The Starship That Could Have Been: The Vesta
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- čas přidán 7. 06. 2024
- Captain Ezri Dax took over the USS Aventine, a Vesta class exploration cruiser in the Star Trek books, beginning with the Destiny Trilogy and the vessel has since made its way into both Star Trek Online and the Adventures RPG but not into canon. Nevertheless, this is the lore, history and stats of this wonderful starship.
Chapters
00:00 Intro
00:23 Real Origins
01:19 Starfleet Origins
04:22 Specifications
05:57 Quantum Slipstream
07:26 Phasers
09:45 Summary and Canon
Star Trek Online developed by Cryptic Studios and Perfect World. Published By Gearbox.
Star Trek Destiny Trilogy (Gods of Nights, Mere Mortals, Lost Souls) Written by David Mack and published by Pocket Books.
Star Trek Picard/Strange New Worlds/Enterprise/Voyager/Deep Space Nine/Discovery and The Next Generation are all owned by Paramount Pictures/CBS and distributed by CBS.
This Video is for critical purposes with commentary. - Hry
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Innovations like the Chronoton Integrator make the slow ramp up to the Temporal Cold War more conceivable. The moment you normalize small changes in the flow of time for the purpose of convenience you start a slippery slope that leads to normalizing the idea of altering time to suit your needs if you have the capacity to do so.
Considering that we see quantum slipstream post-TCW, do you think they found a non-causality-violating alternative or that the Temporal Treaty had carve-outs?
@@GSBarlev If it was a computing issue that prevented the Nav systems from working fast enough to stay ahead of the drive, I think it's more likely there was a breakthrough in computer processing speed that just enabled faster navigational records access.
One of the ideas I came up with a shile ago is a computer you trap in its own temporal bubble. With a converter to give it all th einfo you can as fast as you can and then to translate what it says out of the temporal field. The computer could essentially move faster in time than the ship and give deeper analysis due to having days to analyze what other would have a few moments. That would super fit into your theory :D
You mean... The way Janeway did ?
@@ThunderLord1 The shenanigans that Voyager got up to over seven years in deep space probably gave Temporal Investigations the screaming willies. History might remember the Voyager incident as the first pebble rolling downhill that precipitated an avalanche.
Flew the Vesta for several years, still visit it now and again. Love that ship.
The Vesta was my Main on STO for a pretty long time. It looked awesome, had a hanger for extra fire power, and once I got the hang of R&D and the stats it was pretty formidable. I only moved on from it when T6 became a thing and I got the Pathfinder.
Well done, really accurate! I'm blown away by the love for the Vesta in this comment section, I could never have imagined it would be around for so long. Small remark: The tubes below the deflector are in essence dedicated probe launchers. (I since then have unified Torpedo and Probe shapes, so perhaps in a refit... :P)
Fun/sad fact: It was already in pre-visualisation for Picard, but due to time and actor budget constrains it was left out. I did deliver it to the VFX team and I have seen it in some pre-viz shots and in preliminary bridge LCARS tests. I'm reasonable sure that if Legacy will be made by the same group, the Vesta will get a cameo. :)
I could imagine that the vetsa is a connecting step in progressing QSD to larger ships.
As it's possible that berfore Vesta and Odessey, the federation only managed to make the QSD work on a smaller scale and thus needing a prototytpe testbed for inplementing
the technology to larger classes.
The Vesta/Aventine is close to my heart. I love Ezri Dax, and I love that she got command of that ship. Also, it's a beautiful continuation of the Voyager elongated design. Also, it's my ship in STO :)
How is sto?
I haven't played in years because of health
Vesta is Besta! I love my Vesta Class.
I get a very strong SeqQuest DSV vibe from the ship. Really dig it.
This is also one of my top three favorite ship designes. It's the one I always go back to in STO
Will always be one of my favorite STO ships
Absolutely worth buying the three ship bundle
Mars Attacks reference!!! 🤣🤣🤣
I LOVE the Vesta class. The fact that Dax commands one makes it even cooler. I wish that Eagle Moss had...
They did make the Aventine.
I have it
@@Craig100hockey I meant to say an XL version. I have one too but it's painfully small. Almost Micro Machine size.
This has always been my favorite ship aesthtically in STO. Love my Vesta!
I loved the Vesta. It was my first t5 ship in STO back in 2012.
The Vesta is probably my favorite "new age" trek vessel. Just need one named the USS Hesatia.
It occurred to me sometime in the last year that they ought to be more starship classes that are inspired by nonhuman history. Like it seems like most of the starship classes are named after human myths. But there are so many more species in Starfleet in the Federation, you would think over the centuries that Moore ship classes would be named after non-human history.
