Do You Need An Arcade Stick?!
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- čas přidán 5. 07. 2021
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Max’s grandkids: Hey grandpa Max? What was video games like back in your time?
Max: back in my day, our fingers bleed while we’re doing super combos
*children’s eyes began to sparkle and shocked with awe*
I’ll say this:
If you played any Street Fighter on ANY PlayStation controller (specifically the PS2 or PS3), you DEFINITELY got blisters on your thumbs. And if you were a fiend (like me and my homeboy was) you FOUGHT through the pain of that blister.
@@chancemitchell4147 I feel that, just remembering it making my fingers hurt already lol
☠️☠️☠️ "back in my day we had to take 4 bus transfers both ways to go to the arcade. And you had to fight for the good side of the cabinet because the stick wasn't always good on the right side"
Max's grandkids: You used your fingers? * chuckle *
@@abadenoughdude300 You used your hands? It's like a baby's toy.
Shinra employee educates the public on fight sticks.
Shinra hosts a tourney several months later..
Lol
"The Planet is dying, and those assholes in Shinra are up there making a damn fighting game tournament."
The only thing missing is the shinra theme in the background xD
Thats a good one 🤣
I will never get tired of listening to people talking about things they are passionate about.
Honestly I remember in like 2015 I started getting into fighting games and I just really wanted to try fightstick, even though I knew it wouldn’t make me better or anything. Idk why it just really looked like it would be more fun to play on. I ended up getting one, absolutely loving how it felt and never went back since
This is exactly what happened to me
exactly me aswell
Me too in 2015 but i go back and forth using keyboard.
Maybe a mixbox one day as i like arcade buttons better.
Older games though works best with sticks
I recently got into fighting games and just got a fight stick. I see a bunch of stuff on motion inputs not being necessary but like I just started playing third strike and I really like getting good a them and just learning them. I hope motion inputs and fight sticks stay for a long while
@@sageofnothing2061 I started playing 3rd strike too and although I kinda like playing on a keyboard/hitbox, I kinda feel more at home with an arcade stick, especially with motion inputs. dashing and motion inputs feel easier on an arcade stick to me but hitbox style feels more like direct control.
Do you NEED it? No.
Does it feel AMAZING in some games? Yes.
When I was a kid, it didn't feel that great. Now that I'm an adult, it feels *_great_* when I go back to play the Street Fighter Alphas and the Marvel vs Capcoms and thr Tekkens of the world.
Honestly
Yes
I right now, prefer SFV and Tekken with an arcade stick, even tho in Tekken im still figuring out how to dash consistently
With DBFZ and now Strive, i really cant use the stick
I'll try to use it more and play with it, but its mostly the dashes that stop me from doing great. I know that theres a dash button, wich im trying to get used to
But especially in Strive, i really havent figured a layout i like
@@filipepires9860 don't know if this will help, but on strive I have my layout as:
Top row:
P S H BurstMacro
Bottom row:
K DashMacro D ---
This makes it quite easy to dash for me at least.
@@Jhitch19 Right now i think i have
P S D Burst Macro
K H Dash Macro
I think ill for sure try yours
S and HS need to be togheter, so yours works in that way
I think ill use in the bottom row K D DashMacro instead
The thing is, since i bought the stick i havent used it that much since i was in a DBFZ phase, so my muscle memory is still shit haha
Anyway, thx for the tip ^^
@@filipepires9860 this is my first time playing a game with a fightstick, pad was ruining my thumb so I switched and am glad I did. Np!
Answer: Do what feels comfortable, but dont be afraid to try.
I would guess over 90% of fighting game players use a controller. Always use what’s most comfortable, but which controller is the best?
@@TheAndrewJohnBennett I think the Genesis/Saturn layout is the best since it best replicates a stick. Just make sure you have the 4 shoulders anyway like the Hori Octa or Raion
@@TheAndrewJohnBennett That's a comically large overestimation.
@@cozycherry1790 from the reviews I’ve seen it would seem the Hori Octa is even better than the Razer Raion, specifically when it comes to how the d-pad works. I have the Raion and get a lot of missed inputs because of how you can technically push down all directions at once, so half circle movements are really hard to get right on it. It appears to be better on the Octa, but haven’t tried it to back it up.
@@TabletopJunk I think its more 60-40 but I couldn't tell you side is Stick or Pad.
I'm middle age now, in my 40's, and I was and am a gamer. I remember the 90's calloused knuckles and pinched finger tips. You had to use knuckles to get more damage off of X-Moves in X-Men Children of the Atom, Marvel Super Heroes: Infinite Wars, Darkstalkers and X-Men vs Street Fighter. Roll your knuckles rapidly across the 3 buttons to do more hits with Ultra/X-moves, etc... and you FELT the friction burn. Also, yea, the buttons were concave and pinched between the button and the outer ring as your skin got caught in the gap between.
Dude, I would have never remembered had Max not brought this up today. It blows my mind the things you forget. What a nice little peace of memory there.
Listening to you talk about fighting games has got me into them over the last few years. Just hearing you talk about something your this passionate about makes me want to love these games. Thank you for making this content
“Arcade sticks provide no tactical advantage.”
- Revolver Dood, 2021.
The best part is that he kinda looks like Ocelot
You're pretty good
*spins controller*
@@chocoextract6526 how about spins controller on right hand and spins arcade sticks on the other hand
@@redhawx4216 idk how would ocelot spins an arcade stick :/
Max talking about the arcade days like a war vet having flashbacks is my shit.
