Was destroying a perfectly good car worth it? // Honda-Swapped Ferrari
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- čas přidán 1. 06. 2024
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I really don't understand the hate, it's not like you hacked up a 250 GTO or an F40 or something. It was a 308, and not even a Vetroresina. It's a cool car, and it makes an awesome project race car, but it's NOT that special.
In fact, it's one of the (if not the) Ferrari models with the highest numbers being produced ever.
Some controversy had to be intended. Nobody puts a BMW engine in a Ford Model A truck or Honda engine in a Ferrari without knowing this will draw all kinds of attention.
Imo its a better looking car than the stock 308
That’s because you’re an idiot.
@@466rudy6 it would have more positive comments, because kids only put Ferrari on a pedestal. Not BMWs nor Fords.
I agree with you. "No car is sacred". You took something and made it into something new and I personally think that the end product is really cool (even better than the original, even if it isn't a road-going car anymore). I also love the colour choices you made, as well as the style of the decals all over the car. I'm sure you'll enjoy racing it for many years.
Cars are meant to be used and not locked away in some dark room only to be admired by some rich guy who only has it to flaunt how rich he is.
I love watching proper British chaps throw their expensive toys around the track at the Goodwood Festival of Speed.
Happy birthday Mike, you did the right thing buying the best car you could find, I spent nearly $30 grand just making my 328 GTS into a really good car, Rj in Oz
I'm glad you're saying this for the younger crowd. I've been seeing this advice given for decades, starting with muscle cars.
Buying the best condition car possible is always the best choice for ANY type of build, period.
Well I agree as far as best condition shell, but I don't see why many people get the cars with the cleanest interiors when they're gonna gut it, and with the cleanest, lowest mileage engine when they're gonna swap it, that's just a waste to me. Make sure what you're keeping is in the best condition possible and that's all that matters.
@@imnotaWell usually people who let their engines get blown or their interiors shredded also let them get beat up in other ways pertaining to the shell and chassis and suspension
@@imnota you generally arent going to find a clean car unless its a complete car. you can sell the interior if needed to recoup money. also, complete cars are generally well taken care of, hence the rest of the car will be nice too.
@@ShaunHensley
First thing I never said you should get a complete piece of shit, there is a difference between people trying to get literally full oem restored cars to build them and getting a junker.
Second that's not neccessarily true, 30 or 40yo cars will have some natural wear and tear.
Third thing we're talking about bases for builds, you need it to not be rusty, not be crashed, not be bent, etc. If the previous owner missed an oil change in the engine you're gonna take out on week one, why does it matter ?
@@imnota Oh did you just conflate a missed oil change with a blown engine? 😂
Keep moving the goalposts dude, peace out
I'm doing a restomod to a poor mans Ferarri (Fiat). Left my car club when I was told that I took the soul out of the car.
Car is now better than it ever was.
Restomodding with enhanced safety in mind is never a bad thing.
I see it as putting your own soul into it
It’s such a shame you have to keep explaining yourself on this. I must have heard this explanation in some form a dozen times or more throughout this build. God forbid the keyboard warriors would let you do you. It’s your money, your car and your time. Most importantly, what you do to your car doesn’t harm anyone else in any way. However, complainers will always find a reason to complain. Well done for once again calmly explaining yourself in a polite way instead of telling them all to mind their own business.
P.S.
Happy birthday. I also just turned 35.
I completely agree with you on this! I remember a certain someone from a certain CZcams channel that made a big fuss about the Honda engine in his Ferrari and went silent suddenly when the fire got too hot for them.
@@kiweeltyler3586 care to name the channel? 😊
It always surprises me other people care so much about what a total stranger does with their own car. Especially someone criticizing someone with the skills like you from their sofa about a car they wouldn’t ever own anyway. People are wired haha but your skills and vehicles are amazing ❤ keep it up Mike 🤘
And someone who would never be in the market for such a car
You don't get it. He has the right to do whatever he wants to his car, but once he puts the video on the internet, we have the right to offer an opinion. Not everyone needs to be a fanboy
@@TurbineResearch I'm sorry i have to point out the irony of your response.