As soon as I saw the Aventine/ Vesta in the ships of the line calendar I fell in love. Sufficiently different to show progress forward but still a federation starship.
9:25 - Whew, I was getting worried about the lack of typos, and then along come "AUXILARY" AND "DANUBLE". I have to admire the consistency.
The Vesta immediately became my favorite ST ship design the moment I laid eyes on it. My own headcannon for its role in STO is that only a few ships were produced before the UP attack, and then later when the Klingon War was starting to heat up they revived the line because A) The hull design meant for slipstream aeurodynamics also proved to be sturdy hull for conflict (in game stats be damned lol) but was still hesitant on pure warships, and 2)as it was meant to be a test bed for multiple experimental systems, everything internal was designed to be modular, making it very easy to upgrade and retrofit with new tech. Thank you for covering our blue beauty!
Side note: there is still a small ember of hope in me that STO will give us some kind of Vesta II design someday. Palatine, Esquilline, and Brigid are ... okay, and Caelian is too Section 31ish for my tastes.
Such a beautiful design. I hope it does wind up on screen at some point.
I'd hoped that the Voyager-A was going to be a member of this class.
That would actually make sense.
@somestormchaseridjitwithwi2024 The Vesta is essentially the Intrepid class 2.0, with a grand majority of this ship's systems that were either derived from Voyager's upgrades and discoveries or improved/helped along research that was going on at home.
I loved the Vesta class ships in STO... they were a magical combination of crazy science abilities in space
Since I´ve seen the Vesta Class for the first time, it ist my personal favorite when it comes to design! Thank You for this video!
3:24 Ack ack ack. Ack ack! Ack ack ack!
I would say that in show canon, the Vesta class is undertaken at the same time as the Dauntless class, with the reason being that they already knew a fair amount about QSD, had a design which did work, but wanted something a bit more..., normal as well, something which looked like a Starfleet ship. On top of this, dual-production meant that if one ship failed, they had a backup. When the Dauntless was successful and in the wake of the attack on Utopia Planetia, the Vesta class was set aside to focus on getting more important ships underway. As such by the time they got back to it, the design is in a fair state of outdatedness, and required overhauling for its original purpose, which was now also somewhat secondary. Eventually the vesta class would settle in as that high-speed multi-role cruiser in a backbone state. It wasn't top of the line or able to keep up with more modern ships, but could pack a punch when required, was well-suited for many different tasks, and would make a perfect second-contact vessel. First contact undertaken with a flagship vessel in normal circumstances, and then you roll up with the nitromethane drag car to be like "And here's what else we can do, want to work together?"
Another potential thing might be that that Dauntless was an almost one for one replica of the schematics of the other Dauntless, and was built more to let them understand how it worked. The Vesta class being intended to be able to take the QS Drive designs as a starfleet designed ship that would use it, and designed to have the drives installed following tests while being able to work out other issues with the ship before then with the USS Vesta, and when it's recomissioned as the Aventine, that's with the drive installed following testing of the Dauntless.
Because the original Dauntless was designed as a trap, having it in mass production might be an issue in and of itself, but a test vessel or two makes sense there just to figure out the technology.
Then Janeway "borrows" the Dauntless for her mission to track down the Protostar because it seems like the design might be technically faster, but more of a long range point to point with less of everything else...which would make a lot of sense with the supposed backstory for the design that it was intended to be a rapid transport between Voyager in the Delta Quadrant and Federation space, letting them get people home (and, potentially, back) quickly and easily.
And with the delay in standard production after a few ships would also mean that there would be a lot of upgrades and fixes to the design that would have come up over regular use by the existing ships that might make it a good, reliable design at that point with improvements compared to the top of the line designs.
Honestly, I see the Vesta as a Voyager 2.0, or “how we’d have designed the Intrepid-class after everything Voyager went through.”
VenomGeekMedia described this as "the new crossfire class" and I think that's very much accurate. One huge cruiser sized science ship.
I am totally here for anytime Sir Patrick is being utterly insane.
We almost saw it in ST: Picard Season 3... too bad Mark and producers couldn't get whatever was needed done on time.
At first, I wasn't that hot on this design but you've made me like it more than I thought. Those blue accent lines on the nacelles look great!
That’s one of the best looking ship designs I’ve seen in a while. Really strong profile and good lines.
That's one of the best looking Federation ships so far!
DS9 spin off would be great to see this class. Really enjoyed this ship.. Be cool to see Dax fix slipstream on it.
Vesta is a beautiful ship design.