Ooooohh those were the days. Haven't you been there back in the old days? Sorry, I'm assuming you're a very young person.
He saw someone get stabbed in those days.
back when winning and losing had more weight. if you lose, you lost money kid. if you keep winning too much, well someone might taze you.
Hahaa
@@AchedSphinx taze you, lol
I just bought my very first fight stick- The MayFlash F300. I’m putting in hours practicing on it as it’s VERY different compared to a controller, however, I’m now addicted to the FEEL of the fight stick. Thank you Max🙏🏾🙏🏾
Ayyyy also bought my first in the past few weeks, got the same stick as you. It's mad fun
As someone who only got seriously into fighting games in early 2021, I always wanted to try stick cos it looks cool. Bought one this past December for Christmas and it is definitely a big change as I've used pad all my life, but it feels so cool and satisfying doing a basic bnb or landing a combo ending in a super. It's just fun tbh
what arcade sitck did you get? I'm been wanting to buy one but I don't know what to get.
@@Oroboro888 I have a switch and I'm in South Africa so the options are a bit limited but I snagged a Mayflash F300 cos it works across pretty much all consoles, feels really sturdy and I'm loving it so far
Whats your first game?
what dpad controller do you use? i've been thinking if i should use playstation 5 controller or xbox controller
Apparently the PS5 Dpad is not good so maybe veer away from that. I used the 8BitDo SN30 Pro Plus, there's newer versions out so check it out online. Think the newest is the 8BitDo Pro 2, Dpad felt great @@Scrappy208
“Do I touch it like a sexual object?”…. Yes,…. Just yes! Lmao!
Gently grasp it, squeezing firmly but slowly
Try to keep your movements fluid and not to do anything sudden
Exactly, I use an arcade stick like how Brolylegs uses a controller with the stick in my mouth while I fundle the buttons.
Arcade sticks teach you how to handle sexual objects
@@Sorrelhas you mean cats are sexual object?
Nope...Cringe.
I don’t need an arcade stick but I wanna build one with my dad
Fuck yeah
@@GuitarSlayer136 Dude that sounds amazing🤩
That's the cutest comment I've read today
I want to build a relationship
I love this
I remember working in an arcade in the early 2000s and on some fighting game cabinets, the techs were fixing them every other week because they saw so much action. Great days.
Very glad you made this video. Getting more serious about fighting games, and having grown up with consoles, I was curious if I needed to learn stick.
I just want a controller with the d pad that clicks, not rotates
Try a series x controller in a store. The dpad is clicky and amazing now for fighting games.
What you're describing is a d-pad that uses microswitches as opposed to a rubber membrane. The "joystick" on the Neo Geo Pocket used an eight-way microswitch setup (since SNK knew their pocket fighting games would benefit from it), it feels really nice and I wish more companies would adopt such things. In fact I'm very surprised that some of the newer Xbox controllers have this on their D-pads, yet none of Razer's console controllers do despite Razer using their mouse switches for the other controller buttons.
Seriously
Battle Beaver Customs has that option with their controllers.
@@Boxish unironically I preferred using the switches dpad when I played gg accent core versus ps4 controller d pad on strive
Would love hear your crazy stories from arcade. Like people bleeding, grudges and crazy shit in general.
I think if you dig deep enough Max has an Arcade Stories playlist
They weren't that crazy. Depends on where you went.
It was real in New York City. I seen a guy get his ass beat because he rage quitted on SFA3 and pulled the plug out from the machine.
@@BMKidProductions Craziest stuff I've seen was a guy getting beat up for picking Rugal, K9999 and Angel on KOF2k2
Although I've heard stories of someone getting stabbed because they used Yamazaki's HSDM, which could shut down the machine in the Magic Plus hack
Here in latin america I've seen so many fist fights lol
The good thing is that if you abused a glitch or bug to win....oh boi, you were gonna get some action hah
I remember kicking a kid that was abusing the infinite power charge combo Terry used to have in kof97 (that was patched on the next game) lmao
Good times 😌
If you ask me, it 100% boils down to this: Do you want an arcade stick? Does it look appealing? Have you played with one in an arcade and really liked it? If the answer to any of these questions is yes, then buy an arcade stick.
perfectly said, i've always been a pad user and i manage to do well that way is all the fighting games i play. i do have a stick but like max said it's starting from scratch learning wise. every uses what they are comfortable with these days.
Clearly the answer is the Wu-Tang Clan PS1 controller.
I fancy the RE4 chainsaw controller myself
Don't fuck w/ that.
I’ve got one, I might try to play GGST on it.
@@alexknight81
Dammit! You stole my reply. I guess I'll just use the Power Glove.
Damn dude that's crazy, I was playing that on my Xbox 360 Kinect last night.
"Controller or Arcade sticks"
*me using smoke signals on a fighting game*
So how do the smoke signals enter the game?
That guy who beat Dark Souls 3 using DK Bongos:" *PATHETIC* "
@@umpteenthreason9627 those definitely would have less input lag
I use the pokeball plus to play smash ultimate
I use the Taiko no Tatsujin drums to do electrics.
I like them because I never got to experience arcades as a kid, and there was something I found very mystifying about sticks when watching people play online and at conventions. It's like being able to finally experience this big historical piece of gaming.