First of all, you clearly cared about his opinion enough to respond.
Second, you give out your opinion freely to strangers despite being convinced that nobody cares about it, and I am curious as to why.
Couldn't agree more man. Who actually cares or should care?
Honestly, I don’t agree with the statement that you’ll lose your investment money when buying a salvage title car. You just have to buy the right car. My 2009 BMW 325i cost me $1168 including fees. I transported it myself 76 miles home. It had a light hit in the front right fender. The M3 wheels on this vehicle are worth more than what I paid paid for the car. The plan is to drive it until I do an LS swap. The car was valued at $7916 at purchase.
Was looking for someone with this mindset. First time I disagree with him.
This dude is making a race car.
I get so many people upset when they hear my eventual plans for my car, asking why I wouldn't start with a roller or something less complete. Especially since there's so few of these things running today.
I bought a high milage, mostly complete example. I got a fantastic deal, and could probably sell off my parts for about what i paid for it. But even then, the little odds and ends to make it truly complete have run a good percentage of wait I paid to make it whole. You don't think a few plastic bobs and bits would be too expensive, but once you realize that the sellers have a pretty captive audience (at least on cars where they made a low amount of) they charge a lot for them. I've been smart about it as much as I can but that innately means that I get to spend more time hunting for a deal, sometimes taking months or years to source an interior part I don't feel like getting ripped off on.
At the end of the day, I bought a running, driving, 99% complete version of my car for a great deal. And because of that I get to *enjoy my car* in the time period between the purchase date and the date the entire driveline gets gutted. Granted there are some bits/options I want that I learned I should've just bought on the car (especially from an effort/time perspective) but I also have to remind myself that I have yet to find one in this configuration/quality anywhere near the price point I paid.
It's all a time/effort/money game, and it's up to us as enthusiasts to decide what we're capable of putting up with.
Ferrari did a 208 version in Italy. With your new engine you could fit genuine 208 badges
K20 is 4 cylinder
it is not 8 anymore...
anyhow you are right there was a version n/a and a turbo one...
@@gsm832
Got me there
204 gtk sounds like a great name tho its even more ferrari and honda combined!
Just hit 40 this week, Happy Birthday, Mike!
You ARE 100% correct. Full stop. Glad you spent the time to keep us informed, and I continue to be impressed with your car!
The car before was much , much better looking than after
I must say, i love the livery ! All those tiny little details are so freaking cool, i could spend an entire day looking at this car, on the hunt for those tiny details. The "Stanceworks aesthetic" is one of the reasons i'm hooked on this channel.
Edit : you might have "ruined" a classic Ferrari, but you created an icon in the process.
I loved every single episode of this build. It was a staggering amount of work with plenty of development left to go. As you say, there isn’t much Ferrari left to it and the parts you sold went to good use. So now you have a killer looking time attack car with a drivetrain that actually makes sense for its purpose. Not to mention, you built it all mostly yourself. Sure you had help, but one vision and that much fabrication is something to be super proud of. Anyone who hates on this build can suck it.
This video should be pinned to every message board, facebook group and text message string where anybody is talking about taking on a project car. It should also be the forward of any printed media relating to car projects. I'm probably around 30 deep into my car hobby and had to learn these lessons the hard way - keep spreading the good word.
Flip side - I learned most of my skills by starting out with the cheapest hulks I could find and like a lot of expertise, the knowledge is cumulative - skills built on top of other skills. Without my low budget "shouldn't be an issue" attitude, I've managed to acquire skills that I might not have by starting with something just a smidge nicer. Of the 30+ projects though, I've only finished around 12 - mostly due to time. There's something about spending a year repairing a rusty shell that helps you forget why you bought the stupid thing in the first place.
I'd love to see a series where two "experts", "Professionals" or "Enthusiast" chat about lessons learned - not necessarily skills or how-to's but stories about process, critical thinking and the problem solving that occurs throughout the process.
Excellent video.