If the QSD on the Vesta could be made more stable for long duration use, days or weeks on end, then it might be a viable option for the first extra-galactic exploration. The Dauntless is a good ship, but it's small, not a ton of room for the amenities and aboard ship an exploration mission to the Magellanic Clouds would require. The Vesta has all that. The large shuttle bays that could send runabouts on survey missions while the base ship does things only it can do, the ample space aboard for labs, work spaces, and crew comforts would let the whole mission run longer, and it could get to the Large Magellanic Cloud within a month and the Small within 2 months. Plan it like the old 5 year missions and you have a job that the Vesta class is in a unique position to fill that role.
the Vesta was my first ship i saved up by selling Dilithium and it always have a Special Place in my Hearth
And i could see that the Vesta is fitting in the realm of QST Testbed in that it was an dead end development like the Motorjet that got surpassed by the Jet Engine since it was developed at roughly the same time
Finally you're doing one of my favorite sto ship!
My favorite ship and my STO daily driver, thank you for the breakdown!
congrats sir amaizing video 750 crew so cool i am downloading st online in my ps4 to enjoy having those ships
🖖😎👍Very cool and very nicely well done and executed and very informatively well explained in every detail way shape and form provided on this format and subject matter on the Vesta class starship design and the various functions, abilities, duties and mission parameters of this vessel!; A job very nicely well done indeed Sir...
I can see It's QSD testbed idea for mass production use as opposed to the copy the Dauntless has.
The Vesta's QSD can still fit into existing canon by setting it's design date just slightly before Voyager returns. The project could have been part of a peace time revitalization of Starfleet after the Dominion War, trying to reengage in the science and exploration goal after a bloody war. Even after Voyager's return, they couldn't figure out how to intergrade a proper QSD into the existing Vest design, so the ship was then rolled into production without it as a normally propelled starship. The Vesta design was already really strong, so why scrap the design because of one thing? The Dauntless 2 project was then started with proper working knowledge of functional QSD from Voyager's travel.
i love this ship great job brother😊
This ship deserved time on tv or even it's own show.
I like the idea that the Vesta class is present as a test bed for the quantum slipstream drive as normal, but it's activities is heavily classified.
The Dauntless we see in Prodigy would then be the first ship to adopt the quantum slipstream drive as an ongoing openly known technology, followed by the Odyssey class.
This makes sense, with the Tel Shiar being a big deal post the Dominion War, trying to take advantage of the reputation the Romulan involvement in the war gave them.
I even think Admiral Janeway being in charge of the Vesta development and also secret activities makes further sense. She has had 7 years dealing with far tougher circumstances.
Defeating Tel Shiar agents snooping around secret technological development missions would be fun for her after that.
This ship is pretty cool 😎
It's interesting that the Vesta project was restarted at all. It reminds me of the pre-war projects restarted by France after WWII. Surprising to think they still had those old projects that they were still happy to continue, but there were.
I love the Destiny books so I grew very fond of the Aventine :) Fortunately, I got my hands on the Eaglemoss model back in the days.
She’s a pretty ship, but I was honestly a bit underwhelmed by its performance in STO.
They played her dirty... In the books she's a beast of a ship.
@@danielsuarez3198 exactly! Thats why I was so disappointed.
Vesta is definitely a sleek and beautiful ship.
The Protostar looks very similar to a Vesta, just smaller, maybe the Vesta can be adapted as the next generation of Protostar drive vessels.
"Ack ack ack ack. ACK Ack!"
A beautiful ship!
I love the ship design here
the Vesta/Rademaker class is my second favorite class of ship after the Odyssey, i would love a show featuring one; hell even the Aventine, have Nicole De Boer come back with Alexander Siddig. With how Janeway lead the development of it, having it return to the delta quadrant to establish a federation presence there, and also to deal with the fallout from the Voyager mission would be absolutely just perfect.
Have it take Janeway on the path there to run a newly established Starfleet base starting by finding the Telaxians a new actual home.
Just a small request from a long term subscriber. Could you do a video on the USS Altair 🤞🏼
Just a beautiful ship
minor correction USS Vesta & the USS Aventine are different ships. Vesta after repairs/rebuild ends up becoming the Flagship of the Full Circle Fleet as seen in that series of novels.
Why bother with the cut out for the bridge? Its not like view screen is a window.
The Vesta is a very cool design I would like to see in cannon. Maybe one day.
Those dimensions make it maybe half as dense as water
It's nice when authors check. Many stated ship mass values and dimensions imply they would float on air
They could always say it was the testbed for some more advanced QSD designs, or maybe the first time it was used at such a large scale, for long-term missions.