Jeez. You make me feel old.
Good points. I switched to fight stick and I am enjoying it! I am experiencing way less problems with tendonitis now. I already draw a lot so gripping a controller and doing those fine motor movements were wearing my forearms out. Fight stick is more comfortable and fun so far. It's also better in my opinion for tapping out combos, like gattling combos in anime fighters. You are right it has taken some getting used to but not as much as I expected. Still progressing but I enjoy it a ton.
I don’t even play fighting games, just love hearing max talk
Ya Shud. Decently accessible games that never end.
Give yourself a treat. Pick an accessible fighting game. Any door you'll open will eventually lead to every other one. It's a huge rabbit hole.
I mostly watch it for the intro
@@ArpeggioPegasusMusic So true. I've always played them but crossed from casual Capcom to SO MANY GAMES last year. KoF 02 UM is one of the most fun games I have ever played in my life, has roll back, and is $7.
I play them infrequently and I love hearing him talk
"There's somethings that works better on a controler. There's somethings that work better on a stick."
That reminds me of a player that plays Tekken. He mains two characters and he plays stick with one and pad with other just because it's strings works better with that kind of controler.
Core a gaming
i got one for tekken and dropped it after a month or two but i still use it to play my beginner friends as a handicap which is pretty fun
and arcade style games like cuphead etc are so much more fun with an arcade stick
Yeah, it should all really be based on a case-by-case basis, some characters just plainly work better on a stick, some you can get the inputs out pretty fast on a controller.
Trying to play Yuzuriha from UNIST on a controller is just making it 10 times harder than yourself than with a stick. The same goes for characters who have a hold and release button mechanic in some fighting games, without an arcade stick, or I guess a weird ass grip on your controller, you are just making it so much harder for yourself than it has to be.
Which character is which?
I prefer pretty much every thing on a stick…doa, tekken, steeet fighter or kof. The only exception is games that require a 5th button to block…..mk or injustice spring to mine.
I started playing on the SNES with controllers originally. Loving Street Fighter I played in the arcade when I could and was somewhat competent with a Fight Stick. I have started to get back into it now after 20 plus years. Currently experimenting with some 6 button controllers (Hori Pads, etc), and a Fight Stick I picked up. Definitely don't have the same control using the joystick that I used to have and I am much more proficient with a D-Pad. But need to put in some more hours on the arcade stick. While I have continued to use a D-Pad over the years for other games, you are right in saying that learning the Fight Stick is like starting again. At least it is for me after so many years.
I would like to add as I currently now own and am learning an arcade stick, it is helping me build better habits for fighting games, for example doing manual supers in versus games, usually I’d map supers to the right shoulders so all I need to do is the input and press a button, now, hitting the supers and other multi button commands the way they were intended? Feels amazing ^^
Playing on pad made me overly rely on macros (triple punches/kicks in one button for EXs, RCs in Guilty Gear, wierd Neo Geo button combos, etc.). Going on keyboard has helped in removing that reliance for me, and I can't wait to get a stick and reliably pull off a half-circle again.
@@AceTrainerX3 yeah even now when I do play on pad to learn a new character or team Before I practice what I learn on stick, I’m not using those manual macros for supers or special moves, just the face buttons and my dedicated assist buttons bound to r1 and R2 or R and ZR on switch ^^
This is some damn fine content. This is the kinda stuff, the history, the practicality, the meaning and depth of fighting games that are incredible to learn. I'm an old arcade rat from the 90s, and seeing/hearing this talk from someone who is real and genuine is amazing.
People back then:"I sacrifice my blood for this move! Super activated gyaaaaaaaa!!!!!!"
I used to hold the stick like a wine cup with the stick in between my middle and ring finger. I used to bleed all the damn time every time I did a super. That's why I used to prefer the bat since it forced me to hold it "properly". On the flip side d-pad on the SNES would eat away at your flesh anytime you did a qcf movement in SF2 Turbo. So it was no party on pads either at the time.
@@apoclypse Man you must've had a lot of scars and injuries at the time grumps (joke)
There was a project that got delisted from like kickstarter that pretty much drew blood from you whenever you took damage in a game, obviously for donation purposes. I'd like to see that in EVO one of these days.
@@NinthSettler That is some scary shit dog
Like feeding your blood to your Kamui in Kill la Kill in order to power up.
For me I always remember Tekken's combination of using square + circle combos. With the controller you have to take your hands out. That for me was enough to change to an arcade stick
You can hotkey those to the shoulder buttons.
@@ShineSpark88 yeah but at that point it feels like cheating in a way even though it really isn't
@@WASTHATABULLET Nah. With that sort of mentality, you're simply denying yourself a useful tool out of misguided and vain pride.
Preach. I am so sick of elitism.
The fight stick has been a huge help for doing precision inputs for my case. Controller joy sticks and D pad give me mis-inputs frequently. The stick feels much easier to control it's exact directions.
Dood I’ll be honest, watching this channel for so many years has made me go out and get a fight stick or 2. I agree that it doesn’t make you better by any means, but damn does it make the game more fun. Thank you Max for getting me super far down the fighting game rabbit hole!
And u don't get carpal tunnel
It's funny that he has to remake this video every couple years
It's perennial content really.
The answer will always be the same but there will always be new ears to hear it.
Wonder what its like to be new to the genre, ask about whether learning arcade stick is worth it, only to find out the best controller for FGs is the one that feels most like the keyboards they already use daily?