Happy birthday Mike!🎂 Your channel is an inspiration!
As a lifelong gear head. I love and respect when someone goes outside of the box and creates what they want in a car. Body work and Engine to your liking is what more people should do. I recently bought a 2001 525 BMW Touring. For more power I sourced a 1UR Toyota V8 then getting a SVT supercharger from a wrecked mustang to keep it to where I want it. People say negative comments because the lack of money or creativity
Very well put throughout Mike. Thanks much for sharing.
Best project on the internet (so far) to watch, wether you want to learn something or just be entertained
1:17 All this time and I never knew this was originally an NY Car. Insanely clean for having spent any time up here.
Agree - no car is sacred. Its yours - do as you will!
Great advice, thanks for sharing!
A lot of people in the market for PORSCHE 997 Turbos need to watch this video. Clean DME reports and perfect paint meter readings don’t mean sh*t if it had ever been driven during the winter on rust belt salt covered roads.
Yooo! Mike, as someone who is hurt 😔 by watching this video because currently the main build on my channel is a 240z Im rebuilding for my wife, I can fully support and back your thoughts and opinion on what to buy when starting a project.. 3ish yrs ago I bought the complete opposite, a rusted and torn apart Datsun 240z. I wish I saw this video 3 years ago 😂 Great Advice though without a doubt 💯!!! Rebuilding a rusty torn apart car is soooo much work and thats dirty work you have to do before you can even get to the fun stuff... In case anyone is wondering I havent got to the fun stuff yet.. 😂
Mike, your daring title of episode 1 was, what got me to your channel and I never looked back! For me this project was born outside of the box, miles outside! You did the right thing and I applaud you, you’ve over a boat load of episodes shown me how to build a car, what to do when, the works. The result? Totally rad is this car! Love everything on it and honestly can’t point out what I love more! It’s a at symphony of craftsmanship and esthetics! Keep rocking!
PS: I worked at the proving grounds of Paccar! They own Kenworth and Peterbilt ….. I never understood why good coworkers would hate on one an other due to their brand loyalty…. You’ve shown how it’s made and done!
My current project 'was' a complete, road legal and running (with problems, I fixed myself) car that had everything. Because of the issues - I could fix myself - it was extremely cheap.
Anything broken I did not need, but yes key components like the headlights, tail lights, parts of the intake and exhaust etc, were easily sold........and in the end I sold them for MORE than the whole car cost me.
Then I had everything - a car I could actually drive first to get my before / after experience sorted.
And the outcome, I could then control the parts I wanted to replace, not had to replace to keep it functional.
So Mike - GREAT advice, and you are so right. The best for the price, gives you options.............even if you give up and sell it OEM, you have options.
We all see those projects in 52,000 bits, that have most missing, and think could I. You could, but the effort needs to make it worthwhile.
So support your great advice here. THANKS. I could afford the more expensive version, but now I got it cheaper, and with my changes it is now MY VISION for the cost of an OEM expensive one. Love is.
I love it man I’m glad that you did it, and I’m glad that you have firm boundaries. After all you run a business and this has been very profitable to you. And it works! Good job
Don't worry about the haters bro. It's your car, do what you want. The positive crowd will watch the videos and enjoy it. No need to explain it. The things you do makes your channel grow because you're being different. Keep up the good work.
What an awesome project! Keep up the great work.
Love the finished product and all the vids. Don’t stop.
I reckon you should double down and make a mint Street Ferrari with a 300hp K series. Manual, Leather, AC, Multi-Media. Full Resto Mod. One for the Track, One for the Street. Love your work
It’s a no from me I’m afraid! You do outstanding work, but I would never be able to take a fully working almost concourse vehicle with potential collectors value and break it up into a project car. Therefor I prefer to rescue cars, but that’s me. Great work Mike and apparently happy birthday.
