sitting proud of the old studs. 2) Rip 2X4's down to make shims as needed.
Also: Has the wiring been updated? A house that old would have started with knob and tube. If you don't know what I mean, find wiring you can see. Is it plastic covered wire like you see at store, or does it look like fabric covered wire with white porcelain things attaching it to framing? If it's the latter, call an electrician.
I was taught to prefill....but not like this. This should be the go to reference for prefilling. Well done.
Davenport Iowa. We fill gaps and cracks but we should do more and it shows. Thanks again for the video
Haha! Thanks for watching man!
I always V-grove on patches, interesting I have never seen anyone do it on full installs.
Awesome Video. I usually tape, then see bubbles, then rip off the tape, and get some mesh tape and cut it to 3/4 wide and then put in channel and then apply 7 coats of mud, LOL, you guys are masters
Got to go sand, thanks
Thanks for the video,, very helpful to see how it done correctly.
Excellent work. It is rare.
I'm just a DIY'er who just drywalled my basement. I V-grooved and prefilled my bad butt joints just because it looked like it would make it easier to tape. Glad to see I was doing something the pros do.
nice work! yall know whats your doing!!
Dude's a Master.
It’s a great video and answers a lot of questions
Interesting. Never seen this before on the US mid-Atlantic. Tape first. Can’t wait to give it a try.
Nicely done I enjoyed watching your video, haven’t v notched prior to watching your video , going to give that a try .
Great video and tips. Helped me get a better finish.
Happy to hear Derek!
Im at the stage in my home reno that i need to do this and i had no idea, killer timing. Great video, you saved me tons of time and a massive headache.
Happy to help! Good luck with your renovation!
Great example of what a good prefilled should look like in my opinion.
Good video, respect to the master
Haha! I'm still learning everyday but thanks for the kind words.
Hey man thanks for this. Solid video bro.
You're quite welcome. Thanks for watching!
This channel is awesome... So much good content on this channel....They know their shyt ....
Thanks for tuning in man! Let us know if there's anything else you'd like to see in future videos
I Have always done this, V and prefil is very important. It stops the butt joint from showing up on sun light walls after paint with that tiny miniscule line. Nice to see other pros doing the same thing!
No need for that if you know how to finish.
Thanks for sharing. Good content. I always prefilled butt joints to get a good result. From Ottawa Canada.
Great work sir great I learn alot from your videos even though I float everything by hand and use a banjo..one day I'll try those automatic tools 👍
Makes sense to me...thanks for the info
Upstate NY Durabond 90
I prefill everything you mentioned in the video.
I also fabricated a 45 degree wood block I use with my utility knife to make nice V grooves consistently.
Nice dude! Good thinking making your own v-grooving tools. Tajima makes some nice ones now.
Been making the V forever. Solid joints always. Missouri and Virginia
Good evening. In my experience pre-filled all possible spots in a drywall before taping. Durabound is the king. Good job
Manitoba. I v groove and pre fill exactly like you. Always got mocked by the other tapers for v grooving but every time I stopped I’d see it showing(usually on sanding day or after paint🤦🏻♂️).
Yup! Same, nothing worse than seeing a tape peaking through the finished product. All because someone didn't take 30 seconds to vgroove. Didnt used to have to vgroove as much years past but with lightweight drywall the paper delaminates very easily.
Keep up the good work man!
Yep👍 the best method! I only v groove too and people mock me. They eventually realize their faults after paint and you see their butt joints lol
Yes sir, prefill I think is very important for quality professional workmanship,in my opinion! Concrete fill is my product of choice, I call it liquid drywall, with the fibres in product creates incredibly strong bond and fast setting. From kootenays, bc, canada
63 year old contractor... Impressive!!!!!!!!
Never seen this video in the precision taping catalog, lol. Prefill for the win.
Great video.... Yes I prefill using 5 min mud but only because typically I'm doing a bathroom or kitchen so it's not a large area so 5 min is plenty of working time. Then I tape same day with 20 min and then by the end of the day I'm putting a final coat on with 45 or 90........ Well I try to at least. So this way I can sand the next morning.
Awesome, thanks for posting this…
Dude, you are amazing
Never knew that. Tks!
amazing job bless you
Thanks for the great video and tips
Thanks for watching!
Toronto. 90 Durabond Prefil is a must and Very happy to see so many gooVers in the comments. Cheers.
Very informative and great presentation. From Dothan, AL
Thanks for watching. Glad you enjoyed it!
WHERE WERE PEOPLE LIKE THIS WHEN I NEEDED TO DO MY SHEETROCK INSTALL???
I am strongly considering tackling the finishing of the drywall in my new shop. I figure it doesn't have to be perfect and maybe by the time I'm done with it I'll be proficient for future projects. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
1) Prefill as this video says. 2) Make taping mud VERY wet and loose, and take most of it back off. Don't wet the tape. 3) 3 strips of mud with 6" knife for butt joints. One down the middle and one on each side, taking most of it back off. You should faintly see the tape after first coat. Don't slather a thick wad down the middle and think you can feather it. It will be thicker than you think. 4) For inside corners, do first coat on one side when taping. 5) Corner bead. I still don't know. I had to take a file to a few pointy spots in corner bead. I have not seen one video demonstrating that technique. lol OH...If you use the plastic corner bead, it's designed to apply with adhesive. Spray both surfaces and let it set till its tacky, then press in place. 6) GLUE and screws. The glue is what prevents pops in the future. I used Liquid Nails construction adhesive. I tried the stuff specifically for drywall but didn't like it as much.
First I’ve heard of v grooving drywall. Just like v grooving a butt weld in steel. I like the idea. Looks like it makes for a much better job. I’m going to try that on the next one I do.
Awsome video bro! Subscribed
Midwest USA. I prefill gaps, damaged corners, and anywhere that tape might sag into the joint istead of lay flat. I also have been doing something like v cutting my butt joints since the 90's. I've actually made a cutter that cuts a 1-1/2" wide x 1/8" deep flute into the butt ends of my drywall. Once I make that cut, I take a 3"" knife and coat the bare gypsum with durabond 90 so it doesn't leave boogers when I tape. I also use this method on my corners as so they are always true 90's (so long as the framer did a good job. lol) I also use buttboard as well depending on the application. Usually my cutter and tape make a seamless joint with no hump though. The cutter works like a planer and it takes about 10 seconds from bevel to bevel to scoop the material out as I obviously do not scoop anything out of the bevelled edges. The best part about the tool is that, when I have an odd ceiling height or anywhere where I come up in the middle of a sheet, I can cut a bevel into my sheetrock so the joint can be clean and even . I'm currently working on a portable steam press that can compress the cut edge of the drywall to create more of a factory style bevel that will not strip the paper and eliminate the need to coat the raw gypsum.
Indianapolis, been in residential and commercial construction for over 40 years and don't recall seeing any drywall finishers do that, but I will be talking to them ,maybe on a level 5 finish they might.
'drywall doctor' did a similar video. He emphasized prefilling all your horizontals on walls. If I remember right his theory was that it made the wall one piece and better able to take shocks from small earthquakes etc.