@@Raiden3651 About as weird as it is for those that came form the era to hear it as well. Least for me.
My thumb has been hurting a bit trying to input max super specials in kof13, so I've come to realise that getting a fightstick will help me feel more comfortable.
I've always been a pad player. I did spend sometime in arcades, but not enough to matter. I've been on the fence and I think this video really pulled me towards giving a Stick a try. I've always been about appreciating the nostalgia of games and embracing what makes a game amazing regardless of its age (thinks like old school developer methods or mechanics that were lost to time). So even though I have literally zero problem with a pad nor do I care what one plays... I kinda feel like learning stick allows me to shotgun myself to the way games were appreciated back in their day. Even if I still enjoy pad and mostly played on pad.. I might try a stick. Now it's a matter of finding a solid one.
I think Tekken's "korean backdash" might be an exception to this. It looks easier to execute this on a arcade stick than on a dpad.
Even more with a korean stick
Idk backdashing on a pad feels just fine to me, I never use sticks though so idk if it's easier or not but just the fact that sticks require so much more motion makes it seem like it would be at least more strenuous if not not also more difficult
Theres a thumb rolling method that makes it really easy
not really, much easier on hitbox/keyboard for sure
@@stinkybinth9672 Easy to perfom, but not very comfortable to do in the long run. The advantage of using a Korean stick is with a slight movement of the fingers, you perform the command and after releasing the sitck to return to neutral it gives you the possibility to cancel the backdash without the effort of registering another input. Core-A Gaming explains it better in one of their videos talking about KBD.
Its all preference at the end of the day. The only time I see it having an advantage is in games like Sf4 where you can use techniques like plinking, pianoing, and double tapping. But I have seen players like Smug do plinking on a pad using the shoulder buttons on the left side. I do think Hitbox controllers has the advantage on stick and controller just on the fact that you have better control of your inputs.
You can definitely plink on pad, Brian_F has a video about it on his channel
Shiet, the fact Daigo was able to do charge moves easily with guile on a pad for the first time just basically shows he could learn to apply his knowledge from stick to pad if given time and even probably master doing that forward knee whiff into super on a damn pad! It's all preference!
@@Sorrelhas Do you have a link to the video?
@@raystrife234 Okay so why did he prefer using a hitbox in tournaments and not a pad? In a hitbox your inputs are way quicker and precise because every finger on your left hand is assigned to a direction which results in smooth and quick inputs, you can literally press back while you press forward for a sonic boom to get the quickest charge and you cant do that with a stick or pad. On a pad you still require motions from your thumb to get moves to come out but you can still have input errors. You can still suceed with a pad but hitbox has the advantage of pressing attacks as quick as a stick and has quicker directional inputs than both stick and pad.
@@56clockwork you really think I was arguing with your statement? Because I was doing the opposite. Daigo was invited in an SF5 live stream a while back with other sf5 pros and had an event where players will randomly either play a stick or a pad. He got pad while punk got stick and it was probably his first time playing sf5 on a pad because he looked like a newborn with it and yet he managed to hold himself against punk even for a while with pad. I'm not saying he's going to go pad all the way and I knew he went hitbox later on. What I'm saying is if Daigo could pick up pad right then and there and even did decently, when he practiced with a stick all his life in sf5, then that just means he could move to pad if he wanted to but he prefers stick. Smug could do much better because he prefers pad over stick and practiced on pad more than anyone in sf5. It's all preference dude just like you said
Been playing PC games almost exclusively most of my life and just started playing fighting games for the first time with Strive. After trying controller at first and finding no success I've actually been having a way better time on keyboard (at least once I moved the right hand keys over to the number pad instead of having my hands squished together on the letters). Really goes to what you said about being comfortable with the button layouts being the most important thing.
Honestly I spent a lot of playing nrs games on a pad and it was great! But when I started playing games with quarter circles and dp’s, I just found using the stick to be much easier. Having the 8 gate to make the diagonal input more distinct made the world of difference.
6:00 - 7:24 This is why Max is the face of the fighting game community. Truly a legend.
You're part of the problem
@@JCOdrjones How so?
@@JCOdrjones What exactly is the "problem" that ur talking about? 😐
@@SilentAndy not being old is apparently a problem
@@noahleach7690 I think he's saying the opposite either way that's stupid I'm watching this wishing I grew up with arcades those creeky boned fucked don't know how good they got it
"It's like playing baseball your whole life and suddenly you have to go play soccer. Well Shit!" The 'well shit' killed me
Buying an arcade stick was a decision that I made way too late in the game and was one of the most fun learning experiences ever.
As a person of exceptional size, the inputs on a controller tend to make my thumbs accidentally hit an analogue stick when I'm using a Dpad.
As such, I spent a little money on a budget entry stick once I got somewhat serious about strive, and I don't regret it at all.
Max molesting his arcade stick had me dead
Does anyone else want another episode of Fighting games are food or is it just me?
yes
Please
Not gonna lie, but that's probably one of my favorite videos of his. Just so weird, but after watching it, makes so much sense.
So yes please, Fighting Game Food Real Talk Round 2.
yes
Honestly don’t know why I’ve never subbed before now , I genuinely like the content and your intro is amazing .
I used to get crazy calluses and blisters as a kid playing on gamepads, never had any issues with sticks.
3:58 90 year old max trying to teach his grandkids how to play 3rd strike.