Happy Birthday Mike!!! I know you did the right thing, the headaches from dealing with rust and crash damage cause a lot of sleepless nights and would have added significant time to the project. Your time is worth money (you can calculate your hourly rate pretty easily) and there are a lot of people who forget this when they jump into a car project. The cost of having specialists do some of the body work is staggering (they have a hourly rate as well) so it all adds up. I bought a 1975 TR6 that I'm putting a V8 into and spent (still spending) a lot of money to get it to my spec and do things the way I want (things the previous owner did that had me scratching my head). I knew this going in and I'll never sell the car because I'll never recoup my investment. I bought it to tinker with, to have a small car with a big motor (like a Cobra) and have fun on the twisty roads laughing at all the torque I have at my foot. Its an investment that you make knowing that you're sinking money into something you may never get back. It's the price of entry to this world of loving and having fun cars to drive.
My favourite car on CZcams ❤❤❤
Mike you are so right. Buy the best is the only way to go!! Great video!
Beautiful build. Thanks for sharing.
Great explanation of how and where to start. This took me forever to learn so I really hope the younger views of your channel learn from your example.
I will die without understanding why ppl wants to insist to preserve factory cars like they are. I see your project as a much better story, build, quality, etc as a factory one. This only counts when it's a well done build like yours.
The little bits and bobs on a car add up real quick and that's if you can even find them at all. Solid advice and a great project IMO
for the price the original car fetched and the quality of some of the welding and fabrication.... i would say you improved it significantly. happy birthday mate from Australia.
Dang, I'm thoroughly impressed with how much you recouped from selling the original bits 👏
Can't wait for the next project 👀
This is sound advice, and I can't lie - I was one of the folks who was of two minds about the origins of the project. Realizing that you basically were able to power and/or enhance a lot of other cars while setting up your own project makes a ton of sense and the staggering value of the part outs is hard to argue with. I'm definitely going to keep this in mind when I finally get my project idea going.
Salvage cars..
Mat Armstrong: am I a joke to you?
I want to do a project foxbody and those 3k rough ones seem like the best deal but after watching this, the 12k nice versions are looking much more appealing.
I've had an '86 Mustang SVO Comp Prep for 32 years. It's supposedly 1 of 83 produced that year, and 1 of less than 10 in Jalapeno Red. I've modified the hell out of it because technology has improved greatly in the last 40 years. I could have left it original but it would be a sub-standard driving car. Go for it Mike!
Happy Birthday
Toms turbo garage also starts with good examples for his builds, the logic makes sense
I've never modified or restored a car, but I have reasonable basic knowledge, and want to take on a simple car soon. So actually this has been a really insightful video, and I will hear your words when tempted to take on a rusty project.
Have a great weekend Mike.
this just convinced me a little more to get a closer to pristine car for a body swap project
Happy birthday! Also I definitely agree with your assessment; buying the best example and selling parts to keep other cars alive all while putting money back into the build is the way to go
As a Datsun owner, I have to agree with you completely. I bought it as an affordable project, but it's turning out to be as expensive as a show car. In the end, though, it will be mine, and I’ll take pride in the work I put into it.
I told my other half, that I’m never selling this thing.
It’s great advice, always start a project with the best possible example that you can find. If you can’t find anything good, wait. Be patient.
When the GTBi came out, with 20% less power than its predecessor, it was widely criticised for lack of performance. US cars were even heavier than European ones and so even slower, although they would still crack 8s to 60. In the hierarchy of 308 series cars the Vetroresina GTB is firmly at the top, followed by carb 308s, QVs and 328s depending on owner requirements. GTB/Sis are firmly at the bottom. They still look pretty but that's about it. Yours is now a unique thing with its own character and it looks stunning. Even as a serial Ferrari owner and confirmed tifoso I'm all for it!
Very well said brother! Ultimately it doesn't matter what other people think. You gotta do what works best for you. That car has produced some of your best content which makes it a great business decision regardless of anything else.
I don’t know what the status of restoring cars in the USA is but I do know how specialists in Europe for decades restore cars to better than new, now more and more old cars get valuable, brands as Porsche, BMW, Ferrari, Aston M all have their own classic restore shops and they restore cars to much better than they where build, rust is not coming back after al the baths the chassis has gone trough.