Before the Odyssey came, I always thought this could have been the class for the Enterprise F. Maybe its slightly bulkier and more engineering focused variant, the Rademaker class. The shielded landing bay was such a cool design feature and could be a very useful plot device.
This is crazy. How does Starfleet support all these different Starship classes with spare parts and maintenence?
I'm going to need a darn good reason to explain the logistics here.
We already saw during the Dominion War that Starfleet could not even support its existing fleet. O'Brien complained that he couldnt get spare parts for the Defiant during war time. Even Sisko got annoyed and mad.
And several other ships were said to be in dock waiting for parts to come in. That spare parts were difficult to come by.
This is like WW2 Germany all over again with them making so many different tanks but no spare parts to fix them when they broke down in combat.
Defiant is a limited run type that I always interpreted as a failed class in its original roles. It is not useful for most of what the Federation does with its ships, is notoriously finicky to maintain and is slow (we never see it pass warp 9.5, and it is struggling mightily there) and so it is surpassed by the Sabre Class for its intended role and the mass production that comes with it. O'Brien cannot get parts because the parts for this class are not being produced in quantity, not because the Federation is not making enough parts for the Fleet. You also have to remember that they are on the front lines of a conflict that has (due to the diplomatic, tactical and strategic failures of aggressively confrontational commanders like Sisko) spiraled way beyond what it should have and the supply lines have not yet caught up.
After Voyager returns and the Borg threat is broken it is a ship only useful for reinforcing outposts along contested borders, we see them at the fleet review during Picard due to multiple guarding Earth to allay civilian fear after what happened at Mars and thus they were available to make up numbers. Most of the Odyssey, Vesta and even old refitted Intrepid and Nebula class ships were simply far too far away to make it back in time for the Review, being used for exploration or on the far periphery of the Federation or helping the locals keep the peace in the former Romulan territories.
Iv got the legendary Vesta on STO best ship iv got I can do anything tank done dps done heal done it has hanger pets as well just wish it had a better cloak
They can make the Vesta cannon without paying royalties. Just mention the ship in passing on the show without showing it. A little Easter egg without actually having to do all the legal stuff.
If the vesta ever gets to be cannon, I’d like to see it as the big “state ship” like the Enterprise’s back up or a 2nd to the flag ship. Doing mostly diplomatic missions and putting on a show to member worlds.
Would you ever consider doing the Grissom Class light science vessel(T6) from STO, please?
I gotta ask, what wacky names do you see them using for ships? I could see the uss Ford, uss Mercedes, uss macgyver, etc etc
Great video, for me i can't see why anyone would choose the oddysey over the vesta class, the latter one looks just so much cooler.
This was an interesting design. It's cool that for books Ezri Dax is Captain of this particular class. I hope we eventually see that in a show...but it MIGHT not happen.
Cool
I hate the fact that the Odyssey is canon in service mid-2380s now. We go from sub-700m ships with Galaxy, Sovereign, Vesta... to 1000+m Odyssey. We really ought to have some sort of 850m-ish design at that point, then Odyssey and Ent-F in ~2400. Fits the growth from Enterprise to Ent-E ship classes better than a 300-350m jump that we now have in canon.
Vesta could remain as a QSD test bed. After all, developing a tech could result in multiple test beds as they progress and mature the tech. Dauntless might've been the original, with Vesta being designed potentially "for but not with" QSD with the intent of it providing more...vigorous field testing of the tech once the Dauntless test program completed. That aspect might have been shelved post-UP attack as they were more resource efficient than a 1km Odyssey as they were, though as the decades wore on, they might've gotten refit with QSD. That could even explain why they never showed up in PIC - they were all way off elsewhere getting up to hi-jinks while testing the limits of the QSD.
That being said, I did grab the Eaglemoss USS Aventine and it's quite the unique design with Voyager and Titan on one side and all the STO designs on the other.
This is a nice vessel
My favorite ship
We should also consider that the vesta is likely less resource intensive than the Odyssey but still extremely capable. So it is not out of the realm of possibility that it would be brought back if that function is still needed but resources would be more efficiently spent on more ' really good but not the best' vessels.
I wonder if the vesta could dock an improved difiant type to its aft deck, allowing a utility similar to saucer seperation except without reducing either ship's capabilities?
Vesta is the Great Experiment of the 24th century and imo the modern Excelsior.