If you can, playing on an actual keyboard is a great option. It is principally the same as a hitbox but nowhere near the cost. I've been using it to play Strive and it is so much easier
agreed, Keyboards feel really good for fighting games.
I’m new to fighting games, but WASD feels better for movement than a D-pad or joystick for me.
🤢
@@KhariruOficial suit yourself, but at the end of the day, it’s just about what feels the most comfortable for the individual and what gets the most consistent results. If someone decided to play using a guitar hero controller because it felt better for them, who am I to argue with them?
@@pinkestlemonade1916 I personally prefer to assign up to the space bar instead of wasd so it works more like a hitbox this means if I want to me able to put my fingers on every button instead of a wierd claw grip which I find uncomfortable you can have your fingers more easily on every key. Also if you want to do certain inputs like a vertical charge it's not as much movement required so it's easier. It's down to personal choice so you do you.
I think there is a genuine advantage to the stick if you play a six-button fighting game. A controller will absolutely work, but there are just a ton of tiny advantages to using a stick. Subjectively, hitting big buttons is also just super fun.
a stick helped me a lot when it comes to tekken, not much when it comes to other games like king of fighters but it feels nicer on my hand and doesn't feel sore after playing for a long time compared to controller
I bought my first arcade stick at November last year. I always been a pad player. It's true that sticks don't give you an advantage. But I like that making circular moves and pressing multiple buttons at the same time are easier. Specially for SF. And the most important thing is your fingers don't get tired because you have to use your whole arm. I play A lot of shmups too and with a d-pad your fingers gets destroyed to be constantly dodging things. Also I found more fun to play with a stick.
im someone who got an arcade stick because i struggled with motion inputs, especially Z inputs.
I personally say if you dont struggle with motion inputs on a controller you really dont need one, but if you do I suggested getting a cheap one and seeing how it changes
Saaame.
If all motion inputs were charge/quarter circle/pretzel inputs, I'd happily use controller, but Z-inputs on a controller are hell.
Z inputs is just forward quarter circle forward for controllers.
The thing that's irritating is how close the inputs are, and how tiring playing with your thumbs only.
Was a dpad player before switching to fight stick a year ago.
You can easily do 65236 compared to a dpad where you actually have to life your finger to go back to neutral x.x
@@johnpetersantiago2630 That depends on the game. Some are stricter than others. 63236 can be a failed input depending on game. And with how much speed matters for an average DP, allowing the full reset to neutral was quite cumbersome for me, *especially* for air DPs. I specifically remember trying to find a way to do Baiken's "Youzansen" reliably and I just couldn't get it.
And as you mentioned, characters with both a QCF and a Z-input on the same button were also a pain.
This is the main reason I got a stick, and now I can never go back
Nope, can not use a D-Pad or the Left Stick on a controller to save my life in a fighting game. Just recently got into the genre hardcore the last 3 months or so... I have to use a fight stick to pull of the moves more consistently.
Dope video. With the massive amount of ported arcade games that are on the digital console market right now (beat em' ups and shmups in-particular), there's even more incentive-to grabbing a fighting stick to capture the essence of the 20th Century arcade experience. Several devs out there are STILL making new games to keep it alive.
I just bought my first stick. I bought it because the idea of challenging myself to learn it sounds incredibly fun.
Same. Seems like the most fun way to play.
@@BobbyJenko its definitely been a ton of fun, but I'm still struggling with dashes and drive rush especially. I just know that input is easier for me on pad still lol
@@pregnanttomato9576 for sure. There is going to be an update to make drive rush cancels a macro. So no more double forward inputs, just connect a move then press parry for an auto drive rush!
Surprised the customization aspect wasn't brought up. Its a great hobby outside of actually playing the game. Being able to choose what stick, what buttons, what art, etc. is a really, REALLY fun part of sticks.
That being said, of course that has nothing to do with actually playing the game (as far as the pad vs stick question), but it is another aspect.
Building your fightstick is nice. My fiancee and I have somewhat unordinary builds. She has a Sega 2P layout with 24mm buttons along with an octagon gate for her Sanwa. I use the IL Eurostick and I love it. I will admit I did choose the Eurostick for the dumb reason that I wanted something unique.
Yeah. Customizing your own arcade stick is a really fun project. I'm just about to finish my first one, actually. Even though the entire thing was hell (My initial stick was stolen off my front porch, I learned I ordered the wrong size buttons, not finding the right size buttons in the right color, and learning how to wire everything as I was putting the damn thing together), I still had a lot of fun.
I'm also thinking of the design of my next stick already, but I'm probably not going to do that for a while, though.
@@Thunder8277 Porch pirates suck and sometimes pickup locations aren't an option for everyone so I understand. I have a UPS pickup in my town but a FedEx pickup is in a different city. I wish I was able to offer a solution but it seems you have it figured out.
@@nerdyneedsalife8315 That event was what made me buy a RING doorbell/ camera. Thankfully, the seller was cool and let me buy a new one at a discounted price.
and then there is the xbox elite pad
Been loving Max stepping up as a figurehead and a point of reference to fighting game noobies
It's been like that for years and I do agree
Man, this is such a hilarious and spot on take regarding the transition from a controller to a stick. 😂
6:15
This reminded me of memories I forgot existed.
I remember just vibing on the Soul Calibur and MvC and yep, those buttons were never in good condition.