And they rebuild cars where 75% is gone.
This fear for rust is not rational, it’s not the 20th century anymore, we know how to treat it.
That 308 has fulfilled a destiny so much greater than most others that left the factory.
Such a beautiful car. Amazing work!
i think this was some really really sound advice when it comes to car buying. especially with the thought of modifying it after purchasing. as always mike great video dude!
Some of my favorite projects that I like to see is: "Take Engine X & put it into Car Y", because the learning experience is oftentimes so much more interesting & you can experiment a lot more.
That's one of the reasons why I was so drawn to this series & it has been a very enjoyable ride, so thank you Mike for showing that journey!
Happy belated birthday Mike!
I can tell you from my 1993 Celica GT V6 swap project, fixing the wreck damage (I caused back in 2014) I have been working on the wreck damage since August last year and have only just now started welding panels back to the car! Granted, that's because I am still learning how to weld and I don't have much free time, but starting with a wrecked car puts a BIG hurdle in front of the actual project you plan from the start, because your chasing that "as close to perfect as possible" the entire step of the way! I get it, and I agree, the parts you removed probably saved other GTB's that would have sat for years waiting for good replacement parts if anything from lack of availability in the current new part market of "No Longer Available".
I couldn't agree with you more. Having watched you from the word go with this build, I understand. The last 5% of work and last 5% of parts are what kill projects and why they end up sitting in peoples driveways unfinished. Having built a few of my own cars, from a box of parts and a chassis to a complete blank canvas with all the parts there, the complete car will always win out. Less time searching, more time building and faster to get out the shop and have fun with. Ps. Happy Birthday Mike 🎉
Hey Mike, I bought that 78 308gtb on BaT back in November. You commented on the listing. I snagged it for 38.5 with a spun rod bearing. I wanna do something fun with it like you did. Everything you said in this video is spot on. They're here for us to enjoy. Love the car, love the attitude. Keep it up!
Congrats on the purchase, what a steal!!
Keeping it 100, once again. Starting with a clean shell is simply more time, cost, and labor efficient. Despite what the traditionalists say, that ferrari wasn't ruined, it was improved on every level. I'm glad you're not another crash damaged rebuilder on youtube gluing salvage titles back together.
308 is a very important car in Ferrari history. The owners complained that the car was so slow that they were being passed by small German saloon cars (of the M3 variety) on the autostrada, which made Enzo Ferrari greenlight the F40.
My favorite car on CZcams.
Never bothered me what you did to the stock car until this video where I realized how nice it was. But then your justification brought me back round. A 360 degree roller coaster of emotions there.
One of the best looking cars on the Internet! Amazing job man!
It also depends on what you’re wanting to do with the car. If you know you’re going to cut everything out and rebuild from scratch a R title or shell would be the best starting point. Having done it both with starting with a decent running driving car and just a shell, starting with the shell was much easier.
Absolutely spot on! I can't say my project car is rust free but this makes so much sense!
Also, you have to be careful, because of title washing, and even just DMV policy. My state (Arkansas) won't issue salvage titles on cars that are older than 7 years. So all that needs to happen is the car changes hands after it's 7 years old, and you'll get a clean title back.
Also, when Ferrari build a race car, they start with a brand new one off the production line, not second or reject.
You're doing it right Mike.
I always remind people that my project is MY car and it only has to make ME happy. Everyone else is free to do what they want with their cars and their money. Or do nothing at all. It doesn't have to make sense to anyone else.
I started with a practically new car because I have to daily mine, work third shift, and have to do all the work in a driveway so it's very slow going. That's in addition to all the reasons you laid out, and that's coming from someone working on a 2019 Civic. Parts may be cheap and plentiful, but the fewer I have to find, the better.
I have a mate who builds mostly classic race cars for a living, he ALWAYS tells customers to buy the best example they can find for him to cut up and to leave the wrecks for the restorers to lose time and money on.