Really neat video and iove the Vesta as much as i love Ezri, but aren't we confusing verses here? I know in STO there is any ship playable that has ever been imagined, but: In the former "beta" timeline that has now been erased with the "Coda" there was no Odyssey Class because the Galaxy Class stayed in service well into the late 2380ys as was intended in her 100year lifecyclye. The Vesta ships fulfilled a whole new role as super-fast exploreres like the "Quirinal " did as a part of Janeways Delta Quadrant "Full Circle" fleet or as a fast responder like Ezris Aventine during the final borg invasion.
what would the mission profile of the USS ACK ACK be? and yes it will be made on Utopia Planitia.
I really like this ship in sto. I fly the legendary version very often.
The problem with getting the design into canon is that it wasn't a commissioned fan design, like the Luna or the Odyssey. With those, the rights to use the design automatically went to the licence holder. With the Vesta, they'd have to make a deal with Mark Rademaker for every single show or game they would use it on. That's what Cryptic did.
My favourite Federation Starship design (to be honest, i have 2 No1s. My other favourite is the Achilles Class from ST:DS9 Dominion Wars). I think it's time to read the Destiny Trilogy again.
Surprised it didn't also have active ablative armour (looked like it had the option for them with the red strips for them on the outer hull)
Given that Odyssey class is canonically now older than its STO launch. I think the relationship should be inverted with Vesta class being the new 2405 era ship.
love this class but have also thought about what it would look like if it was more sovereign, akira & achillis along with inquiry, avenger & arbiter in its design
Despite all the love this ship has in the comments, I see a disappointing lack of “Vesta is Besta” comments.
My head-canon is that the Vesta does exist, but that all seven were on long-term deep-space assignments, which is why they've not shown up.
I really hope it will be seen on Lower Decks
Your comment on the Vesta being forefront in "at least one timeline" gave me a thought: if they take the JJ-verse into the TNG or post-TNG era, it could be the Ent-F. In the JJ-verse, QSD is already standard during TOS, so Vesta would be operating at peak performance when it's rolled out and Odyssey wouldn't be needed. I guess it's unlikely since the known ships in JJ are so much larger than their Prime counterparts, but maybe Starfleet decides to dial back the massive ships after Ent-A is able to destroy the Vengeance in a 1-on-1 fight. Who knows, you just got me thinking and I can kinda visualize how it would play out. Thanks for all your vids.
The Sovereign is my favorite, but the Vesta and Odyssey are closely tied for 2nd. So sleek and Fast.
i could still see them add this ship as part of the slipstream test program as a early prototype vessel perhaps it failed or something and then starfleet moved over to the dauntless
I guess a Raven type might fit on the back flight deck, but not a Defiant (to big) maybe something like a Aeroshuttle or Waverunner.
Interesting ship and origin story. Have to admit the design is a bit of a miss for me - it feels way too busy for something that's supposed to look sleek. It's like the design was originally slippery and fast, but then STO slapped the hyper-detailed skin look on it and it kinda lost the plot. I think if they dialed back the greebling and detail, it would look a lot more cohesive. I think the Odyssey class design did a better job balancing the slick and detailed angles.
I want to believe that, like Ezri wanted, the Aventine became the first Starfleet Ship exploring the Andromeda Galaxy, that is why we don't see it in Canon
I think there is still room for it to be a planned Slipstream testbed.
Starfleet wanted a slipstream ship so they started to develop one, the Vesta, however, during the development some people studying the designs of the Dauntless started to voice doubts, they had noticed things that had been overlooked that suggested that their understanding was not quite as complete as they had thought and the Vesta was doomed to fail. Eventually these naysayers would win over enough support for their theories and Starfleet would relent and start designing the new Dauntless, as close to the original as possible to minimise the chance of them missing something important that they hadn't noticed.
By this stage the Vestas development had gone so far that it wasn't worth cancelling, so it was completed, and launched and, as predicted,the slipstream didn't work as hoped proving that the Dauntless design was necessary for a complete understanding of how Slipstream works.
What's the largest number of ships that served in Starfleet simultaneously? Not EVER existed, but like how big did the fleet get?
They should just make a Federation Cube ship. It's space, there's no wind resistance and shape doesn't matter in vacuum.
It is a good looking ship, Ill give it that.
Honestly, wish the Titan A was a new build Esquiline Class. Not a neo constitution.
And great way to introduce it into canon. Its the shio that replaced the Odyssey. Starfleet realized the the Odyssey was too big and over intensive for tge mission profile so Starfleet goes to rhe Vesta as a smaller, sleeker, faster ship. Trans warp and Slip stream tech finally ironed out in a brand new w ship.
Right off the bat I didn't know Vesta is the name of a Roman Goddess. The more you know.
I believe the Vesta (Aventine) design was a better use of space than the Odyssey with the whacking great empty space between the saucer and engineering hulls.
3:26 we come in peace.