Use to go to arcades frequently but then my brother got a ps2 around 02.
I feel like getting an arcade stick could help with Dpad misinputs, it's so fucking difficult to do half circle supers in Guilty Gear on dpad
thats my problem, some of the half circles or movements for some characters i find it hard to do on one side. on the right side i find some moves hard to do
I'm using keyboard right now. It hurts my wrists, but by crap it's vastly more consistent.
One thing to note árcade stick are more durable than the typical console joystick. So if your joystick is broken thats gonna create a misinput.
do them on analogue stick then
@@Xeaku analogies stick is worse.
I play with a D-pad...I was the sheltered kid that learned to play on console, not arcades, so, never had a stick growing up. Still on pad to this day and I'm cool with it.
Same bruh but I have arcade stick experience and realize I need directional buttons and can’t use sticks 😂
Does your thumb not hurt? I played pad for a bit and that shit was painful
@@Jhitch19 sure, after a while, but you get used to it.
@@Jhitch19 ive been playing xbox 360 and one games for like 10-12 years, and using just my thumb on the d-pad to swipe a QCF movement is very quick for me
as for people who use the stick on a controller for fighting games, i dont know how they are fine with that.
@@crazako I agree that it was very fast for inputs, but using my controller (Xbox Series controller) the D-pad was almost sharp and my thumb started to hurt like hell. Maybe it's different for other Xbox controllers (have a 360 controller but don't think I ever really used the d-pad)
The reason why I switched (to test and learn) from pad to stick a week ago is because my directional inputs were really unclean on pad no matter how much i tried, so I tried out the stick for the first time in my life and while I am still very slow with finding the buttons and whatnot my directional inputs DIRECTLY improved so I keep learning with the stick :)
For me the controls depend on how the game plays or based on the movesets of the characters.
If it’s a game where the moves are mostly quarter circle inputs, I use a joystick.
If it’s like a netherrealm game with inputs like down, back, HP I use a dpad
In KI many characters play differently so depending on who I’m using I switch between the two, Jago I use the joystick and Cinder I use the dpad.
You missed one other thing, when I take my qanba dragon out, people get intimidated.
Use what makes YOU happy. Fuck what anyone else says. At the end of the day, as long as you arent cheating, ANY hardware will take time and dedication. So it's best to use what you like the most.
What about in shooters?
Mouse vs controller feels like cheating to me, especially if it's on console.
@@BIGBOY-cu4de almost everyone agrees that keyboard and mouse is great for most shooters, but most people don't get a shit if you play on controller.
Couple things:
*Your thumbs are slower than your other 4 fingers. And you have a lot more access to all of the face buttons.
The stick can make it much easier to make particular directional movements rather than miss/hit things by accident, thanks to more movement.
I actually JUST got a stick for the first time, having very little experience with arcade sticks (even in arcades) and I'm feeling the advantages already. I don't dispute that champs use controllers, but I still maintain that the advantages of a stick can't be denied.
First your first point, do you, have four fingers on each button? For SF I guess that makes sense, but I play Tekken and it'd be 2 fingers, but they'd have to travel further, so it's just as fast as my thumb
had a a cross up just sitting around collecting dust and started using it after playing with hitbox for a while, I'm really enjoying the stick especially for ewgf
SonicFox plays with a pad. You DON’T need a stick.
Punk does too
Pads are great. Especially if you know how to mod the dpad to reduce thumb movement but keep accuracy.
Actually for fighting games, the duelshock and duelsense pads are great. There are no other controllers with good enough input latency for fighting games
@@olivur_1459 Smug, Knuckledu, Dekillsage, Luffy... And many more...
@@inkwyvern5171 watchu mean “mod the dpad”
Well he also wears a fursuit which gives him a tactical advantage of not wanting to sit next to him.
I Ordered a Qanba Dragon yesterday just to feel like a kid again.
GREAT stick
@@tonymack YUP been using it for some time now, super good
i heard great things about it
I decided to try playing fighting games with a stick when Soulcalibur VI came out. I got my first stick shortly after SC6 came out, and I never went back. I just found that not just SC6, but fighting games in general, were more fun to play on stick. Not only that, but I prefer to press all the necessary buttons required for certain commands, rather than map said buttons to one button. So, using a stick made doing just that not nearly as difficult. I get that may sound a little counter-intuitive, but it's just a personal preference thing.
Also, I like the layout of arcade sticks. I didn't grow around the time when arcades were big, but I wish arcades were still as big as they used to be.
Anyone can be great on any piece of hardware.
The psychological thrill of “I have a cool, special, fancy controller just for playing this type of game,” though, is something that needs to be stated. Theoretically, you could be better at playing guitar hero with a keyboard, but it’s *guitar hero*. The guitar is part of the fun.
My left wrist gets real fatigue when using controller for tekken. Just got myself an arcade stick, no more pain though it will take a while to adjust
I started getting ganglion cysts actually using a pad jumping back into FGs.
An arcade stick helped me alot in that regard. Made my inputs cleaner. But thats purely preference
Oooh so that was the reason, I'm a fan of FGs and Tetris, during last summer I played a lot of those games and one of my wrists started hurting like hell, I stopped playing for like a month and that fixed it, I thought it was like a muscle strain but ganglion cysts makes more sense
@@estebanacostaolivera3232 yeah they are like bumps that surface between your wrists and your hand. Id recommend icing after a long time playing. It helps me relieve the strain left on the tendons
it was DMC3 swordmaster mashing for me. no doctor ever mentioned cysts- only "tendonitis" which is just a catch-all for "stop doing what you're doing" syndrome. R.I.C.E.