You make some really great points. I think that you made a wise choice starting with a clean Ferrari, especially with such an ambitious race car project. There are always unforeseen issues that crop up with any project, and you don't want to compound those issues with problems that could sideline the project for years. Because funding, momentum, and interest are not unlimited. With that said I have rebuilt project cars with both rust and accident history, and sometimes it is personally worth it to trade your labor and research (for parts and repair knowledge) to get a special car that you normally could not afford in your garage. The illusion is that it is easy and cheap, and the truth is that it is very hard, and always costs more than your highest estimates. Thanks for sharing your experience and wisdom, and congratulations on completing that amazing car! I enjoyed watching the journey from beginning to the end.
From my own experience I am 100% with you regarding rust, its to be avoided at all costs. What you can see is only the start of it and it can be nightmare to treat it all properly. This can apply to previous repair work also, some previous work you can find to be done horribly, even if its not rusty, it wouldn't sit well with me. Bondo can hide a lot of sins.
I think a lot of people don't realize that if there is rust all over the floor pans and body the its also inside the frame rails and box sections. They are not worried because they can't see it and you can still have a perfect looking car. But I'd never be happy with a car knowing there may be heavy rust internally, especially if I will be running many times the original power. Hence I cut all hidden sections on my build open to be inspected and properly sealed and repaired/replaced if required.
I love your vision and skill. While I am not a BMW fan, I respect the hell out of what you feel about them, and what you can do with them. Someday, I do hope you will do a Porsche, and I know it will likely have a different engine, but will love to see what you come up with.
Absolute best advice on a first project bar none. What a shame that noone is going to take it :D
not a bummer at all. i love what you've done with it. gorgeous build.
I am truly happy with what you have done with this project. I love your design choices and I think cars are tools, not jewels and should be driven and raced.
I appreciate your perspective on what to start with and what to work with. I'll admit I do disagree with some of what you say but I also believe that no two people think alike. I've enjoyed the series and am still waiting for this highly secretive project you have coming up!
I just bought my dream car, and had always planned on doing an LS swap on whatever I got. Well, the example I got was much nicer and lower mileage than I'd ever anticipated and I quickly rethought that plan. This convinced me to just do it.
Ooh Happy birthday to Mike
excellent advice....and it will fall on deaf ears
Great point about improving the other existing 308s with its unused parts, as well as this one actually being driven and enjoyed. ‘Rotting’ in a bubble for decades as just an investment is much worse
Just a small example. I bought a rust free 1991 Civic from Arkansas a few years ago. It was mint chassis wise. BUT the interior was trashed. And it was a blue interior car. To restore the interior I would have spent more than the car was worth. Like the dash vents were trashed. I couldn’t even find good blue hatchback dash vents. I still would
Have to have a 1991 Civic hatch again, but this time I’ll wait to find a clean one.
screw the rivet counters, i bloody love your way of doing a build !
I like your thought process too, but I like to save the turds. That´s just my thing and style of enjoying cars on the cheap. So to each their own. I love the Ferrari! Can´t wait to see it back on track!
You did the right thing. Rock On!
You built an amazing car, I have zero hate, and glad this introduced me to your amazing channel
I will just come out and say it!
What you made this car into is far cooler and sexier then what it was!
The 308 has always been slow and kinda common for a Ferrari.
What you built takes the best parts of the 308 and magnified it!
Even with a Honda engine its somehow more of a Ferrari now😎
Initially I was dead agai converting the 308 into a race car. But with all the tech and know how applied I'm a convert. The livery is so awesome. And the work under said livery is frankly spectacular. I Look fwd to the 244gtk getting back on track.
Mike I’ve watched every episode of this build, first time commenting. New episodes take priority over tv shows. Anyways really liked this one.
I wasn't upset with you, then I watched this video, and I am still not upset with you. Great work.
If someone wants a project car to build or repair, to use and enjoy the final result, it doesn’t really matter if it’s a salvage title or not. Salvage title only hurts resale value. There are plenty of good cars with salvage or rebuilt titles.
It's your car do whatever you desire thats the way I feel I'll do what makes me feel good about it.