I love when max talks about his time in arcades
As someone whos trying to get more in to fighting games this helped alot! I was contemplating getting a fight stick as I assumed that was the ultimate best way to play. Interesting to hear how fighting games have moved more towards accommodating Controllers/thinking of controllers. Might pick up a stick eventually.
If you think you prefer controllers try a "fight pad" with six face buttons, so you don't need to use an analogue trigger as a button - with a circular d-pad as well, they can be a good hybrid of standard pad and arcade stick.
I think it depends on the person, I prefer the arcade stick because I can rest my right hand on 4 buttons at once. it's not that I can't use the controllers face buttons but hitting 4 at once can be challenging and controller layouts can be confusing. I can't play blazblue on a controller. I mean, I can, but it'll be limited to button mashing since I get confused about the buttons. and since some combinations are hard to reach, you can map A+B to L or A+C to R, but that gives me more buttons and only makes it more confusing. whilst on an arcade stick I have access to 4 of them and I can go "oh, this does that, this does that, what does this combination do?" and since my hand can stay in a fixed position rather than skipping over the face buttons, I remember moves easier since in my mind they're assigned to a finger, not a position on a controller.
I got into fighting games with DBFZ after 20 years of PC gaming, and after fooling around with a few pads (none of which felt natural since I wasn't much of console gamer), I tried hitbox and instantly loved it. Very happy to have started out with it.
My muscle memory makes it impossible to just switch to a fight stick after decades of using a d-pad and I grew up in arcades but I definitely played more console games due to arcades dropping off in popularity. Doesn't mean they're not fun, love playing Metal Slug on a stick
Noone can just "switch" to a fight stick. You have to put your six months of work in.
@@mydemon for casual games or different genres it's fine but a fighting game hell no, I don't have time for that shit anymore to dedicate months to get used to it
Exact same thing with me. Started off in the arcades for years. Haven't touched a joystick (heh heh) in almost a decade now.
@@mydemon six months? It takes usually two months to adapt to it. Yeah it's awkward at first, but if you map the buttons yourself then as long as you understand the game you're playing it'll come quicker.
Unless you're a slow learner of course. Which is totally valid btw, everyone learns at a different pace.
When he mentions the different parts of your arms that go into using a fight stick, that's one of the reasons I tried it out - my thumbs/fingers are starting to get painful/arthritus-ish kinda stuff going, so now when I use an arcade stick it gives those muscles a break
I adapted to the fighting stick almost instantly when I got it, never had one before.
In fact I got it today and I think I'm already better with it than with the pad.
Under 30? After 30 your brain is quite hard wired and its hard to adapt.
@@randomnamemabto a certain extent but being over 30 is not old. How bad do you want it? It's not that hard to learn to use an arcade stick.
The only reason I got one is because they last for almost ever. Dpads are almost always broken after playing fighting games with it for a long time.
One thing I'll say about sticks is that they handle charge and mash inputs a lot better than a controller. Being able to piano for characters like Honda or Gen is fantastic, and being able to use the rest of your hand while charging for Zero's buster cancel combos or Shizumaru's tap is incredible.
i recently bought an arcade stick about 3 months ago and im in love with it. do you need it? no. but if possible i HIGHLY recommend talking to a friend that has one or going to an arcade with these and trying them out because they are so much more fun to play with, at least in my opinion, and by trying it out you can see if youd like to get one or not.
I would like to say that personally the down side you mentioned for the stick (the longer movement between directions). I would count as a plus. Every time I would use a pad moves like fireball forward I would usually input as down forward. Which in most games is fine. The input leniency usually gives it to you. But xrd showed me hard what I was doing. The amount of combos dropped from getting 6.k instead of Ryuujin, is painful. I can actually feel the down slide forward on a stick.
The muscle memory is a great point. I'm new to fighting games and having to build muscle memory from almost scratch on my PS4 controller anyway, so I might as well try other ones! Thanks for sharing your perspective!
As an older gamer (early 40s), who's been playing fighting games since the original street fighter (not sf2), my left thumb is in bad shape. The dpad kills me to the point I've had to stop playing fighting games entirely (f). Buying a fighting stick is my only hope. So that's a solid reason to get one. I need my killer instinct.
My fiancee and I are in our 20s and we agree with your notion. The D-pad, especially for PS4, is a killer on the left thumb. Her thumb was slightly bruised and purple after an hour of playing. That is why we play with arcade sticks now for fighting games.
There's a learning curve to any controller honestly. I used a fightstick when I first started playing fighting games cause I thought they looked cool. But I got a bunch of wrist injuries on my left arm because of work and had to switch to a hitbox layout. And it really did take a while for me to relearn how to play the games I enjoyed but eventually it got better. The controller doesn't matter as much as how much you enjoy the game and how much work you're willing to put in to get better at those games
This guys job is beach volleyball cameraman 😏
Still many people get injuries in fingers because of controller, just don't stress yourself
Getting ready for Tekken 8 which is my first big fighting game in years and been debating myself on this. Thanks for having this video for me Max even though its from 2 years ago!
One thing in favour of a stick; much easier on your thumbs. I have occasionally strained my left thumb gaming and sticks are much easier on your hands in general.
I’m new to fighting games and never really had much experience with arcade sticks but I decided to get one and I have definitely already passed my skill level with a controller in a week and I’ve been having a blast playing with it.
Kinda funny you bring us callouses with old arcade sticks cause I started playing on stick when I started getting blisters on my left thumb playing +R on pad. I rubbed my thumb across the dpad so much and so fast it got so bad. So I looked into sticks. Then I got into the idea of being able to accessorize it and was hooked.
Same here but with Xrd. I could 632146 extremely consistently as a new player, but the blister made me wonder if it was worth it.
Exactly, same here. I got so annoyed of the thumb issues that I got a stick, and I haven't looked back now. I hate playing fighting games without one lol.
you can power through it and grow callouses as well on dpad, sucks at first but then its not an issue. I am jealous of sticks customization options though
I've played arcade and console games since I can remember (and I am very old) and me or my friends never suffered any hand injuries with a stick, but I had more than one blister/callus from playing with a gamepad, so I would say console players' hands tend to suffer more than an arcade stick user's.
I did get some shit on my collarbone while playing arcade MK1, but that's another story, I just had very bad posture and habits lol.
Thank you for posting this one Dood, I’ve been on the fence for years about getting a stick and I’m glad to know that all these years it’s still considered respectable to use a controller! I still think I want a fight stick just to have one and to take myself to the next level!
Fun fact: Sticks also work very well in non-fighting games. If you play Rockman (esp X4), having a stick is a massive advantage over a gamepad since dash cancel can be done way easier with less risk of wrist injury. You can also use them for rhythm games. The feel of arcade buttons are just so much nicer than on a keyboard, and the response time is good too.
So could you play Resident Evíl games with a Stick & fight pad controls ( like any of the PS1 games or PS2 Resident Evíl 4 Mercenaries Mode?)
@@A1ml33y As long as the game doesn't involve manual camera control with the second analog stick, yeah, you definitely can use an arcade stick for it. I'm not sure about RE4 though since the only RE game I've finished was RE3.
@@GeminionRay okay I have been thinking about trying this out whenever I can get enough money saved up to buy a fight Stick . But I have always wanted to try it out playing Resident Evíl Directors cut & RE3 Nemesis because of the dodge Mechanic in the PS1 game
As someone relatively new to a stick, I can say the feedback and arm action needed make it a lot more fun to me over a controller. However it is all just preference, and I think both are completely fine.
I agree. There's a greater sense of connection to what you're doing on screen when your whole body is involved in making it happen.
After learning about Initial-T's steering wheel as well as using the gear shifter to win a GGXrd tournament against Dogura, I am convinced that sticks don't give an advantage.
80% fundamentals 10% strategy 10% reads.
WHAT
@@bennyp915 Yea dood, Core-A Gaming has a video on Initial T, I think he used the gear shifter for dust.
Wait...I've heard of things like initial D arcade stage but never heard of initial t can you explain it to me?
@@anhquanphan3089 There is a Guilty Gear player called Intial-T, he calls himself that because he uses a steering wheel to play the game. He used his steering wheel to win a tournament against some of Japan's most well known GG pros.
This video is spot on. I have been using a controller for the past couple years out of convenience, but I love a good stick. I had a street fighter stick for OG XBOX , I got the Madcatz SF tourney stick when SF 4 came out, and I got the tekken 5? collectors edition that came with the wireless stick . I used to play everything but NRS games with a stick. Oh and DOA games would be with a pad as well.
I want to get back to using a stick but i havent again, just out of convenience. I used to have this setup with my TE stick on an old stereo stand so I ccould stand up and play just like at an arcade, but i dont have it anymore and do not want to sit down while using a stick.
It's all about preference. I thought for the longest I needed a stick for MvC2/3 for better execution, turns out I needed to learn everything from scratch again because of that.
That's a lie. How long took you to learn the buttons of the controller? It is the same with the stick it's just 6 buttons you can learn it in one week
@@Cuicas007 idk bro, I haven’t gamed seriously in a few years
What really helped me learn how to use Stick was Tetris: The Grandmaster (technically it was TAP2, but i digress). After a few weeks of regular practice, I was relatively confortable with using stick quickly in every other game.
Also its nice for shmup, metal slug, puzzle bubble and a big nostalgia bomb. Arcades are wonderlands to us kids back then. Arcade stick is our most accessible connection from that.
I think there's a hidden layer underneath the statement of "having to relearn everything". I started out on pad personally, then eventually made the switch to stick for similar reasons (wanting to play BBCF on release, but stuck waiting a year for the international version, thus making the arcade the only place to go). Due to how used I was at gripping the pad, my thumb would always be offset around 15 degrees from horizontal, making motions facing left way more accurate than facing right. I had spent the last half year trying to fix it, but like Max said, it was really difficult to overcome muscle memory and that comfort zone. But by switching to stick, I was forced to re-learn everything - this meant that I had the opportunity to set my motions and grip right, with the new environment of the stick forcing the change.
In short, being forced to re-learn everything isn't always a bad thing. If you're in a similar position, forcing such a change can be a great way to drop old bad habits and develop new better ones.
Most people won't remember or know about the Sega Saturn controller. That thing was a beast for fighting games like Street Fighter Alpha 2, amazing dpad and with the six button layout, three on top, three on the bottom and with an R1 and L1